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rob123ufl
11-23-2007, 23:43
feasability of a thru-hike with just over 1500 in the pocket?

EWS
11-23-2007, 23:49
Try camping out in your parents backyard for four months. Pay for all your own food and cooking fuel, buy a new pair of shoes every month, pay to use the washing machine, pay to use the shower, and give them $20 when you want to sleep inside for the night.

Nean
11-23-2007, 23:50
feasability of a thru-hike with just over 1500 in the pocket?

Do you like pizza or beer?:eek: If you answer yes, then no, its not enough!!!! :( If you take advantage of every hiker box and already have most all your gear, perhaps.:-? YMMV:)

Flush2wice
11-23-2007, 23:58
Hike as fast as you can, no zeros in towns , zeros have to be in the woods. Don't be surprised if you burn out early because everyone else is eating restaurant food and you eat mac. Hiking the trail should be fun, if you don't have the funds I'd suggest doing a section hike instead.

rob123ufl
11-24-2007, 00:23
ok, well let's just say 1500 in my pocket at springer. this is on the very minimal end of what im expecting to have...

EWS
11-24-2007, 00:32
ok, well let's just say 1500 in my pocket at springer. this is on the very minimal end of what im expecting to have...

Seriously..

Try camping out in your parents backyard for four months. Pay for all your own food and cooking fuel, buy a new pair of shoes every month, pay to use the washing machine, pay to use the shower, and give them $20 when you want to sleep inside for the night.

If you can't manage that on 1500 bucks, you won't manage to hike on it.

rob123ufl
11-24-2007, 00:37
haha ews...i could make that work. unfortunately, i pay a lot more than that now NOT to go home. i couldnt manage the 4 months in such proximity to my parents.

Pacific Tortuga
11-24-2007, 00:38
Anything can be done. Do you have the mental moxie with the spirit of a passionate overachiever ?
The stamina to keep it going for miles and months ? Mix that together with some good old fashion luck, and you could do it.
The draw from new friends and the magic of trail towns with a Ron Haven in it has a way of drawing one into the budgeter's dark side ................ but for most, in a good way.
What do you want or need from your hike?, and go for it.

Frosty
11-24-2007, 00:39
ok, well let's just say 1500 in my pocket at springer. this is on the very minimal end of what im expecting to have...Just do the math. $1500 for a hike lasting about 150 days:

you get to spend $10 a day. You can eat on that. What you can't do is eat in retaurants or stay in motels.

Some people can do that, most can't. You will be spending about 1/3 of what most others spend on a thru-hike.

But why worry about it? Just go to Springer with your $1500 and start hiking. Either you will make it all the way or you will run out of money. EIther way you will have had a great hike for your $1500.

Hurley
11-24-2007, 00:42
You can get more then that. Gainesville is an easy town to make money in.

Frosty
11-24-2007, 00:44
haha ews...i could make that work. unfortunately, i pay a lot more than that now NOT to go home. i couldnt manage the 4 months in such proximity to my parents.I can understand that, but EWS had a good point. It is the not eating out when all you friends are that will bust your budget.

Try this instead: Don't eat out or take out between now and March 1. If you can manage that, you can manage your thruhike on $1500. But here is the beauty. If you don't eat out or take out between now and then, you will have MORE than $1500, maybe even $2000. You still won't be able to eat in restaurants or stay in motels, but your odds of making it all the way will be much higher.

rob123ufl
11-24-2007, 01:07
You can get more then that. Gainesville is an easy town to make money in.

how do i do it, hurley?

vaporjourney
11-24-2007, 01:11
Anything can be done. Do you have the mental moxie with the spirit of a passionate overachiever ?
The stamina to keep it going for miles and months ? Mix that together with some good old fashion luck, and you could do it.
The draw from new friends and the magic of trail towns with a Ron Haven in it has a way of drawing one into the budgeter's dark side ................ but for most, in a good way.
What do you want or need from your hike?, and go for it.

Good points. I definitely think that a hike could be done for 1500, and not a rushed hike at that. You could enjoy yourself, take some time, but not indulging in too much. I hiked with a friend this year who did it in under 2,000, and he went out to eat with us from time to time, just didn't drink. Just don't expect to replace gear with expensive lightweight stuff if you got the urge, and eat really really cheep food like mac n cheese, ramen, and mashed potatoes. don't let anyone tell you that you can't do it enjoyably...it just takes a bit of discipline.

shoe
11-24-2007, 01:17
I'll be finding out come April. I will have about 2000 bucks give or take, Hopefully more. I plan on hiking until the money runs out but I do plan to be somewhat frugal. We'll see how it goes.

L Tee
11-24-2007, 02:18
rob, two things. where are you in gville? im staying at my good friends house right next to the hillel house. wouldnt might meeting up and talking about the trail tomm before the game. im going sobo but it could still be an interesting chat. and also, im with whoever said start the hike with whatever money you have, if you cant finish, then ask for money. if that doesnt work, then at least you tried, thats a lot more than most people can say. and withe the 1500 you will meet your goal of losing the weight you want. that could stretch out almost half way even if you didnt spend conservatively. pm me if you want to chat about the trail this weekend.

pitdog
11-24-2007, 12:33
If you really want wilderness and not a party scene.Thru hiking can be done with little money.One has to be a smart shopper and already have their gear ready.Also,there are a few places one can work along the trail.I thru hiker on 2000.

Just a Hiker
11-24-2007, 12:40
The trail can be done for $1,500.00, but it will be difficult for the all of the reasons already mentioned. Weathercarrot has a great article here on "low budget" hiking, but it takes discipline. If you do in fact set out on a thru-hike with $1,500.00, make sure you don't over-spend on the southern half of the AT, because when you get into New England, hiking gets expensive. But if you want to hike the trail bad enough, then go for it!!:D


Just Jim

Lilred
11-24-2007, 12:42
good luck rob, I agree with those that say just start at Springer and go till the money runs out. You may be able to get work-for-stay at some hostels. Just don't turn into a moocher and you'll be ok. Hiker boxes are a good resource for saving money on food. That's what they're there for. You also might be able to pick up work in trail towns as you go. I know one thing. If you do start out with only $1500 and make it all the way, people will want to know how you did it, so keep track of stuff and report back here. Keep us posted.

superman
11-24-2007, 14:01
feasability of a thru-hike with just over 1500 in the pocket?

You'll have a lot more fun if you bring three times that amount. You can do life the hard way or the easy way. From my experience the hard way is not all that much fun. Do what you have to to earn more money and save it for your hike.

ScottP
11-24-2007, 14:51
Get a job

pitdog
11-24-2007, 15:00
Great advice,with all of the hiking done,I wonder how much work one does.Mommy boys.

Hurley
11-24-2007, 15:09
how do i do it, hurley?

You live in a college town. Just like Tallahassee, everyone is going to be quitting thier jobs all this month and next month so they can go home for winter break. There are tons of restaraunts there, and waiting tables is easy, at least for me. If you apply for a job, tell them you'll be willing to work over the holiday and you will more then likely get hired on the spot.

If you rent a house or an apt, have smeone sublease your room. I live in my kitchen now on a futon, and pay 50 bucks a month to my roommates. Sell things you don't need on ebay or to friends. I'm selling my macbook, ipod, an old bass guitar, two snare drums, and an amp. I won't need any of that stuff when I'm gone.

solace
11-24-2007, 15:11
Tortuga has an excellent point.. the "mental moxie"... YES, you can do a THRU w/ 1500, (providing you have ALL your gear), but as others have stated, you do give up some trail life... while in towns.. grabbing that pizza, a cold 6 pack, ect. Remember, on the AT, that coming into to town is always like High School on a Friday Night! CRAZY FUN! And no dout funds are spent.
My Twin KTR did a Spring to Damascus on $280 last year... he raided hiker boxes a plenty and did not eat at restaurants... I would go w/ 2000 min, but if its 1500... tehn still.. GO! (A section hike may be more enjoyable financially) But if your dream is to attempt a THRU... Well then... "life is short".. go for it!

SOLACE

Spirit Walker
11-24-2007, 19:53
One thing about hiker boxes - they can be used to supplement your food supply, but don't count on them to provide your food supply. We had a couple in 1992 who hitched ahead to some of the hostels and emptied out the hiker boxes. 1 - they were not very popular and 2 - those of us who were hoping to supplement our food supply were sorely disappointed.

At the beginning of the trail the boxes were pretty full - but most of the food was hardly worth having: lots of long cooking rice, beans and grains. As people learned that those foods were not feasible for a long hike, they left them behind in towns. After a while, they asked their families to stop sending them to the trail. After Virginia, there were fewer boxes and very little in the boxes we found. You aren't going to find much of interest, just lots of ramen, instant oatmeal and unidentifiable grains in unmarked bags. No cookies or chocolate!

IOW - they're a bonus, not a mainstay to your diet.

weary
11-24-2007, 23:18
The trail can be done for $1,500.00, but it will be difficult for the all of the reasons already mentioned. Weathercarrot has a great article here on "low budget" hiking, but it takes discipline. If you do in fact set out on a thru-hike with $1,500.00, make sure you don't over-spend on the southern half of the AT, because when you get into New England, hiking gets expensive. But if you want to hike the trail bad enough, then go for it!!:D

Just Jim
And Weathercarrot doesn't really get into saving on food costs. The Lipton dinners and such are essentially flavored pasta and rice and oatmeal. Packaged stuff with the spices added typically cost $4 a pound. Add your own salt and pepper and a few spices and you can do the same for a bit more than a dollar a pound.

My wife and I don't skimp. But we manage to eat healthily for far less than $20 a day for the two of us. Nor, as someone suggested, do you need a new pair of boots every month. I started with a pair of boots that I had worn for three or four years. I replaced them most of the way through Virginia and continued to wear the replacements for another five years.

You can't do that wearing $100+ glorified sneakers. But most any sturdy workman's boots will last a thru hike and more. None of the pioneer thru hikers used 4 or 5 pairs of boots. Sure, disposable boots, have their advantages. But they did okay for thousands of early thru hikers before disposable boots were invented.

Nor is it necessary to do without all town luxuries. Just limit town stops. I planned to resupply every six days. Today hikers tend to head to town every 2 or 3 days. Sure it makes for a lighter pack. But thousands hiked the trail before the temptation of town stops were possible.

Weary

EWS
11-24-2007, 23:55
You live in a college town. Just like Tallahassee, everyone is going to be quitting thier jobs all this month and next month so they can go home for winter break. There are tons of restaraunts there, and waiting tables is easy, at least for me. If you apply for a job, tell them you'll be willing to work over the holiday and you will more then likely get hired on the spot.

If you rent a house or an apt, have smeone sublease your room. I live in my kitchen now on a futon, and pay 50 bucks a month to my roommates. Sell things you don't need on ebay or to friends. I'm selling my macbook, ipod, an old bass guitar, two snare drums, and an amp. I won't need any of that stuff when I'm gone.

Excellent advice and an outstanding effort to achieve your dreams. I'll buy you beer if the opportunity arises next year. I already owe Cannibal from down there a t least a few.

You either want it or you don't.

Rob if you're not willing to go to the extent of Hurley, you got to wonder if this is just something you're half-assing and if you're just looking for pity.

Tipi Walter
11-25-2007, 00:01
In the old days, most thru-hikers were dirt poor by today's standards. They carried good gear that was low cost(new Kelty D4: $29), and many started out with a few hundred bucks. They did a few things differently. For one, they took fewer spending town trips with motel rooms,etc., and stayed out on the trail longer without so many "zero" town days. They also saved money on their food choices by cooking longer meals using nutritious but longer cooking foods(beans/rice/bulk oatmeal). They weren't afraid to carry 2 or 3 Sigg bottles of fuel and were prepared to, like I said, spend more time at the stove cooking up raw bulk rice, lentils and other cheap foods.

It's possible even today to live out of a backpack on a long trail and still be dirt poor. But see, the ultralight fanaticism works against it. In the old days it wasn't uncommon for backpackers to carry 2 or 3 large cans of Dinty Moore stew, or spring for a 5 pound bag of rice and a 5 pound bag of beans and carry this supply for several weeks. It also wasn't too unusual for guys to hit the grocery store dumpsters in town(used to be a treasure trove of tossed food), and to augment their diets with common weeds(violet greens, chickweed, lambsquarters, dandelion, burdock roots, etc).

Today such practices sounds like neanderthal throw-backs from the stone age, but a lot of guys wanted to hike the trail with a backpack on their backs and didn't give a whole lot of thought to cash flow.

Hurley
11-25-2007, 01:06
Excellent advice and an outstanding effort to achieve your dreams. I'll buy you beer if the opportunity arises next year. I already owe Cannibal from down there a t least a few.

You either want it or you don't.

Rob if you're not willing to go to the extent of Hurley, you got to wonder if this is just something you're half-assing and if you're just looking for pity.

Wow man, I really appreciate that. I'll be headed out early March if you want to get me that beer:banana .

I've had to give up alot to do this, but will also be gaining so much from it. It's completely up to you on how hard you want to work for it. I'll be working at a restaurant 40+ hours a week plus another job running the counter at a friends pizza place for min wage. Hopefully getting enough money for the thru to be comfortable, plus enough to cover a bit when I get done to chill for a month or two.

Use your resources as best you can. Anything is possible. It's only money.

rob123ufl
11-25-2007, 02:27
Rob if you're not willing to go to the extent of Hurley, you got to wonder if this is just something you're half-assing and if you're just looking for pity.

Thanks for the tips gentlemen and ladies...much like hurley, im currently balancing a 15 credit semester with a 30+ hour work week. unforunately i signed a year-long lease for 480 a month. im gonna sublease and live on someones couch for a few months come january. ill take next semester off, get a night job and try and get some serious money in my pocket... but don't get me wrong people, im not trying to half-ass this, unfortunately im just stuck with some inconveniant financial obligations.

anyways, if you make it down to gainesville, hit me up and i maybe can swing a beer or two for some fellow thru-hikers.

Hurley
11-25-2007, 03:06
Make it happen man, I look forward to seeing another Floridian come March.

EWS
11-25-2007, 03:59
It sounds like you have more a plan that you let on. I would guess that you'll be able to save a bit more than $1500 with your plan.

CoyoteWhips
11-25-2007, 05:04
Apparently on the AT, as everywhere else, sucks to be poor.

However, hard to imagine a modern day Grandma Gatewood saying, "I took $4,000 from the coffee tin. I'm going out for a walk. Don't wait up."

In my vastly inexperienced opinion -- just throwing out some ideas -- going on the cheap, I would work on being a hobo stove expert. Using sticks for fuel, you'd have those long simmer times for beans and stews.

If you don't have the funds for restaurant food, the skills and resources to make real food on the trail will make the first couple of days out of town a treat without denting your funds too much. Otherwise, trying to live on candy bars, noodles and salt will burn you out in a month.

In a variation of what EWS keeps saying, don't wait until you're on the trail to become an expert at hobo life. Start practicing now.

Ya know, some people hike barefoot.

CaseyB
11-25-2007, 05:50
feasability of a thru-hike with just over 1500 in the pocket?
'cmon, nobody is that responsible w/ money. You won't make it, dude, but that's OK. Just walk until you run outta money. Have Fun, hike, love & learn life but quit caring about getting to ME. Do an epic trip until You run out of money and you will be cooler than any so-called 'thru' hiker you meet.

Tipi Walter
11-25-2007, 10:37
Apparently on the AT, as everywhere else, sucks to be poor.

However, hard to imagine a modern day Grandma Gatewood saying, "I took $4,000 from the coffee tin. I'm going out for a walk. Don't wait up."

In my vastly inexperienced opinion -- just throwing out some ideas -- going on the cheap, I would work on being a hobo stove expert. Using sticks for fuel, you'd have those long simmer times for beans and stews.

If you don't have the funds for restaurant food, the skills and resources to make real food on the trail will make the first couple of days out of town a treat without denting your funds too much. Otherwise, trying to live on candy bars, noodles and salt will burn you out in a month.

In a variation of what EWS keeps saying, don't wait until you're on the trail to become an expert at hobo life. Start practicing now.

Ya know, some people hike barefoot.

"Hallelujah I'm a bum!
Hallelujah, bum again!"

Back in the '50s my Dad used to sing this little song ditty to me at random times. Must've been a popular tune waaaay back. Me being at such a tender age, I think it and it alone is what got me living out like a hobo(a hobo with high tech gear).

EWS
11-25-2007, 10:50
"Hallelujah I'm a bum!
Hallelujah, bum again!"
I like it.

The less crap you have/own the better. My "international traveling kit" is a old BD 17L Bullet, an extra shirt, a pair of pants or shorts depending on which one I'm wearing, a pair of smartwool socks, a cheap rain jacket, a weird poly covered space blanket that I can't lose, pack towel, toothbrush, tooth paste, and nail clippers. Replace junk as necessary and no worries if it goes missing.

