View Full Version : Time to hike 30 miles
My son and I are planning a hike from Devil Fork Gap to Erwin, TN (about 32.5 miles) and I'm wondering how long it'll take us to make the trip. We're both in good health and physically fit. I'm a long distance runner - he's 16 years old, lean and trim.
Neither of us have any backpacking experience to speak of but I've done my homework and I'm confident we have the right gear (and attitude) to pull it off.
I'm figuring 2.5 / 3 days. Sound about right?
Thanks
Thomas
p.s. My first post - lots of great info on this site!
1/4 moon
12-18-2007, 19:31
that should be plenty of time to do it and enjoy it thoroughly(sp)
Welcome to WhiteBlaze tbradnc. The fine folks here can answer just about any questions you will have about hiking. :welcome
LIhikers
12-19-2007, 10:16
Unless you're out particularlly for the excersize make sure to build some extra time into your schedule. You never know when you might just want to sit in the sun and relax, or spend a few extra minutes marvelling at the wonders of nature. Since I haven't hiked south of Harper's Ferry yet I can't be more specific. Just make sure to enjoy the trip.
Just bear in mind that days are short this time of year (2 days shy of the winter solstice) so that might cut into hiking time. I don't imagine there's snow down there (???) but snow also slows things down a bit.
Kerosene
12-19-2007, 10:53
I'll echo the terrapin's comment on available daylight. This time of year, the sun will rise at 7:30 and set about 5:15. As first-time backpackers, it will likely take you awhile to break camp, and you'll want to give yourself sufficient time to find and setup camp before dark. I'd figure that you'll have about 7 hours of daylight to hike, assuming that you can get your 16-year old out of a nice warm sleeping bag before noon!
Given your fitness levels, and assuming you won't be carrying more than 30-35 pounds each, you can probably average about 2 mph or better, but since it's your first hike and you'll be figuring out your equipment I wouldn't push the pace. I'd plan to average 10 miles per day. If things are going well, then you'll want to hike more miles that first day, but I'd wait to push your limits until the second or third day. If there's a lot of rain, or a lot of snow/ice on the trail, then your pace will be slowed.
Tennessee Viking
12-19-2007, 15:40
Be careful. I hear it is going to be windy and cold. Snow is a possibility. Last weekend, Sams Gap to Big Bald was just covered in snow.
From Devils Fork Gap up to Sugarloaf Gap will be a good starting climb but once you get to the top its a relatively easy hike. Only a couple small steep climbs at High Rocks.
The real challenge will be Big Bald Mountain. Its a rollercoaster mountain. Up and down, then way up. Big Bald has been under some real hard conditions during the draught. Springs that are normally flowing dried up or went underground.
The hike from Spivey Gap to Erwin is only steep going up Flattop & Temple Hill Gap. Its mainly hillside on a slight down grade to No Business
I would recommend the Roan highlandd--the area a bit north of Erwin is nicer than the area to the south of it.
When are you leaving? I had thigh-deep snowdrifts in that area in the third week of April this year...
booney_1
12-21-2007, 16:51
backpacking is not the same as running. After the first day the front of your hips will be very sore. You spend a lot of time stepping up and down (with a weight) on your back.
I run a lot, and I'm always sore the first couple of days of a backpacking trip.
(you won't be out of breath....just sore)
This time of year, you'll be carrying heavy packs because of the cold. I lead a lot of boy scout hikes, and am familiar with 16 year old guys. Hiking 10 miles a day in these mountains is hard and an all day affair for experienced scouts. I would cut the mileage in half, and bring some good food and enjoy the outting. You will be losing the light around 4pm (sun will be hidden behind hills), so you have a little less margin for error in getting to camp. We usually hike the AT in the spring or summer, and the longer days are helpful in getting to camp and cooking in day light.
The speed at which my "experienced" older scouts hike is about 1 and half miles an hour. (including breaks). This sounds slow, but in the mountains, with backpacks,it is a pretty good rule of thumb.
Have a good time!!!
Pedaling Fool
12-21-2007, 23:51
Make sure you give us a trail report upon your return!
