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Ravendog
12-30-2007, 14:22
This may not be the place for this post, so my apologies if any of the rules are broken;)

However, I notice that quite a few folks on here are or were into scouting. As a Life scout who is still kicking himself in the rear (I'm 45) for not finishing out the Eagle rank, I'm going to try to make amends. My son will turn 11 in August which is the age that you can begin boyscouts. My question for any of you who are into scouting is how to pick out a troop?

My (and my son shares some of them) interests are anything on the water (fishing, surfing, kayaking, etc.) and backpacking/camping/outdoors. I really don't want to get hooked up with a bunch of non-outdoors types, so I'm leary about joining just any troop. Any ideas or any thoughts on starting a troop would be most appreciated. Almost all of my interests including surfing came from Boy Scouts, but a lot of this had to do with my best friends dad being an ex Army Ranger who showed us everything. Another buddy of mine who is an Army Ranger was somewhat blown away that I could tie a simple square knot and a bowline. Most people don't know how.

Thanks for the input.

Shiraz-mataz
12-30-2007, 14:31
When my son was a Cub Scout one of the requirements for earning "Arrow of Light" was to visit several local Boy Scout Troops. It was a nice way to sample the flavor of each troop and make an informed decision about which one to join after cross-over. Even though your son is not a Cub Scout I encourage you to do the same thing. Find out when all the local troops meet, contact each scoutmaster and schedule a visit. Depending on how many troops are in your area this may be a month-long process but you will end up in a troop that best suits your son's desires. Good luck!

Bearpaw
12-30-2007, 14:43
Picking a scout troop is sort of like picking a church or even buying a car. What meets your needs and makes will happy will differ from others.

But a couple of quick ideas might help. Ask folks at your council or district office. They'll give you ideas about which troops are more active with outdoor activities. Visit several troops and ask about their long-term trip plans. A troop that has no plan often wings it and boys tend to lose out.

Find out if the troop has a Venture crew or is involved with a Venturing Program, which will mean high adventure activities for older boys, a real hook which may help keep your son involved in his teen years and improve his chances at becoming an eagle. It will also imply at least a degree of corporate knowledge in outdoor skills for younger scouts.

Look, experience, form impressions, and ask your son which troop appeals to him most.

Oh, and try not to push Eagle on your son too much. I know I will have to work on this with any sons myself, but if he has fun with scouts and learns from it, he is ahead of the game. I wouldn't nugde him for rank until he is at least star or life. Otherwise, he may resent it. That said, I cut my Eagle too close for comfort myself, and just barely made it.

bigboots
12-30-2007, 14:54
Oh, and try not to push Eagle on your son too much.

I agree, with everyone above. Talk to scoutmasters and visit the troops during their meetings. See what activities are in the works and what they have done in the past (see how good they were). Talk to others who have boys in the troops already. One big thing is to see what the older scouts (8th grade and up) are like. They are the leaders for the younger scouts! If they seem to be good kids and are good leaders then the troop will be good.
Also a little pushing for advancement is good but don't press to hard, it has to be something that HE WANTS, NOT YOU! I've seen to many scouts quit because fathers had unresolved issues with not making it themselves. I personally know many successful men who did NOT make eagle but the skills they learned in scouting have served them just as well as those who did make it.
Good Luck

Bigboots

JimM
12-30-2007, 15:06
A friend of mine from scouting (now mid-50's) is still active with the old troop, and a major part of their program is devoted to outdoor activities. We both attended a business meeting several weeks ago, and spent some time reminiscing. They were getting ready for a weekend overnight hike.

I attended the Eagle Court of Honor for one of my son's friends recently, and saw many people I knew (but I didn't realize they were still active in scouting).

My point is that there may be people you know who are involved in scouting, and who would welcome someone with similar interests. Take the time to visit troops in your area...you may find some familiar faces.

