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Flinx
02-27-2007, 20:48
Did anyone read the Backpacker article on the Hiker "Saved"?....apparently this guy was initially running from child molestation charges...interesting read.

K0OPG
02-28-2007, 08:20
Read the article and then came here and searched for posts from when it was happeming. Very interesting read.

It's just like a christian rock band states on one of their albums..."We Christians are our own worst witnesses...we profess Christ with our mouths, but then deny Him with our lifestyle". It would have been easy to be taken in by him.

Beating a dead horse though. He is in jail.

Lone Wolf
02-28-2007, 09:27
Just another "born again" thief who conned his way up the trail

mrc237
02-28-2007, 16:30
What issue?

Sly
02-28-2007, 16:55
I'd make a more compelling article, "Unsaved and still hiking"

oldfivetango
02-28-2007, 18:13
Yup,and he was from Georgia too.I remember having a pm session
with some lady that knew him personally and was telling me about
how he was turning his life around and how wonderful he was and what
an awful jerk I am for thinking a child molester should do time.
Hallelujah Brothers!! Can't you just forgive and forget?
Oldfivetango

norub
02-28-2007, 18:39
Read the article and then came here and searched for posts from when it was happeming. Very interesting read.


Can you post links to those threads? I can't find the article online, so I can't search. What's the guy's name?

Topcat
02-28-2007, 20:22
The writer of the article actually posted on Whiteblaze a couple of weeks ago looking for info about "Saved"

norub
02-28-2007, 21:36
The writer of the article actually posted on Whiteblaze a couple of weeks ago looking for info about "Saved"

Well, searching WB for the term "saved" yields over 500 hits. ;) Anything a bit more specific by any chance? Like a link to a thread perhaps? :D

rickb
02-28-2007, 21:44
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6067&highlight=saved+theft

Monello
02-28-2007, 23:57
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/15/AR2005111501167.html

rafe
03-01-2007, 01:10
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/15/AR2005111501167.html

That is one heck of a story. I remember being tempted by Dan Nicholls' "offer" at the hiker register on the NY/NJ line. I even took a photo (http://www.terrapinphoto.com/cpg143/albums/userpics/10001/normal_IMG_0160.jpg) of it. Glad I decided to hoof it to Wawayanda. Glad they got Lescoe, glad I never met 'im. Whew.

norub
03-01-2007, 01:46
That is one heck of a story. I remember being tempted by Dan Nicholls' "offer" at the hiker register on the NY/NJ line. I even took a photo (http://www.terrapinphoto.com/cpg143/albums/userpics/10001/normal_IMG_0160.jpg) of it.

What is this "offer" about exactly? What kind of experience would a person have who firmly believed in a different religion (or no religion) if they took Dan up on his offer? Would that hiker be welcome?:-?

rafe
03-01-2007, 01:56
What is this "offer" about exactly? What kind of experience would a person have who firmly believed in a different religion (or no religion) if they took Dan up on his offer? Would that hiker be welcome?:-?

Nicholls is a minor character in the article, though he adds a nice touch of irony, being another overt Xian and having hosted & befriended Lescoe. I doubt there'd be an issue, for me at least. Still, I'm glad I booked on down the trail to Wawayanda...

ASUGrad
03-01-2007, 09:33
"being another overt Xian"

Yeah. I judge black people based on the actions of a few of them. I find that suits me best.

CaseyB
03-01-2007, 10:18
Am I the only one who caught the fact that Wolf made the Washington Post?
From the article:
Before he was caught, angry posters on whiteblaze.net entertained fantasies that he should be shot or his gear should be burned.

From 10-21-04:
Or stake out the vehicle and as he breaks in, blow his s**t away! Problem solved. Outta the gene pool. :D

Wolf yer famous!

rafe
03-01-2007, 10:23
"being another overt Xian"

Yeah. I judge black people based on the actions of a few of them. I find that suits me best.

There was no judgement of Nicholls on my part. None. Zero. Zip. The fact of Nicholls religion was the lead in to the WP article. Did you read it?