Now if I could just get that damn boat sold, nothing else has ever made me feel so tied down.

superman
11-25-2007, 10:51
"Hallelujah I'm a bum!
Hallelujah, bum again!"

Back in the '50s my Dad used to sing this little song ditty to me at random times. Must've been a popular tune waaaay back. Me being at such a tender age, I think it and it alone is what got me living out like a hobo(a hobo with high tech gear).

I also remembered hearing that song way back when. So I googled it and found this.http: //www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/parton/2/bum.html

superman
11-25-2007, 11:12
I like it.

The less crap you have/own the better. My "international traveling kit" is a old BD 17L Bullet, an extra shirt, a pair of pants or shorts depending on which one I'm wearing, a pair of smartwool socks, a cheap rain jacket, a weird poly covered space blanket that I can't lose, pack towel, toothbrush, tooth paste, and nail clippers. Replace junk as necessary and no worries if it goes missing.

Now if I could just get that damn boat sold, nothing else has ever made me feel so tied down.

A few years ago I had a 18' Renken with a 305 GMC engine. I got tired of looking at the "for sale" sign. One day I was out jogging by the town boat ramp and two young guys were pulling a little fishing boat out of the water. Their boat barely held all their gear. So I said "want a bigger boat?" One of them said "how much?" I said "no charge." I pulled the boat to its new home and before I left they asked me why I was doing it. I told them that "a boat is a hole in the water that you throw money into." They were so young that they hadn't heard that before. The two canoes that I have now have given me a lot more pleasure than the Renken ever did.

EWS
11-25-2007, 11:47
I've thrown so much money into the thing I want to get half of it back. But the thought of sinking the damn thing gives me some sick pleasure, knowing that I won't have to go find a decent broker and can quit paying marina fees.

My boat (http://www.spenceryachts.net/31.htm#ZULA)

superman
11-25-2007, 12:12
I've thrown so much money into the thing I want to get half of it back. But the thought of sinking the damn thing gives me some sick pleasure, knowing that I won't have to go find a decent broker and can quit paying marina fees.

My boat (http://www.spenceryachts.net/31.htm#ZULA)

Yes, I see it clearly now. It's kind of like an ex. She looked so good when you bought her but then the world changed. The final stage includes thoughts of "what was I thinking?" Or....how many holes in her bottom will end it? Another thought is that if you don't have to spend money on her you will have a big pile of bucks. Unfortunately that is like quitting smoking. Both are good thing to put an end to but there is no big pile of bucks after the deed is done. The money is just spent on the next bad choice. Take heart in knowing that as good as she looks... you know what she is realy like.:)

EWS
11-25-2007, 12:26
Yes, I see it clearly now. It's kind of like an ex. She looked so good when you bought her but then the world changed. The final stage includes thoughts of "what was I thinking?" Or....how many holes in her bottom will end it? Another thought is that if you don't have to spend money on her you will have a big pile of bucks. Unfortunately that is like quitting smoking. Both are good thing to put an end to but there is no big pile of bucks after the deed is done. The money is just spent on the next bad choice. Take heart in knowing that as good as she looks... you know what she is realy like.:)

She actually is quite lovely and tough as nails. I hit 13 knots with only 23ft of water line, way over hull speed, on edge of a hurricane, and she was happy as could be. There are no "hidden" problems, as everything is all hand fitted so there is no liner to cover anything up. I'm going to put another $2k into her and then she will be practically new. But yeah, scuttling it would be a relief.

What in the hell was I thinking though!?! I need a house, that's it. I'll teach SCUBA off of it and make some cash. Well, I don't want a house, and don't like pain in the ass guests.

Now, I have a somewhere to run to away to, can easily stay on the move and teach SCUBA as I go, and that's not good, cause I like being a bum.:o

Skyline
11-25-2007, 12:53
Rob,

You're 20 years old and this is your first attempt at an AT thru-hike. You don't say, but it could be your first long distance hike--period.

Expecting you to hike with the frugality of Weathercarrot--who I very much admire--is not realistic. He's had half a lifetime and multiple thrus on various trails to hone his skills and compose his very wise advice.

In all likelihood, you will gravitate toward others close to your age. Unless you are the exception, you will want to stick with your new trail buds. They will almost certainly not be going as frugally as you must. You will have to make hard decisions constantly: Hike on and camp in the woods and possibly never see my friends again, or hitch into town and be with my friends who are headed that way? Not a pleasant choice to have to continually make, since the AT is such a social place.

If you can raise some more funds before you hit the trail, you won't have to make those choices. At least not as often. Or, you could set your goal at doing half the trail (or two-thirds, whatever is realistic) this year and the rest another year. Nothing wrong at all with doing that.

Or, you could be such an introvert that you will avoid most people out there heading north, and none of the above will apply to you. Or, you could be focused like a laser beam on reaching Katahdin and nothing else will matter. Then you might not suffer from separation anxiety when you part company from your trail family.

Others' advice here is almost all good. Somehow you will come up with the right balance that works for you.

Lone Wolf
11-25-2007, 13:01
feasability of a thru-hike with just over 1500 in the pocket?

not very likely. unless you're anti-social. i wouldn't attempt it for less than $3000. this might be your first and only shot at it. come up with the $$$ or wait another year. what's the rush? you're just 20

weary
11-25-2007, 13:22
A few years ago I had a 18' Renken with a 305 GMC engine. I got tired of looking at the "for sale" sign. One day I was out jogging by the town boat ramp and two young guys were pulling a little fishing boat out of the water. Their boat barely held all their gear. So I said "want a bigger boat?" One of them said "how much?" I said "no charge." I pulled the boat to its new home and before I left they asked me why I was doing it. I told them that "a boat is a hole in the water that you throw money into." They were so young that they hadn't heard that before. The two canoes that I have now have given me a lot more pleasure than the Renken ever did.
I drive my cars for 200,000, sometimes 300,000 miles. When I finally need a replacement, I just park them in the yard. Sooner or later a couple of kids will come by and offer to buy them. I tell 'em to just take them away. It always works -- usually they arrive about the same time the town codes officer appears to tell me that inoperable cars violate some code or other.

Weary

superman
11-25-2007, 14:10
I drive my cars for 200,000, sometimes 300,000 miles. When I finally need a replacement, I just park them in the yard. Sooner or later a couple of kids will come by and offer to buy them. I tell 'em to just take them away. It always works -- usually they arrive about the same time the town codes officer appears to tell me that inoperable cars violate some code or other.

Weary

The Renken wasn't a junk. I just got tired of throwing money at something that I didn't use enough. It seemed like a good idea when I bought it but boat costs just keep on coming whether you use it or not.
I think they are paying about $100 for junk cars these days.

kayak karl
11-25-2007, 14:12
I can understand that, but EWS had a good point. It is the not eating out when all you friends are that will bust your budget.

Try this instead: Don't eat out or take out between now and March 1. If you can manage that, you can manage your thruhike on $1500.

Good advice. ive started eating the same foods that i would eat on the trail. im even cooking it in a pot with a cat stove. Can even poach eggs, steam vegtables and cook a cranberry loaf (small). Keeping track of calories and protien intake. and yes, saving money doing it:). Its not my purpose to save money, but at 52 i dont deal with food changes that well:D

mudhead
11-25-2007, 18:41
13 is cranking. You aren't stretching are you?

Go get some salt on you, before you dump it...

EWS
11-25-2007, 22:57
It was exhausting, but thrilling. The autopilot couldn't keep up, I didn't have the windvane, but I fortunately had two crew, though one was inexperienced. It was a combination of heavy winds (storm jib and all the reefs), currents heading the right way, but mainly surfing. Thirteen was registered on the GPS and we hit 11 a couple of times that night too. I eventually dropped the main and just ran with the storm jib, which took some fun out of it, but allowed people to sleep. It was one of the guys first time on a sailboat, he helped me pull the tranny and rebuilt it, in trade to go sailing. I felt kind of bad, cause he said he'd never sail again.

I'm heading back down next spring before I walk.

JAK
11-25-2007, 23:17
I say it can be done for $1500, and it would be a very worthy thing to do. It can probably be done for much less, without being a burden on anyone. In fact, the less you spend the less of a burden you are really, most of the time, when you think about it. Thrift, frugality, humility, even honest poverty, these things still are virtues. Whether or not we can actually achieve them, or pass them by for our own vanity during our time on Earth is between us and our maker. We don't know unless we try, and even then we don't know until we are tried. For what are virtue and vanity to the man in the mirror, when it is the grace of the maker that matters in the end? Life is a trial. Life is also a gift.

The Road to Damascus was never meant to be paved in pizza and beer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRb8KKyenSY&feature=related

Nightwalker
11-25-2007, 23:42
In the old days, most thru-hikers were dirt poor by today's standards...

Good points, Walter, as usual.

I hike really cheap and I don't feel that I suffer by doing so. My per-day meal costs are around 5 bucks, with good tasting, calorie-dense food. It can be done cheaper, but this is a decent amount.

I eat 4 packs of store-brand, flavored instant oatmeal for breakfast, along with a 2-bag mug of tea. I snack on Little Debbie snacks every hour or two. I sometimes do Ramen for lunch. I have a second mug of tea in the afternoon, again snacking on various LDs throughout the day. I have a Lipton's side and tuna in the evening.

The Little Debbie's brownies and oatmeal pies are 1.19 or so for 1 dozen. A dozen of each will last me for 3-4 days, according to the miles per day. They are calorie heavy and taste good when you're hungry. I switch around to other flavors when I get tired of those two, but always come back to them because of the calorie density and my taste preferences. Ingle's and Wal-Mart instant oatmeal in many different flavors costs 1.50 or so for 10 packs. I vary my flavors a lot and I don't get tired of them, even though some folks do. The Lipton's and tuna is the expensive part of the day, usually around 3 bucks for the pair. Things are higher in the North, but not as high as all that, at least in ME.

My best advice is to chow down at McDonald's before you grocery. you can get a lot for a little there, and 2 or 3 double cheeseburgers will keep you from splurging when you get to the store to do the groceries. In the South, those are a buck apiece, but I've never hit a McD's up North near the trail, so I'm not sure if the price holds up there. I do know that restaurants are higher in general up North, but what can you do, you know? It does seem that I went into a McDonald's in NYC near the bus station, and they had the dollar menu there, so maybe they do that all over. You can really rack up some calories there for 5 bucks!

Tipi Walter
11-25-2007, 23:56
The whole point of living out, whether on the AT or just living out of a backpack in area forests, is to my mind the ability and willingness(and the challenge)to see how little money is needed on a long term basis. When you look at a backpacker's life, it's not too far removed from common spiritual thought(think ye not of what you'll eat or where you'll sleep/give up everything and follow Me/look at the lilies in the field-sow/reap, etc). A backpacker can be in a unique social position: No rent, no car, no water bills, no electric bills, and if not burdened with children and career, people can spend years living out in one form or another.

I've heard of trail bums living on or near the AT for years, augmenting cash flow with periodic work while still living out. In fact, it isn't so hard to find part-time work while still stealth camping close to the work site. I could give a few solid examples from personal experience but what's the point? Nowadays there seems to be a strong cultural class-correctness, nobody wants to be a bum anymore, there's too much pressure from parents and friends to seem to be successful or productive.

Meanwhile the forest and the waterfalls could care less about a person's success or cash flow or class hierarchy. The call of the wild will determine a person's priorities.

stranger
11-26-2007, 00:07
I think sometimes we have the ability to fool ourselves into thinking whatever we need to think in order to get what we want...initially atleast.

In 1994 I met heaps of AT thru-hikers on my Long Trail thru-hike, in 1995 I spent two months on the AT and in 2001 I spent about 38 days on the trail. I cannot think of a single hiker I met who wasn't concerned about money, and most of them had much more than $1500 at the start.

Yes, the AT can be hiked on $1500 if you are very disciplined and move down the trail quite quickly, but realistically many hikers would spend that much before getting to Harpers Ferry. Of course there are the exceptions, and if you are that confident that you are the exception, then go for it. If not, then 2009 will do just fine.

JAK
11-26-2007, 00:07
I don't agree with eating at McDonald's as a means of finding thrift, though I do I do declare, there were times when I was so lonesome I took some comfort there. Generally speaking your common grocery store, and your whole grain cerials plus some things to compliment them would be your best option. Less processed and packaged the better usually. Fresh local can also be cheap and very healthy when in season. Those are bargains to watch for, but the common grocery store is what you may need to depend on mostly.

Back in my undergrad days my usual supper was spaghetti with butter and green peas. It tastes just as good now as it did then. Breakfast was Shredded Wheat, Whole Milk, and Honey. I would also hard boil an egg to carry in my pocket as a hand warmer, then eat it for lunch. Fredericton can be very cold in winter, like many college towns, but life was good. Since then I have wasted an incredible amount of time and money in my life, and gained a lot of weight while doing so. My most frugal years were my best. My suggestion is that if you are going to invest 4-6 months of your life hiking the AT, don't waste it on a life of excess. You can do that the rest of your life.

EWS
11-26-2007, 00:17
The whole point of living out, whether on the AT or just living out of a backpack in area forests, is to my mind the ability and willingness(and the challenge)to see how little money is needed on a long term basis................ A backpacker can be in a unique social position: No rent, no car, no water bills, no electric bills, and if not burdened with children and career, people can spend years living out in one form or another.

........... Nowadays there seems to be a strong cultural class-correctness, nobody wants to be a bum anymore, there's too much pressure from parents and friends to seem to be successful or productive.

Meanwhile the forest and the waterfalls could care less about a person's success or cash flow or class hierarchy. The call of the wild will determine a person's priorities.

Excellent advice Walter.

Though, I feel that it is important to have a cushion to fall back on, for my sake of mind.

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 00:25
[quote=JAK;455576]I don't agree with eating at McDonald's as a means of finding thrift, though I do I do declare, there were times when I was so lonesome I took some comfort there. Generally speaking your common grocery store, and your whole grain cerials plus some things to compliment them would be your best option. Less processed and packaged the better usually. Fresh local can also be cheap and very healthy when in season. Those are bargains to watch for, but the common grocery store is what you may need to depend on mostly.

In the clearing stands a boxer and a fighter by his trade
And he carries the reminders of every glove that laid him out
Or cuffed him till he cried out in his anger and his shame
I am leaving! I am leaving!
But the fighter still remains . . .

Appalachian Tater
11-26-2007, 00:25
The whole point of living out, whether on the AT or just living out of a backpack in area forests, is to my mind the ability and willingness(and the challenge)to see how little money is needed on a long term basis. When you look at a backpacker's life, it's not too far removed from common spiritual thought(think ye not of what you'll eat or where you'll sleep/give up everything and follow Me/look at the lilies in the field-sow/reap, etc). A backpacker can be in a unique social position: No rent, no car, no water bills, no electric bills, and if not burdened with children and career, people can spend years living out in one form or another.

I've heard of trail bums living on or near the AT for years, augmenting cash flow with periodic work while still living out. In fact, it isn't so hard to find part-time work while still stealth camping close to the work site. I could give a few solid examples from personal experience but what's the point? Nowadays there seems to be a strong cultural class-correctness, nobody wants to be a bum anymore, there's too much pressure from parents and friends to seem to be successful or productive.

Meanwhile the forest and the waterfalls could care less about a person's success or cash flow or class hierarchy. The call of the wild will determine a person's priorities.

I agree with you 100% but when you pull into town after a week on the trail and it's cold and wet it's like,
"Screw Thoreau, I want a hotel room with a hot shower and a one-pound burger and half a pizza and a pint of coffee ice cream and a half-gallon of orange juice and a half-gallon of chocolate milk."

JAK
11-26-2007, 00:38
I agree you should have a cushion to fall back on before you start, and the self-discipline not to do so unless it was neccessary. For a young single person without a car this might be as little as one months income. That's the falling back on part, enough to get started agin once you finish or, or stop. As for the hike itself, assuming no other costs, like storage fees or rent due to annual lease or student loans or something like that, I think this should be mostly grocery food money if you are hiking really cheap, and I think something as low as $0.50 per mile, plus another $1000 to fall back on when your done or its time to bail out. Not for everyone of course, but when I was young and sailing competitively it was mostly food and gas and regatta entrance fees we spent our money on. We were usually allowed to sleep on the beach back then. We were basically vagrants with boats. I know it is different today. Everything seems to have to be a dang industry today, at least until the bubble bursts. Then perhaps we can live normal again.

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 00:49
I agree you should have a cushion to fall back on before you start, and the self-discipline not to do so unless it was neccessary. For a young single person without a car this might be as little as one months income. That's the falling back on part, enough to get started agin once you finish or, or stop. As for the hike itself, assuming no other costs, like storage fees or rent due to annual lease or student loans or something like that, I think this should be mostly grocery food money if you are hiking really cheap, and I think something as low as $0.50 per mile, plus another $1000 to fall back on when your done or its time to bail out. Not for everyone of course, but when I was young and sailing competitively it was mostly food and gas and regatta entrance fees we spent our money on. We were usually allowed to sleep on the beach back then. We were basically vagrants with boats. I know it is different today. Everything seems to have to be a dang industry today, at least until the bubble bursts. Then perhaps we can live normal again.

