View Full Version : unassisted hiking
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 18:50
looking to do a sub three month thru-hike(unissited) would like to hear everyones opinion on what they consider unissited! no yellow or blue blazing of course. no slackpacking. maildrops?(not that i use those much)sometimes a bounce box. is bounce boxes ok. i know someone that says town stayovers are not thruhiking. (not sure what to think of that yet?) what about the hostels not in towns then,or the pay campsites in theS.N.P. OR THE WHITES where you pay for them to assist you. hitching to town is ok,what about pre-arrange pickups farther up the trail?(friends) i know most slacks are prearranged,what if i hiked a twenty mile day,walked right by a motel purchased a motel room,left my pack (or just my tent an stove)hiked up the trail another 10+ miles and hitched back? is that slacking.(thats a reach i know. i'm just fishing here... would like to hear opionions. thanks
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 18:52
if you have to ask what an unassisted hike is then it's unlikely you'll do one
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 18:56
99' carried my pack the whole way,wolf. just seeing what other people think. your the one that frowns on town stays. wonder who else agrees with that. opionions vary,thats what i'm looking for.
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 18:59
i love town stays. i'm just sayin' multiple days off on a thru-hike breaks the continuity of a thru-hike. then it's just a section hike
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 19:05
i love town stays. i'm just sayin' multiple days off on a thru-hike breaks the continuity of a thru-hike. then it's just a section hikei completely agree with that wolf,i would'nt of known without asking. i've been a brick/block mason for 18 years just because i know what i'm doing doesn't mean i dont need to ask questions sometimes...
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 19:15
unassisted means carrying your own pack, hitching to town, get your stuff and hit the trail
Miss Janet
02-10-2008, 19:27
Go ahead, take something that is hard to do... hiking the AT... and make it as hard as possible. Neither of you have hiked the trail 100% "unassisted" and NO ONE ever will. So, why try to make it harder than you have to?
LW, how many 0 days, not hiking, turns ones thruhike into a section hike?? 1. 3, 7, 11?? and who gets to judge that??
Crumb... hiking without your gear for a few hours is a TREAT and not something hikers get to do very often unless someone is following them is a car for a long way. So why try to figure out how many "miles" without your pack on disqualifies you as a "unassisted" thruhiker?
You boys both have a great wealth of hiking experience... (I am thinking around 10,000 miles each...) lots of REAL things to share with people and yet you would rather be "pithy" and "Pure" instead of being helpful.
unassisted means carrying your own pack, hitching to town, get your stuff and hit the trail
You would allow maildrops in your definition?
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 19:31
huh? i've never slackpacked or had people waiting for me at roads. hiking the AT ain't that hard. what's your definition of assisted, janet?
sparky2000
02-10-2008, 19:32
I'm sure, since she's a Lady, that not only are maildrops ok. But she'd let you carry her pack up hill!
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 19:39
janet,i have always been helpful of others. giving away gear people need or lost,cheering them up, carrying gear for others to help them out(injuries). and i know freedom hiking is fun. you started me on it. yeah i like to slack now an then but you also know i can carry me and my dogs gear on 30+ days. i was just looking for valuble opionions from wolf,jack you and anyone else that wants to chirp in. not being hateful. i hope that most people enjoyed my company over the years... lots of love here...
Miss Janet
02-10-2008, 19:43
Sure I would let you! Thanks for volunteering!
Come on, you know it's hard. Harder for some physically, harder for some mentally... so why add the extra weight of "rules" that no one agrees on.
Unassisted would mean that you took NO assistance from anyone... not a nice guy with a pickup hitch making your resupply easier or a shuttle picking you up at the trailhead... no one else sending you your stuff from home, no nice friend giving you fuel because you ran out... or food because you didn't have enough... no trail magic to lift your spirits...
Unassisted doesn't happen... and what a sad hike that would be anyway.
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 19:44
i disagree. that's all
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 19:50
Sure I would let you! Thanks for volunteering!
Come on, you know it's hard. Harder for some physically, harder for some mentally... so why add the extra weight of "rules" that no one agrees on.