SteveJ
12-30-2007, 15:33
I agree with all of the above, with some additional thoughts:

As you are visiting the troops, ask what role you can play. Generally, new adults can get involved in the troop as an Assistant Scoutmaster, assisting the Scoutmaster in one of several ways (Patrol Advisor, etc.), or on the Troop Committee (outdoor planning, finance, fundraising, etc.). Troops are generally thrilled to have dads join up in a leadership role who are Eagle Scouts. Ask if parents are welcome to come along on outings. If so, remember that your role on an outing is not to be dad, but to assist the Scoutmaster as he leads / counsels the boys. At the same time, you can be sure your son is getting all that he can out of the program. If the troop doesn't seem interested / willing to have you involved, be wary. If you get involved, plan on attending Boy Scout Leader training, so you'll understand how a troop should be run, and can be supportive in appropriate ways.

Ask if the troop is planning to go to summer camp this summer, and what the deadlines are for getting payment in and getting your son signed up for classes. Our council sign-up is coming up in Feb., and the good merit badge classes (rifle, archery, etc.) that the boys especially enjoy doing fill up quickly. If the troop is not planning to go to summer camp, look elsewhere. Boys that don't go to summer camp generally don't stay involved with scouting very long.

Get a feel for how the troop is run. As an Eagle Scout, I'm sure you know that a Boy Scout troop should be Scout-run, with appropriate adult support / counseling. If the troop meeting is extremely organized, well-planned, and has adults at the front all the time, the boys are probably not being allowed to plan and run the meetings, missing the opportunity to develop leadership skills.

Ideally, your son will find a troop where he has friends involved already. Get him involved early - we encourage our Cub Scout Webelos cross-overs to come as early as they can so the boy can feel that he's part of the group and knows everyone before going away to summer camp for a week.

Exciting times! Have fun!

Steve

SouthMark
12-30-2007, 15:45
I agree with all of the above, with some additional thoughts:

As you are visiting the troops, ask what role you can play. Generally, new adults can get involved in the troop as an Assistant Scoutmaster, assisting the Scoutmaster in one of several ways (Patrol Advisor, etc.), or on the Troop Committee (outdoor planning, finance, fundraising, etc.). Troops are generally thrilled to have dads join up in a leadership role who are Eagle Scouts. Ask if parents are welcome to come along on outings. If so, remember that your role on an outing is not to be dad, but to assist the Scoutmaster as he leads / counsels the boys. At the same time, you can be sure your son is getting all that he can out of the program. If the troop doesn't seem interested / willing to have you involved, be wary. If you get involved, plan on attending Boy Scout Leader training, so you'll understand how a troop should be run, and can be supportive in appropriate ways.

Ask if the troop is planning to go to summer camp this summer, and what the deadlines are for getting payment in and getting your son signed up for classes. Our council sign-up is coming up in Feb., and the good merit badge classes (rifle, archery, etc.) that the boys especially enjoy doing fill up quickly. If the troop is not planning to go to summer camp, look elsewhere. Boys that don't go to summer camp generally don't stay involved with scouting very long.

Get a feel for how the troop is run. As an Eagle Scout, I'm sure you know that a Boy Scout troop should be Scout-run, with appropriate adult support / counseling. If the troop meeting is extremely organized, well-planned, and has adults at the front all the time, the boys are probably not being allowed to plan and run the meetings, missing the opportunity to develop leadership skills.

Ideally, your son will find a troop where he has friends involved already. Get him involved early - we encourage our Cub Scout Webelos cross-overs to come as early as they can so the boy can feel that he's part of the group and knows everyone before going away to summer camp for a week.

Exciting times! Have fun!

Steve

Yes and find out which troops have adult leadership that has gone through at least Scoutmasters Basic Training and any that have Woodbage trained leadership.

rockrat
12-30-2007, 15:51
Find the troop whose Eagle Scouts completed their requirements within a month of their 18th birthdays. This will be the troop that puts more emphasis on outings than on advancing and therefor is the better troop.

rockrat
12-30-2007, 15:55
And also make sure they're not too strict about the uniforms, those are the troops that get made fun of at camporees. The ideal uniform is a Class A standard Boy Scout shirt during the fall, winter, and spring, and the option to wear a Class B, or scout oriented t-shirt, during the summer. People who emphasize those goofy socks and short shorts are going to be more advancement oriented.

bigboots
12-30-2007, 15:59
Find the troop whose Eagle Scouts completed their requirements within a month of their 18th birthdays. This will be the troop that puts more emphasis on outings than on advancing and therefor is the better troop.

Great Point.
To many troops that just hand out merit badges, make sure the program will make your son an eagle scout not just a scout who has received the eagle award.

