View Full Version : TOPO software
I have finally decided to break down and buy some TOPO software...
I have decided between 2. Delorme TOPO USA 6.0 and the National Geographic TOPO!
I just dont know what to do! I have Street Atlas by Delorme, so I am familiar with how it work and I like SA.
Any users of either of these progams have any input? Looking for pros and cons of both...
Thanks!
mountain squid
02-24-2007, 17:04
What are you planning on using it for? I have Topo USA and like it. If you are planning to use it for a thru hike, I wouldn't suggest it, though. In the long run, I believe it would be cheaper to buy the maps. Printing out more than a few pages, sucks the ink cartridge dry. And, unless you get some special paper($$$), they won't be waterproof. Also, the AT maps will have the shelters on them already, as well as the profiles.
Otherwise, I like Topo USA. Has good zoom features and quickly and easily finds places you specify. It is probably similar to Street Atlas and if you are already familiar with that...
See you on the trail,
mt squid
NICKTHEGREEK
02-24-2007, 17:44
I've has Topo! for at least 5 years and use the DC Baltimore Shenandoah regional set. The software is very well supported with free updates, the website has an exchange function where you can up/download trails (maps with personal mark-ups like shelters, good water, etc.
I print my own maps in detail and sizes I find convenient and I perfer those to the PATC AT maps (covers my locality) and USGS products. The maps are easily waterproofed by either laminating them or using document protectors.
There are several places where you can try the software out at maps kiosks at REI and LL Bean stores. Overall I'm very happy with the product and haven't found any reason to change. That said I don't download directly from my computer to my Magellan 270 GPS, I hand transfer landmarks, trailheads and waypoints when I need them for off AT hikes.
The one real advantage I've found is that the TOPO maps are derived from USGS product and have much more ancillary data such as side roads, fire trails and such that aren't always displayed on the PATC maps.
I found the software learning curve about average for all windows based applications so no fear there.
Good luck
generoll
02-24-2007, 18:14
Hiya Wendi:
I've got Topo! and Topo!GPS. I haven't used it lately, but having both can really be useful since you can save your track on your GPS and then download it to your computer and print out your hike. I've printed out the maps and it is nice to be able to size your map to your hike. It always seemed that wherever I went required two maps because invariably the location I was interested in lay along the margin of two (or more) maps. As long as your have a good supply of color cartridges it seemed useful to me. I never tried printing my maps in B&W. I suppose that would also be an option, don't know. Enjoy your Pinhoti hike.
I haven't used TOPO USA, but because they get the entire USA onto one DVD or several CDs, I think the scale is 1:100,000. I think it is the same basic product as National Geographic's BACKROADS EXPLORER.
If so, the program is good for a lot of things like general planning of trips, but I don't like that scale for hiking, not enough granularity for me.
If you want hiking quality topos, you really need the 1:24,000 scale (7.5 minute), and that is what NG calls the STATE SERIES. Delorme also has these maps, which they call Topo-Quad. These maps are good enough to use for hiking, and will look like the 20 or so APT maps Mr. Parkay posted in another thread.
Delorme sells the Alabama Topo-Quad maps on one DVD or several CDs. In NG's case, AL-GA-FL is bundled into one "state" package. It contains 10 CDs that cover all three states.
Going from 1:100,000 to 1:24,000 may not seem like much, but here is the difference between the two:
1:24000:
http://www.kgs.ku.edu/Datasale/Maps/seven.html
1:100,000:
http://www.kgs.ku.edu/Datasale/Maps/hund.html
Delorme sell states for $100 per state ($89 at 4x4 Books). NG sells the state series for $100 a pop. I just bought the AL-GA-FL set for $80 from 4x4 Books www.4x4books.com They sell DeLorme's TOPO USA 6.0 and National Geographic's BACKROADS EXPLORER for $45.
Hope this wasn't as confusing to read as it was to write :)
Delorme pioneered computer based mapping and remains the leader in my opinion. I just returned from the annual winter potluck supper of MATC at which a Delorme designer told of the many innovations of TOPO 6 that will make it easier and more versatile than ever. I wouldn't hesitate to buy it, especially if you are going to use it in connection with a GPS device.