Unassisted would mean that you took NO assistance from anyone... not a nice guy with a pickup hitch making your resupply easier or a shuttle picking you up at the trailhead... no one else sending you your stuff from home, no nice friend giving you fuel because you ran out... or food because you didn't have enough... no trail magic to lift your spirits...
Unassisted doesn't happen... and what a sad hike that would be anyway.i totally agree,but like i said just because i have most of the answers already doesn't mean i wont value other opinions.
Pedaling Fool
02-10-2008, 19:51
I often wonder if it's semantics that cause these arguments or maybe it's emotional immaturity
....:-?
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 19:54
there is no argument. i know what i'm talking about :)
Miss Janet
02-10-2008, 20:18
I often wonder if it's semantics that cause these arguments or maybe it's emotional immaturity
....:-?
We all just agree to disagree about some things...
Appalachian Tater
02-10-2008, 20:22
looking to do a sub three month thru-hike(unissited) would like to hear everyones opinion on what they consider unissited! no yellow or blue blazing of course. no slackpacking. maildrops?(not that i use those much)sometimes a bounce box. is bounce boxes ok. i know someone that says town stayovers are not thruhiking. (not sure what to think of that yet?) what about the hostels not in towns then,or the pay campsites in theS.N.P. OR THE WHITES where you pay for them to assist you. hitching to town is ok,what about pre-arrange pickups farther up the trail?(friends) i know most slacks are prearranged,what if i hiked a twenty mile day,walked right by a motel purchased a motel room,left my pack (or just my tent an stove)hiked up the trail another 10+ miles and hitched back? is that slacking.(thats a reach i know. i'm just fishing here... would like to hear opionions. thanks
There is a difference between hiking and backpacking. You can hike carrying nothing. Backpacking is carrying your stuff with you. You can backpack Europe without walking farther than from the train to the taxi.
Are you talking about unassisted or unsupported?
Unsupported generally means carrying your own stuff, hiking and backpacking at the same time. On a supported hike, someone meets you at road crossings with food and shelter. You don't carry your own stuff except day-hiking type stuff, you aren't backpacking.
Yellow-and blue-blazing have more to do with whether you are thru-hiking or not than whether you are unsupported or not.
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 20:50
There is a difference between hiking and backpacking. You can hike carrying nothing. Backpacking is carrying your stuff with you. You can backpack Europe without walking farther than from the train to the taxi.
Are you talking about unassisted or unsupported?
Unsupported generally means carrying your own stuff, hiking and backpacking at the same time. On a supported hike, someone meets you at road crossings with food and shelter. You don't carry your own stuff except day-hiking type stuff, you aren't backpacking.
Yellow-and blue-blazing have more to do with whether you are thru-hiking or not than whether you are unsupported or not.thanks tater,for the info. i meant unsupported.
Hey Crumb!! a sub three month hike huh?? I have no doubts you can do it!!
I agree with what Tater said about unsupported....no one meeting you at the road crossings with your stuff etc....
overall though, i guess you gotta determine what it truly means in your own mind. at least when it comes to possibly mailing yourself some things ahead, etc. In my mind, that is still unsupported cause you weren't relying on someone else....
and yes, i did enjoy your company on the trail! when you gonna do this hike???
looking to do a sub three month thru-hike(unissited) would like to hear everyones opinion on what they consider unissited! no yellow or blue blazing of course. no slackpacking. maildrops?(not that i use those much)sometimes a bounce box. is bounce boxes ok. i know someone that says town stayovers are not thruhiking. (not sure what to think of that yet?) what about the hostels not in towns then,or the pay campsites in theS.N.P. OR THE WHITES where you pay for them to assist you. hitching to town is ok,what about pre-arrange pickups farther up the trail?(friends) i know most slacks are prearranged,what if i hiked a twenty mile day,walked right by a motel purchased a motel room,left my pack (or just my tent an stove)hiked up the trail another 10+ miles and hitched back? is that slacking.(thats a reach i know. i'm just fishing here... would like to hear opionions. thanks
There's no such thing as an unassisted thru hike. We all walk on the efforts of thousands that dreamed of the trail, built the trail, rebuilt the trail, fought in the Congress to protect the trail, continue to fight to raise the money to provide buffers for the trail as development intrudes.