Bigboots

Ravendog
12-30-2007, 18:20
Thanks for the ideas. As I said, I did not reach Eagle scout. It's a long story that involves surfing, girls, overbearing adults and a rift in the troop. I do not want to get involved in a troop that is just about how many merit badges one can achieve. I would prefer a troop that goes the bare minimum on merit badges, but focuses on the real outdoor skills. Camping was where it was at for our troop when we were having fun, and the adults didn't go nutso.

Monkeyboy
12-30-2007, 19:38
Thanks for the ideas. As I said, I did not reach Eagle scout. It's a long story that involves surfing, girls, overbearing adults and a rift in the troop. I do not want to get involved in a troop that is just about how many merit badges one can achieve. I would prefer a troop that goes the bare minimum on merit badges, but focuses on the real outdoor skills. Camping was where it was at for our troop when we were having fun, and the adults didn't go nutso.


Thing is, if the troop does it correctly, it would acheive both in one motion.....camping and merit badges.

Ravendog
12-30-2007, 20:38
True, our troop probably did both equally well. It all came down to the adult leadership. Thanks, all.

OregonHiker
12-30-2007, 20:51
Picking a scout troop is sort of like picking a church or even buying a car. What meets your needs and makes will happy will differ from others.

.

Certainly the level of activity is important. However, IMO how much the troop is "Boy led" is just as important. There is a nearby troop that does lots of stuff, but is more of a "parent led" troop.

bigboots
12-30-2007, 21:00
The troop I am with is very well set up, IMHO. The boys lead, and the adults are there for safety and reference. Also, the fathers help out at the weekly meetings but we try to avoid having the fathers of the boys who are at camp. To do this we use former scouts (mainly former eagles who range in age greatly) to attend camps as the adults. This avoids the problem of a father and son problem. And the benefit of having former eagles/high ranking scouts is great for advancement and example for younger scouts. For our backpacking trips (2x/yr) we put fathers in separate crews from their sons.
Seems to work well for us...09 is 50 yr anniversary of troop!:banana

Bigboots

OregonHiker
12-30-2007, 21:08
The troop I am with is very well set up, IMHO. The boys lead, and the adults are there for safety and reference. Also, the fathers help out at the weekly meetings but we try to avoid having the fathers of the boys who are at camp. To do this we use former scouts (mainly former eagles who range in age greatly) to attend camps as the adults. This avoids the problem of a father and son problem. And the benefit of having former eagles/high ranking scouts is great for advancement and example for younger scouts. For our backpacking trips (2x/yr) we put fathers in separate crews from their sons.
Seems to work well for us...09 is 50 yr anniversary of troop!:banana

Bigboots

This is as it should be. Well done:sun

Ravendog
12-30-2007, 21:20
That is a great idea, having the kids lead. However, scouting is not real big in my area, so finding older kids may be a challenge. Thanks for the ideas.

bigboots
12-30-2007, 21:23
That is a great idea, having the kids lead. However, scouting is not real big in my area, so finding older kids may be a challenge. Thanks for the ideas.

Not a problem, let the SPL do his job, to be a leader! (Thats why the adults are there; for situations that are more that he can handle)
Enjoy the hike!

Bigboots

OregonHiker
12-30-2007, 21:27
That is a great idea, having the kids lead. However, scouting is not real big in my area, so finding older kids may be a challenge. Thanks for the ideas.

It's not a great idea, it is THE idea. You would be surprised how well a 2nd year scout can lead. You just have to be creful to not judge success from the vanatge point of an adult.

littlelaurel59
12-30-2007, 22:09
In my experience, there are 2 primary things that keep boys involved in scouting: trips and friends. If a troop has a variety of interesting trips and your son enjoys going on them, he will do well. If he has friends in the troop with whom to share the activities, he will do well. The reality is that your son will want to spend more time with his friends than he does with you in the very near future. My son, now 14 and a Life Scout, rarely sees me on troop outings. We do father-son trips on our own when we want togetherness.

There are 2 primary things that distract older guys from scouts- petroleum and perfume. I agree with those who say that the primary focus should not be on rank advancement, but it should be encouraged early in the scouting experience. Most boys who become Eagle do so by advancing quickly early on, then taking their time (due to all the distractions of high school and adolescence) finishing up. Those who are still Tenderfoot at 16 will never stay with it. If a boy is active (attends meetings, goes on monthly outings, and attends summer camp) advancement will usually take care of itself.