Hey. "NYLON VAGRANTS" That could be the new title to my backpacking book . . .:)

Tinker
11-26-2007, 03:26
Try camping out in your parents backyard for four months. Pay for all your own food and cooking fuel, buy a new pair of shoes every month, pay to use the washing machine, pay to use the shower, and give them $20 when you want to sleep inside for the night.

That's one of the best answers I've ever heard!

I agree. A dollar a mile is probably not enough anymore. I wouldn't want to start with less than three grand. When I retire, if I'm still in good enough shape to hike, I'll probably need 5-6 thousand.:(

Tinker
11-26-2007, 03:27
I should have said "Even a dollar a mile - since the trail is over 2,000 mi.

JAK
11-26-2007, 03:39
Could I camp out in my wife's backyard instead?
But then where would I go when I get in trouble?

CoyoteWhips
11-26-2007, 08:19
I love this thread! Experienced opinions on both sides seem to show that it's mostly a matter of perception -- the greatest single barrier to the $1500 through-hike is the lure of pizza and hot showers.

At this point, it's almost a challenge. Could a modern day Merton approach the AT as a pilgrimage, walking it mindful of the spiritual experience and shunning the lure of civilized comforts?

I'd read that book.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 09:10
-- the greatest single barrier to the $1500 through-hike is the lure of pizza and hot showers.
...and hostels, shuttles, motels, buffets, beer...

JAK
11-26-2007, 09:13
I take it you don't mean the Merton of the Black–Scholes model. :)

So what is this book and how much will it set me back? ;)
Will my old copy of Canterbury Tales work just as well? :p

JAK
11-26-2007, 09:18
One way to save on beer might be to ferment some mead as you hike along.
You would be pretty much guaranteed to drink moderately, that's for sure.

CoyoteWhips
11-26-2007, 09:36
I take it you don't mean the Merton of the Black–Scholes model. :)

So what is this book and how much will it set me back? ;)
Will my old copy of Canterbury Tales work just as well? :p

Thomas Merton (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Merton); a monk with a talent for writing. Little easier read than olde eynglish.

I've been impressed by Buddhist pilgrims who travel with a spare robe, begging bowl and umbrella, but they often have a monastery shelter within walking distance, so it might not be quite as austere as it sounds.

I'll bet if you made a good effort at the spiritual experience, well meaning people would occasionally buy you pizza.

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 09:39
I love this thread! Experienced opinions on both sides seem to show that it's mostly a matter of perception -- the greatest single barrier to the $1500 through-hike is the lure of pizza and hot showers.

At this point, it's almost a challenge. Could a modern day Merton approach the AT as a pilgrimage, walking it mindful of the spiritual experience and shunning the lure of civilized comforts?

I'd read that book.

It has already been written. The book, "THE WAY OF THE PILGRIM" opens with these lines:

"By the Grace of God I am a Church man, by my actions a great sinner, and by calling a homeless wanderer of the humblest birth who roams from place to place. My worldly goods are a knapsack with some dried bread in it on my back, and in my breast-pocket a Bible. And that is all."

CoyoteWhips
11-26-2007, 09:44
...and hostels, shuttles, motels, buffets, beer...

How is it we're the same age and you're so much more grizzled than I am?

I never quite got the hang of grizzled.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 09:48
How is it we're the same age and you're so much more grizzled than I am?

I never quite got the hang of grizzled.

well i ain't got no job where i gotta look good plus all the other moonshiners around here look like me

Flush2wice
11-26-2007, 09:52
I think kidneys go for about 5 grand these days.

dessertrat
11-26-2007, 09:54
Try camping out in your parents backyard for four months. Pay for all your own food and cooking fuel, buy a new pair of shoes every month, pay to use the washing machine, pay to use the shower, and give them $20 when you want to sleep inside for the night.

Take everything you can from the hiker boxes whether you like it or not, and no matter how much it weighs, use a wood burning stove, such as a Sierra, or the fire rings at shelters, wash your clothes by hand with creek water and camp soap, wash yourself likewise, and never stay at a hotel.

You will be buying only food-- certainly can be done. Not as much fun, perhaps, if you are a socialite, but consider how often did Earl Shaffer stay at hotels or stop for pizza and beer?

Johnny Swank
11-26-2007, 10:07
I put up something awhile back called "Thruhiking on the Cheap"
http://sourcetosea.net/Articles/articles/thru-hiking-cheap.html

The link may change soon, but you'll always be able to get it through http://sourcetosea.net somewhere


$1500 ain't a whole lot of money for a thru-hike. It can be done, but it'll take more discipline than most hikers have. I'd say start later in the season, no earlier than April 15th, to take advantage of the potentially warmer weather for starters. Getting stuck in Hiawassee for 4 days in March is a easy way to blow your budget before you get out of the gate.

Learn to cook on a fire, and you can cook all kinds of cheap, healthy foods that need more simmering time. Augment that with a few quick meals for when the weather's crappy. Skip as many towns as possible, and plan to stay out for 5-7 days at a time. I actually enjoy taking a zero in the woods near a cool creek every now and again to wash up, chill, do laundry, etc.

EWS
11-26-2007, 10:10
Take everything you can from the hiker boxes whether you like it or not, and no matter how much it weighs, use a wood burning stove, such as a Sierra, or the fire rings at shelters, wash your clothes by hand with creek water and camp soap, wash yourself likewise, and never stay at a hotel.


Good advice, though knowing don't have to depend on free food finds should make world of difference in your feeling of well being.

Rice and beans are cheap, and a lot of the world lives off of them. With a wood stove you'll have no worries about long cooking times. I'd just use a hobo coffee can stove and replace as necessary, they're lighter than Sierra stove and free. The most important thing is knowing how to build a fire though.

To do you laundry, get a detergent bar, like a bar of soap but detergent, find a big flat rock in the water, wet your clothes, wipe 'em with the detergent bar, then scrub and beat the hell out of them on that rock, and rinse. You can use camp soap, but it'll take more work to get them clean looking.

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 10:26
Take everything you can from the hiker boxes whether you like it or not, and no matter how much it weighs, use a wood burning stove, such as a Sierra, or the fire rings at shelters, wash your clothes by hand with creek water and camp soap, wash yourself likewise, and never stay at a hotel.

You will be buying only food-- certainly can be done. Not as much fun, perhaps, if you are a socialite, but consider how often did Earl Shaffer stay at hotels or stop for pizza and beer?

Yeah, that was sort of my earlier point. Many of the old timers who walked the AT, while maybe not poor, did not have the funds(or the inflation)so common today. I know examples of guys living out of their backpacks with just a $40 a month budget. It's called poverty consciousness, being thrifty, don't-spend-it-yet, forget about shopping, etc. A certain mindset. It's a survival mindset. And it's not hard to get. Anyway, the whole point of a city is to separate a man from his money.:)

The rice and bean solution is cheap, whether it's cooked on an open fire, a zip stove or a white gas simmer machine(Svea comes to mind). With a little salt a big pot of lentils and rice can go a long way, especially when augmented with some cheese/cream cheese and a couple handfuls of wild edibles. And let's not forget the HUMBLE OAT! A five pound bag of oatmeal is the near perfect food, has a short cooking time(or no time), and mixes well with wild greens/cheese/black walnuts(which can sometimes be found on the trail)or raisins. The laundry problem is really not a problem as the amount of clothing that needs to be washed is tiny and only needs to be done once every 3 to 4 weeks.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 10:28
and back in the day there weren't dozens of hostels, motels, shuttle services, buffets, outfitters, etc. to suck $$$ out of you

EWS
11-26-2007, 10:32
Buckwheat and Rice is a good cheap combo too.

EWS
11-26-2007, 10:35
and back in the day there weren't dozens of hostels, motels, shuttle services, buffets, outfitters, etc. to suck $$$ out of you Walk the Highlands of Central America. It is gorgeous and it is hard to spend your money. Quite a few people though, but they're poor, and since you're walking they generally think you are poor too.

Chaco Taco
11-26-2007, 11:04
Great site Johnny. Im leaving March 09 and am crunching everything now. Im trying to fight the temptations of luxuries and live as simple as possible to train my mind so I dont give in. I know there will slip ups and times I will say "screw it" and go to town. Im shooting for $3000- $3500. I have my gear and am modifying it and have some weekenders planned. I feel like a year and 3 months will be ample time to prep. Again, thanks for site, its great.


I put up something awhile back called "Thruhiking on the Cheap"
http://sourcetosea.net/Articles/articles/thru-hiking-cheap.html

The link may change soon, but you'll always be able to get it through http://sourcetosea.net somewhere


$1500 ain't a whole lot of money for a thru-hike. It can be done, but it'll take more discipline than most hikers have. I'd say start later in the season, no earlier than April 15th, to take advantage of the potentially warmer weather for starters. Getting stuck in Hiawassee for 4 days in March is a easy way to blow your budget before you get out of the gate.

Learn to cook on a fire, and you can cook all kinds of cheap, healthy foods that need more simmering time. Augment that with a few quick meals for when the weather's crappy. Skip as many towns as possible, and plan to stay out for 5-7 days at a time. I actually enjoy taking a zero in the woods near a cool creek every now and again to wash up, chill, do laundry, etc.

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 11:14
From what I read, here's the basic jist of the Source to Sea:

Minimize town trips and take your zero days on the trail in the tent.

An incentive for this is to stash the pack, hitch into town and get back to the stashed pack, this way there's no overnight town drain.

Minimize non essentials: alcohol, sodas, cigarettes.

Carry extra food. Let me repeat: Carry extra food. This will allow longer trail time before cash-eating town trips.

weary
11-26-2007, 11:16
Good points, Walter, as usual.

I hike really cheap and I don't feel that I suffer by doing so. My per-day meal costs are around 5 bucks, with good tasting, calorie-dense food. It can be done cheaper, but this is a decent amount.

I eat 4 packs of store-brand, flavored instant oatmeal for breakfast, along with a 2-bag mug of tea. I snack on Little Debbie snacks every hour or two. I sometimes do Ramen for lunch. I have a second mug of tea in the afternoon, again snacking on various LDs throughout the day. I have a Lipton's side and tuna in the evening.

The Little Debbie's brownies and oatmeal pies are 1.19 or so for 1 dozen. A dozen of each will last me for 3-4 days, according to the miles per day. They are calorie heavy and taste good when you're hungry. I switch around to other flavors when I get tired of those two, but always come back to them because of the calorie density and my taste preferences. Ingle's and Wal-Mart instant oatmeal in many different flavors costs 1.50 or so for 10 packs. I vary my flavors a lot and I don't get tired of them, even though some folks do. The Lipton's and tuna is the expensive part of the day, usually around 3 bucks for the pair. Things are higher in the North, but not as high as all that, at least in ME.

My best advice is to chow down at McDonald's before you grocery. you can get a lot for a little there, and 2 or 3 double cheeseburgers will keep you from splurging when you get to the store to do the groceries. In the South, those are a buck apiece, but I've never hit a McD's up North near the trail, so I'm not sure if the price holds up there. I do know that restaurants are higher in general up North, but what can you do, you know? It does seem that I went into a McDonald's in NYC near the bus station, and they had the dollar menu there, so maybe they do that all over. You can really rack up some calories there for 5 bucks!
I don't know about all the store brands, but "minute" oatmeal sells for quarter the price of brand name instant oatmeal. regular minute oatmeal in my mind lacks the artificial chemical taste of instants. Just add your own sugar and raisins and whatever else you may like. Cooking time isn't significantly different than the instants.

I eat mine in the pot I cook it in with a bit of extra water and powdered milk.

I "wash" the pot with the water left over from coffee and hot tang.

I don't remember any MacDonalds anywhere near the trail in Maine. That's why we are trying to buy land to buffer the corridor, and thus keep MacDonalds and their ilk at bay.

But elsewhere here they all have the dollar specials. I have nothing against MacDonalds. They just don't belong in the woods and mountains.

A video summarizing the Maine Mountain Conference is now available on YouTube. http://www.youtube.com/protectthemountains The central message is simple: "In Maine it is still possible to do landscape scale protection of mountains."

Weary www.matlt.org

weary
11-26-2007, 11:36
and back in the day there weren't dozens of hostels, motels, shuttle services, buffets, outfitters, etc. to suck $$$ out of you
All true, but there are still a few cheap hostels. Hostels are to long distance trail walkers; as monasteries are to Buddhist monks.

Weary

take-a-knee
11-26-2007, 12:41
Nightwalker, if you lay with the little debbies and mickey D burgers you'll be too damn weak and sick to hike by the time you're my age...if you are still alive.

JAK
11-26-2007, 13:34
Thomas Merton (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Merton); a monk with a talent for writing. Little easier read than olde eynglish.

I've been impressed by Buddhist pilgrims who travel with a spare robe, begging bowl and umbrella, but they often have a monastery shelter within walking distance, so it might not be quite as austere as it sounds.

I'll bet if you made a good effort at the spiritual experience, well meaning people would occasionally buy you pizza.Thanks for that.

Here are some interesting comments on frugality from wikipedia that seem appropriate for a low cost thru-hike:

Strategies for frugality
'Some of the main strategies of frugality are the reduction of waste, changing costly habits, suppressing instant gratification by means of fiscal self-restraint, seeking efficiency, avoiding traps, defying expensive social norms, embracing free (as in gratis) options, using barter, and staying well-informed about local circumstances and both market and product/service realities.'

This I particularly liked:

Philosophy
'Sometimes associated with the concept of frugality is a philosophy in which one does not trust, or is deeply wary of, "expert" knowledge, often from commercial markets or corporate cultures, claiming to know what is in the best economic, material, or spiritual interests of the individual.'

My own advice now, regarding food is that you want to buy in bulk, but small managable sizes. Sugar and carbs and fat are available in many forms relatively cheap, but don't waste money on candy. You need to be frugal and buy staples like whole grain cereals so that you will have money left for stuff that will balance out your nutritional needs with more complete protiens and vitamins. This second tier is stuff like lentils and skim milk powder. When in town it makes sense to drink lots of whole milk rather than skim milk, and lots of fresh fruit and carrots maybe, but don't OD on D. Fresh fruit and vegetables can be expensive in terms of $/calorie, so don't eat more than you need to rebuild, but you are better off rewarding yourself with this stuff rather than pizza and beer. You still need some balance on a daily basis, but variety is not so important on a daily basis. You can provide reasonable variety by varying things more from one resupply to the next. I agree also that time and money can be saved by resupplying in larger quantities, like even 20 pounds of food versus 10 pounds. Your average weight will be only 5 pounds more, less than that if you pig out a little extra on the first few days after resupply. 20 pounds might be a bit much if starting out overwieght, but very manageable I should think once you are leaned down. The 20 pounds will also provide more opportunities for a balanced diet while still being able to buy less processed and less packaged food more economically. Especially when you see sales. With some discipline you might be able to cruise into a town even if your supplies are not empty, just to bargain shop, as long as the town is close to the trail. Fruit stands and farmers markets could also provide some pleasant opportunities as long as you have room for them, and are flexible. I would suggest starting off with smaller resupplies over shorter distances, and build up to larger resupplies over greater distances as you lose weight and gain strength and stamina, and discipline. On a budget of $0.50/mile, and 10 to 20 miles per day in average to rugged terrain, with say 60-80% of your costs being food, you will be looking for an average food cost of about $1 per 1000 calories. Some foods will be as cheap as $0.20 per 1000 calories, but these will be quickly offset by food required to balance your diet, or provide some variety. Also, even when being very frugal, non-food costs can still amount to 20-40%. I think I would try and stick constistently to $0.50/mile, even in rougher terrain. This would give more money for extras in relatively smooth but perhaps more boring sections, and make the more rugged sections even more hostile. Anyhow this is all just untested theory, but it provides some interesting incentives for putting in consistent mileage, while also pacing yourself to conserve food energy, and also being careful about how you spend that extra dollar each day.

JAK
11-26-2007, 13:43
I think I would try and put as much back into hiker boxers as I took out. Perhaps I'm just not humble enough yet, but I am certainly not too proud to poke my head in each time and have a look see. Any of my friends or relatives or mere aquaintances can attest to this. :)

I'm not sure if I would balance on a cost or calorie or nutritional basis, but I think hikers boxes would be a very good way to add some variety. Also it might be fun to take from the hikers boxes in some places where there seems to be lots of excess, but give back to hikers boxes, and other hikers, and others, in areas where there does appear to be a greater need.

Panzer1
11-26-2007, 13:44
I don't think that this kid was looking to set some record for the worlds cheapest thru-hike. He was just asking if $1500 was enough money for a thru hike. The short answer is "NO", it isn't enough for a "normal" thru-hike.

