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Socrates
02-21-2007, 22:06
Ok, not really, but it does have to do with thunderstorms and rain. I have no problems getting wet. I played in the mud as a kid and with fourwheelers as a teen. Me and messy conditions have no issues. However, my down jacket might have something to say about it. Day after day of rain or even a few hours of hard downpour, I have a NF Venture Raincoat to help protect me, but the word is "YOU'RE GOING TO GET WET!" Anyone want to give advice on wearing a down jacket or even share a useful story? NO advice on switching to a different material please. I leave Saturday and the decision has been made.

Footslogger
02-21-2007, 22:11
You are WISE to admit and accept that up front. You may have heard about 2003. Some say it was the wettest year on record for the AT. Not sure about that ...but I can tell you that a lot of hikers quit early because they were not MENTALLY prepared to deal with the constant wetness.

Regardless of how wet 2007 ends up being you ARE going to get wet and most like STAY WET for days in a row. Make fun of it, joke about it, complain about it ...but DEAL !!

Have a great hike !!

'Slogger

rafe
02-21-2007, 22:15
Except in the dead of winter, I've never worn down garments for hiking. And even then, layering is a lot more versatile. So my advice is to stash the down if there's any rain at all. Save the down for inside the shelter or tent, where it's guaranteed to stay dry.

peanuts
02-21-2007, 22:17
socrates, don't wear the down while hiking. leave it for camp. just layer up and accept that you will get wet!

Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-21-2007, 22:27
If it is cold enough to wear down for hiking, it won't be raining, it will snowing. Keep your down with your sleeping bag or in a separate waterproof sack.

Socrates
02-21-2007, 22:34
If it is cold enough to wear down for hiking, it won't be raining, it will be snowing.

Of course! DUH! The perfect explanation! I forgot all about the freezing point on that one. haha I swear if my head weren't screwed on...

Lone Wolf
02-21-2007, 22:35
Ok, not really, but it does have to do with thunderstorms and rain. I have no problems getting wet. I played in the mud as a kid and with fourwheelers as a teen. Me and messy conditions have no issues. However, my down jacket might have something to say about it. Day after day of rain or even a few hours of hard downpour, I have a NF Venture Raincoat to help protect me, but the word is "YOU'RE GOING TO GET WET!" Anyone want to give advice on wearing a down jacket or even share a useful story? NO advice on switching to a different material please. I leave Saturday and the decision has been made.

you ain't gonna make it

rickb
02-21-2007, 22:40
Geese get wet and do OK.

Socrates
02-21-2007, 22:47
you ain't gonna make it

Wow LW, you've actually finally disappointed me with your negativity, but not discouraged me in the slightest and that's all that really matters. What makes you think that? Because I'm unexperienced and ask silly questions? Hmm I asked silly questions when I was 15 and scuba diving in the ocean, 16 and flying planes solo over my town, 18 and wondering around Australia and mountains of Hawaii, 20 surviving in Los Angeles, 22 being a police officer, and any other thing I've done with my life. It's what I do and you shouldn't prejudge anyone without knowing them. I'm more of a survivornthan you have any idea about and when I set my mind to something, it gets done. So remind me in Damascus and I'll wave and tell you you're number one. :D

Jim Adams
02-21-2007, 23:08
Even in cold weather, down is too hot to hike in so just use your under layers and the rain jacket. You will be amazed how warm this will keep you while walking. Your body will also begin to adapt to the temperatures outdoors and your comfort level will be at alot lower temp than at home.
As the others have stated, the down is very useful but 99.9% of the time it is for camp.
Good luck and have fun!

geek

Lone Wolf
02-21-2007, 23:15
Wow LW, you've actually finally disappointed me with your negativity, but not discouraged me in the slightest and that's all that really matters. What makes you think that? Because I'm unexperienced and ask silly questions? Hmm I asked silly questions when I was 15 and scuba diving in the ocean, 16 and flying planes solo over my town, 18 and wondering around Australia and mountains of Hawaii, 20 surviving in Los Angeles, 22 being a police officer, and any other thing I've done with my life. It's what I do and you shouldn't prejudge anyone without knowing them. I'm more of a survivornthan you have any idea about and when I set my mind to something, it gets done. So remind me in Damascus and I'll wave and tell you you're number one. :D

sorry guy. you just seem so unsure of yourself. hope to see you in damascus.

VictoriaM
02-21-2007, 23:16
Wow LW, you've actually finally disappointed me with your negativity, but not discouraged me in the slightest and that's all that really matters. What makes you think that? Because I'm unexperienced and ask silly questions?

No, he just says that to everyone. Don't mind Wolfy, he's all bark. ;)

Lone Wolf
02-21-2007, 23:18
No, he just says that to everyone. Don't mind Wolfy, he's all bark. ;)

no honey, most don't make it. a thru-hike is a marathon.

Blissful
02-22-2007, 00:35
no honey, most don't make it. a thru-hike is a marathon.

Yes indeed, a marathon, but hey, with all these great minds on WB getting us ready with boatloads of advice, all WB members are assured they will finish -

Won't they?