Thoughtful Owl
12-22-2007, 00:00
I lead a lot of boy scout hikes, and am familiar with 16 year old guys. Hiking 10 miles a day in these mountains is hard and an all day affair for experienced scouts. I would cut the mileage in half, and bring some good food and enjoy the outting. You will be losing the light around 4pm (sun will be hidden behind hills), so you have a little less margin for error in getting to camp. We usually hike the AT in the spring or summer, and the longer days are helpful in getting to camp and cooking in day light.
The speed at which my "experienced" older scouts hike is about 1 and half miles an hour. (including breaks). This sounds slow, but in the mountains, with backpacks,it is a pretty good rule of thumb.
Have a good time!!!
I would have to agree with Booney. When I am out with older scouts (15-18) from my troop they average about 1.5 mph and some of those guys run cross country. Now the young scouts...that's another story for another thread.
Let's go hiking!
River Runner
12-22-2007, 00:00
We did it in a day and a half slack packing this April, so with full packs, 2.5 to 3 days should give you plenty of time, barring severe weather.
pyroman53
12-22-2007, 00:20
I'm with Booney and TO...1.5 mile per hours...all day. I'm a bit older, not a runner, but in pretty decent shape, and 10 miles per day, 1.5 miles per hour seems to work for me. I can do more, faster, but I'm all about the journey...and as mentioned, I allways get sore cause nothin gets you in shape for hiking except hiking. Did the Balds north of Erwin last year, and they were awesome. Many say its some of the best on the trail.
Hope you have a great hike :)
briarpatch
12-22-2007, 15:09
I would have to agree with Booney. When I am out with older scouts (15-18) from my troop they average about 1.5 mph and some of those guys run cross country. Now the young scouts...that's another story for another thread.
Let's go hiking!
My experience matches Booney and Thoughtful Owl. And remember that the first day will likely be a short day anyway, due to the time spent getting to the trail.
Don't forget that a sunset time of 5:30 means dark in the mountains up to an hour earlier this time of the year.
Thanks to everyone for the suggestions and things to watch for. The amount of information and experience on this site is incredible.
Anyway, we're back and already planning our next hike. We're sore but both of us could have kept going - physically it was very challenging in some sections but it never got close to being unbearable. A few more hours of daylight would have been very helpful.
Next time I will pack more ready to eat food (snacks, bars, etc.) and carry less water. We didn't need as much water as we carried and we had too much food that required cooking. One more day and we would have had to start cooking food to eat.
My son and I both give the trip a 9 on a 1-10 scale and want to try something more challenging next time.
We made the trip in 2.5 days. The first 2 days we did 13 miles (I took my GPS to measure mileage). The last day was 6.3.
Day 1 - (total mileage 13) Left Devil Fork Gap at 8:00am in high spirits and made it to Sam's Gap in 5 hours. It was a tough slog uphill to begin with but we were fresh and well rested. No real problems other than "Gosh, this is tough..." moments.
Night 1 - The first night was pretty close to miserable. We got about 4 miles from Sam's Gap headed towards Spivey's Gap. We waited until dusk to pitch because we were on a hill and there were no level places to pitch the tent so we had to settle on a less than ideal campsite - as in unlevel. As soon as we got the tent up it started raining and we had to scramble to get everything covered. We ate huddled up in the dark pointing flashlights at each other so we could eat. Then, in the middle of the night I rolled over in my bag and the entire tent pitched about halfway over and the stakes pulled out of one side leaving the tent hanging loosely right over me, dripping wet. It quit raining at dawn and we got up -cold, wet and in *very* low spirits.
Day 2 - (total mileage 13) From the campsite to Spivey's Gap we went from "This sucks *so* bad" to "This is fun!" over and over again. The trip up Big Bald and over Little Bald was a killer. Snow on the ground, dense fog and cold-cold-cold. This was actually the most challenging part of the trip because we started off cold and miserable and until we got to High Rocks, about 2 miles from Spivey's Gap conditions went from bad to worse. As we came down from Little Bald it warmed up and by the time we got to High Rocks we took off our jackets and toboggans and things started looking up. We got to Spivey's Gap at 1:00, had lunch, filtered some water, had some fun talking about the hell we had just walked through and rested up for an hour. Then we headed out of Spivey's Gap to Nolichucky River. The first mile or so of that hike is very steep but once we got to the top we had a long downhill section and hiked into No Business Knob shelter at 4:30 - having learned our lesson from the night before we decided to stop there for the day.