And when asked if anyone would have a problem hanging with Nicholls, I said, for me, prolly not.

K0OPG
03-01-2007, 11:31
to find the articles on WB I just did a search for "lescoe" the guys name.

Smile
03-01-2007, 12:06
Too bad ALL people who act like this (hikers/christians or otherwise) aren't treated with the same publicity so they can be weeded out!

Would he have gotten the same publicity if he were a Muslim? Or Jewish? Or Wiccan?

We are too lenient on criminals these days IMHO.

Glad he got caught.

:)

norub
03-01-2007, 12:19
I remember being tempted by Dan Nicholls' "offer"

I find it ironic that this religious fanatic dangles the enticement of a hot shower/meal to hikers in a way that some may find to be less than straightforward. Then a hiker takes him up on it, eats, drinks, accepts the 50 bucks and cruises out, and now the religious guy feels hurt because the hiker was less than straightforward with him. :rolleyes:

Vapour
03-01-2007, 14:04
I find it ironic that this religious fanatic dangles the enticement of a hot shower/meal to hikers in a way that some may find to be less than straightforward. Then a hiker takes him up on it, eats, drinks, accepts the 50 bucks and cruises out, and now the religious guy feels hurt because the hiker was less than straightforward with him. :rolleyes:

Quotes from the Washpost article:

"...hikers are welcome to use an outdoor, rustic, but with privacy, hot/cold SHOWER. It's bait, truth be told. Nicholls is an evangelical Christian, and he uses the promise of running water and a hot meal as an opening to proselytize about "the new, fantastic water, which is life in Christ."...Nicholls started talking about redemption. ...at the end of the night...Nicholls offered this suggestion: Why not spend the night praying?"

I'd be pretty fed up with the jesusbot myself by then. Spend the night praying? I'd be like "Dude, I gotta get some sleep".

Then:

"...the hiker said, his first thought was not of some divine religious calling but rather, "Oh, that's probably some sucker Christian guy." ...before the formerly famished hiker headed out on the trail again, Nicholls gave him a stock of food, a $50 bill and a new trail name."

"Some sucker Christian guy"...ya think? Hell, if some looneytunes lured me to his cabin on the promise of a shower and a snack, then kept me up all night with this jesusbabble, I'd take the $50 too. And head directly to the Motel 6 and spend it on a good night's sleep.

And finally:

"...Of all the people involved in Saved's story, nobody has had a harder time figuring him out than Dan Nicholls. ...ater Lescoe was captured, Nicholls sent a letter to him jail.... Nicholls asked "Did you really receive Christ as your Saviour at my place?" ... waited more than three months for a reply. He got none. Then, in June, he re-sent the letter to Lescoe. This time he attached a $25 money order. The money got Lescoe's attention. He wrote back, citing a verse in the King James Bible that Nicholls had given him, Romans 3:23: "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.""

Now that's funny.

SteveJ
03-01-2007, 15:51
I find it ironic that this religious fanatic dangles the enticement of a hot shower/meal to hikers in a way that some may find to be less than straightforward. Then a hiker takes him up on it, eats, drinks, accepts the 50 bucks and cruises out, and now the religious guy feels hurt because the hiker was less than straightforward with him. :rolleyes:

you're pretty loose with the word 'fanatic' there, buddy.... so sharing a hot shower, and leaving tracts around is your idea of fanaticism? my idea of fanaticism is more like:

http://tinyurl.com/24q4pb

but I guess I'm also a fanatic in your eyes....jeez...

norub
03-01-2007, 16:25
you're pretty loose with the word 'fanatic' there, buddy.... so sharing a hot shower, and leaving tracts around is your idea of fanaticism? my idea of fanaticism is more like:

http://tinyurl.com/24q4pb

but I guess I'm also a fanatic in your eyes....jeez...

I don't click on tinyurls, so no idea what your link is all about.

Anyhoo, if you trick/lure/entice someone, for the sole purpose of shoving your religion down their throat, then yep, in my book you're a religious fanatic. {shrug} Deal with it.

