View Full Version : Thru-Hiking in 3 months
I'm thinking about shooting for a 3 month thru-hike my first time. I've wondering if you guys have any advice to help I would appreciate it.
I want to do 25 miles a day, every day. Anyone know if how much I'll need to be eating? Or what I could possibly carry to add up to enough calories to push myself.
I'm currently 5'10, 177 Lbs. Just recently started some basic training. Any advice there? What kind of shape should I be getting into before starting a fast thru-hike? I'm already backpacking almost a hundred miles a month, though only been out for a couple days at a time at most so far.
I've got a lot of experience with 2 to 3 day trips, a very large amount of day hikes under my belt. A good amount of wilderness survival skill and outdoor and weather experience. Being wet doesn't stop me from moving, being cold gets me moving more and faster. Being both, even more. I have been doing 20 to 25 mile days recently within 2 months of starting back up.
oh and I've got a year or two to prepare for this, I intend on drying my own food and eating well.
Thank you guys!
Ch4d
warraghiyagey
04-01-2008, 16:29
With the questions you're asking, maybe a 90 day plan isn't the best way to approach the trail.
From my understanding, the folks who have done the trail that quickly were experienced distance hikers.
Can you hike 25 a day now with 3000 or more feet of elevation gain/loss? If not you're likely to get injured the 1st week.
Appalachian Tater
04-01-2008, 16:32
Scott P wrote a good article on pretty much what you're talking about but darn it if I can't find it. My manual searching and googling powers just aren't working right today. Why don't you send him a Private Message asking for it?
wilconow
04-01-2008, 16:35
IMO if you're already doing trips that involve 20+ mi/day, then physically you'll be fine. The biggest challenge will be mental. You may develop a need for more caloric intake then you require now, but it's not a big deal. You'll learn as you go.
If you haven't already, ask yourself why? You will need to be highly motivated to accomplish what you desire to do. I'm not saying you can't do what others have, but I wonder what motivates such thinking. You should too.
Sometimes, I think the AT is squandered on youth who know not what they do. clured will likely respond and have some worthwhile things to say. Listen to him.
Fannypack
04-01-2008, 16:44
suggest 2 things:
-- walk w/ pack on roads to toughen up feet
-- do at least one 1 week trip averaging 25 miles per day to test your fitness as well as your level of comfort w/ back to back 25 mile days
good luck
btw, I am in the Richmond area if u would like to discuss any AT questions....
fiddlehead
04-01-2008, 16:56
Have fun! Sounds like you're gonna enjoy it!
Here is ScottP's article about a 3-4 month thru hike
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=33346
ALong with Scott's great article, you may want to read Chris's article as well:
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?p=184425#post184425
Basically go light, be consistent (try to avoid towns if you can) and have fun. As others have aid, 90 days may be a tough nut to crack for a first time thru-hike, but attitude is everything. Good luck!
Blissful
04-01-2008, 19:31
You are inviting injury and a failed thru hike. Better to find the time to do it or section hike it instead. Rushing the AT is ridiculous, IMO, and you miss out on so much.
foggy-bottom
04-01-2008, 19:40
why????
Hey Chad,
Go for it man. My hike was similar to the one you are planning. I hiked in 84 days without any experience, and turned 20 on the trail, so we're in the same place. I'm not in the mood to rehash the "why?" questions, and I hope this doesn't turn into an anti-fastpacking thread; I'll just say that my hike was the best experience of my life, and that since you're drawn to quick hiking right off the bat, you're probably the kind of person that will enjoy the struggle out there. The best things in life are the hardest, and for some people that applies to hiking too - I think I gained more from my hike because of the difficulty/pain management factor.
In a nutshell:
1. Pack light - Keep the baseweight under 10 pounds.
2. Start fast - Lots of people here will tell you to ramp up into the high mileages, but I think it's better to shock and awe the knees once (this may not apply if you hike a lot before hand) and get them totally broken in during the first week on the trail. Also, with 90 days you don't have time to ease into the pace; it's going to feel really daunting at first, and you need to get some miles behind you to get momentum.
3. Walk long, not fast - The biggest mistake is to think that you need to be "speedwalking" out there. You should never walk a pace that feels "fast," ever. You will get hurt. The key is to maximize daylight; start at 5:30, hike long and steady (break only for water purification and bathroom) for 6 solid hours before noon and get 15 miles behind you before midday. This makes the second half psychologically easy, and you can avoid that sucky feeling you get at 4:00 when you have 12 miles left before you can stop.
4. There are two relevant mileages - the miles that you walk during a "full" day in the woods (wake up, walk, camp), and the actual average with resupply factored in. From Hot Springs on (most of the trail, basically), I walked no fewer than 30 miles on a full day, but my final average was only about 26mpd, so resupply cost me about 4mpd on average. This may vary for you; I lost time to Lyme disease in MA, and I took a couple unnecessary luxury zeroes to meet with family, eat ice cream, etc., that could have been cut out if need be. So, if you want to average 25mpd, you can't just go out and walk 25's consistently, because you have to pad the average with longer days in between stops.
