View Full Version : Never lend your gear.
I'm just steamed this morning. Leant my Pocket Rocket to a very disorganized guy. I mean, seriously disorganized. He lives in the sort of house that has clutter piled to the ceilings, trash heaped up everywhere... gargh. So I leant it to him, and of course, it's gone. He says he gave it back to me, but I know he didn't. I knew this would happen, and still I leant the stove. I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot.
Oh, well. My cat is happy that she just had an unexpected meal of Fancy Feast. I guess this weekend I'll be using a super cat stove.
But I'm NOT lending my gear ever again! (At least not to this guy!)
The Weasel
03-04-2008, 09:29
Neither a borrower nor a lender be;
For loan oft loses both itself and friend,
And borrowing dulls the edge of husbandry
- Polonius to Laertes, Hamlet, Act I, Scene 3
William Shakespeare
Sorry, Lellers. I know the feeling. Sometimes I feel like I helped outfit everyone else. Good luck. Enjoy the trail this weekend.
The Weasel
Lesson learned. Hope you got some use out of it!
Almost There
03-04-2008, 09:42
Yeah, I hate lending stuff, my buddy needs a single person tent, and so I told him I'd seel him one of my tents, because I'm done lending out big items, it's only a matter of time before something gets lost or destroyed.
At least it wasn't a pack or tent!!!
So who was it? A WB'er?
I have not lent out gear, but I have done the "show & tell" thing where someone was interested in purchasing the same piece of gear, but a local shop didnt carry it, and they wanted to see it before buying.
Sorry there has to be ******** in this world.
Tipi Walter
03-04-2008, 09:42
The only time I ever leant(lendt? lended?)out gear was on a backpacking trip where a person might use one of my packs or tents. After the trip I got the stuff back.
Uh oh, I just remembered lending out a dome tent to a kid who went out with his friends to carcamp. The tent came back to me with no stakes and a broken tent pole.
My current solution is to give away excess gear to needy friends and a couple of years ago I souvineered a nice Kelty pack to my best backpacking buddy Johnny B.
cannonball
03-04-2008, 09:44
Loaning your car to some one is one thing. Loaning hiking gear............just a little too personal if you ask me.
saimyoji
03-04-2008, 09:50
Lent my map to a guy to photocopy one day, said he'd have it back on my desk by the end of the day. Wasn't there. He then forgot it at home (why he took it home is beyond me) for the next two days. I reminded him I needed it for a hike that weekend, he said he'd definately get it to me the next morning. Nope. He did scan and email me the sections I needed, though much info was cut off. :mad::mad:
Got it back Monday morning.
Never again.
Tipi Walter
03-04-2008, 09:56
Lent my map to a guy to photocopy one day, said he'd have it back on my desk by the end of the day. Wasn't there. He then forgot it at home (why he took it home is beyond me) for the next two days. I reminded him I needed it for a hike that weekend, he said he'd definately get it to me the next morning. Nope. He did scan and email me the sections I needed, though much info was cut off. :mad::mad:
Got it back Monday morning.
Never again.
Yeah, stuff I'm using, what I call my standard load, will never be lent out until the Last Will and Testament is read to grieving friends and relates.
The only time I ever leant(lendt? lended?)
I think it's lent. ;)
Skidsteer
03-04-2008, 10:01
So Lellers gave up her Pocket Rocket for lent!
My other 'favorite' is the hiker who doesnt take care of their own gear or doesnt know how to repair it once on the trail, then they rely on everyone else and borrow everything all day long. Ive seen the whole bag of tent stakes left behind, broken stove, no maps/guide what-so-ever.
Swiss Roll
03-04-2008, 10:02
I lend my stuff out all the time. My tent, pack, sleeping pad, Jetboil, whatever. I don't worry about it while its gone, because its just stuff and can all be replaced, and I trust that all my friends have the character to replace it if they break it. I do draw the line at my sleeping bag though. I don't want anyone's bag sweat in my bag.
Swiis roll, hopefully you don't have ahy bad experiences with that approach. My favorite line is "It was like than when I borrowed it". What might be "just stuff" to someone is considered to be my life line to sanity(Or insanity:-?