SteveJ
03-01-2007, 16:35
I don't click on tinyurls, so no idea what your link is all about.

Anyhoo, if you trick/lure/entice someone, for the sole purpose of shoving your religion down their throat, then yep, in my book you're a religious fanatic. {shrug} Deal with it.

so, if you ever hike the AT, you will obviously avoid the several church hostels and religious groups that provide meals, right? If I'm not mistaken, all of them will be very willing to talk with a hiker that admits to them that they're depressed and considering suicide - but that's your definition of fanatic, right?

the link was to a story about a fanatic bomber who managed to kill 4 Israeli's in a homicide bombing:

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.factsofisrael.com/en/images/articles/bombing-04292003.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.factsofisrael.com/blog/archives/000656.html&h=238&w=350&sz=66&hl=en&start=24&tbnid=UV9NTZeAVEDc0M:&tbnh=82&tbnw=120&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dislamic%2Bbombing%26start%3D20%26ndsp %3D20%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26c2coff%3D1%26safe%3 Doff%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox%26rlz%3D1I7GGLR%26sa%3DN

wasn't sure if the long url would post... surely you admit this was a 'fanatic?' if so, you are equating this terrorist with Dan Nichols?! IMHO, a very loose use of the term....

rafe
03-01-2007, 16:50
Whoa, guys... I don't quite understand the hostility toward Dan Nicholls. As others have pointed out, there are lots of church-sponsored hostels along the AT, and I don't think I've been hypocritical staying at a few of them. None of them tried in any way to proselytize me -- they were way too cool for that. Had they done so, I'd have shrugged it off, or maybe moved on. No big deal. I did find it slightly ironic that the WP article started off with a sub-story about Nicholls hosting and befriending Lescoe. That's all.

SteveJ
03-01-2007, 17:08
Whoa, guys... I don't quite understand the hostility toward Dan Nicholls. As others have pointed out, there are lots of church-sponsored hostels along the AT, and I don't think I've been hypocritical staying at a few of them. None of them tried in any way to proselytize me -- they were way too cool for that. Had they done so, I'd have shrugged it off, or maybe moved on. No big deal. I did find it slightly ironic that the WP article started off with a sub-story about Nicholls hosting and befriending Lescoe. That's all.

thanks, terrapin_too - was hoping someone would jump in that had actually been on the AT and met some of these folks. I was bothered a lot by the hostility you point out....from what I've read, Dan seems to be a decent guy that doesn't deserve most of what's been served up here today....

moxie
03-01-2007, 17:34
The AT does attract alot of strange people, some stranger and more different than others. I think it is a safe bet that 100% of the people that thru hike are strange or different, present company included. It's just this guy was strange and evel. There are many moochers, born agains and even thiefs but this guy had the worse qualities of all of them.

norub
03-01-2007, 18:05
Not hostility. Just...amusement.

Smile
03-01-2007, 18:27
IMHO anybody whether a moonie, hari krishna or whatever that offers a hot shower is providing a service - take it or leave it. If you don't want to be proseltized to, then leave - no different than walking away from any conversation you're not interested in. Hey, but ya got a shower.

I guess now that this is out in the public, those who don't want to deal with the guy shoving his beliefs at people will pass on the offer!


Reminds me of those calls about "free" vacations if you sit and listen to the schpeel about a timeshare, you can just listen and take advantage of the free stuff, or just don't listen and head out!

norub
03-01-2007, 19:58
IMHO anybody whether a moonie, hari krishna or whatever that offers a hot shower is providing a service - take it or leave it. If you don't want to be proseltized to, then leave - no different than walking away from any conversation you're not interested in. Hey, but ya got a shower.

I guess now that this is out in the public, those who don't want to deal with the guy shoving his beliefs at people will pass on the offer!


Reminds me of those calls about "free" vacations if you sit and listen to the schpeel about a timeshare, you can just listen and take advantage of the free stuff, or just don't listen and head out!