Panzer

Marta
11-26-2007, 13:54
One sure-fire method of parceling out money that I used when we were in college--I withdrew a set amount of cash per week and that was all I got. We were living in a setting where we had to make our own food, so I'd take my allotment of money to the store and shop, adding up the total, until I had gotten a week's worth of food with the amount of cash I had available.

My kids have used this method while they were in school. It's much easier not to overspend when you're dealing with cash, rather than credit or debit cards.

An opposite strategy was used by one of the SOBOs last year. He pre-bought enough food to finish the hike very cheaply ahead of time, in Sam's Club and the like. He mailed it to himself at widely-spaced intervals, to cut down on postage costs. The drawbacks are that 1) he lost a lot of weight 2) he had to carry 19 to 21 days' worth of food away from each resupply. The advantage was that he knew that even if he spent every cent he had, he'd still be able to finish the hike.

A-Train
11-26-2007, 13:58
Just go out to Springer and try to get as far as you can. When you run out of money, just hop on whiteblaze and contact lone wolf asking for financial assistance. Or see if someone on here will give you a generous donation to finish.

Or, you could rob a bank. Just my 2 cents (If I had more I'd give you for the hike)

JAK
11-26-2007, 14:00
$1500 is certainly enough for a very healthy and pleasant experience, even if you don't make it all the way. If you feel you just have to have pizza and beer and stuff, and stay in a motel or hostel when the crowd you are with does, then no. In general, when on the trail it doesn't matter, but once in town you will need as much money as the people around you.

JAK
11-26-2007, 14:06
Worth quoting again I think, from Wikipedia on frugality:

Strategies for frugality
'Some of the main strategies of frugality are the reduction of waste, changing costly habits, suppressing instant gratification by means of fiscal self-restraint, seeking efficiency, avoiding traps, defying expensive social norms, embracing free (as in gratis) options, using barter, and staying well-informed about local circumstances and both market and product/service realities.'

Philosophy
'Sometimes associated with the concept of frugality is a philosophy in which one does not trust, or is deeply wary of, "expert" knowledge, often from commercial markets or corporate cultures, claiming to know what is in the best economic, material, or spiritual interests of the individual.'

Just a Hiker
11-26-2007, 14:06
Maybe there should be a "$1,500.00 Challenge" to test some of these theories?:-?

Just Jim

JAK
11-26-2007, 14:08
I'm thinking its high time I need to test some of my theories on myself for sure.

weary
11-26-2007, 14:10
I think I would try and put as much back into hiker boxers as I took out. Perhaps I'm just not humble enough yet, but I am certainly not too proud to poke my head in each time and have a look see. Any of my friends or relatives or mere aquaintances can attest to this. :)

I'm not sure if I would balance on a cost or calorie or nutritional basis, but I think hikers boxes would be a very good way to add some variety. Also it might be fun to take from the hikers boxes in some places where there seems to be lots of excess, but give back to hikers boxes, and other hikers, and others, in areas where there does appear to be a greater need.
A lot of the stuff in hiker boxes is stuff that few hikers really want. Like ordinary rice and pasta -- not the quick cooking kind. I wouldn't hesitate to take what ever I could use.

Put back that stuff that you can't or won't use. But there is no rule requiring one to swap value for value. An attempt to do so, probably would result in a lot of stuff going to waste. I know every shelter maintainer is constantly removing stuff that has been left that only a rare hiker has any use for.

Weary

Frosty
11-26-2007, 14:12
When you look at a backpacker's life, it's not too far removed from common spiritual thought(think ye not of what you'll eat or where you'll sleepI haven't met any of these backpackers yet. Everyone I met, the first thing they talk about is where they will sleep tonight and what they will eat. (The second thing they talk about is where they slept last night and what they ate.)


The whole point of living out, whether on the AT or just living out of a backpack in area forests, is to my mind the ability and willingness(and the challenge)to see how little money is needed on a long term basis. Admirable, but not sure not sure that is the whole point of thruhikers. The third thing most mention is where the next town stop is and what they will eat there.

JAK
11-26-2007, 14:15
Just a Hiker has me wondering how a section hiker or local hiker might test out some of his theories before attempting a frugal thru-hike. There must be a way. Anyhow, I've got to run and get my second daily cup of $1.78 Extra Large Double Double, and maybe a sugar donut. If I think of anything while I'm gone I will let you all know.

Frosty
11-26-2007, 14:15
A lot of the stuff in hiker boxes is stuff that few hikers really want. Like ordinary rice and pasta -- not the quick cooking kind. I wouldn't hesitate to take what ever I could use.

Put back that stuff that you can't or won't use. But there is no rule requiring one to swap value for value. An attempt to do so, probably would result in a lot of stuff going to waste. I know every shelter maintainer is constantly removing stuff that has been left that only a rare hiker has any use for.

WearyYeah, most hiker boxes have a lot of ZipLoc baggies full of unidentified rice and other grains or beans or silage.

I don't know what this is or how it got here or how long to cook it, but hey! It's free.

I have yet to find a Snickers bar in a hiker box :D

Panzer1
11-26-2007, 14:29
being the paranoid person I am, I don't like eating anything our of a hiker box. You never know if it is 100% safe to eat.

Panzer

lunchbx
11-26-2007, 14:30
I was down at palmerton jailhouse a month or two ago to meet up with some southbound friends and one of them had found MULTIPLE snikers in the hiker box there. he didnt stop talking about it the whole weekend.

Just a Hiker
11-26-2007, 14:40
Yeah, most hiker boxes have a lot of ZipLoc baggies full of unidentified rice and other grains or beans or silage.

I don't know what this is or how it got here or how long to cook it, but hey! It's free.

I have yet to find a Snickers bar in a hiker box :D


You are right, but occasionally you'll find a gem or two. I have found Mountain House Dinners and other little goodies that someone has left behind. Don Cogswell, (former owner of the AT Lodge) used to buy nice stuff for his hiker box as well as provide free clothes for NOBO's who have finished but their hiking clothes were trashed.

A-Train
11-26-2007, 14:40
Maybe there should be a "$1,500.00 Challenge" to test some of these theories?:-?

Just Jim

Sounds great. If anyone is willing to shell out 1500 clams i'll gladly go down to springer in a couple months and test the limits:-?

Dances with Mice
11-26-2007, 14:44
Sounds great. If anyone is willing to shell out 1500 clams i'll gladly go down to springer in a couple months and test the limits:-?Me too! That would be enough cash to get me to .... Gatlinburg, maybe. Probably just the NOC.

weary
11-26-2007, 15:12
I would like to echo whoever it was that urged a mid-April start for walkers on a tight budget. It allows you to hike during the prettiest season in the southern Appalachians -- and more importantly avoid some early season costs of both gear and towns. A minor benefit is that by then the stores will be out of all the hiker fads so you will be less tempted to buy.

Mole skin, for instance, was totally gone by late April and early May in 1993 from trailside markets, forcing one to use duct tape -- a far better blister preventive, and cure.

Plus, of course, the hiker boxes will be filled with inconvenient but nutritious food items.

Weary

LIhikers
11-26-2007, 15:25
The only thing I know for sure is that if you never attempt that $1500 dollar thru hike then you surely will never be able to do it, it's that simple.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 15:27
The only thing I know for sure is that if you never attempt that $1500 dollar thru hike then you surely will never be able to do it, it's that simple.

correct. he'll make it about 800 miles

Jack Tarlin
11-26-2007, 16:02
I don't know if anyone's said this, but quite a few folks who hike on the cheap end up becoming rather unpopular with their peers or with people they meet.....they annoy hostel proprietors by pleading poverty and guilt-tripping them into giving a discount or a work stay; they take advantage of people offering Trail magic or services to hikers; and most of all, they end up as mooches, perpetually looking for free food to cadge, free lodging, free beers, etc.

If a guy's short on money, of course I'll offer him a drink, a smoke, a spare Lipton, etc. Every single time I've ever cooked a "communal meal" at a hostel, i.e. when we decide to eat together and everyone throws in a few bucks for dinner......well every time I've ever done this, there's always someone who begs off saying he can't afford it. And of course we feed him anyway.

But around the third time he does this, it gets tired, and when he does it every time you see him, you start to despise him. Never mind the fact that he always seems to have a few spare bucks for his beer or weed.

In short, a lot of folks who set out insufficiently funded end up being a real pain in the ass. If you wanna start from Georgia with 1200 bucks, that's up to you, but don't expect other people to pick up the slack because you were too lazy or too foolish to start the trip without enough money.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 16:05
I don't know if anyone's said this, but quite a few folks who hike on the cheap end up becoming rather unpopular with their peers or with people they meet.....they annoy hostel proprietors by pleading poverty and guilt-tripping them into giving a discount or a work stay; they take advantage of people offering Trail magic or services to hikers; and most of all, they end up as mooches, perpetually looking for free food to cadge, free lodging, free beers, etc.

If a guy's short on money, of course I'll offer him a drink, a smoke, a spare Lipton, etc. Every single time I've ever cooked a "communal meal" at a hostel, i.e. when we decide to eat together and everyone throws in a few bucks for dinner......well every time I've ever done this, there's always someone who begs off saying he can't afford it. And of course we feed him anyway.

But around the third time he does this, it gets tired, and when he does it every time you see him, you start to despise him. Never mind the fact that he always seems to have a few spare bucks for his beer or weed.

In short, a lot of folks who set out insufficiently funded end up being a real pain in the ass. If you wanna start from Georgia with 1200 bucks, that's up to you, but don't expect other people to pick up the slack because you were too lazy or too foolish to start the trip without enough money.

tell it brother jack! truth! :) every year there's a few dozen of them that come thru damascus pleading poverty and lookin for work. what $$ they do earn goes to pot, booze or cigarettes. most get off here

Montego
11-26-2007, 16:19
When you do your laundry, just put your closthes into a cloth/nylon/waterproof sack, add a bit of camp soap and a couple of small stones, add water, close up and chake it like crazy.
Repeat as needed, then rinse by doing it again (without the soap). It's not as "convenient" as using a washer, but is a heck of a lot cheaper than paying the "washer spirit" if your trying to do the AT for cheap. The best part is that you don't lose that sock mate to the "nether world" (or is that the dryer that eats stuff?). :-?

JAK
11-26-2007, 16:27
That would not bemy cup of tea. Like I said, I may be frugal, but I'm not that humble yet. From my days as a poor yachtsman, the only way to do it on a budget is to be friends with everyone on the race course, but when in town you should only hang out with those you can afford to. In thru-hiking terms I think that would mean a good sponge bath before you get to town, hitting the grocery store, maybe the laudromat if you feel extravagant, then leaving town before the thought of pizza and beer gets too tempting. When folks offer you a free one, politely pass. Delight in the little things. Maybe lug a six pack or some cheap wine and cheese back out to the trail with you, and don't open them for at least a couple of days. For the same money it takes to live like a bum in town, you can live like a king on the trail. It might be a little heavier, but you will have a head start.

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 16:32
well ladies and gentlemen. you all have very interesting theories on undertaking a frugal thru-hike. some of you seem to think that because i am short on money im half-assing this thing. some of you are adament that its not possible to thru-hike on 1500 dollars.

to be honest, im still up in the air about the money situation. im gonna give it my best to get more before then, but as far as it seems, i feel that i could do it for 1500. ill have to rely on the kindness of a lot of people to help me see it through, but i don't intend to take any hand-outs without due reciprocation.

i was wondering, would it be possible to supplement my savings by carrying a trail guitar and playing for passersbys or in towns? are there gigs available at hotels, hostels, restaurants along the way? im a singer/songwriter and i can strum out some nice melodies. that could be enough to at least score a beer or two along the way...

JAK
11-26-2007, 16:36
Montego,
When I said not my cup of tea I was refering of course to being a bum in town and around hostels. That's a great idea on doing laundry.

I might still use a laundry as a treat now and then, but not every town. Zero and Nero days on the trail are great for laundry I should think. Good way to let some good friends catch up also, if you had to leave them in town. I would try and do most of my self cleaning on the trail also, daily. I hot shower would be a nice treat now and then, but a motel or hostels stay isn't the only way to smell nice and feel great and walk tall.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 16:40
i was wondering, would it be possible to supplement my savings by carrying a trail guitar and playing for passersbys or in towns? are there gigs available at hotels, hostels, restaurants along the way? im a singer/songwriter and i can strum out some nice melodies. that could be enough to at least score a beer or two along the way...

possible but not probable or likely especially in the southern towns

Jack Tarlin
11-26-2007, 16:42
No, you will not be able to support yourself by busking or singing.

This is merely a masquerade for panhandling, i.e. another form of begging.

And it's troubling that you're already expecting "the kindness of a lot of people" to help you see it through.

Um, here's the news: Nobody's obligated to help you "see it through" and you shouldn't take for granted that all the folks you'll meet will want to do so. This is PRECISELY what I was talking about in my post above.

Nobody is doubting whether or not one can hike on the cheap.

But I'm sorry, it sounds like you're planning to become a mooch, or at the very least, it sounds like you're taking for granted that other people will always be around to bail you out or pay your way.

It's only November. You have months to plan your trip, and months to save for it.

With all due respect, you shouldn't be here telling us about the folks who you think will help you "see it through."

You should be out working at a second or third job, saving your money, and taking responsibility for your own needs and your own expenses.

A-Train
11-26-2007, 16:44
well ladies and gentlemen. you all have very interesting theories on undertaking a frugal thru-hike. some of you seem to think that because i am short on money im half-assing this thing. some of you are adament that its not possible to thru-hike on 1500 dollars.

to be honest, im still up in the air about the money situation. im gonna give it my best to get more before then, but as far as it seems, i feel that i could do it for 1500. ill have to rely on the kindness of a lot of people to help me see it through, but i don't intend to take any hand-outs without due reciprocation.

i was wondering, would it be possible to supplement my savings by carrying a trail guitar and playing for passersbys or in towns? are there gigs available at hotels, hostels, restaurants along the way? im a singer/songwriter and i can strum out some nice melodies. that could be enough to at least score a beer or two along the way...

Probably not. Every yr there seems to be a few people who can play guitar real well and their not charging money to hear their songs. Though I think you'd make friends real easy doing it, you wouldn't make much money. Many of the towns aren't, how do you say, thriving too much and i'm sure there isn't a lot of demand for musicians though I could be wrong. Also consider how looking for working along the way will affect your hike. It can throw you out of the groove, you lose any friends you've made and may miss the opportunity to hike the whole trail in a year

JAK
11-26-2007, 16:52
well ladies and gentlemen. you all have very interesting theories on undertaking a frugal thru-hike. some of you seem to think that because i am short on money im half-assing this thing. some of you are adament that its not possible to thru-hike on 1500 dollars.

to be honest, im still up in the air about the money situation. im gonna give it my best to get more before then, but as far as it seems, i feel that i could do it for 1500. ill have to rely on the kindness of a lot of people to help me see it through, but i don't intend to take any hand-outs without due reciprocation.

i was wondering, would it be possible to supplement my savings by carrying a trail guitar and playing for passersbys or in towns? are there gigs available at hotels, hostels, restaurants along the way? im a singer/songwriter and i can strum out some nice melodies. that could be enough to at least score a beer or two along the way...I agree that it can be done. I caution against being dependant on others, as pius an objective as that may be. The reciprocal arrangements can work, but like most friendships, work best when they are not strained. I suggest finding ways to be frugal while being dependant on no one. There will always be people calling you a bum no matter how much you spend, or what you do. Screw them. The best revenge is living well. Smile broadly as you leave town, having only seen the grocery store and a few sights, and perhaps helping someone in need for nothing in return. If someone does offer to do you a favour, accept it gracefully if you wish, and do them one in return if you can, or the next deserving person you meet. I would also suggest looking for opportunities to do some trail maintenance, which is always a reward in itself. If you chance across one of these large trail magic parties, join in if it is pleasant, but mind you manners always. Good time to play your music I should think. If they like your music, keep playing, and stay long enough to help clean up. Remember the old Highland proverb; though I am poor, I am noble. Frugality is a virtue, but only if you make it so.

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 16:55
No, you will not be able to support yourself by busking or singing.

This is merely a masquerade for panhandling, i.e. another form of begging.

And it's troubling that you're already expecting "the kindness of a lot of people" to help you see it through.

Um, here's the news: Nobody's obligated to help you "see it through" and you shouldn't take for granted that all the folks you'll meet will want to do so. This is PRECISELY what I was talking about in my post above.

Nobody is doubting whether or not one can hike on the cheap.

But I'm sorry, it sounds like you're planning to become a mooch, or at the very least, it sounds like you're taking for granted that other people will always be around to bail you out or pay your way.

It's only November. You have months to plan your trip, and months to save for it.

With all due respect, you shouldn't be here telling us about the folks who you think will help you "see it through."

You should be out working at a second or third job, saving your money, and taking responsibility for your own needs and your own expenses.

wow jack tarlin, sounds like maybe you werent loved as a child. don't presume to know my intentions, sir. i don't intend to mooch, and i don't intend to "pan-handle". I may play my guitar and sing, but that obligates nobody to contribute anything to me.