Hmmm? ;)

Socrates
02-22-2007, 00:39
sorry guy. you just seem so unsure of yourself. hope to see you in damascus.

Nah, I'm very confident in my endurance. I'm into philosophy so being curious is my nature, not to be mistaken for a weakness. Sometimes, I let people perceive me that way because it's their mistake and only to my advantage.

Bryan Mc
02-22-2007, 01:16
just when i thought LW couldnt lose any more respect, he went and raised the bar. well how about you stop beign a prick and just not say anything at all. i think victoria m has a superb point about LW having not bite. no bite at all.
socrates, i wish you well on your thru and i hope you show LW that he once again has no idea what he is talking about.

sham on

Sly
02-22-2007, 01:27
Wow LW, you've actually finally disappointed me with your negativity, but not discouraged me in the slightest and that's all that really matters. What makes you think that? Because I'm unexperienced and ask silly questions? Hmm I asked silly questions when I was 15 and scuba diving in the ocean, 16 and flying planes solo over my town, 18 and wondering around Australia and mountains of Hawaii, 20 surviving in Los Angeles, 22 being a police officer, and any other thing I've done with my life. It's what I do and you shouldn't prejudge anyone without knowing them. I'm more of a survivornthan you have any idea about and when I set my mind to something, it gets done. So remind me in Damascus and I'll wave and tell you you're number one. :D

All your previous experiences are admirable, but thru-hiking is different. Best of luck and fortitude...

rafe
02-22-2007, 01:28
Socrates, you'll be fine. Ask all the questions you want but remember that it's nobody's hike but yours. Make the most of it, and do whatever you have to do to keep it fun. Have a great hike.

Sly
02-22-2007, 01:34
just when i thought LW couldnt lose any more respect, he went and raised the bar. well how about you stop beign a prick and just not say anything at all.

Oh man, no need to egg him on! :D :p Relax... you don't think Socrates is going to quit because LW think so, do you? If anything, I see his "advice" as a nudge to tough it out.

Schulo
02-22-2007, 01:40
It really is amazing how in this world of electronics some people lose all ability to remain polite and hopeful. Thru hiking is not a marathon, if it were thru hiking would be a competitive sport. Its your hike do it the way you most enjoy and have fun.

emerald
02-22-2007, 01:46
20some miles out and he's looking for a hostel.:rolleyes: 1 in 25 chance.

Anyone remember that post? What we need now is a post from MinnesotaSmith!

RAT
02-22-2007, 01:46
If its raining it wont be cold enough for a down jacket. I have a nice marmot and have never used it cept for a pillow, its just too hot to hike in only good for stops when its really cold. Leave it in your pack when its raining, you will be fine long as your moving, you can put it on when you stop when you have shelter. Dont worry about it or Wolfy will be correct, you wont make it.

RAT

rafe
02-22-2007, 01:49
Anyone remember that post?

Is Socrates this year's MS? ;) Nah...

emerald
02-22-2007, 02:03
Is Socrates this year's MS? ;) Nah...

Wasn't suggesting that. Each hike is as different as the hikers who hike them. My point was don't mind the naysayers.

MinnesotaSmith does have a great signature. A post from him even if he doesn't say anything would add something.

Socrates
02-22-2007, 02:23
This isn't the place to share the details of my life, but I will say that just last December, I ended up in the ER, stopped breathing, got put on a machine, and spent 3 days in a coma. For me, this isn't just a hike or an escape or party in the woods or even a personal accomplishment. Life has it's ups and downs no matter how rich or poor you are, no matter where you are or where you go, or how positve or negative you try to be. I choose to live. I choose to experience life in as many broad perspectives as I can bceuase that's living. None of us know about the others personal life. Mine, for example, can get no worse. Traveling with a pack and enjoying the sights and sounds and new faces and the journey of walking meditaion is something to be appreciated and something that maybe some of those who left the trail failed, failed to hold on to the bigger picture. But for each, the reason for being out there is diferent so I can only speak for myself. But in my opinion nothing good comes easy and really, isn't that the way it should be? If this hike was nothing but fun, I wouldn't want to do it. I learn from from pain, frustration, and anger, and fear. That's who I am and I love learning. Blah blah this is just another post right? Eh well, there ya go... Thanks for the positives and look foward to seeing you guys out there.

Bryan Mc
02-22-2007, 02:24
Oh man, no need to egg him on! :D :p Relax... you don't think Socrates is going to quit because LW think so, do you? If anything, I see his "advice" as a nudge to tough it out.

this 'nudging to tough it out' doesnt seem to me to be a good thing. i really dont see how some people take these comments as positive thinking. i guess i was just brought up the wrong way.

i guess theres one in every crowd.

Sly
02-22-2007, 02:45
this 'nudging to tough it out' doesnt seem to me to be a good thing. i really dont see how some people take these comments as positive thinking. i guess i was just brought up the wrong way.


I tend to doubt you've ever thru-hiked the AT. Lots of people have doubts along the way whether they're going got to make it or not, and think about quitting. Joking or not, Socrates, started this thread in doubt. Basically, LW agreed.

