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neighbor dave
03-25-2007, 14:36
:-? well as you all know it's spring again and jack is headin' south for the umteenth time. my question to the masses is, "will jack make it farther than bill bryson made it on his hike.:D

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-25-2007, 14:57
May the best man win (http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b47/lowcarbscoop/CandyA.jpg)

SGT Rock
03-25-2007, 15:01
My money is on Jack

bfitz
03-25-2007, 15:27
Jack's new book will be called "Walking With Candy-Ass".

Rain Man
03-25-2007, 16:09
.... my question to the masses is, "will jack make it farther than bill bryson made it on his hike.

They both made it farther than 99.99% of Americans! Otherwise, is hiking a contest?

Rain:sunMan

.

bfitz
03-25-2007, 17:18
99.99 % of thru-hikers in Jack's case.

moxie
03-25-2007, 17:58
In 2000 I placed a small sign beside the trail about a mile north of Newfound Gap. It read, "Congratulations, you have now made it further than Bill Bryson".......OK tree huggers, give me hell for placing an unathorized sign on the trail. I frankly dodn't give a darn, it made a statement I was proud of, was written with water soluable ink on biodegradeable paper. I asure you and it is written in stone, Jack will make it past Newfound Gap before he even breaks into a sweat.

Dances with Mice
03-25-2007, 18:01
Betting on the success or failure of a thru-hiker's attempt is crass and unseemly.

Almost There
03-25-2007, 18:03
Seeing as Jack has already done the trail how many times??? Who gives a krap!

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-25-2007, 18:45
I think we all know Jack has and will make it quite a bit further than Bryson - and without 1% of the snivling.

rafe
03-25-2007, 18:55
A more meaningful comparison would pit Jack's hiking skills against Bryson's wit, erudition, and writing skills. I've read all of Bryson's books, and always look forward to the next. Outside of a couple of internet hiking forums, Jack is "Baltimore who?"

mweinstone
03-25-2007, 19:16
demonstrating sleeping in jesters room at the doyal with 10 of us talking and laughing shows that our man has the ability to rest while the competion is annoyed and loosing sleep.a nessesary thruhiking skill.jacks world renoun for it.makes him fresh as a daisy in no time.

mweinstone
03-25-2007, 19:19
oops. thats the stale and pasty sot. heres the fresh and daisylike jack were all behind. sorry.

weary
03-25-2007, 21:33
I think we all know Jack has and will make it quite a bit further than Bryson - and without 1% of the snivling.
Jack will certainly make it as far as he wants to -- or at least as far as his cash and hiker boxes permit.

rafe
03-25-2007, 22:09
Jack will certainly make it as far as he wants to --

Of course, the same could be said for Bryson and Katz... :D

Jester2000
03-25-2007, 22:12
Betting on the success or failure of a thru-hiker's attempt is crass and unseemly.

When has that ever stopped us from doing something?

freefall
03-26-2007, 01:10
Betting on the success or failure of a thru-hiker's attempt is crass and unseemly.
Could this rival the great, almighty thread? (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13082&highlight=minnesotasmith+update) :-?

From minnesotasmith update thread, post #42 on 02-21-2006 at 18:14:





25 to 1 :cool: neo
I keep seeing these odds...and I'll take them.

I'll put down a $10 donation to Whiteblaze if he makes it. I'll take on the first 4 to bet against him, I'll even let you pick the odds. Lone Wolf and Neo have already given theirs.

A potential $40 donation to Whiteblaze.net is in the balance, against donations of about $1000 if he kisses the Katahdin sign - unless the odds start getting lower when real dough's on the line.

Step right up, don't start getting shy now. Show me the money!

Who's first?

freefall
03-26-2007, 02:19
Just for s&gs, I typed in www.baltimorejack.com. (http://www.baltimorejack.com)

who is that masked man?:D

NICKTHEGREEK
03-26-2007, 06:28
Seeing as Jack has already done the trail how many times??? Who gives a krap!

I guess he pretty much knows what's over top of the next hill. Seems too much like trying to compare a long distance coast to coast trucker to the Lewis and Clark expedition.

Jaybird
03-26-2007, 06:36
:-? well as you all know it's spring again and jack is headin' south for the umteenth time. my question to the masses is, "will jack make it farther than bill bryson made it on his hike.:D




Jack has ALREADY made it farther than Bryson ever thought about!:D

Spork
03-26-2007, 07:43
May the best man win (http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b47/lowcarbscoop/CandyA.jpg)

Has anyone else noticed the striking similarities between these two men?! I mean, it's like looking in a mirror!! I'm thinking this is a case of identical twins separated at birth... perhaps destined to reunite on the trail. God bless you Jack and Bill!!!

Jack Tarlin
03-26-2007, 11:22
Heading out in a few days, thanx for all the kind words.

Oh, and Terrapin, thanx to you too, really classy post! Now clear your throat, hawk up a good one, and lose some of your daily bile!! I assure you you'll feel a whole lot better.

And I'm glad you're so impressed with Bryson's wit, erudition, and writing skills. Are you aware that there are scores of mistakes, omissions, exaggerations, and outright factual errors in "A Walk in the Woods?"

But then again, considering how many mistakes occur in YOUR posts, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that you're bowled over by Mr. B's erudition and skills.

This is EXACTLY the sort of writer you'd enjoy!

MOWGLI
03-26-2007, 11:27
And I'm glad you're so impressed with Bryson's wit, erudition, and writing skills. Are you aware that there are scores of mistakes, omissions, exaggerations, and outright factual errors in "A Walk in the Woods?"



Gee Jack. 6 months ago you were off of the criticize Bryson bandwagon. What happened other than Terrapin's post to change your mind again?

Jack Tarlin
03-26-2007, 11:30
Because Terrapin is a horse's ass, Mowgli, and this needs to be said frequently.

The Weasel
03-26-2007, 11:34
Jack will walk as far as Bill Bryson, and as far as the rest of us, and no further: He will start at his beginning, and he will walk until he is finished with his walk. And then he, like Bryson and the rest of us, will go home.

The Weasel

MOWGLI
03-26-2007, 11:44
Because Terrapin is a horse's ass, Mowgli, and this needs to be said frequently.

I like it when you use the word "fundament" better. ;)

Rhino-lfl
03-26-2007, 11:55
Can someone just give the the 30k ft overview of what this is about?

Fannypack
03-26-2007, 12:10
Because Terrapin is a horse's ass, Mowgli, and this needs to be said frequently.
could u two take your personal differences offline?

Jack, is everyone who disagrees with u a "horse's ass" or just the ones that tell it like it is?

Have a good hike!

The Weasel
03-26-2007, 13:07
Jack forgets that this is a "AT" forum, and not one of the "Non-AT" forums where he can (and does) get pretty nasty, and where that's allowed.

The Weasel

MOWGLI
03-26-2007, 13:11
Can someone just give the the 30k ft overview of what this is about?

It's kinda like Seinfeld. It's a thread about nothing.

The Weasel
03-26-2007, 13:28
Yeah, but Seinfeld was entertaining.

The Weasel

Rhino-lfl
03-26-2007, 14:33
I hate hikers lol.

shades of blue
03-26-2007, 14:51
Jack has done a lot to help hikers, especially newbies. He may not write like Bryson...but I would rather have Jack's input on resupply and other issues, than Bryson's view of life on the AT.

iafte
03-26-2007, 15:12
Baltimore Jack is Bill Bryson's alter ego. To keep us off his true identity he faked getting off the trail and he made all those errors in the book. We are on to you masked man, one day the truth will come out.

The Scribe
03-26-2007, 15:13
May the best man win (http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b47/lowcarbscoop/CandyA.jpg)

That, is funny.

The Weasel
03-26-2007, 15:40
Baltimore Jack is Bill Bryson's alter ego. To keep us off his true identity he faked getting off the trail and he made all those errors in the book. We are on to you masked man, one day the truth will come out.

I'm sure you're aware that Bryson and Jack both live in Hanover, NH.

The Weasel

Groucho
03-26-2007, 15:54
Jack forgets that this is a "AT" forum, and not one of the "Non-AT" forums where he can (and does) get pretty nasty, and where that's allowed.

The Weasel


And your friend Terrible Two?

iafte
03-26-2007, 15:59
I'm sure you're aware that Bryson and Jack both live in Hanover, NH.

The Weasel

More proof! Now, to find his kryptonite...


Advertisement: Coming this fall, a new film that will pull at your heart strings. A Book writer during fall and winter, he transforms into the wildy beloved AT Man.

Staring:
Jack Nicholson as Bill Bryson/Baltimore Jack
Nichole Kidman as Ms. Janet
Shrek as ATTroll

Coming this fall, if we decide not to cut it short and just say it's a movie.

moxie
03-26-2007, 16:02
Bryson made a ton of money from the trail. Jack contributes so much to the trail and the trail lore they cannot be compared. What Bryson takith away-Jack givith back. One has to wonder if they nod and speak when they pass each other at the Hanover Posrt Office.

rafe
03-26-2007, 16:03
One has to wonder if they nod and speak when they pass each other at the Hanover Posrt Office.

Bryson's been living in England these last couple of years.

moxie
03-26-2007, 16:48
Bryson's been living in England these last couple of years.
He must sneak back now and then, I hear he appeared at a publishers function last summer. I'm sure he had to leave the United States for fear of his very life at the hand of some real hikers. He isn't really safe there either because England has produced some serious thru hikers. Viet Nam might be a better place for Bryson or perhaps Sadar City, Iraq. Have a great hike Jack, see you at Caratunk.

rafe
03-26-2007, 17:06
I'm sure he had to leave the United States for fear of his very life at the hand of some real hikers.

Gosh, I never knew hikers were so inclined toward violence. :D

NativePennsylvanian
03-26-2007, 18:21
I just read the book last week after never hearing of it. Funny but lame how they gave up so soon. So what are the errors and embelishments ?

max patch
03-26-2007, 20:30
He must sneak back now and then, I hear he appeared at a publishers function last summer.

He doesn't have to "sneak back" as the percentage of people who read his book and have hiked the trail enough to know his inaccuracies and embellishments is very low.

max patch
03-26-2007, 20:33
I just read the book last week after never hearing of it. Funny but lame how they gave up so soon. So what are the errors and embelishments ?

Well, you could start with the cover to get the first one.

I always crack up when I read his take on Rainbow Springs, which was one of my favorite places. What he writes is half true, and then he takes that half and exaggerates it.

rafe
03-26-2007, 21:12
Well, you could start with the cover to get the first one.

Sure, he's the wrong kind of bear, but his expression is priceless. :D

MOWGLI
03-26-2007, 21:19
Sure, he's the wrong kind of bear, but his expression is priceless. :D

Are you assuming that's a Griz? Bears in the High Sierra and Lower Alabama are cinnamon. I don't know if that is a Black Bear or a Griz. Are there any distinguishing facial features that allow you to determine what species that bear is? Inquiring minds want to know.

rafe
03-26-2007, 21:31
Are you assuming that's a Griz? Bears in the High Sierra and Lower Alabama are cinnamon. I don't know if that is a Black Bear or a Griz. Are there any distinguishing facial features that allow you to determine what species that bear is? Inquiring minds want to know.

I assume from other folks' comments that the bear on the cover isn't a black bear. But I don't know from bears, one way or another, nor do I think it's smart to judge a book by its cover. :D I always assumed black bears were... well, black. :-?

Actually, there is a distinguishing facial feature, having to do with the shape of the nose/snout. Supposedly: viewed in profile, griz have a curved upper snout, while black bear snout is straight.

moxie
03-26-2007, 22:48
Are you assuming that's a Griz? Bears in the High Sierra and Lower Alabama are cinnamon. I don't know if that is a Black Bear or a Griz. Are there any distinguishing facial features that allow you to determine what species that bear is? Inquiring minds want to know.
That particular bear on the cover of Bryson"s book is a griz, His name is Herbert and he lives in a cave in the Rocky Mountains about 10 miles west of Browning, Montana. He frquently poses for pictures in exchange for Raman noodles. After being fed a pet rabbit he agreed to stand still long enough to let a staff artist paint his picture for Brysons book. Bryson shared the royalities from his book with Herbert so now Herbert has retired and lives on an occassional Elk he finds drunk at the Browning Elk's Lodge and spends his winters near Lukeville, Arizona, (now if you believe that you will believe everything Bill Bryson says in his book);)

MOWGLI
03-26-2007, 22:52
That particular bear on the cover of Bryson"s book is a griz, His name is Herbert and he lives in a cave in the Rocky Mountains about 10 miles west of Browning, Montana. He frquently poses for pictures in exchange for Raman noodles. After being fed a pet rabbit he agreed to stand still long enough to let a staff artist paint his picture for Brysons book. Bryson shared the royalities from his book with Herbert so now Herbert has retired and lives on an occassional Elk he finds drunk at the Browning Elk's Lodge and spends his winters near Lukeville, Arizona, (now if you believe that you will believe everything Bill Bryson says in his book);)

Thanks for clearing that up for us Moxie. :banana

bartender
03-27-2007, 00:41
You people all need help.

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 00:55
Weasel:

Bryson did indeed sell his house in Hanover for just under a million bucks, and moved back to Britain in 1995, where he accepted a post at the University of Durham, in the North of England.

So telling us that we all know that he and I both live in Hanover is in error.
This hasn't been the case for quite some time.

Ya know, Weasel, when your posts are getting fact-checked and corrected
by Terrapin of all people, it's really time you started posting to another thread.

freefall
03-27-2007, 01:40
I just read the book last week after never hearing of it. Funny but lame how they gave up so soon. So what are the errors and embelishments ?


Well, you could start with the cover to get the first one.

I always crack up when I read his take on Rainbow Springs, which was one of my favorite places. What he writes is half true, and then he takes that half and exaggerates it.


It's been years since I read it. Might have to revisit just to see how many I can pick out.

bfitz
03-27-2007, 01:49
Jack forgets that this is a "AT" forum, and not one of the "Non-AT" forums where he can (and does) get pretty nasty, and where that's allowed.

The Weasel
The truth hath no forum.

bfitz
03-27-2007, 01:50
Bryson made a ton of money from the trail. Jack contributes so much to the trail and the trail lore they cannot be compared. What Bryson takith away-Jack givith back. One has to wonder if they nod and speak when they pass each other at the Hanover Posrt Office................................!

freefall
03-27-2007, 01:51
Weasel:

Bryson did indeed sell his house in Hanover for just under a million bucks, and moved back to Britain in 1995, where he accepted a post at the University of Durham, in the North of England.

So telling us that we all know that he and I both live in Hanover is in error.
This hasn't been the case for quite some time.

Ya know, Weasel, when your posts are getting fact-checked and corrected
by Terrapin of all people, it's really time you started posting to another thread.


...He lived with his family in North Yorkshire before moving back to the States in 1995, to Hanover, New Hampshire, with his wife and four children. In 2003 he and his family moved back to England, where they currently reside... http://www.randomhouse.com/features/billbryson/flat/about.php


Wasn't 2003 about the time the movie rumors sarted?:-?

Brrrb Oregon
03-27-2007, 02:08
What he writes is half true, and then he takes that half and exaggerates it.

Man, you guys would shoot Patrick F. McManus, wouldn't you? ;)

I have a friend like this, and honestly, he doesn't know there is any other way to tell a story. If there was some big disaster at a dinner party for ten, he has to make it for fourteen.....which would be fine, except he doesn't comfine himself to dinner parties at which no one else present was in attendance! :rolleyes:

Be glad you only get to enjoy it in print! :D

atkentucky
03-27-2007, 02:59
More proof! Now, to find his kryptonite...


Advertisement: Coming this fall, a new film that will pull at your heart strings. A Book writer during fall and winter, he transforms into the wildy beloved AT Man.

Staring:
Jack Nicholson as Bill Bryson/Baltimore Jack
Nichole Kidman as Ms. Janet
Shrek as ATTroll

Coming this fall, if we decide not to cut it short and just say it's a movie.

My casting

Nick Nolte.... Jack
Pamela Anderson.. Miss Janet
Paris, France as the setting for.......Harper's Ferry

Plus toss in some anacondas in Pennslyvania, as well as some grizzlies in Virginia.

Also throw in some Deliverance type scenes or some kidney stealing at some of the sketchy hostels. :P

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 05:28
I always crack up when I read his take on Rainbow Springs, which was one of my favorite places. What he writes is half true, and then he takes that half and exaggerates it.
I stayed at Rainbow Springs Campground the nite that Katz & Bryson were there and from what I remember, Bryson was very accurate in his description of this place and its owners. I definitely remember it was a cold nite in the bunkhouse, of course, it was 20 degrees or so & the bunkhouse was built for use in the summer.

rafe
03-27-2007, 07:40
Bryson made a ton of money from the trail.

Yeah, and James Michener made a ton of money from Hawaii and Alaska. :) And Bryson is a scoundrel for selling his house in Hanover (http://www.cbredpath.com/proddir/search/73?searchSelect=73&Search%5Blistprice%5D%5Bmin%5D=1000000&Search%5Blistprice%5D%5Bmax%5D=0&Search%5Btownship%5D%5B%5D=%27Hanover+NH%27&Search%5Bnnrenid%5D=&submit.x=17&submit.y=10&submit=Search) for almost a million bucks! Imagine!

Doctari
03-27-2007, 07:51
My wife has "hiked" 1/4 mile of the AT. So she has hiked 1/4 mile further on the AT than Bryson. :rolleyes: I bet Jack makes it even further than that :D

rafe
03-27-2007, 08:36
My wife has "hiked" 1/4 mile of the AT. So she has hiked 1/4 mile further on the AT than Bryson.

For the benefit of those who've never read the book (possibly including Doctari) that statement is quite untrue.

MOWGLI
03-27-2007, 08:41
When I walked into the store @ Rainbow Springs, Jensine launched into a tirade about Bryson almost immediately. Said she was going to sue him, but decided not to. She really had her shorts in a bind over that book.

FWIW, I enjoyed my stay there.

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 09:06
When I walked into the store @ Rainbow Springs, Jensine launched into a tirade about Bryson almost immediately. Said she was going to sue him, but decided not to. She really had her shorts in a bind over that book.

FWIW, I enjoyed my stay there.
my father, Tex, and i also enjoyed our stay there... we were inside with 20 degrees and snow outside, not a hard choice, i.e., inside vs. outside

bfitz
03-27-2007, 09:16
Correction: Bryson was indeed in Hanover in the late nineties and it was in 2005, not 1995 that he returned to Britain.

rafe
03-27-2007, 09:19
Bryson did indeed sell his house in Hanover for just under a million bucks, and moved back to Britain in 1995, where he accepted a post at the University of Durham, in the North of England.

So telling us that we all know that he and I both live in Hanover is in error.
This hasn't been the case for quite some time.

Ya know, Weasel, when your posts are getting fact-checked and corrected
by Terrapin of all people, it's really time you started posting to another thread.

Since you're talking about facts, now....Bryson's hike -- the one chronicled in the book -- took place in 1995 or so. The book was first published in 1998. His departure from Hanover to England was in 2003. He claims (though I do not believe him) that his departure had nothing to do with the current administration of the US federal government.

NICKTHEGREEK
03-27-2007, 09:28
Heading out in a few days, thanx for all the kind words.

Oh, and Terrapin, thanx to you too, really classy post! Now clear your throat, hawk up a good one, and lose some of your daily bile!! I assure you you'll feel a whole lot better.

And I'm glad you're so impressed with Bryson's wit, erudition, and writing skills. Are you aware that there are scores of mistakes, omissions, exaggerations, and outright factual errors in "A Walk in the Woods?"

But then again, considering how many mistakes occur in YOUR posts, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that you're bowled over by Mr. B's erudition and skills.

This is EXACTLY the sort of writer you'd enjoy!

Where can I get copies of your books Jack?

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 09:31
Since you're talking about facts, now....Bryson's hike -- the one chronicled in the book -- took place in 1995 or so.
1996 was when I saw him & Katz at Rainbow Springs campground & then also in Franklin the next day at the motel (i think, Days Inn) up near US441

Skyline
03-27-2007, 09:52
Yep, the abbreviated hike that was the basis for the book occurred in 1996.

Jack is right. If you search this site and TrailForums for past threads involving Bryson you will discover not just a few indiscrepencies between the trail and off-trail amenities Bryson "experienced" and what most of the rest of us know to be true. His version made for a decent read but the book needs to be thought of as pure fiction.

My favorite gotcha involves a quote he attributed to an ATC spokesperson about the murders of Julie Williams and Lollie Winans in SNP--which happened in late May 1996 about the time Bryson says he was hiking in SNP. He was so busted on that quote it was deleted from the book-on-tape and subsequent print editions.

Footslogger
03-27-2007, 10:11
[quote=Skyline;345498] His version made for a decent read but the book needs to be thought of as pure fiction.

================================

Key point here ...

Now if the book was/is proported to be a true-to-life (non-fiction) account of an AT thru-hike attempt there'd be a lot more to dispute.

I read the book shortly after it came out and found it amusing, but never once placed any credence on its authenticity as an accurate historical account.

'Slogger

Skyline
03-27-2007, 10:23
[quote=Skyline;345498] His version made for a decent read but the book needs to be thought of as pure fiction.

================================

Key point here ...

Now if the book was/is proported to be a true-to-life (non-fiction) account of an AT thru-hike attempt there'd be a lot more to dispute.

I read the book shortly after it came out and found it amusing, but never once placed any credence on its authenticity as an accurate historical account.

'Slogger

If you do a Google search for "A Walk In The Woods Non-Fiction" you will see that Bryson and/or his publisher do in fact classify the book as non-fiction. Some of us strongly disagree, tho many of us found the book to be amusing anyway.

Aside from Bryson's divergence from the truth here and there, the only thing that really offended me about the book was his and Katz's cavalier attitude toward the environment and their fellow travelers. He's a good writer, but not much of a steward for the AT.

Footslogger
03-27-2007, 10:28
[quote=Skyline;345509][quote=Footslogger;345501]

If you do a Google search for "A Walk In The Woods Non-Fiction" you will see that Bryson and/or his publisher do in fact classify the book as non-fiction.
==================================

Hmmm ...well in that case Bryson knowingly openned himself up for some pretty major criticism. Been so long since I've read the book I must have forgotten that fact.

Personally though, I'm not that heavily invested in it. Bigger fish to fry.

'Slogger

rafe
03-27-2007, 10:47
1996 was when I saw him & Katz at Rainbow Springs campground & then also in Franklin the next day at the motel (i think, Days Inn) up near US441

I couldn't find my copy of the book this AM so that's why I hedged on the date. '96 sounds right to me. ;)

Doctari
03-27-2007, 11:55
For the benefit of those who've never read the book (possibly including Doctari) that statement is quite untrue.

Yea, I know. OK, he hiked more than 1/4 mile.

I read the book, pretty good for a work of fiction, & yes, he is funny.
Probably what irritates me most is it's sold as a factual book, usually in the "tour guide" section is where I have seen it.

I'm off my soap box now, sorry :rolleyes:

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 12:02
Terrapin:

Where did I call him a scoundrel for selling his house......or anything else, for that matter? Houses on North Balch Street go for a million bucks all the time, and his wasn't even one of the largest houses.

Please, if at all possible, stop being such a jerk all the time, OK. It's rude.

rafe
03-27-2007, 12:33
Where did I call him a scoundrel for selling his house......or anything else, for that matter?

Umm, Jack... it was you who brought up the sale (and the sale price) of Bryson's house, in Msg. 53.

rafe
03-27-2007, 12:37
Probably what irritates me most is it's sold as a factual book, usually in the "tour guide" section is where I have seen it.

One presumes that the intelligent reader can approximately distinguish fact from fiction in one of Bryson's travelogues. But maybe that's asking a bit much from some readers... ;)

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 12:42
Um...Terrapin: I'm entirely aware of what I brought up. But nowhere did I call him a scoundrel or anything similar for other moving, or for making a profit off the sale of his house. This is stuff YOU brought up.

So as has been previously requested, please stop being a jerk, and stop imputing comments or statements to people that were, in fact, never made. It's rude.

rafe
03-27-2007, 12:45
So as has been previously requested, please stop being a jerk, and stop imputing comments or statements to people that were, in fact, never made. It's rude.

So why the eff did you mention it, Jack?

Midway Sam
03-27-2007, 12:49
Anyone wishing for a quick overview of the BJ / TT conversation, click here:

http://www.freefever.com/animatedgifs/sports/animated/tennisa2.gif

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 12:52
What does my mentioning it have to do with you falsely accusing people of calling Bryson a scoundrel?

We were discussing his departure from Hanover. Selling off his house and making a million bucks in the process is certainly something that'd be of interest to people, in that it was the success of WITW that enabled him to buy the house in the first place.

But nobody called him names or insulted him, so you should really make an effort to avoid putting false words in people's mouths, OK?

I'm beginning to think that asking you to refrain from being a jerk is probably a waste of time; your continued posts in re. to the "scoundrel/million bucks" thing are a pretty good indication that this character trait is deeply ingrained in your shell somewhere and is unlikely to change.

But it's still rude. Sorry you have trouble seeing this.

The Weasel
03-27-2007, 13:06
I think there is a powerful argument that Bill Bryson contributed much to the trail. To many of us - me included - our first written exposure to anything really about the AT was "A Walk In The Woods," which, while over-the-top, does convey a lot of the feeling of being on the Trail. It was funny, thoughtful, and, clearly, affectionate even while being as sarcastic as Mark Twain was in his travel books. That got me to think, "I can do this." THAT led me to Trailplace, and thoughts of "HOW can I do this." And that led me several hundred miles north from Springer. I think there are others.

Jack does much, I know, and I don't undervalue that. But the simple fact that Bryson's book has such longevity here shows that it has an influence, and not always a bad one.

The Weasel

rafe
03-27-2007, 13:59
I think there is a powerful argument that Bill Bryson contributed much to the trail. To many of us - me included - our first written exposure to anything really about the AT was "A Walk In The Woods," which, while over-the-top, does convey a lot of the feeling of being on the Trail. It was funny, thoughtful, and, clearly, affectionate even while being as sarcastic as Mark Twain was in his travel books. That got me to think, "I can do this." THAT led me to Trailplace, and thoughts of "HOW can I do this." And that led me several hundred miles north from Springer. I think there are others.

Bryson's "attempted thru" took place six years after my own. He had nothing to do with getting me on the trail, but I thoroughly enjoy his observations and humor (in all of his books, not just AWITW.) He's a great satirist and curmudgeon, in the mold of Mark Twain and H. L. Mencken.

I love his commentary in between the hiking-journal stuff -- about the nature of American towns and American attention span, the Park Service, USFS, early explorations of the Appalachians, MacKaye's life, the Centralia PA fire, dinner at Shaws, sharing a damp shelter in SMNP, etc. Not to mention that Bryson is almost exactly my age, and another "chubby section hiker" like myself. I completely relate to the guy.

Since AWITW, Bryson's written at least three entertaining works of non-fiction. Two of these are about the English language, and the third is a history of science.

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 15:06
And the Centralia fire has exactly WHAT to do with the Appalachian Trail? :-?

Oh, and of course you'd like his perpetual negative commentaries on Americans.......Bryson considers himself an Englishman and never fails to speak with disdain about his native land, which is something else he has in common with TT.

And there's a factual error on virtually every page of his book, sometimes several, sorta like your posts.

Birds of a feather. :D

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 15:18
In post #84 the poster gives opinions and views while the poster of post #85 seems to think it is okay to attack the poster of post #84.....

My challenge to the poster of post #85 is to stop attacking other WB posters.

Please deal in facts. How about giving the WB community a list of the errors appearing in AWITW in addition to attacking a WB poster?

Midway Sam
03-27-2007, 15:22
Oooh... one more and we've got ourselves a doubles match!!

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 15:32
What page of the book do you want, Fannypack?

For example, when Bryson is talking about Norwich Vermont and the founder of the military academy there, Alden Partridge, he makes several historical errors in one paragraph.

And he does this sort of thing a lot.

If he's not to be trusted when talking about the history of a community withing walking distance of where he lived for the better part of a decade, then why should we be confident about his facts when he's talking about communities hundreds and hundreds of miles from home, places he's never been, or only been once, fleetingly.

In fact, the book is shockingly fact-checked, it's riddled with errors, and calling it a work of non-fiction is a long stretch. When someone picks up a non-fiction book, one does so in the confidfdence that what lies between the covers actually took place and really happened.

For much of Bryson's book, this is simply not the case.

Oh, and as for Fannypack's "challenge."

My challenge to you is to stop whining so much when posting. It's unseemly.

hopefulhiker
03-27-2007, 15:37
So Jack are you on the trail yet? I read Brysons book after the trail and thouht that it was Ok but a little pretentious, when he claimed at the end to have hiked the AT when he only did about 800 miles max...

MOWGLI
03-27-2007, 15:49
And the Centralia fire has exactly WHAT to do with the Appalachian Trail? :-?



Nothing. But I thought it was one of the more interesting aspects of the book.

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 15:54
Geez....if one of the most interesting things you found about the book had NOTHING to do with what he was ostensibly writing about, then what does this say about how enlightening he was when he WAS speaking on his chosen subject? :-?

MOWGLI
03-27-2007, 15:56
So Jack are you on the trail yet? I read Brysons book after the trail and thouht that it was Ok but a little pretentious, when he claimed at the end to have hiked the AT when he only did about 800 miles max...

The thing is Hopeful, 99% of the people outside of this small community would probably see hiking 800 miles of the AT as "having hiked the AT." It is only a small fraction of the hiking community that concerns themselves with matters as trivial as walking past every white blaze.

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 16:00
Then those people would be wrong, Mowgli.

800 miles is just over a third of the whole A.T. If a climber made it 9500 feet up Everest, would 99% of the world give him credit for summiting? And would ANYONE in the climbing community?

I don't think so.

What's trivial about actually completing something rather than only doing part of it and "CLAIMING" that you did it all? :-?

MOWGLI
03-27-2007, 16:05
Geez....if one of the most interesting things you found about the book had NOTHING to do with what he was ostensibly writing about, then what does this say about how enlightening he was when he WAS speaking on his chosen subject? :-?

I found him amusing Jack. There were some very funny parts to the book - IMO.

I had planned to hike the trail from the time I was 14 or 15. In 1998 (I think), I was driving south with my Mother and two of my daughters. We had Bryson's book on tape when we drove up to Rockfish Gap. There was what appeared to be a thru-hiker sitting under a tree next to his backpack, and that image crystalized the thru-hiking experience in my mind. As we drove down the BRP listening to Bryson, I knew that I would soon be hiking the trail.

MOWGLI
03-27-2007, 16:08
Then those people would be wrong, Mowgli.

800 miles is just over a third of the whole A.T. If a climber made it 9500 feet up Everest, would 99% of the world give him credit for summiting? And would ANYONE in the climbing community?

I don't think so.

What's trivial about actually completing something rather than only doing part of it and "CLAIMING" that you did it all? :-?

I don't want to argue with you Jack, nor do I want to diminish anyone's accomplishments.

But lets face it. Outside of a very small circle of folks, whether a hiker chooses to pass every white blaze (or not) is a very trivial matter.

bfitz
03-27-2007, 16:37
I don't want to argue with you Jack, nor do I want to diminish anyone's accomplishments.

But lets face it. Outside of a very small circle of folks, whether a hiker chooses to pass every white blaze (or not) is a very trivial matter.Certainly a trivial matter, unless they go around calling it something it isn't, then it's a lie. I don't think Bryson made any false claims to thru-hiking. "Purism" is annoying. What's the idfference between a purist and a blue-blazer? A blue-blazer doesn't mind if you're a purist.

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 17:26
I stayed at Rainbow Springs Campground the nite that Katz & Bryson were there and from what I remember. . .

Hmm. Well, if you're asking for factual errors, you may recall that you weren't there on the first day of spring, as Bryson claims -- in order to give being "snowed in" a sense of irony. You were actually there earlier, and so was he. How do I know? I saw his 3 by 5 card, which was still in Jensine's possession. You know what else was funny abou that card? They would keep a tab of everything you ate on the back of it so they would know what to charge you. All the food he complained about? He had most of them twice.


What's trivial about actually completing something rather than only doing part of it and "CLAIMING" that you did it all? :-?

To give Bryson his due, he never claims in the book to have hiked the entire trail, and in fact points out that his mileage, while impressive to non-hikers, would not be close to half of what a thru hiker does.

Some confusion comes in because the back jacket copy of the trade edition, which is not written by the author, says ". . .who hiked almost all of the Appalachian Trail. . ." Now, you could say he should have objected, but it's entirely possible that he didn't even see the copy in advance, as that's usually done by the PR division of the publisher.

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 17:33
Certainly a trivial matter, unless they go around calling it something it isn't, then it's a lie. I don't think Bryson made any false claims to thru-hiking. "Purism" is annoying. What's the idfference between a purist and a blue-blazer? A blue-blazer doesn't mind if you're a purist.
I agree with all your statements....

I hope Purists realize there is more than one way to hike the AT.... Of course, I was a pursit during a 96GA2ME hike then when i went to the PCT in 2001 I found enjoyment in hiking my own hike. I don't need the triple crown and I am sure many others feel the same way. I don't down anyone who has done the triple crown.

A day on the trail beats any day at work!

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 17:35
Boston.....

Everest Base Camp is actually closer to 17,000 feet, not ten.

My "9500" foot comment was in regards to the person who mentioned that Bryson has actually completed around 800 miles, i.e. just over a third of the Trail. On Everest, this would put you around 9500' feet up, which would leave you a very long way from the summit.

You're right.....9500' isn't very far in terms of an Everest summit climb. Just as 800 miles might be a goodly distance, but it isn't close to the miles one would do after completing a thru-hike.

rafe
03-27-2007, 17:39
As I recall, Bryson's words were something like, "We walked the trail." I don't believe he ever said, "We finished the trail" or "We walked the whole trail." Not the exactly a lie, though not exactly honest either.

I wonder how much of the bad blood between Bryson and "the hiking community" is over this... unfortunate claim. He may have thought it innocent or harmless as presented to a non-hiking audience, but may not have considered its effect on actual thru-hikers.

I personally don't hold a grudge against Bryson for those words, but I can see where a narcissistic or purist thru-hiker might.

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 17:43
Did you actually read the book Terrapin?

I suggest you re-read the last two pages.

He said quite plainly that while he didn't walk every mile, well, he doesn't care, because, as he put it, "I hiked the Appalachina Trail."

Um, no he didn't, and neither did anyone else who skipped chunks.

What part of this is so difficult for you to comprehend? You either hiked the Trail in its entirety, or you elected not to. Nothing wrong if you elected to do the latter, except of course if you insist on convincing yourself and others that you did the former.

rafe
03-27-2007, 17:44
All the food he complained about? He had most of them twice.

If you're snowed in with no place else to go, that's not too surprising. He was there for a couple of days, right? (Katz was settling in for a long stay...)

Tin Man
03-27-2007, 17:45
Bryson = 800 AT miles

Tarlin = 8 x 2174 AT thru-hike miles + many section miles

Case closed!

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 17:45
I don't think it's so much a matter of being narcissistic or even purist. I think a lot of hikers were annoyed because the first person to really make a lot of money on a book about the AT was not really part of the trail community, however you want to define that.

Personally, I rather wish that a movie were being made based on Model T's book, for example.

It just came across as a bit carpetbagger-esque to a lot of folks.

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 17:47
If you're snowed in with no place else to go, that's not too surprising. He was there for a couple of days, right? (Katz was settling in for a long stay...)

Yeah, that would make sense if there weren't other things on the menu and other things in the store. But there were.

Jack Tarlin
03-27-2007, 17:47
Giving back to the Trail somehow, i.e. a financial contribution to the Trail that made him a very wealthy man, sure wouldn't hurt, Jester.

As far as I know, in the decade and more since he hiked, he hasn't done this.

rafe
03-27-2007, 17:51
I don't think it's so much a matter of being narcissistic or even purist. I think a lot of hikers were annoyed because the first person to really make a lot of money on a book about the AT was not really part of the trail community, however you want to define that.

It's about the money? Quite honestly, I'm amazed at that notion.

I thought we hiked for more... ummm... selfless reasons.

rafe
03-27-2007, 17:54
Yeah, that would make sense if there weren't other things on the menu and other things in the store. But there were.

It's been 17 years.... I don't recall the hot food menu... except that chili was prominent, and I had some. It was just OK. Barely. I can't remember if I had it twice, but I might have. You know how it is.

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 18:00
I can't remember if I had it twice, but I might have. You know how it is.

Yeah, I do. And you know how when you think something tastes like crap you don't eat it again? Yeah. Bryson doesn't know about that, I guess.


It's about the money? Quite honestly, I'm amazed at that notion.

I thought we hiked for more... ummm... selfless reasons.

Yeah, you see, it would be selfish if I said that I should have been the one to. . .oh, never mind. Let's hear the "selfless reason" that you hike. This should be good. I don't know of anyone, even people raising money for a cause, who can rightfully claim that what they're doing it "selfless." So let's hear it. I'm amazed at that notion.

bfitz
03-27-2007, 18:00
It's about the money? Quite honestly, I'm amazed at that notion.

I thought we hiked for more... ummm... selfless reasons.What possible selfless reason could there be to hike? It's inherently self-indulgent. Especially thru-hiking, which, in the context of Jack's definition, I have not done, despite having hiked as many miles in similiar timeframe. What's the big deal.? I'm hiking for the chicks.

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 18:01
the complete original post from Fannypack (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showpost.php?p=345417&postcount=60)
Originally Posted by Fannypack
I stayed at Rainbow Springs Campground the nite that Katz & Bryson were there and from what I remember. . .
Hmm. Well, if you're asking for factual errors, you may recall that you weren't there on the first day of spring, as Bryson claims -- in order to give being "snowed in" a sense of irony. You were actually there earlier, and so was he. How do I know? I saw his 3 by 5 card, which was still in Jensine's possession. You know what else was funny abou that card? They would keep a tab of everything you ate on the back of it so they would know what to charge you. All the food he complained about? He had most of them twice.




Jester, u disappoint me by cutting off my orginal post to suit your reply. (See my original post above)....
Look I WAS THERE when Katz & Bryson were there, end of discussion.

And all of us hikers complained about the food and we also questioned whether someone else's food was put on our bill.... With all this said Rainbow Springs campground saved us that nite from the cold and maybe we were just typical hikers just complaining about everything, it happens and I do realize that today..

I hope this thread can end so we can concenbtrate on something more productive. (I realize we will still have differences of opinion!)

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 18:09
Jester, u disappoint me by cutting off my orginal post to suit your reply. (See my original post above)....


Sorry, FP, I cut off your post because mine was about the fact that you were there with him, so you must know that the snow storm wasn't on the first day of Spring. I was providing one of the factual errors you asked for.

I wasn't claiming that you weren't there. I was claiming that he wasn't there when he said he was.

It wasn't done to "suit" my reply. It was done because it was the part of your post that was relevant. The ellipse was put in so that others would know that it wasn't your entire post. Pretty standard, but I apologize if I wasn't clear with my point.

rafe
03-27-2007, 18:14
Yeah, you see, it would be selfish if I said that I should have been the one to. . .oh, never mind. Let's hear the "selfless reason" that you hike. This should be good. I don't know of anyone, even people raising money for a cause, who can rightfully claim that what they're doing it "selfless." So let's hear it. I'm amazed at that notion.

My bad. Poor choice of words. It's totally selfish. But it sure as hell isn't for monetary gain. Not for one millisecond.

I sell photographs on the side, and I've taken a few nice photos on the AT and even sold a few of those. But it would be no different if those photos had been taken while on vacation at Zion National Park or pooting through Europe in a Fiat 500 (as I did 35 years ago.) I hike, I travel, and I take photos, and if those avocations should align to my financial benefit, fine. None of those avocations are driven by the desire for financial gain. Quite the contrary, in fact.

Bryson writes for a living (and does it quite well) and for a while he thought that a long hike on the AT might be fun. What's the crime in that? Why begrudge him the success of his book because of the venue and the subject?

Fannypack
03-27-2007, 18:16
Jester, thx for the response

YES, the snow strom was March 19.. We were at Carter Gap Shelter & Bryson was at the shelter atop Albert Mtn.... Even though it didn't snow on the 1st day of spring, the snowstorm on the 19th impacted the hiking on the 1st day of spring greatly... 1.5 ft of snow north of Winding Stair gap and 2 ft in the Smokies

Another day in paradise....

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 18:30
Bryson writes for a living (and does it quite well) and for a while he thought that a long hike on the AT might be fun. What's the crime in that?

There's no crime in that. I was just explaining why some feel the way they do, and that it has little to do with narcissism or purism, as you had stated in your post.

I also don't see anything wrong in some people wishing that if someone were to be financially successful as a result of their association with the trail, that it would be someone who was closer to the trail community and someone who thought of the trail as slightly more than just "fun." Someone who would, for example, donate to the Maine Land Trust, or someone who was a member of, say, a trail club.

Perhaps Bill Bryson has made a donation or two and done it quietly. He doesn't seem like a bad guy to me.

Regardless, I wasn't trying to sound all money-grubby about this. But those who know me know that I'm all about the greed, so sometimes it leaks through.

weary
03-27-2007, 18:33
A more meaningful comparison would pit Jack's hiking skills against Bryson's wit, erudition, and writing skills. I've read all of Bryson's books, and always look forward to the next.
As do I. Well, except for "a walk in the woods," which was pretty much crap. crap that begins with an S and ends with a T.

Bryson's AT book was skillfully written, but really mostly imagined experiences, which was all he had to deal with after having signed a book contract, gotten a big advance, and discovered he hated the trail and most of the folks he met thereon.

Weary

bfitz
03-27-2007, 18:34
Did Weary just agree with Jack on something?

Major news outlets need to be notified immediately.

Hell just froze over.

The Weasel
03-27-2007, 18:36
*** When someone picks up a non-fiction book, one does so in the confidfdence that what lies between the covers actually took place and really happened.

***
My challenge to you is to stop whining so much when posting. It's unseemly.

Jack, you need to remember a few things:

1) This isn't the "Non-AT" forums. People can't unsubscribe you when you get nasty and personal here. Lighten up and stop accusing others of what you are doing.

2) "Non-fiction" is something Mark Twain and Amerigo Vespucci both used in their travel books and, for that matter. Alexis deTocqueville. All had anything from honest errors to bald faced lies to - broad, crazy, wild humor. That doesn't mean they are fiction. Just wrong. mistaken or funny as hell. Sometimes all three. Stop trying to be pompous and leave it to those of us who get paid for it; you're not very good at it and it shows.

3) Tell you what. You can ignore points 1) and 2) if you'll just agree that Ann Coulter's screeds are fiction, too. By the way, where is Big Mouth Ann now that Elizabeth Edwards is showing what it means to be classy?

In other words, if you want to attack people and be antagonistic, take it elsewhere. There are special forums for that. This isn't one of them.

The Weasel

rafe
03-27-2007, 18:45
I also don't see anything wrong in some people wishing that if someone were to be financially successful as a result of their association with the trail, that it would be someone who was closer to the trail community and someone who thought of the trail as slightly more than just "fun." Someone who would, for example, donate to the Maine Land Trust, or someone who was a member of, say, a trail club.

What I find odd is that Bryson is being held to some standard that's hardly ever applied to other folks in his position. If Bryson was in fact the first to "get rich off the AT," it's from a combination of factors -- talent, humor, excellent publicity, a great publisher, etc. I'd read dozens of trail journals before my hike in '90 and long before AWITW came along. Most of them were b o r i n g. Most of the authors struck me as pompous. To me, Bryson was a breath of fresh air -- in some ways, the most honest account of all, but in any case, far and away the most fun to read.

Maybe it's best to think of AWITW as a very funny book that happens to be somewhat about a long hike on the AT.

bfitz
03-27-2007, 18:46
Stop whining so much. Jack's actually got a point. Oh, and "fiction" means false, made-up, invented i.e. the product of the author's imagination. "Non-fiction" means NOT made up, i.e. true, like a work of history or biography.

So Jack is right about that too.

rafe
03-27-2007, 18:48
...and discovered he hated the trail and most of the folks he met thereon.

Projecting a little, Weary? :rolleyes:

Skidsteer
03-27-2007, 18:52
Did Weary just agree with Jack on something?

Major news outlets need to be notified immediately.

Hell just froze over.

It happens occasionally. And when it does, my gut reaction is to pay really close attention.

John B
03-27-2007, 18:59
Stop whining so much. Jack's actually got a point. Oh, and "fiction" means false, made-up, invented i.e. the product of the author's imagination. "Non-fiction" means NOT made up, i.e. true, like a work of history or biography.

So Jack is right about that too.


From Wikipedia. The MLA says about the same:
"Essays (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essay), journals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journal), documentaries (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Documentary_film), scientific papers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_paper), photographs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photograph), biographies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biography), textbooks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Textbook), blueprints (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blueprint), technical documentation, user manuals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technical_writer), diagrams (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diagram) and journalism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journalism) are all common examples of non-fiction works, and fiction within any of these works is usually regarded as dishonest.

Other works can legitimately be either fiction or non-fiction, such as letters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter), magazine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magazine) articles, histories (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History), websites (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Website), speeches (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speech) and travelogues (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travel_literature). Although they are mostly either one or the other it is not uncommon for there to be a blend of both, particularly non-fiction with a dash of fiction for added spice."

Jester2000
03-27-2007, 19:00
What I find odd is that Bryson is being held to some standard that's hardly ever applied to other folks in his position. If Bryson was in fact the first to "get rich off the AT," it's from a combination of factors -- talent, humor, excellent publicity, a great publisher, etc. I'd read dozens of trail journals before my hike in '90 and long before AWITW came along. Most of them were b o r i n g. Most of the authors struck me as pompous. To me, Bryson was a breath of fresh air -- in some ways, the most honest account of all, but in any case, far and away the most fun to read.

Maybe it's best to think of AWITW as a very funny book that happens to be somewhat about a long hike on the AT. (emphasis mine)

That's pretty much how I view it. I enjoy Bryson's writing. I particularly enjoy his series of articles about what it was like moving back to the US.

As for him being held to some standard that others are not, that would be difficult to assess, as I know of no one else "in his position," and if I did, I'd probably hold them to the same standard. For example, if someone made a lot of money writing about a walk in the Rain Forest, I'd kind of expect them to donate some of their earnings to some sort of environmental non-profit that worked in the area.

Note that I said "earnings." I am fully aware that he writes for a living, and that he is good at it.

Perhaps if you knew more about me you'd be in more of a position to judge the accuracy of your insinuations of hypocrisy.

Or maybe you were making a statement about hikers generally, and not aiming your comment my way.

rafe
03-27-2007, 19:06
I apologize for my hasty words toward Weary in Msg. 122.

Even so, Weary, it's quite disingenuous to suggest that the book consists of "mostly imagined experiences" or to deny Bryson's sincere affection for the trail, both explicit and implicit.

rafe
03-27-2007, 19:18
Perhaps if you knew more about me you'd be in more of a position to judge the accuracy of your insinuations of hypocrisy.

We've never met, Jester, and I know nothing about you except from what I read on Whiteblaze. None of my words are directed at you specifically. A while back my words were directed at Jack Tarlin primarily, but not now.

It would, I suppose, be interesting to know if Bryson (or his publisher) has made generous contributions to the ATC or some other trail-related cause. I have no way of knowing such things.

Did Ansel Adams make huge financial contributions, from his own wealth, to the Sierra Club or other environmental/ecological causes? How about Ed Abbey? Jon Krakauer? David Muench? I'm struggling a bit to find "equivalents" for Bryson here, as you can see.

saimyoji
03-27-2007, 20:19
For example, if someone made a lot of money writing about a walk in the Rain Forest, I'd kind of expect them to donate some of their earnings to some sort of environmental non-profit that worked in the area. (emphasis mine)


Why? I don't disagree, just askin'.

moxie
03-27-2007, 21:34
Did Ansel Adams make huge financial contributions, from his own wealth, to the Sierra Club or other environmental/ecological causes? How about Ed Abbey? Jon Krakauer? David Muench? I'm struggling a bit to find "equivalents" for Bryson here, as you can see.[/quote


Adams did give and still gives long after his passing with sale of photos whose rights were donated to enviromental causes. Ed Abbey never really saw any real profit from his incredable adventures. He worked as a seasonal park ranger, hiked in sneakers, and was never shy about picking up a bar bill. Jon Krakauer is as pompas an ass as Bryson and belongs in the same league. I have no idea who the other guy is but I'm just a simple country boy from Mount Vernon, Maine. Struggle away, there is no equilivant to Bryson----- Thank God,:D

rafe
03-27-2007, 21:53
Strangely, nothing much about cash for the AT in particular. A bit of googling reveals that Bryson's been quite generous with his wealth and success, and supported numerous worthy causes.

http://www.woodland-trust.org.uk/wentwood/wentwood2_securing.htm

In the spring of 2005, a large part of Wentwood Forest near Newport, Wales’ largest remaining planted ancient woodland (PAWS), was offered for sale on the open market. The Woodland Trust felt that Wentwood was a site in need of urgent restoration; however, we needed to raise at least £1.5 million to secure the purchase of the site. Celebrities like Oscar-winning actress Dame Judi Dench, TV personality and meteorologist Siân Lloyd, and award-winning writer Bill Bryson, also backed the campaign.

http://www.rsc.org/Education/BillBryson/

In 2005 all UK schools and colleges received a copy of Bill Bryson's book 'A Short History of Everything'. Bill Bryson has generously donated his royalties from these sales to establish a schools' science communication award. His cash donation has been matched by both the RSC and Bryson's publishers, Transworld.

http://www.gosh.org/news/2004/bill_bryson.html

American author Bill Bryson, winner of the 2004 Aventis Prize for Science Books, has donated his £10,000 award to Great Ormond Street Hospital Children’s Charity. In response to this generous gesture, the Aventis Foundation has matched Bill Bryson’s donation with a further £10,000 gift to the hospital. Bill Bryson will present the combined cheque to the hospital on Wednesday 23 June at 10am.

http://www.amazon.ca/Bill-Brysons-African-Diary-Bryson/dp/038565989X

The book's cover states that royalties and profits from the book will be donated to CARE International. Highly Recommended.

rafe
03-27-2007, 22:11
Jon Krakauer is as pompas an ass as Bryson and belongs in the same league.
The Everest '96 Memorial Fund, established by author Jon Krakauer, has made donations of $138,500 to charitable groups, including a grant of $4,000 to the Himalayan Explorers Club.

The fund was established with Krakauer's share fo the royalties from Into Thin Air: The Illustrated Edition, which was released in 1998. The fund was set up to honor the climbers that lost their lives on Mount Everest in May 1996, by providing humanitarian aid to the indigenous people of the Himalaya, supporting organizations working to preserve the natural environment, and assisting various other charities in the United States that support these humanitarian and environmental efforts.
Link (http://www.terrapinphoto.com/fall99.pdf) (to mirrored copy of PDF on my website)

Footslogger
03-27-2007, 22:17
What does any of this have to do with the price of tea in China ?

'Slogger

Tin Man
03-27-2007, 22:21
Any of you all worked up over who is donating to what cause think about donating to the WB cause? :-?

Skidsteer
03-27-2007, 22:34
Any of you all worked up over who is donating to what cause think about donating to the WB cause? :-?

Actually, I think most of the 'worked up' players are Donating members.

moxie
03-27-2007, 22:51
The Everest '96 Memorial Fund, established by author Jon Krakauer, has made donations of $138,500 to charitable groups, including a grant of $4,000 to the Himalayan Explorers Club.


The fund was established with Krakauer's share fo the royalties from Into Thin Air: The Illustrated Edition, which was released in 1998. The fund was set up to honor the climbers that lost their lives on Mount Everest in May 1996, by providing humanitarian aid to the indigenous people of the Himalaya, supporting organizations working to preserve the natural environment, and assisting various other charities in the United States that support these humanitarian and environmental efforts.Link (http://www.terrapinphoto.com/fall99.pdf) (to mirrored copy of PDF on my website)
According to the late Anatoli Boukreev, a master Everest guide who was on Everest with Krakauer, Jon took about as much liberty with the truth as Bryson did with "Walk In The Woods". That is why you can paint them both with the same brush. It is an intresting side note that both Jon Krakauer and Baltimore Jack are both alumini of Hampshire College.

moxie
03-27-2007, 22:52
What does any of this have to do with the price of tea in China ?

'Slogger
I'm going to Tibet through China in July, want me to bring you some tea?

Footslogger
03-27-2007, 23:01
I'm going to Tibet through China in July, want me to bring you some tea?

============================

But yes ...Darjeeling please.

'Slogger

rafe
03-27-2007, 23:02
According to the late Anatoli Boukreev, a master Everest guide who was on Everest with Krakauer, Jon took about as much liberty with the truth as Bryson did with "Walk In The Woods". That is why you can paint them both with the same brush. It is an intresting side note that both Jon Krakauer and Baltimore Jack are both alumini of Hampshire College.

Well, it's clear that Boukreev and Krakauer weren't on the best of terms after the Everest expedition -- that's pretty clear from the epilogue. I wasn't there, so I'm in no position to judge. (Were you?) As with Bryson, I don't judge Krakauer by one book alone; I've read most of his stuff, and it's all good reading.

Now, about that $138 thousand....

Tin Man
03-27-2007, 23:10
Actually, I think most of the 'worked up' players are Donating members.

Then maybe the donator players should pay by the post. ;)

Skidsteer
03-27-2007, 23:20
Then maybe the donator players should pay by the post. ;)

That would certainly assure adequate bandwidth for future generations.

Sleepy the Arab
03-27-2007, 23:30
I can't believe this stupid Bryson issue has come up once again. Furthermore, I can't believe I just read seven pages of the same old stuff. And lastly, I can't believe it's not butter.

For what it's worth, I know which of the two I'd rather be with when attacking a Chinese Buffet like a Mongol finding a hole in the Great Wall. It's the same guy who could sleepwalk 850 miles of the AT.

rafe
03-27-2007, 23:55
I can't believe this stupid Bryson issue has come up once again. Furthermore, I can't believe I just read seven pages of the same old stuff. And lastly, I can't believe it's not butter.

Well, we could be talking about the use or non-use of trekking poles, alcohol stoves, canister resupply, fording the Kennebec, optimal start dates, the horribleness of shelters, shelter etiquette, sorucks, parucks, trashgivings, fifty ways to dress up ramen, Squeaky's next speed-hiking attempt, Zelph's latest stove design, Skid's latest ultralight thingamajig, duct-tape drinking cups, the father of Anna Nicole Smith's baby, vagrant petty-thieving jesus-freak thru-hikers, illegal immigrants, the latest Bush scandal, water treatment methods, to walk or not walk the approach trail, and that sort of thing. But yeah, it's all the same old same old. You got something new and interesting to talk about? Let's hear it. :D

grysmn
03-28-2007, 00:38
Jack there is an imposter claiming to be you. He is an old broken down drunk. His come on line to women is "Want to sleep with a legond, I'm Baltimore Jack". Don't worry no ones going to sue you for paternity, it hasn't worked once! It is the number one rated form of birth control! :banana :banana :banana :banana

Jimmers
03-28-2007, 00:56
Wow, I am truly impressed. You've managed to summarize pretty much every thread I've read in the last month. And faced with this list, I can only come to the conclusion that I need to find something more productive to do with my ridiculous amounts of free time. But first, what's happening on that global warming thread.........:D


Well, we could be talking about the use or non-use of trekking poles, alcohol stoves, canister resupply, fording the Kennebec, optimal start dates, the horribleness of shelters, shelter etiquette, sorucks, parucks, trashgivings, fifty ways to dress up ramen, Squeaky's next speed-hiking attempt, Zelph's latest stove design, Skid's latest ultralight thingamajig, duct-tape drinking cups, the father of Anna Nicole Smith's baby, vagrant petty-thieving jesus-freak thru-hikers, illegal immigrants, the latest Bush scandal, water treatment methods, to walk or not walk the approach trail, and that sort of thing. But yeah, it's all the same old same old. You got something new and interesting to talk about? Let's hear it. :D

moxie
03-28-2007, 08:27
Well, it's clear that Boukreev and Krakauer weren't on the best of terms after the Everest expedition -- that's pretty clear from the epilogue. I wasn't there, so I'm in no position to judge. (Were you?) As with Bryson, I don't judge Krakauer by one book alone; I've read most of his stuff, and it's all good reading.

Now, about that $138 thousand....
Jon has written some excellent books as has Bryson but great liberties were taken with "Walk In The Woods" and "Into Thin Air" and presented to readers as actual facts. No I wasn't there but between Boukreev, Beck Weathers and the statements of those that were there Jon may have eithered suffered an o2 memory loss or altered what happened to make himself and his party look good. I loved both books, have re-read them several times and accept them as creative writing, not historical fact. I have hiked the trail, personally met several people in Brysons book and again, in my opinion, many actual events were altered in the intrest of cerative writing and $$$ from book sales. If you want to accept the books as accurate accounts of events that really took place I would like to show you some land I have for sale 20 miles southeast of Bar Harbor, Maine.

StarLyte
03-28-2007, 08:35
Well, we could be talking about the use or non-use of trekking poles, alcohol stoves, canister resupply, fording the Kennebec, optimal start dates, the horribleness of shelters, shelter etiquette, sorucks, parucks, trashgivings, fifty ways to dress up ramen, Squeaky's next speed-hiking attempt, Zelph's latest stove design, Skid's latest ultralight thingamajig, duct-tape drinking cups, the father of Anna Nicole Smith's baby, vagrant petty-thieving jesus-freak thru-hikers, illegal immigrants, the latest Bush scandal, water treatment methods, to walk or not walk the approach trail, and that sort of thing. But yeah, it's all the same old same old. You got something new and interesting to talk about? Let's hear it. :D

You got it right Terrapin.....bring it on ;)

rafe
03-28-2007, 08:52
I can't comment on Krakauer's "truth" because I'm not a technical climber and have never been to most of the places he describes.

With regard to AWITW... there are, and have been for ages, dozens of "accurate" and "honest" diaries and journals -- the great Rodale anthology from 1975 being one of the very best. You can get the full accouts from Garvey, Shaffer, Dorothy Laker, et. al. and ad nauseum. The point is, most of them are dry and not that interesting and many of the authors (IMO) take themselves and their "quest" far too seriously.

I don't take Bryson as a "serious" account of the AT -- but in some ways he captures the truth better than the more "serious" accounts. One example: early on, he observes some guy, southbound, near the finish, in great pain, and nearly in tears from the pain and deprivation he's suffered along the way. Bryson wonders out loud, why anyone would endure all that when doing so is entirely voluntary. It sounds sarcastic, but in fact it's a question that all wanna-be thru hikers ought to think about, deeply, before setting out.

Brrrb Oregon
03-28-2007, 15:09
Did you actually read the book Terrapin?

I suggest you re-read the last two pages.

He said quite plainly that while he didn't walk every mile, well, he doesn't care, because, as he put it, "I hiked the Appalachina Trail."

Um, no he didn't, and neither did anyone else who skipped chunks.

What part of this is so difficult for you to comprehend? You either hiked the Trail in its entirety, or you elected not to. Nothing wrong if you elected to do the latter, except of course if you insist on convincing yourself and others that you did the former.

So if you haven't sailed the entire ocean, you haven't sailed the ocean?
If you haven't read the entire cycle, straight through and in order, you haven't read Shakespeare?
If you've never sat down and read it straight through from start to finish, you've never read the Bible?

He said what he meant by "hiking the AT". He's not implying that he did what you would mean by saying that.....is he required to use the language in the way that you do, in order to not be self-deluded?

Oh, please. That's a bit strict. The phrase "thru-hike" exists to express what you mean when you say "hike". If we all switch to your meaning, then how do you describe it when you've spent a month up there? "I've done a serious stroll on the AT"?


Stop whining so much. Jack's actually got a point. Oh, and "fiction" means false, made-up, invented i.e. the product of the author's imagination. "Non-fiction" means NOT made up, i.e. true, like a work of history or biography.

So Jack is right about that too.

I suspect that in his case, "fiction" means "I had to come up with a plot, rather than just report what I did with a lot of hot wind added for fun".

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 15:21
Hey, Jack? Who made you the arbiter of what "walking the Appalachian Trail" means? Sorry to break it to you, but you don't get to decide things like that. You're not the ATC. You're not a majority here. It doesn't matter what the majority here says, since the majority here doesn't get to make decisions (if it did, you'd be wearing a Hillary/Obama sticker on your foreheard). You have no more right to decide what Bill Bryson should or shouldn't say about "I walked the Appalachian Trail" than he does.

You say tomato, and I say tomahto. Big deal. When you become King of the World, you can make the rules, and not before. Until then, sit down and stop sounding foolish.

The Weasel

MOWGLI
03-28-2007, 15:22
I agree. 800 miles of hiking the AT gives the hiker an understanding of what the trail experience is all about. Especially if you've hiked it during thru-hiker season. You may not know every part of the trail, but for 99.9% of Americans, 800 miles is more than enough to say that "you hiked the Appalachian Trail."

Now if you said you hiked ALL of the Appalachian Trail after 800 miles... That's a different story.

I would suggest that the hiker who goes back repeatedly and hikes the trail in all seasons, in both directions, really knows the trail best. The AT in Georgia, TN & NC in summertime is radically different than the same place in April & May.

In other words, there are always new and exciting things to discover about our trail!

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 15:38
I agree. 800 miles of hiking the AT gives the hiker an understanding of what the trail experience is all about. Especially if you've hiked it during thru-hiker season. You may not know every part of the trail, but for 99.9% of Americans, 800 miles is more than enough to say that "you hiked the Appalachian Trail." ***

Mowgli, you're dead right. Bryson wrote a book that was honest about where he walked and where he didn't. He stated opinions, some of them harsh, some sarcastic, and many affectionate. After a couple of hundred pages, after making it clear he never walked everything, he closed with "I walked the Appalachian Trail." The only people who could think that was somehow deceptive are those who never read anything in front of that sentence.

People like Jack should take a few breaths into a sandwich bag and stop hyperventilating.

The Weasel

Jack Tarlin
03-28-2007, 15:39
Fine, Weasel. I give up, Let's make YOU the arbiter.

Give us your definition of "thru-hike", OK? Tell us what YOU think it means, and make sure you tell us how many you can skip while still pretending you've done the entire thing.

I'd be curious to hear it.

I hope it means more than a thousand miles. :rolleyes:

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 15:44
Fine, Weasel. I give up, Let's make YOU the arbiter.

Give us your definition of "thru-hike", OK? Tell us what YOU think it means, and make sure you tell us how many you can skip while still pretending you've done the entire thing.

I'd be curious to hear it.

I hope it means more than a thousand miles. :rolleyes:

Jack, you don't get it, do you? You're not entitled to decide who is in charge, whether it's you, me, Bill Bryson, or Mumbo Jumbo the King of the Jungle. Bryson never "pretended" anything, which you'd know IF you read the whole book.

You're a good source of trail info. You're not the King of the World, or even King of the AT, Jack. No one is.

So thanks for offering me something that's not yours to give.

The Weasel

Brrrb Oregon
03-28-2007, 15:49
When you become King of the World, you can make the rules, and not before.

And good luck enforcing them in the backcountry when you do! Whoever got the position first went and gave everybody free will, so I think you're out of luck! :p


I would suggest that the hiker who goes back repeatedly and hikes the trail in all seasons, in both directions, really knows the trail best. The AT in Georgia, TN & NC in summertime is radically different than the same place in April & May.

I have to admit to being in this camp....which, ironically, implies that you can hardly be expected know a trail if you've only thru-hiked it, any more than you "know" Maine when you can only be induced to show up there during the summertime. It is a prejudice of a different sort, I'll admit it.

Luckily, though, most of us get more than one season to hike, even if we may only be lucky enough to get one season to thru-hike!

As for me, I like to hike when the crowds don't. Since I'm not likely to ever have the chance to thru-hike the AT (what are the chances that I'll have another season, after taking the first two (or umpteen) free ones it would take me to finally knock down the PCT and the CDT?), I'm most likely to spend whatever time I do get to hike it mid-week, in whatever section the thruhikers aren't doing. Then I'd go down to the towns on the weekends, for the music and the crowds I do like. IOW, I can tolerate crowded restaurants better than crowded trails.

jesse
03-28-2007, 15:50
When you put "I walked the AT" in context, Bryson was not claiming to have completed a thru. There maybe false claims in the book, but this is not one of them. I also think that the average joe off the street, who puts on pack and walks the AT, would have an experience closer to Bryson's, than to the typical WB member. Bryson was writing to the masses, not to the hiking community.
I enjoyed the book. Every time I go caming with my sons BS troop I think of Brysons description of scouts being "charmingly incompetent", and have a chucle.

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 17:25
So "hiking the AT" may mean different things to different people; so what? The real Bryson issue, aside from a few factual errors, is the way he makes totally disparaging remarks about practically everyone he runs across. Is this an example we want to embrace, like some here are leaning towards? Or, is this an example we can rise above to show that we are constructive and compassionate and can respect each other's differences?

[Apologies in advance if this is too serious or too deep and please know I mean no offense.]

Jack Tarlin
03-28-2007, 17:48
Jesus, Weasel, I'm trying to be concilliatory.

All I asked was a very simple question.....one that seems to be quite beyond you. Forget about me for a minute. What is YOUR definition of what constitutes a thru-hike, eh? And how much can one miss or skip and still honestly say they hiked the A.T.

Pretty simple questions, counselor. What's your problem? Forget this "King of the World" chicken**** name-calling, OK? You obvioulsy don't care for what I think, so I'm giving you the chance to tell us what YOU think.

If you don't care to answer, then I've got to believe you're not that interested in the subject. You're just interested in bitching at me.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-28-2007, 17:57
::: Threadjack :::
Jack, go shake bfitz's hand and give Miss Janet a big hug for me.
::: end threadjack - resume fighting :::

TJ aka Teej
03-28-2007, 18:04
So "hiking the AT" may mean different things to different people; so what? The real Bryson issue, aside from a few factual errors, is the way he makes totally disparaging remarks about practically everyone he runs across. Is this an example we want to embrace, like some here are leaning towards? Or, is this an example we can rise above to show that we are constructive and compassionate and can respect each other's differences?

Best dang post of the whole dang thread.
Thanks, Tin Man!

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 18:13
Jack, you always try to set the conditions for discussion. Get a life. You think it's "chicken" stuff when you get the truth put at you, but get this, will you: NO ONE ELECTED YOU TO ANYTHING. YOU DO NOT GET TO DECIDE WHAT THE TERMS OF DISCUSSION ARE. YOU GOT ONE - EXACTLY ONE - VOTE. NO MORE.

And if you're trying to deepsix Bill Bryson, he never said "I thru hiked the AT." Give THAT one up too. Calling a writer a liar - which is what you've done about him several times - sometimes gets one in more trouble than it is worth. Especially if you say it in a very public forum, often enough. This is friendly advice. I don't need the work.

As for "definitions" of a "thru hike", mine only matters to me. You want to try to paint people into cute little categories, so I suggest you get a job with the Census Bureau. Then you can be part of a nice bunch people trying to force definitions on othes.

Jack, if I'm irked here, its because you first, call someone names, second demand that anyone responding to it play by your rules, then act all hoity-toity when they don't. I repeat: You're not the boss of me, or anyone else. When you can show me the election returns for King of ANYthing, maybe I'll change my feelings. On the other hand, as a Republican senator said yesterday, "We had a king once, and it didn't work." I doubt you'll be all that much better, but once you show me the vote, I'll consider it. Not now; then.

Until then, stop it with the demands. You sound like a little kid. "Do it MY way!"

The Weasel


Jesus, Weasel, I'm trying to be concilliatory.

All I asked was a very simple question.....one that seems to be quite beyond you. Forget about me for a minute. What is YOUR definition of what constitutes a thru-hike, eh? And how much can one miss or skip and still honestly say they hiked the A.T.

Pretty simple questions, counselor. What's your problem? Forget this "King of the World" chicken**** name-calling, OK? You obvioulsy don't care for what I think, so I'm giving you the chance to tell us what YOU think.

If you don't care to answer, then I've got to believe you're not that interested in the subject. You're just interested in bitching at me.

Heater
03-28-2007, 18:15
I think anyone that has hiked on the AT, whether long or short, for a section or a picnic, has "hiked the AT".

dixicritter
03-28-2007, 18:16
I think this arguing is silly, that's what I think. Y'all are arguing over semantics now.

Here's what the ATC has to say about the defining of Thru-hikers...


How does ATC define thru-hiking?

We don't. ATC uses the term "2,000-miler" as a matter of tradition and convenience. ATC defines a "2,000-miler" as anyone who has hiked the entire Trail between Springer Mountain in Georgia and Katahdin in Maine. We don't consider issues such as the sequence, direction, speed or whether one carries a pack. We do expect that persons applying for inclusion in our 2,000-miler records have made an honest effort to walk the entire Trail.

ATC Website (http://www.appalachiantrail.org/site/c.jkLXJ8MQKtH/b.788745/k.9CE2/FAQ_ThruHiking.htm)

As far as Bryson saying he'd "hiked the AT" well that would be a true statement to make as he did hike 800 miles of the AT... correct? He didn't say he thru-hiked the AT, nor did he claim to be a 2000 miler so I don't see a problem here. I've hiked a few steps on the the AT myself just to be able to say I'd hiked some on the AT. Does that earn me the same disdain from some of you that you are throwing at Bryson? Or is he just special like that? ;)

I believe it is time to take advantage of the beautiful weather, get away from these computers and out on the trails to let off some of that steam. Don't y'all agree? :D

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-28-2007, 18:17
So when do we leave, Ms Dixie :D

Jester2000
03-28-2007, 18:19
Why? I don't disagree, just askin'.

(the question pertains to why I would expect someone to donate some of their earnings when writing about a place or people who could use donations)

I can honestly say that it really only has to do with the fact that it's what I'd do in that situation. I don't really have a good answer beyond that. I see people who thru hike the AT, earn nothing from it in the monetary sense, who feel an urge to "give back" in whatever way they can, be it through trail work or donations or trail magic. So I guess I kind of feel like that's the standard to which people should be held -- give if you can, 'cause a lot of people give even when they can't.


I can't believe I just read seven pages of the same old stuff.

I always find it incredibly funny when people complain about having read a long thread about a topic that is being rehashed. It's as if they start clicking and have no free will. "Look deep into my Bryson thread. Deeper. Now keep reading. And if anyone says 'Katz,' you will cluck like a chicken. . ."

dixicritter
03-28-2007, 18:19
Unfortunately I'm stuck till the weekend since Rock is out of town again.... dang Army...LOL.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-28-2007, 18:24
Well, we'll go when you get some free time.

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 18:24
So when do we leave, Ms Dixie :D

[Happily following Dixie and FD, trying not to trip in dino tracks in the Trail]

The Weasel

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 18:25
Unfortunately I'm stuck till the weekend since Rock is out of town again.... dang Army...LOL.

Laughing...Only non-soldier in this entire forum allowed to say, "Dang Army!"

The Weasel

dixicritter
03-28-2007, 18:28
Laughing...Only non-soldier in this entire forum allowed to say, "Dang Army!"

The Weasel

Glad to make someone laugh... :D

rickb
03-28-2007, 18:45
Hey, Jack? Who made you the arbiter of what "walking the Appalachian Trail" means? Sorry to break it to you, but you don't get to decide things like that.

Not the arbiter, but Jack's spot on, nevertheless.

While Bryson does say that he he didn't walk the Trail's entire length (though some would say he exagerates even those miles he does lay claim to), he most certainly presents his exeprience and story as capturing the essense of the AT.

Yea, right.

If Weary said he hiked the AT, I'd agree in a heart beat-- even if his swollen toe caused him to skip a few blazes.

But Bryson? You have got to be kidding. That would me like me saying I went to Harvard.

Even though it was just for Christmas Revels a time or two.

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 18:52
Not the arbiter, but Jack's spot on, nevertheless.

While Bryson does say that he he didn't walk the Trail's entire length (though some would say he exagerates even those miles he does lay claim to), he most certainly presents his exeprience and story as capturing the essense of the AT.

Yea, right.

If Weary said he hiked the AT, I'd agree in a heart beat-- even if his swollen toe caused him to skip a few blazes.

But Bryson? You have got to be kidding. That would me like me saying I went to Harvard.

Even though it was just for Christmas Revels a time or two.

When Jack wants to discuss what you have raised - "Did Bill Bryson capture the essence of what it's like?" - that will be a good discussion, instead of demands for "definitions" and a lot of childish hooey.

I think he did: There was much about the AT that I found to be exactly as he put it it - am I the only one to improve his gear and food by the time I hit Hot Springs from trailside and hikerbox frinds? - and other times his 'gonzo' descriptions (Hunter Thompson fans will know what I mean) had absolutely no factual basis while being the total truth. Other parts I just flat out disagreed with. But once I got going, I had the exact feel he did at a lot of times.

The way I describe the AT to others is much different than how others do. That's just how people are.

The Weasel

rickb
03-28-2007, 19:02
I saw no joy in Bryson's account. YMMV.

Not for the people.

Not for the critters.

Not for the AT itself.

If one wants to read a travelog written by a curmudgeon, much better -- by an order of magnitude -- to read Paul Thereoux . I just wish he got to the AT first.

eventidecu
03-28-2007, 19:10
I can't believe I've read 9 pages of this crap. Who cares what Bryson did, said or wrote otherwise. Don't like him don't read his books. He had a job to do which was "write a book" and he hiked enough of the AT that made him believe he was "qualified" to give testament as to what it was like hiking the AT. 800 miles is more than most of us here have hiked the AT at one time. If Jack wants to bitch about what someone else writes about the AT he certainly has the "experience" to write his own book and do what ever he wants to with the details and profits. Add a chapter invalidating Brysons "accounts of the trail" which would give him a hell of a lot more PR than Bryson ever got for his book. If he doesn't care then write it anyway and give the money to buy more land along the AT.

Don't knock a man for "hyping" his hike because some have "hyped" their own hike(s) for their own "whatever" reasons. Not to take anything away from Jack or anyone else but I would bet Jack, (and others) have received plenty of "monetary gains" (meals, hostel stays, beer, cigs, motels, discounts on gear ...ect, ect...) during one of his latter hikes exclusively due to his own "hype".

Jester2000
03-28-2007, 19:15
I can't believe I've read 9 pages of this crap.

I can't believe you did either (see my above post about people who say this).

rickb
03-28-2007, 19:20
Last week I was gettinng my ass kicked on a treadmill test, convinced that the Doc would turn off the power before I cried Uncle when I made the mistake of mentioning that I had hiked the AT.

Naturally he had read Bryson.

So there I am sweating like a pig pushing myself harder than any sane person would were it not for the knowledge that I if my heart exploded it would all be on tape and help was near, when the questions came.

Naturally I had to refute each misconception as it was presented. And as a solo hiking SOBO, I had to further qualify all my answers.

The machine won.

And that, (in a nut shell) is why Bryson sucks.

rafe
03-28-2007, 19:27
I saw no joy in Bryson's account. YMMV.

As indeed it (my mileage) did.

I recall (or maybe I imagined) numerous paragraphs and/or chapters ending with the simple sentence, "We were happy." Or, "We were very happy."

And there is a palpapble sadness at the end, when Bryson & Katz are back in town, after Katz has been lost and found in the 100-mile wilderness.

Katz offers to buy Bryson a Coke out of a machine, but there's no longer much joy in it... and Bryson explains why.

I'm still mystified at why this hugely popular, best-selling book is so thoroughly dissed by the so-called "hiking community." Y'all have a good sense of humor, most of the time, but for Bryson, you get all sanctimonious. What's up with that?

rafe
03-28-2007, 19:34
Naturally I had to refute each misconception as it was presented. And as a solo hiking SOBO, I had to further qualify all my answers.

Just out of curiousity, could you cite a couple of the Doc's misconceptions, and how you're certain that they're attributable to Bryson?

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 19:48
Just out of curiousity, could you cite a couple of the Doc's misconceptions, and how you're certain that they're attributable to Bryson?

Rickb, please don't. This thread is about played out - actually several forums ago.

Terrapin, search for Bryson and you will find several forums to entertain you. The Bryson story needs a rest.

Weasel, take it easy man.

Jack, I thought you were hitting the trail? Like the rest of us real hikers wish we were.

All, there is truth in some viewpoints here and I will leave it at that. Why can't we talk about having fun together rather than having fun at each other's expense?

Where is lobster when you are hungry for one?

Lone Wolf
03-28-2007, 19:49
walk in the woods is a great book.

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 19:52
Just out of curiousity, could you cite a couple of the Doc's misconceptions, and how you're certain that they're attributable to Bryson?

Terrapin, for all the "we love everybody and everything" nonsense here, and the "all are welcome" bs, this is a very insular, provincial community, in some ways. Bill Bryson - who, like all of us before we started thinking about the AT, wasn't part of it (by definition) - and came in and made a little fun and a fair piece of money at it. Do you recall what happened to poor Ronin? Had a cute idea, decided to try to make a few bucks, didn't say anything false but was immediately viewed as "slime" and worse as he got persecuted from pillar to post. Bryson did the same thing and got away with it. So of course he's attacked. He could stand on the top of Sinai holding his book in tablets of etched stone from The Great God Of The Holy AT and people like Jack would take shots at him. (As a matter of fact, that's what they did to Moses, too, when he tried a thru hike. You'll recall he didn't finish it, either. Slacker. Putz. Liar.)

I thought it was an enjoyable read, and it frankly impelled me to do something I'd dreamt about for decades. I'm grateful to Bryson, and when, in '01, I saw him at the Dartmouth Bookstore, I said so. He seemed a little nervous to see an AT veteran, and I don't blame him.

By the way, Jensine is a very nice lady. But her chili really was overhyped. But that is heresy to say, so I never said it. If I did, I would have the hyenas all over me. [OH MY GOD!!!! HERE THEY COME!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!]

CHOMP.

*****

We regret to inform you that we are The Weasel's caretakers. He has been savagely attacked by a pack of wild dogs. We will do our best to restore him to life, since we know he will be missed by one and all.

The Weasel Clan

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 19:52
walk in the woods is a great book.

Gotta love the L. Wolf.

I would amend that to say, "walk in the wood is a great novel". Nothing more, nothing less.

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 19:57
Terrapin, for all the "we love everybody and everything" nonsense here, and the "all are welcome" bs, this is a very insular, provincial community, in some ways.

Speaking from the heart of insular and povincial, no doubt. :D

max patch
03-28-2007, 20:08
By the way, Jensine is a very nice lady. But her chili really was overhyped. But that is heresy to say, so I never said it.

RSC ain't exactly the Ritz Carlton. I thot the chili was pretty darn good for a campground in the middle of the woods 15 miles or so from the nearest town. And the day I hiked in during a 20 degree day in a rapidly increasing snowstorm, that bowl of chili was one of the best meals I've ever had, all things considered.

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 20:13
RSC ain't exactly the Ritz Carlton. I thot the chili was pretty darn good for a campground in the middle of the woods 15 miles or so from the nearest town. And the day I hiked in during a 20 degree day in a rapidly increasing snowstorm, that bowl of chili was one of the best meals I've ever had, all things considered.

Some critics are critical regardless of the situation. Some are critical regardless of the cause. Some are just critical. Pass the chili.

The Weasel
03-28-2007, 20:19
Speaking from the heart of insular and povincial, no doubt. :D

The Weasel just moaned, "Keep them away!!! Please!!! I can't be eaten again!!! What do they think I am???? Chili???" When he is coherent again, we will try to let you know. It is difficult telling, sometimes, so be patient.

The Weasel Clan

rafe
03-28-2007, 20:28
Terrapin, search for Bryson and you will find several forums to entertain you. The Bryson story needs a rest.

Not to worry, Tin Man. I'm likely to be civil as long as I keep certain individuals on "ignore." I'm hardly the only one "driving" this thread.

Again, I'm seriously puzzled at the reaction to this book, and its author, on WB and on at least one other AT-related forum that I've been on. I'm quite aware of (and mystified by) the passions involved.

weary
03-28-2007, 20:34
Not the arbiter, but Jack's spot on, nevertheless.

While Bryson does say that he he didn't walk the Trail's entire length (though some would say he exagerates even those miles he does lay claim to), he most certainly presents his exeprience and story as capturing the essense of the AT.

Yea, right.

If Weary said he hiked the AT, I'd agree in a heart beat-- even if his swollen toe caused him to skip a few blazes.

But Bryson? You have got to be kidding. That would me like me saying I went to Harvard.

Even though it was just for Christmas Revels a time or two.
Okay, for the record, I am not a thru hiker. When I started from Amicalola State Park on April 13, 14 years ago, I didn't really expect to do a "thru" hike. I just wanted to explore some of the Appalachian trails I'd never experienced, being a northerner.

One thing lead to another and soon I was heading to Katahdin, somewhat belatedly. It was well into July by the time I reached Harpers Ferry.

I have to admit that after six months and three days when I reached Katahdin it certainly felt like a thru hike. But when I told Wingfoot, he was appalled that anyone who had skipped Connecticut and Massachusetts, and a few spots elsewhere, could possibly think of themselves as a thru hiker.

I totally agree with Dan. It's an appalling assumption, even for me. But in my weaker moments, my mind still persists in thinking it was a lot of fun, a great adventure that few folks do -- and even in truly weak moments -- I think that maybe I've done a bit more of the trail than many who claim that illustrious status.

It's amazing the tricks the human mind can play. don't you think?

Weary

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 20:39
Again, I'm seriously puzzled at the reaction to this book, and its author, on WB and on at least one other AT-related forum that I've been on. I'm quite aware of (and mystified by) the passions involved.

Hmm, Bryson grabs the most attention ever about the AT, yet he doesn't quite get it right. In fact, he gets a lot of it wrong, criticizes the people he meets along the way, then quits. Nope, no passionate AT'ers should ever touch that. :rolleyes:

Lone Wolf
03-28-2007, 20:41
it's a good book. you're jealous is all

The Old Fhart
03-28-2007, 20:42
Jack-“I suggest you re-read the last two pages.” Great idea, let’s see exactly what Bryson said. Also where Bryson is being held to an absolute high level of accuracy, his critics should expect the same.


“I had done 870 miles, considerably less than half the AT. All that effort and sweat and disgusting grubbiness, all those endless plodding days, the nights on hard ground-all that added up to 39.5 percent of the trail. Goodness knows how anyone ever completes the whole thing. I am filled with admiration and incredulity for those who see it through. But hey and excuse me, 870 miles is still a lot of miles-from New York to Chicago, indeed somewhat beyond. If I had hiked that against almost any other measure, we would all be feeling pretty proud of me now.”

“We didn’t walk 2,200 miles, it’s true, but here’s the thing, we tried. So Katz was right after all, and I don’t care what anyone says. We hiked the Appalachian Trail.”

“I have regrets, of course. I regret that I didn’t do Katahdin……”


So when Jack says: “He said quite plainly that while he didn't walk every mile, well, he doesn't care, because, as he put it, "I hiked the Appalachina Trail."”, That has 2 factual errors. First Bryson doesn’t say anything like “while he didn't walk every mile, well, he doesn't care”, what he says is that “I don’t care what anyone says”, which is something entirely different, kinda like HYOH, get it? Also he didn’t say "I hiked the Appalachina Trail", which being enclosed in quote marks would lead you to believe is an actual quote from Bryson, but it isn’t, it is a rather poor paraphrase that distorts the original meaning. What he said was “We hiked the Appalachian Trail”(not Appalachina, which I believe must be in China!:D ) He clearly also expressed some regrets about his hike (I regret that I didn’t do Katahdin…), and he probably has more as well.


As to the remark about the FACT that they “hiked the Appalachian Trail”, others have pointed out the obvious silliness of trying to show that Bryson claimed to have hiked the ENTIRE© Appalachian Trail when in the last 2 pages of the book he goes into great detail about the exact number of miles he calculated he actually hiked. So when Jack says:

Jack- “Um, no he didn't, and neither did anyone else who skipped chunks.
What part of this is so difficult for you to comprehend? You either hiked the Trail in its entirety, or you elected not to. Nothing wrong if you elected to do the latter, except of course if you insist on convincing yourself and others that you did the former.”
Anyone with rudimentary reading comprehension skills knows exactly what Bryson meant and it isn’t that he hiked the ENTIRE© Appalachian Trail. To say the least, it is disingenuous to say you have “read” the AWITW, found 258 factual errors(or whatever) in the book and make that fallacious claim. That is just plain wrong and shows an obvious agenda.

Two final points: 1st the cover photo on the British and Canadian version of the book has a black bear and a moose, not the photo by well-known nature photographer Art Wolfe of a grizzly bear. The editors in NY may not be that knowledgeable about bears, and only know Smoky the Bear.

2nd the fact that Bryson made money from hiking the trail (in the interest of full disclosure, I have as well, although not as much as Bryson) has nothing to do with the worth of his writings. Yes it would be nice if he gave something back to the trail but that can be said for thousands who have hiked the trail and done nothing for it afterwards, them’s the breaks.

So despite the fact that AWITW is a more heavily discussed book than the Bible:rolleyes: , it is just an entertaining book, nothing more, nothing less, take it for what it’s worth (or what you think it’s worth) and move on.

ed bell
03-28-2007, 20:45
I just want to know how the hell anybody can offer a critique of a bowl of chili that costs less than 3 or so bucks AND have others take great offense at the critical evaluation of that cheap bowl of chili. Petty B.S. As far as Bryson goes, I read and enjoyed the book. Having said that, he has shown to be an opportunist with his subject matter. If he really has no love of backpacking or the AT, than I feel free to decide that he made a lot money off of the AT in an underhanded fashon. Oh well, c'est la vie.:)

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 20:50
After all the controversy on the last Bryson thread, I read the book a second time. I thought it was a good book (or novel) the first time I read it and I still think it is a good book, but it doesn't quite do justice to the trail or the people he met along the way. Instead, we have the kangaroo court and the court jesters here to decide what is right and wrong with the book. :D

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-28-2007, 20:51
....the hyenas all over me. [OH MY GOD!!!! HERE THEY COME!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!]

CHOMP.Arg... copywrite infringement :D

weary
03-28-2007, 21:07
Great idea, let’s see exactly what Bryson said. Also where Bryson is being held to an absolute high level of accuracy, his critics should expect the same.




So when Jack says: “He said quite plainly that while he didn't walk every mile, well, he doesn't care, because, as he put it, "I hiked the Appalachina Trail."”, That has 2 factual errors. First Bryson doesn’t say anything like “while he didn't walk every mile, well, he doesn't care”, what he says is that “I don’t care what anyone says”, which is something entirely different, kinda like HYOH, get it? Also he didn’t say "I hiked the Appalachina Trail", which being enclosed in quote marks would lead you to believe is an actual quote from Bryson, but it isn’t, it is a rather poor paraphrase that distorts the original meaning. What he said was “We hiked the Appalachian Trail”(not Appalachina, which I believe must be in China!:D ) He clearly also expressed some regrets about his hike (I regret that I didn’t do Katahdin…), and he probably has more as well.


As to the remark about the FACT that they “hiked the Appalachian Trail”, others have pointed out the obvious silliness of trying to show that Bryson claimed to have hiked the ENTIRE© Appalachian Trail when in the last 2 pages of the book he goes into great detail about the exact number of miles he calculated he actually hiked. So when Jack says:

Anyone with rudimentary reading comprehension skills knows exactly what Bryson meant and it isn’t that he hiked the ENTIRE© Appalachian Trail. To say the least, it is disingenuous to say you have “read” the AWITW, found 258 factual errors(or whatever) in the book and make that fallacious claim. That is just plain wrong and shows an obvious agenda.

Two final points: 1st the cover photo on the British and Canadian version of the book has a black bear and a moose, not the photo by well-known nature photographer Art Wolfe of a grizzly bear. The editors in NY may not be that knowledgeable about bears, and only know Smoky the Bear.

2nd the fact that Bryson made money from hiking the trail (in the interest of full disclosure, I have as well, although not as much as Bryson) has nothing to do with the worth of his writings. Yes it would be nice if he gave something back to the trail but that can be said for thousands who have hiked the trail and done nothing for it afterwards, them’s the breaks.

So despite the fact that AWITW is a more heavily discussed book than the Bible:rolleyes: , it is just an entertaining book, nothing more, nothing less, take it for what it’s worth (or what you think it’s worth) and move on.
Well, for what it's worth the windy one is right, more or less. Bryson walked most of the way through the Smokies and did a few day hikes through the summer, and part of the so called "hundred-mile-wilderness" in the fall. I question his arithmetic, but that's hardly important.

What I find fascinating is that Bryson seemed to have met no one on the trail that remotely resembles most of those I met on the trail. I conclude that he probably didn't really meet those people he wrote about, but just imagined them -- since they all seem to fit common stereotypes, not real living people.

But whatever. It certainly was a fun read -- from a fairy tale perspective, anyway.

Weary

Tin Man
03-28-2007, 21:15
Well, for what it's worth the windy one is right, more or less. Bryson walked most of the way through the Smokies and did a few day hikes through the summer, and part of the so called "hundred-mile-wilderness" in the fall. I question his arithmetic, but that's hardly important.

What I find fascinating is that Bryson seemed to have met no one on the trail that remotely resembles most of those I met on the trail. I conclude that he probably didn't really meet those people he wrote about, but just imagined them -- since they all seem to fit common stereotypes, not real living people.

But whatever. It certainly was a fun read -- from a fairy tale perspective, anyway.

Weary

Yup, and I recall reading in previous forums that those who think they met him along the trail said there was no Katz and that he didn't talk much to the ones grinding it out. Fun, but fiction and (to many) a disservice to real trail folk.

rafe
03-28-2007, 22:35
Hmm, Bryson grabs the most attention ever about the AT, yet he doesn't quite get it right. In fact, he gets a lot of it wrong, criticizes the people he meets along the way, then quits. Nope, no passionate AT'ers should ever touch that. :rolleyes:


Ok, one more time, what did he get wrong? Let's see what's been mentioned so far in this thread:

1. Wrong kind of bear on the cover.
2. Off by a day or two (maybe) with regard to Bryson's stay at RSC
3. Disagreement over # of bowls of chili eaten at RSC (for the record, Bryson himself says he had two bowls. - P. 82 of paperback edition.)
4. Something about the murders in SNP (in 1996?) -- ATC spokespersons mis-quoted?
5. Something about Alden Partridge and the military academy in Norwich VT

Surely there's more, right? I mean, this is the best that the accusers can come up with?

There have been numerous accusations of inaccuracies in this thread, and a handful of folks asking for actual examples of inaccuracies. You'd think the accusers could come up with something better than the list above.

Brrrb Oregon
03-28-2007, 23:03
The Weasel just moaned, "Keep them away!!! Please!!! I can't be eaten again!!! What do they think I am???? Chili???" When he is coherent again, we will try to let you know. It is difficult telling, sometimes, so be patient.

The Weasel Clan

Again? He coherent a first time, and I missed it? And why does he want us to know that he eats his chili twice? He's following a dinosaur, and I'm not even sure that the lizard part of his brain is working.

This is scaring me. Make him stop. Egads, I know he is both a lawyer and from Southern California, but I think he needs some kind of medical exam....starting with whatever region of his body he attempts to think with first. In the meantime, medicate him, or reprimand him, or hit him with a fire hose. Something! Anything! :D

Brrrb Oregon
03-28-2007, 23:22
If you think this thread is a hoot, you should read the 913 reviews of the book on Amazon.com

Let's just say that it seems to be far more popular with those who like thinking about hiking than those who actually do it, with the exception of those who are looking for satire and not a documentary. (Oh, and people who LOVED his previous books were much more easily won over! :rolleyes: )

My two cents is that he doesn't seem to have much affection for people who are different than he is. I find that off-putting, like the kids at school who laugh at the other ones who dress or talk differently than they do. Satire should be the weak taking shots at the powerful, not the tourists taking shots at the locals. The latter is nor only arrogant; it is just mean.

But you know, it's just a book. It's not one that's going to win him any awards for journalism or literature, but I have friends whom I admire who like it. It isn't their problem that I don't. If he finds an audience that wants to buy it, well, it is a free country.

Still, it didn't make me want to hike with him.

skeeterfeeder
03-28-2007, 23:37
Since when did you start trolling. :) I can hear you laughing here in Missouri over this thing you've stirred up.

By the way, I was just thinking about the Trail Magic your dad dropped on us. Great food. Tell everyone hello for me. Skeeterfeeder.

Mags
03-28-2007, 23:55
I believe it is time to take advantage of the beautiful weather, get away from these computers and out on the trails to let off some of that steam. Don't y'all agree? :D

Damn straight! Spring is in the air. I saw my first two spring wildflowers tonight on my afterwork "Social hike":
Pasque Flowers (http://www.pmags.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_gallery2&Itemid=36&g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=9543) and Sand Lilies (http://www.pmags.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_gallery2&Itemid=36&g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=13139). Being a social kind of fellow, I also grabbed a pint. (Just one..I'm tired. :) )

The days are longer, the foothills are snow free and the mountains in the distance are calling.

Enough kibbitzing over an almost decade old book.
Do what Ms. Dixie says. Get off the keyboard and get out there and hike! :)

bfitz
03-29-2007, 00:11
Not to worry, Tin Man. I'm likely to be civil as long as I keep certain individuals on "ignore."Likely, maybe, but not guaranteed.

Tin Man
03-29-2007, 07:25
Ok, one more time, what did he get wrong? Let's see what's been mentioned so far in this thread:

1. Wrong kind of bear on the cover.
2. Off by a day or two (maybe) with regard to Bryson's stay at RSC
3. Disagreement over # of bowls of chili eaten at RSC (for the record, Bryson himself says he had two bowls. - P. 82 of paperback edition.)
4. Something about the murders in SNP (in 1996?) -- ATC spokespersons mis-quoted?
5. Something about Alden Partridge and the military academy in Norwich VT

Surely there's more, right? I mean, this is the best that the accusers can come up with?

There have been numerous accusations of inaccuracies in this thread, and a handful of folks asking for actual examples of inaccuracies. You'd think the accusers could come up with something better than the list above.

Examples expemplify the missing examples and I am not interested in pointing out more examples. Like I said before, if you want to be entertained do your own Bryson search and you will find more inaccuracies. Write a research report if it is that important to you. Personally, I don't care about what "facts" he may have gotten wrong as much as what he got wrong in terms of the people he claims to have came across, making it sound like most were not worthy of his respect. And like I said, I did enjoy the book. So, feel free to keep digging, but I have wasted enough of my time on a subject that has been exhausted already.

Tin Man out on the Bryson diatribe.

mudhead
03-29-2007, 07:51
Best part of that book was that it made me dig out Thousand mile summer.

Then I donated it, and hope they shelve it next to that book.

Someone start a good thread on foot care.

rafe
03-29-2007, 08:46
Examples expemplify the missing examples and I am not interested in pointing out more examples.

Not interested? You are, at this moment, the fourth most prolific poster on this thread.

moxie
03-29-2007, 08:48
Bryson's book did create a sensation. No matter where I go in the world, and I do travel alot, when people learn I am a thru hiker the first question they ask is, "Did you read Bryson's book?" Millions of people have read it and it is entertaining. Some of us have torn it apart in the last 10 or so pages and as serious hikers we all have strong opinions. While the book is entertaining the tragerdy of the book in my opinion is that it is an extremely inacurate description of what life is really like on the trail. Millions of people who will never set foot on the trail now accept Brysons account of what it is like on a thru hike and that is very sad. Thru hiking is sweat, work, socalizing, comparing notes, working out the best style for yourself, learning from others and your own mistakes,and in my opinion a world of fun. The adventure Bryson described while, entertaining, in no way resembles what trail life and trail people are like in real life. Perhaps an account of a real thru hike and what life is really like day after day in the trail would never sell and that is why Bryson took felt it okey to tamper with reality to create a story and sell books. As a serious hiker I resent his description of a life style and the people I so personally enjoy but I did enjoy his book, have read it three times, and my message to non hikers is it is enrtertaining semi fiction but nothing like real AT thru hiking.:)

rafe
03-29-2007, 08:55
While the book is entertaining the tragerdy of the book in my opinion is that it is an extremely inacurate description of what life is really like on the trail.

Specifics, man. What did Bryson get wrong?

weary
03-29-2007, 09:21
Bryson's book did create a sensation. No matter where I go in the world, and I do travel alot, when people learn I am a thru hiker the first question they ask is, "Did you read Bryson's book?" Millions of people have read it and it is entertaining. Some of us have torn it apart in the last 10 or so pages and as serious hikers we all have strong opinions. While the book is entertaining the tragerdy of the book in my opinion is that it is an extremely inacurate description of what life is really like on the trail. Millions of people who will never set foot on the trail now accept Brysons account of what it is like on a thru hike and that is very sad. Thru hiking is sweat, work, socalizing, comparing notes, working out the best style for yourself, learning from others and your own mistakes,and in my opinion a world of fun. The adventure Bryson described while, entertaining, in no way resembles what trail life and trail people are like in real life. Perhaps an account of a real thru hike and what life is really like day after day in the trail would never sell and that is why Bryson took felt it okey to tamper with reality to create a story and sell books. As a serious hiker I resent his description of a life style and the people I so personally enjoy but I did enjoy his book, have read it three times, and my message to non hikers is it is enrtertaining semi fiction but nothing like real AT thru hiking.:)
Moxie has it right, though how he managed to read "A Walk..." three times remains a puzzle.

Weary

weary
03-29-2007, 09:24
Specifics, man. What did Bryson get wrong?
Well, for starters, the trail, life on the trail. the trail experience, and the people one meets on the trail.

rafe
03-29-2007, 09:32
Well, for starters, the trail, life on the trail. the trail experience, and the people one meets on the trail.

Specifics, please. Bryson describes the trail as he and Katz experienced it. You can't expect him to do otherwise. Your experience was different, I gather. So what?

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 09:53
I can like Bryson as long I classify his work as fiction. As a result of reading A Walk In the Woods, I don't take anything the man writes all that seriously as a factual account or rely on any of the historical facts he mentions. He just got too many points wrong in his book on the AT for me to consider him a reliable source of info. However, his writing is entertaining - and as long as it is viewed as purely entertainment, I see no problem with his books.

moxie
03-29-2007, 09:59
Specifics, man. What did Bryson get wrong?
Once you thru hike you will know. The lifestyle and experiences are simply not as he describes it. There are many specifics in the last 10 or so pages brought up by others, read them.

rafe
03-29-2007, 10:23
Once you thru hike you will know.

I've walked three-quarters of the trail now, Moxie, starting in the 1970s. No thru-hike, that's true, but an attempted through in 1990 that took me from Springer to Blacksburg, VA. I think I have the general idea of the thing.

rafe
03-29-2007, 10:24
He just got too many points wrong in his book on the AT for me to consider him a reliable source of info.

Specifics??? Please, FD. Or anybody....

The Old Fhart
03-29-2007, 10:25
Moxie-"While the book is entertaining the tragerdy of the book in my opinion is that it is an extremely inacurate description of what life is really like on the trail. Millions of people who will never set foot on the trail now accept Brysons account of what it is like on a thru hike and that is very sad."I actually give readers of the book more credit than most people here do. Although we are all so-called 'experts' and laugh, shake our heads, or swear at what Bryson and Katz supposedly did while hiking, I believe that most readers (other than some here;) ) are smart enough to see the book as kind of a "Three Stooges Do The Trail" sort of book. Most of the examples from 'flung it' to Katz getting lost display a type of behavior that you can see is a bad example of what to do or how to act on the trail.

Perhaps one of the real reasons that many thru hikers hate the book is that it reminds them how green and ignorant they were when they started their hike. Bryson never seemed to get out of that mindset plus he is about as snooty as they come. The way he interacted (or maybe reacted) to the people he met, especially in the south, is how he probably sees everyone he meets. I personally have told Bryson that and he passed it off as just how he saw the people he met but he certainly is somewhat of a bigot. Even so I do have a copy of his book autographed to me. Who knows, someday it may be a collectors item when the rest of you burn all the remaining copies of AWITW!:D

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 10:47
TT, most have been mentioned in this thread - the misquotes, unchecked out facts written as historic facts from local folklore (often embellished or inaccurate), the grossly flawed portrayal of the trail community’s dynamics and the conflicting facts in events that are found both in Bryson's book and in thru-hikers' journals.

Bryson is an author - he writes what sells. The truth doesn't always make as good a story as fantasy.

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 11:14
After all the controversy on the last Bryson thread, I read the book a second time. I thought it was a good book (or novel) the first time I read it and I still think it is a good book, but it doesn't quite do justice to the trail or the people he met along the way. Instead, we have the kangaroo court and the court jesters here to decide what is right and wrong with the book. :D

It is not bad, if you read it as fiction....and I could see where someone might really like it.


Specifics, please. Bryson describes the trail as he and Katz experienced it. You can't expect him to do otherwise. Your experience was different, I gather. So what?

Well, actually he does more than that. He gives background into the area and the flora and fauna and whatnot, which is certainly implied to be totally factual. That is what I found the most disappointing about the book. I had no idea what he had actually researched and what he had taken on the strength of one source....that is, what he was just as likely to have had totally backwards as right.

I wish he'd left all that stuff out. I guess I'd like his writing to imply that his stories should be given just about as much weight as those of Patrick McManus. With McManus, there is no doubt that he's pulling your leg a bit....and even when he's describing total idiocy, he does it with affection.

In other words, I can't expect him to say that a great many people are not miserable when hiking in the rain. If he hates it, he can say he hates it. But when he presents something as fact, I expect him to be a journalist about it and do the work to get his facts straight. People do care about those things. If he doesn't, he should have said, "Several rangers told me that..." or "Some guy told me that..." or "I read in such-and-so book that...". If you're going to be lazy, admit where you're being lazy.


TT, most have been mentioned in this thread - the misquotes, unchecked out facts written as historic facts from local folklore (often embellished or inaccurate), the grossly flawed portrayal of the trail community’s dynamics and the conflicting facts in events that are found both in Bryson's book and in thru-hikers' journals.

Bryson is an author - he writes what sells. The truth doesn't always make as good a story as fantasy.

So put the durned thing in the fiction section, and have it over with. Better yet, put it in "humor." But you ought to play by the rules you claim to play by.

But that's just me. I'm a curmudgeon about that kind of thing. It's not as if I'd feel put upon if I hiked the AT after being so lazy as to take his word on everything, and found it to be completely otherwise. I mean, with the style he uses, that would be expected, no matter what section of the library I found it in. I wouldn't believe what he said until I'd heard it from a more sober source.

OK, so he's not Patrick McManus and he's not Rick Steves, and even if he were either one, he does not write in the style of an enjoyable hiking companion, but rather something of a whiner. So I guess he's just not my cup of tea.

saimyoji
03-29-2007, 11:21
For all the complaining about Bryson, you guys sure are giving him lots of publicity. :-?

rafe
03-29-2007, 11:24
Sorry FD. I've scoured the thread for specifics. Found five specific charges. Everything else is just griping and bellyaching.

Eg. "grossly flawed portrayal of the trail community’s dynamics." Bryson described the dynamics as he and Katz experienced them. Who are you to say that these aren't the "true" trail dynamics?

Bryson started his hike fairly early (March 6, if I recall properly) and in interviews he said that he just didn't meet a lot of other hikers on the trail. He and Katz left the trail in Gatlinburg, presumably a month or so later, and resumed their hike near Roanoke VA -- and at that point they'd have encountered almost no other thru hikers. So, it certainly wasn't a "typical" thru-hiking situation (in terms of the social dynamics) but I don't recall Bryson ever claiming that it was.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 11:31
.....So put the durned thing in the fiction section, and have it over with. Better yet, put it in "humor." But you ought to play by the rules you claim to play by. But that's just me. I'm a curmudgeon about that kind of thing.....Remember, I'm the one who feels most US news sources are more fiction than fact and FOX is more humorous than the comedy network.... Saying your one thing while being another doesn't bother me. BTW, Patrick McManus is one of my favorite humor authors. I can't see a grasshopper without breaking into laughter.

Midway Sam
03-29-2007, 11:32
I like pie.

http://www.weebl.jolt.co.uk/pie.htm

Midway Sam
03-29-2007, 11:33
Remember, I'm the one who feels most US news sources are more fiction than fact and FOX is more humorous than the comedy network.... Saying your one thing while being another doesn't bother me. BTW, Patrick McManus is one of my favorite humor authors. I can't see a grasshopper without breaking into laughter.

I think we should all go "Kid Camping". It would be a fine and pleasant misery.

MOWGLI
03-29-2007, 11:36
Perhaps one of the real reasons that many thru hikers hate the book is that it reminds them how green and ignorant they were when they started their hike.

Hey! I resemble that remark! ;)

How you been Old Fhart?

rafe
03-29-2007, 11:39
Most of the examples from 'flung it' to Katz getting lost display a type of behavior that you can see is a bad example of what to do or how to act on the trail.

Pretty much. Bryson makes it clear from the get-go that he's middle-aged, overweight, and no outdoorsman. Even more so (well, much more so) for Katz.

As for Katz "flinging" stuff out of his pack on the approach trail... I winced when I read it. It was funny, yeah, but I knew that Brsyon was setting himself up for some serious criticism on that score. It was certainly no example to be emulated, nor did Bryson present it as such.

Bryson had a miserable time hiking in the rain in the Smokies, and so did I, and I'm sure, so have countless others. He spent nights in ratty motels and hostels. So did I. He met obnoxious hikers, and some decent folks. So did I. He never mastered trail cooking beyond Liptons and Ramen. How atypical is that?

If Brsyon walked the trail without seen g*d and jeezus in every flower and footstep, well, that's his call. You can disagree with his viewpoint or attitude, and that's perfectly fine. To say that he got it all wrong is just BS.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 11:41
TT, if Bryson was indeed reporting the trail community as he and Katz experienced it, then he is either one of the most pessimistic humans I've ever encountered or lacking something in his ability to relate to other people or just so extremely self-absorbed & pompous that he could not see past his own difficulties in adjusting to the trail to the community's dynamics.

When I read hundreds accounts of hikes and only one portrays the community unfavorably, I can only conclude that something was wrong with the writer - not with the community. If others were reporting similar perceptions, I would take Bryson's comments more seriously, but he is the first I've seen to express the non-stop negative view of the hiking community.

MOWGLI
03-29-2007, 11:48
There is no boilerplate AT experience. Some folks take 200 days. Others 66. Some folks hit every bar along the way. Others don't. SOme folks get stoned every day. Most don't. Some folks are interested in the flowers, trees and wildlife. Others could care less. You've got your vegans and your meat eaters. Your day hikers, section hikers, and thruhikers. Southbounders and northbounders. Some folks are in great shape. Others in pitiful shape. A few finsih what they started. Many more don't. SOme folks need to know everything about the trail before they start. Others want to learn about the AT as they walk it. Some chronicle the trail with thousands of photos. Others are content to record their memories in their mind. You got hammock campers, tenters and shelter rats. You have gram weenies and folks whose idea of backpacking is carrying a minimum of 65 pounds.

In that regard, I have to agree with TT when he said that Bryson's experience was his own. Don't charge him with BS over his perceptions.

Midway Sam
03-29-2007, 11:51
There is no boilerplate AT experience. Some folks take 200 days. Others 66. Some folks hit every bar along the way. Others don't. SOme folks get stoned every day. Most don't. Some folks are interested in the flowers, trees and wildlife. Others could care less. You've got your vegans and your meat eaters. Your day hikers, section hikers, and thruhikers. Southbounders and northbounders. Some folks are in great shape. Others in pitiful shape. A few finsih what they started. Many more don't. SOme folks need to know everything about the trail before they start. Others want to learn about the AT as they walk it. Some chronicle the trail with thousands of photos. Others are content to record their memories in their mind. You got hammock campers, tenters and shelter rats. You have gram weenies and folks whose idea of backpacking is carrying a minimum of 65 pounds.

In that regard, I have to agree with TT when he said that Bryson's experience was his own. Don't charge him with BS over his perceptions.

Don't forget the hikers on the "group W" bench!

The Old Fhart
03-29-2007, 12:05
Terrapin_too-"Bryson had a miserable time hiking in the rain in the Smokies, and so did I, and I'm sure, so have countless others."Wow, you got rain in the Smokies! I got 2 solid days and nights of snow, youse guys had all the luck!:D :banana

You have to admit that the conditions we all go through while hiking make for great (or is it greater?) stories when they are retold. Whether any experience is good or bad depends on our phenominalogical outlook; that is, our background, experiences, expectations, etc. Some of my fondest memories were so fond at the time they were happening.

DawnTreader
03-29-2007, 12:14
Like a lot of AT hikers, I owe a lot to Bryson. I read the book before getting into long distance hiking, and this was my first exposure to the idea of a a 2200 mile long footpath across appalachia. It planted a seed in my head that won't go away. It's not about thru-hiking, lying, factual errors, lack of donations; wether he did or didn't, is none of our buisness anyway. It is about getting outdoors, trying something new, adventure, meeting new people, and seeing things you have never seen. It is about learning, experience, and adaptation. This book is not about a thru-hike.. I've now got a long distance hike under my belt, and I'm proud to say that I've hiked the AT, and someday I will hike all of it.
It's not a bad book, I've read better since....

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 13:21
Remember, I'm the one who feels most US news sources are more fiction than fact and FOX is more humorous than the comedy network.... Saying your one thing while being another doesn't bother me. BTW, Patrick McManus is one of my favorite humor authors. I can't see a grasshopper without breaking into laughter.

Face it, we're just spoiled.


Like a lot of AT hikers, I owe a lot to Bryson. I read the book before getting into long distance hiking, and this was my first exposure to the idea of a a 2200 mile long footpath across appalachia. It planted a seed in my head that won't go away. It's not about thru-hiking, lying, factual errors, lack of donations; wether he did or didn't, is none of our buisness anyway. It is about getting outdoors, trying something new, adventure, meeting new people, and seeing things you have never seen. It is about learning, experience, and adaptation. This book is not about a thru-hike.. I've now got a long distance hike under my belt, and I'm proud to say that I've hiked the AT, and someday I will hike all of it.
It's not a bad book, I've read better since....

And the Lone Ranger, quite honestly, probably got a lot of people into law enforcement....and some nice, honest guys, too. So there's that.

rafe
03-29-2007, 13:38
When I read hundreds accounts of hikes and only one portrays the community unfavorably, I can only conclude that something was wrong with the writer - not with the community. If others were reporting similar perceptions, I would take Bryson's comments more seriously, but he is the first I've seen to express the non-stop negative view of the hiking community.

Ain't nothing "wrong" with Bryson, aside from being a world-class curmudgeon. His book isn't about your sacred "hiking community" (whatever that is...) or about your Holy act of Thru Hiking. The title, as I recall, is "A Walk In The Woods." He told a story the way he saw it, and I'm sure with heaps of literary license to boot. Sold lots of copies, got rich and famous. Woo-hoo!

Who ever knew that hikers (I'm talking about "internet" hikers, now) were so damned thin-skinned, so easy to take offense at a description of their trail that wasn't 100% positive and glowing.

Who ever imagined that Thru Hikers (and t.h. wannabes) might not all be proud, stoic, g*d-loving, clean-living, generous, kind, and otherwise perfect human specimens. I'm shocked... shocked at the thought.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 13:57
I think we should all go "Kid Camping". It would be a fine and pleasant misery.Yes indeed, we could go into the twilight, endlessly grousing about the bear the attic that ate our last goombaw as we dined on whatchagot stew.

The Weasel
03-29-2007, 15:09
TT, most have been mentioned in this thread - the misquotes, unchecked out facts written as historic facts from local folklore (often embellished or inaccurate), the grossly flawed portrayal of the trail community’s dynamics and the conflicting facts in events that are found both in Bryson's book and in thru-hikers' journals.

Bryson is an author - he writes what sells. The truth doesn't always make as good a story as fantasy.

For that matter, the "misquotes, unchecked out facts and the flawed portrayal of the trail community's dynamics" that someone would get from reading WhiteBlaze would (and sometimes does!) give people a really weird opinion of the AT as a place with raging arguments, massive cussing, and hugely fit people living in very strange shelters. I say this as someone who has misquoted others, not always perfectly checked "facts" and helped provide a flawed portrary of the AT community.

Let's just all agree that people see things differently sometimes, and that 'truth' is often subjective.

The Weasel

Tin Man
03-29-2007, 15:40
This thread, and many others about the author in question, remind me of the famous Saturday Night Live episode with William Shatner. Just substitute Bryson for Shatner, Bryson lovers/haters for Trekkies and book for TV show...

++++
William Shatner: You know, before I answer any more questions there's something I wanted to say. Having received all your letters over the years, and I've spoken to many of you, and some of you have traveled... y'know... hundreds of miles to be here, I'd just like to say... GET A LIFE, will you people? I mean, for crying out loud, it's just a TV show! I mean, look at you, look at the way you're dressed! You've turned an enjoyable little job, that I did as a lark for a few years, into a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME!

[ a crowd of shocked and dismayed Trekkies.... ]

I mean, how old are you people? What have you done with yourselves?

[ to "Ears" ] You, you must be almost 30... have you ever kissed a girl?

[ "Ears" hangs his head ]

I didn't think so! There's a whole world out there! When I was your age, I didn't watch television! I LIVED! So... move out of your parent's basements! And get your own apartments and GROW THE HELL UP! I mean, it's just a TV show dammit, IT'S JUST A TV SHOW!

++++

Now just take a Hike! :D

The Weasel
03-29-2007, 15:53
***There's a whole world out there! When I was your age, I didn't watch television! I LIVED! So... move out of your parent's basements! And get your own apartments and GROW THE HELL UP! I mean, it's just a TV show dammit, IT'S JUST A TV SHOW!

++++

Now just take a Hike! :D

Bill Bryson is making a TV show about the Trail? And SHATNER is going to play him? Oh, dang. This is terrible news.

The Weasel

weary
03-29-2007, 16:33
There is no boilerplate AT experience. Some folks take 200 days. Others 66. Some folks hit every bar along the way. Others don't. SOme folks get stoned every day. Most don't. Some folks are interested in the flowers, trees and wildlife. Others could care less. You've got your vegans and your meat eaters. Your day hikers, section hikers, and thruhikers. Southbounders and northbounders. Some folks are in great shape. Others in pitiful shape. A few finsih what they started. Many more don't. SOme folks need to know everything about the trail before they start. Others want to learn about the AT as they walk it. Some chronicle the trail with thousands of photos. Others are content to record their memories in their mind. You got hammock campers, tenters and shelter rats. You have gram weenies and folks whose idea of backpacking is carrying a minimum of 65 pounds.

In that regard, I have to agree with TT when he said that Bryson's experience was his own. Don't charge him with BS over his perceptions.
You're right about the diversity of interests one finds on the trail. I wonder why Bryson totally missed that diversity. Well, not really. He quickly discovered he wanted no part of hiking the AT and fulfilled his book contract by taking a few day hikes and utilizing his imagination.

Weary

Tin Man
03-29-2007, 16:50
Bill Bryson is making a TV show about the Trail? And SHATNER is going to play him? Oh, dang. This is terrible news.

The Weasel

So, who would be better at the mythical role of Katz: Bones or Scotty? Certainly not Spock! :D

weary
03-29-2007, 16:58
Had I never spent time on the trail, I would have thought it a wonderful book -- and would have gotten a totally wrong idea about what thru hiking the Appalachian Trail is about. Bryson is a very talented writer. I've enjoyed all his books that I've read -- except "A Walk..."

However, I'll never again assume his travel writing represents anything approaching reality of either his experience or of the places he describes.

Upon reflection, I also enjoyed AWITW, when I first read it. It was a brilliant example of a skilled writer turning a failed assignment into a best selling book. I appreciate and envy that talent. I'm sure others with trail experience enjoyed the humor and exaggerations of the book.

Most long distance hikers, however, seem to be wise enough to recognize the book for what it is, a bit of summer fluff that capitalized on the mystique of a 2,000-mile trail. The combination, unexpectedly, caught the public's fancy, probably because it so distorted the trail experience and confirmed what most people suspected must be true. That only nuts actually walk 2,000 miles. Bryson knows this. That's why he refused to attend the gathering a few years ago. What is puzzling is why otherwise bright people can't see the obvious.

Weary

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 17:33
Let's just all agree that people see things differently sometimes, and that 'truth' is often subjective.

The Weasel

The truth isn't subjective.
Unfortunately for the truth, all of us people are! :D

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 17:42
Bill Bryson is making a TV show about the Trail? And SHATNER is going to play him? Oh, dang. This is terrible news.
So, who would be better at the mythical role of Katz: Bones or Scotty? Certainly not Spock! :DLet Shatner play Katz and Brent Spiner (Data) can play Bryson :D

Jester2000
03-29-2007, 17:55
we have the . . . court jesters here to decide what is right and wrong with the book. :D

Is that me?


Ok, one more time, what did he get wrong? Let's see what's been mentioned so far in this thread:. . .
2. Off by a day or two (maybe) with regard to Bryson's stay at RSC
Surely there's more, right? I mean, this is the best that the accusers can come up with? (emphasis mine)

Not maybe. Definitely. And done intentionally, for a specific purpose, which you, in a later post euphemistically refer to as "literary license."

I wonder how many examples of inaccuracies you would accept before you would accept the fact that A Walk in the Woods is an inaccurate account? If we were talking about a book written by George W., would that number be less?


For all the complaining about Bryson, you guys sure are giving him lots of publicity. :-?

Got bad news for you, saimyoji. Not enough people are on whiteblaze for this thread to qualify as "lots of publicity."


He told a story the way he saw it, and I'm sure with heaps of literary license to boot.

Yeah, so there's that post. When you use "literary license" in a nonfiction book, that's another way of saying "lying."

I actually like the book. That's the funny thing. But expecting a "nonfiction" book to be accurate isn't about being "thin-skinned" or having a reverence for the trail. I felt the same way about A Million Little Pieces -- that if you have no interest in sticking to the truth, you could always write fiction books.

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 18:01
Let Shatner play Katz and Brent Spiner (Data) can play Bryson :D

The problem is that Shatner is twenty years older than Bryson is and about thirty years older than Bryson was then.

I remember Bryson described Katz as looking like Orson Wells after a bad night, and also claimed something along the lines that Katz was, singlehandedly, the Iowa drug scene. And roughly contemporary. So Katz, according to Bryson, was an extremely obese forty-four-year-old drunk at the time.

Sorry, but I'm afraid Shatner could only pass for a grossly overweight 60-year-old drunk. :D

As for Spiner, I do not think he could put a face on that would be stupid enough for the scene in which Bryson purchases his equipment. When Spiner isn't acting like an android, he looks really smart and more than slightly crazed, kind of like Jack Nicholson does.

Tin Man
03-29-2007, 18:08
As for Spiner, I do not think he could put a face on that would be stupid enough for the scene in which Bryson purchases his equipment. When Spiner isn't acting like an android, he looks really smart and more than slightly crazed, kind of like Jack Nicholson does.

I think you are onto something there...Jack Nicholson as Bryson! Or would that be the Joker as Bryson? :-?

Tin Man
03-29-2007, 18:11
Is that me?

Oops, I was using jester in the general sense, not the Jester2000 sense. Hope that is okay with you.

Jester2000
03-29-2007, 18:14
General Jester. I like the sound of it. Leading an army of fools I know not where.

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 18:16
I think you are onto something there...Jack Nicholson as Bryson! Or would that be the Joker as Bryson? :-?

I've never met the man, but Bryson painted himself in the book as impulsive, pathetic, and inept, not psychopathic!

I know....have Bryson and Katz played by Mario Batali and Emeril Lagasse. They're not drunks, but they could pull it off....and they definitely have the required upholstery!

I would particularly enjoy seeing them grouse over the abandoned "Little Debbies"! :D

The Old Fhart
03-29-2007, 18:18
Jester 2000-"General Jester. I like the sound of it."From your attention to detail I think your title should be 'Specific Jester', not general.:D

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 18:21
I've never met the man, but Bryson painted himself in the book as impulsive, pathetic, and inept, not psychopathic!

I know....have Bryson and Katz played by Mario Batali and Emeril Lagasse. They're not drunks, but they could pull it off....and they definitely have the required upholstery!

I would particularly enjoy seeing them grouse over the abandoned "Little Debbies"! :D

Ah, but they both obviously don't have a problem with Bubbas.

Maybe Jason Alexander? That's the ticket! He can definitely do pathetic, inept, whiny, and arrogant simultaneously! He could really do the part where they hate that trail chick that followed them, too.

That match is probably too good ,from my point of view. With Alexander in it, I think I could only take about 15 minutes of it.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-29-2007, 18:28
How about Hugh Laurie (http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2005/12/02/House_051202011818170_wideweb__300x450.jpg) as Katz (Main character on House) and Jason Alexander (http://www.worth1000.com/entries/70000/70498fKMJ_w.jpg)(George Castanza on Sienfeld) as Bryson. Jason can play stupid and sniveling... as well as impulsive, pathetic, and inept.

Brrrb Oregon and I posted at the same time - great minds think alike :D

rafe
03-29-2007, 18:39
If we were talking about a book written by George W., would that number be less?Please, let's not make odious comparisons.

As to whether AWITW is fiction or not... well, it's somewhere in between, and it's the reader's job to sort it out. It's kinda like a long editorial. If you agree with the man's opinions, you'll think of it as mostly fact. If not, you'll think of it as a pack of lies. Editorials are the perfect analogy. A mix of fact and fiction.

There are narratives of personal interactions (eg. hitch-hike to Hiawasee) that most likely have loads of literary license. You have commentary about AT luminaries (Mackaye, Avery, Shaffer) and service-providers (Buddy, Jensine) that clearly have Bryson's opinion superimposed.

The factual errors that have been cited so far strike me as largely inconsequential. It's quite fair & honest to say, "I don't his attitude" or "I don't like his politics" or "This wasn't anything like my hike" or, "He's a pompous, snotty SOB."

I have yet to see anyone on this thread make a decent case for the book's inaccuracy.

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 18:47
How about Hugh Laurie (http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2005/12/02/House_051202011818170_wideweb__300x450.jpg) as Katz (Main character on House) and Jason Alexander (http://www.worth1000.com/entries/70000/70498fKMJ_w.jpg)(George Castanza on Sienfeld) as Bryson. Jason can play stupid and sniveling... as well as impulsive, pathetic, and inept.

Brrrb Oregon and I posted at the same time - great minds think alike :D

I like the idea of Hugh Laurie, except that he does not resemble Orson Wells in the least. (Of course, Bryson is neither dark-haired nor balding, either.)

How about Kevin James (King of Queens) as Katz? He could definitely play a flat-lander with a Little Debbie habit, if not a drug habit.

Brrrb Oregon
03-29-2007, 18:50
It's quite fair & honest to say, "I don't his attitude" or "I don't like his politics" or "This wasn't anything like my hike" or, "He's a pompous, snotty SOB."

Yeah, that, and then there is his worst sin.

I don't want to detract from his reputation as a hiker, but....talking about gear bores him, and he's...proud of that! :eek:

The Old Fhart
03-29-2007, 18:52
Seeing that this whole WITW movie casting debate is getting rather cartoonish, I nominate Homer Simpson to play Katz.:D