5. Don't take zeroes, take "town days." Try to get in position (by speeding up, not slowing down, ;)) to camp ~20 miles before a town. The next moring, wake up real early (headlamp it if you want, but I didn't carry a light, so it's not necessary) and truck it into town as fast as you can. I treated it like a game; I'd try to get up, camel up on water, eat down any remaining food, and see if I could get into town literally without sitting down or breaking for anything. That way, you can get into town by noon, and have half the day to mess around; most people sleep late on zeroes anyway, so you'll have about as much fun-time as people walking gentler paces.
6. I don't think food is as big of an issue as people make it out to be; everyone always acts like what you eat is incredibly important, and that may be true for a 6-7 month hike, but for 2.5-3, not so much. In my experience, all that really matters is caloric intake, not what kind of calories. My diet was probably 40% poptarts (don't listen to the haters, these are greattrail food), 40% bagels+PB+gorp+honey, 20% bars. I didn't carry a stove, so this may be different for you. Of course, this needs to be supplemented with massive 10,000 calorie camel-ups in towns (pizza).
7. Stay true to your goal. In fact, don't talk about your hike to other hikers. You will be actively, literally discouraged, called a fool, laughed at, etc. Lots of people are talked into slowing down by other people; if you decide that's what you want to do, by all means do it, but just think back to the original goal and make sure that what's "fun" for some might not be cowardly for you (I am notcalling slow hikers cowards, just saying that sometimes it can be less than admirable to give up on yourgoal, and all people have different goals).
Be a punching bag. No matter what gets thrown at you, bounce back. There is no luck, you make it yourself. Go kick ass and take names.
-DQ
Hey Chad,
Go for it man. My hike was similar to the one you are planning. I hiked in 84 days without any experience, and turned 20 on the trail, so we're in the same place. I'm not in the mood to rehash the "why?" questions, and I hope this doesn't turn into an anti-fastpacking thread; I'll just say that my hike was the best experience of my life, and that since you're drawn to quick hiking right off the bat, you're probably the kind of person that will enjoy the struggle out there. The best things in life are the hardest, and for some people that applies to hiking too - I think I gained more from my hike because of the difficulty/pain management factor.
In a nutshell:
1. Pack light - Keep the baseweight under 10 pounds.
2. Start fast - Lots of people here will tell you to ramp up into the high mileages, but I think it's better to shock and awe the knees once (this may not apply if you hike a lot before hand) and get them totally broken in during the first week on the trail. Also, with 90 days you don't have time to ease into the pace; it's going to feel really daunting at first, and you need to get some miles behind you to get momentum.
3. Walk long, not fast - The biggest mistake is to think that you need to be "speedwalking" out there. You should never walk a pace that feels "fast," ever. You will get hurt. The key is to maximize daylight; start at 5:30, hike long and steady (break only for water purification and bathroom) for 6 solid hours before noon and get 15 miles behind you before midday. This makes the second half psychologically easy, and you can avoid that sucky feeling you get at 4:00 when you have 12 miles left before you can stop.
4. There are two relevant mileages - the miles that you walk during a "full" day in the woods (wake up, walk, camp), and the actual average with resupply factored in. From Hot Springs on (most of the trail, basically), I walked no fewer than 30 miles on a full day, but my final average was only about 26mpd, so resupply cost me about 4mpd on average. This may vary for you; I lost time to Lyme disease in MA, and I took a couple unnecessary luxury zeroes to meet with family, eat ice cream, etc., that could have been cut out if need be. So, if you want to average 25mpd, you can't just go out and walk 25's consistently, because you have to pad the average with longer days in between stops.
5. Don't take zeroes, take "town days." Try to get in position (by speeding up, not slowing down, ;)) to camp ~20 miles before a town. The next moring, wake up real early (headlamp it if you want, but I didn't carry a light, so it's not necessary) and truck it into town as fast as you can. I treated it like a game; I'd try to get up, camel up on water, eat down any remaining food, and see if I could get into town literally without sitting down or breaking for anything. That way, you can get into town by noon, and have half the day to mess around; most people sleep late on zeroes anyway, so you'll have about as much fun-time as people walking gentler paces.
6. I don't think food is as big of an issue as people make it out to be; everyone always acts like what you eat is incredibly important, and that may be true for a 6-7 month hike, but for 2.5-3, not so much. In my experience, all that really matters is caloric intake, not what kind of calories. My diet was probably 40% poptarts (don't listen to the haters, these are greattrail food), 40% bagels+PB+gorp+honey, 20% bars. I didn't carry a stove, so this may be different for you. Of course, this needs to be supplemented with massive 10,000 calorie camel-ups in towns (pizza).
7. Stay true to your goal. In fact, don't talk about your hike to other hikers. You will be actively, literally discouraged, called a fool, laughed at, etc. Lots of people are talked into slowing down by other people; if you decide that's what you want to do, by all means do it, but just think back to the original goal and make sure that what's "fun" for some might not be cowardly for you (I am notcalling slow hikers cowards, just saying that sometimes it can be less than admirable to give up on yourgoal, and all people have different goals).
Be a punching bag. No matter what gets thrown at you, bounce back. There is no luck, you make it yourself. Go kick ass and take names.
