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View Full Version : If No Water On AT in '08, What's Plan B?



HapKiDo
10-14-2007, 20:06
:eek:If the current weather trends continue and water along the AT is either non-existent or intermittant, do you have a Plan B for your 2008 AT Thru Hike? Please share if you do.

:bananaAnd if anyone knows a rain dance that works, please send water to the AT Corridor, especially in the South.

Seriously, though, will the lack of water affect your AT Thru Hike? If so, how? If not, if the springs and small streams are dry, how will you obtain water? (I noticed that some of the river water was labeled "non potable" in Wingfoot's book. I assume due to agricultural run off {a phrase meaning farm animal poop} and pesticides.)

What is your Plan B?

As Always, Thanks In Advance, HapKiDo

Jack Tarlin
10-14-2007, 20:13
It is the 14th of October.

It is much too early to be worrying about water conditions for next spring or summer, and there is no accurate way to predict these conditions, either.

If it's still like this in March of '08, then hikers can be justly concerned. But right now, I think worrying about "present trends" and what they might indicate, is premature.

Nest
10-14-2007, 22:14
If this trend continues, we have more to worry about than our hikes. It's already causing a lot of problems for farmers around here. My uncle is on his last roll of hay, and will be selling all of his cattle in the next couple of weeks. Since most of the people in the area are selling their cattle, he will be lucky to get 10% of what they were worth earlier this year. Everyone is having to sell their cattle because their hay fields didn't grow. Normally a roll of hay costs $10, but now it runs at $100 a roll. No one can afford to keep the cattle.

SGT Rock
10-14-2007, 22:20
According to the Almanac - we are likely in for warmer than normal winter and spring and a wetter than average winter, spring and summer - except for Feb and March.

Appalachian Tater
10-14-2007, 22:22
Start planning now to make your pack as light as possible so you can carry a lot of water.

Tipi Walter
10-14-2007, 22:24
The ultralight types just might have to carry twenty pounds of water between stops. In the meantime, read up on Colin Fletcher to learn more about water-humpage and liquid caches.

SGT Rock
10-14-2007, 22:26
Well it won't be just the ultralighters having to carry 20 pounds of water LOL. Ultralight or ultra heavy - water is water.

Nest
10-14-2007, 22:32
You could always do more night hiking through the areas that have less water.

Jan LiteShoe
10-14-2007, 22:34
Some of the farmers here in mid-state NC were saying the water table here is down seven feet, and our drought has been easier than the drought in the western part of the state.

The problem is offshore hurricanes did not bring the storms and needed fall water that usually recharges things.

Tipi Walter
10-14-2007, 22:35
Well it won't be just the ultralighters having to carry 20 pounds of water LOL. Ultralight or ultra heavy - water is water.

I know, but I just love the thought of ultralighters having to carry a 50 pound pack.

Appalachian Tater
10-14-2007, 22:39
During hot weather, walk through the desert slowly and rest for 10 minutes every hour. Begin early in the morning or late in the day. Water and body temperature are critical to survival. A person requires about a gallon of water each day. Be sure extra drinking water is available as it may be the difference between life and death. To reduce water loss, keep the mouth closed, breathe through the nose and avoid conversation. Do not drink alcohol. It causes dehydration. Digestion consumes water so don't eat food if there is not a sufficient amount of water available. Don't ration water in hot weather. When you are thirsty, drink. Conserve water as best as possible and look for more.
In the summer, ground temperatures can be 30 degrees hotter than the surrounding air temperature, so, when resting, sit at least 12 inches above the ground on a stool or a branch.
Body temperature is absorbed in three ways: from direct sunlight, hot air and heat reflected from the ground. Stay in the shade and wear clothing, including shirt, hat and sunglasses. Clothing helps ration sweat by slowing evaporation and prolonging the cooling effect. Travel at night or early in the day if possible.

SGT Rock
10-14-2007, 22:42
If my pack normally weighs 28 pounds with 1 liter of water and I add two more liters I only make it up to about 32 pounds! Ouch!

If a heavy hiker is carrying 45 pounds and needs to add more water - he could break 50 pounds - and since he is carrying more, he should also need more water to hydrate from the higher exertion. So he could end up with 20 pounds more than me when I am carrying 3 liters of water!

Poor guy.