Ravendog
12-31-2007, 11:21
Thanks for the advice. My experience was certainly along those lines (as soon as I got a car, I don't think I looked back).

jesse
12-31-2007, 11:31
I would second the idea of finding a troop that welcomes new adult leaders. Some troops have a few adults that try to do everything and don't want new leaders.

Tabasco
12-31-2007, 11:43
I've only been in scouting for 10 years, but I have NEVER heard of a Troop or Pack that would not welcome new leaders. I spend 70% of my time trying to get new leaders.

wpbucher
12-31-2007, 22:03
IMHO finding a Troop that follows the BSA program is crucial. Purchase a copy of the Boy Scout and Scoutmasters handbook for your own personal use. Also purchase The Others Scoutmasters Handbook by MarK Ray. This will provide a baseline for what the BSA program should be.

I would avoid Troops where boys are earning the rank of Eagle a few months/weeks/days before their 18th birthday. The BSA program offers numerous opportunities for outings, merit badges, and leadership positions. Thus, a Scouts should earn Eagle well before their 18th birthday.

I would look for a Troop that takes the Uniform seriously. The uniform is one of the eight methods of Scouting. Thus, leaders who do not utilize this method will tend to not utilize other methods and the deliver something other than the BSA program. Our Troop views the uniform as an external barometer of Scout Spirit. Boys would not be caught dead walking onto a baseball field without their uniform, but somehow uniforms in Scouting are viewed in a derogatory fashion. Scouts who are living the ideals of Scouting would never make fun of another person due to their appearance.

Here are some good thoughts on Leaders who do not follow the BSA program: http://netcommish.com/AskAndySmart.asp

I would look for a Troop that has one or more Junior Assistant Scoutmasters (JAS). When a Scout becomes and Eagle Scout they have held leadership positions within the Troop. They have "been there done that". At that point they take on the position of JAS. This position takes them out of the "Scout structure"...like Troop elections. The JAS position enables the Scout to teach/help the Troop as needed.

Beware. There are many Troops that do not follow the BSA program. They deliver a program that can charitably be called "Advanced Cub Scouts".

Another resource is to read all of the "Ask Andy" columns at: http://netcommish.com/askandy.asp

I don't agree with 100% with Andy...but it is pretty close.
Good luck!!!

gsingjane
01-01-2008, 09:30
WPBucher, thanks for the food for thought. I think you raise some interesting points... it can be hard, though, to find a troop that operates as you recommend. I have a friend whose son has already been through 4 troops in our area, and none of them has been "Scout-y" enough.

I would also add that my son was just signed off on his Eagle project last night.... his 18th birthday is in five days, believe it or not. I look at what he did, in terms of the project and the delays and the stalling and the disorganization, as entirely his own fault. Everybody said, starting in the year 2000, don't stall on your Eagle until you're applying to college/doing financial aid apps/working//finishing your Senior year. But my son, like an awful lot of kids, knows everything and refused to listen to any good advice. His Scoutmaster and the advancement staff did everything they could to get him going on it sooner, but he was the one who blew them off.

I am just so relieved it's done, although the process of getting there will not leave a pleasant memory for me or anyone else in our poor family, which wound up doing about 90% of the volunteer work because nobody else wanted to come out and work in the cold.

Jane in CT

SteveJ
01-01-2008, 10:40
Hi, Jane - Congrats to your son! It's interesting that when I talk with my son about his Eagle project, he has an entirely different view of what he learned / experienced than what I thought he would or that we had. When he did his Congressional interviews for a Service Academy appointment (1 Senator and our Congressman), his Eagle project and what he learned doing it was a big part of the interviews... Hopefully your son learned something!

Steve

gsingjane
01-01-2008, 12:36
Steve, time will give the needed perspective (I hope). He did have some unanticipated challenges (largely due to weather) but he also recognizes, even at this point, exactly how much time he frittered away, "planning to plan" and, more importantly, why he stalled. Part of it involved a subject matter (carpentry) that he was totally unfamiliar with, and rather than asking for help and advice, I think he engaged in magical thinking, that somehow it was going to fix itself or miraculously wind up done (like the shoemaker and the elves!).

