View Full Version : Affordable alternative to down jacket?
This is the one piece I am missing for my section hike. I can't really afford a down jacket right now so I am open to suggestions
I am carrying midweight long underwear, rain jacket, convertable pants, long sleeve shirt and Marmot wind jacket if that helps.
I was thinking fleece. I know it's a bit heavy and bulky but...
Thanks in advance
Mel
Feral Bill
03-16-2008, 01:05
Fleece or a nice sweater is probably better than down except in dry cold. When and Where?
This is the one piece I am missing for my section hike. I can't really afford a down jacket right now so I am open to suggestions
I am carrying midweight long underwear, rain jacket, convertable pants, long sleeve shirt and Marmot wind jacket if that helps.
I was thinking fleece. I know it's a bit heavy and bulky but...
Thanks in advance
MelConsider hiking most of the time with just your wool sweater on, and hiking shorts and boxers. No other layers. In this way the wool sweater can be much heavier than otherwise. Yes? In this way your other layers can be lighter weight and more packable but stiff sufficient when you are less active in cooler weather with those extra layers under and over the sweater, and you may not need the down jacket or vest.
But I say try a heavier sweater. Mid summer it might only be a light merino sweater, but whatever the heaviest sweater you can hiking in 80-90% of the time with no other layers and shorts is the right sweater for the trip I think. OK, in winter maybe sweater plus shorts and tights. Sun hats are always a good idea also.
I think the real case for a down jacket might be if you go between total extreme like you might out west, but except in extreme dry and cold alot of the advantage of down over wool goes away when you consider the other layers you already are carrying and the combinations for different conditions. But it really depends on your total system, and how you use it.
An idea that has attracted me for some time is a super-lightweight down longcoat, for mid winter over top of my sleeping bag and overtop of my usually wet winter clothing for the normal range of conditions from say 35F down to 0F. It would be very useful to have if it ever did drop down to -30F, which does happen even at lower altitudes, usually in January but possibly December, February up North. I haven't done much above the treeline though, so I don't really know what works best up there.
Anyhow, a cheap althernative to down along such lines might be a poncho liner, or something fairly rectangular and long but not too open on the sides but overlapping so you legs can swing some, and made with superlight nylon and some sort of synthetic bat insulation. You might get away with shell on outside only depending on the insulation.
Fleece or a nice sweater is probably better than down except in dry cold. When and Where?
April 8th - starting at Wayah Bald and heading north for 30 days.
Thanks guys for the response, gives me an idea of where to start.
Mel -
I carried a fleece similar to this one... http://www.rei.com/product/755099?vcat=REI_SEARCH for a while. It's not expensive and pretty warm but isn't enough for serious cold weather. Keep in mind that fleece doesn't compress well.
I've since switched to this: http://www.backcountry.com/store/MTB0015/MontBell-America-Inc-Ultralight-Thermawrap-Jacket-Mens.html . It compresses better but cost a bit more and is warmer.
I use a layered approach and in doing so, do not need a low temp. rated down or synthetic jacket. Start with a synthetic T-shirt (underarmor or cheaper brand). Then get a good 200 or 300 fleece jacket, either pull-over or full front zipper. The full-zipper allows more temperature control. Even when temps are in the 20s/30s, this is enough when hiking.
For camp or if it should get even colder when hiking, my last layer is a Marmot Precip jacket. It's not only a great rain jacket, but totally blocks wind and seals in the body heat. You'll be amazed at how little you have on and how warm you are with these three pieces.
I use REI's Minimalist gloves that have a waterproof/windproof outer shell and a fleece liner. They are fantastic - the first gloves I've ever owned that you can put on over cold fingers and actually feel them warm up. All other gloves, once my fingers get very cold, they stay cold inside the gloves, but not these.
