View Full Version : Mt Washington now sporting worlds first biodiesel steam railway locomotive
http://www.martynbane.co.uk/modernsteam/nday/mw/ndaymw-biodiesel.html
vonfrick
03-18-2008, 19:48
http://www.martynbane.co.uk/modernsteam/nday/mw/ndaymw-biodiesel.html
YEAH!!!!! :sun
better living through chemistry!!
Flush2wice
03-18-2008, 19:53
Instead of mooning this train, hikers should applaud.
Darwin again
03-18-2008, 20:16
Food-powered vehicles. Brilliant.
That settles it: I'm converting my car to run on mashed potatoes.
Dances with Mice
03-18-2008, 20:20
So instead of throwing coal at hikers the engineers are now going to throw ... what? Globs of grease?
imagine the hiker hunger generated by a train running on french fry oil...it will drive thru hikers crazy with its smell
Just wait till them NH Black Bears get a whiff of that sucka
There'll be more bears riding that train than people http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/laughing021.gif
vonfrick
03-18-2008, 20:26
nah...french fry smell from SVO (straight veg oil) engines only
i run biodiesel in an old merc wagon i make via 11th grade slave labor from from my school cafeteria's used fryer oil- no odor
great lab experience for the kids and pays for my commute :)
Frolicking Dinosaurs
03-18-2008, 20:31
::: Dino cheers and abandons plan to moon the COG :::
Darwin again
03-18-2008, 20:39
...Mount Washington No. 9 'Waumbek', affectionately referred to as Vicki (as in victim!) has become the first steam railway locomotive in the world fired on biodiesel, thus becoming effectively carbon neutral.
Carbon neutral?
Poppycock.
Not on Planet Earth.
Not unless it rains engine-ready biodiesel someplace I don't know about, OR unless absolutely no carbon-based fuels are used to grow the plants that become the oil, transport the crops to a processing plant, process that crop into oil, transport that oil, utilize (in restaurant fryers, etc.) that oil, transport that oil to a processing location, process the transported waste oil into biodiesel, then transport that newly produced biodiesel to the base of the mountain where it flows into the tanks of the stupid little steam engines. (Let's not forget the compounds used to turn the oil into biodiesel, either, which are themselves products of energy intensive processes. If you've ever made the stuff or are familiar with the process, you know how industrial and energy intensive the whole thing is, and I"m not even talking about growing the plants, corn, seeds, whatever.)
Simply using biodiesel doesn't make a mechanical device carbon neutral.
(As recent stock market activity -- and this article -- both show, there are suckers born every minute...)
Skidsteer
03-18-2008, 20:43
So instead of throwing coal at hikers the engineers are now going to throw ... what? Globs of grease?
Soybeans!
vonfrick
03-18-2008, 20:55
Carbon neutral?
Poppycock.
Not on Planet Earth.
Not unless it rains engine-ready biodiesel someplace I don't know about, OR unless absolutely no carbon-based fuels are used to grow the plants that become the oil, transport the crops to a processing plant, process that crop into oil, transport that oil, utilize (in restaurant fryers, etc.) that oil, transport that oil to a processing location, process the transported waste oil into biodiesel, then transport that newly produced biodiesel to the base of the mountain where it flows into the tanks of the stupid little steam engines. (Let's not forget the compounds used to turn the oil into biodiesel, either, which are themselves products of energy intensive processes. If you've ever made the stuff or are familiar with the process, you know how industrial and energy intensive the whole thing is, and I"m not even talking about growing the plants, corn, seeds, whatever.)
Simply using biodiesel doesn't make a mechanical device carbon neutral.
(As recent stock market activity -- and this article -- both show, there are suckers born every minute...)
ugh...yeah, you're right. why bother.
Darwin again
03-18-2008, 20:59
ugh...yeah, you're right. why bother.
Does it make lots of sense to burn food in vehicles when that means that food prices are going to cause people to starve? I don't think so.:rolleyes:
But why bother with compassionate, intelligent economic/farm policy?
