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Bear Cables
05-06-2008, 17:27
I decided to start a new thead about rain. As some of you know from a previous thread, I hike with a light weight rain fly so I don't have to cook and eat in the rain once I'm "in camp". I would love to wean myself from the extra weight but just don't like cooking and eating in the rain. I'd be interested in what other hikers do. How do ya'll deal with the rain, cooking and eating.:-?

Summit
05-06-2008, 17:42
I've done different things for different situations. If I happen to tent camp near a shelter, I'll cook at the shelter. I might switch and eat a meal that doesn't require cooking and eat that evening's cookable dinner for lunch. Or, I might cook in the tent if it looks like there will be no letup in the rain and I'm really wanting something hot to eat and no shelter is nearby. With my Jetboil, I can light it outside the tent in the rain and then bring it in the tent relatively safely. I don't zipper up the tent door when doing this and I don't recommend it as a regular practice.

From another hotly debated thread on cooking in tents, deciding to do so is assessing a risk and with expertise and skill, deciding you can do it safely, just like getting behind the wheel of a car, or not treating water! :eek:

Blissful
05-06-2008, 17:50
It really didn't happen that often for us last year. We used the tent vestibule twice to eat and ate twice in our tent. There are shelters also to cook and eat at, which we did several times. You really won't believe the things you will get used to doing that you never thought you would after being out there day after day. Give it time. It all comes with the territory. :)

Skidsteer
05-06-2008, 18:32
I cook in the vestibule or under the 'beak' or just eat some cold food packed for just such an occasion. No worries.

SGT Rock
05-06-2008, 18:33
I sleep in a hammock that has a tarp for a rain cover. When I am not sleeping in the hammock, the entire tarp is my "rain fly". I cook, dress, pack, unpack, and whatever else I want to do under there.

hammock engineer
05-06-2008, 18:37
What Rock said. I use a 12'x10' tarp on my hammock. Plenty of room to hang out and do whatever out of the rain.

sofaking
05-06-2008, 18:44
i quit backpacking when it rains, it's yucky and wet. then i go fetch a cheeseburger at the mall.

peanuts
05-06-2008, 18:47
same here, what rock and hammock hanger said.....

Appalachian Tater
05-06-2008, 18:47
I sit in my tent and cook just outside of it using a supercat-type alcohol stove and a MSR Titan kettle which is wide and protects the stove from the rain.

Pokey2006
05-06-2008, 19:04
Summer sausage, cheese and crackers make a mighty fine meal when you're stuck and can't (or don't want to) cook.

SGT Rock
05-06-2008, 19:10
Summer sausage, cheese and crackers make a mighty fine meal when you're stuck and can't (or don't want to) cook.
Change crackers to bread. Add some instant pudding, cold tea done by flow thru, and lots and lots of snack foods.

Summit
05-06-2008, 19:13
And if you've got a cell phone and are at Rock Gap, call Ron Havens and he'll bring you a hot pizza! :D But it'll cost you! :eek:

hammock engineer
05-06-2008, 21:34
same here, what rock and hammock hanger said.....

hammock hanger?:eek:

bigcranky
05-06-2008, 21:35
I don't mind stopping in at a shelter to cook dinner, or lunch for that matter. Gets me out of the weather and gives me a flat spot to cook.

I carry a tarp as my only shelter anyway -- with a hammock under it in summer (solo trips), or just on the ground in cold weather. Easy enough to set up the tarp and cook dinner right underneath.

If I really wanted to carry a tent, I'd just plan to do the shelter thing for dinner, then move on and camp later. Or eat cold food.