Socrates
02-22-2007, 02:59
Joking or not, Socrates, started this thread in doubt. Basically, LW agreed.

At no point did my thread ever consist of doubt. My thread subject was a joke about quitting because of thunderstorms. The actual thread was a very specific question about "RAIN AND DOWN JACKETS" and NOTHING to do with my ability to survive or endure the AT. Anyone who confuses this with a "Help me. I'm just a wittle hiker and scared of the dark. Pwease discouwage me." really didn't read the question. Thank God, I'm not out to prove anything to anyone or this would be one hell of a trip. sometimes I notice that there are versions of Simons from American Idol on here... And no, I don't watch the show.

Singe03
02-22-2007, 03:12
Down and water do not mix very well man, it will compress and lose alot of it's loft or insulation, not to mention get far more heavy than it's worth and will take ages to dry. Fact is that your going to spend some days soaked to the bone and the best bet is good layering and a warm dry bag to get in to atnight.

NOTHING in the world wakes you up as fast as pulling on a pair shorts, still soaking wet from the previous day's hiking, on a 35 degree morning right after crawling out of a warm sleeping bag.

RAT
02-22-2007, 03:20
Yep and putting them wet boots back on ;)

RAT

Sly
02-22-2007, 03:23
At no point did my thread ever consist of doubt. My thread subject was a joke about quitting because of thunderstorms. The actual thread was a very specific question about "RAIN AND DOWN JACKETS" and NOTHING to do with my ability to survive or endure the AT.

That's what you think, I see your post loaded with doubt. How long have you been around? You're asking if down and rain mix? Right.

Socrates
02-22-2007, 03:33
That's what you think, I see your post loaded with doubt. How long have you been around? You're asking if down and rain mix? Right.

No, I didn't ask if they mix. To quote myself,... "Me and messy conditions have no issues. However, my down jacket might have something to say about it."... Which infers that I already know that down and rain don't mix. I then went on to mention rain rain and more rain and the fact that I have a raincoat for protection... Leading one to believe that I know my down jacket should be protected from rain... The point was about down when it gets wet and for others to share stories of their own experiences with wet down.

Sly
02-22-2007, 03:43
No, I didn't ask if they mix. To quote myself,... "Me and messy conditions have no issues. However, my down jacket might have something to say about it."... Which infers that I already know that down and rain don't mix. I then went on to mention rain rain and more rain and the fact that I have a raincoat for protection... Leading one to believe that I know my down jacket should be protected from rain... The point was about down when it gets wet and for others to share stories of their own experiences with wet down.


Whatever dude, just go hike the trail and stop fretting. :rolleyes:

Socrates
02-22-2007, 04:03
Whatever dude, just go hike the trail and stop fretting. :rolleyes:

I'm not fretting. I'm bored and talking is what I do best. I'm in a small part of Florida. Not many philosophers and hikers running around down here especially on my sleep schedule. Better than wasting my money at some bar every night or getting fat with french fries watching the boob tube, although I do love me some South Park and Colbert Report. That's why I moved up my departure date. I can't wait to get out there and start stinking.

rattler60
02-22-2007, 04:43
Yeah but have ya noticed that Socrates is full of questions and deep statements. But I posted a question to him about his newfandangled tent and no reply. Just a taker not a giver. Look at me. Hear me. Here I am over here. I've only got time to ask the questions, not answer them. I am only here for my benefit. phht.

Socrates
02-22-2007, 04:52
Yeah but have ya noticed that Socrates is full of questions and deep statements. But I posted a question to him about his newfandangled tent and no reply. Just a taker not a giver. Look at me. Hear me. Here I am over here. I've only got time to ask the questions, not answer them. I am only here for my benefit. phht.

If I see a question, I'll answer it. So I'm sorry bout that. I don't know when or where you posted it, but I never saw it. If you took it that seriously, you should have just sent me a PM or email. Like I've said, I love to talk. So what's the question?

Socrates
02-22-2007, 05:11
Yeah but have ya noticed that Socrates is full of questions and deep statements. But I posted a question to him about his newfandangled tent and no reply. Just a taker not a giver. Look at me. Hear me. Here I am over here. I've only got time to ask the questions, not answer them. I am only here for my benefit. phht.

Nevermind, I found the question. I never measured the pack size and I tried to find it on google for you, but coudn't find it there either. With the floor pulled back and the vestibule open, there is enough room to sleep. I'm 6'4" and I fit without bending, but barely. However, my sleeping pad is square and 6ft so it wouldn't fit if there were two of them side by side because of the angles at the ends of the tent. But 2 people on shorter pads could sleep side by side, no problem.

Blue Jay
02-22-2007, 06:09
Is Socrates this year's MS? ;) Nah...

Now that's just plain mean. Even I the King of Mean would never call anyone that, even Fitz. I'm very glad you added the Nah.

hopefulhiker
02-22-2007, 08:43
I saw 10 year olds that have completed the hike. It's just a matter of preference I think if one is not injured and still has the money to do it... Also I would try to keep the down dry in with the sleeping bag.. thats the best way.. When you are walking you generate a lot of heat. I saw people walking in the snow with shorts....

icemanat95
02-22-2007, 09:20
Expect to get wet and stay wet and that's survivable, Wet and COLD is a problem. Protect your down coat from the wet as best you can. I would avoid hiking in it if possible except under the coldest of conditions when your physical output isn't up to the heat loss to the air.