It's all about the profit, right?
le loupe
03-18-2008, 21:08
Does it make lots of sense to burn food in vehicles when that means that food prices are going to cause people to starve? I don't think so.:rolleyes:
But why bother with compassionate, intelligent economic/farm policy?
It's all about the profit, right?
Whaaat?
I think this is great, even if the article writer mis-spoke using the "carbon neutral" moniker. I just converted my home heating system to a ground source heat pump which is great and something more people should be doing.
does the water that system uses mean there is less water on the earth for people to drink and therefore die of dehydration? Oh-no...
vonfrick
03-18-2008, 21:10
i teach in an urban public school. i teach my students to transform what would become garbage from our school cafeteria into a useful fuel. it is enough for me that they understand and get excited about learning and a few of them have gone on to effect real change in the community in regards to environmental policy- because of my influence.
cynicism and hope have no letters in common
Grumpy Ol' Pops
03-18-2008, 22:13
So instead of throwing coal at hikers the engineers are now going to throw ... what? Globs of grease?
Well, now we know what everyone can do with all that packed-out poop that we're supposed to carry to really embrace LNT philosophy! Ship it(gotta be careful spelling that one!) all to Mt. Washington so the engineers have another totally biodegradable something to use against the "honey-Mooners"!
Nearly Normal
03-19-2008, 10:48
If they could only get the trucking/auto industry to follow suit.
Sending peanut oil to Saudi would be sweet.
UCONNMike
03-19-2008, 13:44
Finally!
I thought it was so ridiculous that all over the white mountains they preach about conservation and environmental responsibility, but they had an old COAL powered train taking lazy tourists up and down the mountain all day. Not to mention all the cars that are allowed up there as well. They have one good step, now just get the cars out of there.
Finally!
I thought it was so ridiculous that all over the white mountains they preach about conservation and environmental responsibility, but they had an old COAL powered train taking lazy tourists up and down the mountain all day. Not to mention all the cars that are allowed up there as well. They have one good step, now just get the cars out of there.
Amen! This is exactly how I feel too. :banana
Big Blue
03-19-2008, 19:26
Be sure not to moon the train at the top of Mt. Washington. Right Politician.
hammock engineer
03-19-2008, 19:33
At least the 100 foot or so soot covered rocks next to the tracks won't get worse. Maybe they'll get adventurous and clean up there mess when they are done playing.
Darwin again
03-19-2008, 19:41
This is what happens (http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/19/smbusiness/Chernoff_pizza/index.htm?postversion=2008031912&OhNo) when you use food to make fuel for vehicles.
Link: http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/19/smbusiness/Chernoff_pizza/index.htm?postversion=2008031912&OhNo
Corn into ethanol is such a big business, subsidized by Uncle Sugarpants in Washington using your tax dollars, that there is less wheat to eat because farmers are all growing corn, so its price goes up two and a half times in just a year. Nothing cynical about that -- everything is just great if you've got lots of money!
Maybe a better solution for the cog railway at Mount Washington is to rip up the tracks and hand the tourists a bag of corn dodgers at the bottom. Eat that corn, climb that mountain! Just like in the old days. (Suddenly, everything old is new again.)
Using biodiesel in the Mount Washington touron transporters is part of the problem, not part of the solution.
The Old Fhart
03-19-2008, 20:01
UCONNMike-"I thought it was so ridiculous that all over the white mountains they preach about conservation and environmental responsibility, but they had an old COAL powered train taking lazy tourists up and down the mountain all day. Not to mention all the cars that are allowed up there as well. They have one good step, now just get the cars out of there."The only group you haven't mentioned should be banned from the Whites to be a total elitist is those smelly hikers.:rolleyes:
The only group you haven't mentioned should be banned from the Whites to be a total elitist is those smelly hikers.:rolleyes:
Don't forget the elitists that corral all the smelly hikers into big money huts or pay campsites because the rest of the Whites are "too fragile" to camp in.
Darwin again
03-19-2008, 20:12
How about banning TRAINS from the Whites?
:rolleyes:
Skidsteer
03-19-2008, 20:14
Oh boy.
Deja vu.
Skidsteer
03-19-2008, 20:15
Oh boy.