A good fleece North Face head sock (or balaclava) completes the ensemble. Hope this helps. ;)
BTW, all fleece jackets / pullovers are not created equal. The 100/200/300 rating is like thread count in bed sheets. The higher the number the thicker, more tightly woven the fleece. You'll feel the wind through a 100 fleece jacket. You will not feel it through a 300 one. ;) For winter hiking, I often carry a 100 and a 300 one, sized so I can wear both at the same time, with my Precip jacket over top of both of them if it gets "three-dog-night" cold! :)
A wool or polyester flannel shirt is quite versatile. Wool (eg. Pendleton) will set you back $60 or so, but polyester flannel can be had for about $10. (eg. blair.com.) Be aware that most flannel sold in retail stores is 100% cotton -- not what you want for hiking. I had to search high and low for polyester flannel. Hence the link above to blair.com.
Two Speed
03-16-2008, 08:01
Random thought: MEC makes some good stuff. I've got one of their Northern Lite jackets, and frankly I rarely use it because it's too hot for hiking in the southeast. Unfortunately it appears MEC has discontinued the Northern Lite and replaced it with the Physique (http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=84552444262 2291&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302703907&bmUID=1205668591966). Might want to take a look at it. One thing to remember is the Loonie is trading pretty well against the dollar, so prices at MEC aren't as attractive as they were a year or so ago.
Down jackets and similar stuff will be going on sale soon....
StubbleJumper
03-16-2008, 08:38
Inexpensive wool sweaters can be hard to find in most retail outlets...the cheap sweaters are poly-cotton, and wool is a great deal more expensive. I have seen some at Winners that are 100% wool (some even cashmere!) and they are usually between $20 and $30. I haven't looked at the Sally Ann.
FWIW, I live in Canada and when I go snowshoeing I typically wear a synthetic t-shirt and a light wool sweater, or sometimes a 100-weight fleece. That's plenty of warmth while you're moving, but if you plan to stop you'll need to add a layer, find some shelter or get a fire going.
This is the one piece I am missing for my section hike. I can't really afford a down jacket right now so I am open to suggestions....................................ETC ETCETC...........Thanks in advance
Mel
Yo Mel,
Down is nice...but visit your local outfitter & they can set up up with a SYNTHETIC version if you'd like to stay on the "LITE" side or a FLEECE top would work...make sure you have a thin, outter shell handy if you decide to wear the FLEECE as your regular, outter wear...:D
"Jigsaw" & I will see you out there in the Shennies in April/May.
Good Luck with your hike!
take-a-knee
03-16-2008, 10:03
I would stay away from down clothing in above freezing (non snow) temps. Something like a Patagonia Puffball Vest along with a microfleece shirt should do fine for April. Have a watch cap, thin polypro balaclava and gloves, and something like ULA's rain mittens stored in the pockets of your precip jacket and leave that stuff there year round. That microfleece is just as warm as wool and weighs about half as much and it will dry much faster.
what about sgt rock's idea of a jacket liner from a military surplus store. super light, compressable, warm, and cheap
take-a-knee
03-16-2008, 10:40
what about sgt rock's idea of a jacket liner from a military surplus store. super light, compressable, warm, and cheap
Nothing wrong with that, that liner doesn't have any insulation around your neck so plus it up with a microfleece neck warmer. Keeping your head and neck covered is half the battle of staying warm. Also, if you or someone you know can sew Thruhiker,com has some nice kits to make vests and jackets.
Bare Bear
03-16-2008, 11:12
Right now the US Olympic Committee is giving away a free Fleece with a $35 donation.............I got one and it is about medium weight and very nice, front zipper too, (I do not like pullovers for any hiking gear).
You are always going to want layers, polypro type base, long sleeve if you are a cold person. Then a top if needed or jsut the wind/rain jacket. I always hiked with just the shirt unless it was really cold or you sweat. Then at camp I switch to my second (dry) shirt and the fleeece over it and if it is really cold then the wind/rain jacket. I found thin leather gloves and a beanie for my head helped a lot. Even after warm weather made me send the gloves and beanie home; I found I used my second socks for mitts a few times.
