View Full Version : Dog gear
Ok, I have a few questions about some gear for my dog on my thru hike next year. For starters, I will be picking him up in Hot Springs around mid-April so keep that in mind with weather. I sleep in a hammock, and will get him used to laying in it with me when necessary, but for the most part he will sleep under me under the tarp. For the ground I will make a sleeve with tyvek on the bottom, and a nylon vellux blanket on top. The vellux is very warm like fleece, but much lighter, easier to pack, and easier to clean. This sleeve will be open on one end so I can slide in half a z-rest. When in my hammock the sleeve will be used without the z-rest to protect the hammock from his claws. Does this sound like enough insulation for him? Oh yeah, he is a german shepherd/border collie mix weighing 40 lbs.
Second question is, are all the implant chips prety much the same. If I get one brand, will all scanners be able to read it? I don't want to get a chip and it not read in other scanners.
Last question for now. What about diet. I will take him to a vet and ask all of these questions, but they don't have first hand knowledge so I wanted to ask here. Are there any people foods I should avoid? Chocolate is obvious, and candy and treats aren't what I mean. I will be carrying dehydrated meats and veggies, and if I could I would like to add some of this to his food at times. Does anyone have a good commercial food they reccomend for a dog on a long hike.
I appreciate any suggestions and help.
doggiebag
01-06-2008, 19:43
My dog did very well on dry cat food on the trail (it's all protein) which allowed him plenty of pep. Whenever we got to a town/gas station - I'd get him a couple of big cans of wet Alpo. Just to give him a treat. I always shared my mountain house dinners with the dog. He loves pop-tarts and pretty much whatever I ate. I've got a cattledog which is a pretty tough breed. He's about the same weight as your dog. Though he's been putting on the pounds lately.
wrongway_08
01-06-2008, 20:30
The food, think along the lines of what you need while hiking. You'll need to feed him a little more then usual because, just like you, he is burning more calories then normal.
The chips are all suppose to be readable by all scanners.
The insulation should be fine, how is your dogs coat? Thick, thin, long fur, short haired? If he has a solid coat (full) he will be fine. German Sheppards usually have a short but full coat that will be fine.
shelterbuilder
01-06-2008, 20:43
Try not to give your dog grapes (or raisins!) of any kind - there's some chemical in them that can kill dogs in sufficent quantities (I think it causes renal failure, but I can't remember). Pork products also aren't too good for some dogs. Foods in the onion family are also potentially fatal.
As for commerical dog foods, any of the higher end dog foods should be good, but you'll still need to feed him more. Purina ONE, Iams, Eukanuba. Make sure that he will eat it before you hit the trail; some dogs are (or become) finicky. Think about supplementing his food with some oil. If you can feel his ribs, he's probably close to an ideal weight; if you can SEE his ribs, he needs more food! Try feeding him several times a day instead of one big meal - less chance of gastric torsion - you CAN'T deal with this on the trail, and it's a real emergency.
Not certain about the microchips - check with the vet. Good luck - watch out for snakes and skunks (a leash is good insurance against these!).
I've heard about the cat food before. I'll look into that more. Some of the higher end canned dog food has rice and whole veggies in it. Since that will be a large part of my diet, I figured I could add to his food with that. My only concern with cat food is that it isn't designed for dogs, so it may be lacking in certain vitamins or whatever that dogs need more than cats. Or it may be too heavy in some that dogs don't need. So I could try mixing, half cat food and half dog food. That should be a safe balance.
I've found some dog food that is designed for working dogs. I will probably look at the ingredients and nutritional values. Any idea what daily value I should look for? For example, if regular dog food is based on x% of calories, fat, and everything, should I aim for doubling that? So either give him twice as much of his regular food, or look for a better food that has double the values in a regular serving?
His coat is short, and pretty thick in the winter. You can't see any skin even when you move the hair around except for his underside. Very much like a shepherd's coat. So I just want to provide some good insulation for the bottom.
I appreciate all your help.
Try not to give your dog grapes (or raisins!) of any kind - there's some chemical in them that can kill dogs in sufficent quantities (I think it causes renal failure, but I can't remember). Pork products also aren't too good for some dogs. Foods in the onion family are also potentially fatal.
As for commerical dog foods, any of the higher end dog foods should be good, but you'll still need to feed him more. Purina ONE, Iams, Eukanuba. Make sure that he will eat it before you hit the trail; some dogs are (or become) finicky. Think about supplementing his food with some oil. If you can feel his ribs, he's probably close to an ideal weight; if you can SEE his ribs, he needs more food! Try feeding him several times a day instead of one big meal - less chance of gastric torsion - you CAN'T deal with this on the trail, and it's a real emergency.
Not certain about the microchips - check with the vet. Good luck - watch out for snakes and skunks (a leash is good insurance against these!).
Ok, I didn't know about the raisins. I would share my trail mix with him, so I will just give him the nuts. He does get sick from eating real pig ears, so that's something I will avoid too.
I have a source of high end dog foods that use better ingredients than most, and I will have that mail dropped to me. Otherwise I will supplement with food I buy on the trail. Most of his food will come from here, so I know he will eat it. I will be carrying ev olive oil for myself, coudl I put a small splash of it on his food occasionally?
As for the leash, I will keep him on one. He is perfectly happy walking beside me, so wouldn't mind a leash.
Again, thanks for all the answers. I will be taking him to the vet soon and asking all of these questions when I take him for his yearly check up. I just want to hear from those who know first hand. Most of the vets around here work with small yappy house dogs who've never been in the woods. Nothing against the vets, but they don't have the experience dealing with this.
shelterbuilder
01-06-2008, 21:13
Yes, olive oil should work. Also, consider what you will do when (not if) he has cracked pads, or bruised ones. Maybe a set or two of dog booties to protect his feet from our beloved Pa. rocks!!!
While I think of it - you can give a dog aspirin (the standard dosage is 5 mg per pound every 12 hours), but NEVER ibupofen bcause they can't excrete it and it quickly builds to toxic levels. While this will give the dog relief from any pain and swelling, it does not remove the underlying cause of the pain or swelling. I used to give one of my lead sled dogs aspirin for two days after a training run to relieve pain from mild arthritis - aspirin and 4 or 5 days of rest, and he was as good as new! (Yes, the rest was the most important part of it!)
The insulation factor not only depends on the breed of the dog, but what kind of temperatures the dog is used to. Will the dog sleep inside or outside at home before the trip? I read the post a couple of times and wasn't sure if the dog had the option of a cover, or was sleeping on top of the whole thing.
Is the dog you're getting in April a puppy? Remember that for the health of a growing dog, you don't want them carrying weight until they're grown. That isn't to say not to get him/her used to the pack, just really watch the weight for the first 18 months or so.
Most of the "premium" dog foods have a formula for "active" or "working" dogs that will work, with less bulk/weight than cheaper foods. Check out their websites.
Yahoo groups has a group titled "traildog" that sometimes has some interesting posts, too.
Also, in regards to the packing, I had the idea originally that the dog would carry her own gear. (I'm not a thru hiker, just a multi-day hiker/camper.) After the first hike, she had a light pack, and I was still packing all the constant weight, I changed my mind. I decided that I'd give her a load that didn't change as much as her carrying her food. (I'll carry the stuff that loses weight every day!) So now, she helps with some of the more constant weight items; items I can stuff in her pack, ie. half the weight of a two man tent, my sleeping pad (hers is too wide) first aid kit, etc. (My dog is 70 lbs)
Yeah, I forgot to mention about his pads. I will look into either vaseline, which is easier to get on the trail, or udder cream to put on his pads every night. Unless they are doing fine that is. I will get the boots for really bad areas. Last time he hurt his leg the vet said give him half an asprin as needed. So I planned on doing that if I needed to. I plan to take my time. I could do 10-15 miles a day easily and still finish in time and with money to spare. So if he wants to keep going during the day we can, if he's tired we can stop. I'm in no rush.
The insulation factor not only depends on the breed of the dog, but what kind of temperatures the dog is used to. Will the dog sleep inside or outside at home before the trip? I read the post a couple of times and wasn't sure if the dog had the option of a cover, or was sleeping on top of the whole thing.
Is the dog you're getting in April a puppy? Remember that for the health of a growing dog, you don't want them carrying weight until they're grown. That isn't to say not to get him/her used to the pack, just really watch the weight for the first 18 months or so.
Most of the "premium" dog foods have a formula for "active" or "working" dogs that will work, with less bulk/weight than cheaper foods. Check out their websites.
Yahoo groups has a group titled "traildog" that sometimes has some interesting posts, too.
Also, in regards to the packing, I had the idea originally that the dog would carry her own gear. (I'm not a thru hiker, just a multi-day hiker/camper.) After the first hike, she had a light pack, and I was still packing all the constant weight, I changed my mind. I decided that I'd give her a load that didn't change as much as her carrying her food. (I'll carry the stuff that loses weight every day!) So now, she helps with some of the more constant weight items; items I can stuff in her pack, ie. half the weight of a two man tent, my sleeping pad (hers is too wide) first aid kit, etc. (My dog is 70 lbs)
As it stands, he is an inside dog. Fortunately I am very cheap, and I usually don't turn on the heat until it gets so cold that the pipes will freeze. I know that's cheap, but clothes cost nothing to layer, and it pays for a thru hike. So he isn't used to 72* at all times. If it is 35 outside, it is 35-40 inside. I know that isn't much, but it's a start.
