View Full Version : Umbrellas for the desert
TwoForty
02-10-2008, 00:47
I haven't seen too much talk about umbrellas here. Are they worthwhile for the southern California sections? I've read a lot about not finding shade for miles. It seems an umbrella would be like portable shade at breaks. If I carried one, I would probably ditch my rain gear for a light DWR windshirt to use with the umbrella until Kennedy Meadows. I'd also use my trusty wide brimmed sun hat.
The offerings from golite seem decent at 10oz for the mylar coated one. Montbell has the lightest I've seen at 6oz.
The umbrellas from this site seem popular as well....
http://www.birdiepal.com/index.html
Any thoughts?
I'm getting an umbrella for the desert section of my CDT hike.
If you have an umbrella you can probably rock a bandanna/visor combo instead of a wide-brimmed hat.
Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-10-2008, 08:32
I have used umbrellas for desert and above tree line for sun protection. Excellent for this purpose. I suggest you find one that will attach to your pack so you can walk in the shade. As for the mylar coatings - I found that adding my own mylar cover made from a space blanket worked better. The mylar coating on umbrella wears off and gets dull - having it be easily changeable worked better for me. YMMV
Wolf - 23000
02-10-2008, 10:06
I've hiked the PCT 3 times and have never used an umbrella ever.
If your trying to do things the "Ray Way" of doing, do yourself a favor and don't. Every hiker I ran into doing things the "Ray Way", was carrying 3 or 4 times more weight than myself.
The book is a waste of money and time.
Wolf
Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-10-2008, 10:27
If your trying to do things the "Ray Way" of doing, do yourself a favor and don't. Every hiker I ran into doing things the "Ray Way", was carrying 3 or 4 times more weight than myself. The book is a waste of money and time.Different strokes for different folks. While miminalists will do fine with "Wolf Way", most hikers want more comfort than the method allows. I agree that since Jardine's book was published some things have become available that are lighter and more practical.
If your trying to do things the "Ray Way" of doing, do yourself a favor and don't. Every hiker I ran into doing things the "Ray Way", was carrying 3 or 4 times more weight than myself.
I have no dog in this fight, but since you've been notoriously secretive about the "Wolf Way," I don't see where you're helping matters much.
Anyway, Jardine isn't the only authority on UL hiking. Don Ladigan and Ryan Jordan cover the topic pretty well, IMO... and without the ego.
IMO, light and ultra-light hiking have to be practiced and learned from experience, and every "practitioner" needs to find their own limits and approach it their own way.
Marty_Mcfly
02-10-2008, 11:21
I think that umbrellas do have a place in hiking. Maybe that place was greater around Jardine's time when hiking products were extremely heavy. Andrew Skurka carried a mylar umbrella for a portion of his Great western loop hike, and Im sure he's about as light weight as it gets, except for people like Ryan Joran. I say if you want the umbrella, carry it, do things your own way, and hike your own hike, no one else's.
I never liked using an umbrella, then again I do like hiking poles.
That's the beauty of hiking: There is no correct way of doing anything.
What works for one person may or may not work for another.
What is nice about Ryan Jordan's book (http://www.amazon.com/Lightweight-Backpacking-Camping-Wilderness-Equipment/dp/0974818828/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1202659648&sr=8-1) is that it is a collection of different opinions. Though I think the book is too "Techie" oriented [1], I do like the idea of showing a spectrum of different opinions for lightweight backpacking.
Terrapin mentions the Ladigan (http://www.pmags.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=14205&g2_serialNumber=2&g2_GALLERYSID=5295e440ec8cfee1f60b90b7c5eb97bf)boo k. Personally, I think it is the best book for someone looking to go lightweight who is a tradtional backpacker. Plus, there is less emphasis on gear and more on overall attitude. (K.I.S.S.!) The Jordan book is better for refining techniques, though.
So, some people love umbrellas. I prefer the dorky-sun-hat myself. (I need no help in looking like a dork, though. ;) )
When I did the CDT, Disco and POD rocked the umbrellas and loved it. They looked VERY comfortable during breaks.
http://www.pmags.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=14205&g2_serialNumber=2&g2_GALLERYSID=5295e440ec8cfee1f60b90b7c5eb97bf
But, umbrellas for me have too much of a "futz factor".
