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Lugnut
06-21-2007, 20:46
This should make LW proud!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070621/ap_on_fe_st/odd_lethal_log_2;_ylt=Ah0iibGgTABcneOgzTAA38wE1vAI

Lugnut
06-21-2007, 21:23
This should make LW proud.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070621/ap_on_fe_st/odd_lethal_log_2;_ylt=Ah0iibGgTABcneOgzTAA38wE1vAI

Frosty
06-21-2007, 21:25
I'm impressed with the six-year-old who threw the shovel at the bear!

Darwin again
06-21-2007, 21:37
Bear killed for taking cooler that should have been secured.
Nothing to be proud of.

Panzer1
06-21-2007, 22:49
I feel sorry for the bear. He wans't trying to hurt anyone. He didn't do anything that Yogie the Bear didn't do.

Panzer

wilconow
06-21-2007, 22:53
The bear had taken the Everharts' cooler and was heading back to the woods when 6-year-old Logan hurled a shovel at it.

Fearing what might happen next, the Norcross father and ex-Marine grabbed the closest thing he could find — a log.

heading back to the woods...means away from them, right? why was he afraid what would happen next?

smokymtnsteve
06-21-2007, 23:20
Ex-Marine ...FEAR...I thunk that one a Marine always a Marine..

FEAR< FEAR< FEAR>

Appalachian Tater
06-21-2007, 23:51
....especially since the bear was running away.

jrwiesz
06-22-2007, 00:09
....especially since the bear was running away.

Fine should be equivalent to what any poacher would receive, in addition to that for the unsecure campsite.

Appalachian Tater
06-22-2007, 00:13
Actually, I think he should be charged under the animal protection laws in Georgia, even though it would only be a misdemeanor.

http://tinyurl.com/yu7a4m

jrwiesz
06-22-2007, 00:39
Actually, I think he should be charged under the animal protection laws in Georgia, even though it would only be a misdemeanor.

http://tinyurl.com/yu7a4m

Under those laws, he has the right to protect his personal property.:-?

I think, authorities will go after him via the, "secure campsite", angle.

khaynie
06-22-2007, 05:41
Does anyone find it hard to believe that the "log" he threw at the bear's head was what actually delivered the fatal blow?

Dances with Mice
06-22-2007, 06:15
This week we've seen reports of bears being chased up trees by kitty cats and killed by sticks.

I don't think they're making bears like they used it.

Jimmers
06-22-2007, 06:28
This week we've seen reports of bears being chased up trees by kitty cats and killed by sticks.

I don't think they're making bears like they used it.

I don't know. They still seem to grow them big out west (http://www.billingsgazette.net/articles/2007/06/18/news/state/22-bear.txt).

Marta
06-22-2007, 07:01
A bear that grabs a cooler was corrupted well before the Norcross dad threw the log at him. That bear had already been trained by other irresponsible campers that the cooler might contain food. He was heading for serious conflict with humans and his days were already numbered.

Marta/Five-Leaf

Tipi Walter
06-22-2007, 07:49
It ain't the bear that's corrupted, it's a system that allows nonraters the ability to drive into the woods and set up a car camping site AND THEN be slack enough to leave a food cooler out in the open.

Is scavenging now punishable by death? How about the crows? The ants? Raccoons? Stray dogs? Must all be killed cuz they took an interest in my food? What self-centered hubris. Any bear interaction with humans, including fatalities, must be seen AS ACCIDENTS, and accepted as part of the outdoor life. We accept 48,000 traffic deaths yearly and don't raise a ruckus, it's just the risk of travel. It's the same in the woods, a bear attack is just part of the risk of camping as is hypothermia, a sprained ankle, giardia, falling, lightning and all else.

txbubba
06-22-2007, 07:56
"The bear should have been admolished and ordered to attend C.A. Meetings". (Coolers Anonymous). This would have solved the problem along with teaching the bear a valuable lesson, that no doubt, he would not repeat.

txbubba
06-22-2007, 08:23
What is your definition of "nonrater".

Tipi Walter
06-22-2007, 08:42
What is your definition of "nonrater".

For a backpacker, a 'nonrater' is a car-bound tourist. With too many roads in the woods, car campers can go just about anywhere without effort, hence they don't 'earn' the wilderness experience by humping weight on a long trail. My plea? Close the roads.

txbubba
06-22-2007, 09:17
Wouldn't that limit your ability to hitchhike to town if the roads were closed?

Panzer1
06-22-2007, 09:36
Reportably, when the marine killed the bear the bear was "was heading back to the woods" . At that point I don't think it was reasonable for the marine to attack the bear. He should have just let the bear get away with the ice cooler. So what, he would be down one ice cooler. big deal.