Tipi Walter
10-14-2007, 23:01
The ridge walking nature of the AT is one reason we're having this discussion. Had the AT been allowed to follow the natural valley waterways instead of staying high up on the ridges where water is scarce, we wouldn't be so concerned with dried up springs and water hauling. Anyway, like Jack said, it'll probably rain soon enough to keep these mountain lands alive.

But if not, I would consider the carrying of 8 liters of water to be normal which might take a person into 3 days without refill. We could take a lesson from the desert hikers and in a worst case scenario have to haul 4 gallons at a time, about 24.8 pounds.

All in all, a drought will mean more weight for the backpacker, especially the slower ones.

Just a Hiker
10-14-2007, 23:17
removed post

EWS
10-15-2007, 00:09
Gather up the new agers and have them do a rain dance...

Downunda
10-15-2007, 00:40
2002 was a very dry year on the AT. Basically one had to take every opportunity to top up water containers (even if it did mean a long haul downhill and back). Plus I would carry more than I normally would.

It was quite amazing when traveling through the northern states how much of the vegetation had died off and how much dust would be kicked up as you moved along.

Also it was fortunate and much appreciated that a few trail angels had left water containers along the trail.

stranger
10-15-2007, 04:27
Can't help but think about how mad I'm gonna be when I wake up at some stage next spring to my 11th day of rain in a row, especially after I think about this thread...For real though, it will be fine water wise. And if it's not, well you will find a way around it. It's the east coast after all, not exactly Arizona. I remember the spring being very wet in the east, and 3 liters of water goes a long way if you're smart about it.

mudhead
10-15-2007, 06:27
Forest fire issues are also a concern.

NICKTHEGREEK
10-15-2007, 07:02
Can't help but think about how mad I'm gonna be when I wake up at some stage next spring to my 11th day of rain in a row, especially after I think about this thread...For real though, it will be fine water wise. And if it's not, well you will find a way around it. It's the east coast after all, not exactly Arizona. I remember the spring being very wet in the east, and 3 liters of water goes a long way if you're smart about it.

Without starting to dehydrate, 3 liters of water will go less than a day in moderately hot weather, and that's it. Add a long uphill in full sun and high humidity and -----.
If you mean how far you walk, stagger, and finally crawl over 4 days with 3 liters then you may be right, but I don't see the smart part.

EWS
10-15-2007, 07:40
Where did stranger suggest three liters of water was sufficent for four days?

NICKTHEGREEK
10-15-2007, 08:16
Where did stranger suggest three liters of water was sufficent for four days?
He didn't---- I think that's about all you can do in hot weather with 3 liters Hooked up now?

chiefdaddy
10-15-2007, 08:27
There will always be water out there.....all you have to do is look, and most of the time, you will walk right over it!\

On labor day weekend I was told a spring was dry and not to bother....I got 3 liters out of it! I went down hill til I found a place, took amybe 45 min total. Guess I don't take someone's word when It comes to water!

Cannibal
10-15-2007, 08:30
I don't think water will be a problem. Historically, if I am out for more than a single night, I get lots and lots of rain. I think I'm a rain jinx.

I'm starting March 1, so anytime after that and you should be fine. :D

Moon Monster
10-15-2007, 13:35
No worries, yet. Use memory and conventional wisdom.

In many areas of the AT, the drought of 2001-2002 was way worse than the current one. It ranked as one of the 2 or 3 worst droughts on record for the Mid-Atlantic. It wasn't that long ago--there should be many stories of thru-hikers from that year. Go look for them. Also, 1998-1999 was a drought term. There are plenty of veterans from that year around as well.

These droughts tend to last just over a year. Shifts happen sometime in the Fall. Remember, 2003 wound up being the wettest year on record for much of the AT territory. That wet period started right on the heels of the 2002 drought.

So, by next Spring, you very well could be wishing for drought just so you could see more than gray and fog. But, there are many variables. La Nina is strengthening. Hurricane forecast is down for the rest of the season. Only time will tell.

dessertrat
10-15-2007, 15:17
Not all of the water will dry up, no matter how dry it gets. Sometimes, people might have to plan around water sources rather than take them for granted, and might have to carry a gallon. That means if you're a very lightweight hiker, you'll carry a gallon of water and still not be carrying the 45 pounds some folks carry on a regular basis. This makes it even more important to cut out extra weight.

shelterbuilder
10-15-2007, 16:02
This is another good argument for carrying good maps. Most will show springs, or at the very least streams. They may be quite a distance off of the footpath, but with a good map, most people who can read a map wouldn't hesitate to make the trip down and back up. That's what I had to do this weekend in Pa. Just a 15 minute walk down turned a dry camp into a pleasant evening and morning with plenty of water.

digger51
10-15-2007, 18:14
2001 was a dry year, but I only had a problem in Pa. There were times when we had to climb down long hills for a trickle or hike a mile or more down a road to a friendly house. But the big savior was Desperado. He left gallon jugs of water at many road crossings and some shelters.

saimyoji
10-15-2007, 18:20
He left gallon jugs of water at many road crossings and some shelters.