Weary www.matlt.org
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 21:25
Hey Crumb!! a sub three month hike huh?? I have no doubts you can do it!!
I agree with what Tater said about unsupported....no one meeting you at the road crossings with your stuff etc....
overall though, i guess you gotta determine what it truly means in your own mind. at least when it comes to possibly mailing yourself some things ahead, etc. In my mind, that is still unsupported cause you weren't relying on someone else....
and yes, i did enjoy your company on the trail! when you gonna do this hike???thanks for the kind words, wak. my hike will be start sometime around may2008 or may 2009.i am not sure about alot of things still,i still do not have full support from ida yet, cant say i blame her. its not responsble of me to leave her and my baby daughter behind for such a long time, i know.it would be a driving force for me though to get back a early as i could. i would like the challenge,but i'm still weighing the cost.i love my daughter so much, and look forward to sharing the trail with her. but dont want to give up my dreams either.
Appalachian Tater
02-10-2008, 21:29
Go NOBO and take the wife and offshoot with you.
thanks for the kind words, wak. my hike will be start sometime around may2008 or may 2009.i am not sure about alot of things still,i still do not have full support from ida yet, cant say i blame her. its not responsble of me to leave her and my baby daughter behind for such a long time, i know.it would be a driving force for me though to get back a early as i could. i would like the challenge,but i'm still weighing the cost.i love my daughter so much, and look forward to sharing the trail with her. but dont want to give up my dreams either.
yeah, i'm sure that is a tough decision!! and like you said, it will make you get back sooner!! If i'm still up north here when you do it, i'll try to find you out there and maybe do some magic...unless of course, that's considered not in the realm of this hike for you! i am hoping though, that i'll be moving south sometime in the sorta near future!!
An unsupported hike? It's one where you don't have people meeting you on the road with equipment, food, and so forth on a regular basis.
Maildrops? No problem. If the extent of your support is that someone at home mails your prepacked drop from your local post office, this is NOT a "supported" hike.
Slackpacking? If you do it once in a while from the most popular places (Dennis Cove, Damascus, etc) it's a nice change of pace, not support. (Actually I never slackpacked, but don't oppose the practice in any way.) Now if you have a structure in place to allow you to slackpack pretty much the entire trail, yes, this is supported, but this is the extremely rare exception.
Staying in towns? Of course it's not support. Has the town moved to meet you? Nah.
Hitching? Some could argue this is support, but is it something you can count on like a support team? Not at all.
What is "support" for a thru-hike? A pre-arranged service designed to allow a hiker to carry little or no gear for essentially the full trail. My 2 cents.
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 21:43
BEARPAW, thanks for the post,much appreciated advice.
fiddlehead
02-10-2008, 21:48
I believe the two most important elements in the definition would be mail drops and hitching.
I personally don't think there's a problem with either one, but i know some do.
I remember a guy on the PCT in '96 who would get to a big town, buy about 4 weeks food, go to a hotel room, rebag it all, get some empty boxes and send himself 4 or 5 maildrops from there. When he completed that much of the trail, he would do it again. This (to me) is not a supported or assisted hike.
But, i guess to be really pure, you would have to buy your own food all the time, and walk to town to get it, (and walk back) to some people anyway.
Up to you really, isn't it.
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 21:54
fiddlehead,thanks for your advice, and i love my copy of REALLY LIVIN' you guys sure know how to live it up!
Pedaling Fool
02-10-2008, 21:56
...Slackpacking? If you do it once in a while from the most popular places (Dennis Cove, Damascus, etc) it's a nice change of pace, not support. (Actually I never slackpacked, but don't oppose the practice in any way.) Now if you have a structure in place to allow you to slackpack pretty much the entire trail, yes, this is supported, but this is the extremely rare exception....
Slackpacking is something I've never done either, but based on my observations it is something that is highly addictive. Once someone did a slackpack they wanted to do it again and again and again.....
It got to the point I remember hearing people talking a lot about it, speculating if this hostel or that one or that outfitter.... provided this drug, oops, I mean service.
I wonder how much some people spent for this service (all together), must of really added to their cost of the trip.
If the extent of your support is that someone at home mails your prepacked drop from your local post office, this is NOT a "supported" hike.