As always, YMMV.
[1] I am more of a dirt-bagger in terms of gear.
Wolf - 23000
02-10-2008, 12:13
I have no dog in this fight, but since you've been notoriously secretive about the "Wolf Way," I don't see where you're helping matters much.
Anyway, Jardine isn't the only authority on UL hiking. Don Ladigan and Ryan Jordan cover the topic pretty well, IMO... and without the ego.
IMO, light and ultra-light hiking have to be practiced and learned from experience, and every "practitioner" needs to find their own limits and approach it their own way.
terrapin,
Please do tell what is the "Wolf Way?" Everyone who know me or read my post knows I believe hikers should hike how ever they feel like. What I don't like is when someone tries to copy others - carry the same sleeping bag, back pack, etc., just because someone with a lot of experience carries it.
Don Ladigan and Ryan Jordan I don't believe promote the use of an umbrella either which is the topic. Ray is the only one that I am aware of that seems to like it.
Wolf
Wolf - 23000
02-10-2008, 12:28
Different strokes for different folks. While miminalists will do fine with "Wolf Way", most hikers want more comfort than the method allows. I agree that since Jardine's book was published some things have become available that are lighter and more practical.
Frolicking Dinosaurs,
I do backpack the "Wolf Way" of course and I encourage others to backpack the "Frolicking Dinosaurs Way" or the "Joe Hiker Way" or how every they like to do so. I just don't like when hikers try to copy the way others backpacks travel. If someone likes to carries 50 pounds or 20 pounds that their choice. You don't need a book or video to tell you if you every time you add something in your pack, that more weight you will have to carry.
As for "since Jardine's book was published some things have become available that are lighter and more practical." that not true. Grandma Gatewood, myself and others started backpacking before Ray ever came out with his book and lighter than even the self-proclaim lightweight grue himself. The equipment has been out there before Jardine ever came around.
Wolf
What is nice about Ryan Jordan's book (http://www.amazon.com/Lightweight-Backpacking-Camping-Wilderness-Equipment/dp/0974818828/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1202659648&sr=8-1) is that it is a collection of different opinions. Though I think the book is too "Techie" oriented [1], I do like the idea of showing a spectrum of different opinions for lightweight backpacking.
That "conversational" approach is also used in the 4th edition of The Complete Walker. It's presented as an ongoing conversation between Colin Fletcher and Chip Rawlins. Lots of interesting sidebars, footnotes, and introspective comments along the way. Umbrellas are mentioned in a couple of places in the book, first in the context of desert hiking and later for rain protection.
Well, books or videos ARE good for giving different ideas. Much like this BBS. :)
Otherwise, we could have one page on WHITE BLAZE and be done with it. ;)
Naah..give me books, discussions, videos, whatever. Not to copy other ideas, but for the purpose of sharing.
We all started at ground zero in terms of knowledge for EVERYTHING.
I love to read cookbooks, read backpacking books, or peruse websites. Sharing is good. There is so much to learn.
Toolshed
02-10-2008, 12:51
I wish I had thought of an umbrella back in 1996 when I backpacked across Joshua Tree. 12 years later, I still cannot stand to be in the sun after that trip.
TwoForty
02-10-2008, 13:17
Thanks for the replies guys. I think I'll give a cheap one a try and ditch it if I don't like it. I talked to a few PCT hikers while I was on the JMT last year who said they carried umbrellas during the southern section so I thought Id ask here to get opinions on if they are effective or not.
Mags: I saw their Walkumentary and loved it! It shows how a great sense of humor is one of the greatest things you can take with you on a hike.
I've hiked the PCT 3 times and have never used an umbrella ever.
If your trying to do things the "Ray Way" of doing, do yourself a favor and don't. Every hiker I ran into doing things the "Ray Way", was carrying 3 or 4 times more weight than myself.
The book is a waste of money and time.