Deja vu.
Nevertheless, I'm impressed. Over a page and no one's called anyone a communist or nazi yet.
Skidsteer
03-19-2008, 20:18
Or a hippie.
I think hypocrite is the word you're looking for.
warraghiyagey
03-19-2008, 20:32
Or a hippie.
My ears were ringing.
Nevertheless, I'm impressed. Over a page and no one's called anyone a communist or nazi yet.
This could be a new record for one of my threads:rolleyes::banana
warraghiyagey
03-19-2008, 20:35
Just wait till them NH Black Bears get a whiff of that sucka
There'll be more bears riding that train than people http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/laughing021.gif
:eek::mad:
Oops, I mean :rolleyes::p:D
Finally!
I thought it was so ridiculous that all over the white mountains they preach about conservation and environmental responsibility, but they had an old COAL powered train taking lazy tourists up and down the mountain all day. Not to mention all the cars that are allowed up there as well. They have one good step, now just get the cars out of there.
Might be nice, but both are not on USFS property, and were there long before the White Mountain National Forest
Flush2wice
03-20-2008, 09:31
This could be a new record for one of my threads:rolleyes::banana
I wish you'd quit causing trouble.
Flush2wice
03-20-2008, 09:33
This is what happens (http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/19/smbusiness/Chernoff_pizza/index.htm?postversion=2008031912&OhNo) when you use food to make fuel for vehicles.
Link: http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/19/smbusiness/Chernoff_pizza/index.htm?postversion=2008031912&OhNo
Corn into ethanol is such a big business, subsidized by Uncle Sugarpants in Washington using your tax dollars, that there is less wheat to eat because farmers are all growing corn, so its price goes up two and a half times in just a year.
Yeah, but maybe the price of coal will come down.
Nevertheless, I'm impressed. Over a page and no one's called anyone a communist or nazi yet.Well I just wish those biofuel nazi communist hippy engineers would finally get it right and just flatten that sucker out and pave it.
Two Speed
03-20-2008, 09:38
Well I just wish those biofuel nazi communist hippy engineers would finally get it right and just flatten that sucker out and pave it.I had a chance to be a biofuel nazi communist hippy engineer and missed out? When was that added to the curriculum?
I'm always the last to hear about these sort of opportunities.
I wish you'd quit causing trouble.
And if you http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/customavatars/avatar14002_4.gif (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/member.php?u=14002)would get your finger out of your nose, you might be able to see better:p
Wind chill froze that sucker in place.
If they throw a dining cart with a fryolator and a grill for burgers it could be dual purpose! Woo hoo! :D
warraghiyagey
03-20-2008, 13:28
If they throw a dining cart with a fryolator and a grill for burgers it could be dual purpose! Woo hoo! :D
The George Forman Cogway Train and Grill??
The George Forman Cogway Train and Grill??
I love it!!!!!
It is New England, so some kind of fried seafood would be good, too. I vote for fried clams.
warraghiyagey
03-20-2008, 14:19
Bacon wrapped scallops.
Bacon wrapped scallops.
Kinda high class food for a vege train isn't it Wargy?
I'll settle for greasy fries and smoked Togue
Instead of choking on the coal smoke, I guess I'll probably get the munchies instead on my yearly hike of the mountain. :)
warraghiyagey
03-21-2008, 03:25
Kinda high class food for a vege train isn't it Wargy?
I'll settle for greasy fries and smoked Togue
Cause yo can only catch stocked fish . . . OHHHH!!!!!
http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/ad/wootrock.gif
Instead of choking on the coal smoke, I guess I'll probably get the munchies instead on my yearly hike of the mountain. :)
Munchies? What? . . What time is it??? April 20th??
rlharris
03-26-2008, 10:54
I received this email this morning. Has anyone else heard about this? Any more details?
Word is out that all the oil burning clap trap has been removed and the steamer once again burns coal. Biodiesel is over $3.50/gallon and it takes 130 gallons to make it to the top of Mt Washington vs 5 tons of coal. Pure economics and they don't have the ski area open this winter, only 2 trips to Waumbek Tank on weekends.