Panzer

scope
06-22-2007, 10:09
Reportably, when the marine killed the bear the bear was "was heading back to the woods" . At that point I don't think it was reasonable for the marine to attack the bear. He should have just let the bear get away with the ice cooler. So what, he would be down one ice cooler. big deal.

Panzer

Story says the bear was at the cooler and then began going for his kid. Sensationalism? Maybe, but I highly doubt that one can 'throw' a log at a bear that is going away and kill it.

scope
06-22-2007, 10:14
For a backpacker, a 'nonrater' is a car-bound tourist. With too many roads in the woods, car campers can go just about anywhere without effort, hence they don't 'earn' the wilderness experience by humping weight on a long trail. My plea? Close the roads.

I agree with your earlier post, but I can't say I agree that you 'earn' the right to be in the wilderness by hauling your own weight. Its an education issue. But I agree that we could close more of the forest roads.

This is the second bear-attack that's been in the news in the last week. Now I have to re-educate my wife as to how safe it is to go hiking deep into the woods! :mad:

Tha Wookie
06-22-2007, 10:19
The man killed a bear with its back turned.

Obviously he could have handled it better, even before the bear got there.

But it happens. Never get between a Marine and his cubs!

Bless the spirit of that bear. And the man with the blood on his hands. I'll tell you one thing -his sons will always think he's a god.

Time To Fly 97
06-22-2007, 10:24
Wouldn't that limit your ability to hitchhike to town if the roads were closed?

The roads you hitch from to resupply aren't usually park or forest roads.

Happy hiking!

TTF

Dances with Mice
06-22-2007, 10:32
The cooler probably had all the man's beer so the killing was justifiable.

scope
06-22-2007, 10:38
heading back to the woods...means away from them, right? why was he afraid what would happen next?

Funny, this story was on the front page of the AJC today and it didn't mention the hurling of the shovel by the 6 year-old. I assume that the father was letting the bear do its thing and then the kid made the unwise decision to throw something at it, and wisely I think, the father proactively finds a method of defense. I still say there's no way he kills this bear if its going away into the woods. I think the bear probably was going into the woods, stopped when the kid threw the shovel at it, and must have been close enough to not be able to avoid the thrown log. In typical fashion, the AJC article says the man killed the bear with his bare hands! :rolleyes:

scope
06-22-2007, 10:43
Does anyone find it hard to believe that the "log" he threw at the bear's head was what actually delivered the fatal blow?

Yes, yes, yes! No way this bear was killed as he's going away into the woods, and how does a bear not avoid a flying log? Unless, the bear was charging toward a target and was blindsided, but why doens't the article report that the bear was charging? Sounds bearly believeable. ;)

sparky2000
06-22-2007, 10:44
I AGREE THAT WE SHOULD GIVE THE bEAR EQUAL RIGHTS. nOW, THE QUESTION BECOMES, "wHAT MAY i DO TO YOU IF U TRY TO STEAL SOMETHING - ANYTHING- FROM ME?"

oldfivetango
06-22-2007, 11:12
This should make LW proud.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070621/ap_on_fe_st/odd_lethal_log_2;_ylt=Ah0iibGgTABcneOgzTAA38wE1vAI

My take on the article was that it was "involuntary bear slaughter".
In other words it was really an accident.Sounds like the kid hurled
the shovel and then the dad,not to be outdone,hurled a log which
must have been a one in a million shot to take out the bear with one
lick to the head.I would think a couple hundred hours of community
service would be more than enough punishment for an event like this:D
But the good news for the anti-gun crowd is that this is living proof
that you don't need a gun for defense in the woods-just a MARINE.:banana
Oldfivetango

spittinpigeon
06-22-2007, 11:42
The kid threw a shovel, which the father feared may aggravate the bear, so he does the same thing, throws something at the bear...which may aggravate the bear. What if the log hit somewhere non-lethal, that family would have been in a world of trouble.

Lone Wolf
06-22-2007, 11:45
Never get between a Marine and his cubs!

more like never get between a Marine and his cooler full of beer

Lone Wolf
06-22-2007, 11:47
The kid threw a shovel, which the father feared may aggravate the bear, so he does the same thing, throws something at the bear...which may aggravate the bear. What if the log hit somewhere non-lethal, that family would have been in a world of trouble.

no. dad would've pulled his glock and shot the sumbitch

Lone Wolf
06-22-2007, 11:48
The cooler probably had all the man's beer so the killing was justifiable.

yes. i agree

superman
06-22-2007, 11:55
It wasn't the stick that killed the bear. It was the mere vision of a stick wielding Marine that made the bear up and have a killer heart attack.:-?

Lugnut
06-22-2007, 12:12
Didn't mean to start two threads. It seemed the first one didn't take so I did it over. Sorry about that. :o Maybe ATtroll can combine them or just let them fade away.