I already have the dog. I just don't want to take him at first because the weather may get really bad the first part, and I don't want to pay to have him kenneled for the Smokies. My mom was planning on meeting me in Hot Springs for an annual hammock hangout there, so she is going to bring him with her. He's 4 years old. I like the idea of me carrying his food, and him carrying things that stay. You just automatically put his gear in his pack, which isn't necessary. I will probably have him carry my water filter, his tether, bowls, and blanket and stuff like that. I figure if he weighs 40 lbs, I will keep his pack around 8 lbs.
AlwaysHiking
01-06-2008, 21:29
The chips are all suppose to be readable by all scanners.
Actually, they're not.
There are scanners now that can read multiple frequencies, some of them can only detect a frequency but not actually read it. I'd be worried that the shelters or animal control agencies along the trail might not have the newer scanners. My posh vet clinic 30 miles outside of DC only got a universal scanner from Home Again just last year; I imagine that the smaller communities along the AT aren't all going to have the latest and greatest scanners.
I know this is an issue that has some years on it, but it's important to do your research and talk to your vet to decide the best chip to use. You can't bet on the saftey of your dog that a clinic or shelter in a small community is going to have an updated scanner. Your vet will be able to advise you on which is best. Most of the rescue groups I work with lean towards Home Again because of the encryption used in AVID that older Home Again scanners can't read. Older AVID scanners supposedly can read Home Again though.
Check out the manufactures but be careful of their wording. Claiming a chip can be detected by all readers is different than a chip that can be read by all readers. A little deceptive in that way.
What you have to be aware of specifically is the Banfield microchip controversy. Banfield uses a chip with an ISO (International Standards Organization) frequency that does not require licensing here in the US. The frequency that Home Again and AVID use does require FCC licensing. Banfield wanted to save money and so they used the ISO. Currently, from what I know, there are no scanners that can read both the ISO (which is standard in Europe, Japan, Canada and other places) and the frequency which AVID & Home Again use. There are some newer model scanners that can detect but not read ISO frequencies. So Banfield's chips aren't very shelter friendly. Banfield did donate something like 100,000+ scanners but I'm sure that doesn't put one in every shelter, rescue, and vet office.
Some scanner info re: AVID vs. Home Again:
This is from Home Again's website (this is the new scanner my vet just got last year)
What's unique about the HomeAgain WorldScan™ scanner?
The HomeAgain WorldScan™ scanner reads all microchips utilizing the 125 kHz and 128 kHz radio frequencies (HomeAgain, AVID and Trovan) including those that previously could not be read by all U.S. scanners. The HomeAgain WorldScan™ scanner also detects the presence of 134.2 kHz microchips, or ISO chip, commonly used outside of the United States. While the scanner will not display the number of all ISO chips, it will indicate the presence of the chip so that steps toward a recovery can be put in place.And this is from AVID's website
How many brands of chips are there? Can shelters read the AVID® chip?
In the mid 90's, shelter groups asked microchip companies to provide shelters with a "universal" scanner that could read both chips. Since then, rescue groups, shelters and humane societies can use a single scanner to detect any 125 kHz microchip.AVID says they can "detect" it but it doesn't say it can be "read." I think they're being misleading.
Wiki says that chip manufactures still aren't working together to allow scanner manufactures access to their chips.
As of 2007, however, there are still many scanners used in shelters that lack the ability to read one or more of the four common chip types. In some cases, scanner makers simply left out support for one or more of the well-known chip transmission protocols. Also, in the U.S. especially, many vets have implanted pets with chips of a type made deliberately difficult to read, and not every scanner maker has the secrets needed to read these.By secrets they mean AVID's use of encryption.
Here are links to my sources and more info on the issue:
Articles -
http://www.saveourstrays.com/chips.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_%28animal%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_%28animal)
http://www.petplace.com/dogs/microchipping-for-your-dog-s-safety/page1.aspx
FAQs -
http://www.homeagain.com/8_5.html
http://www.avidmicrochip.com/answer.htm
Sources:
http://www.doggienews.com/2005/01/crystal-import-sues-avid-over.htm
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/11/1115_051115_pet_chips.html
http://www.dvmnews.com/dvm/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=173118
Forgot to address your first question. He will be sleepi ng on top of the whole thing without top cover. I figured if it ot too cold for that, then I will put him ni the hammock.
wrongway_08
01-06-2008, 21:56
The dog living indoors or outdoors is something to be aware of.
My vet told me about this guy who came to him last winter. It was suppose to be the dogs first exam, the owner came in on the exam day to cancel his dogs appt. because it had frozen to deat that night.
He had his dog outside (Maryland) during the winter. In the morning he woke up and found his dog froze to death on the porch.
The owner came to him all upset said he couldnt understand why the dog died, the dog has always been an outside dog.
My vet asked him a few questions about the dog, asking why it took him this long to make an appt. to get the dog his first appt..
The owner said he just moved to MD from Florida!! Yea the dog was an outside dog, used to 90 degree weather and then you toss him outside in freezing cold...... idiot.
Sorry, I was confused about picking up your dog in Hot Springs! Got it now.
I use "Paw Wax" on my dog's pads.
AlwaysHiking
01-06-2008, 22:05
A couple tidbits of info you may or may not have thought of.
It's a good idea to carry vet records with you, including current vaccination info. If you don't want to carry it with you, give a copy to someone you can contact in an emergency that can fax it to you. Or scan them in and save as a PDF on a handheld, etc...
If you're taking a cell phone, make sure you dog's ID tags have that number and a number of an emergency contact, like your parents, who will know how to get a hold of you or that you can check in to see if they've heard any news.
I use name plates that are riveted to the collar and to the leash rather than ID tags because they tend to break off easily. You should add the line "AT Thru Hiker" to the tag as well.
Always bring an extra collar and leash. I've had them snap on the trail. You should have a set of ID tags or name plate for these as well.
10, 15, or 20 foot training leads work well as tie outs. You can use a leash around the base of a tree and thread it through the handle of the training lead to secure your dog as needed. I do this at night so my dog doesn't wonder off yet he's got plenty of room to move around.
Here's my list of First Aid. I don't take everything with me at all times, it gets adjusted as needed. If I were doing a thru, I'd probably have most of these items in my bounce box.
First Aid
VetWrap - not just for wrapping injuries but can also be used to make a muzzle or booties in a jam, purple is my favorite color http://centralpetz.com/smf/Smileys/set1/001_tongue.gif it's super sticky, works much better than gauze on fur
Kwik Stop - septic powder
Flea Comb - cheap, plastic, $.99 kind work just fine, good for ticks too, invaluable on the trail
Razor Blade - to shave hair from injury, cheap disposables work great
Good Tweezers - for removing ticks or thorns or anything else fun pups can find to get into
Benadryl - for allergic reactions, will make pups sleepy so can be used for dogs that are too nervous to settle down at night; I think the standard recommendation is 2mg/lb in an 8 hour period (example, a 25lb dog shouldn't exceed 50mg in 8hrs so you could give that dog 25mg every 4hrs as needed), children's liquid works great, double check with your vet on dosage
Liquid Bandage - great for pad rips/injuries, I've used it myself and it sort of stings at first so don't be shocked by a negative reaction but it is great in a pinch (I use New-Skin but I think there are other brands available)
Triple Anti-biotic Ointment or Biocaine Lotion - most human tubes will be OK for dogs, but you can get pet specific tubes from pet stores
Buffered Aspirin - dogs can't have human aspirin (per my vet, but I've heard other opinions on this), pick some up specifically for dogs from pet stores, they'll be chew tabs and will be the proper dose for your dogs weight and you won't have to remember it on the trail
Small Scissors or a Small Knife - lots of uses, you'll probably have one in your supplies, no need to duplicate
Gauze - for packing and cleaning wounds
Rubbing Alcohol - used to help cool overheated dogs, rub on inside of ears and soak pads in it
Hydrogen Peroxide - to induce vomiting, one teaspoon per 10lbs of weight, PLEASE do your research before attempting this, it can do more harm than good in certain circumstances, always best to call your vet for instructions before your trip to know when you should and shouldn't do this
Oral Syringe - for administering liquid medications
Plastic Baggie - put everything in waterproof baggie
Bitter Spray - some people spray this on injuries to keep dogs from licking, but Biocaine (mentioned above) has a bad taste to it for that purpose so it's a two in one
Nail Clippers - you should ALWAYS trim nails very well, it can be painful for a dog on rough terrain with long nails
Booties - I never hike my dogs with booties but I bring a cheap pair in case of a pad injury, put a little New-Skin on to close the rip, wrap with VetWrap and put on a bootie to hold the wrap in place
Paw Wax - some people recommend it but personally I wouldn't especially during the summer since dogs sweat through their pads, I don't know this to be a fact but it seems to me like wax going over their pads would keep heat/sweat in and raise their body temps, it does work awesome on human feet tho (or anywhere on the body for that matter) where shoes/boots/straps may be rubbing
zach you are planning to make your dog walk 10-15 miles per day??? i wish you would reconsider that.
I will be taking him on a lot of hiking and camping trips. It's just now starting to get cold around here (freezing weather). I have an uncle who owns a farm nearby, so I can camp out there in the woods on his farm. So it would be a pretty controlled area to get him used to being outside all the time.
My MP3 player has a USB slot. I will load his vaccine info on it, and if that isn't enough my parents will have all his records on hand. I will get the chip implant, and a ID tag for his collar. I will put my name and my parents on the chip, but not my namy on the collar tag. If something happens to me and he is found, it wouldn't do any good to call me. I will look into collars with tags permenantly atached. I also like the idea of putting AT thru hiker on it. That will really help. Thanks for the first aid kit setup. I will use the paw wax since it is made for paws.
I really appreciate all of the help.
zach you are planning to make your dog walk 10-15 miles per day??? i wish you would reconsider that.