Or hey, just carry the tarp anyway, and use it, and be happy.

peanuts
05-06-2008, 21:49
hammock hanger?:eek:
oops sorry coffee:o

Ramble~On
05-06-2008, 21:52
Once upon a time whilst tent camping I sat out in the pouring rain and tried my best to cover my stove while cooking and when done...the second I took the pot off the stove the rain put it out..I sat hunched over to eat and vowed to get a tarp and never hike without a tarp again.
--not all vestibules are created equal. Heavy downpours can be a PITA.
I use a 10x12 tarp when hammocking and have converted the large size tarp that I got with my Clark North American into an extended vestibule when tent camping..The tarp is the first thing out of the pack and the last thing in.
I've since puttered around sewing my own tarps and "ain't skeered" no more of rain.
Kinda like this Photo (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=24444&catid=member&imageuser=2785) of tarp over tent. Or this honking huge tarp over a hammock photo (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=10753&catid=member&imageuser=2785). Lots of room to cook, eat, or play a nice friendly game of UNO with you buds..

Bear Cables
05-06-2008, 21:52
I've done different things for different situations. If I happen to tent camp near a shelter, I'll cook at the shelter. I might switch and eat a meal that doesn't require cooking and eat that evening's cookable dinner for lunch. Or, I might cook in the tent if it looks like there will be no letup in the rain and I'm really wanting something hot to eat and no shelter is nearby. Jetboil, I can light it outside the tent in the rain and then bring it in the tWith my ent relatively safely. I don't zipper up the tent door when doing this and I don't recommend it as a regular practice.

From another hotly debated thread on cooking in tents, deciding to do so is assessing a risk and with expertise and skill, deciding you can do it safely, just like getting behind the wheel of a car, or not treating water! :eek:

You're right about assessing risk. Don't you worry about becoming bear bait? I think I'd rather hunker down under a tree in my rain suit and eat a no cook meal. Anyone every use an umbrella?

sofaking
05-06-2008, 21:54
You're right about assessing risk. Don't you worry about becoming bear bait? I think I'd rather hunker down under a tree in my rain suit and eat a no cook meal. Anyone every use an umbrella?
because we all know how many hikers get attacked by bears on the a.t.
perhaps that fear would justify concealed carry?

aaronthebugbuffet
05-06-2008, 21:58
Summer sausage, cheese and crackers make a mighty fine meal when you're stuck and can't (or don't want to) cook.
QFE
I dont cook a lot when backpacking so I usually have plenty of stuff to eat without worrying about cooking in the rain.

Summit
05-06-2008, 22:16
Kinda like this Photo (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=24444&catid=member&imageuser=2785) of tarp over tent. Or this honking huge tarp over a hammock photo (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=10753&catid=member&imageuser=2785). Lots of room to cook, eat, or play a nice friendly game of UNO with you buds..What the heck are you doing camping in the middle of the trail (first photo) SW? :eek: :p

Summit
05-06-2008, 22:23
You're right about assessing risk. Don't you worry about becoming bear bait?Not at all! Now days I've gone to eating Mountain House meals on section hikes for dinner. I don't get food anywhere but "down the hatch," and with proper ventilation, there is no lingering odor of food for very long. I don't even have to worry with hanging food in a down pour after dinner. I just pack it away in my bear vault and roll it out of the tent as far as I can . . . nice and dry and safe! ;)

Ramble~On
05-06-2008, 22:52
What the heck are you doing camping in the middle of the trail (first photo) SW? :eek: :p

:rolleyes: The day & night before was ?17+ miles and it rained like a Moe..I got in there late..this is down past Burrell's Ford (Foothills Trail) near the side trail to the falls and I set up on the side trail before the bridge, was up and gone early @ 11:00am:D

Bear Cables
05-06-2008, 22:56
because we all know how many hikers get attacked by bears on the a.t.
perhaps that fear would justify concealed carry?

I guess I just a "rule follower". Everything I've been taught and read says eating and cooking in or near tent is an invitation to the bear. I do realize that is really the case in grizzly territory but don't you think it's wise counsel anywhere there is a bear population. And what is concealed carry? A consealed tarp?;)But this a discussion for another thread...hey think I'll start one:-?