Agreed. And also w/vapor, this Dan character is not a victim in this story. More like comic relief.:D

Brrrb Oregon
03-02-2007, 20:10
Too bad ALL people who act like this (hikers/christians or otherwise) aren't treated with the same publicity so they can be weeded out!

Would he have gotten the same publicity if he were a Muslim? Or Jewish? Or Wiccan?

We are too lenient on criminals these days IMHO.

Glad he got caught.

:)

I think anybody who used their religious affiliation to create a false sense of trust would get the same response. It's right up there with lying to your grandma and ripping off girl scouts; i.e., the immediate response is "what kind of person would...."

I would highly recommend the book, "The Sociopath Next Door." As many as 1 in 25 of Americans are sociopathic; that is, they are manipulative people who do not have a conscience....and interestingly enough, appear not to believe that consciences really exist. Most of them do NOT wind up with a criminal record. Some of them are charming, some are just plain weird, but all of them work out of a totally different playbook than the standards that people with a conscience take as a matter of course. They do not make emotional connections with other people, although the socially clever ones will learn to feign those connections very skillfully, when it suits their purpose. They think everyone else is either working out of that same playbook (and lying about it to themselves or to the rest of the world) or else is just plain stupid. They sometimes find cruelty very invigorating in its own right. They will sometimes hurt other people just because they can. Likewise they will befriend people as a way of setting up possible future use of them. I do not have to tell you that reading that book made the hair on the back of my neck stand up.

The book is very enlightening the subjects of a) how to identify sociopaths and b) how to stay off of their radar. These folks classify others into three groups: the competition, the pawns/prey, and the unimportant. Let me tell you, you want to stay in that last group.

RockStar
03-02-2007, 20:34
I think anybody who used their religious affiliation to create a false sense of trust would get the same response. It's right up there with lying to your grandma and ripping off girl scouts; i.e., the immediate response is "what kind of person would...."

I would highly recommend the book, "The Sociopath Next Door." As many as 1 in 25 of Americans are sociopathic; that is, they are manipulative people who do not have a conscience....and interestingly enough, appear not to believe that consciences really exist. Most of them do NOT wind up with a criminal record. Some of them are charming, some are just plain weird, but all of them work out of a totally different playbook than the standards that people with a conscience take as a matter of course. They do not make emotional connections with other people, although the socially clever ones will learn to feign those connections very skillfully, when it suits their purpose. They think everyone else is either working out of that same playbook (and lying about it to themselves or to the rest of the world) or else is just plain stupid. They sometimes find cruelty very invigorating in its own right. They will sometimes hurt other people just because they can. Likewise they will befriend people as a way of setting up possible future use of them. I do not have to tell you that reading that book made the hair on the back of my neck stand up.

The book is very enlightening the subjects of a) how to identify sociopaths and b) how to stay off of their radar. These folks classify others into three groups: the competition, the pawns/prey, and the unimportant. Let me tell you, you want to stay in that last group.




Do you have other books like this you would suggest?

...as a sociopath I had no idea anyone was onto us...gotta upgrade the radars you know. :dance ;)

Spork
03-03-2007, 19:49
sociopathic; that is, they are manipulative people who do not have a conscience...

Your post provides a very accurate and concise description of Antisocial Personality Disorder - people we typically call psychopaths or sociopaths. I have the dubious honor of working with these folks every day. I just finished reading the BP article and the most telling piece is near the end: "He (Lescoe)...has never been able to stop blaming others for his troubles. As much as he seeks forgiveness and understanding, he seem incapable of extending much empathy to others, even those to whom he brought pain... He says if Nicholls had answered his calls from the trail, if he had sent him a new pair of socks, maybe he never would have been forced to commit the crimes he did." These few lines pretty much close the book on Mr. "Saved" - still deceiptful, manipulative, and lacking remorse, responsibility, or regard for others. Clearly the only thing he's interested in "saving" is his own a@@...