Here's a perfect example of why, sometimes, these discussions are fruitless. I seldom use drops and when I do, I mail it myself from home, right before the start of the trail, or from the trail. So if you asked me if mail drops from a third party is support, my answer would have to be yes.
That said, my best advice is to just get out there and hike and not worry about definitions.
Just a note about slacking I thought I'd add. I slacked a handful of days on the AT and I think four times on the PCT. Slacking doesn't necessarily have to cost you more money, or a lot more. It's not always necessary to pay a shuttle service, if you don't mind thumbing it yourself. For instance this summer in Sisters OR, there are 2 PCT crossings out of town, so we simply hitched to one, walked to the other and hitched back to town. And you won't spend extra money in town if you're slacking as an alternative to a zero day.
Not all slacking has to be arranged with a hostel/service provider if you can be a bit creative and read maps.
Blissful
02-10-2008, 22:07
There were times my hubby met us to give us a maildrop of food. We also did some slacking. If that's assisted, fine with me (and who cares?). We still hiked the trail for GA to ME and that's more than a lot of people (say 98% or maybe 99%?) have done or will do in their lifetime. And I for one am SO glad we did it!! It was an adventure of a lifetime.
HYOH, have fun with it the way you want and not let others presume there is only one way to do it to have supposed credibility. (which means absolutely nothing on the grand scale of things anyway)
Blissful
02-10-2008, 22:09
That said, my best advice is to just get out there and hike and not worry about definitions.
Here, here!
End of discussion.
CrumbSnatcher
02-10-2008, 22:15
Here's a perfect example of why, sometimes, these discussions are fruitless. I seldom use drops and when I do, I mail it myself from home, right before the start of the trail, or from the trail. So if you asked me if mail drops from a third party is support, my answer would have to be yes.
That said, my best advice is to just get out there and hike and not worry about definitions.
sly,thanks for your view on the maildrops. very interesting,cant say i remember ever recieving maildrops. my family back in nebraska was never into my hikes. had some money sent to me before in 99' grossly under estimated the cost of a thru. i use bounce boxes though. i agree some people get addicted to looking and paying for slacks. 99' i carried my pack the whole way. my slacking experience is around erwin only(miss j)she calls it freedom hiking. to me slacking was usually to give my dog a day or two off,yeah you heard me right. on my 03' thruhike my dog was 10 years old,wanted to keep her on the journey,but not all the miles.example manchester center to bennington 40.1 miles while blister sister watched bear. bonzo watched bear on the day i went 47 miles into harpers ferry northbound. tricks watched bear on two long days also. slacking is cool,but i like the weight of my pack on me. and i can stop anywere. thanks again
mweinstone
02-10-2008, 22:17
this thread is an hard saying. how can you be concerned with anything but hiking your own hike. supported hiked just are hikes are just one of many typs of hike. not to be aspired to or disdaned but rather one of many chooises. and for your information it means only that the hiker either carrys less than all his gear or cooks less than most of his food or is shuttled by less than all the shuttles on the trail but by a dedicated one. other than those three things, no other varyable exists to seperate thruhiking from supported hiking. if someone walked behind you carrying the trail of your robe or combing your hair or doing some useless act it is not supported. if someone were to fetch all your water or allways carry your raingear, then that is supported. these rules are written on two stone tablets moses made during his tablet makeing years and are housed in an ark that was made during the ark useing years. its all very propper.
AT-HITMAN2005
02-10-2008, 22:18
are you going for the unsupported record?
I completely agree with Miss Janet. Even if you could do a completely unassisted hike - why bother? If you define a single 0 day as making it a section hike instead of a thru-hike, fine. In that case, I'd rather do a section hike any day. HYOH
Slackpacking is something I've never done either, but based on my observations it is something that is highly addictive. Once someone did a slackpack they wanted to do it again and again and again.....
And what do you say to section hikers who count day hikes among their sections? Would that be "slacking?" :-?
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 22:41
I completely agree with Miss Janet. Even if you could do a completely unassisted hike - why bother? HYOH
because that person would be HTOH
Pedaling Fool
02-10-2008, 22:47
And what do you say to section hikers who count day hikes among their sections? Would that be "slacking?" :-?