Ive lent out other stuff (not hiking gear) and never seen it again, or like Gungho says... "it was like that..." Thats why I only do the show-n-tell now... it never leaves my hands!
cannonball
03-04-2008, 14:25
I lend my stuff out all the time. My tent, pack, sleeping pad, Jetboil, whatever. I don't worry about it while its gone, because its just stuff and can all be replaced, and I trust that all my friends have the character to replace it if they break it. I do draw the line at my sleeping bag though. I don't want anyone's bag sweat in my bag.
I could not bear the fact that my giga power is in another mans pack:confused:
Jack Tarlin
03-04-2008, 14:28
Lessons learned the hard way:
Don't lend out your gear (or really, anything else), unless you're willing for it:
*To not be returned, ever
*To be returned late
*To be returned dirty
*To be returned broken, or seriously damaged somehow
Oh, and if you lend out a map, there's about a ninety per cent chance you'll never see it again.
Likewise, don't lend money unless you have no immediate need of it anytime soon, as I promise you it'll be awhile, if ever, that you get it back again.
DesertMTB
03-04-2008, 14:31
I completely disagree with the topic of this post.
If my brother didn't lend me his gear, I could never go on multi-day hikes.
DesertMTB
03-04-2008, 14:32
But of course, it magically became my gear, so...
maxNcathy
03-04-2008, 14:40
In two weeks my niece is coming on a 6 week hike with me on the AT north from Roan Mt.
Of course since she is a total newbie i am loaning her all the gear she needs..$250 tent, $350 down sleeping bag, stove etc.
I know it is not a smart thing to do but...............
It will give me an excuse to buy more gear which i like doing within reason of course.
Two Speed
03-04-2008, 14:47
Basically I've got two sets of gear, the "A" list stuff and the "B" list stuff.
"A" list is primo stuff, either expensive or difficult to find. Examples would be my SMD Lunar (expensive, easy to damage if you aren't careful) or my custom "Skids Built" PMS stove (not everyone has one of those).
"B" list stuff would be my old Sierra Designs Lightyear or North Face synthetic sleeping bag. Plenty good enough for the average newb, but it ain't gonna piss me off too badly if it gets lost or damaged.
The way I see it I'm setting myself to be pissed off if I loan out my primo gear. If a newb wants to get started they can either start with the same gear I did or they can go to the nearest outfitter and plunk down their cash.
I don't loan out my camping gear, EVER.
If its a stove(s), I just give them my current alcohol stove, then go make myself another one. That way I always have a new stove, & they get one I know works well in field conditons.
And I do have some "spare" gear, that I will never use, so it can be lent out, but I'm real choosy about who it gets lended to.
My uncle borrowed a brass vibrator (for cleaning bullets, like a rock tumbler) and it vibrated off the table and broke the motor housing. It was junk and had to be thrown away. My uncle gave it to my dad to return to me and never said anything about it being broke to my dad or me. That was several years ago and he still has never brought it up, he acts like it never happened.
My brother and I have had this discussion several times and came to the conclusion that after being taken advantage of numerous times we don’t loan out any gear. He loaned a tent to 3-woman once and got it back all moldy with the colors all ran over each other. They put the tent away wet and never let it dry out or even put it in the sack before returning it. I have loaned out a few items to people that seem like nice and trustable only to have an extremely hard time getting it back or getting it back with damage.
I now put gear away when camping with others, I have found that while I’m out hiking they will go ahead and use your things without asking and show little to no care how they treat the equipment. It’s sad that you have to put everything away like this, but the alternative is to have things broken or missing. I have woken up and had people use my camp stove and cook set to make breakfast and then leave it all out and dirty for me to clean up before I can cook with it. It’s strange the way they seem to think nothing of doing this?
It’s natural to work together and want to help others and loan things back & forth, but I find that more times then not, it leaves you with a sour taste in your mouth. Sad that others are so selfish.
envirodiver
03-04-2008, 15:54
I've lent gear to people several times. Alomst always to people that were just getting started and they were with me. When we got home they took their personal items out and I took my stuff home. Worked out OK. But, I try not to lend out my other gear.
I have also had people try to loan me stuff, and I don't want to borrow anything. I don't want to be resonsible for breaking anyone else's stuff, and gear does get broken sometimes. Then you have to buy or replace something that is broken.
Rain Man
03-04-2008, 16:34
I agree with Swiss Roll and Jack. It's just stuff, but be willing to get it back in not-so-perfect shape. Be realistic about your expectations. (In your case, you knew the chances of getting your stove back were slim to none, right?) Then you'll only be pleasantly surprised.