-DQ
Great post, great advice. Should be mandatory for anyone thinking of a speed hike.
CrumbSnatcher
04-01-2008, 21:41
Hey Chad,
Go for it man. My hike was similar to the one you are planning. I hiked in 84 days without any experience, and turned 20 on the trail, so we're in the same place. I'm not in the mood to rehash the "why?" questions, and I hope this doesn't turn into an anti-fastpacking thread; I'll just say that my hike was the best experience of my life, and that since you're drawn to quick hiking right off the bat, you're probably the kind of person that will enjoy the struggle out there. The best things in life are the hardest, and for some people that applies to hiking too - I think I gained more from my hike because of the difficulty/pain management factor.
In a nutshell:
1. Pack light - Keep the baseweight under 10 pounds.
2. Start fast - Lots of people here will tell you to ramp up into the high mileages, but I think it's better to shock and awe the knees once (this may not apply if you hike a lot before hand) and get them totally broken in during the first week on the trail. Also, with 90 days you don't have time to ease into the pace; it's going to feel really daunting at first, and you need to get some miles behind you to get momentum.
3. Walk long, not fast - The biggest mistake is to think that you need to be "speedwalking" out there. You should never walk a pace that feels "fast," ever. You will get hurt. The key is to maximize daylight; start at 5:30, hike long and steady (break only for water purification and bathroom) for 6 solid hours before noon and get 15 miles behind you before midday. This makes the second half psychologically easy, and you can avoid that sucky feeling you get at 4:00 when you have 12 miles left before you can stop.
4. There are two relevant mileages - the miles that you walk during a "full" day in the woods (wake up, walk, camp), and the actual average with resupply factored in. From Hot Springs on (most of the trail, basically), I walked no fewer than 30 miles on a full day, but my final average was only about 26mpd, so resupply cost me about 4mpd on average. This may vary for you; I lost time to Lyme disease in MA, and I took a couple unnecessary luxury zeroes to meet with family, eat ice cream, etc., that could have been cut out if need be. So, if you want to average 25mpd, you can't just go out and walk 25's consistently, because you have to pad the average with longer days in between stops.
5. Don't take zeroes, take "town days." Try to get in position (by speeding up, not slowing down, ;)) to camp ~20 miles before a town. The next moring, wake up real early (headlamp it if you want, but I didn't carry a light, so it's not necessary) and truck it into town as fast as you can. I treated it like a game; I'd try to get up, camel up on water, eat down any remaining food, and see if I could get into town literally without sitting down or breaking for anything. That way, you can get into town by noon, and have half the day to mess around; most people sleep late on zeroes anyway, so you'll have about as much fun-time as people walking gentler paces.
6. I don't think food is as big of an issue as people make it out to be; everyone always acts like what you eat is incredibly important, and that may be true for a 6-7 month hike, but for 2.5-3, not so much. In my experience, all that really matters is caloric intake, not what kind of calories. My diet was probably 40% poptarts (don't listen to the haters, these are greattrail food), 40% bagels+PB+gorp+honey, 20% bars. I didn't carry a stove, so this may be different for you. Of course, this needs to be supplemented with massive 10,000 calorie camel-ups in towns (pizza).
7. Stay true to your goal. In fact, don't talk about your hike to other hikers. You will be actively, literally discouraged, called a fool, laughed at, etc. Lots of people are talked into slowing down by other people; if you decide that's what you want to do, by all means do it, but just think back to the original goal and make sure that what's "fun" for some might not be cowardly for you (I am notcalling slow hikers cowards, just saying that sometimes it can be less than admirable to give up on yourgoal, and all people have different goals).
Be a punching bag. No matter what gets thrown at you, bounce back. There is no luck, you make it yourself. Go kick ass and take names.
-DQ
CLURED,out of those 84 days on the trail, could you tell me about how many were bad weather/rain days, and any memorable stories about those days.
Thank you for the encouragement everyone. Clured, Mags, and and quassar thank you for the good information. And to all those who think I'm crazy, you're right. The thought of anyone telling me I can't do it in three months confirms to me that I AM going to. :) happy trails
-Ch4d
Good luck!
Stumpknocker, who has taken anywhere from 3 months to almost a year to hike the AT, told me the one he has enjoyed most was his fastest hike. He said it was a great hike because he felt so great.
How fast can you run 20k?
You are inviting injury and a failed thru hike. Better to find the time to do it or section hike it instead. Rushing the AT is ridiculous, IMO, and you miss out on so much.
I'd agree he was risking injury if he wasn't prepared beforehand (missed the part he was already hiking 20-25 a day) but doing big miles doesn't necessarily lessen ones hike, especially if you're in shape.
I remember when I first started and could hardly do 8 miles per day and thought faster hikers couldn't possibly be enjoying themselves. It wasn't until I started doing better, hiking 20 mpd that I realized how wrong I was.
Many would say anything less than 15-20 mpd is ridiculous, like me nowadays, and I'll strive to do better.
Failed thru-hike? Not in my vocabulary, unless you walk away learning nothing.