Bear Cables
05-06-2008, 22:59
Not at all! Now days I've gone to eating Mountain House meals on section hikes for dinner. I don't get food anywhere but "down the hatch," and with proper ventilation, there is no lingering odor of food for very long. I don't even have to worry with hanging food in a down pour after dinner. I just pack it away in my bear vault and roll it out of the tent as far as I can . . . nice and dry and safe! ;)


You're right about keeping it clean. I am going to carry a bear vault this summer. I like the idea of security with out the bear rope hassle. Of course if the shelters have good cables that's fine , but there are also the nights on the trail camps.

SGT Rock
05-06-2008, 23:07
Heck, this trip I passesed an abandoned camp in springtime with cooked food still sitting on the pots the hikers abandoned. It looked like it had been there for days.

Anyhow, my experience and what I have noticed with bears on the AT is they have already figured out where hikers are likley to stay and they hang out in those areas when it is the right time of the year to get the food. You could avoid cooking all together and they would still show up to check the site out and know what a food bag looks like.

I also say this: have you ever smelled yourself and your clothing after you get off the trail? I bet you smell like food of some sort to a bear after you eat the first meal in the clothes you hike in.

Summit
05-06-2008, 23:08
You're right about keeping it clean. I am going to carry a bear vault this summer. I like the idea of security with out the bear rope hassle. Of course if the shelters have good cables that's fine , but there are also the nights on the trail camps.I haven't hiked in the northeast, except for about 75 miles of the Long Trail in Vermont, so I'm not sure how "friendly" the bears are there, but hanging food or using a bear vault in the eastern US is more about other critters like skunks, mice, birds, raccoons, etc. getting into your food or bothering you in the tent if you keep food in it, than bears. The PCT, CDT, Canadian Rockies, Alaska is a different story. I've done plenty of that in my 35 years of backpacking. I've never had a bear come into my campsite in the East, but I have out West. But that's just my experience. Other's mileage may vary! ;)

Ramble~On
05-06-2008, 23:12
You're right about keeping it clean. I am going to carry a bear vault this summer. I like the idea of security with out the bear rope hassle. Of course if the shelters have good cables that's fine , but there are also the nights on the trail camps.

I think they're called "Mouse Vaults" on the east coast and "Bear Vaults" in points west.:D Just kidding...they're popular but I don't bother with them.
I don't always bother bear bagging and I'm guilty of cooking and eatting in the tent, under the tarp and where I sleep..guess I am setting myself for some sort of statistic thing. But I'll die out doing what I love fighting to defend my snickers bars and gorp to the last. I do bearbag in the GSMNP, SNP and anywhere else that it makes good sense to do so and/or is required.
2 years ago or 3? there was a guy in the GSMNP that had a bear bite into his leg through his hammock - The guy admitted being at fault as after he got done cooking he did the thing guys are famous for...he wiped his greasy, food scented hands all over his pants. The bear was just out doing what bears everywhere are trying to do - survive.
Oh yeah...sorry! This thread is about RAIN huh.

Bear Cables
05-07-2008, 09:59
I also say this: have you ever smelled yourself and your clothing after you get off the trail? I bet you smell like food of some sort to a bear after you eat the first meal in the clothes you hike in.

I would think that the way I smell after a few days on the trail would scare the bear off! But anyway...back to dealing with the rain....

envirodiver
05-07-2008, 11:00
Once upon a time whilst tent camping I sat out in the pouring rain and tried my best to cover my stove while cooking and when done...the second I took the pot off the stove the rain put it out..I sat hunched over to eat and vowed to get a tarp and never hike without a tarp again.
--not all vestibules are created equal. Heavy downpours can be a PITA.
I use a 10x12 tarp when hammocking and have converted the large size tarp that I got with my Clark North American into an extended vestibule when tent camping..The tarp is the first thing out of the pack and the last thing in.
I've since puttered around sewing my own tarps and "ain't skeered" no more of rain.
Kinda like this Photo (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=24444&catid=member&imageuser=2785) of tarp over tent. Or this honking huge tarp over a hammock photo (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=10753&catid=member&imageuser=2785). Lots of room to cook, eat, or play a nice friendly game of UNO with you buds..