Ironically, I just lent out my REI Quarter Dome UL today to the daughter of friends. She's going to Florida for the week to visit family and attend a Bonaroo-type music festival. Might she return it a little worse for wear? Maybe. Should I horde my stuff. Not in my mind. To each his own.
Sorry you had a bad experience. Perhaps it'll turn up soon among all his junk and he'll return it to you yet?!
Rain:sunMan
P.S. Since Frolicking Dinosaur recently borrowed my Shenandoah Maps, I hope she reads this thread!!! :D
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I agree with Swiss Roll and Jack. It's just stuff, but be willing to get it back in not-so-perfect shape. Be realistic about your expectations. (In your case, you knew the chances of getting your stove back were slim to none, right?) Then you'll only be pleasantly surprised.
Ironically, I just lent out my REI Quarter Dome UL today to the daughter of friends. She's going to Florida for the week to visit family and attend a Bonaroo-type music festival. Might she return it a little worse for wear? Maybe. Should I horde my stuff. Not in my mind. To each his own.
Sorry you had a bad experience. Perhaps it'll turn up soon among all his junk and he'll return it to you yet?!
Rain:sunMan
P.S. Since Frolicking Dinosaur recently borrowed my Shenandoah Maps, I hope she reads this thread!!! :D
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It’s not that I’m trying to horde my gear, it’s just that I bought it to use & enjoy when camping, not to loan out and have others abuse it.
Not that I use the brass tumbler I mentioned above for camping, But I did use it for another hobby I enjoyed (target shooting.) It was a Lyman top of the line brass tumbler; it cost $150.00 and should have lasted a life time for me. But I had to go out and buy a replacement and pay for it out of my own pocket. So instead of having to invest $150.00 for it I spent $300.00 for it. My uncle never felt it was a problem to return it broken, after like you said things ware out and get broke. This is a sad & pathetic way to think about other peoples stuff.
My brother went through the same thing with the tent that got wet and was destroyed. Have this happen a few times and you will not look at it as hording, it’s just that I want to enjoy my hobbies without having my gear destroyed or lost through no fault of my own.
For years I loaned things out and for years I had to fight to get them back or buy new to replace damaged items. Not any more. I don’t feel I’m in the wrong at all, the other people that abuse my kindness were in the wrong, and the fact that it was an ongoing thing tells me they feel no remorse for their actions with my stuff.
Yep, I knew there was a good chance that my stove would not get back to me in a timely fashion. I'm sure that it's not on a trail somewhere. I know he's got it, but it's lost in the black hole of this guy's house. Maybe someday he'll return it.
That's why I felt so bad in the first place. I KNEW what would happen, and I went ahead and did it anyway.
Rain Man
03-04-2008, 17:32
It’s not that I’m trying to horde my gear, ...
Sorry, didn't mean to imply that anyone was, only how I felt about my own. I was just "hiking my own hike," so to speak.
I agree I would not be happy with your experience.
Rain:sunMan
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Rain Man
03-04-2008, 17:34
... I KNEW what would happen, and I went ahead and did it anyway.
In that case, you were being truly selfless, truly "Christian" some would say. Altruism is admirable.
Rain:sunMan
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Gray Blazer
03-04-2008, 17:51
Don't lend out stuff you don't care about getting back. YMMV
In the 60's, you didn't want to lend out your scratchless Iron Butterfly Album, or Herbie Hancock Album for that matter, and even if your friend had the best turntable in the world, far superior to yours, it was still going to come back with a scratch or a skip in the middle of the drum solo or the Eye of the Storm.
If any of you guys with stuff to "lend" (especially cold weather gear) "lend" me something, I'll "lend" you one of my photos with the homemade appalachian barnwood frame (you can see one or two frames in my gallery). In case you don't understand the quotes around lend, they mean a more permanent arrangement.
NICKTHEGREEK
03-04-2008, 18:04
I'm just steamed this morning. Leant my Pocket Rocket to a very disorganized guy. I mean, seriously disorganized. He lives in the sort of house that has clutter piled to the ceilings, trash heaped up everywhere... gargh. So I leant it to him, and of course, it's gone. He says he gave it back to me, but I know he didn't. I knew this would happen, and still I leant the stove. I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot.
Oh, well. My cat is happy that she just had an unexpected meal of Fancy Feast. I guess this weekend I'll be using a super cat stove.