I was gonna play it by ear. If he wants to walk less, then we walk less. That was just a rough number. I know my hike will revolve around him, and thats fine. He's my best friend, and really the only friend I have left. So he comes first.
shelterbuilder
01-06-2008, 22:32
It sounds like you have a good understanding of your dog and his capabilities for miles per day. Just keep listening to what he tells you - some of it will be subtle, but most of it will be loud and clear!
You might want to consider getting an extra copy of his rabies certificate from your vet, laminating it, and carrying it with you in a secure location. Most animal control and LEO's are used to seeing a piece of paper when they ask to see a rabies certificate. The rest of the vaccination records shouldn't be a problem, but rabies is required by law most everywhere, and the extra hardcopy could save you some time and frustration!
It sounds like you have a good understanding of your dog and his capabilities for miles per day. Just keep listening to what he tells you - some of it will be subtle, but most of it will be loud and clear!
You might want to consider getting an extra copy of his rabies certificate from your vet, laminating it, and carrying it with you in a secure location. Most animal control and LEO's are used to seeing a piece of paper when they ask to see a rabies certificate. The rest of the vaccination records shouldn't be a problem, but rabies is required by law most everywhere, and the extra hardcopy could save you some time and frustration!
I do read my dog very well. It's been the two of us for almost 4 years now, and we are always together. I'm sure most pet owners know what I am talking about.
I will keep a laminated copy of his rabies vaccine in my wallet.
doggiebag
01-06-2008, 22:41
You're being very thorough. You'll have a blast. It'll be tough but it's an awsome adventure. Keep us updated - you have the best resource on the web concerning the AT. As far as your pooch is concerned - I've got a feeling he's in good hands. Regards.
In my area, Geo. Washington/Jefferson National Forest and AT, it does no good to have your dog chipped. The local animal control and SPCA have no chip readers. My dogs are all tatooed.
Last spring I met a thru hiker with his lab he had just picked up in the Roanoke VA area. In two days time he had split pads. The hiker bought the only booties he could get, which tore in another 2 days time. If you get booties make certain they are made for SAR dogs, or other working dogs. They should be ALL leather.
Good luck. I will am eager to hear how you dog does. Mine has already broken the buckle on his pack after o nly 4 trips out. You might think aobut taking some extra buckles with you, too.
Frau
I appreciate all the help and support. This isn't my hike with my dog, it is our hike.
doggiebag
01-06-2008, 23:18
I appreciate all the help and support. This isn't my hike with my dog, it is our hike.
You're gonna be a Team for 2008. I hope you're thinking of a good trail/team name. I hiked with a couple of dog teams last year. There was Team Otter (Otto and Max-golden retriever), Team Diesel (Diesel and Juice-terrier), Team Skittles (Skittles, Hummingbird and Lotus-Jack Russell) and yours trully Team Doggiebag (Max and Aldo-Cattledog). Let us know what your name is when you have the time.
You're gonna be a Team for 2008. I hope you're thinking of a good trail/team name. I hiked with a couple of dog teams last year. There was Team Otter (Otto and Max-golden retriever), Team Diesel (Diesel and Juice-terrier), Team Skittles (Skittles, Hummingbird and Lotus-Jack Russell) and yours trully Team Doggiebag (Max and Aldo-Cattledog). Let us know what your name is when you have the time.
Never thought of a team name. His name is Ben, but sometimes I call him furface or just Ben Dog.
One quick note on the microchips there are three major types available. Two are commonly found in north america and one is found in Europe and other areas. Talk to your vet but most implants today belong to one type. The microchips can only be read by a scanner designed for that chip. I know this because I had to get a second chip for my guy so we could travel outside of North America. You are probably safe but check it out first. Good luck
concerning food, look at puppy food or if you can find a working dog formula, it has more calories than your average dog food, make sure its high quailty too. keep in mind you want your dog to have the steadiest diet possible, make it easy on its stomach
zuke's makes power treats for active dogs (i highly recommend this brand), my girl loves them on the trail, the only human treats she got was cleaning out my pot after dinner
there are doggie vitamins out there, don't have a specific one to recommend, again look for a working dog or puppy formula
and its a common missunderstanding about dogs and chocolate, i'm not saying feed your dog chocolate, but most chocolate in small amounts won't bother dogs, its large amounts of baking chocolate that will get them in trouble.
in addition to having a rabies tag on the dog, i laminated her vet info w/ shots and place one in her pack and one in mine. for the month she hiked w/ me, my parents had her entire known medical history so if the vet wasn't available, they would be able to fax it.
also make sure your dog has its distemper/parvo and bordatello (sp?) shots as well, these are required by most places for boarding your dog, if the need arises.
asprin: make sure it is a low dose coated asprin, uncoated will upset their stomach.
and when your dog joins you in hot springs, keep in mind how it was for you starting up, start the dog very slow, will it have an exercise plan for the time u start to hot springs?
AlwaysHiking
01-07-2008, 08:52
I think you two are going to have a blast. I'm jealous that you get to do this with your dog. It's going to be a blast for the two of you to spend so much time together. It sounds like you're already bonded very well so I bet you're looking forward to this!
AlwaysHiking
01-07-2008, 08:59
I'm a fan of the coated Nylon collars. They last much longer and don't rot/mildew from constant use.
I get my name plate ID tags and collars from this link below. They come free with a collar but you can order extra for only $1. That's why I've put them on the leash as well. Another option is to embroider a contact number on the collar.
http://www.gundogsupply.com/collars.html
For food, I would look into the holistic department, try blue buffalo brand, thier Wilderness is especially good. www.bluebuff.com
theres really a ton of food out there that would work, dehydrated foods, freeze dried foods, working dog foods, ect.. if you're going to do mail drops these would all work well. you can google for the dehydrated and freeze dried foods, you should find quite a few brands and formulas.
I'd stay away from puppy chow. A lot of male dogs have a really hard time handling it. Dingo gets explosive diarrhea and gassy if he eats puppy chow, and on the trail that can be dangerous(think gastric torsion).
Puppy chow is not any more likely then other foods to cause bloat. That said it is not a good quality food and likely to cause nutritional and health problems. Bloat is a concern on the trail because a dog is more likely to excersize and drink excessively shortly before and after eating. Teach your dog to eat at head height or lay down and eat will prevent many cases. Trying to keep the dog calm and relaxed during and after feeding times is your best defense against this deadly condition.
Vitamins are pretty simple but talk to your vet because of the dangers of oversupplimentation. I have vitamins from my vet that are designed for large breed working animals and they are fine but I half the dose because Timber's diet has higher food value then most. Puppy, all stages and working dog foods are about the same, you want something with at least 500cal per cup which will assure you that it has less fillers. Consider adding extra calories in the form of fat once you meet his basic needs in dog food.
Good luck on your trip and in terms of collars consider one designed for hunting that will not allow the dog to become caught up in the bushes.
hey if you need a basis for how much food this website will calculate it for you. I use it to get a base on most of my dogs caloric needs,
http://www.mycockerspaniel.com/mer.htm and here it is opps, sorry
wrongway_08
01-07-2008, 18:29
Never thought of a team name. His name is Ben, but sometimes I call him furface or just Ben Dog.
Team furface.......it'll match both of you while hiking the trail :D
Thanks for all the links and advice on food. I'm gonna look more towards the working dog lines since he is a herding breed and this type of activity would be normal for him on a farm. When I pick him up in Hot Springs I will probably just do a few miles for the first week. My hiking style is to hike until lunch, then eat and take a nap for about an hour. Then I hike the rest of the day. Regular few minute breaks when needed. As fafr as him exercising while I am on the first part, not sure if I can. My parents will be watching him, and I don't want to burden them with taking him out in the cold. They will put his pack on him whenever they take him out, and my dad might take him to the park on decent days to run around. So I figure from the start he should be good for a 5-7 mile day.
Again, thanks a lot for the advice.
Team furface.......it'll match both of you while hiking the trail :D
Hmm.......
Critterman
01-08-2008, 11:23
Second question is, are all the implant chips prety much the same. If I get one brand, will all scanners be able to read it? I don't want to get a chip and it not read in other scanners.
Last question for now. What about diet. ......Does anyone have a good commercial food they reccomend for a dog on a long hike.
Chip- homeagain or AVID , accept no other. homeagain is most common chip used in the US.
Food- Science Diet maintaince was developed during the Vietnam war as a high calorie food for military dogs used on patrols. It should be just what you need.
Chip- homeagain or AVID , accept no other. homeagain is most common chip used in the US.
Food- Science Diet maintaince was developed during the Vietnam war as a high calorie food for military dogs used on patrols. It should be just what you need.
From what I have been reading, the HomeAgain seems to be the best choice. Now I just need to call the Vet tomorrow and schedule an apoitment.
Critterman
01-08-2008, 21:31
From what I have been reading, the HomeAgain seems to be the best choice. Now I just need to call the Vet tomorrow and schedule an apoitment.
Be sure to register the chip with homeagain after implantation, you will get all the necessary info from the Vet.
A couple of thoughts here:
1) At some point after you've had the chip implanted, make sure it can be read. (Sometimes they move.)
2) Check with the chip contact folks (I've got an AVID chip) with the chip number, to make sure they have your correct information. If the person typing entering the chip number in hits a wrong digit, your information isn't there!
Most first responders are familiar with the terminology ICE (in case of emergency) and they'll check for that entry in your cell phone. I use a tag that includes "ICE" and a phone number.
Jim Adams
01-08-2008, 22:58
I have no idea whether this is true or not because I don't remember if it was a vet that told me this or not but I was told not to feed my dog cat food as there is some ingredient in it that can cause blindness in dogs.