Tha Wookie
06-22-2007, 13:52
This does serve a valuable lesson. Never get between a Marine and his cubs.

dixicritter
06-22-2007, 14:11
Didn't mean to start two threads. It seemed the first one didn't take so I did it over. Sorry about that. :o Maybe ATtroll can combine them or just let them fade away.

Taken care of. :sun

halibut15
06-23-2007, 00:21
AJC said the guy "had his pistol packed away" or else he'd have used it instead. Apparently you don't have to follow common sense in the woods like storing your food as long as you're strapped.

Sounds like a typical Helen visitor to me. No wonder there are so many problem bears up there these days...there's too many problem people that make them that way.

Panzer1
06-23-2007, 01:16
Story says the bear was at the cooler and then began going for his kid. Sensationalism? Maybe, but I highly doubt that one can 'throw' a log at a bear that is going away and kill it.

Wrong. The bear never "began going for his kid"
Wrong. The bear was not "at the cooler"

Story says "The bear had taken the Everharts' cooler and was heading back to the woods when 6-year-old Logan hurled a shovel at it. Fearing what might happen next, the Norcross father and ex-Marine grabbed the closest thing he could find a log. "(I) threw it at it and it happened to hit the bear in the head," Chris Everhart said. "I thought it just knocked it out but it actually ended up killing the bear.""

Please reread the article.

Panzer

Tha Wookie
06-23-2007, 16:27
more like never get between a Marine and his cooler full of beer

LOL..... yeah I guess that's more accurate

poor bear. it was probably some bud ice or some old milwakee BS.

Bolo
06-23-2007, 17:45
Last weekend, while camping in the Smokies a bear came into the campsite next to ours on his way to the dumpster. The campers managed to scare him off by beating on a cookpot and shouting "Shoo, shoo, go away!"

I didn't know they responded to that:-?

Funny, but whatever works...

-Bolo

McQueen
06-24-2007, 12:14
What an idiot. I hope this guy gets in big trouble.

JoeHiker
06-25-2007, 13:11
I hope he gets a log-throwing award.

When I see a bear anywhere near my child, approaching, walking away, whatever, if I have the slightest apprehension about it, then that's a dead bear, and good riddance. No matter who "started it", particularly not a child.

One need not be a wilderness-trashing, environment-destroying ignoramus to have such an encounter. People are at the top of the food chain. Bears are not. I wouldn't lose any sleep over the fate of the bear.

the onondaga kid
06-25-2007, 13:40
Anyone else read this thread as "Former bear kills marine with log"?

twosticks
06-25-2007, 16:53
Now if Chuck Norris was there ......

Tipi Walter
06-25-2007, 21:16
People are at the top of the food chain. Bears are not. I wouldn't lose any sleep over the fate of the bear.

Bears are special, they have an innate wisdom and an appreciation of nature. They are the last vestige of the big mammal and as such symbolize primitive wilderness and reflect the wisdom of god's green earth. People are not so special and we've worn out our welcome on this blue-green jewel.

Lone Wolf
06-26-2007, 07:27
Bears are special, People are not so special and we've worn out our welcome on this blue-green jewel.

so you gonna off yourself soon?

icemanat95
06-26-2007, 08:23
Bears are special, they have an innate wisdom and an appreciation of nature. They are the last vestige of the big mammal and as such symbolize primitive wilderness and reflect the wisdom of god's green earth. People are not so special and we've worn out our welcome on this blue-green jewel.

Anthropomorphism rears its sill head again.


Wisdom? Wisdom takes intellectual processing power. Bears have the intellectual capacity of a roll of toilet paper. Male bears are known to slaughter the young of a prospective female mate, to get them out of the way, then the females promptly go into heat and essentially forget about their former offspring.

Yes humans can be profoundly stupid about their environment, but the reason animals aren't isn't because they choose not to screw things up, but because they lack the capacity to do anything but react to natural process. And when nature does something for which they aren't prepared, they die, having an extremely limited capacity to adapt to it.

scope
06-26-2007, 09:54
Wrong. The bear never "began going for his kid"
Wrong. The bear was not "at the cooler"

Story says "The bear had taken the Everharts' cooler and was heading back to the woods when 6-year-old Logan hurled a shovel at it. Fearing what might happen next, the Norcross father and ex-Marine grabbed the closest thing he could find a log. "(I) threw it at it and it happened to hit the bear in the head," Chris Everhart said. "I thought it just knocked it out but it actually ended up killing the bear.""

Please reread the article.

Panzer

This is what I had read in the Atlanta Journal:

"The bear then dropped the cooler and started coming at the boy, said his father. Fearing what might happen next, Everhart, an ex-Marine, grabbed the closest thing he could find a log from their stash of firewood."

I didn't read the article that was linked initially thinking it was the same story which I read in the AJC, which of course it was, but its funny how the difference in little details in the separate articles make such a big difference in the interpretation of what actually happened.