But I'm NOT lending my gear ever again! (At least not to this guy!)
Great excuse to buy a better stove, the selections under $50.00 make a burner freak drool. Self image is everything, there's lots of dumber things to do to qualify a an idiot cubed.
What's the problem. You weren't planning on using last years models were you?
My life may depend on my gear so I take extra time to take good care of it. Therefore I am picky about who I loan it to.
If I borrow a piece of gear I become responsible for it.(that's becoming rare). If it breaks from normal wear on my watch I feel obligated to "make it right" with the lender. I just think it's the right thing to do.
I have loaned gear out and have been very, very disappointed in people who lack the "take responsibility for your own actions". It cost me money, time and frustration!!!!
I would loan anything out if I knew the person was responsible, but sadly that is not often the case (at least in my experience).
On another note... hehehe.. I loaned out my "A Walk in the Woods" book and now I can't remember who I lent it to!!! :eek:
My boy wants to read it and I guess I have to buy another copy:mad:
My memory is starting to go!!!!!
Sorry, didn't mean to imply that anyone was, only how I felt about my own. I was just "hiking my own hike," so to speak.
I agree I would not be happy with your experience.
Rain:sunMan
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I use to love to share or loan out gear all the time to help others enjoy the outdoors as much as I do. It’s sad that I have become somewhat hard with this issue. I think the issue with my uncle (a good Christian guy and a heck of a nice guy if you ask anyone that knows him.) has really helped reduce my trust of others with my gear.
I was a gear borrower in the beginning. My brother loaned me all his stuff for my first ever backpack trip in the early 1990's. I had nothing and did not have the money to outfit myself for a hobby I did not know I would pursue. He loaned me everything: backpack, sleeping bag, pad, cooking and eating utensils, clothes, water bottles. He also sat me down and taught me how to take care of my feet. I was so careful with his stuff, this is stuff I knew he used on the AT for years, although he neve said a word about it. He is alot older than I am, and he didn't really know me that well or how I would handle his belongings at that time. I think he really wanted to pass his love of backpacking to me and he did.
I loan stuff to responsible friends. So far, I have never had anything not returned or returned broken. A good sign if if a person take care of their own stuff, whatever it is.
And one gets surpised: one nephew who lived with me while in college for a semester. I loaned him stuff for his trip to Canada. I just wrote it off when I handed to him thinking, this stuff is gone. I almost had to call in Hazmat to clean his room, a total disorganized slob. He was so careful with my stuff and brought it all back intact after a month in Canada, with a thank you of the coolest rocks he picked up for my collection.
Rain Man
03-05-2008, 00:25
My life may depend on my gear so I take extra time to take good care of it. Therefore I am picky about who I loan it to.
.... On another note... hehehe.. I loaned out my "A Walk in the Woods" book and now I can't remember who I lent it to!!! :eek:
You too?!!! My hard-back copy is long gone and I can NOT remember who I loaned it to. Finally bought another cheap soft-back copy from www.alibris.com.
As far as my life depending on my gear, I used to be a caver, including "vertical" caving (with rope and climbing gear). My life really did depend on my gear then, so by comparison I don't feel as if my life depends on my backpacking gear, so I don't sweat it if someone else uses it.
Rain:sunMan
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But of course, it magically became my gear, so...
case and point:D
While I don’t loan camping gear as it has proven to be problematic. I will loan out books and DVDs. I have never had a problem loaning them out other then I use to forget who I loaned what to. I solved this with a free downloaded program for my Palm Pilot that easily tracks who has what. Now I can easily tell who has my DVDs and the day they got them.
fiddlehead
03-05-2008, 01:08
I guess i just have too much gear. I don't have a problem lending stuff to people to get them into hiking. But then, i have been collecting backpacking gear since the boy scouts in the 60's.
I mentioned my backpacking stove collection on WB before: http://fiddlehead.wordpress.com/2008/02/05/my-backpacking-stove-collection/
I think i have 4 down sleeping bags, 5 tents (rarely use tents anymore anyway), an old thermorest that i haven't used in at least 5 years, etc.