I don't know what you're asking. I wasn't defining the term slackpack. I was just saying slackpacking can be addictive to those attempting a long distance hike. I've seen it and I'm pretty sure they ended-up spending a lot. Just not worth it to me.
Footslogger
02-10-2008, 22:49
When I hike the trail in 2003 I didn't even consider the whole "asissted" or "unassisted" stuff. I planned my hike and just got out there. That said ...a number of people showed me what I would call "random acts of kindness".
I don't consider my hike to have been "assisted" but I'd be lying if I said that I was ever helped in any way.
Guess it's all a matter of definition ....
'Slogger
I didn't read most of this thread. Far too much verbiage. But I don't understand all this fuss about definitions and authorized versions. Who cares about what an unsupported hike is, or a supported one? Well, obviously a lot of people. Not me. You do what you need to do to get on down the trail. Or off it, or around it, or beside it, whatever you want. This is a recreation, an adventure, whatever, but it's not a legal contract. If you must have rules, make your own.
There are obviously a few rules on the trail, such as in the parks and the Whites, and fire regs. And there are a few good practices, like LNT and avoiding overuse. Then there some good neighbor things like helping with maintenance and helping those in trouble of one sort or another and avoiding being a nutjob in trail towns or shelters. None of which have anything to do with going supported or unsupported, or being a thru or a flip-flopper, or sectioning, going nobo or sobo, and so on. Just because somebody made up a cool mnemonic or abbreviation doesn't mean those things have anything to do with your hike. As they say, HYOH, and when discussing it here, make full use of all the in phrases, but don't take it to heart. It's just a long walk in the woods. Or a string of shorter walks in the woods.
Lone Wolf
02-10-2008, 22:55
Who cares about what an unsupported hike is, or a supported one?
folks attempting to set records
folks attempting to set records
If you want a record -- or a thru hike for that matter -- just claim it. A lot of folks do.
Some of us from time to time criticize the practice. But wiser folks always stop such discussions. HYOH, LYOL seems to be the rule.
Okay.
But the question remains - is it physically possible for the average hiker? (sub 3-month unsupported NOBO thruhike)
River Runner
02-11-2008, 01:01
Except for those wanting to set an 'unofficial' record, I don't think it matters how you choose to hike the AT (well, as long as you aren't doing anything illegal along the way). It's for your own satisfaction and you are the only one who can figure out how you want to do it.
Okay.
But the question remains - is it physically possible for the average hiker? (sub 3-month unsupported NOBO thruhike)
Seems to me an average hike takes 5-6 months. 3 months is well above average.
jersey joe
02-11-2008, 09:36
I would say an unassisted thru hike would not include any slackpacking. Carry your pack the whole way. Something rubbed me wrong when people slackpacked for 3 or 4 straight days while I was backpacking.
But I don't understand all this fuss about definitions and authorized versions. Who cares about what an unsupported hike is, or a supported one?
Definitions are important in communications. If we are going to have a dialog, common definitions are important.
I don't care if a person thrus, sections, or flip flops, supported, or unsupported, but when they talk about it, they should be truthful.
Pedaling Fool
02-11-2008, 10:54
Definitions are important in communications. If we are going to have a dialog, common definitions are important.
I don't care if a person thrus, sections, or flip flops, supported, or unsupported, but when they talk about it, they should be truthful.
This is true; I've also worked in a job where definitions are very important. However, in common life it's just too tedious to expect that level of exactness WRT definitions of certain terms. Hiking is no different; we don't need the hassle of defining in exact terms.
Now if the ATC were to recognize records, then it'd be incumbent upon them to define in no uncertain terms many things, like thru-hike, slackpacking, unsupported.... but they don't define these things in an exact manner, just a waste of time and resources. So to ask a bunch of hikers the definition will only cause emotionally charged discourse.
But it is kind of fun to watch;)
Something rubbed me wrong when people slackpacked for 3 or 4 straight days while I was backpacking.
Why? As long as you are enjoying yourself, whywould you care if someone day hiked and was supported for a few days?