Night 3 - Great! Nice level place to pitch the tent, we cooked under the shelter and went through our gear drying and repacking, had a nice hot meal and a good cup of coffee and slept well.
Day 3 - (total mileage 6.3 - Great hike, no problems, no complaints. Spirits were high and we had a father/son conversation the whole way.
And that was it... Reading back over my trip report it sounds worse than it was (well... it *was* pretty bad at times..). The bottom line is that I like a good physical and mental challenge and hiking definitely fits the bill. I also relish spending time with my kids and this is the ultimate for doing that. Thumbs up on this sport!
Thanks
Thomas
pyroman53
12-23-2007, 00:23
Sounds like overall a big success and the stuff that memories are made of. Yeah, it doesn't always work out as you plan, and sometimes you end up on a hill gettin a little wet. Its how you handle those situations and bounce back the next day that matters. Guaranteed you and your son will tell stories about the trip forever. By the time you're both done telling the story, the rain will have become a torrential downpour and the slope a knife edged ridge with a 100 foot drop! Sounds like its time to start panning the next trip.
As we came down from Little Bald it warmed up and by the time we got to High Rocks we took off our jackets and toboggans and things started looking up.
I enjoyed reading your report and am glad to hear you and your son had a good experience.
It's been some time since I heard the word toboggan(s) used as you did. I guess I haven't heard it used in place of watch cap or beanie since I lived in West Virginia.:)
Love a trip report written by someone who tells it the way it was, the good, the bad and the ugly. Sounds like you had the full range of climatic conditions to deal with which always keeps it interesting and challenging, makes for good stories later. Good job!
BTW, nice description of the first night out, had a good visual! LOL
nitewalker
12-23-2007, 09:19
great trip report! im glad you both had a great time on the trip. now i welcome you to the sport of backpacking/hiking. isnt it great!!! peace out,nitewalker
Thanks for the trip report. It sounds like a memorable trip--and that future trips should go more smoothly.
I wanted to make a comment on hiking speed. Two mph is pretty normal. For people as in shape as you are, you will probably speed up in the future to 2.5 or 3 mph. I think the slower 1.5 mph Scout rate is caused by the group factor more than the age and fitness factors. When talking to hikers who lead group hikes, I've heard that the larger group, the slower the pace. When you get a group size of 10 or more, the speed drops to around 1 mph.
And, yeah, as you found out, the camping thing can take a fair amount of time. That will decrease as you get more experience and develop a routine.
Now that you've gone out in the winter, a trip during the warm weather will be a piece of cake!
Thanks to everyone for the suggestions and things to watch for. The amount of information and experience on this site is incredible.
Anyway, we're back and already planning our next hike. We're sore but both of us could have kept going - physically it was very challenging in some sections but it never got close to being unbearable. A few more hours of daylight would have been very helpful.
Next time I will pack more ready to eat food (snacks, bars, etc.) and carry less water. We didn't need as much water as we carried and we had too much food that required cooking. One more day and we would have had to start cooking food to eat.
My son and I both give the trip a 9 on a 1-10 scale and want to try something more challenging next time.
We made the trip in 2.5 days. The first 2 days we did 13 miles (I took my GPS to measure mileage). The last day was 6.3.
Day 1 - (total mileage 13) Left Devil Fork Gap at 8:00am in high spirits and made it to Sam's Gap in 5 hours. It was a tough slog uphill to begin with but we were fresh and well rested. No real problems other than "Gosh, this is tough..." moments.
Night 1 - The first night was pretty close to miserable. We got about 4 miles from Sam's Gap headed towards Spivey's Gap. We waited until dusk to pitch because we were on a hill and there were no level places to pitch the tent so we had to settle on a less than ideal campsite - as in unlevel. As soon as we got the tent up it started raining and we had to scramble to get everything covered. We ate huddled up in the dark pointing flashlights at each other so we could eat. Then, in the middle of the night I rolled over in my bag and the entire tent pitched about halfway over and the stakes pulled out of one side leaving the tent hanging loosely right over me, dripping wet. It quit raining at dawn and we got up -cold, wet and in *very* low spirits.