They don't have to use my best stuff. Some of the older heavier stuff is what they get. Just to see if they like hiking. I guess i'm just always searching for better, lighter gear and don't throw much out. I did sell my avalanche probe and lightweight snowshovel last year though.
camojack
03-05-2008, 01:40
I think it's lent. ;)
Yes...and it has been since Ash Wednesday. :-?
fiddlehead
03-05-2008, 02:49
On another note... hehehe.. I loaned out my "A Walk in the Woods" book and now I can't remember who I lent it to!!! :eek:
My boy wants to read it and I guess I have to buy another copy:mad:
My memory is starting to go!!!!!
I do that all the time. But at least i figure books are better being read than they are just sitting there looking good on a bookcase somewhere.
I've leant out only my best books. The other's i have in a box somewhere in my garage.
Right now, i know my CDT maps are out on lend (they've done the trail 4 times already and are reserved already for this year and next), my Suunto watch is out, my -35 degree $800 sleeping bag is out (i live in Thailand, what do i need that for?) as well as my car (to a hiker who needed it and will be using it to shuttle people as well as hike), space in my garage, and my bass guitar. Having too much stuff and hording it is not my idea of quality people.
Living in Thailand around people who have grown up poor has taught me some lessons in sharing. These people share most everything. People are often wondering through my house to get something from my kitchen and my wife does the same. There are good and bad parts of different cultures and i see sharing as one of the better ones here.
Whoever was asking for the cold weather gear: what do you need? where do you live? have you hiked the AT with anyone i know that could vouch for you (what year?) were you serious?
kayak karl
03-05-2008, 04:07
Loaning your car to some one is one thing. Loaning hiking gear............just a little too personal if you ask me.
if ted kennedy............
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:TeddyVWad.jpg
I do that all the time. But at least i figure books are better being read than they are just sitting there looking good on a bookcase somewhere.
I've leant out only my best books. The other's i have in a box somewhere in my garage.
Agree. Books are to be read, not dusted.
I do that all the time. But at least i figure books are better being read than they are just sitting there looking good on a bookcase somewhere.
I've leant out only my best books. The other's i have in a box somewhere in my garage.
Right now, i know my CDT maps are out on lend (they've done the trail 4 times already and are reserved already for this year and next), my Suunto watch is out, my -35 degree $800 sleeping bag is out (i live in Thailand, what do i need that for?) as well as my car (to a hiker who needed it and will be using it to shuttle people as well as hike), space in my garage, and my bass guitar. Having too much stuff and hording it is not my idea of quality people.
Living in Thailand around people who have grown up poor has taught me some lessons in sharing. These people share most everything. People are often wondering through my house to get something from my kitchen and my wife does the same. There are good and bad parts of different cultures and i see sharing as one of the better ones here.
Whoever was asking for the cold weather gear: what do you need? where do you live? have you hiked the AT with anyone i know that could vouch for you (what year?) were you serious?
After viewing you videos, people just THINK they are doing a lot with very little. You do with less and seem to be very happy with much less. Congratulations to you!
Rain Man
03-05-2008, 11:40
Living in Thailand around people who have grown up poor has taught me some lessons in sharing. These people share most everything....
My family hosts foreign exchange students. We've hosted from Thailand, among eight other countries. One of our volunteer friends told us this story. She was living in some "poor village" (might have been Peach Corps) in another culture and decided to teach the little children to be polite. Whenever her family sent her a "care package" with candies, she made the little children say "Please" and "Thank You" before she would hand out the goodies. She was very proud of herself ... for a while.
That's when she came to understand that in small villages in that culture, what belongs to one belongs to all. Rather than needing to teach these poor folks courtesy, she needed to learn courtesy. She was acting selfish and was hording what didn't belong solely to her, in that culture.
Then SHE started acting polite and sharing the candies freely rather than demanding they jump through hoops to please her. After that, and among other cultural adjustments, she had a rewarding time and learned much more than she taught.
The "western" paradigm isn't the only one right for this wide, wide world.
Rain:sunMan
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fiddlehead
03-05-2008, 11:40
After viewing you videos, people just THINK they are doing a lot with very little. You do with less and seem to be very happy with much less. Congratulations to you!
I thank you and wish it were true.
I am somewhat materialistic too. I try not to be, that is a big reason i loan my gear so much. But it is a human trait i guess. I want to keep too much of my old gear whether it's because of memories, or for my son to use when he gets big.
You don't need much out there to enjoy life. I think the AT was the first to teach me that little gem of knowledge.
I lend my stuff all the time. It works fine as long as they don't meet anyone else on the trail. If they do, they bring it back in horrow and rush out to buy new stuff like other people have.
Weary