Don't count on this anymore. In most places the ridgerunners/maintainers are removing coolers, jugs, etc. that are unnattended.

Appalachian Tater
10-15-2007, 18:22
Don't count on this anymore. In most places the ridgerunners/maintainers are removing coolers, jugs, etc. that are unnattended.


Jugs of water should not be removed from dry stretches. The ATC needs to adjust this policy. All you have to do is run a piece of string through the handles and they won't go anywhere.

Blissful
10-15-2007, 18:36
Jugs of water should not be removed from dry stretches. The ATC needs to adjust this policy. All you have to do is run a piece of string through the handles and they won't go anywhere.

I was thinking that too - a good argument for the blessings of trail angels and trail magic - a drought - but that is another thread. :)

hopefulhiker
10-15-2007, 18:46
At one point I was carrying up to four litres in 05 for a short period of time. Maybe there will be a trail angel effort to set up water drops and road crosssings next year.

max patch
10-15-2007, 18:50
Georgia is gonna be plumb full of water next spring.

Kirby
10-15-2007, 19:33
I plan to have my 3 liter bladder, and two other 1 liter sources. If the bladder dies on me, like mine did in the "wilderness", I will have 2 liters worth of water sources to carry. Depends on what Georgia is doing with water, hard to tell what water sources will be like 4.5 months out.

Kirby
30-5-2????

shelterbuilder
10-15-2007, 19:34
Don't count on this anymore. In most places the ridgerunners/maintainers are removing coolers, jugs, etc. that are unnattended.

There is a hesitancy to endorse - even tacitly - the policy of leaving unattended jugs of water where they are found, because of the remote possibility that some sicko could have tampered with the contents. On the part of the powers-that-be, this is a "liability issue". I always tell our shelter maintainers that ANYTHING they find at shelters should be removed ("trash" breeds trash, no food for critters, no "support" for the homeless).

Trail Magic from a person who is right there when hikers are coming through is something else again - there's nothing wrong with that, so long as it doesn't become an impromtu "Gathering" in an ecologically sensitive area. And for section hikers, I personally don't see the harm in caching a couple of jugs here and there, as long as they're tagged with the date, the intended purpose, and a probable retrival date. (That way, if somebody stumbles across the jugs, they know to leave them alone.) But I'm afraid that the fail-safe position for thru-hikers - at least for now - is going to be: climb down off of the ridge and search the streambeds below the springs until you find water.

Nightwalker
10-15-2007, 21:11
I know, but I just love the thought of ultralighters having to carry a 50 pound pack.

You would! :)

Nightwalker
10-15-2007, 21:14
There will always be water out there.....all you have to do is look, and most of the time, you will walk right over it!

If water is still an issue when he goes, topo maps or a mapping GPS show springs and creeks near the trail. I've found water many times where none was supposed to be.

hopefulhiker
10-15-2007, 21:23
I think the idea of carrying maps next year is a reallly good one. Sometimes you might have to search for water down a stream bed.

Appalachian Tater
10-15-2007, 22:08
There is a hesitancy to endorse - even tacitly - the policy of leaving unattended jugs of water where they are found, because of the remote possibility that some sicko could have tampered with the contents. On the part of the powers-that-be, this is a "liability issue".

Oh it could happen, but it is probably less likely on the trail than in the grocery store. There is a difference from endorsing it and ordering its removal. At the very least the trail clubs could issue information regarding alternative water sources and make sure that ridgerunners have accurate information regarding sources. That should be in a trail club's core mission.

MOWGLI
10-15-2007, 22:47
Georgia is gonna be plumb full of water next spring.

I hope you're right Max. It is parched over here in SE Tennessee. I mean bone dry.