Treadwell
03-03-2007, 20:02
hello.

i just received the april issue of backpacker and the article on lescoe was the first thing i read. although i have been reading quite a bit about the trail in recent months, largely to prepare for my upcoming hike, i had not heard of this story.

i found it disturbing on several different levels, but it seems there is a consensus in the threads i'm reading...that lescoe's crimes were not as irksome as is the prevalence of evangelical proselytizing on the trail.

i would disagree. seemed to me lescoe fit the profile of most career criminals, he was a skilled con-man and thief/burglar who, in fleeing to the trail, for a time, found a safe haven and a host of easy victims. his crimes strained the goodwill communities have towards hikers and endangered those he encountered along the trail...but he's in jail now, and from the way it sounds, he'll be there for some time.

nicholls' good intentions at providing a hot shower and a grilled hamburger in exchange for a lecture on salvation through JC were not the focus of the article, and i think such topics deserve a separate thread (though i'll not start it). i too find born-agains wildly tiresome and their penchant for sharing their thoughts on religion exceedingly rude and disrespectful. but nicholls, like many of the people lescoe met in his time on the trail, was a victim...whether you agree with his ideology or not, nicholls was duped by a career-criminal who used religion to chip through people's guard.

what i'd be more interested in seeing here is opinions about the trail being used as a hide out for criminals or perhaps less nefarious, but still shady characters. is the trail (chatter-chatter go the knees) safe? have people had other distressing encounters? let's move away from religion-bashing (it's too easy and too offensive) and on to more productive topics.

let's here about crime and the trail...what should i watch out for as a novice hiker?

woodsy
03-03-2007, 20:35
I think that you will find that word about shady characters on the trail travels up and down the trail pretty fast amongst other hikers. It's not really a good place for criminals to hide for very long.

tha
03-03-2007, 21:39
Your post provides a very accurate and concise description of Antisocial Personality Disorder - people we typically call psychopaths or sociopaths. I have the dubious honor of working with these folks every day. I just finished reading the BP article and the most telling piece is near the end: "He (Lescoe)...has never been able to stop blaming others for his troubles. As much as he seeks forgiveness and understanding, he seem incapable of extending much empathy to others, even those to whom he brought pain... He says if Nicholls had answered his calls from the trail, if he had sent him a new pair of socks, maybe he never would have been forced to commit the crimes he did." These few lines pretty much close the book on Mr. "Saved" - still deceiptful, manipulative, and lacking remorse, responsibility, or regard for others. Clearly the only thing he's interested in "saving" is his own a@@...

Spork, I, too, just finished the article and was struck by the exact same thing; Lescoe's failing to take any responsibility. When you think about it, I guess that fits well with having no conscience.

Heater
03-03-2007, 22:11
I think that you will find that word about shady characters on the trail travels up and down the trail pretty fast amongst other hikers. It's not really a good place for criminals to hide for very long.

The abortion clinic bomber, Eric Rudolph, seemed to be pretty adept at it.
I wonder if ol' Dan gave him a shower too? :-?

Treadwell
03-03-2007, 22:37
ah...thank you, austexs, for bringing that guy up. i couldn't dredge his name out of the memory banks.

but lescoe and rudolph are obviously extreme examples.

smokymtnsteve
03-03-2007, 23:29
The abortion clinic bomber, Eric Rudolph, seemed to be pretty adept at it.
I wonder if ol' Dan gave him a shower too? :-?

shoot folks all around Robinsonvile and western north carolina was helping rudolf

Rain Man
03-04-2007, 11:35
I would highly recommend the book, "The Sociopath Next Door." As many as 1 in 25 of Americans are sociopathic; that is, they are manipulative people who do not have a conscience....and interestingly enough, appear not to believe that consciences really exist. Most of them do NOT wind up with a criminal record. Some of them are charming, some are just plain weird, but all of them work out of a totally different playbook than the standards that people with a conscience take as a matter of course. They do not make emotional connections with other people, although the socially clever ones will learn to feign those connections very skillfully, when it suits their purpose. They think everyone else is either working out of that same playbook (and lying about it to themselves or to the rest of the world) or else is just plain stupid....