I have to say, though, that at least his project involved a lasting change and something that people can view and appreciate. An awful lot of the projects that guys in his troop did are, IMO anyhow, pretty small beer, and don't result in anything that anyone can observe or that will last.

Jane

cannonball
01-01-2008, 13:17
I've only been in scouting for 10 years, but I have NEVER heard of a Troop or Pack that would not welcome new leaders. I spend 70% of my time trying to get new leaders.


This is generally the case. I noticed when my boy crossed over to Boy Scouts, a long standing very active troop, things really sucked. The adult committee members were some sickl puppies in my opinion. They had thier boys in scouting to justify thier being there. Hell some of the kids had quit or Eageld out and yet somre parents hung on. They were very clicheish and as a new comer I felt like I was intruding and could'nt break into the "good ole boy" network. They preached "boy leadership' But I never saw any one working with the green bars to help them be effective leaders. The older boys would'nt help the younger opnes and as an adult I was chastised more than once fortrying to intervene. Thus the troop was ran by the " Lord of the flies" method. I never saw a more dis respectable bunch of spoiled brats in my life. We eventually left the troop and am glad we did.

Lessons learned:
The Boy led concept is a good one but no boy at age 14-15 can lead with out being led.

If your an active adult, always check your motivation for doing it.

Wilson
01-01-2008, 13:38
As a former Scoutmaster, I can say boy led is a fine goal...But, if you really want to get out and go camping, hiking, canoeing, ect. ya need adult (PARENT) leaders who actually like to do that kind of stuff.

Otherwise you just go to council camporees (which are fine, for what they are), and non camping activities......

Most boys want to camp ....Most adults don't want to camp.

My church asked me to restart our troop after it was dormant for few years, started out with a bunch of eager 12 year olds. It was a hoot to take them out.
Once they started hitting 16 and 17 I was ready for some of them to go, some were a negative influence on the younger ones.

My boys are 4 and 6, can't wait to get back into it.

CaptChaos
01-01-2008, 19:07
I find this thread very interesting.

I was a Scout and made it to Star and then got out. What a mistake but the car fumes and perfume got to me before the leaders found out and I lost interest.

My son on the other hand did not like to wear his uniform and had a lot of peer pressure and he dropped out. It was such a loss for me as a former Scout as he had reached Life and had just completed his Eagle project and had 5 badges to go and he would have been an Eagle Scout. But the peer pressure from his friends was to much and he dropped out.

What is bad is that the saved a girls life here in Bowling Green, KY while he was still in scouting and he was awarded the Medal of Honor with Crossed Palms for Lifesaving and at the time was the only Scout from KY to ever have received such an honor. He went to Washington, D.C. and visited the President of the United States and he help to lay the flowers at the Tomb of the Unknown. So much going on for him and he drops out because his friends made fun of him for being a Scout.

Having been a Scout and also being part of a Troop I would suggest that you have a lot of trips and keep them interested or they will not stay in.

As I was told to late they have to get Eagle before they smell car fumes and perfume or you will lose them and I really think that this happens most of the time.

John "Capt Chaos" Knight
Bowling Green, KY USA

Monkeyboy
01-01-2008, 19:46
One thing our troop is doing this year to avoid the car fumes and perfumes is starting a Venture Crew.....

It is a co-ed group of boys and girls from 14 to 20......

Keeps the older kids interested....
Teaches leadership....
Allows for more high adventure stuff.....

And our troop, cub pack and girl scout troops love it, because it provides teachers of skills the other parents may or may not know.

cannonball
01-02-2008, 18:23
A strong OA lodge keeps older kids in scouting. Trouble is that a lodge is ran like a troop.

bigben
01-03-2008, 14:43
I made Eagle Scout in 1988. My troop was badass! We made it a point to have at least one overnighter every month of the year, regardless of weather. And while Cincinnati isn't exactly the Yukon, February is still pretty cold.