Sly
10-15-2007, 23:38
Jugs of water should not be removed from dry stretches. The ATC needs to adjust this policy. All you have to do is run a piece of string through the handles and they won't go anywhere.

Well, a full jug isn't going anywhere but, I don't think that was the point. Water jugs, coolers, sodas etc. are trash, full or empty. I'm not against caches per se and have cached water on my own, but I've always packed out the bottle once I retrieved it. If you can't self cache during a drought, it's best to realize there's going to be long dry stretches and find out beforehand where you can get water or carry enough. I'd never rely on predetermined cache by a trail angel.

shelterbuilder
10-16-2007, 07:01
Oh it could happen, but it is probably less likely on the trail than in the grocery store. There is a difference from endorsing it and ordering its removal. At the very least the trail clubs could issue information regarding alternative water sources and make sure that ridgerunners have accurate information regarding sources. That should be in a trail club's core mission.

You have to understand, the liability mentality borders on paranoia sometimes. These days, it seems like almost everybody is "sue-happy", and a million-dollar judgment could ruin a maintaining club's day.:(

From what I've seen, this drought is the worst one in my area in decades. I know that BMECC is not used to thinking in terms of "no water" - limited water, yes, but not like this. That's one reason that I made the effort to go out and try to get some accurate information to post here and elsewhere. But water availability is, and always has been, the luck of the draw, and we all have to be responsible for ourselves in terms of water supply. THAT'S WHERE THE MAPS BECOME INDISPENSABLE. Learn to read a map before you get out there and carry maps when you're out. I've heard other folks say that they think Pa.'s maps are too detailed these days, but this is one instance where the details can make a hiker's day! I don't like dropping off the ridge any more than the next guy, but if I'm out of water, and the map shows a spring or stream 500 - 800 feet down, then I'm going down, too.

saimyoji
10-16-2007, 13:00
Well, here's what they have to say about it in Little Gap PA.

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=19272&c=520

horicon
10-16-2007, 15:05
Bring a water tank??

SGT Rock
10-16-2007, 15:58
I have faith it will work out.

max patch
10-16-2007, 16:18
Anybody who thinks that it isn't going to rain/snow almost every day in north Georgia is spending too much time listening to Algore. Non-issue next spring.

Johnny Swank
10-16-2007, 16:24
Lets not forget that there are plenty of SOBO's on the trail right now. Those folks have to be packing some water at every source.

Bootstrap
10-16-2007, 16:36
People hike in much drier places than the current AT. In the Grand Canyon, they installed pipes - I hope it doesn't get to that point with the AT.

Carry more water containers. Ask the hikers coming in the opposite direction where they found water, and fill up as much as you need to get to the next verified source.

If a spring marked on a map is dry, you can usually find water further downhill. If you can't get the end of your water filter into a pool at a spring, let it drain into a container, and pump out of that.

Someone described a trick with PVC pipe - does anyone know how that works?

You know the fancy solar stills they show in the survival books, with a clear plastic tarp and a rock, with a container to hold the resulting water? Forget it, they are very low yield.


Jonathan

Sly
10-16-2007, 18:25
Anybody who thinks that it isn't going to rain/snow almost every day in north Georgia is spending too much time listening to Algore. Non-issue next spring.

Perhaps, but you could be overly optimistic. As Liteshoe mentioned, not much precipitation from hurricanes this year.

shelterbuilder
10-16-2007, 18:36
People hike in much drier places than the current AT. In the Grand Canyon, they installed pipes - I hope it doesn't get to that point with the AT.
Carry more water containers. Ask the hikers coming in the opposite direction where they found water, and fill up as much as you need to get to the next verified source.
If a spring marked on a map is dry, you can usually find water further downhill. If you can't get the end of your water filter into a pool at a spring, let it drain into a container, and pump out of that.
Someone described a trick with PVC pipe - does anyone know how that works?
You know the fancy solar stills they show in the survival books, with a clear plastic tarp and a rock, with a container to hold the resulting water? Forget it, they are very low yield.
Jonathan

Solar stills need to be HUGE in order to provide more than just subsistance amounts of water. But there has to be water contained within the soil for it to work at all. (And I believe that black plastic works much better than clear.)
A trick with a PVC pipe??? What are you trying to do - use it as a dousing rod???

Kirby
10-16-2007, 18:58
We certainly need to watch the weather patterns over the next few months to help determine if we will have a shortage, but I am not going to worry because the streams and rivers have 4.5 months to be normal or above normal, thats plenty of time. I will hope and pray for a wet winter down south though, certainly would not hurt my cause.