I do think that one could infer even from the original wording of the Yahoo article that this is what happened. There is no way one kills a bear running away from you by throwing something at it.

mriets1
06-26-2007, 16:48
From what I have read bear attacks are like getting hit by lightning statistically (documented attacks) and with black bears it is even less. I believe when people are put in such situations they may react overly aggressive. I do not blame the guy for throwing a log. I do blame for the bad food management. Correct consistent education would help. Some articles I have read said that you should throw rocks at the bear until it is gone. A rock to the head would kill the bear as easy as a log. Handling of a bear in a campsite is not a common sense issue and there is a lot of varing information out there and it is hard to determine what the correct strategy would be.

Tipi Walter
06-26-2007, 20:13
so you gonna off yourself soon?

A common question when dealing with overpopulation. The answer is not mass offings but the choice by individual humans to limit births. Over time thru the wisdom of choice we might as a group find our balance and then begin to repair the damage. No mass "die-off" is needed, just a slower birth rate over time, etc.

"Wisdom" is the ability to see the long term consequences of our actions. Bears have it. Humans don't. Responding correctly to natural processes is what bears do and have been doing for millions of years. I call such response wisdom. On the other hand, modern humans are at war with nature, they react incorrectly to natural processes. Just look around.

scope
06-28-2007, 10:06
A common question when dealing with overpopulation. The answer is not mass offings but the choice by individual humans to limit births. Over time thru the wisdom of choice we might as a group find our balance and then begin to repair the damage. No mass "die-off" is needed, just a slower birth rate over time, etc.

"Wisdom" is the ability to see the long term consequences of our actions. Bears have it. Humans don't. Responding correctly to natural processes is what bears do and have been doing for millions of years. I call such response wisdom. On the other hand, modern humans are at war with nature, they react incorrectly to natural processes. Just look around.

Lots of humans do make bad choices, but I think it reflects a bit of anthropormorphic elitism on your part to throw humanity under the bus as you've done in a couple of posts here.

SteveJ
06-28-2007, 10:35
<clip>"Wisdom" is the ability to see the long term consequences of our actions. Bears have it. Humans don't. <clip>

This would be funny if I didn't think you were serious.....

wolf
07-04-2007, 13:04
shame on you man, I HOPE YOU FEEL LIKE A REAL MAN NOW,big sissy

oldfivetango
07-04-2007, 14:37
I hope he gets a log-throwing award.

When I see a bear anywhere near my child, approaching, walking away, whatever, if I have the slightest apprehension about it, then that's a dead bear, and good riddance. No matter who "started it", particularly not a child.

One need not be a wilderness-trashing, environment-destroying ignoramus to have such an encounter. People are at the top of the food chain. Bears are not. I wouldn't lose any sleep over the fate of the bear.

It's posts like these that make me think I am not the only
heartless,mean spirited,gun totin',conservative here.:D
I am sorry it happened for the bear but they ARE expendable
IMHO when they get too familiar with garbage.Yep,it's our fault
but when it happens to you-whatchagonna do?
Oldfivetango

Jack Tarlin
07-04-2007, 14:48
Bears have the ability to see the long-term consequences of their actions?

Geesh, what a titanic load of new-age, goo-goo, horseflop.

I just spent a week in Shenandoah National Park. According to Park Rangers, there are about 7,000 bears there. The place is lousy with 'em. Their principal concerns are getting laid, staying outta the rain, poohing on the Trail, and getting their next meal.

I really don't think they spend a whole lotta time sitting around with their pals talking about what it's gonna be like 150 years from now.

But some people think bears possess the "wisdom" to engage in these sort of dialogues. They evidentally spent countless waking hours worrying about
the long-term consequences of their actions.

I don't know whether to laugh hysterically or throw up.

But in one respect, Tipi is correct: There are definitely bears that are smarter than some humans.

Or at least one. :D

MikeG
07-05-2007, 16:26
first of all, all you people who are so quick to judge need to take a few things into consideration...

1 low gap is a 5 mile hike in from the nearest road, this couldnt have been "family" camping

2. low gap has been known for black bear problems and has been closed down for bear activity

3. if you re read the AJC artical it says the bear turned on the kid

Papaw John
07-05-2007, 17:03
Hey!!!

Is Everhart a Scottish name? Is this guy a fabulous 'caber-toss' star?

If prosecuted, he could claim it's his national heritage and 'right' to throw logs. Who are we to tell him when and where he can throw a log anyway.

Keep your big-gov't hands OFF MY LOG!!!

Papaw John

Tha Wookie
07-06-2007, 22:53
Their principal concerns are getting laid, staying outta the rain, poohing on the Trail, and getting their next meal.

sounds like just about every thru hiker