I am currently working my damn ass off trying to make things happen for myself. I'm sorry, maybe you don't work 6 hours a day and then do homework until 3 am every damn day,while balancing full-time school, only to wake up and do it again and again and again. why the hell do you think im trying to get out there? don't you think im gonna do the best i can do before i go?

i recommend you don't make such harsh criticisms, because you don't know what youre talking about.

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 17:00
and furthermore, tarlin, when i said id be relying on peoples kindness, i mean merely encouraging words and advice, not material necessarily.

if you just don't want the likes of me in your exclusive trail club, you can say it, my friend. you don't have to blatently insult me.

JAK
11-26-2007, 17:02
Worth quoting again I think, from Wikipedia on frugality. Notice it doesn't mention panhandling either. Don't let Jack bother you. But he probably does know what he is talking about. He just doesn't like competition.

Strategies for frugality
'Some of the main strategies of frugality are the reduction of waste, changing costly habits, suppressing instant gratification by means of fiscal self-restraint, seeking efficiency, avoiding traps, defying expensive social norms, embracing free (as in gratis) options, using barter, and staying well-informed about local circumstances and both market and product/service realities.'

Philosophy
'Sometimes associated with the concept of frugality is a philosophy in which one does not trust, or is deeply wary of, "expert" knowledge, often from commercial markets or corporate cultures, claiming to know what is in the best economic, material, or spiritual interests of the individual.'

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 17:03
yea jak, thats good advice. that's the kindness im talking about.

JAK
11-26-2007, 17:07
Well it seems the people most critical of riff raff sponges of society, are the riff raff sponges of society. Whether they or others realize this or not is another matter entirely.

Mags
11-26-2007, 17:13
Hi Rob!

Sounds like you have the ambition and desire to do a thru-hike. That's awesome!

Though hiking on $1500 is feasible, it may not be very fun.

I know it sucks to wait a year, but if you can do it with more money saved, you'll find that your hike will be much more enjoyable. Sometimes the burger in town with a beer is not just a luxury, but a pickup that is neccessary for mental health. :)

I had to put off my own CDT hike by two years for financial and other reasons.

By waiting those two years, I had an enjoyable and satisfying hike. I also had money for AFTER my hike. I was able to be a bum for a few months and not have to jump back into the rat race right away! Most importantly? I met some awesome people (even on the CDT!) that I am still close friends with.

So my advice? I know your heart is set on the AT in 2008. But an extra year of saving money may just be the best thing for your wallet and mental health.

As a side note, I ended up doing the Colorado Trail in 2004 rather than the CDT. You know what? I had a blast! I also used this trail to see if I could sustain a certain pace. The Colo Trail helped me iron out some kinks in my gear and to get ready for my CDT hike in 2006.

So if you decide to put of the AT for another year, all is not lost. You could do the Long Trail and see if you enjoy long distance hiking, see a beautiful state in its own right, get to do a shakedown hike to test out your gear. And best of all? You get to have an incredible experience in addition to the AT in 2009! I did the LT the year before the AT and it helped A LOT.

Good luck with whatever choice you make, but I really think waiting a year (and doing a trail such as the LT) may be an excellent choice for you.

dessertrat
11-26-2007, 17:21
I think it's totally doable, as I've said before. You just can't expect to drink beer or sleep in a bed very often. I think it would be very cool to say "I did it for X dollars when people said it couldn't be done, and I didn't mooch off anyone."

However, I would skip the guitar. That sounds like it would annoy people, no matter how good you are.

Panzer1
11-26-2007, 17:24
wow jack tarlin, sounds like maybe you werent loved as a child.

Maybe he wasn't, but he's still right about carrying your own weight financially. If hiking is at least partly about independence, that that also means financial independence. If you only have $1500 you can have a very nice hike if you plan on doing half the trail. Save the other half for another year.

Panzer

A-Train
11-26-2007, 17:31
I suggest going onto trailjournals.com and checking out "Highlander II's" journal from 2003. He did the whole trail on 1850 bucks, but granted he also hiked the trail in some 95 days. This is a pace that 95% of hikers don't wanna do and probably aren't capable of without getting hurt. Though it'll give you some idea of the discipline you need, as well as how hiking "fast" can help you save money. Basically you need to avoid towns if they don't involve resupplying

JAK
11-26-2007, 17:32
$1500 is plenty enough to do the entire trail if you don't let people make you feel obligated to indulge in such luxuries as fast food, laundromats, hostels and motels. However, as I was aluding to earlier, it might be a good test to see if you can go a month without fast food, of any sort including Tim Horton's coffee and 90% of the junk they sell in grocery stores these days, before you should expect to be too frugal on the trail. Also you can practice doing laundry and personal ablutions on local section hikes and even day hikes. I would avoid using city parks for such activities however. There are many people, good and bad, that might take this the wrong way. :)

Johnny Swank
11-26-2007, 17:34
Mags - that advice was beautiful. I gots me a tear reading that!

JAK
11-26-2007, 17:36
I suggest going onto trailjournals.com and checking out "Highlander II's" journal from 2003. He did the whole trail on 1850 bucks, but granted he also hiked the trail in some 95 days. This is a pace that 95% of hikers don't wanna do and probably aren't capable of without getting hurt. Though it'll give you some idea of the discipline you need, as well as how hiking "fast" can help you save money. Basically you need to avoid towns if they don't involve resupplyingThat's a good point, but I think fast hikers are more likely to be 'frugal compatable', and frugal hikers are also more likely to waste too much time in trail towns. So there is a strong correlation that if you are capable and willing to be one, you might also be capable and willing to be or become the other.

Mags
11-26-2007, 17:38
Mags - that advice was beautiful. I gots me a tear reading that!

I've been there. Having the burning desire to do a hike, but not neccessarily having all the resources in place. Waiting two years put everything in place for me quite nicely.

Seriously Rob, consdering doing the LT this year and THEN doing the AT next year. Everyone is different, but I would not want to stint on my first thru-hike.

Good luck!

JAK
11-26-2007, 17:38
Saving for a thru-hike is also a great way to practice frugality, and vices versus.

Panzer1
11-26-2007, 17:39
If you can't afford a laundromat, you can't afford to hike. Just my opinion.

Panzer

Panzer1
11-26-2007, 17:49
I bet you could hike the just the southern part of the trail from Georgia to Pennsylvania on $1,000 comfortably. That's the cheaper half of the trail, and you wouldn't have as many issues with gear wearing out and needing to be replaced.

Most people don't make it all the way to Maine anyhow.

Panzer

Kirby
11-26-2007, 17:52
I have no thru hiked before, so my advice is not to be taken above those who have done extensive long distance hiking before.

That said, frugality would be needed, I personally will have around 3 times more than you are thinking of having. Mags gave a great idea. Do a section hike, shake down your gear, and thru hike in 2009. Or you can do a long section of the AT, perhaps 2008 is the only good year for you, then you should pick a 700 to 1,000 mile stretch you really want to see, and do that section instead of the whole thing. Physically, after a while, a good portion of hikers can backpack day after day, but mentally the trail can wear you down. Even during my wilderness section hike this summer there were days when I was out of it.

Perhaps do a flip flop, that way you can see the half of the trail you would like to see the most, and then do the other half if you have enough money, either way, enjoy your trail.

Kirby

Johnny Thunder
11-26-2007, 17:56
Or, take three extra months to make some scrill and head South.

Heater
11-26-2007, 18:00
[quote=JAK;455576]
In the clearing stands a boxer and a fighter by his trade
And he carries the reminders of every glove that laid him out
Or cuffed him till he cried out in his anger and his shame
I am leaving! I am leaving!
But the fighter still remains . . .

Ohhhhh maaaaaaaaan. You did it now. JAK with respond with a flood of obtuse verse.

:eek:

smokymtnsteve
11-26-2007, 18:13
If you can't afford a laundromat, you can't afford to hike. Just my opinion.

Panzer

why do you need to own a laundromat to be able to hike?

but seroiusly washing a a few things by hand isn't really that hard...

Johnny Thunder
11-26-2007, 18:25
why do you need to own a laundromat to be able to hike?

but seroiusly washing a a few things by hand isn't really that hard...


Steve,

But, how am I to afford all this Western Mountaneering gear without taking that second mortgage out against the family bodega?

Johnny

minnesotasmith
11-26-2007, 18:53
:clap :clap :clap :clap :clap
You'll have a lot more fun if you bring three times that amount. You can do life the hard way or the easy way. From my experience the hard way is not all that much fun. Do what you have to to earn more money and save it for your hike.

Jack Tarlin
11-26-2007, 18:54
Geez, I'm sorry Rob is peeved that I evidently misjudged his intentions.

But then again, it wasn't me that announced that I intended to rely on the kindness of strangers in order to see my way through.

The bottom line, Rob, is that one has to carry one own's weight out there, and you CAN'T always rely on other people to bail you out. Likewise, you can't count on doing work-for-stays at hostels, or finding odd jobs for a few days in Trail towns, and so on. And you certainly can't support yourself or your hike standing on a street corner hoping folks toss loose change in a guitar case.

Sorry if these truths distress you, but that's the way it is. And I think it's great that you're working your way thru school, but then again, millions of folks do this, it's not such a novel concept.

Please re-read my posts: Yeah, it's possible to hike on a really tight budget, i.e. less than $1500.00. Most folks wouldn't want to do this, tho, especially younger hikers, who particulalrly enjoy the social aspects of Trail life, especially towns, hostels, and other things that eat money. In my experience, people who set out with too little money either quit prematurely, or they stick around, but don't really have that great a time because so much of their trip and what they do on it becomes tied to their financial situation. It's also a real drag when you're hiking with a group of people you like and you can't do what they're doing because you're short on money. When your friends are going somewhere decent to eat, it eally sucks not being able to go along. When they're staying an extra day in town because the weather is horrible, it really sucks to not be able to join them because you're short thirty bucks. I'm sorry you took my post so personally, but all I was saying is that hiking on a tight budget will REALLY impact your trip more than you think.

Oh, and Rob, if you question whether or not I know what I'm talking about, you might wanna ask around. I do have a bit of experience out there, and I have indeed seen people in this situation before.

Mags nailed it pretty good in his post. I really think people have a better time on the Trail when they don't have financial considerations hanging over their heads, and in some cases, it's better to wait til they can have the trip they really want, without nickel and diming it all the way to Maine. The Trail's not going anywhere.

Appalachian Tater
11-26-2007, 19:12
And it's troubling that you're already expecting "the kindness of a lot of people" to help you see it through.


It worked for Blanche DuBois. In a way.

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 19:34
well ladies and gentlemen. you all have very interesting theories on undertaking a frugal thru-hike. some of you seem to think that because i am short on money im half-assing this thing. some of you are adament that its not possible to thru-hike on 1500 dollars.

to be honest, im still up in the air about the money situation. im gonna give it my best to get more before then, but as far as it seems, i feel that i could do it for 1500. ill have to rely on the kindness of a lot of people to help me see it through, but i don't intend to take any hand-outs without due reciprocation.

i was wondering, would it be possible to supplement my savings by carrying a trail guitar and playing for passersbys or in towns? are there gigs available at hotels, hostels, restaurants along the way? im a singer/songwriter and i can strum out some nice melodies. that could be enough to at least score a beer or two along the way...

My burning ears perked up at this one! Living out of a backpack and playing street music can be done but it's a hard way to make a few bucks. I started playing clarinet street music in Boone, NC and around campus at ASU. My pack would be sitting nearby and many times fellow musicians would join me, drummers, etc. One guy brought out his two congas and we wailed, etc. . . Afterwards I'd just load up the gear and hit the woods. On the street you just throw out the hat and start playing. If you've studied and practiced you might as well have an audience and make some cold cash.

The best place I played was on Franklin St in Chapel Hill NC by the UNC campus. I made $17 in one hour, not bad, and in the evening found campsites around Duke Forest.

Another time I hitched to the Cherokee reservation where with a topo map I found some great tent sites, so during the day I whipped out the B flat horn and the felt hat to play for the tourists in Cherokee village. A resident Indian was nearby dressed in a head dress and regalia getting a dollar per photo and we said our hellos. After playing a few tunes a white shop owner ran out and told me to stop and move on, don't play in front of my store, etc. The Indian came up to me with a very sad face and said, "You don't want to be here, get out while you can." I took his advice and hitched to Sylva(camped up behind a grocery store in the trees).

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 19:36
damn those pale faces

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 20:27
tarlin, i know you have tons of experience. i never called that into question. i agreed with your statements about having more fun with a little more money as well. the only thing that peeved me was that you made some qualifying statements about me that were wholly inaccurate and completely unproductive, even rude. it made you seem like a bit of an elitist, which REALLY peeves me, because the point of getting out on the trail is to avoid that altogether.

mudhead
11-26-2007, 20:30
wow jack tarlin, sounds like maybe you werent loved as a child. don't presume to know my intentions, sir. i don't intend to mooch, and i don't intend to "pan-handle". I may play my guitar and sing, but that obligates nobody to contribute anything to me.

I am currently working my damn ass off trying to make things happen for myself. I'm sorry, maybe you don't work 6 hours a day and then do homework until 3 am every damn day,while balancing full-time school, only to wake up and do it again and again and again. why the hell do you think im trying to get out there? don't you think im gonna do the best i can do before i go?

i recommend you don't make such harsh criticisms, because you don't know what youre talking about.

Do not let the grades suffer.

Priorities. Reevaluate.

rickb
11-26-2007, 20:39
Time is the most valuable commodity on earth.

Even at usurious rates, payment on an extra $2000 on a credit card is around $40 per month.

Paying interest is pissing money away but in actual dollars it wont be that much. And unlike a new stereo the AT will be with you forever. And if you are able to hike cheap, then all the better.

With the stamina and work ethic you find on the Trail you can come back and bust you ass to pay it off before you know it.

Or not.

Just a theory.

Sometimes opportunitites only knock once.

Jack Tarlin
11-26-2007, 20:39
Oh, so I guess that saying that people should be independent, self-reliant, self-supporting, should pay their own way, and should not start their trip expecting to rely on others makes me an "elitist".

OK, I plead guilty.

Sorry you're still peeved, but you did indeed say that you fully expected to have to rely on other people to sustain your trip and get you thru. If I misquoted you, show me where.

Most folks don't have this mindset, Rob. The occasional act of kindness from a stranger is a wonderful thing, but it's a mistake to "rely" on it, cuz sooner or later there'll be a time when you really need it, or really expect it, and you'll come up empty.

Then you know what you do?

You go home and spend the rest of the summer hating life because your planned six month adventure lasted 35 days.

Not fun.

weary
11-26-2007, 20:41
That would not bemy cup of tea. Like I said, I may be frugal, but I'm not that humble yet. From my days as a poor yachtsman, the only way to do it on a budget is to be friends with everyone on the race course, but when in town you should only hang out with those you can afford to. In thru-hiking terms I think that would mean a good sponge bath before you get to town, hitting the grocery store, maybe the laudromat if you feel extravagant, then leaving town before the thought of pizza and beer gets too tempting. When folks offer you a free one, politely pass. Delight in the little things. Maybe lug a six pack or some cheap wine and cheese back out to the trail with you, and don't open them for at least a couple of days. For the same money it takes to live like a bum in town, you can live like a king on the trail. It might be a little heavier, but you will have a head start.
Jak is the voice of wisdom.

Programbo
11-26-2007, 20:52
I made it from Springer to Duncannon,PA on $250 in 1977 :D

weary
11-26-2007, 20:58
Oh, so I guess that saying that people should be independent, self-reliant, self-supporting, should pay their own way, and should not start their trip expecting to rely on others makes me an "elitist".

OK, I plead guilty.

Sorry you're still peeved, but you did indeed say that you fully expected to have to rely on other people to sustain your trip and get you thru. If I misquoted you, show me where.

Most folks don't have this mindset, Rob. The occasional act of kindness from a stranger is a wonderful thing, but it's a mistake to "rely" on it, cuz sooner or later there'll be a time when you really need it, or really expect it, and you'll come up empty.

Then you know what you do?

You go home and spend the rest of the summer hating life because your planned six month adventure lasted 35 days.

Not fun.
Jack, it would be helpful if you spelled out which post you are responding too. That way us slow people wouldn't have to guess or sit around figuring things out. I know it's difficult from time to time to Keep track of who and what you are. But it sure would be helpful.

Weary

JAK
11-26-2007, 20:59
Serious athletes can and do compete on less.
This is just a walk in the woods.
It can be done.

Appalachian Tater
11-26-2007, 21:05
Jack, it would be helpful if you spelled out which post you are responding too. That way us slow people wouldn't have to guess or sit around figuring things out. I know it's difficult from time to time to Keep track of who and what you are. But it sure would be helpful.