Shouldn't this be over in one of the "rationalizing stealth camping in the GSMNP" threads?!!! ~wink~

Rain:sunMan

.

Spork
03-04-2007, 12:33
Shouldn't this be over in one of the "rationalizing stealth camping in the GSMNP" threads?!!! ~wink~

Rain:sunMan

.


OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOh are you gonna get some nasty PM's for this!!:D

Lone Wolf
03-04-2007, 15:01
shoot folks all around Robinsonvile and western north carolina was helping rudolf

cuz abortion is murder

Rain Man
03-05-2007, 00:31
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOh are you gonna get some nasty PM's for this!!:D

Who? MOI????? LOL

Rain:sunMan

.

Dances with Mice
03-05-2007, 07:18
shoot folks all around Robinsonvile and western north carolina was helping rudolfThey helped him so much he was stealing old dry corn out of silos and was caught with his hair full of dumpster doo from digging through trash bins. If I ever need help I know where not to go.

rafe
03-05-2007, 10:04
They helped him so much he was stealing old dry corn out of silos and was caught with his hair full of dumpster doo from digging through trash bins. If I ever need help I know where not to go.

He was in the woods for two three years or more, no?

ASUGrad
03-05-2007, 10:33
Doubt it. There are lots of summer homes in that area. I imagine he was moving around quite a bit.

Dances with Mice
03-05-2007, 14:27
If he was getting help you'd think somebody could have kicked him down a pot roast or a couple of hams now and again to keep him out of the dumpsters. If lots of people were feeding him then Rudolph's capture was really an insult to their cooking!

In his own words (http://www.decaturdaily.com/decaturdaily/news/050417/manifesto.shtml): After so many years ducking and hiding and eating crappy foods you tend to let your guard down, and this is what led to my capture in Murphy in 2003.

So either he wasn't getting much help or those folks were feeding a sneaky serial bomber crappy food. Take your pick. Hey, if I was feeding a fugitive serial bomber I'd lay out a good spread, y'know?

timhines
03-05-2007, 15:35
Funny how this turned to a Rudolph thread. I've seen a few refeerences to people saying he hid on the trail. Impossible. I live in that area and I had ATF and FBI agents visiting our property on more than one occasion. They paroled the AT a lot during this great "hide & seek" run.

Brrrb Oregon
03-05-2007, 16:44
...what should i watch out for as a novice hiker?


Apparently, this is a good news/bad news thing:
The bad news: there is no "fool-proof method" for determining who is worthy of your trust. And as (I think) Sherlock Holmes put it: those who suspect everything waste their suspicions on many innocent things. Even in the United States, 96 out of 100 people have a conscience, as a psychologist would define it, have some baseline of decency and responsibility that is in line with what you'd think is normal. Not perfect, not saintly, but not remorselessly manipulative, either. Those other 4% are not always easy to identify....some of them are artists at what they do, very well-camoflaged predators and parasites.

I am Catholic, I love essentially every priest I have ever known well, but you all know that this class of people have included some well-loved parish priests. Do not beat yourself up if you fail to identify these people. The "successful" ones have a very polished act.

The good news is that once you believe the concept that there is such a thing as a truly shameless person--and I don't mean that in the funny way that we sometimes do, but the guilt-free of the stand-up-the-hair-on-the-back-of-your-neck kind--you can be on the look-out for the red flags concerning who not to trust. (Although the fact that we do joke about being shameless is one reason that sociopaths sometimes operate so freely in our society.)

The best, although not fool-proof, tip-off to the social predator, says Martha Stout, the author of that book, is the pity play: "The most reliable sign, the most universal behavior of unscrupulous people is not directed, as one might imagine, at our fearfulness. It is, perversely, an appeal to our sympathy." As Dr. Stout puts, "More than admiration--more even than fear--pity from good people is carte blanche."