Weary
Whoa... OK, Im using it for general mapping purposes only. To look at a trail, see what it will be like ( I like the "fly-thru" feature that both softwares have!) Dont know that Id be printing. I just need a visual before I head out... I would use it with a gps after the fact, by uploading my tracks to the program, so the program must be compatible with gps files (gpx, google earth and GSAK files)
I guess either are good programs. I was hoping for a cheaper out... Delorme does have the whole eastern US for only $50. While I cant find the exact "size" it uses, it does say that it had the 7.5 min quad maps. Are those the ones I want (the closest in with most detail?)
thanks for the link to 4x4 books and gpsnow... Thats where I had orginally bought my gps and mapsource software a few years back! Good pricing!
OK. Now what I need to know is:
Are the major long-trails (Pinhoti, BMT, GET etc) on any of these programs?
Which one(s) can I up load my tracks of the trail that Ive hiked to my computer from the gps?
I really do like NG's feature that has other users tracks available. I dont like having to buy each individual state...
The search continues...
Whichever program you choose, don't expect them to have up-to-date trail routes. Most, if not all, base their data on USGS quads, most of which is more than 20 years old. Buying maps from trail organizations is still the best way to go. I've used DeLorme Topo USA and I found it next to useless until I managed to import the AT centerline and shelter data. As to the newer trails like the Pinhoti, good luck with that!
Mr. Parkay
02-25-2007, 00:30
Whoa... OK, Im using it for general mapping purposes only. To look at a trail, see what it will be like ( I like the "fly-thru" feature that both softwares have!) Dont know that Id be printing. I just need a visual before I head out... I would use it with a gps after the fact, by uploading my tracks to the program, so the program must be compatible with gps files (gpx, google earth and GSAK files)
I guess either are good programs. I was hoping for a cheaper out... Delorme does have the whole eastern US for only $50. While I cant find the exact "size" it uses, it does say that it had the 7.5 min quad maps. Are those the ones I want (the closest in with most detail?)
thanks for the link to 4x4 books and gpsnow... Thats where I had orginally bought my gps and mapsource software a few years back! Good pricing!
OK. Now what I need to know is:
Are the major long-trails (Pinhoti, BMT, GET etc) on any of these programs?
Which one(s) can I up load my tracks of the trail that Ive hiked to my computer from the gps?
I really do like NG's feature that has other users tracks available. I dont like having to buy each individual state...
The search continues...
Hey AL hiker gal,
I think I can aswer some of your questions since I have recently purchased both National Geographic AL-GA-FL, and Delorme TOPO USA (V. 5.0 not 6.0)
I prefer National Geographic topo, since I like the look of the USGS topo maps. However, I don't like that it costs $100 per set.
I purchased Delorme TOPO usa 5.0 for $29 on ebay. I got it last week and it works great. I'd say this is probably best deal around.... I haven't used V. 6.0, so I'm not sure how much better it is.
You can load tracks from your GPS into both programs. Although, it took me a while to figure out how to do everthing. Neither of the programs have any long trails automatically included with them. But NG TOPO has Mapxchange, which is a nice way swap files. But if you dont have NG TOPO, you can extract the tracks from Mapxchange files for use with other programs like:
Google earth, Mapsend, and Delorme.
For example: if you go to the National Geographic MapXchange page you can search for trails by state. If you go to Georgia you will find a NG TOPO file for the Georgia sectioin of the BMT. Even if you don't have NG TOPO, you can use GPSbabel to convert the track to a google earth file... or convert it to .gpx to view in Mapsend. etc. etc. ... I can definitely help out if anyone needs to convert a track file from one format to another.... I've been doing it non stop for about 2 weeks now.
As for as which tracks exist... the BMT track in National Geographic TOPO is the most accurate one that I know of... but its not complete. My BMT google earth track covers the missing sections, but the accuracy isn't as good.
For the pinhoti, my google earth track is the best thing available at the moment. This can be converted for use within Delorme or NG TOPO.
I don't think theres any GPS info online for the GET. Let me know if you find some, I was looking for info on it just a couple of days ago. The same goes for the Mountains to Sea Trail....River To River Trail...etc..etc..
--Mr. Parkay
Mr. Parkay
02-25-2007, 00:32
I forgot to mention... delorme 5.0 is still availble on Ebay for $29. The guy still has about 5 or 6 more left.. I guess they fell off a truck.