You may want to check into this.
I can't imagine how much cat food you would have to carry as Ziggy ate 2 pounds every 5 days on the trail.
geek
Thanks for the heads up on checking the chip info. I would have just gone on their word that it was entered correctly. Also, I didn't know I had to register it myself. Oh well, I would have found out at the vet anyways. He will have a regular tag on his collar with my parents contact info, and I will probably put one on my pack too.
As far as the food, I won't be feeding him cat food. I know a lot of people have done it, but I'm just not comfortable with it. Like you said, you have heard that it may cause blindness. I just don't know what effects or imbalances it may cause. I have some really good pet stores in the area, and I shouldn't have any problem finding a working dog food. There's always Co-op. I know they have real good food for high energy dogs.
His backpack came in today. A Ruff Wear Approach II. He's not too happy about it yet, but I put it on him and took him out to throw frisbee. He didn't mind it then so there's hope. It will just take some getting used to. I also got a Ruff Wear overcoat for him. Just a nylon cover for his back that is fleece lined. I will get him used to sleeping in it outside, so he will be a lot warmer this year. He knows something is up now.
AlwaysHiking
01-09-2008, 01:38
If he's not used to a pack you definitely want to get him accustomed to it now before you go so that when he joins you on the trail it's not a shock to him.
You should start out with very little weight and build him up to carrying a full load. Vary the amount and distance under different size loads until you get him up to a full weight (sort of like distance training for a marathon with short and long days with time off in between, etc). Might be a hike a week at one weight before moving him up to the next increment, or two hikes a week before adding, and so forth.
It really depends on your dog and his general condition/fitness level and trail experience as to how much the weight increments and distance under weight should be. Some dogs need more time to get up to full weight, others are so fit they can get there pretty quick. Just check with your vet to see how much and how soon they recommend.
I know I said it before, but I'm so jealous! All the prep work you're doing now will pay off!
AlwaysHiking
01-09-2008, 01:48
Just curious, have you tried sleeping with him in the hammock yet? Right now I'm on the ground because of my dog, but I'd really like to hang. I think for the most part he'd would be OK under me but I wonder about the rare occasion where I'd think it better for him to be inside the hammock.
He makes one heck of a great heater in the winter so for that I would be thankful, but I just wonder how it works getting him in and out and if he moves around once inside would it be pretty miserable?
one other thing I dont think has been mentioned is building up his pads before you have him hitting the trail. If at all possible you could have your parents take him to a large parking lot and toss a ball around with him, this will toughen his pads and wear down his nails.
When I started with the dog packs, I played some games to distract her. (Like you did with the frisbee) and corrected her when she tried to roll it off.
Next time, with the dog watching, I packed her nylon bowl, dog treats, two small water bottles, and a dog toy. I packed a small pack for me, so I was carrying something, too. Then we went walking in a new "fun" place with new smells, with the dog carrying the pack. After she'd been having fun for awhile, I asked her if she wanted a drink, and made a big deal out of taking her pack off, and then getting the stuff out of her pack. Same with cookies. She realized she was carrying stuff she liked. I think we probably played with the toy awhile, too.
Then we returned to the truck.
She's been a hiking dog ever since!
One thing, it is REALLY important to have the same amount of weight on each side of the pack, to keep the thing from pulling to one side. Even though that harness will keep the works in the center, it still pulls if off-balance. (Which is one of the reasons she now carries some more constant weights than the consumeables, they are easier to keep track of!)
You need to get the jacket on him, too, before the trail. I waited for a real cold snap, (hey, I live in Florida!)
And boots! You want to see hilarious, try boots for the first time!
Luckily he didn't try to get the pack off. He just kind of moped around with it on trying to look pitiful. Right now I am playing with him when he has it on and empty. Aftar a week I will probably start adding weight. We have a park nearby with a paved "nature" trail that is a few miles long. I will probably start taking him there with the pack so his pads toughen up, and he can hike on easy terrain with the pack at first. Then it will be to my uncle's farm which has some hills that would put the AT to shame.
He hasn't been in the hammock yet, that's on the list for this weekend. I will put a small blanket where he will lay so his claws don't do any damage. I figure I will pick him up and hold him to my chest, then sit down in the hammock and swing around inside and set him between my legs.
I will try the ideas for packing his stuff in the pack to make him like it. I figure if he sees putting the pack on as a step leading up to fun, then he will like the pack.
NorthCountryWoods
01-13-2008, 10:20
When I started with the dog packs, I played some games to distract her. (Like you did with the frisbee) and corrected her when she tried to roll it off.
Next time, with the dog watching, I packed her nylon bowl, dog treats, two small water bottles, and a dog toy. I packed a small pack for me, so I was carrying something, too. Then we went walking in a new "fun" place with new smells, with the dog carrying the pack. After she'd been having fun for awhile, I asked her if she wanted a drink, and made a big deal out of taking her pack off, and then getting the stuff out of her pack. Same with cookies. She realized she was carrying stuff she liked. I think we probably played with the toy awhile, too.
Then we returned to the truck.
She's been a hiking dog ever since!
One thing, it is REALLY important to have the same amount of weight on each side of the pack, to keep the thing from pulling to one side. Even though that harness will keep the works in the center, it still pulls if off-balance. (Which is one of the reasons she now carries some more constant weights than the consumeables, they are easier to keep track of!)
You need to get the jacket on him, too, before the trail. I waited for a real cold snap, (hey, I live in Florida!)
And boots! You want to see hilarious, try boots for the first time!
Use the 2 water bottles to balance the weight (pour more into the lighter side).
My dog Junior sleeps in the tent with us and doesn't really mind his pack. He knows it means we're hiking. He carries everything he needs...food, pad, water, folding bowl but his leash is binered to my pack. He weighs about 90lbs and his pack weighs under 15lbs. I've heard they can handle more weight, but found this is his comfort zone.
Just make sure he/she can handle the miles. Junior will stop when he's tired, too hot or his pads hurt, but most dogs will continue to follow you no matter how tired they are. Keep an eye on pads until they toughen up. Pad treatments used too often can actually make the pads more prone to injury. Bag balm or Burts Bees works well at the end of a long day, but for the above reason, use it sparingly.
superman
01-13-2008, 10:56
I've had many dogs over the years and have had packs and boots on many of them. FWIW, someone told me ages ago to put the pack or boots on the dog and praise the appearence and complement the dog. He said, if you laugh at the way the dog looks the dog would never wear the gear. It may be a coincidence but I have found that it is true. Once the dog finds that the gear is associated with going for a hike, the dog will be anxious to get the gear on.
CrumbSnatcher
01-13-2008, 11:04
you can buy 5 lb. bags of food at almost every grocery store along the way.and that way the food will be fresher. i agree with geek i heard you do not want to feed your dog cat food. dogs are no different on the trail than humans, you take it slow at first let them adapt to the trail and the life style of the hiking. they will need the conditioning too. dogs are not a true pack animal, after about 50 to 75 miles on the trail in 99' i donated my dogs pack to a hiker box. and carried all her supplies in my pack afterwards. if your not willing or able to carry your dogs gear, at least think about taking off the dogs pack the last 1/2 mile or more. so they can stretch out, and relieve the stress. dont skimp in towns either when your pigging out let your dog do the same. i always ordered double/triple burgers at resturants then went outside to eat with my dog. i always hated the people that would make there dog carry part of their gear too.(and brag about it) your dog is not only the best hiking partner youll ever have,remember their supposed to be youR best frind. TAKE CARE OF THEM... (BEARdog )ga-me 99' 03' 02'-07' p.s. you cant predict the weather either, when ever it was hot as hell, me and bear would take alot of afternoons completely off. we always hiked very early, and often very late(some night hikes too) good luck and have a blast on all your adventures crumbsnatcher
superman
01-13-2008, 11:39
When we started the AT I was having Winter's super duper expensive dog food mailed. It didn't work. The post office thing was a big hassle. I changed to buying her food along the trail and that worked much better. I carried sardines or beef jerky that Winter and I shared. She also shared my gorp (no chocolate). On trail stops I rented motel rooms and Winter liked to watch animal planet while I did laundry and re-supplied. She wouldn't look directly at the TV if a cat was on but she loved the dog show. Her favorite was the dog training show. The thing she and I really liked was "cheap chicken." I'm talking about those pre-cooked whole chickens at the grocery store. I ate the dark meat and Winter got everything else except the bones. When I bought pizza she only ate the cheese and the meat.
Well, Ben's pack came in the other day. The first day I just put it on to fit it, and he didn't seem to mind. Then the last two days I decided to ignor advice. The first two times he wore his pack I had 6 lbs. in it. It all comes down to knowing your dog and all. He did fine. We walked on a paved trail, but it was a start. Friday he did 1.5 miles no problem. Yesterday we did 3 miles. Today I plan on doing 3-5 miles because yesterday he was still real hyper and full of energy after the walk. So it looks like he wil do fine with a pack.
Now a couple more questions. One is the motel rooms. If I can, I would like to get one once a week to do my laundry, shower, and get a good nights sleep. I figure a motel since a lot of hostels might not allow my dog, and I'm not paying money to camp in someone's back yard. So, how much money should I expect to pay for a night in a motel with my dog?
Second question. My dog's yearly physical has always been in July. Unfortunately I will be on the trail with him then. My vet said I couldn't get his shots done early, so I will have to get his physical/shots while on the trail. Would this be pretty easy to do? Around July just walk into a vet on my town stop and get the shots?
AlwaysHiking
01-13-2008, 13:58
If you can estimate where you'll be when his shots are due, then maybe call ahead to a few places to establish a relationship with them ahead of time. Have your vet send records over to them to put on file.