Just go out and walk. Should be simple. :)
I think it's just:
1. No slackpacking.
2. Walk past every blaze.
3. Any assistance not related to making miles on the trail (hitches into town, etc.) has to be improvised, in that there can be no prior arrangements; ie, you stumble out of the woods, stick your thumb out, and let the winds of fate determine how long you wait.
Unassisted/unsupported are both general concepts. If you want to give either of these terms a more specific meaning, then outline that meaning either personally, publicly, or both, but you probably already knew that.
Enjoy!
warraghiyagey
02-11-2008, 12:14
Should be simple. :)
Should be.:rolleyes:
I think that the level of support that you receive goes back to what your purpose or motivation for doing the sub-three month hike is.
Are you wanting to go as fast as you can because you will not have Bear to limit your abilities?
Are you just trying to see want you are made of? How far you can push yourself?
Are you wanting to do a thru-hike, but you do not want to be gone from home too long?
Are you wanting to set a personal record? Preping for an even bigger hike? Are you wanting recognition in the trail community? Maybe this is your secret way of getting in the Bill Bryson movie???
All I am saying is that if I happen to show up somewhere on the trail with a bag of brownies, don't make me eat them all because it would be "supported". (You know that I have to keep my girlish figure)
All these years you have lovingly "supported" Bear on his hikes. Maybe it is time that some of the love comes back to you.
I think that the level of support that you receive goes back to what your purpose or motivation for doing the sub-three month hike is.
Are you wanting to go as fast as you can because you will not have Bear to limit your abilities?
Are you just trying to see want you are made of? How far you can push yourself?
Are you wanting to do a thru-hike, but you do not want to be gone from home too long?
Are you wanting to set a personal record? Preping for an even bigger hike? Are you wanting recognition in the trail community? Maybe this is your secret way of getting in the Bill Bryson movie???
All I am saying is that if I happen to show up somewhere on the trail with a bag of brownies, don't make me eat them all because it would be "supported". (You know that I have to keep my girlish figure)
All these years you have lovingly "supported" Bear on his hikes. Maybe it is time that some of the love comes back to you.
well stated Hotrod! :)
A number of women hikers don't like to hitchhike alone. I always tried to accomodate that concern by hitching with an attractive woman hiker, because they always seemed to get a ride more easily than I could alone. Does that mean my walk north was assisted?
A number of women hikers don't like to hitchhike alone. I always tried to accomodate that concern by hitching with an attractive woman hiker, because they always seemed to get a ride more easily than I could alone. Does that mean my walk north was assisted?
I think anyone pink blazing is getting a little assistance :rolleyes:
I mean the adrenaline boost to catch up, of course. They should definitely be disqualified.
jersey joe
02-11-2008, 14:33
Why? As long as you are enjoying yourself, whywould you care if someone day hiked and was supported for a few days?
Just go out and walk. Should be simple. :)
I was trying to answer your question Mags as to why...
I couldn't really come up with a reason, but I remembered when I was out there, it bugged me for some reason, so I looked at my journal and found an entry that kinda sums up my feelings on slackpacking...
"I passed a whole bunch of people, some that I knew, slackpacking south. By slackpacking I mean that they just had day packs on with food+water. Apparently one of the hostels was dropping them off 19 miles from Erwin and they spend a day if when you get to the end you feel good about yourself, thats all that really matterswalking to Erwin. Now, call me a purist, or picky, but I think thats cheating. Not so much the not having a backpack part, although I won't do that, but the fact that they are hiking south, eliminating big climbs and in total 2000ft of vertical climbing. But I shouldn't complain, it's their thru-hike. I suppose if when you get to the end you feel good about yourself, thats all that really matters."
I But I shouldn't complain, it's their thru-hike. I suppose if when you get to the end you feel good about yourself, thats all that really matters."
Remember your own advice. It is good advice for any hiker.
Be safe, have fun and the right to do what you want ends at your nose.
All the rest are just details.
Cheating?? While hiking??? Someone taking steroids?? :D:eek::rolleyes:
there needs to be a Congressional inquiry.
Roger Clemens hikes?
there needs to be a Congressional inquiry.
George Mitchell is a Mainer and a Red Sox fan. That's who we need to investigate. ;)