Weary

Weary, you want him to refer to the post he is referring to by number, like this:

Post #1: You're a fool
Post #13: More B.S.
Post #33: You da man
Post #72: More garbage
Post #97: I couldn't agree more
Post #173: Finally someone understands
Post #246: More garbage from garbage-mongers

weary
11-26-2007, 21:08
wow jack tarlin, sounds like maybe you werent loved as a child. don't presume to know my intentions, sir. i don't intend to mooch, and i don't intend to "pan-handle". I may play my guitar and sing, but that obligates nobody to contribute anything to me.

I am currently working my damn ass off trying to make things happen for myself. I'm sorry, maybe you don't work 6 hours a day and then do homework until 3 am every damn day,while balancing full-time school, only to wake up and do it again and again and again. why the hell do you think im trying to get out there? don't you think im gonna do the best i can do before i go?

i recommend you don't make such harsh criticisms, because you don't know what youre talking about.
Just come close to what you think you need, If you run out, don't be bashful about asking friendly folks to listen to your songs and make a contribution. Neocons probably won't be much help.

But there will be a few Liberals, from time to time, who will welcome the chance to help out.

Weary

JAK
11-26-2007, 21:20
The kid is not a fool. He is a college kid on a budget, wanting to do something while he is young other than make others rich. A lot of people didn't take me or a lot of my friends very seriously back when I was doing a lot of competive sailing. Yeah we were on a budget, but we had loads of fun, mooched off nobody, and kicked a lot of rich kids ass. That never gets old. This is just a walk in the woods. It doesn't have to cost thousands of dollars unless you are already gone soft with age, or spoiled.

$1500 and 100 days is plenty for someone aged 20.
Heck, I've won a national championship on less than that.

Frosty
11-26-2007, 21:26
ill have to rely on the kindness of a lot of people to help me see it through, but i don't intend to take any hand-outs without due reciprocation.I'm not sure what this means, but I hope it doesn't involve squealing like a pig!

JAK
11-26-2007, 21:29
It probably means he is not a spoiled college kid or yuppie, with more bucks than brains.

JAK
11-26-2007, 21:31
I don't see why everyone has to get their panties in a knot just because someone wants to walk 2000 miles without spending all their money on pizza and beer and cheap motels and overpriced gear like most folks. Get a life. If he only makes it 1000 miles on $1500 he is still $2000 ahead of the fool that only make it halfway on $3500.

JAK
11-26-2007, 21:33
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frugality

'Sometimes associated with the concept of frugality is a philosophy in which one does not trust, or is deeply wary of, "expert" knowledge, often from commercial markets or corporate cultures, claiming to know what is in the best economic, material, or spiritual interests of the individual.'

bfitz
11-26-2007, 21:39
1500 can do it, but it won't be easy. I saw one guy do it with almost no spare cash...just food sent from home and hiker boxes and the like. He was very concientious and literally would not mooch even when invited and encouraged to. He sacrificed a lot of the good times in town and such the rest of us had (which in my opinion is what it's all about) as a result.

Kirby
11-26-2007, 21:58
Weary, you want him to refer to the post he is referring to by number, like this:

Post #1: You're a fool
Post #13: More B.S.
Post #33: You da man
Post #72: More garbage
Post #97: I couldn't agree more
Post #173: Finally someone understands
Post #246: More garbage from garbage-mongers

I got lost when you refered to 173 in a thread with only 155 post:o. Maybe I am missing the point here.:rolleyes:

Kirby

Frosty
11-26-2007, 22:05
I don't see why everyone has to get their panties in a knot just because someone wants to walk 2000 miles without spending all their money on pizza and beer and cheap motels and overpriced gear like most folks. Get a life. If he only makes it 1000 miles on $1500 he is still $2000 ahead of the fool that only make it halfway on $3500.?????

Read post #1. He asked if it was feasible to hike the trail on $1500.

People answered him, honestly and thoughtfully.

He took issue with those who thought it would be impossible.

He took issue with those who thought it would be hard to do.

He took issue when experienced hikers pointed out that such hikers are very annoying on the trail.

So the question isn't why the responders are getting their panties in a knot, it is why the hell did he ask the question to begin with if he didn't want answers?


wow jack tarlin, sounds like maybe you werent loved as a child. don't presume to know my intentions, sir.He does, though. You stated your intentions. It was to hike the trail with $1500 and to rely on the kindness of strangers.



i recommend you don't make such harsh criticisms, because you don't know what youre talking about.He's been there, done that, on hte AT for more years than you have been alive, so he may know what he is talking about. When I was your age (God, I can't believe I used those words) I thought I knew more than anyone. I didn't and neither do you.

Anyway, if you read what he said, he wasn't criticising you. He was telling you about people who have already been on the trail who tried to get by on the kindness of others. This is based, as he said, on direct observation. Not of you, but of people who tried to you what you say you want to do.

If you think you can do it, go. Go do it. Come back and tell us you did it and how. No one is stopping you. But if you ask for thoughts on the feasibility of doing it, expect to get answers.

Have a great hike.

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:12
I should also say that it probably can be done for $5000 also, maybe even more. When I sailed competively I competed against a lot of guys with some money to burn. Great guys mostly. Some of them were even competitive, even in the heavy air and nasty cold stuff. You can't right anyone off. I'm just saying that rich stuff never did a whole lot for me. There should be room for everyone though. That's the thing.

Call be paranoid or skeptical or whatever, but I tend to be weary of commercial interests when I here people advising people to spend more money or stay home. Hog wash. If I did that I would never have learned to sail, or kayak, or do a lot of the other stuff I have done. Like I said. This is just a walk in the woods after all. For most of us we have either the time but not the money, or the money but not the time, so if someone wants to see how far they can run the damn thing in their underwear in 10 days with $10 of food I say let them.

$1500 is plenty for a 20 year old with 100 days to spare.
Anyone that says it can't be done, or shouldn't be attempted, is soft, or corrupt.
Probably both.

Mags
11-26-2007, 22:15
TIt doesn't have to cost thousands of dollars unless you are already gone soft with age, or spoiled.




No, but more than $1500 would be nice. :)

I was 24, came from a blue-collar family, paid my own way and did it on ~$2500 (not quite ten years ago). So try not to make generaliztions both ways..'eh? :)


Speaking of 10 years ago, if you don't mind me asking, when did you sail competitively? $1500 is worth less than 5, 10, 15 or more years ago.

And, as has been discussed in the past, while a 100 day hike IS doable, it is much like a $1500 thru-hike--possible, but not for everyone. And it takes discipline and experience.

Anyway Rob, I think you've heard a bunch of opinions.

I hope you enjoy your journey which ever path you choose to take. And that is what matters in the end afterall.

bfitz
11-26-2007, 22:18
?????

Read post #1. He asked if it was feasible to hike the trail on $1500.

People answered him, honestly and thoughtfully.

He took issue with those who thought it would be impossible.

He took issue with those who thought it would be hard to do.

He took issue when experienced hikers pointed out that such hikers are very annoying on the trail.

So the question isn't why the responders are getting their panties in a knot, it is why the hell did he ask the question to begin with if he didn't want answers?

He does, though. You stated your intentions. It was to hike the trail with $1500 and to rely on the kindness of strangers.

He's been there, done that, on hte AT for more years than you have been alive, so he may know what he is talking about. When I was your age (God, I can't believe I used those words) I thought I knew more than anyone. I didn't and neither do you.

Anyway, if you read what he said, he wasn't criticising you. He was telling you about people who have already been on the trail who tried to get by on the kindness of others. This is based, as he said, on direct observation. Not of you, but of people who tried to you what you say you want to do.

If you think you can do it, go. Go do it. Come back and tell us you did it and how. No one is stopping you. But if you ask for thoughts on the feasibility of doing it, expect to get answers.

Have a great hike.Man, Bertrand Russel has a quote for everything....

What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence.

-Bertrand Russell

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:19
Honestly and thoughtfully,
I don't think the people that answered were all that honest or thoughtful.

As a society, we have gone soft. There is no doubt of that. Taking 100 days off is bad enough, but is really only contemptible if you wasting excessive amounts of money on pizza and beer and cheap motels and overpriced gear while doing so.

Hows that for honest and thoughtful.
p.s. If you didn't live through the depression or the war your not really a geezer.

Mags
11-26-2007, 22:22
$1500 is plenty for a 20 year old with 100 days to spare.
Anyone that says it can't be done, or shouldn't be attempted, is soft, or corrupt.
Probably both.


Or experienced. ;)

I'm just giving some honest advice, in, what I thought a thoughtful and polite manner. Please don't be so nasty. I'd like to think I am honest; as mentioned I grew up very working class (a little too proud of it at times), so I know the value of hard work (Dad would literally beat it into us at times..but that's another story. ;-), etc.

To be called "Soft" and "Corrupt" because I disagree with your statement, esp. when I said my opinions in a non-antagonistic manner, seems rather harsh.


(Seriously, a 100 day hike is a serious undertaking, esp for a first time thru-hike. But that's another thread. :D)

weary
11-26-2007, 22:24
1500 can do it, but it won't be easy. I saw one guy do it with almost no spare cash...just food sent from home and hiker boxes and the like. He was very concientious and literally would not mooch even when invited and encouraged to. He sacrificed a lot of the good times in town and such the rest of us had (which in my opinion is what it's all about) as a result.
This is an incredible trail, an incredible resource. Those who think good times in town are all the trail has to offer truly missed 90 percent of the experience. I'm sad for them.

Weary

Mags
11-26-2007, 22:25
Honestly and thoughtfully,
I don't think the people that answered were all that honest or thoughtful.




I did. You were insulting. Whatchya gonna do? :sun

All I am saying, as fairly frugal and experienced thru-hiker, is that a $1500 thru-hike is a tough nut to crack.

An extra year of working, plus a regional hike like the Long Trail thrown in this year, may make for a more enjoyable hike both financially and mentally.

Call me soft. But, I know you are wrong for reasons I don't have to defend. :)

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:28
No, but more than $1500 would be nice. :)
Speaking of 10 years ago, if you don't mind me asking, when did you sail competitively? $1500 is worth less than 5, 10, 15 or more years ago.
Mostly 1973 though 1983. Got back into it intensely in 1988 for 6 months. Also did some training and a few trips in 1996, just to experience the Canadian Olympic Trials with some old friends. When I started sailing in the 70s we did it without wetsuits, even in April and May. Wool sweaters and cheap nylon baby, just like I like to hike in now.

Kirby
11-26-2007, 22:29
I found this thread to be honest and thoughtful, it seems the thread starter was looking for feedback, and lashed out when he got it.

Kirby

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:31
MAGS,
I'm mostly just making some general counterpoints in defence of frugality.
Don't be personally offended. It's modern society that offends me, myself included, but not any individuals in particular, not even myself.

Cheers.

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:34
Sure he lashed out, and might have been more respectful.
So what. Jack could have been more respectful also.

Frugality is a virtue.
We should be encouraging people to spend less, not more.

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 22:34
hey frosty, tarlin blatently called me out as being a mooch and half-assing this whole endeavor. I never called his advice or experiences into question, i called his criticism into question. If you notice, I left the entire post open-ended in the first place: feasability of thru-hiking on 1500 dollars? I didn't say that I am dead-set on hiking for 1500 dollars and no damn more, i was just hoping to gain some insight into doing things "economically."

I also clarified my statement about relying on kindness: not kindness in any material form, but in advice and encouragement. I also stated that I would not be begging any handouts without due reciprocation, which means an eye for an eye, basically.

you all need to take a good hard look at your posts and ask if they are positive guides to individuals interested merely in the same endeavor as you. I love being outside. Now, how are you going to pick this post apart? Have I insulted the cherished elders of the appalachian trail with anything ive said?

Mags
11-26-2007, 22:37
Mostly 1973 though 1983. Got back into it intensely in 1988 for 6 months. Also did some training and a few trips in 1996, just to experience the Canadian Olympic Trials with some old friends. When I started sailing in the 70s we did it without wetsuits, even in April and May. Wool sweaters and cheap nylon baby, just like I like to hike in now.

So, at your peak you did it 20 yrs ago?

$1500 in 1988 dollar is is ~$2500 today. An excellent sum for a thru-hike! Frugal, but very doable. See we agree. :)
(Amounts are in American dollars)

http://www.westegg.com/inflation/infl.cgi

As for hiking clothes, I hike in a $4 polyester shirt, use a $4 pot, wear $10 shorts, wear $3 wool gloves, etc.. Do I get a prize? :banana

As any experienced person will tell you, gear means jack squat. Both ways.


/not an athelete
//just an outdoors person
///a soft, corrupt one at that. ;)

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:37
Mostly I'm just tired of the same old cliches.
So I like to throw out a few of my own.

Also like to defend the underdog.

Seriously though... honest and thoughtful?
... or just following the herd, and leading them astray?

bfitz
11-26-2007, 22:38
This is an incredible trail, an incredible resource. Those who think good times in town are all the trail has to offer truly missed 90 percent of the experience. I'm sad for them.

WearyOh weary...don't weep for me. I love the trees, mountains and streams etc., otherwise I'd just go on cruises and road trips, but I also love the towns and the people, the different cultural experiences such a trip offers. I believe one of Earl Schaeffer's regrets was that the trail has been more and more rerouted to avoid towns and roads to interesting features.

Mags
11-26-2007, 22:39
Jak,

AS your conversation is now turning to insults, perhaps we should just end this conversation?

Rob, I think it is safe to say you've heard the different opinions,

Best of luck. Enjoy the journey!

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:43
MAGS,
Your math is more than fair. Sailing inflation is much worse. I bought my first Laser in 1978 from my brother for $900. They are something scarey like $9000 now. Total ripoff once they became an Olympic Class. In fact they were already a ripoff before then. Sailing has gotten WAY to expensive since the 1970s. I would hate to see something as simple as a walk in the woods go the same way. It doesn't have to be that way. Sailing doesn't either, as long as you have access to water and sail a small boat you are allowed to build yourself. Kayaking and Canoing can be very frugal also, but only if you make it so. Be very skeptical of anyone that leads you to believe otherwise.

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:45
No need to end the conversation. Just need to get it back on track.

We should all be encouraging people to do it cheaper.
We will all be better for it if we do.

DavidNH
11-26-2007, 22:49
Well I guess it is possible. One thing I learned on my hike..whenever I thought something couldn't be done this way...someone came along and did it that way.

My question is this: WHy would you want to do this??



yes I suppose 1500 dollars for a thru hike is possible. But why would you want to do that? as someone mentioned we are talking about 10 dollars a day.

So consider that during your thru hike you will have to accept the following:

No restuarants (well very few)
Forget beer and cigs..unless someone gives to you for free
No hotels or motels
No or very few hostel nights

You may do ok in the south (oh but you won't be able to afford those wonderful southern breakfasts!!!) BUT
God help you when you get to New England.
lodging and food is costly compared to down south.

Oh .. and in the whites I HOPE you can get work for stays ...but
Forget getting any candy or snacks at huts


Wouldn't an AT thru hike be much more enjoyable if you waited x years till you could afford 3000 -5000 dollars for the trip?

davidnh

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 22:49
and honestly, please. anybody look at jack tarlins 2nd response to me and tell me that i lashed out...

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:52
They won't see it that way because it was a canned knee jerk response on this forum and others that everyone has grown used to. As someone already said, all lies and jest. Still the man hears what he wants to hear, and disregards the rest.

JAK
11-26-2007, 22:53
I am just a poor boy and my storys seldom told
Ive squandered my resistance for a pocketful of mumbles, such are promises
All lies and jest, still the man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest, hmmmm

When I left my home and my family, I was no more than a boy
In the company of strangers
In the quiet of the railway station, runnin scared
Laying low, seeking out the poorer quarters, where the ragged people go
Looking for the places only they would know

Li la li...

Asking only workmans wages, I come lookin for a job, but I get no offers
Just a comeon from the whores on 7th avenue
I do declare, there were times when I was so lonesome
I took some comfort there

Now the years are rolling by me, they are rockin even me
I am older than I once was, and younger than Ill be, thats not unusual
No it isnt strange, after changes upon changes, we are more or less the same
After changes we are more or less the same

Li la li...

And Im laying out my winter clothes, wishing I was gone, goin home
Where the new york city winters arent bleedin me, leadin me to go home

In the clearing stands a boxer, and a fighter by his trade
And he carries the reminders of every glove that laid him down or cut him
til he cried out in his anger and his shame
I am leaving, I am leaving, but the fighter still remains
Yes he still remains

Li la li...

doggiebag
11-26-2007, 22:55
hey frosty, tarlin blatently called me out as being a mooch and half-assing this whole endeavor. I never called his advice or experiences into question, i called his criticism into question. If you notice, I left the entire post open-ended in the first place: feasability of thru-hiking on 1500 dollars? I didn't say that I am dead-set on hiking for 1500 dollars and no damn more, i was just hoping to gain some insight into doing things "economically."