If your down coat does get wet, and you are days from a town stop where you can dry it out quickly, you are going to want to start the process on the trail by wearing it in camp. Your body heat will drive out some of the moisture trapped in the down. If you can stand it, bring it into your sleeping bag , where again, your body heat will drive out moisture (into the sleeping bag unfortunately. If some enterprising person starts a fire in camp, that's a nice opportunity as well, but keep the coat out of range of sparks and such since the ultraweight fabrics used by most makers now will fail instantly under that heat.

Protect the coat. Don't sacrifice dry inside the pack storage for your coat in the name of weight savings...that's a bad trade off.

rafe
02-22-2007, 09:28
Now that's just plain mean. Even I the King of Mean would never call anyone that, even Fitz. I'm very glad you added the Nah.

Wasn't meant as mean, it was a reply to ShadesofGray's query in Msg #21.

rafe
02-22-2007, 09:55
I tend to doubt you've ever thru-hiked the AT. Lots of people have doubts along the way whether they're going got to make it or not, and think about quitting. Joking or not, Socrates, started this thread in doubt. Basically, LW agreed.

LW did what Warren Doyle and Ward Leonard have often done. Doesn't make it right. Self-doubt is one thing, but having someone else say it -- I just don't see where that's ever helpful. It's absolutely contary to "HYOH".

Every thru-hiker-wannabe worries about "making it to K." I suggest that's the wrong mindset; the more immediate concern ought to be keeping it fun. Worry about K when you get to Gorham. By then you ought to know. ;)

superman
02-22-2007, 10:29
You've already gotten the straight information on down and layering. Yes, no rain, no Maine. The problem I had was adjusting my layers where I was warm but not sweating. The issue was that if my front torso was warm my back was sweating. If my back was comfortable, my front torso was cold. So I found it worked best for me if I wore my fleece and/or light plastic rain coat backwards. If I got a little too warm I let them slip out on my arms more and if I needed more warms I shifted it close to my torso. I didn't care much about being wet but staying at a comfortable temperature was my issue. I also had a hat with a brim that kept the rain out of my eyes. I couldn't wear my eyeglasses because they fogged up too much in the rain. My eyes seemed to get better as I hiked such that I could hike with out them after a while. I had great eyes until my late 40's and by the time I hiked they and I were still in a state of change. I can't hike with out my glasses now. Enjoy your hike.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-22-2007, 10:30
Best of luck to you, Sorates. Don't let the nay-sayers get to you. You will either make it or you won't.... either way you will have grown spiritually from having started and tried.... and in the end that is far more important than passing every white blaze or walking from GA to ME.

Gray Blazer
02-22-2007, 10:36
You are WISE to admit and accept that up front. You may have heard about 2003. Some say it was the wettest year on record for the AT. Not sure about that ...but I can tell you that a lot of hikers quit early because they were not MENTALLY prepared to deal with the constant wetness.

Regardless of how wet 2007 ends up being you ARE going to get wet and most like STAY WET for days in a row. Make fun of it, joke about it, complain about it ...but DEAL !!

Have a great hike !!

'SloggerI heard about 2003. Some guy from Gainesville, FL was thruin' and journalin' to our newspaper every week and all he talked about was the rain and the jungle rot on his feet. I think he got a permanent case of jungle rot. I hope you have better luck.

Smile
02-22-2007, 11:10
Socrates - you get out there and have a great hike!

Don't sweat all this stuff - it's normal to second guess yourself, but just get on the trail. You'll be out there, and you won't have any choice but to do the right thing, wear the righ thing, think things through to keep yourself as safe as possible and comfortable as possible!

So far everybody's given you great advice - leave the down for camp/night - it's like a special treat at the end of the day and something to look forward to.

Remember, just getting out there and starting is one of the toughest parts-You can do this :)

the_iceman
02-22-2007, 11:28
I would sweat to death if I hiked in down. Dress on the cool side and KEEP MOVING until camp then put on the down that was deep in your pack all day and dry. If it is 45 or more I hike in shorts and a t-shirt. You can use the rain jacket if you need to stop to seal in the body heat for a few minutes but I try to not stop for more than a minute.

I also try not to take my pack off either because you lose tons of heat from your core when you expose you sweaty back. Plus it sucks putting the wet pack back on. Keep a pace that regulates your body temperature in cold or wet weather.

jesse
02-22-2007, 11:30
I do love me some South Park and Colbert Report
Man, I thoght there was hope for you until then. You should be watching"King of the Hill" and "O'Riely Factor"

Disclaimer: This was a joke. No need to get nasty and flame me.