Another option is, unless it's rabies which has to be given by a licensed vet per most legal requirements, to order your shots and administer them yourself. You can ask your vet to ship them to you or to give you a prescription to fill from one of those online pet meds stores. Just pick them up in the town you're in and take a day or two off to make sure there are no adverse reactions. Might even be a good idea to make sure there is a vet clinic near by just as a precaution. I would space out the shots though so you don't overload his system with too many viruses all at once. Maybe wait a week between shots.
superman
01-13-2008, 14:15
Well, Ben's pack came in the other day. The first day I just put it on to fit it, and he didn't seem to mind. Then the last two days I decided to ignor advice. The first two times he wore his pack I had 6 lbs. in it. It all comes down to knowing your dog and all. He did fine. We walked on a paved trail, but it was a start. Friday he did 1.5 miles no problem. Yesterday we did 3 miles. Today I plan on doing 3-5 miles because yesterday he was still real hyper and full of energy after the walk. So it looks like he wil do fine with a pack.
Now a couple more questions. One is the motel rooms. If I can, I would like to get one once a week to do my laundry, shower, and get a good nights sleep. I figure a motel since a lot of hostels might not allow my dog, and I'm not paying money to camp in someone's back yard. So, how much money should I expect to pay for a night in a motel with my dog?
Second question. My dog's yearly physical has always been in July. Unfortunately I will be on the trail with him then. My vet said I couldn't get his shots done early, so I will have to get his physical/shots while on the trail. Would this be pretty easy to do? Around July just walk into a vet on my town stop and get the shots?
I didn't go to hostels. I paid $30 - $60 down south. That is except for one place in Abingdon during Trail Days where I paid about $105 per night. When I got up north I paid between $70 - $120.
Ask your vet how to deal with it. My vet simply moved Winter's annual appointment to just before we left for the AT. He also provided a complete medical record that I carried in my pack. The vet also inserted a chip in Winter's back for identification. Incidentally, the only time Winter ever wandered off (in Somerville, MA) it was the vet tag on Winter's collar that got her returned to me.
I didn't go to hostels. I paid $30 - $60 down south. That is except for one place in Abingdon during Trail Days where I paid about $105 per night. When I got up north I paid between $70 - $120.
Ask your vet how to deal with it. My vet simply moved Winter's annual appointment to just before we left for the AT. He also provided a complete medical record that I carried in my pack. The vet also inserted a chip in Winter's back for identification. Incidentally, the only time Winter ever wandered off (in Somerville, MA) it was the vet tag on Winter's collar that got her returned to me.
Ok, that's good to know. I was thinking of budgeting $100 a week for a motel. That means if one only costs $60, then I have an extra $40 for when one goes over. The problem with the vet is I move a lot, so he doesn't have a specific vet. He's gone to a different one every year. Fortunately he doesn't have any health issues, so it's always just a check up, standard poop and blood tests, and the shots. I'll call around though to see if one can help.
Use the 2 water bottles to balance the weight (pour more into the lighter side)
platypus makes 1L reservoir http://www.platypushydration.com/product_detail.aspx?ProdID=3
I use two, one for each side, you don't have to fill them up all the way, and they fit nicely into a dog pack
thanks to the help of ms. janet's fabian, my coco learned to drink from my hose, she was afraid of it untill she saw fabian getting water from it, which is really nice, that way you don't have to worry about the whole water bowl routine for short stops. once my water ran out, i'd take both 1L's from her pack into mine, hooking one up to my hose, they were all platy's so i could easily switch them out.
also to keep her bag even during the day, i kept a system to help me, breakfast = right side, dinner = left side, simple and stupid,
AlwaysHiking
01-13-2008, 17:24
platypus makes 1L reservoir http://www.platypushydration.com/product_detail.aspx?ProdID=3
I use two, one for each side, you don't have to fill them up all the way, and they fit nicely into a dog pack
Seconded... although I use the smaller half liter size for panniers that won't quite fit a liter plus other gear.
shelterbuilder
01-13-2008, 21:52
If you can estimate where you'll be when his shots are due, then maybe call ahead to a few places to establish a relationship with them ahead of time. Have your vet send records over to them to put on file.
Another option is, unless it's rabies which has to be given by a licensed vet per most legal requirements, to order your shots and administer them yourself. You can ask your vet to ship them to you or to give you a prescription to fill from one of those online pet meds stores. Just pick them up in the town you're in and take a day or two off to make sure there are no adverse reactions. Might even be a good idea to make sure there is a vet clinic near by just as a precaution. I would space out the shots though so you don't overload his system with too many viruses all at once. Maybe wait a week between shots.
Regarding shots - they can be given earlier than the once-a-year schedule without any ill effects. They do make 2 kinds of rabies vaccines - a once-a-year, and one that's good for 3 years. (Most clinics use the once-a-year.) The is the only shot that MUST be vet-documented - all other shots can be given at home, but if you do it that way, peel the label off of the vial and attach it to the rabies certificate so everything is in one place. You can order the vaccines on-line from supply shops like Foster and Smith - get syringes, too. Most of the vaccines come in perishable liquid form, so put them in the fridge ASAP. Unless the dog's immune system is already compromised, multiple shots at the same time shouldn't harm the dog (mine usually get sleepy for a day). Since you will be travelling in an area that's loaded with Lyme disease-carrying ticks, it's wise to get the dog vaccinated for Lyme disease, too.
Your vet will NEVER tell you this, but it's vastly cheaper to learn how to give the shots yourself than it is to let the vet do it. The only drawback is that some suppliers have a minimum order size - you might have to buy more vaccine than you could ever use for only one dog. But if you have friends that do home vaccinations, you might be able to split the cost of an order....
Ok. I guess I will talk to another vet about getting his shots early. Probably look into giving his own shots too. My mom is a nurse, so she is very comfortable with using needles.
Took him out with his pack again today. Did 5 miles in a little less than 2 hours. I know it is flat paved ground so that isn't much, but I'm proud of him. From watching him with the pack I think the hiking part won't be a problem with him. After we got home he was running all over the house playing with squeeky toys and his frisbee so he had lots of energy left in him.
Lost My Mind
01-13-2008, 23:31
I may be a nurse, and I may be comfortable using needles, but I'm not giving my Grandpuppy his shots. I'll pay the vet bill! What kind of Granny sticks needles into her grand-dog???
Signed: Cerberus' Mom
Oh yeah, be sure and pack a favorite toy!
AlwaysHiking
01-14-2008, 17:06
Unless the dog's immune system is already compromised, multiple shots at the same time shouldn't harm the dog (mine usually get sleepy for a day).
I wouldn't take that as medical advice... I have had several vets tell me the opposite. Only two vets have said it's OK to hit a dog's system with everything all at once. One was right out of school. The other was one of those national chains that will sell you anything to make a buck.
Get a vet's advice before giving all shots at once and just do whatever makes you feel comfortable.
AlwaysHiking
01-14-2008, 17:09
Ok. I guess I will talk to another vet about getting his shots early. Probably look into giving his own shots too. My mom is a nurse, so she is very comfortable with using needles.
Even if you don't find one that will give them early, none of the vets I use will, you can ask them when the time is right to ship them to you on the trail.
He loves squeeky toys, so I figure I will bring one for when we are camping alone or in a motel. He can get very annoying with them.
Well, my mom won't give him his shots, and I'm not comfortable doing it. So I will just plan on walking into a vet and getting them. Maybe make that an overnight or even a zero for him. He's alwasy gotten all of his shots at once, and it's never bothered him. He still wants to play just as much. I will get a lyme vaccine when I get his chip though.
shelterbuilder
01-14-2008, 20:47
I wouldn't take that as medical advice... I have had several vets tell me the opposite. Only two vets have said it's OK to hit a dog's system with everything all at once. One was right out of school. The other was one of those national chains that will sell you anything to make a buck.
Get a vet's advice before giving all shots at once and just do whatever makes you feel comfortable.
I'm NOT a vet - and I don't play one on TV - but the vaccines that we routinely administer to our dogs are a 5-way combo vaccine: one shot covers 5 of the most common "nasties" out there, including lepto, which is the one that will tend to make most dogs very ill IF they are going to get ill from the shots at all. Our dogs have only ever gotten sleepy and somewhat lethargic for 24 hours or so. (Your results may vary.)
When we were going to our vet for routine shots, they also would give multiple shots - never had any problems. Again, this is just OUR experience. However, it appears that the point may be moot.
Good luck with your hike - I'm sure that both of you will have a blast!!
:banana:banana:banana:banana
Remember the first lyme vaccine is a two-part... need the second one 1-3 weeks later I think....
I laughed when I read your mom's post, and I wouldn't either. Yep, support those years of schooling, and pay the vet.
shelterbuilder
01-14-2008, 21:49
Remember the first lyme vaccine is a two-part... need the second one 1-3 weeks later I think....
I laughed when I read your mom's post, and I wouldn't either. Yep, support those years of schooling, and pay the vet.
...and just so you folks won't think that I'm a complete cheapskate: we have a sled dog team - we're down to only 4 dogs right now, although we've had as many as 7 at one time. With multiple dogs on a workingman's wage, we've found it to be prudent to use the vet's schooling - and our hard-earned money - for serious problems and once-a-year physicals prior to the start of the racing season. At $37 per dog per visit, plus the fee for the shots, I'm sure that you can do the math and understand why we do what we do!