Day 2 - (total mileage 13) From the campsite to Spivey's Gap we went from "This sucks *so* bad" to "This is fun!" over and over again. The trip up Big Bald and over Little Bald was a killer. Snow on the ground, dense fog and cold-cold-cold. This was actually the most challenging part of the trip because we started off cold and miserable and until we got to High Rocks, about 2 miles from Spivey's Gap conditions went from bad to worse. As we came down from Little Bald it warmed up and by the time we got to High Rocks we took off our jackets and toboggans and things started looking up. We got to Spivey's Gap at 1:00, had lunch, filtered some water, had some fun talking about the hell we had just walked through and rested up for an hour. Then we headed out of Spivey's Gap to Nolichucky River. The first mile or so of that hike is very steep but once we got to the top we had a long downhill section and hiked into No Business Knob shelter at 4:30 - having learned our lesson from the night before we decided to stop there for the day.
Night 3 - Great! Nice level place to pitch the tent, we cooked under the shelter and went through our gear drying and repacking, had a nice hot meal and a good cup of coffee and slept well.
Day 3 - (total mileage 6.3 - Great hike, no problems, no complaints. Spirits were high and we had a father/son conversation the whole way.
And that was it... Reading back over my trip report it sounds worse than it was (well... it *was* pretty bad at times..). The bottom line is that I like a good physical and mental challenge and hiking definitely fits the bill. I also relish spending time with my kids and this is the ultimate for doing that. Thumbs up on this sport!
Thanks
ThomasAwesome trip report! Four and a half dancing bananas!
:banana :banana :banana :banana :)
And that was it... Reading back over my trip report it sounds worse than it was (well... it *was* pretty bad at times..). The bottom line is that I like a good physical and mental challenge and hiking definitely fits the bill. I also relish spending time with my kids and this is the ultimate for doing that. Thumbs up on this sport!
It's a learning/growing experience. Hopefully you won't make the same mistake(s) twice. (You'll make more sophisitcated mistakes. ;)) Only one teensy complaint with this report... it's in the very last word... I don't think of hiking as a sport, because (as someone pointed out to me) sport implies competition. I think of hiking as recreation instead. There's a difference, and it's important.
Just Jeff
12-23-2007, 11:55
Unless you like to hike as competition. Against yourself, against nature, against others, etc. I like to view it as a competition against myself sometimes, and other times just as plain old recreation as you say. HYOH - and that's important. :D
I can definitely see the point about hiking/backpacking being considered recreation rather than sport. I totally get it.
Running is the same way. There are runners who compete against each other and there are people like me who just show up at races to run. I only win trophies when the real runners stay home but I enjoy the challenge - competing against myself more than others and sometimes the challenge is just to finish. ;-))
Thanks to everyone for sharing our experience with us!
Thomas
Ravendog
12-30-2007, 14:14
One piece of advice that I recently learned and cannot believe the difference it makes is to lose the flashlights and get one of the small headlamps. Coolest thing since titanium pots. It's easy to pitch a tent in the dark when you have both hands free and plenty of light. Anybody want to buy some flashlights? Thanks for the journal. It was a good read.
Pedaling Fool
12-30-2007, 14:39
One piece of advice that I recently learned and cannot believe the difference it makes is to lose the flashlights and get one of the small headlamps. Coolest thing since titanium pots. It's easy to pitch a tent in the dark when you have both hands free and plenty of light. Anybody want to buy some flashlights? Thanks for the journal. It was a good read.
True, but headlamps have one major drawback. You blind yourself when you point it at an object really close, I've do this everytime I take a "nature break" in the middle of the night while standing close to a tree.:D
Programbo
12-30-2007, 16:13
Thanks to everyone for the suggestions and things to watch for. The amount of information and experience on this site is incredible.....Anyway, we're back
You`re back?????..What did you post your question wondering how many days it would take the day before you left???:eek: ....LOL..Just teasing..Glad you had a great time and I`m sure you`ll enjoy the trail more and more in the coming years