CLURED,out of those 84 days on the trail, could you tell me about how many were bad weather/rain days, and any memorable stories about those days.
Last summer was something of a drought, I believe, so I stayed dry most of the time. But I did get really screwed by weather a couple times. I sent home all my warm gear at Damascus, and walked through a freezing rain storm on Mt. Rogers the next day with no insulating layers and a liner bag (spent four or five hours holed up on the loft of that shelter on the top, curled up in by "bag" and zipped into my bivy trying to get warm). On the way into Waynesboro I got rained on like three days in a row and my socks shrank down under the lip of my shoes and my ankles lost most of their skin, which made for a miserable 30 miles into town. And then there was that day on the piece into Hanover when it literally did not stop pouring from the moment I started walking until I got to Dartmouth. I wanted to kill myself. Sucky experiences in the moment, great memories now.
CrumbSnatcher
04-02-2008, 09:35
Last summer was something of a drought, I believe, so I stayed dry most of the time. But I did get really screwed by weather a couple times. I sent home all my warm gear at Damascus, and walked through a freezing rain storm on Mt. Rogers the next day with no insulating layers and a liner bag (spent four or five hours holed up on the loft of that shelter on the top, curled up in by "bag" and zipped into my bivy trying to get warm). On the way into Waynesboro I got rained on like three days in a row and my socks shrank down under the lip of my shoes and my ankles lost most of their skin, which made for a miserable 30 miles into town. And then there was that day on the piece into Hanover when it literally did not stop pouring from the moment I started walking until I got to Dartmouth. I wanted to kill myself. Sucky experiences in the moment, great memories now.
thanks clured,this summer or next i will be doing a sub three month hike.i was just curious about your weather on your trip,one of my thru's was one of the wetest in the history of the trail2003,and one was one of the driest ever1999 so i know weather can play a big part...thanks again
How fast can you run 20k?The reason I brought up the 20k time, is because for most people the number of miles you can hike each day and the time it takes you to run 20k are highly dependant on your body weight, that is how much fat you are carrying relative to the amount of energy your legs can burn each day on an ongoing basis. Keep your gear weight down and hike your body weight down to 12% body fat or so and 25 miles a day won't be too crazy. 15 miles a day is just as crazy if you are carrying 60 perhaps even 70 pounds of excess body fat, as I am at the moment. At 5'10 170# and 23 you are probably in fairly good shape, and you should be able to get into better shape as you go. Unless you have a bunch of muscles up top you aren't willing to part with I think you will be better off hiking closer to 150#, with a 30" to 31" waist line.
http://home.fuse.net/clymer/bmi/
The reason I brought up the 20k time, is because for most people the number of miles you can hike each day and the time it takes you to run 20k are highly dependant on your body weight
Walk, don't run. I can't run a mile.
How fast can you run 20k?
Runing and hiking are two different beasts. I am a slowish runner, but can outpace many 3:30 marathoners when hiking. Short twitch vs long twitch nerve fibers, endurance vs. speed, different muscles, etc. etc.
I would not take fast time in running as indication of preparedness for backpacking. A better question is can you do a 20 mile day hike with a consistent pace then repeat the following day?
The reason I brought up the 20k time, is because for most people the number of miles you can hike each day and the time it takes you to run 20k are highly dependant on your body weight,
Bah....
As mentioned, I run on the slow side, but did 25-30 MPD on the CDT when hiking (4 mos on the nose for my hike) I am also best described as having a build that could work well an extra for a movie that requited dockworkers. :)
In any case, to train for a hike, running is good for cardio, but I suggest HIKING. Trail running works well..but hiking is ultimately what will get you in shape for hiking. :)
I would agree that two guys same height and weight, one might be a better thru-hiker and the other might be a better 20K runner. I've got this theory though, that in both cases, if you reduced their total weight (body plus gear) by 10% you would increase the distance they cover by 10%, running or hiking, for the same amount of effort.
At least until you run out of excess gear and body fat, and start cutting into bone and muscle.
Leg muscle that is. I don't think upper body mass helps a thru-hiker.
Upper body strength makes alot more sense than a lot of other luxury items though. :D
I'm actually not sure about how body composition affects fast hiking. I'm inclined to think that it has less to do with "visible" factors than it does with the invisible biomechanical stuff (dispositional strength of knees, etc.). I also think that literal hiking speed, in terms of miles per hour over a certain stretch of trail (as opposed to daily mileage over long periods) has more to do with stride length than anything else. I met lots of guys last summer that had big, bulky builds that I would handily beat in a road race, but that seemed to be able to walk fast paces easier than me because of their height.
With running, your aerobic capacity - VO2max - comes into play, but with hiking your heartrate doesn't really go over about 100-120 (on climbs) I'd say, so stuff like that isn't as important.
Appalachian Tater
04-02-2008, 10:47
I don't think upper body mass helps a thru-hiker.It is helpful when climbing up or down and putting your pack on or taking it off. It may also help with comfort while carrying the pack.
Using poles gives your upper-body muscles more to do while hiking.