Again, your results may vary!;)
...and just so you folks won't think that I'm a complete cheapskate: we have a sled dog team - we're down to only 4 dogs right now, although we've had as many as 7 at one time. With multiple dogs on a workingman's wage, we've found it to be prudent to use the vet's schooling - and our hard-earned money - for serious problems and once-a-year physicals prior to the start of the racing season. At $37 per dog per visit, plus the fee for the shots, I'm sure that you can do the math and understand why we do what we do!
Again, your results may vary!;)
Hey, even if you have one dog it isn't being cheap. You don't go to the doctor for a cold anymore. You buy your own tylenol and othet stuff. Most people get free flu shots at work now, so why pay for it at the doctors? Save money where you can.
Did not know the lyme was 2 part. Will look into getting that in the next couple of weeks. Thanks.
Please reconsider vaccinating your animal yourself. It is simply unsafe. If there is a serious problem there is nobody trained or capable of helping your dog. I have handled/ trained many dogs for many years and I am a wilderness medic but I wouldn't administer vaccines to my dog. What happens in the middle of the woods if you accidentally inject into a vein or the dog has a reaction? I have given myself shots for over 8 years and three times I have ended in the hospital because of blood clots when I forgot to ensure the needle was clear of veins. If professionals make mistakes and mistakes can be deadly, why take the risk? Finally vaccines are prescription medication, you will require a prescription from your vet to order these products. If you can order the product without a prescription run in the other direction because she have no clue what you are buying or if it is even safe to administer. Odds are that the non-prescription vaccine wouldn't work.
For reference, the Lyme vaccine is tolerated by many dogs but like all vaccines not all dogs react the same. My dog was fine for the first shot but became seriously ill for several days after the second. Even though we are in a moderate risk area I won't be giving him the lyme vaccine again. All vaccines have risks and you should look to your dogs past behaviour after vaccines to identify which are capable of being administered together and which should be seperate. My guy gets all his shots at once and has never had a problem finishing his work day before the lyme vaccine.
As for getting the shot on the trail, that shouldn't be a problem but plan to take that day off from hiking to give the dog a break to recover.
Please reconsider vaccinating your animal yourself.
Well I already took him for his first round of Lyme vaccine. Also got him a rattle snake vaccine. For $34 it's worth the extra insurance. So I won't be doing the shots myself. Even the regular yearly shots. I don't know how and my mom won't so the vet does it. No big deal.
shelterbuilder
01-20-2008, 18:22
Adam B - for the record, I was not recommending that cerberus (or anyone or that matter) attempt a vaccine regimen in the woods! We give ours at home - where, if there was a problem, help is just a phone call and a short drive away. Procedurally, all we do is pull up a bit of skin on the dog's cape area (between the shoulders), and quickly insert the needle in the space between the fold of skin, inject and withdraw. As long as the needle is roughly parallel to the dog's spine, and you don't penetrate BOTH layers of skin that you've pulled up, there's no problem. (Of course, an extra set of hands to keep the dog from squirming around doesn't hurt, either!)
However, this sort of thing is not for everyone - in fact, I remember a time not so very long ago when we were not comfortable doing it. To each his own....
AlwaysHiking
01-22-2008, 01:50
Adam B - for the record, I was not recommending that cerberus (or anyone or that matter) attempt a vaccine regimen in the woods! We give ours at home - where, if there was a problem, help is just a phone call and a short drive away.
Agreed. I don't see where anyone said to do it on the trail away from civilization, but maybe I missed something.
Procedurally, all we do is pull up a bit of skin on the dog's cape area (between the shoulders), and quickly insert the needle in the space between the fold of skin, inject and withdraw. As long as the needle is roughly parallel to the dog's spine, and you don't penetrate BOTH layers of skin that you've pulled up, there's no problem. (Of course, an extra set of hands to keep the dog from squirming around doesn't hurt, either!)
For anyone reading that doesn't know, vaccines given at the same time or back to back should be spread out on the body so if there is a reaction it's easy to determine which vaccine caused it.
Also, to Adam B's other comment, I don't think anyone recommended getting the prescription from anywhere but his vet. The only thing in discussion was whether or not Cerberus or his mother wanted to administer the vaccines. It is very common procedure for owners of pets requiring daily shots to do it them self. But some people don't feel comfortable, and that's fine.
The point is, Adam B, it's actually very safe if common sense is used and certain precautions are considered. Obviously the first place anyone should start is with their vet.
On my thru, if I can avoid having to give shots myself that would be great, but if the timing works out that I have no choice, then yes, I would have my vet order and mail me the prescriptions and wait in town until I'm sure no side effects will occur.
Cerberus, I'm glad everything is working out for you. Sounds like you've gotten a lot of the prep work out of the way. Getting excited!?
Butterflymoon
01-22-2008, 11:18
FYI
Do not feed you dog: COFFEE --- the caffeine in a cup of java is a methylxanthine compound that can increase a dogs heart rate and trigger seizures. CHOCOLATE—the chemical theobromine can be fatal. Just 3 or 4 ounces of dark or 7 of milk can bring on vomiting in a 50 pound dog. MACADAMIA NUTS--- experts have yet to determine why just a few of these nuts produce tremors, even temporary paralysis, in a dog’s hind legs. GARLIC--- garlic breaks down a dog’s red blood cells, leading to anemia and possible kidney failure from leaking hemoglobin. ONIONS—their damage to canine hemoglobin is cumulative, so small taste can be worse than wolfing down the whole bulb. GRAPES— toxicologist have found that grapes and raisins can cause kidney failure. They’re still trying to learn why. ALCOHOL --- it depresses the brain function and can cause a coma. So no pina coladas for Fido.
National Geographic is a wealth of info isn’t it?
Also NEVER give tylenol, as it is toxic to the liver, or ibuprofen - Nuprin, Motrin, Advil etc. Ibuprofen is fery toxic and fatal to dogs at low doses. Only aspirin is safe for dogs, and buffered aspirin or ascirptin is preferred to minimize sttomach upset.
I keep a lamated dogie Id card in my pup's pack with emergency info ( name, breed, weight, contacts, and medications etc) just incase we ever become seperated. You might want to invest in a good tick repelent as they are a potential nuisance. Not to mention that the carry Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever (RMSF) and Lyme disease, and dogs are every bit as susceptible to these diseases as humans.
My dog, an experienced 50# backpacker most of her life, does well on 1000MG of plain glucosomine sulfate (without condroitin, or other stuff) and 81MG aspirin per day. She gets a monthly treatment with Frontline for fleas/ticks. The vet recommended all.
As for food we have been using Beneful Original. She gets 2 cups per day at home. I supplement that in the woods with leftovers from my Mary Janes and Liptons dinners. The lists here of foods that are bad for dogs are important advice.
CrumbSnatcher
01-22-2008, 19:10
man up and carry your dogs gear. dogs are not built like pack animals. dog packs should be ILLEGAL........................................... .................................................. ............................................
Starting to get excited. Just need to find him some kind of good jacket to keep him dry on cold days.
He actually enjoys carrying the pack. Actually many dogs were used as pack animals in the past. I'm not saying load a dog down with your gear to make your hike easier, but with that philosophy no one should ride a horse, or use any animal as a pack animal. If he likes it, he likes it.
shelterbuilder
01-22-2008, 21:09
man up and carry your dogs gear. dogs are not built like pack animals. dog packs should be ILLEGAL.
I know that I shouldn't go down THIS road, but here we go....
I've heard similar arguments used about sled dogs and against mushing. But the simple truth is that you CANNOT MAKE a dog mush - or hike - if it really doesn't want to do it. No matter how much they may love YOU, if they don't love the sport, they will simply sit down and refuse to go...in that respect, they have a lot more sense than some people! I've seen it with sled dogs, and I've seen it with dogs on the trail. And the foolish person who tries to make the dog go...well, horse-whippin's too good fer 'em!
Conversely, if a dog really enjoys it, you can see it in their reaction to the equipment (yours and theirs). The minute they see the equipment come out, they go NUTS!!! (If you've ever seen sled dogs before the start of a run, they're all going berserk, yelping, howling, barking, jumping - as if to say, "hey, don't forget me"!)
Anyway, that's my $0.02 worth....
CrumbSnatcher
01-22-2008, 22:53
not only will a dog sit down and refuse to hike. but ive had a couple vets along the trail tell me some dogs will fake a injury to get you to stop.
CrumbSnatcher
01-22-2008, 23:07
SHELTERBUILDER your two cents are always welcome. im glad to hear someone has a little common sense when it comes to hiking with their dog. not totaly against dog packs. i have no trouble carrying bears (my dog) gear. pack weight to me means notta. bears has three thruhikes 6,000 plus A.T. miles and i ditched her pack in a hiker box on the first hike with no regrets. bears gear: z-rest,dog boots, blanket, medical kit,( neosporin works great on thier pads when thier drying out) collar,leash food and water bowl, snacks ,usually a 5 pound bag of dry food out of the grocery stores every few days. she would tip her head up for water out of my water bottles during hiking. had her lyme vaccinated (not sure on that though,stopped after a couple years. any one hiking with a dog, have fun its a blast but take care of them. you owe it to them...and respect and stay clear of hikers with problems with dogs. its thier loss.
man up and carry your dogs gear. dogs are not built like pack animals. dog packs should be ILLEGAL........................................... .................................................. ............................................
Oh, please.
Common sense has to prevail. Don't force a dog to carry too much weight. But no weight? Dog packs should be illegal? "Man up"?
My dog goes berserk when I pull her pack down from the shelf. In a good way! It means she's going hiking--perhaps for several days. It's a saddlebag pack that weighs about 1.25 lbs. empty. Fully packed with her food, water, shelter, and ground stake it's about 8 lbs. She weighs a bit over 50 lbs. That's less than 1/6 of her body weight. Not a problem. She balks at getting in the truck without her pack if she sees me put my pack in. That says enough for me.