You might be able to get a down jacket on sale, search with Google Products
I got a Montbell down jacket on sale for $89! Looks like they have one left, it's a women's L. perfect if you don't mind your zipper on the wrong side!! :)
http://www.backcountry.com/store/MTB0036/MontBell-America-Inc-Alpine-Light-Down-Jacket-Womens.html?mv_pc=r126&CMP_ID=SH_FRO001&CMP_SKU=MTB0036
"but polyester flannel can be had for about $10. (eg. blair.com.) Be aware that most flannel sold in retail stores is 100% cotton -- not what you want for hiking. I had to search high and low for polyester flannel. Hence the link above to blair.com"
The ones I saw were made of acrylic, are these the ones you are talking about terapin?
"what about sgt rock's idea of a jacket liner from a military surplus store. super light, compressable, warm, and cheap"
Having a hard time finding the size I might need and the prices seem to vary quite a bit but am still looking.
Thanks again for the options :)
The ones I saw were made of acrylic, are these the ones you are talking about terapin?
Yeah. Acrylic, poly. All the same. :D As long as it's not cotton. $9.95. How can you lose? You can wear it around the house over a t-shirt in winter or on cool evenings.
Good, so I ordered the right one.
Great prices on other clothes as well.
Thanks for sharing the link.
LIhikers
03-16-2008, 16:52
Inexpensive wool sweaters can be hard to find in most retail outlets...the cheap sweaters are poly-cotton, and wool is a great deal more expensive.
Check your local thift shops and second hand stores for wool sweaters at low prices. Earlier this winter I came home with 3 sweaters that are 100% wool for a total price of $17 USD, and they are all in good shape.
Christopher Robin
03-16-2008, 21:17
I have a fleece vest 200 for Campmor for $19.99 & it's good for 3 seasons.
Appalachian Tater
03-16-2008, 21:39
I would buy a down jacket on sale or used. Someone was selling a nice one in the gear section for $70, size medium. Unfortunately, fleece is heavy and bulky compared to down.
Alligator
03-16-2008, 21:55
Polarguard 3D jacket (http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/230,43664_Sierra-Designs-Packable-Jacket-Polarguard-3D-For-Women.html)at Sierra Trading Post. $56. 1 lb, medium blue.
Dang, now it shows unavailable.
Marmot Primaloft (http://www.backcountry.com/store/MAR0918/Marmot-Sayan-Insulated-Jacket-Womens.html?CMP_ID=SH_FRO001&CMP_SKU=MAR0918&mv_pc=r126), $77. That's not a great price though.
Doughnut
03-16-2008, 21:56
Check the down jacket at cabela's too, I got one for $25 right before SOruck and wore it there, super warm, very light,
You'd be surprised what you can find at the Salvation Army thrift stores. Sometimes people donate clothing that used to belong to their since grown-and-moved-on kids. I've seen nice down jackets with lightweight nylon shells there.
I have looked all over for the sales...unfortunately my size prevents me from partaking. I am a large girl and wear a mens XL.
I do understand that fleece is bulky, but price is a factor for me as well.
I might check out the thrift stores if I have a chance.
Thanks
I use a system much like Summit's and Bare Bears: wicking tee, then a light or medium fleece sweater, with a Precip on top when I stop.
Yes, fleece is slightly but not overly bulky ... which is why it makes a nice pillow rolled up! That alone justifies the slight bulkiness.
Mrs Baggins
03-17-2008, 09:48
I have a Polar Tec fleece full zip jacket I bought at a Woolrich outlet store in Maryland 6 years ago. It's still in fantastic condition. It's thin, soft, very warm, has pockets. I wore it glacier climbing in New Zealand and it was all I needed. I know I didn't pay more than $20 for it then. When it got very cold and windy I put a Polar Tec fleece vest under it and was nice and snug.
I have a polar fleece jacket that my wife ordered from a factory. I have never been cold in that coat. If it rains, I toss a rain jacket over it and sweat it out.
Polar fleece is the new down.