She goes on later in the chapter, "When deciding whom to trust, bear in mind that the combination of consistently bad or egregiously inadequate behavior with frequent plays for your pity is as close to a warning mark on a conscienceless person's forehead as you will ever be given." She counsels that you not make a close friend of such a person, nor place them in a position of trust.

She also includes 13 Rules for Dealing with Sociopaths in Everyday Life, which I abbreviate here:
(And I really do recommend you get her book and read her explanations):

1. Accept that some people have no conscience.
2. In a contest between your instincts and what is implied by the role a person has taken on, go with your instincts. (that is, do not automatically trust someone in a position of trust: pastor, teacher, leader, etc.)
3. Practice the Rule of Threes: A person who has lied, broken a promise to you, or neglected a serious responsibility toward you three times should not be assumed to be anything other than inherently deceitful when deceit suits his or her needs. Do not give time, money, secrets, or affections to a "three-timer."
4. Question authority when your instinct or anxiety tells you to, especially when no one else is, and encourage others when they do so. Legitimate authority has answers to legitimate questions.
5. Always suspect flattery! If you are drawn to someone, ask yourself: do they flatter me? Are they massaging my ego, my vanity? If so, keep the radar up.
6. If necessary, redefine your concept of respect.....someone who deserves your fear rarely deserves your respect. The strong, the kind, the morally courageous is not likely to also be someone who profits from frightening you.
7. Do not join into games of intrigue....do not try to outsmart, compete with, psychoanalyze, or banter with a sociopath. You will be distracted from protecting yourself.
8. Quietly avoid social contact or communication with a suspected sociopath....and I want to expand on this: You are never going to be a great friend to someone who makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up. Do not feel bad, do not apologize, do not defend your decision to anyone else. "I'd rather not" is reason enough. You deserve to be able to trust yourself....and, by the way, so does everyone else. Respect the right of everyone else to socialize as they choose, without taking offense. Sociopaths do not run their con on everyone. They choose people. Do not help them to corner their chosen quarry because they've never chosen to con you.
9. Question your tendency to pity too easily.
10. Do not try to redeem the unredeemable.....see "The Rule of Threes".
11. NEVER agree to help another person conceal his or her true character. "Please don't tell!" is the trademark pleas of thieves, child abusers, and sociopaths. Other red flags: "You owe me" and "You are just like me". You do not and you are not. Do not be taken in.
12. Defend your psyche....do allow contact with a sociopath to convince you that humanity is a failure.
13. Living well is the best revenge. Do not carry victimization by a sociopath with you. Do not beat yourself up over their choice to victimize you--and these are not insane people with no choice, but rather unfeeling people who choose their own desires over all else.

Brrrb Oregon
03-05-2007, 17:00
12. Defend your psyche....do allow contact with a sociopath to convince you that humanity is a failure.

I hope the typo is obvious:

12. Defend your psyche....do not allow contact with a sociopath to convince you that humanity is a failure.

Oh yeah, they want you to believe "all guys are like that" or "love does that to women." No, all guys are not "like that" and love does no such thing to anybody. There are good people out there, and you deserve to choose one of them over someone who doesn't respect you.....yes, that's right. You deserve a partner who does not try to use their title or experience or ability to hurt you to impress you or cow you into compliance, who doesn't use flattery to blind-side you, who respect your wishes, even if you don't want to socialize with them, who lives a life of integrity, and who don't try to act as if "bad" guys or "b**ches" are some kind of prize. If someone tries to tell you otherwise, run fast the other way. Life's too short.

SteveJ
03-05-2007, 17:19
Funny how this turned to a Rudolph thread. I've seen a few refeerences to people saying he hid on the trail. Impossible. I live in that area and I had ATF and FBI agents visiting our property on more than one occasion. They paroled the AT a lot during this great "hide & seek" run.

yep - guy that lives in my neighborhood is w/ the FBI. Just prior to this, he had a supervisory desk job. After the bombing, he spent weeks away in the NC woods searching for Rudolph...to say that he was anxious to catch him so his life could return to normal would be an understatement!