Wolf
I honestly never read his book. I couldn't get past his online ego. I don't really like people telling me that I should or shouldn't hike this way. ;) I'm not sure how much stuff he carried, but I'd wager that I will be carrying more anyways. No big deal.
Please do tell what is the "Wolf Way?"
Nobody knows. It's classified information, apparently. That was my point. All we know is that it's super-ultra-light -- something you never fail to point out, at every opportunity. The rest is a mystery. :-?
taildragger
02-10-2008, 14:33
Twoforty (or two forties?)
I should have a post here somewhere about an umbrella (I think it was mentioned on my PCT gear thread).
Anyways, I figure that for the cost and the possible added benefits its worth giving it a shot. Just think, shaded and in the breeze while walking, sweat on your head would work so much more efficiently.
I'm thinking about either dollar store or Golite for an umbrella, then I'll just need to figure a way to strap it to my pack for low wind situations. The one thing that is getting me though is that I do like trekking poles.
Wolf - 23000
02-10-2008, 14:44
Nobody knows. It's classified information, apparently. That was my point. All we know is that it's super-ultra-light -- something you never fail to point out, at every opportunity. The rest is a mystery. :-?
Terrapin,
As I've pointed out before, I just believe everyone should backpack his or her own way. Yes there are some people that travel light weight of course, but you don't need them to tell you what to carry. And some of the "ultra-light" backpackers don't have the best advise. It works for them but others it maybe the wrong suggestion.
Wolf
Mags: I saw their Walkumentary and loved it! It shows how a great sense of humor is one of the greatest things you can take with you on a hike.
Indeed. We had a good crew two years ago. Lots of good people (if slightly too many margs in Rawlins. :D)
I tried the umbrella thing since they handed out free ones at the Kickoff last year. It ended up staying in th pack mostly till I ditched it very quickly. I like to use poles so it wasn't really conducive to an umbrella. All consider that they don't work well with gusts of wind, which you encounter all the time in the desert.
That being said, a few people had em' and loved em'.
I love my umbrellas, and unfortunately use them all the time:(, but I've never had the pleasure of using it for shade.
TwoForty
02-10-2008, 16:28
Twoforty (or two forties?)
I should have a post here somewhere about an umbrella (I think it was mentioned on my PCT gear thread).
Anyways, I figure that for the cost and the possible added benefits its worth giving it a shot. Just think, shaded and in the breeze while walking, sweat on your head would work so much more efficiently.
I'm thinking about either dollar store or Golite for an umbrella, then I'll just need to figure a way to strap it to my pack for low wind situations. The one thing that is getting me though is that I do like trekking poles.
I heard someone mention taking thick grey pipe insulation and velcroing it to a shoulder strap. From there you slip the umbrella shaft in and use more string or velcro straps to secure it. I imagine it would give enough adjustment after some tinkering.
Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-10-2008, 18:38
.....As for "since Jardine's book was published some things have become available that are lighter and more practical." that not true. Grandma Gatewood, myself and others started backpacking before Ray ever came out with his book and lighter than even the self-proclaim lightweight grue himself. The equipment has been out there before Jardine ever came around.Not saying you're fibbing, but I'm having trouble figuring out what you are talking about. Examples please?
taildragger
02-10-2008, 19:15
Not saying you're fibbing, but I'm having trouble figuring out what you are talking about. Examples please?
Well, just think about the basics
a quilt could always be made, same with a pack
or if you travel light, use a daypack, or a school back pack
use anything you can that makes an adequate shelter
three pairs of wool socks and maybe an emergency poncho
what else do you REALLY need?
Frolicking Dinosaurs
02-10-2008, 19:21
Well, just think about the basics
a quilt could always be made, same with a pack
or if you travel light, use a daypack, or a school back pack
use anything you can that makes an adequate shelter
three pairs of wool socks and maybe an emergency poncho
what else do you REALLY need?Jardine urged making your own quilts and packs - and also using plastic drop clothes as tarps. This is why I'm having trouble figuring out how Granny Gatewood (old wool army blanket, canvas duffel bag and shower curtain as a tarp) was all that much different or lighter.