Shell out $15 (with S&H). Light, warm, cheap.
http://www.rddusa.com/U-S-G-I-M-65-J...ear-Us-Gi.html (http://www.rddusa.com/U-S-G-I-M-65-Jacket-Liner-Military-Army-Liners-Army-Clothing-Military-Gear-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-Vintage-Urban-Wear-Out-Wear-Us-Gi.html)
Plus, they run large. A men's large is probably equal to the men's XL. I have a men's large at home and it is a little big.
Nothing wrong with that, that liner doesn't have any insulation around your neck so plus it up with a microfleece neck warmer.
I just noticed someone else gave the same idea..DOH! :)
Since you need to take a hat, why not take the a light balaclava? Light, warm and versatile. Roll it down for just neck protection. Roll it up all the way just for a hat. Wear it normal for great warmth. Etc.
I use something very similar to this all year:
http://www.amazon.com/Ultra-Force-G-I-Polypropylene-Balaclavas/dp/B0001ZLD8M
Johnny Swank
03-17-2008, 10:34
Shell out $15 (with S&H). Light, warm, cheap.
http://www.rddusa.com/U-S-G-I-M-65-J...ear-Us-Gi.html (http://www.rddusa.com/U-S-G-I-M-65-Jacket-Liner-Military-Army-Liners-Army-Clothing-Military-Gear-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-Vintage-Urban-Wear-Out-Wear-Us-Gi.html)
Plus, they run large. A men's large is probably equal to the men's XL. I have a men's large at home and it is a little big.
Do these have the armpits sewn up, or are they open like the old ones? I might pit up one in any case to play with - can't beat the price.
Johnny Swank
03-17-2008, 10:37
This one was kind of fly too.
http://www.rddusa.com/Dutch-Liner-Military-Army-Liners-Army-Clothing-Military-Gear-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-Vintage-Urban-Wear-Out-Wear-Us-Gi.html
http://www.rddusa.com/images/products/Army-Liners/Military-Dutch-Liner-coat-350.jpg
This one was kind of fly too.
http://www.rddusa.com/Dutch-Liner-Military-Army-Liners-Army-Clothing-Military-Gear-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-Vintage-Urban-Wear-Out-Wear-Us-Gi.html
That one actually looks nicer (and less expensive!).
Arm cuffs that seal up a bit. Pits look to be "solid" and no need to be sewn (even the new ones have open pits). Has buttons, too. (which the US Army one DOES have as well).
I bought one mainly because it is cheap.
Johnny Swank
03-17-2008, 11:01
I've decided to pick up that one I posted. I can sew on cuffs and all that, but would rather have something that doesn't need to be futzed with.
I give that about 10 minutes, then I'll be tearing it up to refit, patch pocket, make a hoodie, or otherwise destroy it:)
Airblazer
03-17-2008, 11:22
Inexpensive wool sweaters can be hard to find in most retail outlets...
I just scored a wool sweater at Salvation Army for $2... and some polyester shirts similar to REI's $30 version for $1-$3!
I love a bargain!!!
i just picked up the army liner w/ no pits and no buttons (i'll probably just sew one on top and one on the bottom) for $5 at top gun military surplus in palmyra wooohoooo
hopefulhiker
03-17-2008, 16:06
It is hard to beat down, I would look for a used down jacket or sweater on the internet.. I bought a used down sweater(color,puke green) and used it for the thru hike in 05.. There might be some synthetics out there that could compete too.. I wore my sweater 90 percent of the time in camp or in the bag.. For actual hiking most of the time I just used long underwear, the marmot jacket, and frog togg jacket for a rain coat..
I bought a nice fleece pullover on clearance (cheap) sale at Penny's about a month ago. Might be worth looking
Skidsteer
03-17-2008, 20:42
I've decided to pick up that one I posted. I can sew on cuffs and all that, but would rather have something that doesn't need to be futzed with.
I give that about 10 minutes, then I'll be tearing it up to refit, patch pocket, make a hoodie, or otherwise destroy it:)
Let us know how you like it. I like the looks of the sleeves on that one versus the U.S surplus liners.