Kirby
30-5-2??

shelterbuilder
10-16-2007, 19:10
We certainly need to watch the weather patterns over the next few months to help determine if we will have a shortage, but I am not going to worry because the streams and rivers have 4.5 months to be normal or above normal, thats plenty of time. I will hope and pray for a wet winter down south though, certainly would not hurt my cause.

Kirby
30-5-2??

Anyone who has a basic understanding of weather forecasting knows that any prediction beyond 4 - 5 days out is an educated guess at best. If we get a reasonable amount of snow cover this winter, the current "trend" will reverse and this years' drought will be just another campfire story. But no matter which direction this goes, it's just too far away to call right now. We'll all just have to wait and see....

saimyoji
10-16-2007, 19:20
But in the meantime we can speculate, armchair-forecast, debate and complain.....:D

shelterbuilder
10-16-2007, 19:21
But in the meantime we can speculate, armchair-forecast, debate and complain.....:D

Of course - it's much more fun than scientific prognostication!:banana :D :banana

saimyoji
10-16-2007, 19:22
ah
But in the meantime we can speculate, armchair-forecast, debate and complain.....:D


Nah, screw that. Even with my fall pack weight at around 20lbs I carried 6L of water. And was glad that I did.

saimyoji
10-16-2007, 19:24
Of course - it's much more fun than scientific prognostication!:banana :D :banana


Hey, those scientists are an honorable lot. So what if they have to augment their income a little, I'm sure its not just for fun. They must have huge student loans to pay off. :)

shelterbuilder
10-16-2007, 19:25
ah


Nah, screw that. Even with my fall pack weight at around 20lbs I carried 6L of water. And was glad that I did.

I didn't carry that much last weekend - I just struck the rocks with my staff and water came pouring out.:eek: D^mn, I'm good!

Kirby
10-16-2007, 19:35
I didn't carry that much last weekend - I just struck the rocks with my staff and water came pouring out.:eek: D^mn, I'm good!

Well, I am god, so if I say there will be plenty of water on the trail in 2008, there will be plenty of water on the trail in 2008.:D

Kirby
30-5-2??

shelterbuilder
10-16-2007, 19:41
Well, I am god, so if I say there will be plenty of water on the trail in 2008, there will be plenty of water on the trail in 2008.:D

Kirby
30-5-2??

god, I hope so....

Appalachian Tater
10-16-2007, 19:44
Then your trailname is Chuey.

rafe
10-16-2007, 19:48
god, I hope so....

I just checked with g*d. She says everything's gonna be cool, so long as y'all deal with that "Wally" fella over at MRO.

Dakota Dan
10-16-2007, 20:14
I'm a WB'er in training here, but I would like to ask what have other thru-hikers used to carry water? My nephew has started throwing out all kinds of ideas. I really like the looks bladders, but would still have to have a backup bottle in case that sucker breaks. What are some other hikers recommendations? I guess I could have started a whole new thread but this one looks ok for asking the question. We'll also be looking at all the other things needed here at WB, such as bags, tents, pads, clothing, cooking gear.

rafe
10-16-2007, 20:16
I really like the looks bladders, but would still have to have a backup bottle in case that sucker breaks.

Which is pretty much S.O.P. Given how essential water is, backup is mandatory.

Appalachian Tater
10-16-2007, 20:19
I'm a WB'er in training here, but I would like to ask what have other thru-hikers used to carry water? My nephew has started throwing out all kinds of ideas. I really like the looks bladders, but would still have to have a backup bottle in case that sucker breaks. What are some other hikers recommendations? I guess I could have started a whole new thread but this one looks ok for asking the question. We'll also be looking at all the other things needed here at WB, such as bags, tents, pads, clothing, cooking gear.

I don't even carry a patch kit for my Platypus bladders. They are quite durable--mine has 2500 miles and is still going strong, and I'm sure others have used ones much longer than that. I don't coddle it except to keep it away from open flame because I'm sure it would melt. The squishy ones I would worry about a little more. This summer I switched out another Platypus for a soda bottle I used to carry because it holds more and is less bulky when empty or emptying. You couldn't pay me to carry the extra weight of a heavy Nalgene-type water container.