My son is 6 and I'll be where you're at in a few years. I've thought about this and here's the answer to how to pick a troop who actually holds camping/hiking/BPing, etc. as a big priority. Ask the scoutmaster if they've been to Philmont in the past 5 years. Then ask him how many boys from the troop have. If said troop has a bunch of kids who have been there, and especially leaders who have, it's a safe bet that they're the kind of troop you're looking for. If they've been more than once, all the better, because once might mean they all came back thinking "I'll never do that again." Twice or more means, unequivocally, that they came back thinking "I've GOT to do that again!" and that's what you want.

Bigben

Monkeyboy
01-03-2008, 21:38
I made Eagle Scout in 1988. My troop was badass! We made it a point to have at least one overnighter every month of the year, regardless of weather. And while Cincinnati isn't exactly the Yukon, February is still pretty cold.

My son is 6 and I'll be where you're at in a few years. I've thought about this and here's the answer to how to pick a troop who actually holds camping/hiking/BPing, etc. as a big priority. Ask the scoutmaster if they've been to Philmont in the past 5 years. Then ask him how many boys from the troop have. If said troop has a bunch of kids who have been there, and especially leaders who have, it's a safe bet that they're the kind of troop you're looking for. If they've been more than once, all the better, because once might mean they all came back thinking "I'll never do that again." Twice or more means, unequivocally, that they came back thinking "I've GOT to do that again!" and that's what you want.

Bigben


I'd have to disagree with the Philmont question.....

Our troop does ALOT of camping and high adventure, but have never been to Philmont....ever.

There are tons of other places to go and have the same quality program without the expense of going out west to Philmont.

Bearpaw
01-03-2008, 23:35
There are tons of other places to go and have the same quality program without the expense of going out west to Philmont.

If you haven't been to Philmont, it's hard to understand, but there is NOTHING in scouting like it. Florida Sea base was neat, but it didn't give the same feeling of Philmont. Philmont is so much more than just backpacking. The various staffed activities and whole atmosphere create a lasting impression on scouts unlike any thing else I did in 7 years of scouting.

Bearpaw
01-03-2008, 23:39
Capt Chaos,

What troop was your son with? I earned my eagle in 1989 with Troop 202 in Bowling Green. It ran very much in the way that WPBucher noted in his post. I can only hope to find a troop that worked as well for my children down the road.

OregonHiker
01-04-2008, 00:48
If you haven't been to Philmont, it's hard to understand, but there is NOTHING in scouting like it. Florida Sea base was neat, but it didn't give the same feeling of Philmont. Philmont is so much more than just backpacking. The various staffed activities and whole atmosphere create a lasting impression on scouts unlike any thing else I did in 7 years of scouting.


I think Dad (me) had just as much at Philmont

Ravendog
01-04-2008, 01:10
It has been very insightful reading all of the responses to this thread. In my opinion based on "my" experience with scouting, leadership from the boys was good for the inside experience, but having adults who had interest in the outdoors was crucial to getting the full experience from scouting. You have to have a good blend, and I would have to say that this mindset has to come from the adults.

PS. My Uncle who served in World War II and saw quite a bit of combat action always contributed his survival to the Boy Scouts.

Lellers
01-04-2008, 01:24
Yeah, I don't think the Philmont question would necessarily point out a troop that doesn't put on a good outdoors program. Our troop is out every month, as well, and the boys do a 100-mile BP trip in the summer. We only had one scout go to Philmont in recent years - my son, who loved it. Philmont is really expensive for our families, and so we can't field a Philmont crew from our troop. Going with a council contingent is not easy, either, as there is a two-year wait list, at least.

Here's what I wonder: Is there a boy scout troop in the town of Cimarron? If there is, do they go to Philmont, are are they just bored of having it in their back yards?

When we visited New Mexico a few years ago and people heard we were from the east coast, I was constantly asked about the AT. I just said, 'Yeah, it's right in my backyard. Trouble is, my backyard is in Pennsylvania."

HoosierHiker
01-04-2008, 01:34
I was involved in scouting with my oldest son and encouraged him to particiapte in everthing that interested him. He attended a national jamboree as well as three summer camps. In the end he quit at age 15 because his troop was more involved in earning merit badges and ranks than enjoying the outdoor activities. He's 20 now and his fondest memories are winter campouts, hikes, and learning outdoor skills from his Assistant Scoutmaster. He hated the Jamboree - too crowded and too many scouts earning easy one day merit badges. As a young adult he enjoyed interacting with people and acquiring skills at summer camp is a less crowed woodsy environment.