Trail Dancer
04-02-2008, 11:10
I met a guy on the trail that was hiking for his summer break in college. He was hiking 20-35 miles a day and took only 2 zero days. He was having a blast. He did mention that he wasn't able to make many friends on the trail unless they were keeping up with him...which some people were. I just so happen to see him just before one of his zero days and then he caught up to me in a day. So I was one of the few to get to see him twice. It was amazing to see log entries of him flying thru the trail and how many days he was ahead of us. A few down sides to hiking fast that he mentioned and to be aware of...
1. He was skinning to begin with, he was down to zero body fat and was eatting a 1/2 a stick of butter with dinner (with noodles).
2. From the loss of weight he had major rubbing on his hips and back, duck tape solved that one.
3. Foot rot - his feet were always damp or wet and his boots never totally dried out so his feet were in bad shape...take care of your feet. He used cream to try to dry them out at night. Change your socks.
Good luck!
Trail Dancer
04-02-2008, 11:11
I met a guy on the trail that was hiking for his summer break in college. He was hiking 20-35 miles a day and took only 2 zero days. He was having a blast. He did mention that he wasn't able to make many friends on the trail unless they were keeping up with him...which some people were. I just so happen to see him just before one of his zero days and then he caught up to me in a day. So I was one of the few to get to see him twice. It was amazing to see log entries of him flying thru the trail and how many days he was ahead of us. A few down sides to hiking fast that he mentioned and to be aware of...
1. He was skinning to begin with, he was down to zero body fat and was eatting a 1/2 a stick of butter with dinner (with noodles).
2. From the loss of weight he had major rubbing on his hips and back, duck tape solved that one.
3. Foot rot - his feet were always damp or wet and his boots never totally dried out so his feet were in bad shape...take care of your feet. He used cream to try to dry them out at night. Change your socks.
Good luck!
Dirtygaiters
04-02-2008, 17:40
I met a guy on the trail that was hiking for his summer break in college. He was hiking 20-35 miles a day and took only 2 zero days. He was having a blast. He did mention that he wasn't able to make many friends on the trail unless they were keeping up with him...which some people were. I just so happen to see him just before one of his zero days and then he caught up to me in a day. So I was one of the few to get to see him twice. It was amazing to see log entries of him flying thru the trail and how many days he was ahead of us. A few down sides to hiking fast that he mentioned and to be aware of...
1. He was skinning to begin with, he was down to zero body fat and was eatting a 1/2 a stick of butter with dinner (with noodles).
2. From the loss of weight he had major rubbing on his hips and back, duck tape solved that one.
3. Foot rot - his feet were always damp or wet and his boots never totally dried out so his feet were in bad shape...take care of your feet. He used cream to try to dry them out at night. Change your socks.
Good luck!
In other words, make sure your backpack's wasit belt will fit a person with a much thinner waist than yourself, right?
Blissful
04-02-2008, 20:12
I wrote my post after hearing one our intrepid leaders of WB had to come off because of stress fractures of his ankle and it made me sad. And he wasn't even going fast. So sure, you can wing it at three months. But I have to ask - why? I know people do it, but after having done the whole trail myself, I can't imagine why one would unless it's this mentality of youth in conquering it all and in as little time as possible as if that in itself proves something. I only say you are at a greater risk of injury - because you are. I saw a 20 yr old guy race up the trail at the start last year and blow out his knee by Unicoi gap. And others develop stress fractures. Ankle twists. Plantar fascitis. Nor can I see people doing 25 miles a day from Glencliff, NH to mid Maine. That's all.
But hey, if that's what you want to do and your memory of trail is doing it as fast as possible, whizzing by the scenery, a fast mtn stream and a chance to see what these woods are really all about, along with the people hiking it and the townspeople who make your time a memory, then by all means - don't let a post like mine make you think twice. After all - it's HYOH and I'm sure there are other reasons for doing it fast.
I met a guy on the trail that was hiking for his summer break in college. He was hiking 20-35 miles a day and took only 2 zero days. He was having a blast. He did mention that he wasn't able to make many friends on the trail unless they were keeping up with him...which some people were. I just so happen to see him just before one of his zero days and then he caught up to me in a day. So I was one of the few to get to see him twice. It was amazing to see log entries of him flying thru the trail and how many days he was ahead of us. A few down sides to hiking fast that he mentioned and to be aware of...
1. He was skinning to begin with, he was down to zero body fat and was eatting a 1/2 a stick of butter with dinner (with noodles).
2. From the loss of weight he had major rubbing on his hips and back, duck tape solved that one.
3. Foot rot - his feet were always damp or wet and his boots never totally dried out so his feet were in bad shape...take care of your feet. He used cream to try to dry them out at night. Change your socks.
Good luck!
That was probably Clydesdale? Little guy, black GoLite pack? I met him two or three times; we actually started only three or four days apart, and we were on more or less the same schedule for the first half, although I rarely saw him. He got Lyme and had to get off the trail at Duncannon.