I'll bet that rigging the tarp over that tarptent in that manner also helps with the condensation that tends to fall in a cold heavy rain from the raindrops striking on the surface of the tent and causing the condensation to fall. Good idea.

NICKTHEGREEK
05-07-2008, 11:23
Heck, this trip I passesed an abandoned camp in springtime with cooked food still sitting on the pots the hikers abandoned. It looked like it had been there for days.

Anyhow, my experience and what I have noticed with bears on the AT is they have already figured out where hikers are likley to stay and they hang out in those areas when it is the right time of the year to get the food. You could avoid cooking all together and they would still show up to check the site out and know what a food bag looks like.

I also say this: have you ever smelled yourself and your clothing after you get off the trail? I bet you smell like food of some sort to a bear after you eat the first meal in the clothes you hike in.
Regardless of accumulated odor you smell like food to a bear because you are food to a bear. It all depends on how hungry or pissed off they are at the moment

SGT Rock
05-07-2008, 11:26
Regardless of accumulated odor you smell like food to a bear because you are food to a bear. It all depends on how hungry or pissed off they are at the moment
Exactly. Add to that bears like smelly dead things - sounds like hiker funk.

sofaking
05-07-2008, 11:29
seeing as how capsacin is so unpleasant to bears, i guess you could sprinkle cayenne all around your tent, put little satchets of it in your food bag and wear a necklace of habenero peppers to ward of midnight bear attacks- just don't rub your eyes or touch any 'sensitive' places on your body...a crucifix may come in handy also.

SGT Rock
05-07-2008, 11:32
Actually I have found a camera, prepared to take a picture, is the best defense against seeing bears. I have never ever seen one when I have a camera ready.

I think it is the same principle as crosses and vampires.

sofaking
05-07-2008, 11:33
hey wait, didn't this topic get its own thread?

envirodiver
05-07-2008, 11:35
Actually I have found a camera, prepared to take a picture, is the best defense against seeing bears. I have never ever seen one when I have a camera ready.

Rock it's this kind of info that makes you da man. You are so right. If you do see a bear and start reaching for a camera they run away.

So making the connection bears fear cameras. Wonder if this works for grizzlies? You could wear a camera around your neck and not have to listen to a confounded bell. Hang a camera outside your tent and eat inside to your hearts content.

SGT Rock
05-07-2008, 11:37
Rock it's this kind of info that makes you da man. You are so right. If you do see a bear and start reaching for a camera they run away.

So making the connection bears fear cameras. Wonder if this works for grizzlies? You could wear a camera around your neck and not have to listen to a confounded bell. Hang a camera outside your tent and eat inside to your hearts content.
I think this is why that one muldoon up in Alaska got ate. He had the lens cap on that day.

envirodiver
05-07-2008, 11:38
I think this is why that one muldoon up in Alaska got ate. He had the lens cap on that day.

Makes sense.

sofaking
05-07-2008, 11:38
I think this is why that one muldoon up in Alaska got ate. He had the lens cap on that day.
that, and he said 'say cheese'

Frosty
05-07-2008, 11:41
I guess I just a "rule follower". Everything I've been taught and read says eating and cooking in or near tent is an invitation to the bear. I do realize that is really the case in grizzly territory but don't you think it's wise counsel anywhere there is a bear population. And what is concealed carry? A consealed tarp?;)But this a discussion for another thread...hey think I'll start one:-?Sofaking was just being a PITA. His post wasn't meant to be taken seriously.

You are correct in your observations about bears. It is pretty universqally recommended to bear bag and not eat in tents, etc.

There are other considerations, though. Bears follow their own social rules. Food near you is yours, food near them is theirs, food not near either of you is anyone's. This is important in that a bear is much less likely to go after food on your person, but more likely to get it from a pack on the ground or a bear bag if it can get it, and most importantly: if if does get your food, don't try to get it back. It will defend it as though you are stealing HIS food. