View Full Version : Topo! Is anyone else
disappointed with Topo! software? (I have the Nat'l Geographic incarnation) If you7 think of it as a bunch of 7.5 quads for one low price, not so bad. If you want to do stuff with the software, not so good.
Drawing routes is at best tedious. It would go much faster if you could go from intersection to intersection (the program is not really "aware" of roads, trails, etc - they are just pixels displayed) or if you could combine two or more segments.
Profiles at fine resolution looked terrible - at first, I thought it was because I was tracing the trail (which was flat) poorly, but it turns out it is because the compressed format for elevation info fudges things quite a lot. If you skirt a cliff, it will give the trail elevation as well up the cliff, since it cannot store sharp changes in slope accurately. If you put the cursor on benchmarks, summits, or trace a contour line you can see how far off things get.
Again, it is great for looking at or printing maps, but if you want to do serious planning, or really need to know how much climbing your route includes, I found it patchy. Did not help that the map of my own neighborhood (in northern Virginia) is about 25 years out of date.
Anyone have hints on how to get more out of this? Are there competitive products that do better? (the reviews I read were a wash - I bought what REI had on sale last week)
Thanks!
NICKTHEGREEK
05-15-2007, 18:54
disappointed with Topo! software? (I have the Nat'l Geographic incarnation) If you7 think of it as a bunch of 7.5 quads for one low price, not so bad. If you want to do stuff with the software, not so good.
Drawing routes is at best tedious. It would go much faster if you could go from intersection to intersection (the program is not really "aware" of roads, trails, etc - they are just pixels displayed) or if you could combine two or more segments.
Profiles at fine resolution looked terrible - at first, I thought it was because I was tracing the trail (which was flat) poorly, but it turns out it is because the compressed format for elevation info fudges things quite a lot. If you skirt a cliff, it will give the trail elevation as well up the cliff, since it cannot store sharp changes in slope accurately. If you put the cursor on benchmarks, summits, or trace a contour line you can see how far off things get.
Again, it is great for looking at or printing maps, but if you want to do serious planning, or really need to know how much climbing your route includes, I found it patchy. Did not help that the map of my own neighborhood (in northern Virginia) is about 25 years out of date.
Anyone have hints on how to get more out of this? Are there competitive products that do better? (the reviews I read were a wash - I bought what REI had on sale last week)
Thanks!
The bad part of TOPO! is it uses the current quad data, and sadly it isn't updated every day or every decade in many cases. I wasn't all that comfortable with the user interface either at first, but a one hour sessions over a few days helped me figure it out. No instant gratification, but a nice product overall.
Download some of the free trails from the website and see what others have done with the same product.
The website is a good idea.
I work off and on with a whole raft of GIS tools in my work, I am probably expecting a lot for a $100 piece of software. I think it would be great if they would let you set a maximum slope for a given route - that would probably knock the noise down to a useful level.
How do you tell a newbie "hey don't sweat the 5500' the computer says you will be climbing - the trail is flat, trust me . . . "
Nightwalker
05-15-2007, 19:40
I work off and on with a whole raft of GIS tools in my work, I am probably expecting a lot for a $100 piece of software. I think it would be great if they would let you set a maximum slope for a given route - that would probably knock the noise down to a useful level.
How do you tell a newbie "hey don't sweat the 5500' the computer says you will be climbing - the trail is flat, trust me . . . "
I use Global Mapper for my GIS work. It's fantastic, in my opinion. Especially when you see what you can do with it and compare it to Arc GIS.
My .015
LostInSpace
05-15-2007, 20:12
To the best of my knowledge, the USGS no longer updates any of the raster graphic topos. They only update vector based GIS.
Over time, as a more accurate Digital Elevation Model (DEM) is published, NG will incorporate the model data into the Topo product. I say "published" because a highly accurate DEM does exist, I have read. It just happens to be classified.
Because the format of the NG Topo .tpo files is proprietary, it is difficult to exchange tracks with other mapping software. As a result, a lot of users have abandoned any interest in the NG MapExchange program. Take a look at the posting dates for the MapExchange files on the NG Web site. I think that will support my conclusion.
I have Topo Version 4.2.7 that supports handhelds such as Palm and Pocket PC. This version provides the capability to import a track from a .gpx (GPS exchange format) file. The version I had before I upgraded did not have this capability. There are various programs that support .gpx files, so that seems like a good way to import a track, if you can make or find good GPS tracks.
In fact, that is how I created an AT track in Topo. I downloaded the ArcView shape file from the ATC and converted it to a .gpx file using a using a commercial (paid for) version of Global Mapper. Using Global Mapper I also converted the datus from NAD27 to WGS84 (Topo expests data in WGS84.) Then I imported the .gpx file into Topo.
LostInSpace
05-15-2007, 20:14
I mean I converted the "datum" ...
I get my maps from Offroute .com you can make coustom maps in different sizes. I get shaded water proof maps and you name the map
http://offroute.com/geofinder/FS_geographic-finder.asp?qnplace=Enter+%22City%2C+ST%22
fiddlehead
05-15-2007, 22:50
I like Delorme's Topo. I have about 50 hours on it so won't change software now. I draw my own routes, then can look at the profile, mileage, print any size, with or without grids, anything i can imagine really.
It helps a lot when you are traveling in snow conditions and can't see any trail. (out west)
I just wish they'd do more international maps as the zoom level is not very good for Asia. i bought a similar program here in thailand but it is sucks comparatively.
I am with you on this Fiddlehead. I also have Delorme Topo and love it.
I'm using DeLorme Topo, but not with a GPS or anything. It's lots of fun. Especially doing "flyovers" of the trail in 3D.
Slosteppin
05-16-2007, 19:46
I worked over 40 years as a land surveyor, half that time also using computers. In my experience, all maps are wrong, in some way. All computer programs have problems. Combine the two and have fun...
I use DeLorme Topo at home. I also have a Garmin GPS and use the Mapsource topo. Both have uses and limitations.
Slosteppin