I wrote my post after hearing one our intrepid leaders of WB had to come off because of stress fractures of his ankle and it made me sad. And he wasn't even going fast. So sure, you can wing it at three months. But I have to ask - why? I know people do it, but after having done the whole trail myself, I can't imagine why one would unless it's this mentality of youth in conquering it all and in as little time as possible as if that in itself proves something. I only say you are at a greater risk of injury - because you are. I saw a 20 yr old guy race up the trail at the start last year and blow out his knee by Unicoi gap. And others develop stress fractures. Ankle twists. Plantar fascitis. Nor can I see people doing 25 miles a day from Glencliff, NH to mid Maine. That's all.
But hey, if that's what you want to do and your memory of trail is doing it as fast as possible, whizzing by the scenery, a fast mtn stream and a chance to see what these woods are really all about, along with the people hiking it and the townspeople who make your time a memory, then by all means - don't let a post like mine make you think twice. After all - it's HYOH and I'm sure there are other reasons for doing it fast.
Blissful,
I think you really care about hiking and hikers, and I respect your input; but maybe there's just a difference in perspective. If a friend of yours decided that he wanted to break 3 hours for the marathon, would you tell him that he is "wasting" the marathon, or that he should slow down? No, that would make you a bad friend; you would encourage him to accomplish his goals.
As for Sgt. Rock, perhaps his case is just a reminder of why it's better to do your fast hiking at 19 instead of 41.
As for Sgt. Rock, perhaps his case is just a reminder of why it's better to do your fast hiking at 19 instead of 41.
Actually, when I was starting SOBO, about half the young folks around me got off with one sort of injury or other, frequently knee problems. Even the young have to be smart enough to know when they can get away with pushing hard and when they need to scale back a notch. It's not really anything anyone else can give you a recipe for--you have to work it out for yourself. I think hiking solo helps so that you can make decisions based on what you need to do, instead of what your partner or your friends want to do.
Actually, when I was starting SOBO, about half the young folks around me got off with one sort of injury or other, frequently knee problems. Even the young have to be smart enough to know when they can get away with pushing hard and when they need to scale back a notch. It's not really anything anyone else can give you a recipe for--you have to work it out for yourself. I think hiking solo helps so that you can make decisions based on what you need to do, instead of what your partner or your friends want to do.
Well, of course - pacing is as important as aggression. That's something you have to learn in all endurance sports. I'm a lightweight rower at college, and all novice rowers make the mistake of starting racing pieces way too fast, and then the "blow up" and finish so slowly that they cancel out any lead they secured in the first 2-3 frantic minutes of the 6-minute race. You have to learn exactly how fast you can go for 2174 miles, not for 100 or 200 or even 1000 or 1500 miles. That self-knowledge is just as much a part of the challenge as is the raw physical challenge of doing 30 mile days.
kayak karl
04-02-2008, 22:20
Half a shovel ALL day, Full shovel HALF a day.
Keep It Simple S:D
warren doyle
04-02-2008, 22:29
A three-month hike is doable for a hiker who is more 'smart' than 'strong'.
It is all about intelligent, motivated and focused endurance.
A pace of 2 mph at 15 hours a day is 30 miles per day. A simple strategy.
I've been hiking since I was about 8 off and on. As I stated before I started back up a couple months ago and have gotten myself up to 20-25 miles a day. Even at 25 miles a day I find there is a little too much daylight left for me and I end up laying around camp extremely bored and just wanting to get back on the trail. I'm always up 30 minutes before sunrise and almost always walking down the trail by the time the sun does rise. But every single time I go solo I find I'm in camp a couple hours before the sun sets. I want to avoid that in the future. Including on my thru-hike.
Oh and I'm certainly not rushing or moving too fast. I'm moving at a comfortable enjoyable speed and I look up often enough to avoid big game that I get to see everything I want to see. I recently took a buddy out who was probably hiking a little bit out of his comfort zone. We did 15 miles and I found it rather frustrating to stop as often as we did. I just prefer to see more in a shorter amount of time.
Highlander II
04-03-2008, 07:36
I wrote my post after hearing one our intrepid leaders of WB had to come off because of stress fractures of his ankle and it made me sad. And he wasn't even going fast. So sure, you can wing it at three months. But I have to ask - why? I know people do it, but after having done the whole trail myself, I can't imagine why one would unless it's this mentality of youth in conquering it all and in as little time as possible as if that in itself proves something. I only say you are at a greater risk of injury - because you are. I saw a 20 yr old guy race up the trail at the start last year and blow out his knee by Unicoi gap. And others develop stress fractures. Ankle twists. Plantar fascitis. Nor can I see people doing 25 miles a day from Glencliff, NH to mid Maine. That's all.
But hey, if that's what you want to do and your memory of trail is doing it as fast as possible, whizzing by the scenery, a fast mtn stream and a chance to see what these woods are really all about, along with the people hiking it and the townspeople who make your time a memory, then by all means - don't let a post like mine make you think twice. After all - it's HYOH and I'm sure there are other reasons for doing it fast.
As you said and I always stressed while I was hiking HYOH. If by young you mean 32 or less, then I qualify as I hiked at age 32 in what most would consider a "speed hike". And yes I did 25-30 mile days from the beginning of the Whites to Katahdin (except for the last day which was only 20 miles) plus many others further south.