Kirby
10-16-2007, 20:28
My nalgene bladder did not last long in the wilderness because varmint chewed it over night, BUT, it was doing well up to that point.

Kirby
30-5-2??

rafe
10-16-2007, 20:33
My nalgene bladder did not last long in the wilderness because varmint chewed it over night, BUT, it was doing well up to that point.

I worried about that this summer. But my platy sat on shelter floors and picnic tables on many a night, with no problems. Maybe just lucky?

Appalachian Tater
10-16-2007, 20:37
Varmints? Well, they won't hold up to a shotgun or a hole puncher, either!!!! Normal use they hold up to.

sneezer
10-16-2007, 20:38
Do what I do: carry dehydrated water - it's soooo much lighter. When in camp re-hydrate with water, wait 10 minutes. It tastes just like real water - you would never know it was dehydrated!

Dakota Dan
10-16-2007, 20:49
Thanks Tater and Kirby. What me and JR will do is spend a lot of time at the local outfitters, looking at all the gear, books, maps etc. (REI here we come). The most important thing to me is my footwear, I'm proud to say I've got 2 pair of boots I've had for 15 years, broken in and sealed, one pair has already been resoled. We'll be fitting JR up with a better pair than he's got. I've already explained to him the importance of having a good fitting, as well broken in, pair or 2 pair of boots.

Appalachian Tater
10-16-2007, 20:54
Actually a lot of people are wearing trail runners or lighter boots these days.

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?p=419634

Kirby
10-16-2007, 20:56
Thanks Tater and Kirby. What me and JR will do is spend a lot of time at the local outfitters, looking at all the gear, books, maps etc. (REI here we come). The most important thing to me is my footwear, I'm proud to say I've got 2 pair of boots I've had for 15 years, broken in and sealed, one pair has already been resoled. We'll be fitting JR up with a better pair than he's got. I've already explained to him the importance of having a good fitting, as well broken in, pair or 2 pair of boots.

What year do you plan on hiking the entire AT?

I was quite mad when I discovered the varmint had gotten into my bladder, stupid things, I show no mercy for them.

Kirby
30-5-2???

saimyoji
10-16-2007, 21:30
What year do you plan on hiking the entire AT?



Since you're relatively new here I'll let it slide...but that should be ENTIRE, always caps that. ;)

dockaos
10-17-2007, 00:54
Thus far, the picture for drought relief is not looking too good:

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/expert_assessment/seasonal_drought.html

Guess it's time to start tossing out all those unecessary items like a stove and change of clothes to make more room for water. :) It's taken 15 years to get the nerve (and savings) to kiss the 8 to 5 goodbye. I never figured I'd actually hope for a rainy hike.

hopefulhiker
10-17-2007, 09:22
I used a two litre and a one litre platypus and a gatoraid bottle...

MOWGLI
10-17-2007, 09:23
There is always the PCT. :sun

Blissful
10-17-2007, 12:36
I have faith it will work out.


Amen, brother! :)

We were supposed to leave on March 1st last year. It rained in Georgia buckets on that day. They got like seven inches or somethng. We actually delayed until March 5th. So anything can happen.

Animals will chew your playtpus hose, esp if you had those sweaty lips on the bite valve, etc. Mice chewed Paul Bunyan's. We had hoses chewed in the Whites a few years back. Keep it with you and take it into the tent with you.

Sly
10-17-2007, 13:48
There is always the PCT. :sun

Yeah, they only have 35 mile waterless stretches. Pack it in, pee it out!

Jan LiteShoe
10-17-2007, 15:45
I hope you're right Max. It is parched over here in SE Tennessee. I mean bone dry.

Here too. Lots of drought-tolerant plants not so tolerant, such as hollies and junipers throwing out dead limbs.
Story on the drought:

Drought-Stricken South Facing Tough Choices
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/16/us/16drought.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

Brenda Goodman of The New York Times writes, "For the first time in more than
100 years, much of the Southeast has reached the most severe category of drought,
climatologists said Monday, creating an emergency so serious that some cities are
just months away from running out of water."

In North Carolina, Gov. Michael F. Easley asked residents Monday to
stop using water for any purpose “not essential to public health and
safety.” He warned that he would soon have to declare a state of
emergency if voluntary efforts fell short.