BipolarStroller
01-23-2008, 10:10
Oh, please.
Common sense has to prevail. Don't force a dog to carry too much weight. But no weight? Dog packs should be illegal? "Man up"?
My dog goes berserk when I pull her pack down from the shelf. In a good way! It means she's going hiking--perhaps for several days. It's a saddlebag pack that weighs about 1.25 lbs. empty. Fully packed with her food, water, shelter, and ground stake it's about 8 lbs. She weighs a bit over 50 lbs. That's less than 1/6 of her body weight. Not a problem. She balks at getting in the truck without her pack if she sees me put my pack in. That says enough for me.
you say common sense has to prevail,but it usally dont. my boyfriend crumbsnatcher has over 8,000 miles on the a.t. and he has seen this common sense you talk about.(or lack of) and just because you have some dont mean everyone else does. he was joking about the illegal part(packs should be illegal) he carried all of bears gear because he wanted to. NOBODY CARES FOR THIER DOG ON THE TRAIL MORE THAN CRUMBSNATCHER, JUST ASK AROUND. bear could hike thirty miles a day, consistantly or twelve miles a day. it was always up to the dog(bear). THE WAY IT SHOULD BE-UP TO THE DOG....
you say common sense has to prevail,but it usally dont. my boyfriend crumbsnatcher has over 8,000 miles on the a.t. and he has seen this common sense you talk about.(or lack of) and just because you have some dont mean everyone else does. he was joking about the illegal part(packs should be illegal) he carried all of bears gear because he wanted to. NOBODY CARES FOR THIER DOG ON THE TRAIL MORE THAN CRUMBSNATCHER, JUST ASK AROUND. bear could hike thirty miles a day, consistantly or twelve miles a day. it was always up to the dog(bear). THE WAY IT SHOULD BE-UP TO THE DOG....
If I left the days distance up to my dog, I would kill over dead!:eek:
I'm thru-hiking this year with my dog as well. She's just over a year old and knows how to act/behave on the trail unlike any other dog I've seen. A true natural.
For those that have hiked with their canines, can I rely on outposts and resupply stops for all of her food?
you say common sense has to prevail,but it usally dont. my boyfriend crumbsnatcher has over 8,000 miles on the a.t. and he has seen this common sense you talk about.(or lack of) and just because you have some dont mean everyone else does. he was joking about the illegal part(packs should be illegal) he carried all of bears gear because he wanted to. NOBODY CARES FOR THIER DOG ON THE TRAIL MORE THAN CRUMBSNATCHER, JUST ASK AROUND. bear could hike thirty miles a day, consistantly or twelve miles a day. it was always up to the dog(bear). THE WAY IT SHOULD BE-UP TO THE DOG....
Totally agree. When you hike with a dog, you have to let the dog's abilities guide your routine. Same as when you hike with a group of humans. The abilities of the slowest person has to set the pace for the rest.
I've been looking for ways to make sure my dog is going to have enough calories. Has anyone ever used or heard of this?
http://www.amazon.com/Nutri-Stat-High-Calorie-Food-Supplement/dp/B0006N9DXG
CrumbSnatcher
01-23-2008, 20:11
pittmad, yeah the product you listed works well in small doses.(nutri-cal too) my dog enjoyed alot of the snacks i enjoyed. on trail-beef jerky,tuna,grandmas peanut butter cookies etc. off trail, when i made it to towns or such, can dog food(pedigree)and whenever i had restraunt food, usually cheeseburgers id always go outside and share order double burgers and gave her a patty off the sandwich. most important when you reach your campsite every evening, let your dog settle down before feeding so they dont get a upset stomach. carried daily vitamens too. neosporin works great on dry and cracking pads.(some dog booties work well. ) i carried benadryl (antihistamine) suppose to stop the swelling, incase of snake bite. slows or stops the swelling of thier neck and head so they dont choke to death,get them to a vet as soon as posible.
shelterbuilder
01-23-2008, 21:37
pittmad, to up the amount of calories in the dog's diet, try adding some oil to the regular dog food. And don't neglect protein intake, either. Those muscles have to have something to rebuild with!
Hammer and Nails
01-25-2008, 01:16
Can't believe it took me so long to find this discussion.
Thanks Alwayshiking for the collar site - I just went on and ordered two.
I'll be heading out from Amicalola on 21 Feb with my Jack Russell "Nails". (You should see her with her pack!) Anyone else in the doggie state of mind going to be around about then?
Also thanks to whomever mentioned the idea of the dog carrying your stuff and you carrying the food - brilliant thinking. (I was imagining packing each meal into two equal-weight bags so that her pack would always be balanced. What a drag that would have been!)
My dog's done 60 miles in a 24-hour period with me before, and she's refused to do even 3 miles in the Australian sun sometimes (we're from Sydney originally) - so I totally agree with the idea that the dog's in charge.
And I think you're right, Cerberus, about just popping into a vet when it comes time for the vaccs. And I bet if they're booked out, they'll help you make a booking at the vet in the next town down the line.
And finally, fwiw, I've gone with the advice in the article posted on the ATC's site about hiking the AT with dogs: I'm using "Pad-Tough" on her feet at the moment, and she's nice 'n tough now - got the boots and the tape too, just in case. I've also gone with the Science Diet Active food. I'm a diabetic myself, so I've got a long history of nutritional care under my belt, and counting calories for the pup is every bit as important as doing so for you. You can actually see the dog 'bonk' in early afternoon if he's not eating/drinking enough - just like you.
I'm also a huge advocate of getting the dog to carry around weight - as much as he'll allow you to - for the easy walks around the neighborhood. It's just like a serious runner would do it - train in heavy shoes, and when you get to the main event, bust out the racing flats.
But you sound like you're in great shape - hope to run into you along the way.
and to add to the dog carrying weight: look at the breed, some breeds aren't designed to carry weight, some are, my coco has alot of rottie in her (she's a mutt), rotties are designed for carrying weight, its in their bone structure and muscles (for example rotties are wide set). some are built for speed, companionship, endurance, or sprints; all with varying capacities . i wouldn't make a greyhound carry any weight, they just aren't built for it.
really the best way to find out, is look up the history of your dog breed, what was its initial purpose, for mutts, figure out the strongest breeds in your dog, a vet can help you w/ this (or anyone very familiar w/ lots of different breeds)
adjust the weight that you will allow your dog to carry based off of that.
AlwaysHiking
01-25-2008, 11:06
and to add to the dog carrying weight: look at the breed, some breeds aren't designed to carry weight, some are, my coco has alot of rottie in her (she's a mutt), rotties are designed for carrying weight, its in their bone structure and muscles (for example rotties are wide set). some are built for speed, companionship, endurance, or sprints; all with varying capacities . i wouldn't make a greyhound carry any weight, they just aren't built for it.
really the best way to find out, is look up the history of your dog breed, what was its initial purpose, for mutts, figure out the strongest breeds in your dog, a vet can help you w/ this (or anyone very familiar w/ lots of different breeds)
adjust the weight that you will allow your dog to carry based off of that.
To add to that:
Even among breeds there can be very different abilities from dog to dog. A lot of what decides whether a dog can carry weight and how much depends on the individual dog's health and general wellbeing. Always consult a vet before beginning training with a pack. And always work up to weight, start slowly then add on gradually.
This is a good thread, thanks to the OP for starting it and hopefully other people are gaining knowledge from it as well.
my dog that i'm thruhiking with is a Mountain Cur (great trail dog) and she's pretty slender (trying to help her put on some pounds before heading out) so I'm going to carry most of her food. She'll carry jerkey, her meds, leash, and some of her food, but that's about it. I don't want her to be weighed down too much and end up straining her back.
To add to that:
Even among breeds there can be very different abilities from dog to dog. A lot of what decides whether a dog can carry weight and how much depends on the individual dog's health and general wellbeing. Always consult a vet before beginning training with a pack. And always work up to weight, start slowly then add on gradually.
This is a good thread, thanks to the OP for starting it and hopefully other people are gaining knowledge from it as well.
We have a golden/lab mix 17month old. She is a handful with all the energy, but our goal is to one day be able to backpack with her. For now, we just wait for the pup to settle down. Thanks for all this info, it is great to see everyone's input. It helps with our pup's hiking future.:)
docllamacoy
02-01-2008, 19:34
Long thread so I didn't read through it all so I might be repeating a suggestion.
Ask your vet for a supply of antibiotics. Coy got kennel cough on the PCT. If we had had a 7 day supply of antibiotics on hand, it would have saved us a vet visit.
docllamacoy
02-01-2008, 19:38
For those that have hiked with their canines, can I rely on outposts and resupply stops for all of her food?
Well, we did and were able to find Iams puppy food almost everywhere, but that was truly the best we could find for the most part. And it's crappy food. I tried to mail better food along, but that gets expensive with weight.
So I guess it depends on what kind of food you want to have. If I were going to do it over again, I would buy Nature's Variety Freeze Dried Food and do mail drops for it. It's expensive, but it's so much better for them than Iams.
But, yes, to answer your question, you can rely on towns for all of her food if you're not picky about the type.
docllamacoy
02-01-2008, 19:41
Coy did NOT carry a pack on our '03 thru-hike. She did carry one on our '02 PCT thru-hike, and after that, we really changed our view on them. I don't think they are good for them over a long period of time, unless the weight is VERY minimal. Dayhikes, weekend hikes, sure, but I don't know if I'd ever put a pack on a dog again for a thru-hike.