We had a very sucessful cub scout pack that had more outdoor activities than the boy scouts. The troop was sucessful for a few years until adults who stressed advancement over campouts took over. Unfortunatley most of the troops in our area don't do a lot of camping anymore. I observed that boys tended to stay in scouts longer if their parents were involved and didn't force them to stay active when the ygot older. One scout in our troop did finish his eagle after dropping out for six months.

Good luck.

SteveJ
01-04-2008, 02:14
Interesting! I think one thing we can learn from this thread is that every troop is different! I'm the Committee Chair of a troop that is very active in outdoors activities: we camp every month (mix: 3 to 4 backpacking trips a year - including a "Polar Bear" in January or February, 2 - 3 camporee's a year, 1 whitewater trip, 1 mtn biking trp, 1 ski trip), we have had a group go to Philmont about every other year for the last 6 years or so (have 2 crews going next year - one on a trek, one on a calvaclade), 3 trips to Northern Tier in the last 6 years, and 1 trip to Seabase. Our Scoutmaster is the Camp Director for the Council's Ranger Camp for older scouts / Venture scouts. To say that we focus on outdoor activities that give the boys the opportunity to have fun would be an understatement. We also have very active adult support to be able to deliver this type of program for the boys (4 of our adult leaders are Wood Badgers, and we ask every ASM to go through Scoutmaster training).

We also have had 54 Eagle Scouts in the last 13 years. While we focus on camping, we put camping in the perspective of the outdoors skills and leadership skills the boys should be learning as they camp and earn their merit badges: camping, backpacking, wilderness survival, first aid, etc. We make sure the boys are operating in patrols as they do this, with the SPL, ASPLs and PLs leading the troop as we undertake these activities. We make a committment to every boy (and their family) that joins our troop that if they want to earn the rank of Eagle Scout, they will have the opportunity and support to do so. We have 3 adults (2 parents of Eagle Scouts - 1 ex SM and 1 ex CC, 1 Eagle Scout parent) who work with the Life Scouts in our troop, supporting and counseling them as they work on their Eagle rank and project.

At the same time, we have a boy run troop! The SM and ASM's roles are to counsel and support the SPL, ASPLs and PLs as they attempt to fill their roles.....

I think it's a fair question to ask whether or not the troop has gone to Philmont (or the other two high adventure bases). If they have, it lets you know they focus on the boys' outdoor experience. It doesn't necessarily mean the troop doesn't focus on this if they haven't, but is a good indicator....

I also agree that the more active the parents are, the better chance the boys stay involved and go all the way to Eagle. I would say that the parents of the majority of our Eagle Scouts have been registered leaders wth our troop - either as SM, ASM or Committee Members. That's one reason I suggest that prospective scout's parents ask about their role in a troop....

All of our experiences are different, and based on the area we live in and the types of troops we have access to... I think these are things parents of Webelos Scouts or new Boy Scouts should be aware of as they work with their son to select a troop....

Just an opinion!

Steve

Thoughtful Owl
01-04-2008, 14:18
This may not be the place for this post, so my apologies if any of the rules are broken;)

However, I notice that quite a few folks on here are or were into scouting. As a Life scout who is still kicking himself in the rear (I'm 45) for not finishing out the Eagle rank, I'm going to try to make amends. My son will turn 11 in August which is the age that you can begin boyscouts. My question for any of you who are into scouting is how to pick out a troop?

My (and my son shares some of them) interests are anything on the water (fishing, surfing, kayaking, etc.) and backpacking/camping/outdoors. I really don't want to get hooked up with a bunch of non-outdoors types, so I'm leary about joining just any troop. Any ideas or any thoughts on starting a troop would be most appreciated. Almost all of my interests including surfing came from Boy Scouts, but a lot of this had to do with my best friends dad being an ex Army Ranger who showed us everything. Another buddy of mine who is an Army Ranger was somewhat blown away that I could tie a simple square knot and a bowline. Most people don't know how.

Thanks for the input.

It has been interesting reading this thread. Some did offer advise on how to "pick out" a troop and others simply told of their experiences. While this is great too, you ask a guestion and are expecting an answer.