I also clarified my statement about relying on kindness: not kindness in any material form, but in advice and encouragement. I also stated that I would not be begging any handouts without due reciprocation, which means an eye for an eye, basically.

you all need to take a good hard look at your posts and ask if they are positive guides to individuals interested merely in the same endeavor as you. I love being outside. Now, how are you going to pick this post apart? Have I insulted the cherished elders of the appalachian trail with anything ive said?
Go on your hike with what you have, ignore the naysayers and maintain your dignity. Go as far as you can and have a great time. It's the trail -it will be tough but you'll be ok. I've seen some folks that should not be on the trail (no equipment and no means of support) - being "trail angeled" by certain folks who should know better than to basically enable the inexperienced and most helpless of the newbees. I've seen it more than once. None of the folks they were "mentoring" even came close to a real hike. One things for sure ... with the research your doing; you're not going into this thing blind. Shoot - if you make it halfway -you're still doing better than 75% of the people that don't even make it to Harpers. Carry your own weight and pay your own way - economy is the key. Then you'll enjoy the trail without the heartburn of paying homage to some of these so called trail legends.

CoyoteWhips
11-26-2007, 22:55
All I am saying, as fairly frugal and experienced thru-hiker, is that a $1500 thru-hike is a tough nut to crack.

An extra year of working, plus a regional hike like the Long Trail thrown in this year, may make for a more enjoyable hike both financially and mentally.
:)

On one hand, I've learned not to call something impossible when it's only difficult. However, I think a Long Trail hike is a pretty good suggestion. It's getting out and hiking. The AT is not the only trail.

Heck, I'm writing it down in my itinerary. 2008, Hike the Long Trail. Who's with me?

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 22:59
jak, im liking the simon and garfunkel

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:00
Heck. Never even mind the Long Trail.
I'm just gonna see if I can go a week or two without Tim Horton's after all my talk.
Betcha I don't even make it 'til the day after tomorrow. ;)

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:01
So how long can you go without fast food Rob?
Good way to save up for your thru.

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:03
I'll make you a deal. Gentleman's honour.
First guy between you and me to buy fast food has to apologize to Tarlin.

You game?

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 23:04
you'll last til hiawassee

Heater
11-26-2007, 23:04
I hike in a $4 polyester shirt, use a $4 pot,

I've seen that pot. It 'aint worth $4. :rolleyes:

http://www.magnanti.com/t2/aaa.JPG

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:05
you'll last til hiawasseeDo they have a Tim Horton's there?

CoyoteWhips
11-26-2007, 23:05
I'll make you a deal. Gentleman's honour.
First guy between you and me to buy fast food has to apologize to Tarlin.

You game?

I like that deal. I stopped eating fast food in July 2006.

Lone Wolf
11-26-2007, 23:07
Do they have a Tim Horton's there?

Tim Horton ain't chit. you ain't had Krispy Kreme

pitdog
11-26-2007, 23:08
The frozen pizzas at neels gap can be real tempting.

rob123ufl
11-26-2007, 23:09
alright jak, deal. starting now then, ey?

Mags
11-26-2007, 23:15
On one hand, I've learned not to call something impossible when it's only difficult. However, I think a Long Trail hike is a pretty good suggestion. It's getting out and hiking. The AT is not the only trail.

Heck, I'm writing it down in my itinerary. 2008, Hike the Long Trail. Who's with me?


That's what I've said several times: Not impossible, just difficult. Then I get insulted. :D

Do the Long Trail in the fall if you can. Go SoBo and end on Greylock. Only another 20 miles by trail with a wonderful view of the New England countryside in Autumn! Well, that's a trip I want to do anyway...

In any case, besides the financial benefits of waiting a year and doing the Long Trail this year instead is that you get some mental benefits as well. Do you like hiking for three-four weeks straight? In the rain and cold? Do you like hiking day after day?

IF you finish the Long Trail (which still had some of the most difficult hiking I've ever done mile for mile), then you have a good feel for what it may be like to do the AT.

I am jonesing for Eastern hiking again. Seriously. Maybe I'll do the LT in 2008!

Mags
11-26-2007, 23:19
I've seen that pot. It 'aint worth $4. :rolleyes:




I suspect I paid too much for it. ;)

Do you think I paid too much for my shirt? (http://www.pmags.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_gallery2&Itemid=36&g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=14207) :D


(http://www.pmags.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=14207&g2_serialNumber=2&g2_GALLERYSID=d79c16c49f1e6d5adfbf4a74d4cc784d)

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:20
That's some pretty tough hangin CoyoteWhips. I know Rob123ufl is probably getting into exams, so I'll let him set his own rules.

For myself, I'll say fast food will include Tim Horton's, McDonalds, Subway, vending machines. Other than junk food anything my wife serves me at home will be fair game, and dinner out once a week will be fair game also as long as its healthy, and I limit myself to salad, one beer, and my eight year old daughters left overs. Bear in mind my current Tim Horton's kick has been 2 Extra Large every day, and this is a totally open ended agreement. No doubt Tarlin will eventually get his apology. I just want to see how much weight I might lose first. Also, if I do any day hikes or overnights before my will crumbles I will see if I can do that on a budget also.

Wonder what Rob's beer budget is like. I remember those days well.
Wonder if he has learned how easy it is to make his own. College kids.:rolleyes:

:)

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:23
alright jak, deal. starting now then, ey?You are on. Make your own rules. I've made mine.

And it's spelled like 'eh', eh. Ya hoser. :D

Tipi Walter
11-26-2007, 23:27
I've seen that pot. It 'aint worth $4. :rolleyes:

http://www.magnanti.com/t2/aaa.JPG

Phew, I scrolled down to this picture and at first I thought I was looking at the results of a high colonic. Wait a minute, is that somebody's gear??

EWS
11-26-2007, 23:30
The kid is not a fool. He is a college kid on a budget, wanting to do something while he is young other than make others rich. A lot of people didn't take me or a lot of my friends very seriously back when I was doing a lot of competive sailing. Yeah we were on a budget, but we had loads of fun, mooched off nobody, and kicked a lot of rich kids ass. That never gets old. This is just a walk in the woods. It doesn't have to cost thousands of dollars unless you are already gone soft with age, or spoiled.

$1500 and 100 days is plenty for someone aged 20.
Heck, I've won a national championship on less than that.
What were you racing, dingies?

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:30
Tim Horton ain't chit. you ain't had Krispy KremeLocal urban legend has it, on good authority mind you, that Tim Horton's coffee is laced with crack.
Actually I think it's laced with chocolate, but I'm pretty sure the chocolate is laced with crack.

On my 3km walk to work I pass 3 Tim Hortons.
One on the corner of Millidge Ave and University Avenue.
One in the Regional Hospital. One here on Campus.

Bear in mind it is a very small campus, and a very sparsely populated neighbourhood with as many deer as people. Actually it just occured to me that the deer might be addicted also. I did see that 5 point the other morning at the hockey rink just past Tim's. Hmmm.

JAK
11-26-2007, 23:34
What were you racing, dingies?Yup.
Something called a Cadet mostly up to 1978.
Something called a Laser mostly after that.
Raced a few winnebagos around the track a few times also.
( winnebagos is the derogatory term we used for the big boats. ;) )

http://www.cadetclass.org.uk/gettingstarted.htm
http://www.laser.org/

Heater
11-26-2007, 23:35
I suspect I paid too much for it. ;)

Do you think I paid too much for my shirt? (http://www.pmags.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_gallery2&Itemid=36&g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=14207) :D


I understand now.
You were saving the big bucks for the Timex, right? :-? :D

EWS
11-26-2007, 23:38
Yup.
Something called a Cadet mostly up to 1978.
Something called a Laser mostly after that.
Raced a few winnebagos around the track a few times also.
( winnebagos is the derogatory term we used for the big boats. ;) )

http://www.cadetclass.org.uk/gettingstarted.htm
http://www.laser.org/Saw the lasers mentioned three pages later. Lots of excellent sailors come out of those lil things.

CoyoteWhips
11-26-2007, 23:44
I am jonesing for Eastern hiking again. Seriously. Maybe I'll do the LT in 2008!

I'm fortunate that I can do Eastern hiking after work, if I want.

Not a big fan of bugs -- an autumn trek sounds like the way to go.

Mags
11-26-2007, 23:50
I understand now.
You were saving the big bucks for the Timex, right? :-? :D


Tar-zhey special! $20. :) (IT is on my wrisit now!) A watch is great for navigating.

And yes Tipi Walter, I actually used that pot. On the LT, the PCT,CT and the CDT. :eek: I crushed it by accident early this summer. :(

EWS
11-26-2007, 23:52
Ain't going to multi quote 40 things today...

Tarlin did have some excellent points though. People don't like mooches. People don't like someone who thinks that you should pay them, just cause they're playing guitar in public, especially in hostels, they'll turn hostel. No, you can't have all of my beer you want, buy your own. If the sharing isn't reciprocal, you're cut off. Poor-poor-pitiful me people are the worst. If anyone has to do the above stuff to get by, they'll probably have a hard time.

In my younger days, women could sometimes get away with some of the above crap, by tempting me with their wares, but now they just get an earful that they don't like.

JAK
11-27-2007, 00:17
Saw the lasers mentioned three pages later. Lots of excellent sailors come out of those lil things.Yes indeed. I wouldn't count myself amongst them, but I've had the privilege to have raced amongst them, sometimes even at the finish. :)

Some great American's I've met along the way:
Cam Lewis. John Bertrand. Stew Neff. Carl Buchan. Brian Ledbetter. Martin Hartmanis. Many others. Most of those guys were the legends before my time, but those are the ones you remember best eh. Hey, I even met Super Henry Sprague once.

Frosty
11-27-2007, 00:28
hey frosty, tarlin blatently called me out as being a moochNo, he didn't. You said you were going to rely on the kindness of strangers and he said it SOUNDS LIKE you were intending to mooch. And that is exactly what it sounded like.



I also clarified my statement about relying on kindnessThat is very nice, but people responded to what you said, not what you meant to say. Think about the chronology for a minute. And while the kindness of strangers (your new definition) may and probably will help you at times, relying on it is one of the worst ideas in the history of bad ideas. You and you alone are responsible for you.



you all need to take a good hard look at your posts and ask if they are positive guides to individuals No, we don't. This website does not exist to give you or anyone else what you want, in a way that will make you feel good about yourself. That is the big problem Jack saw. You think everyone should consider your needs and cater to them. It doesn't work that way, son, and if you hit the trail thinking everyone needs to see how they can best help you, in a positive way, you are going to be one big pain in the arse. Most others will have their own lives with their own problems, and will not have time or inclination to be a positive force in your life. That is your job. You are going to meet some true angels out there, and you are going to meet many people having bad days with no time for you.

You asked for opinions, and that's what you got. People posted their thoughts on the feasibility of a $1500 hike, just as you asked. It was not to be a positive guide to you or anyone else. It was information based on experience.

It is your job to take information given to you and see it you can use it.

The problem is that you don't like the answers, and rather than say, "Hmm, the experiences of people who have been there and done that indicate it is going to be a difficult undertaking," you get nasty and defensive. It is hard to learn anything new with that frame of mind.

No one is telling you that you cannot do it, only that it is difficult and will take great discipline and sacrifice. Either you have that or you don't.

You asked for advice and people were kind enough to give it. Say thank you, take what you like and leave the rest. Do whatever hike you think is best for you. Get out there, with whatever money you have, spend it as you and you alone want, and go as far as you can. Happy Trails.

JAK
11-27-2007, 00:42
Ain't going to multi quote 40 things today...

Tarlin did have some excellent points though. People don't like mooches. People don't like someone who thinks that you should pay them, just cause they're playing guitar in public, especially in hostels, they'll turn hostel. No, you can't have all of my beer you want, buy your own. If the sharing isn't reciprocal, you're cut off. Poor-poor-pitiful me people are the worst. If anyone has to do the above stuff to get by, they'll probably have a hard time.

In my younger days, women could sometimes get away with some of the above crap, by tempting me with their wares, but now they just get an earful that they don't like. I hear ya. Still you can be frugal and avoid all that. Also you can be a spender and still make a total ass of yourself. But where I am coming from, at age 20, without a car or an apartment, or a wife and kids, there is no reason not to attempt a thru-hike on $1500, not that I can see. Depends a lot on what sacrifices you are already putting yourself though putting yourself through school. In my day it was $20 a week for rent and $15 a week for groceries, and probably $20 a week too much for beer. I know its lots more than that, with tuition through the roof, but if that is the case I can't see a college kid ever being able to afford a thru-hike unless he's willing to do it very very cheap. If we say its $4500 then we might as well say don't bother unless mom and dad pay for it. Truth is, most are probably somewhere in between.

I just don't think a 20 year old should be spending in the same category as much as someone older. I know they can drink more beer, but that's all the more reason not to have so much to spend. I think most 20 year olds will probably get into less trouble and do more good for themselves and less grief for others if they set out and plan on a $1500 frugal hike rather than a $4500 beer fest, because at 20 that is were most of the extra would go. I think 20 year olds should plan on doing it faster also. Doesn't that make any sense?

For the average 20 year old, I would suggest:
Attempting it on something like $1500 over 100 days, and that still allows some beer money, but much less than they are probably used to. They don't have to finish it. But I think attempting to be frugal and reasonably moderate, even if you fail, is a far cry better than planning on being extravagant for your age and calling it responsibility.

JAK
11-27-2007, 00:46
Frosty,
You and I can disagree on what the kid sounded like, and what Tarlin's intentions were. My point is you are advising kids to be extravagant, and calling it responsibility, when it really isn't. I suggest you cut the kid some slack and make some positive suggestions on how he should learn to be discipline. There is very little virtue in a $4500 jolly at 20 years old, even if you make the money yourself some how. I can't really conceive of how you would think otherwise. Is it just their money you are after, or an argument?

Panzer1
11-27-2007, 00:56
If he's still in school how's he going to do a thru?

Panzer

EWS
11-27-2007, 01:01
I hear ya. Still you can be frugal and avoid all that. Also you can be a spender and still make a total ass of yourself. But where I am coming from, at age 20, without a car or an apartment, or a wife and kids, there is no reason not to attempt a thru-hike on $1500, not that I can see. Depends a lot on what sacrifices you are already putting yourself though putting yourself through school. In my day it was $20 a week for rent and $15 a week for groceries, and probably $20 a week too much for beer. I know its lots more than that, with tuition through the roof, but if that is the case I can't see a college kid ever being able to afford a thru-hike unless he's willing to do it very very cheap. If we say its $4500 then we might as well say don't bother unless mom and dad pay for it. Truth is, most are probably somewhere in between.
Asses do span all socio-economic lines. I realize I can be one.

A twenty-year-old should be able to do it on $1500. I'd stand a much better chance doing it on that amount now, than I would have at 20, though I won't.

About 80% of the Americans, I've met abroad, taking a break from college, have had the trip paid for by mommy and daddy. I respect the other 20% a lot more.


I just don't think a 20 year old should be spending in the same category as much as someone older. I know they can drink more beer, but that's all the more reason not to have so much to spend. I think most 20 year olds will probably get into less trouble and do more good for themselves and less grief for others if they set out and plan on a $1500 frugal hike rather than a $4500 beer fest, because at 20 that is were most of the extra would go. I think 20 year olds should plan on doing it faster also. Doesn't that make any sense?

Yes, it makes sense. It just runs opposite of a young persons desires though.


For the average 20 year old, I would suggest:
Attempting it on something like $1500 over 100 days, and that still allows some beer money, but much less than they are probably used to. They don't have to finish it. But I think attempting to be frugal and reasonably moderate, even if you fail, is a far cry better than planning on being extravagant for your age and calling it responsibility.

Rob has said he's out of shape and overweight in another thread, so I don't think he's going to get off to a running start.

Hopefully, people walking with $1500 remember to save enough money for a bus ticket home and they learn how to live the un-American way. I can still be an excellent time, which one can come away still respecting his/herself.

Appalachian Tater
11-27-2007, 01:05
The reality of what happens to most young people who attempt a thru-hike on $1500 is they they stop at Harpers Ferry because they run out of money, if they didn't drop out sooner for other reasons.

If you have the time, take whatever money you have and go out on a trail somewhere and start hiking until you run out of either time, money, or trail. Don't worry too much about which one you run out of first. Just enjoy being out there. A long-distance hike can be a very meaningful thing and it would be a shame to miss out on it or have it too constrained by worry about resources, either time or money. So don't worry about either one.

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:08
That's a good question Panzer. Most college kids take 4 months off in summer, which is plenty, but usually have to work it. Maybe he is graduating in the Spring, and will have some money left over. I don't know. I know that I did most of my sailing while still in school, and very little since. But you could just as well ask if he's finished school and working how's he going to do a thru? How does anyone do a thru?

I say do it young if if can, and cheap.
Also don't be a pain in the ass, but don't be a patsy neither.