While you may not realize it, you clearly showed what Clured explains as the discouraging words that "speed hikers" have to deal with during their hikes. It seems no one can understand why someone would want to hike that fast or how they could hike that fast. I got "the look" every time I would answer the question of when I started especially when my start date was a month or two after the questioner. It got to the point when I would really not want to answer people because the discouraging words were; pretty discouraging.
As for why I hiked what some would consider long days: I like to hike. I got bored in camp especially when I was done 20 miles by 2pm. I don't drink alcohol so the whole party scene is not for me. Most other people were not out there for the same reason(s) as me (to hike) so I didn't connect with many. I hated getting to a shelter and getting turned out because it was full of a group that were taking a day off because it was raining, so I just hiked more. I would see more wildlife early in the morning or late in the evening.
There are probably other reasons which I can't think of right now...
I think its basic human nature to think "your own way" is best and although most stress HYOH, they really only mean that when it comes to hikes similar to theirs. This was pretty clear to me based on the discouraging words that I got from most other thru-hikers on my hike.
I said from the start of my hike that I would never ask the question that was always in the back of my mind as a response: "How can you be going so slow?" For anyone who asks such a question -- shame on them. The same thing applies for those that ask the equal and opposite question: "How can you go so fast?"
Trail Dancer
04-03-2008, 07:36
That was probably Clydesdale? Little guy, black GoLite pack? I met him two or three times; we actually started only three or four days apart, and we were on more or less the same schedule for the first half, although I rarely saw him. He got Lyme and had to get off the trail at Duncannon.
It was a 19 year old going to college in Boston, name Mowgli (from the Jungle book).
Highlander II
04-03-2008, 07:42
Oh and I'm certainly not rushing or moving too fast. I'm moving at a comfortable enjoyable speed and I look up often enough to avoid big game that I get to see everything I want to see. I recently took a buddy out who was probably hiking a little bit out of his comfort zone. We did 15 miles and I found it rather frustrating to stop as often as we did. I just prefer to see more in a shorter amount of time.
It sounds like you have similar reasons for hiking long days as myself. Unfortunately, I don't believe there is much point in trying to explain why you (and I) like to hike long days. "They" just will never understand. This is really the same thing as any thru-hiker trying to explain why they thru-hiked, why they want to thru-hike, why they yearn for the trail in the Spring (typically) every year, etc. to someone "normal".
I'm not sure that many people understand that speed is relative, not just to the terrain (most people understand that much) but also to your total gear weight and body weight. I'm not saying 25 miles a day is too fast, or that people going 10-15 miles a day are going too slow. I'm just saying that people shouldn't compare miles per day like its all the same to everybody. That's just dumb.
Trail Dancer
04-03-2008, 07:54
It was a 19 year old going to college in Boston, name Mowgli (from the Jungle book).
He had a friend on the trail name Chop Sticks that was going about his pace... he had a great time.
I did not go as fast as Mowgli by any means, I don't think I judged him for going as fast as he did. My boyfriend that I hiked together in 07' and he had done a thur hike in 03' with a college friend. They did 25-30 miles a day... he loved it so much he wanted to come back out and do it again with me. (we did 15-20 miles a day, pretty average). Before my boyfriend and I decided to hike I was worried that he was going to get bored or that I wouldn't be able to go as fast as he wanted. He knew that it was going to be a much different hike and he had different goals in mind than from his 03' hike. Everything worked out great, and now I wouldn't mind thru hiking again one day.
Personally I think you would see more going 25-30 miles a day, not less. If they get to the end of the trail too soon they can always find another one. I really don't see how people think they can get people to slow down or sit down any more than they can expect people to speed up or stand up. Now there is such a thing as doing things that are bad for your health, but you are just as apt to find that in slow hikers as fast ones. I think it should be everyone's goal to finish healthier than when they started, God willing.
It was a 19 year old going to college in Boston, name Mowgli (from the Jungle book).
Oh yea! I remember him too..different guy. I passed him at Cable Gap Shelter right before the Smokies. He was really nice. He actually new a girl at Tufts that went to my highschool. His real name was Chris I think.
warren doyle
04-03-2008, 10:53
On my long days (15 hours at 2mph), I would see so much walking/flowing into and during dawn and then being rewarded by walking/flowing into dusk/night.
The smells, the sounds, the shadows and light patterns....
I felt joy in this and comfort.
I hear you warren. 2mph seems really slow, but I've gone slower.
I feel it is quite often better to count the hours instead of the miles.
Fannypack
04-03-2008, 11:27
I hear you warren. 2mph seems really slow, but I've gone slower.
I feel it is quite often better to count the hours instead of the miles.
for a 15 hour day, 2mph average is very reasonable ;
of course, at the present time I would have a hard time walking a 15 hour day with breaks that allow me to average 2 mph...
Thx Warren for pointing out this "simplistic" approach to hiking a long/big day
I hiked a really flat trail in PEI, an old railway bed, plus PEI is really flat. I found I could walk as many miles as usual, but not as many hours. Might have been the shoes I was wearing. On the other hand the fundy footpath is a real bag drive, but I find its easier to put the hours in, as long as you don't carry too much weight. Less weight on feet, plus changing scenery, plus changing grade, that's what seems to make for a nice long days hike. Whatever distance gets covered as a result is secondary, I think, as long as you can put the hours in.