~ using plastic drop clothes ~
Is this what Janet Jackson was wearing at the SuperBowl, a few years ago? :D
Wolf - 23000
02-10-2008, 20:37
Frolicking Dinosaurs,
Grandma Gatewood first backpacked the AT in 1955 (second in 1957 and third time 1964). Her pack weight was approximately 18 pounds. My first hiked of the AT the was back in 1989 carrying after trimming down everything between 10 – 15 pounds – it took me about 2 months before I was able to trim down. In 1992, during my third hike of the AT is when I was notice by Lynne Whelden and one of the contribute factor in the creations of “Lightweight Backpacking Secrets Revealed”. I only mention that because Ray Jardine wrote his first book in 1993 long after hikers were already traveling ultra-light.
Between Grandma Gatewood and myself I’m sure there were other light weight backpackers that I’m not aware of. To say that Ray Jardine book credit for causing things to become available that are lighter and more practical just is not true. Lightweight gear was available long before Jardine ever came around.
Wolf
vaporjourney
02-10-2008, 20:40
I'm going to be using an umbrella on the PCT this year, and think it will make my hike through the desert exponentially more enjoyable. I won't need to carry a hat, which will help offset the weight savings some. Also less water will be needed since I'll be cooler in general without a hat trapping heat in my head, and the shade and coolness of the upper body won't hurt either for that purpose.
I've got the Birdiepal Swing Liteflex, here http://www.prolitegear.com/birdiepal_swing_liteflex.html , in the UV silver color. They are out of stock now it looks like, but if you email them and request that color, they will definitely put in a special order for you. Very great customer service. I tried the smaller, lighter, Dainty umbrella, but found the handle to be entirely too short. The Swing Liteflex has a longer handle, wider coverage, and much better construction.
Nice umbrella comparison here: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/2007_birdiepal_umbrellas_spotlite_review.html
RenoRoamer
02-10-2008, 20:56
The Euroschirm Swing Liteflex umbrella is available at Campmor (item 90601).
I tried hiking with an umbrella after reading Jardine's book and found it a nuisance. Aside from holding the thing, which is tiring, there is the obvious problem of wind. Personally, I think a good hat (a Stetson made of fur felt) and the right clothes (loosely-fitting long pants and long sleeve shirt in nylon or cotton) are just as effective as an umbrella. When was the last time you saw a south Texas or New Mexico cowboy toting an umbrella? Or a Mexican farm-worker for that matter? Most of them that I see wear wide-brimmed Stetsons made of wool or fur felt. Certainly that works fine for me and I've spent quite a bit of time hiking in the hills here in Nevada in the summer, though admittedly not with a backpack.
Jardine is not a ultra lightweight backpacking pioneer. He's a lightweight backpacking popularizer.
The 'best' way to do the desert is to cover lots of miles and night, relax during the day, and not bother with an umbrella or a large water capacity. But personally, I don't like night hiking very often, for some reason night hiking more than every once in a while makes me miserable. I hate it so much that I didn't even carry a headlamp or any light source for most of the PCT. I'd rather suck up the heat and carrying the extra gear (umbrella, water, water capacity) so that I can hike during the day, but we all have our quirks.
taildragger
02-11-2008, 13:44
Hrmm, what about just rigging a space blanket (or tyvek) over your head and attaching it to your pack. Seems like it could work, and double useage...
I found the sun in the Sierra to be about as intense as I can stand, so for this hiker, it's not just the desert. I found starting a day at first light and getting in some good miles before 10 AM to be key. I am also rather fond of night hiking.
Regarding a space blanket, they are noisy suckers. I'd rather be hot than have one of those things draped over me like I was a baked potato.
WWBD? (What Would Bedouins Do? :) ) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bedouin)
vaporjourney
02-12-2008, 19:46
Mowgli: what about the Sierra sun was so bad? Did the sun cause the Sierra to be extremely hot, or did it just feel wayy too bright out there and baking your skin due to the higher altitude and reflecting snow?