Thanks Parkay! As long as I can get it into a gps file, I can get it into Delorme via GSAK. I wish you were closer, Id show you the program and how easy it is to use for importing and exporting waypoints!
(did a quick search... go to gsak.net) while the name implies its for geocaching, as long as you have a gpx file, you're good! this guy created the software for GC'ers to use to import the waypoints to several different programs and it became so popular (it think its only about $20) that hes quit his regular job to do this full time!!)
Delorme does have the whole eastern US for only $50. While I cant find the exact "size" it uses, it does say that it had the 7.5 min quad maps. Are those the ones I want (the closest in with most detail?)Yes, 7.5 minute is the most detail. It is the same as 1:24,000.
Are the major long-trails (Pinhoti, BMT, GET etc) on any of these programs?I can only speak to the one I use, which is NG TOPO (State series). The answer is yes and no. It has a lot of trails, few of which are labeled.
PINHOTI: Yes and No. The Pinoti is there. Not all of it, and the parts that are are not labeled. A quick check shows no trail near Flagpole Mtn on the norhtern end, but there are trails depicted in most of the areas where I expect the Pinhoti to be.
BMT: The trail is shown on the map and is labeled. The map in this area is much better than the map in Alabama. I think they use scanned USGS Survey maps, so one would expect more recently updated maps to be better. The bad news is that the the BMT goes beyond GA and to see the entire trail, you would need the TN map. Ka-Ching $$.
GET: I don't have the Arizona or New Mexico State maps, but I am thinking of hiking either this trail or the Ice Age Trail one of these days. If I get the AZ/NM map I'll let you know. I think the hikers wallet people (Simblissity?) has a good map of the GET.
Which one(s) can I up load my tracks of the trail that Ive hiked to my computer from the gps? Again, I can only speak to NG TOPO. You can upload and download tracks and waypoints to and from from your GPS without needing any other program. You can also upload any other person's tracks and waypoints that are in a .gpx file.
I dont like having to buy each individual state.Yeah, that sucks. In this regard Delorme is more expensive, as they don't bundle states as NG does. For instance, I paid $80 for NG's AL-GA-FL. Delorme charges $90 for AL, $90 for GA, and another $90 for FL.
One benefit to Delorme is that you have an option to buy each state on a DVD. My GA-AL-FL set has 10 CDs, and of course, part of the AL Pinhoti is on CD#2 and part is on CD#3, which means switching out disks to go back and forth. I don't think it is worth paying $270 instead of $80 just so as not to switch a disk, though.
The search continues...One thing is certain: As soon as you buy from one of the companies, the other will immediately market a brand-new, far superior product for less money :D
Mr. Parkay
02-25-2007, 03:08
This is a little bit off topic, but Speaking of TOPO maps... I just found a great web site today which allows you to download full quality USGS Quad Maps... possibly every current Quad Map. It's part of something called the "Libre Map Project" and their mission is to make TOPO maps and related Geographic Data freely available to everyone. Here's the link:
http://libremap.org/
Note: The maps are scanned so that they are tilted to the right. This was apparently done on purpose since the maps are geo-coded so that they can be imported into GIS software programs.
Mr. Parkay
02-25-2007, 03:13
Thanks Parkay! As long as I can get it into a gps file, I can get it into Delorme via GSAK. I wish you were closer, Id show you the program and how easy it is to use for importing and exporting waypoints!
(did a quick search... go to gsak.net) while the name implies its for geocaching, as long as you have a gpx file, you're good! this guy created the software for GC'ers to use to import the waypoints to several different programs and it became so popular (it think its only about $20) that hes quit his regular job to do this full time!!)
Thanks for the link, I bet it would have come in handy after my Pinhoti hike. I had about 1500 waypoints to manage.. man that was rough!
generoll
02-25-2007, 12:18
this is slightly off the subject, but are you all familiar with the site http://www.geocaching.com/ ? they aren't so much about trails as caching, but there are a lot of users there that could help with questions.
I have Delorme TOPO 6.0; I got $200 worth of downloads free. Does anyone know how to use the downloads. I guess they are the satelite(sp) imagery, right?
Hey Medicine Man, I posted.
Gene!
Love caching. Its what got me back out into the great outdoors! while there are caches just about everywhere nowadays, I spend my time going after those that are in the woods and require a good hike to get to! I even "own" one in Sipsey Wilderness, 2 mi roundtrip to get to!