Sly
10-17-2007, 16:15
Time to put on your clean underwear. The Rapture Index is up. Drought 5+1

http://www.raptureready.com/rap2.html

superman
10-17-2007, 16:25
There is always the PCT. :sun

Yes, on the desert part of the PCT and CDT the locals put out many gallons of potable water for hikers. It can be done on the AT if it's necessary.

WILKEBEAST
10-17-2007, 18:37
on my hike in 2005 water was always available, even when day-hikers or sectioners thought a spring was "low". they usually dont have a clue what low is compared to some of the stuff you suck water out of with a filter. so take any info given by others with a grain of salt. especially when commenting on a sections difficulty.

i used 2 nalgenes when hiking and a 2 liter in camp. at least till mahoosuc swallowed one of the nalgenes.

WILKEBEAST
10-17-2007, 18:38
on my hike in 2005 water was always available, even when day-hikers or sectioners thought a spring was "low". they usually dont have a clue what low is compared to some of the stuff you suck water out of with a filter. so take any info given by others with a grain of salt. especially when commenting on a sections difficulty.

i used 2 nalgenes when hiking and a 2 liter platypus in camp. at least till mahoosuc swallowed one of the nalgenes.

Sly
10-17-2007, 18:45
Yes, on the desert part of the PCT and CDT the locals put out many gallons of potable water for hikers. It can be done on the AT if it's necessary.

Not so much on the CDT. But anyway, you really don't want to depend on them. Let me give you an example. There's 20 miles between two known good water sources with a cache at ten miles. You decide carrying 2 liters will do, but get to the cache and there's nothing left. Walking 10 miles or more with no water through the desert on a hot and sunny day.... :eek:

saimyoji
10-17-2007, 18:50
If I know I'm walking 20 miles, I have no problem carrying at least 6L of water. But thats just me.

SGT Rock
10-17-2007, 18:52
At one point I would carry 6 liters when training in the deserts of El-Paso, but it was mostly because students have a tendency to not have enough and it is better to give them some than to deal with the BS over a heat casualty.

Nest
10-17-2007, 18:59
At one point I would carry 6 liters when training in the deserts of El-Paso, but it was mostly because students have a tendency to not have enough and it is better to give them some than to deal with the BS over a heat casualty.


Just admit it, you care.:D

Sly
10-17-2007, 19:36
If I know I'm walking 20 miles, I have no problem carrying at least 6L of water. But thats just me.

I usually carry 1 liter for every 5 miles. If I plan on stopping overnight, I'll carry an extra two.

However, one time in New Mexico, there was a 40 mile stretch with a known broken source in the middle. I carried my capacity, 7.25 liters (2-two liter platty's, 2-one liter Aquafina bottles and 2-twenty oz Gatorade bottles) and made due.

When I got to town, I reminded the FS ranger that the source was still out. He responded with something about "citizen caches"!

Hello Mr Ranger, who's going to depend on a trail angel to leave water for hikers in the middle of the desert and an Indian rez to boot? :rolleyes:

And now for the rest of the story:

About a half mile prior to hiking to the known broken water source we reached a paved road that led 12 miles to a Cabazon. On my partners map, which had already done 3 CDT hikes, it said "bar". We hitched and got a ride fairly quick that dropped us off at the bar. Well, the bar part was closed but, they did sell beer and soda to go. Rainmman and I picked up a 6 pack and his girlfriend bought a couple sodas. We asked the guy about getting water. They didn't have any water! It had to be trucked in. :(

Anyway, back to the trail. The ride out of time took less time to get than the ride in. Awesome. A Navajo native picked us up and upon dropping us off gave us all a slice of pizza and my friends a gallon water. Wicked awesome! :banana

I fired down a quick beer and started hiking the half to the broken pump, where we planned on camping. Jubilant about our "trail magic" I was chatting away when I made a moved to cut back on a switchback when I severely rolled an ankle. It still ain't right! :mad:

superman
10-17-2007, 21:05
Not so much on the CDT. But anyway, you really don't want to depend on them. Let me give you an example. There's 20 miles between two known good water sources with a cache at ten miles. You decide carrying 2 liters will do, but get to the cache and there's nothing left. Walking 10 miles or more with no water through the desert on a hot and sunny day.... :eek:
Oh yeah, the water is hit and miss on those trails. Even when there is water it can be real nasty stuff. It's great when the water is where it's supposed to be but when it isn't it makes for a bad day. Dry riverbeds, spigots that are dry and just a lot of heat make it a bit different than the AT. You can't bank on the water caches but they are sweet when they are there. Tex had a pure filter that clogged on it's first use. My msr made most of the distance but the ceramic filter burst. We collected water in a plastic bag that was running across a field with lots of deer **** in it. Tex had some iodine tablets left in the bottom of his pack from a previous hike that treated the water. You do what you need to do and if needed the folks on the AT will adapt.