Best wishes Socrates. Have fun, enjoy.

hopefulhiker
02-22-2007, 11:44
I must admit that approaching Mt Rogers during a bad thunderstorm I did fear for my life.. I had come out into an unprotected bald and lightening was striking all around. I could feel it in my belly. Somehow I made it through... Looking back I should have stayed down low in the trees and waited the storm out instead of crossing the open bald...

Boat Drinks
02-22-2007, 12:15
This isn't the place to share the details of my life, but I will say that just last December, I ended up in the ER, stopped breathing, got put on a machine, and spent 3 days in a coma. For me, this isn't just a hike or an escape or party in the woods or even a personal accomplishment. Life has it's ups and downs no matter how rich or poor you are, no matter where you are or where you go, or how positve or negative you try to be. I choose to live. I choose to experience life in as many broad perspectives as I can bceuase that's living. None of us know about the others personal life. Mine, for example, can get no worse. Traveling with a pack and enjoying the sights and sounds and new faces and the journey of walking meditaion is something to be appreciated and something that maybe some of those who left the trail failed, failed to hold on to the bigger picture. But for each, the reason for being out there is diferent so I can only speak for myself. But in my opinion nothing good comes easy and really, isn't that the way it should be? If this hike was nothing but fun, I wouldn't want to do it. I learn from from pain, frustration, and anger, and fear. That's who I am and I love learning. Blah blah this is just another post right? Eh well, there ya go... Thanks for the positives and look foward to seeing you guys out there.


I hope to run into you out there. I think we'll have some great discussions!:sun

Marta
02-22-2007, 13:05
I don't think it's hostile or negative to face the facts--most people who start AT thru-hikes choose to quit. They don't have to quit; they choose to quit. I think it's just dumb to pretend that's anything other than the truth.

If anything, I think you help yourself prepare mentally if you ackowledge how difficult it's going to be and that your chance of success is pretty small. If you do that, when it turns out to be harder--or at least longer--than you expected (even if you already expect it to be pretty long and hard), you won't be surprised and feel betrayed and lied to.

I wish all the 2007 starters the best of luck, and happy trails, and all that.

Here's the TJ of a couple of kids I'll be specially cheering on. They're from Hanover, NH, and I hiked with them for a couple of weeks last summer.

http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?trailname=5317

Cheers to the Class of 2007!
Marta/Five-Leaf

Bryan Mc
02-23-2007, 03:11
I tend to doubt you've ever thru-hiked the AT. Lots of people have doubts along the way whether they're going got to make it or not, and think about quitting. Joking or not, Socrates, started this thread in doubt. Basically, LW agreed.


of course ive never hiked thru hiked the AT, thus the reason for my thru hike this march. and im oh so glad that you were able to realize it. i was affraid no one would be able to, because of you and your ignorance towards just about everything this site stands for, i can now sleep soundly and rest assure knowing that l wolf isnt the only jerk on this whiteblaze. as for all of you who seem to agree with the fact that negative vibes are just being honest and giving the truth of the situation, lets think of it a different way. how about, lets give the truth and tell everyone what should be expected rather than just jump the gun and tell someone theyre screwed. pick on all of the rookie thru hikers all you want, i doubt any one of us 'rookies' will bow down to you because you think youre way is the right way and asking questions and doing things differently will land you back at home. if you really want to know about someone and their outdoor abilities, why dont you just ask them before you make belittling comments, you may find out that some of us have a lot more experience at a younger age than you 'elders' and some of us may have a lot more experience long distance hiking, running trekking programs, and this 'gear knowlege' that you all think you have right down pat and can flaunt in a biased rage. you want to put your name on it and see who really has the last word when it comes to information on what 70% of what this site talks about, give it a go and stop pushing everyone else around. youre just bullying because you have insecurities that need to be hidden behind your comments and its a load of bull.

as for sly and his genious comment, i hope you make a pleasant visit to l wolf in damascus. throw a 'how are ya?' at my way. ill be the one next to Socrates waving 'youre number one' with a different finger.

and in closing i bid you all adieu until someone can show some real 'advice' and positive input.

Socrates
02-23-2007, 07:08
Anyone ever tried Jalapeno Boiled Peanuts? My nose is running and my tongue is on fire... Yet I can't put them down. YUMMY!

Socrates
02-23-2007, 07:10
Anyone ever tried Jalapeno Boiled Peanuts? My nose is running and my tongue is on fire... Yet I can't put them down. YUMMY!

Oops! I hope I poop them out before Saturday or my first hole in the ground will be a mess!

Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-23-2007, 07:40
and in closing i bid you all adieu until someone can show some real 'advice' and positive input.Bryan - people that make you face the realities of what you are about to undertake are your friends - the giddy cheerleaders who ignore reality may be your friends, but they aren't doing you any favor by ignoring reality. LW & Sly have thru'ed several times each - they know how tough it is and you don't yet.

A wise man learns from the experience of others who have gone before. A foolish man remakes the mistakes for himself. I submit that more wise men make it from ME to GA or GA to ME than foolish men.

Marta
02-23-2007, 07:41
Oops! I hope I poop them out before Saturday or my first hole in the ground will be a mess!

There are privies every few miles in Georgia. No cat holes needed.