As an Eagle Scout, father, former Cubmaster, former Webelos Den Leader, and now a Scoutmaster, (and did I mention, the father of an Eagle Scout)I would suggest you visit as many troops within the driving distance you are willing to travel and ask not just the adult leadership, but the youth members as well about their outdoor program. Be prepared to ask pointed questions such as, When & where was your last canoe trip? When & where was your last backpacking trip? etc. Find out what a units strengths are. Ie we have a troop in our area that spends a lot of time climbing and repelling, where as we backpack and canoe a lot.
When I was a youth, my parents were willing to drive me anywhere I wanted to for scouts as long as I was committed; they drove me 22 miles one way every week for many years until I was old enough to drive myself. I made Eagle in 1976.

Wish you the best and Happy Scouting!

bigben
01-04-2008, 23:58
I think it's a fair question to ask whether or not the troop has gone to Philmont (or the other two high adventure bases). If they have, it lets you know they focus on the boys' outdoor experience. It doesn't necessarily mean the troop doesn't focus on this if they haven't, but is a good indicator....

That's what I was getting at. I don't mean that if a troop doesn't go to Philmont that they can't have outdoor activities as a big focus. I mean, if I was a scout in somewhere like Jackson Hole or Aspen or Moab, there's tons of FREE high adventure to be had. Philmont is just a very special place and experience, and I stand behind my statement as being a good one to test the waters. And I'm sure that if you asked a dedicated, outdoor-oriented scoutmaster this question and he said no and you gave him that "OK, this must be a wimpy troop" look, he'd be the first to say why they haven't gone and how they've done all the other things in that vein instead. Either way, my question will probably get you your answer. And if he simply says no, then YOU ask why and if there's other similar things or high adventure trips(formal or not) that they've done. If he still says no, keep looking.

Bigben

BTW: you have to go to Philmont! If you are on WB, trust me, you LOVE it. I went twice, 1986 and 1988, completely on my own teenage dime.

Monkeyboy
01-05-2008, 01:28
I think it's a fair question to ask whether or not the troop has gone to Philmont (or the other two high adventure bases). If they have, it lets you know they focus on the boys' outdoor experience. It doesn't necessarily mean the troop doesn't focus on this if they haven't, but is a good indicator....

That's what I was getting at. I don't mean that if a troop doesn't go to Philmont that they can't have outdoor activities as a big focus. I mean, if I was a scout in somewhere like Jackson Hole or Aspen or Moab, there's tons of FREE high adventure to be had. Philmont is just a very special place and experience, and I stand behind my statement as being a good one to test the waters. And I'm sure that if you asked a dedicated, outdoor-oriented scoutmaster this question and he said no and you gave him that "OK, this must be a wimpy troop" look, he'd be the first to say why they haven't gone and how they've done all the other things in that vein instead. Either way, my question will probably get you your answer. And if he simply says no, then YOU ask why and if there's other similar things or high adventure trips(formal or not) that they've done. If he still says no, keep looking.

Bigben

BTW: you have to go to Philmont! If you are on WB, trust me, you LOVE it. I went twice, 1986 and 1988, completely on my own teenage dime.






Well, I guess the asking of the question and the scoutmaster's response theory was proven true......

I took the bait anyway..... :)

It's just difficult, as you may know, to get people to be able to take a three week vacation.....

I know I couldn't do it....as I own my own business, extended vacations is a little hard to do.....

The longest vacation I've ever taken was two weeks in Germany.

But we try to accomidate the high adventure stuff on our own, and get pretty ingenious at doing it ourselves.

I also know that Philmont is a dream come true, but we also have a lot of low income families in our troop, and coming from Florida, it would be very expensive to say the least.

Maybe some day......

Our troop did enjoy Camp Daniel Boone though.....another nice camp to check out, if you haven't. I know it's no Philmont, but a very active camp indeed.

Thoughtful Owl
01-06-2008, 00:51
Well, I guess the asking of the question and the scoutmaster's response theory was proven true......

I took the bait anyway..... :)

Our troop did enjoy Camp Daniel Boone though.....another nice camp to check out, if you haven't. I know it's no Philmont, but a very active camp indeed.

Be there done that. You ought to check out Blue Ridge Scout Reservation. They have a great backpacking program (High Knoll) as well as base camp and other high adventure programs.