People need to hear 25+ is not necessarily about hiking fast, but rather hiking long hours consistently and there is at least the potential to experience more and not less as some seem unable to grasp.
It's not for everyone, but it's not always misguided foolishness either. If done right, it's but a another approach to hiking smart, whether employed for only 1 day or several months.
I would agree with that. I think you see more when you walk faster, as long as you hike the same number of hours. Biking is faster still, but I am not sure you get the same quality per mile biking as hiking. Running is as good as hiking, but I can't run more than 2 hours. I think the best way to measure a good hiking day is by the hours first, then the miles. Quality of time spent in camp is important also, but it always feels so much better if you've put in a good day. It's rather moot however, since you can only hike so far anyway. We can't be measuring the quality of your day compared to someone elses. That will just make us all miserable. Whether people are passing you or you are passing people no need to get all bent and twisted. Just smile and wave boys. Smile and wave.
I think if more people spent more time high on endorphines the world would be a better place.
I think if more people spent more time high on endorphines the world would be a better place.
I do my best.
I think you see more when you walk faster, as long as you hike the same number of hours.
What about someone who hikes more hours at the same rate (mph)? Wouldn't such a hiker see what a another who hikes less hours sees the next morning? Does a hiker putting in more hours go blind after 8 or 10 hours or some other arbitrary number we can all agree upon?;)
Quality of time spent in camp is important also, but it always feels so much better if you've put in a good day.
It is important to those hikers who value time spent in camp beyond what is required for physical rejuvenation.;)
We can't be measuring the quality of your day compared to someone elses. That will just make us all miserable. Whether people are passing you or you are passing people no need to get all bent and twisted. Just smile and wave boys. Smile and wave.
Better to just smile and wave, for sure!:) Compare notes with others who are HYSH (hiking your same hike) and answer questions from those who stand to benefit.
As for Sgt. Rock, perhaps his case is just a reminder of why it's better to do your fast hiking at 19 instead of 41.
Endurance record holders tend to be older. Marathon runners/tri winners/cyclists typically are in their early 30s. Competitive ultra runners are more towards 40 (look at the recent Barkley thread..and see the ages of the only 7 people to compete it). Just an FYI. :)
What about someone who hikes more hours at the same rate (mph)? Wouldn't such a hiker see what a another who hikes less hours sees the next morning? Does a hiker putting in more hours go blind after 8 or 10 hours or some other arbitrary number we can all agree upon?;)
It is important to those hikers who value time spent in camp beyond what is required for physical rejuvenation.;)
Better to just smile and wave, for sure!:) Compare notes with others who are HYSH (hiking your same hike) and answer questions from those who stand to benefit.Good points. Life is good. Endorphines are just a pleasant reminder. Hedonism is really not all that bad an approach to life, and it doesn't necessarily have to be all that sinful, though it doesn't hurt to keep your options open either. ;)
I'm thinking about shooting for a 3 month thru-hike my first time. I've wondering if you guys have any advice to help I would appreciate it.
I want to do 25 miles a day, every day. Anyone know if how much I'll need to be eating? Or what I could possibly carry to add up to enough calories to push myself.
I'm currently 5'10, 177 Lbs. Just recently started some basic training. Any advice there? What kind of shape should I be getting into before starting a fast thru-hike? I'm already backpacking almost a hundred miles a month, though only been out for a couple days at a time at most so far.
I've got a lot of experience with 2 to 3 day trips, a very large amount of day hikes under my belt. A good amount of wilderness survival skill and outdoor and weather experience. Being wet doesn't stop me from moving, being cold gets me moving more and faster. Being both, even more. I have been doing 20 to 25 mile days recently within 2 months of starting back up.
oh and I've got a year or two to prepare for this, I intend on drying my own food and eating well.
Ch4d
Go for it! As a long distance runner I totally get it. What you're wanting to do is an excellent challenge and a worthwhile endeavor in my book.
I wouldn't talk about it too much with other people because I have a feeling that in one way or another most folks would try to discourage you.
Blissful
04-03-2008, 20:05
For me it wasn't just about making miles, though I am very goal oriented (but as I have gotten older, I know too what my body can do, and I treat it with respect. And it rewarded me by getting me all the way to the end). I made the decision to be out on the trail more than just for myself (I had my son with me, too). It was a chance to meet and talk to others. Find out who they are, where they come from, what makes them tick. Share the ins and outs of this trail experience. Camp was a good way to do that, as was being in town with those zero days. Hard to get to know people and make friends arriving late and leaving early, and with set goals that take precedence over everything and anything (though my set goals of mileage were cast out the window by Neels Gap). But again, meeting and talking to people isn't for everyone either. But it's a facet of trail life I enjoyed. I learned alot by being a listener instead of just a doer, doing my own hiking thing. I learned how to do things on the trail too because of people I met and took the time to talk rather than just hike. And I believe it led to its success. Including talking to Warren and Shades of Gray while on the trail. :)