Marta/Five-Leaf

Marta
02-23-2007, 07:52
you may find out that some of us have a lot more experience at a younger age than you 'elders' and some of us may have a lot more experience long distance hiking, running trekking programs, and this 'gear knowlege' that you all think you have right down pat and can flaunt in a biased rage.


Pride goeth before the fall, my young friend. All I'm saying is that completing a long-distance hike is hard, and lots more people quit than finish. I make no predictions at all about your chances, or Socrates' chances--or experience, or commitment. I wish you all the best, and if I run into you this spring when I'm out hiking on the weekends, I'll give you a ride to town, or help you out in any way I can.

But I sincerely doubt that you have "a lot more experience" in this area than either LW, Sly, or even a relative lightweight in the arena like myself...since I went through Outward Bound well before you were born, and have been hiking ever since.

No one ever knows that they'll finish until they do. I'm only 97% finished, and while I expect to finish, it's possible that I won't. Or that I'll choose not to. I don't regard that as a negative concept, but a statement of fact.

Marta/Five-Leaf

Jaybird
02-23-2007, 08:02
Ok, not really, but it does have to do with thunderstorms and rain. I have no problems getting wet. ...................."YOU'RE GOING TO GET WET!" Anyone want to give advice on wearing a down jacket or even share a useful story? NO advice on switching to a different material please. I leave Saturday and the decision has been made.




NO RAIN...NO PAIN...NO MAINE!:D

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 08:59
of course ive never hiked thru hiked the AT, i can now sleep soundly and rest assure knowing that l wolf isnt the only jerk on this whiteblaze.

as for sly and his genious comment, i hope you make a pleasant visit to l wolf in damascus. throw a 'how are ya?' at my way. ill be the one next to Socrates waving 'youre number one' with a different finger.



Now Bryan, you need a chill pill.:) Sly and I are total experts. We are #1. It's true I'm a jerk but Sly isn't. Stop by Dot's for a beer and chat. If you make it to Damascus. Just remember not to take this internet forum crap so seriously.:)

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 09:10
Yes indeed, a marathon, but hey, with all these great minds on WB getting us ready with boatloads of advice, all WB members are assured they will finish -

Won't they?

Hmmm? ;)

advice and gear don't get you to Katahdin

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 09:15
Oh man, no need to egg him on! :D :p Relax... you don't think Socrates is going to quit because LW think so, do you? If anything, I see his "advice" as a nudge to tough it out.

Bryan is young. He's feeling his oats. Plus he's letting me get to him and I never had discussion with him here. He likes me.:)

Outlaw
02-23-2007, 09:28
A wise man learns from the experience of others who have gone before. A foolish man remakes the mistakes for himself. I submit that more wise men make it from ME to GA or GA to ME than foolish men.

FD: Well said. Why re-invent the wheel when you can learn from those who have "been there and done that"? :-?

On the otherhand, one may need to adapt other's knowledge and experience to their own unique situation, e.g. LW said in another thread, "Hanging food is not for me. Neither are Leki poles, filtering/treating water, or crossing the Kennebec in a canoe." :eek: All that may be okay for LW, but it may not be the best advise for others. :confused: All this goes to support the concept of HYOH, but keep in mind the advise offered by those who have done it all before... some many times over.:D

rafe
02-23-2007, 09:36
Geez, has it occured to anyone that LW is just wrong and lucky? Consider the young cocky fella in "Grizzly Man." Defied the odds for 14 years or so... but eventually he became some grizzly's dinner.

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 09:40
Geez, has it occured to anyone that LW is just wrong and lucky? Consider the young cocky fella in "Grizzly Man." Defied the odds for 14 years or so... but eventually he became some grizzly's dinner.

The AT is full of grizzlys. I'm very lucky.:eek: I'm right and lucky.

rafe
02-23-2007, 09:48
Just sayin' Wolf. You like to live dangerously, and that's fine -- for you. It's not necessarily good advice for anyone else. You thrive on "being different" (it's in your moniker) and that's who you are. But occasionally there's truth in the "conventional wisdom." You say I'm a pussy for using Lekis or filtering my water, but these things are not for you to decide.

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 09:53
Just sayin' Wolf. You like to live dangerously, and that's fine -- for you. It's not necessarily good advice for anyone else. You thrive on "being different" (it's in your moniker) and that's who you are. But occasionally there's truth in the "conventional wisdom." You say I'm a pussy for using Lekis or filtering my water, but these things are not for you to decide.

hey buttmunch, go to the other thread and read. i didn't "advise" anybody. i said don't listen to me, i'm a bad influence. as far as you being a puss. if the shoe fits..

rafe
02-23-2007, 10:10
hey buttmunch, go to the other thread and read. i didn't "advise" anybody. i said don't listen to me, i'm a bad influence. as far as you being a puss. if the shoe fits..

Well, that's a fair start. You admit to being a bad influence, and I'll admit to being a wuss. :) Knock wood, I've been farting around in the woods for a few years myself... and I take my safety seriously, 'cuz I want to be doing it for a whole lot longer.

rafe
02-23-2007, 10:22
I submit that more wise men make it from ME to GA or GA to ME than foolish men.