I am in the middle of a thru hike heading south. My appendix ruptured just at the right time for me to have to go home for the holidays from NJ. So, in Jan I am returning to NJ to continue my thruhike.
I came across a stray a few days ago. She is my dog now. She is awesome. She will be coming with me to NJ. She is quite hyper and filled with energy, so I do not see to much problem getting her used to hiking that many miles a day. The main thing I am concerned about is what gear do I need to hike with a dog? Its going to be COLD. Oh Boy!! I picked out the dog pack, and I will probably make some leather booties for her. And I have an old foam sleeping pad that I could cut to fit her. But what else? It is going to be cold.
~ Z
How big is the dog? Where did you find her? What kind of coat does she have?
My dog, from the FL Keys sleeps under a blanket when we're in colder temps. Depending upon the size of the dog, she can curl up under your jacket if you're not wearing it to sleep in. But, it may get a little doggie smelling!
I was using a piece of fleece, but, it didn't really work well, because if the dog turned around during the night, the blanket would fall off and she couldn't get back under it. I recently found an old sleeping bag I'm cutting down. It's puffy enough that I think she can cover up on her own, without waking me up, if she turns around during the night.
A cut a trash compactor bag to use for a rain coat when it was cold and raining. Chamois cloths are super light, dry easily, and are a great thing to dry/wipe off a wet/muddy dog.
I've got a two man tent (for me and the dog) but sleeping in the vestibule would help on warmth if you've got a smaller tent.
She is 35 lbs., but she was kind of skinny when I found her, so I am trying to fatten her up just a bit before the hike. She has spent I assume all her time outside in NC in the fall and early winter and seems fine in 20 degree nights at least. I found her running around in a neighbor hood for about a week. The neighbors had all taken turns taking care of her and feeding her, but none of them wanted to keep her. She is so friendly towards humans. I do not know about other dogs.
I wish I had a tent, but all I have is a large piece of Tyvec which I love. So light weight. I can normally set it up like a small tent though. I hope that will do for us in that respect. I used a contractor trash bag for me for a while, but did you have any experience with it tearing with the dog? I have a feeling she will love running through brambles. I have a good pack towel that I carry anyways which would work to dry her off, but I do not have a rain jacket except if I made one like you suggested. Should I try to keep her dry during the day completely or just make sure to dry her off at the end of the day when going to sleep? Thanks for the suggestion about the sleeping bag. I was going to use a fleece blanket, but I think I have an old kids sleeping bag lying around from walmart or the like.
I am trying to get a pack for her as soon as possible to start getting her used to carrying it, but I do not have much time to do this since I am trying to get back on the trail as soon as possible after I heal from surgery and the holidays are over. I would like to end with her carrying all her gear and food, but I understand from my own experience not to start out so heavy. I am going to increase it in increments with me carrying the difference? How long do you think I should take to increase her pack weight to the max compacity with which she should carry?
Thanks again for the info.
~Z
Feral Bill
12-20-2008, 12:46
Aiwix: Go to the beginning of this thread. Lots of information. Also see the rest of the DOGS... section of the group.
I have read most of them. Thanks, but maybe I passed over some of the info I for which I was looking. There are a lot of posts ;) I already carry a way to heavy pack (about 55-60 lbs) Because I have a dog, and she will not be carrying all her weight at first, I am really trying to figure out exactly what I need to bring along since I will be carrying it for a while. Dog bowl? More water bottles for her so that eventually she will be able to carry them?
I probably just need to relax a bit. I had no problem starting out on my thruhike, but being responsible for something else all of a sudden adds so much else to just going out in the woods and heading south. I wonder if she will help me speed up? Ha.
~Z
It's really important to load the two sides of the dog's pack nearly identical in weight, to keep it from pulling sideways. Although some "pack" breeds (Swiss Mtn Dogs, etc) carry 30% of their weight, I limit my dog's pack weight to 10%.
If your dog carries 3.5 lbs... It doesn't really matter whether that 3.5 lbs is yours or hers.
I carry the water. It is easier for me to get it for both of us. I have a quick connect in my bladder, pop off my bite valve, and fill her dish. I use a zip-lock bowl with a screw lid for her to drink out of. It is lighter than the fold-up nylon ones, and if the dog doesn't drink all the water, I screw the lid on and save it for later. I punched a hole in the lip around the bowl, put a string in it, and hook it to a carabiner that I attach to my pack. I also have an extra platy, but the water is "community" until it goes into her bowl.
I have a 70 lb dog that usually carries 6-6.5 lbs. It is easier to load her pack with stuff that the weight doesn't change from day to day... and stuff that compresses down and doesn't hurt to get wet: my tent and fly, a chamois towel, etc. I usually stick a few dog treats in there, too, that I give her throughout the day, so she knows she's carrying treats.
I take off her pack every time I take off mine.
The trash compactor bag made a pretty good raincoat... I trimmed it down and duct
taped it together under her belly. I did it when it was raining and COLD.
I put her daily ration of food into a ziplock. I give her half in the evening, he other half in the morning, so the only time I need to measure anything is when I'm putting it into the ziplocks.
I can't even imagine what you've got in your pack that makes it so heavy. I suspect you can trade some of the weight for dog items, and never miss what you left.
My dog related items: piece of z-rest to sleep on, piece of sleeping bag, dog food, zip-lock bowl, extra water, chamois towel, dog treats, collar, leash, dog pack, trash compactor bag, tick repellant, benadryl, and oh yeah, (since we're from the Keys and our sections aren't long enough to get a winter coat... a dog jacket she wears around camp and sleeps in) and shhh... her favorite soft squeaky toy she likes to sleep with.
WritinginCT
12-23-2008, 03:51
My boxer, Peanut, will be sectioning with me in the spring. She's 2.5yrs old (about 50-55lbs) and is just the silliest, sweetest thing. She adores being out in the woods and hiking- I swear she was a mountain goat in a former life. Backpacking is going to be a new adventure for the both of us. I'm not worried about wearing her out- I'm overweight and out of shape and my pace is slowwwww and she's one solid little spring-loaded muscle.
I'm not too concerned about the doggy first aid kit because most of the stuff I'll be carrying for myself anyway, I'll just flush it out with a few canine-specific needs.
I'm still sorting out my own gear but do have a two-person tent that was bought specifically big enough for the both of us. And I'm most likely going to go with a sleeping pad and quilt setup for myself. I'm planning a doggie-sized pad for Peanut with a remodeled piece of sleeping bag for her (basically think of a open square-flapped envelope- if its warm she can sleep on top of the whole thing, if it's cold she can nose her way into the "envelope" and nest or do what she does at home which is curl up next to me in bed.)
I've got a Kelty Chuckwagon pack for her that she's been tolerating well when I put it on her (I just used the whole "it's your pretty girl pack, wanna put it on?" trick that I did when I first got her used to having a collar and then later her harness- she *loves* being pretty lol).
She's used to being on a 15ft lead (with her harness) in the woods hiking- so I think that's going to come with us, plus a shorter 6ft.
She likes her sweatshirt - but I sorta like this idea better - seems like it would work better under her pack than a bulky sweatshirt or coat. http://www.retrieverworld.com/articfleece.htm
Luckily for me she eats Pedigree which is readily available and does really, really well on it. Our other ancient boxer has all sorts of skin issues and allergies and we have been through every $40 a bag holistic food on the market only to, by accident, discover that Pedigree causes her no issue so we've stuck with it. Peanut will eat dry kibble but I will be bringing some of the pouches of the Pedigree "Little Champions" wet food to mix in with it for extra calories and enticement. The pouches will travel well in her or my pack and aren't horribly heavy.
She does okay drinking from my water bottles with the sports tops but I'm someone that takes fairly frequent 5-10 minute breaks while hiking so to ensure that she's getting enough water I'll just pull her bowl out of her pack and fill it from my bottle/bladder. And I'm using a couple of the Ziploc disposable bowls for her, they are light and I can find a size that works with her having a big muzzle and an underbite.
One think I have been thinking about is hunters and what I can do for Peanut in the way of blaze orange (she is a flashy fawn boxer that does prance and jump around like a clumsy gazelle and it just makes me a little nervous). I'm thinking about a blaze collar and a bandanna or two (figuring I can tie one on like a cape to her pack and the other around her neck. What do you all do in that regard? Am I just being a worry wart?
On my list is one of her knotted rope toys and a rawhide bone. No squeaks (she adores them but just doesn't stop- it would get annoying by minute 3 or 4).
Other than that I can't think of anything I'd need for her.
Thanks a lot Mercy for your info. No boots for her? Has she been fine in snow or ice without foot protection? I guess I need to find a sleeping bag for her. Peanut sounds like she has a good one like an envelope, but what was it made of? Maybe I will copy hers. I was not sure about how to hike with her on a leash, but a 15ft lead sounds good, but with that, I should get her a harness? Right now, she just has a collar.
I do not think you are being a worry wart at all about the hunters. While there is no hunting in spring that I know of, what I went through in Nov in New England was enough to make sure that I wear orange all the time. I wore bright collars, my massive backpack, tramping through the forest and still had numerous rifles trained on me. Tree stands being right on the trail. Was worry some. And at that point, it was just me.
Hunter orange
Ruffwear has a bright orange vest. http://www.ruffwear.com/Track-Jacket;jsessionid=0a010c441f43d09910adb2134a5e99ea 966602e4df49.e3eTa3aSaxmTe34Pa38Ta38Nc3b0 which works ok without a pack.
With a pack? Maybe you could modify a bicycle vest/piece of bright nylon.
Mountain Crossings had some bright orange bandanas last fall that looked like that would be a simple solution.
My dog has worn boots, but usually doesn't. We didn't hike in snow, though.