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:17
EWS,
Good post. Points taken. I still think he should be encouraged to try and do it cheap rather than put it off until he has more money to waste though. Also, being out of shape at 20 can still be pretty decent shape, even these days. I would agree that some tough questions need to be answered, but I think more money is the wrong knee-jerk response for someone at 20 years of age.

A better question is how long can you go without fast food. Good question for all of us these days, which I will probably answer myself within a day or two. We will see. Rob said he will answer to that also. Then perhaps I'll ask him the beer question.

Reminds me of that old Bill Cosby joke.
"Noah, how long can you tread water."
"I've been good."

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:26
The reality of what happens to most young people who attempt a thru-hike on $1500 is they they stop at Harpers Ferry because they run out of money, if they didn't drop out sooner for other reasons.

If you have the time, take whatever money you have and go out on a trail somewhere and start hiking until you run out of either time, money, or trail. Don't worry too much about which one you run out of first. Just enjoy being out there. A long-distance hike can be a very meaningful thing and it would be a shame to miss out on it or have it too constrained by worry about resources, either time or money. So don't worry about either one.I agree with your second paragraph. Totally. It's not how far they get that matters, especially at that age, but what they experience and learn along the way.

My question is this however, because I don't know. Most of you probably do. I can only guess. Of those that run out of money at Harper's Ferry, why do they run out of money? Of those that are 20ish, what do they do most of their overspending on? My guess would be beer and tavern food mostly. Perhaps they could spend grocery money more wisely also, but I would guess that most of the excess is beer and tavern food mostly. Don't get me wrong. Not the worst thing to be wasting money on. Reminds me of WC Fields. Spent most of my money on women and booze, and squandered the rest. I just don't see the wisdom behind some folks' suggestions on waiting until you can afford to do more of it. Better than mooching I suppose. But why not encourage moderation, or as you suggest, moderation combined with seeing how far they might get. This is what my mother called moderation in all things, including moderation.

Appalachian Tater
11-27-2007, 01:35
The way people run out of money is to spend more than they have coming in. The secret is not to have a large income or wealth, but to spend less than you make.

Learn to differentiate between needs and wants and to control desire. There are whole religions built around these concepts.

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:36
Speaking of bus fare, how much is that, say from half way up the AT, or all the way, to back home again, for students? I could see trying to hitching or sharing a ride if you come across a safe one, but I agree that bus fare should be an integral part of the base plan / contingency plan. There might also be opportunities to work a pickup into the plan, combined with family vacation and what not, or some friends that are planing their own road trip. That might be harder to coordinate into an early bail out though, which should be planned for. Having bus fare makes sense, as does defering the expense until needed.

Panzer1
11-27-2007, 01:37
That's a good question Panzer. Most college kids take 4 months off in summer, which is plenty, but usually have to work it. Maybe he is graduating in the Spring, and will have some money left over. I don't know. I know that I did most of my sailing while still in school, and very little since. But you could just as well ask if he's finished school and working how's he going to do a thru? How does anyone do a thru?


It might help to know more about his circustances.

Panzer

Appalachian Tater
11-27-2007, 01:40
Speaking of bus fare, how much is that, say from half way up the AT, or all the way, to back home again, for students? I could see trying to hitching or sharing a ride if you come across a safe one, but I agree that bus fare should be an integral part of the base plan / contingency plan. There might also be opportunities to work a pickup into the plan, combined with family vacation and what not, or some friends that are planing their own road trip. That might be harder to coordinate into an early bail out though, which should be planned for. Having bus fare makes sense, as does defering the expense until needed.

Going somewhere, anywhere, when you don't have enough money to get home is pretty dumb. Sorry if that's offensive, but it needs to be said.

Panzer1
11-27-2007, 01:43
Good night everyone.

Panzer

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:45
Well said Tater. Actually I found that easier when I was in school and life was less complicated, and I did it on my own pretty much. It was after my school years that I made most of my mistakes and the real learning began.

Again, I like your idea of a college age student starting with $1500, plus bus fare, at the beginning of summer, or upon graduation, and then seeing how far they can get. Of course they would need next years college funds also, or time to find a job after graduating. In many ways, the frugal hiking itself is the easy part. Most often time is the real issue. Money makes it worse though.

EWS
11-27-2007, 01:49
I've met lots of dumb people stuck in some really weird places.

EWS
11-27-2007, 01:50
Time is harder to come by than money.

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:52
Going somewhere, anywhere, when you don't have enough money to get home is pretty dumb. Sorry if that's offensive, but it needs to be said.No offence taken. I think Rob's original question was that if he had $1500, plus backup finds, could the hike itself be done on that.

I think the basic answer should be yes, if you are disciplined and willing to see how far you get without spending too much on pizza and beer under peer pressure. I don't think the pat answer for someone at 20 should be wait until they have more money to spend. $1500 is enough to spend, as you say, even if they don't make it all the way.

JAK
11-27-2007, 01:58
I got stuck on the other side of the Digby Ferry once.
Time is the real commodity though, that's for sure.
It is even more rare than common sense, and that is saying alot.

Time and Tide wait for no man. That's for sure.

Speaking of which, must go. Good night. I've really enjoyed this thread. Let you all know how I make out on my quest. It seems Lent has come early for me this year. I will apologize to anyone that I have offended when I apologize to Jack. Of course I might hold out longer than Rob. We will see.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvWaD-NErlY&feature=related

A-Train
11-27-2007, 02:59
Time is harder to come by than money.

Really? I see it the opposite. Time is a lot easier to make than money.

JAK
11-27-2007, 03:19
Usually you have one, but not the other.
Or was it the other way around?

Anyhow,
if I want to be soaring with the eagles,
I need to stop howling with the owls.

rob123ufl
11-27-2007, 03:55
im not really an average 20 year old, in the sense that i have to support myself. so rather than having any type of beer budget, im usually more concerned with paying my utilities.

as for school, im taking off a semester. ive busted my ass the past couple years and i recently realized that i have all the time in the world to finish. this is the right time in my life to attempt the thru-hike.

as for hiking: ive done plenty. im not shooting for 100 days though, im thinking ill take it slightly more leisurely (as that's the point).

also, to address those who think i'm blatantly ignoring you trail legends/old timers, i'm really not. a lot of you are just argument/mongers and nay-sayers just wishing you were 20 with absolutely nothing to truly worry about. hopefully ill see you all out and the trail and we can put this foolishness behind us.

and as i will now likely finish most of my posts: go ahead and pick this one apart, make false assumptions and be cranky.

JAK
11-27-2007, 04:34
Thanks for the additional info. I also understand you guys down south have a drinking problem. I am of course refering to the legal drinking age being 21. :)

I also took a semester off, in my 4th year of what became a 5 year engineering program. It worked out very well. It gave me a chance to work a few extra months to make some money before the sailing season and I was still 20 when I graduated. 25 is still plenty young, especially with the drinking age being so damned high. :)

I recall your other thread now. You are on the beefy side I understand. Plenty of time to turn that into something more suitable for hiking. Don't feel like your body needs to be a certain size and shape though. It will adapt on its own. Anyhow, don't be afraid to have a few cold ones on your trip. Everything in moderation, including moderation.

Good luck with the contest. I'll keep you posted.

I checked out some grocery prices by the way. Cereals are a great staple because they are cheaper than sugars, and can contain some protiens. Also fibre, and vitamins and minierals. As cheap as $0.50/1000kcal, but might be closer to $1.00/1000kcal in practical sizes, but the bulk food section might be cheaper and allow smaller quantities. Oats are great, but you can only eat so much at once. Great foundation food though. Simpler sugars seem to run $1/1000kcal to $2/1000kcal for honey. Honey is good to have as an emergency fuel if you bonk, and as sweetener for tea and oatmeal and anything else. Milk and some meets run $3./1000kcal. Important for the protien, vitamins also. Didn't get a chance to check on lentils and stuff. I know most fresh fruit and veggies run about $1/pound and probably $3-$6/1000kcal. You'll want some of that when in town tough. Fresh orange juice in a big jug was $3./1000kcal. Probably much cheaper where you are. Very important rebuilding food. I would drink lots of that when in town also. Peanuts might be cheap where you are also. Raisins, currents, dates, similar to honey at $2/1000kcal. Canola oil here runs $0.40/1000kcal. You'll only need so much fat though, at least until you get more lean. Also probable more expensive in practical quanities. Again bulk food places might help, if you can find them. Anyhow, myself I wouldn't mail stuff ahead. I would just shop. With stuff like oats and milk and honey as staples, and some more pricey items for balanced nutrition, I think $2/1000kcal might be a good target average for frugal shopping. Frugal eating out probably runs $5-10/1000kcal, so I wouldn't do too much of that. Anyhow, food consumption will be more or less proportional to total weight on feet, time dstance travelled each day. Initially perhaps $5/10 miles, but as you lose weight and gain pace you might be able to get by on $6/15 miles. Don't know really. I will have to do some experimenting over winter, as I lose more weight. Cheers.

JAK
11-27-2007, 04:41
Of course you will need more than $6/15 miles. That is just resupply, and doesn't include extras. Overall $1500 will be about $10/15 miles per day, so you will still have $4/day to spend on making your food more interesting and nutritious, or saving up for more exotic luxuries, like pizza, or beer, or laundry.

Johnny Thunder
11-27-2007, 10:10
Rob, dude, what is wrong with sticking around for 3 more months and saving more money? Hike south with the people of a similar mindset...less distractions...less economics separating you from your soon-to-be-met friends. I mean, look at your wad and wonder how you'll do all the other things that aren't day-to-day expenses. Like, how are you going to replace your shoes? Your shirt? Your socks? What if something breaks? What if you get bit by a tick? Break a bone? Have to get home suddenly and then want to return to the trail? All of these things can happen in 100 days.

Shouldn't you have a little bit of financial flexibility instead of walking with a loaded dollars-and-cents revolver to the head?

Footslogger
11-27-2007, 10:30
feasability of a thru-hike with just over 1500 in the pocket?

==================================

Feasible with the following assumptions:

- All gear purchased in advance

- All transportation to/from trail arranged and paid for in advance

- Most food purchased in advance and maildropped to you on the trail

- No motel stays

- No restaurant food

- No alcohol or tobacco

======================================

Under the above conditions I think a thru with $1500 in pocket would be feasible ...but NOT very pleasant.

'Slogger

Mags
11-27-2007, 11:08
Rob, dude, what is wrong with sticking around for 3 more months and saving more money?

Apparently a lot. :)

I think what has been lost in the mix is money for AFTER the trail.

But what do I know. I'm just an old fart who is envious of a 20 yr old apparently. :)

( I worried more at 20 yrs old than I do now for reasons I'd rather not get into. Life became REALLY good as I became older.)

Johnny Thunder
11-27-2007, 11:19
Apparently a lot. :)

I think what has been lost in the mix is money for AFTER the trail.

But what do I know. I'm just an old fart who is envious of a 20 yr old apparently. :)

( I worried more at 20 yrs old than I do now for reasons I'd rather not get into. Life became REALLY good as I became older.)


I'm guessing that since he's taking off a semester he'll end up right back at school with his financials (relatively) taken care of by work/loans. So, maybe he has less to worry there.

But yeah, seems like a classic case of someone coming to the board with their decision already made just looking for someone to confirm what they already believed.

Panzer1
11-27-2007, 11:52
Is this thread still going...

Panzer

Johnny Thunder
11-27-2007, 11:54
Is this thread still going...

Panzer

Bump (why not?)

rob123ufl
11-27-2007, 13:41
i am going to start in georgia because i have friends who can drive me to the trailhead, saving me a lot of transportation money. i doubt they'd be willing to drive me to maine (actually, im hitching a ride with the travel and recreation program at University of Florida).

i have my mind made up about thru-hiking, yes. So i am not going to take the advice not to do it just because i don't have that much money. I wil take the advice about limiting expenses etc. You can say it's not feasible, but im not gonna listen to people telling me not to go, bottom line. I've thought that aspect through.

And to address the question, what about broken bones, flying home, etc... i like a little risk. well, a lot of risk.

Johnny Thunder
11-27-2007, 13:44
Good luck!

chief
11-27-2007, 13:59
i am going to start in georgia because i have friends who can drive me to the trailhead, saving me a lot of transportation money. i doubt they'd be willing to drive me to maine (actually, im hitching a ride with the travel and recreation program at University of Florida).
Never too soon to start mooching, huh?


i have my mind made up about thru-hiking, yes. So i am not going to take the advice not to do it just because i don't have that much money. I wil take the advice about limiting expenses etc. You can say it's not feasible, but im not gonna listen to people telling me not to go, bottom line. I've thought that aspect through.
So, why did you ask?


And to address the question, what about broken bones, flying home, etc... i like a little risk. well, a lot of risk.
Your 1,500 bucks will be long gone. You're not planning on mooching medical care and transportation are you?

jesse
11-27-2007, 14:12
Chief, cut the guy some slack will you. This is the first time I have ever heard someone bashed for "hitching a ride". If he has friends willing to help, God bless them. Its not the same as mooching off other hikers.

There has been enough "you shouldn't try it advice" He wants to do a $1500 hike, and is asking "how to do a $1500 hike advise".

If he makes it that will be great, if he dosen't, well that will also be great, because he will have had one hell uv a great section hike. If he dose not make it because he ran out of cash, well, he is still young, and he can save more money, and try again. No big deal either way.

Johnny Thunder
11-27-2007, 14:34
Rob, just a quick heads-up. I looked at Greyhound and they have Portland to Gainesville at $174 day of purchase and 7 day advance purchase at $89. Also, I was doing to Christmas shopping at Target last night and saw Champion Polyester shirts at 11.99, underwear about the same, and Boots for $39.99.

rob123ufl
11-27-2007, 15:01
well ill start considering the SOBO option then, Johnny. Also, Chief, i am just gonna take your post as humorous. otherwise youre beating a dead horse.

rob123ufl
11-27-2007, 15:02
and i have health insurance

chief
11-27-2007, 15:21
and i have health insuranceExcellent!

Appalachian Tater
11-27-2007, 19:17
Overall $1500 will be about $10/15 miles per day, so you will still have $4/day to spend on making your food more interesting and nutritious, or saving up for more exotic luxuries, like pizza, or beer, or laundry.

That's the problem: most people in the U.S. do not consider pizza, beer, or laundry exotic luxuries. Plenty of people in the world live on the equivalent of $1.00 a day. To them, $1500 to spend over six months would mean such luxuries as a bit of meat in the rice on occasion, a Coca-Cola for the kids, and maybe some of those used clothes that are rejected by U.S. thrift shops and sold by the ton to be sent overseas for retail sale to poor people. They might even buy a pig or a couple of chickens and perhaps even a bicycle or some new tin for the roof, or buy antibiotics to save their child's life.

In other words, if you are of the right mindset, you could thru-hike on $1500 with a little luck. Most people wouldn't be able to do it, but some could. I do respect somone who can do it.

rickb
11-27-2007, 19:27
In other words, if you are of the right mindset, you could thru-hike on $1500 with a little luck. Most people wouldn't be able to do it, but some could. I do respect somone who can do it.

One thing about hiking is that it can really suck from time to time. Sort of like real life.

One difference is in real life you have a whole host of options for making your self feel better: cuddling with your mate, a long hot shower, running around the track, vegging out in front of the TV etc, etc.

On the trail one is often left with good food as the only cure-all. And that can be expensive.

I am all for going cheap, but some back up source to help you through the doldrums would be great to line up in advance.

Programbo
11-27-2007, 20:26
He sacrificed a lot of the good times in town and such the rest of us had (which in my opinion is what it's all about) as a result.

I can recall when a thru hike was about getting away from the good times in town :p

Lone Wolf
11-27-2007, 20:31
I can recall when a thru hike was about getting away from the good times in town :p

today it's towns, big feeds, festivals and hostels that are the focus. especially if they can slackpack out of a hostel for a few days

Frosty
11-27-2007, 20:47
Frosty,
My point is you are advising kids to be extravagant, and calling it responsibility,Show me where I advised anyone to be extravagant. I told him it would take discipline and sacrifice to hike on $1500, and it will. The average price of a thruhike - average, not extravagant - was $2000 back in 1990. The cost of living hasn't gone down that I've noticed.




I suggest you cut the kid some slack and make some positive suggestions on how he should learn to be discipline.I did. At the beginning of this thread I suggested that he eat on $5 a day between now and the start of his hike.



Is it just their money you are afterWhat?

Just a Hiker
11-27-2007, 20:48
well ill start considering the SOBO option then, Johnny. Also, Chief, i am just gonna take your post as humorous. otherwise youre beating a dead horse.


You'll enjoy being a SOBO, and you might even spend less money!!:D

Frosty
11-27-2007, 21:05
You'll enjoy being a SOBO, and you might even spend less money!!:DEhhh. I think he will spend his $1500, whether he starts in GA or ME.

It would be super if he came back here next September and reported on what happened.

There is a reason why almost everyone spends more than $1500 on a thru, and why it is so remarkable when someone does it.

It is far less remarkable when someone SAYS he is going to do it.