Now there's an interesting and infinitely debatable philosophical issue. :) Of course, any given individual might be wise about some things and foolish about others. The wisdom that gets you from GA to ME won't necessarily bring success in relationships, marriage, parenting, school, career, or other things that matter hugely in "real life."

Biloxi
02-23-2007, 10:44
ok..I have been watching this thread since it's birth and it took the course I knew it would, witha ''wolf attack''..here on WB two things are certain..1.when warren doyell post''anything'' Jack will follow...COUNT ON IT and 2. Lone Wolf is gonna piss on just about everything else..unless it comes from a female..COUNT ON IT..but you have to take wolf with a grain of salt..why he can be negative and crude in his rants or statements and often steps on toes before knowing to whom they are attached..he is usualy just trying to draw a flame and is harmless to all but himself:-? ..Wolf I really wish you would chill on making such blanket statements to people you know nothing of..I know you are proubly one of the most knowledgable people as to the AT,so use that to teach others instead of belittleing them..my fear is you will inflame someone ..not realy trying to and will recieve a visitor @ Dots while haveing a cold 1 for something you said who knows when..just because you dont take something as serious doesnt meen someone else wont..I know when I 1st got to WB you pissed me off a few times..but now I know how you operate;) just friendly advice..wolf does know his stuff as does Jack..good luck to ALL

Bloodroot
02-23-2007, 11:26
Everyone is way too serious. Some people are adherant to their own personal safety as others are more self-reliant on the environment. As for me, I don't filter water unless its standing. Never had a problem, but would it still be considered bad advice to tell someone that?

Sly
02-23-2007, 11:27
as for sly and his genious comment, i hope you make a pleasant visit to l wolf in damascus. throw a 'how are ya?' at my way. ill be the one next to Socrates waving 'youre number one' with a different finger.

and in closing i bid you all adieu until someone can show some real 'advice' and positive input.

You want some real advice and positive input? Waved that finger at me and you're likely to find it broken.

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 11:56
..my fear is you will inflame someone ..not realy trying to and will recieve a visitor @ Dots while haveing a cold 1 for something you said who knows when..just because you dont take something as serious doesnt meen someone else wont..

well if that happens then that person has a real problem. this is just an internet forum, not to be taken serious. there's people on here that tick me off to the point that i'm typing with TWO fingers but i would never physically confront them in person. viginia is for lovers:) no time for fightin'.

Blissful
02-23-2007, 12:00
advice and gear don't get you to Katahdin

What does?

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 12:01
What does?

mental toughness

Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-23-2007, 12:04
Mental toughness and certain amount of luck / hedge of protection....

Blissful
02-23-2007, 12:07
mental toughness


Thanks!!!

A thru told me that back on my very first stay at shelter long ago it's 90% mental.

Glad I had a little training pain wise anyway. Won't get into all my personal pain-filled struggle of the past, but I think it has been good mental training. Besides giving birth without pain medication or anethesia... ha ha
And of course, just getting out and hiking, going through different situations, being adaptable, etc. For us, it was the Whites. I am SO glad I did training there!

RobKimball
02-23-2007, 12:15
All this fuss over a down coat and a walk in the woods... boy, I'd love to see y'all delve into politics or religion!

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 12:16
All this fuss over a down coat and a walk in the woods... boy, I'd love to see y'all delve into politics or religion!

... or fording the Kennebec.:eek:

Boat Drinks
02-23-2007, 12:18
Mental toughness and certain amount of luck / hedge of protection....
We create our own "Luck". The Law of Attraction says positive attracts positive. If you can see it, believe it, it will happen. But it takes discipline to do this, its not easy, and it shouldn't be easy.

Sly
02-23-2007, 12:23
Thanks!!!

A thru told me that back on my very first stay at shelter long ago it's 90% mental.


Certainly hiking under similar conditions beforehand helps tremendously. I wish I was doing more of it this time around. You (not you in particular) really need to give it four-six weeks before it's starts getting easier, but easier means more miles, more pain. By that time you'll know what it takes and baring any injuries you'll have no excuse not to finish. Of course, lots of people will still make them and leave the trail for one reason or another, but I don't think you'll find more than 1 person, if that, that will say it wasn't worth it.

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 12:29
my first time i quit in gorham, n.h., 300 miles from katahdin. physically i was fine. i was haulin' ass up and down the trail with a 40+ lb pack. i just burned out on hiking. time had come to move on to something else. a thru-hike is a marathon. you really gotta want to finish.

REBELYELL
02-23-2007, 12:32
When so many wannabees trying, It's now hard to take anyone serious past Pearisburg or at least waynsboro-Staunton If by then........Diss the Wolf

rafe
02-23-2007, 12:48
For us, it was the Whites. I am SO glad I did training there!

Yeah, that's what I thought, too. Figured I had it licked. What could be harder than the Whites, huh? ;) Wolf's right -- it's about mental toughness or somethin' like that. It's about willingness to endure a lot of *****t -- all the while knowing that you're really only doing it for yourself, and nobody else. And don't be tellin' me that you're doing it all for PB's benefit, Blissful... there will be times when one or both of you will have your doubts...