No Belay
10-17-2007, 22:18
Do what I do: carry dehydrated water - it's soooo much lighter. When in camp re-hydrate with water, wait 10 minutes. It tastes just like real water - you would never know it was dehydrated!
Sneezer, I used dehydrated H2O for several years but have recently switched to freeze dried H2O instead. I can carry 4 liters and not even notice it's in the pack. Best thing to hit the trail since reversible underwear.

Savor Happy!
Stan

HapKiDo
10-27-2007, 15:34
I'm glad I asked the question when I did. Lots of good answers, I especially like the "hike early and late in the day" suggestion. I guess I could spend the middle of the day dehydrating water to carry later. :)

So, unless there are fires to hinder an AT hike, if it's a dry hike season, we'll be out there carrying food and water and precious little else.

:D This is Greta Cistern with FozNews reporting on the sightings of nekked hikers along the Appalachian Trail. The hikers are only carrying six to eight gallons of water and a food bag due to the severe drought along the East coast. An unnamed source states that the weight of sleeping bags, stoves, fuel, and clothing has been off set by a need to stay rehydrated. Stay tuned to FozNews for further updates. :D

shelterbuilder
10-27-2007, 18:59
I'm glad I asked the question when I did. Lots of good answers, I especially like the "hike early and late in the day" suggestion. I guess I could spend the middle of the day dehydrating water to carry later. :)

So, unless there are fires to hinder an AT hike, if it's a dry hike season, we'll be out there carrying food and water and precious little else.

:D This is Greta Cistern with FozNews reporting on the sightings of nekked hikers along the Appalachian Trail. The hikers are only carrying six to eight gallons of water and a food bag due to the severe drought along the East coast. An unnamed source states that the weight of sleeping bags, stoves, fuel, and clothing has been off set by a need to stay rehydrated. Stay tuned to FozNews for further updates. :D


LMAO over the news quote!!!:D :D We all will just have to wait and see what 2008 brings in terms of water supplies. Here's a thought, though: the maintaining clubs all have maintainers, ridgerunners, groups out on hikes to various locations, so why not have these folks check the water sources on a regular basis. The information could be sent to a single person to post on the club's website for general information, as well as here on WB. And if things get critical out there, maybe they can organize some "trail magic for water" at selected sites where there's no water for long stretches. (I'm talking "organized" trail magic, as opposed to "spur-of-the-moment".)

Just a thought....

wrongway_08
10-27-2007, 19:04
Not going to change my plans at all.

Chicken Feathers
11-16-2007, 21:34
Sneezer, I used dehydrated H2O for several years but have recently switched to freeze dried H2O instead. I can carry 4 liters and not even notice it's in the pack. Best thing to hit the trail since reversible underwear.

Savor Happy!
Stan
I like that suggestion carry instant water it is much lighter all you have to do is add water and wa-la you have water. :banana

Tennessee Viking
11-16-2007, 23:32
I think Al Gore is going to say "I told you so..."

HapKiDo
11-20-2007, 18:13
Al Gore has nothing to say to me. Buying off-sets is like carrying dehydrated water.

North Georgia has has a bit of rain. I haven't been out to check for any water and now have a bad cough (I have no heat in my house, so have to use the dogs to keep warm) from the weather change, so it may be another week before I venture out to the AT.

I'll let you know.:sun

HapKiDoGaMe2008

Johnny Thunder
11-20-2007, 18:25
If no water next year I'll Cyber-hike and positively OWN my Fantasy Football League.

WILLIAM HAYES
11-20-2007, 20:38
We will just have to wait and see what the rainfall level will be starting dec-march I will be carrying extra water about 4 liters. I have been out of water before (my mistake-not a problem with availability) and close to becoming dehydrated. I plan to Check availability with the trail clubs along the way and camel up whenever I can .I also will be carrying a water filter for better pumping. see you out there in March 08
Hillbilly

Kirby
11-20-2007, 20:44
It is to early to tell, it could be a strong winter and the springs could be running with snow melt, hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

Kirby