Sorry I don't mean to be so negative. But there are folks that quit in VA, and folks that quit in PA, and folks that quit in Gorham... :D. First time I heard that story from LW, I was amazed. Actually, I still am.

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 12:56
First time I heard that story from LW, I was amazed. Actually, I still am.

but i think i told you that the GOAL of getting to katahdin ended when i got to hot springs that year. i was burning out. i took some days off and promised myself to keep walking till it wasn't fun anymore. that was my new goal. beginning and ending meant nothing. just being out there. i've seen tons of miserable hikers plodding thru n.h. and maine not enjoying it. sad.

REBELYELL
02-23-2007, 12:58
Hey man ***** happens.It always will.But Wolf is right The numbers don't lie!

jesse
02-23-2007, 13:00
A thru told me that back on my very first stay at shelter long ago it's 90% mental.

I believe it was yogi berra who said, "winning was 90% inspiration, the other half was prespiration"

Lone Wolf
02-23-2007, 13:04
Thanks!!!

A thru told me that back on my very first stay at shelter long ago it's 90% mental.

Glad I had a little training pain wise anyway. Won't get into all my personal pain-filled struggle of the past, but I think it has been good mental training. Besides giving birth without pain medication or anethesia... ha ha
And of course, just getting out and hiking, going through different situations, being adaptable, etc. For us, it was the Whites. I am SO glad I did training there!

"The more you sweat in training the less you bleed in war" saw this on a billboard at Parris Island back in 77 when i spent 3 months there for summer camp.

Blissful
02-23-2007, 13:14
. And don't be tellin' me that you're doing it all for PB's benefit, Blissful... there will be times when one or both of you will have your doubts...



Good post.

Nope, I am not doing it solely for Paul Bunyan's benefit. This was my dream back when I was his age. I wonder where that little grey data book I bought from the ATC went - my first AT purchase when I was 14, along with Ed Garvey's first book (just read it again). :) But it has grown into something for him as well. He has become a part of the dream, not the reason. And he will have to endure it in his own way. I liked it when one hiker talked of completing the trail right after HS. Then when she went to college, nothing fazed her. Hope that happens to PB. Hope he wll be able to do even greater challenges b/c of this trip. That this will do something in him nothing else can.

Yes, I'm sure there will be doubts along the way. I've struggled with tons of doubts even leading up to this (as my blog will attest). Guess this is where my beliefs come into play. And my belief that Someone greater is watching out for me, who knows my weaknesses, who is faithful. And I've seen His help time and time again.

Boat Drinks
02-23-2007, 13:49
I believe it was yogi berra who said, "winning was 90% inspiration, the other half was prespiration"
No no no, Yogi said: Baseball is 90 percent mental. The other half is physical. I love that guy!:D

Spirit Walker
02-23-2007, 18:51
This discussion may sound negative, but the reality is most thruhikers do quit for reasons other than a physical inability to continue. As Grandma Gatewood said, "It's more head than heel."

It has little to do with experience. I've met folks on the AT who had never put on a backpack before they got on the trail. They walked all the way to Katahdin. I've known others who had a lot of experience backpacking who got bored and went home in NC.

Experience can make a difference in that a lot of people have a very romanticized view of backpacking. Truth is, it can be very hard work. It can be difficult to go out in all weathers, day after day, hiking all day every day. If you've been out on some long hikes you have some understanding of what that means, but unless you've done a long hike, you won't really know what thruhiking is like until you actually do it. It is different when you can go home if the weather turns bad, or you can pick and choose your times so you get the best conditions. The tyranny of the miles gets to a lot of people, both experienced and inexperienced. On a short trip, you can always turn back or change your plans. On a thruhike, there is always the knowledge that getting to the end of the trail requires that you keep hiking - even when you don't really want to. There are exceptions, and it can be really nice to take a break for a day or two in the middle of a thruhike to rest up or go rafting, etc. But if you are going to reach your goal, you have to get back on track and start hiking again. And that can be hard for some people who discover that they no longer care about the goal.

Only you can decide whether the rewards you are getting out of thruhiking are worth the price (and I don't just mean money) you're required to pay to do the hike. An outsider can't know what rewards you are getting out of the experience or what the price is for you. For some it's physical pain, for others loneliness, for others boredom. Some love the lifestyle so much they don't feel there is much of a price - or the rewards are so great that it doesn't matter how high the price may be. But each individual is different. I long ago learned not to try to predict who would make it and who wouldn't. People constantly surprise me. And sometimes just being told, "You won't make it" is enough to make folks decide they really need to prove you wrong. The reward of being able to say "I did it" makes up for the moments when you ask yourself, "Why am I out here?" I've watched really enthusiastic wanna be hikers leave the trail before Damascus. And others who were dragged in by a friend or a spouse who caught the fever and went all the way.

greentick
02-23-2007, 19:32
Anyone ever tried Jalapeno Boiled Peanuts? My nose is running and my tongue is on fire... Yet I can't put them down. YUMMY!

I love to suffer when I eat:D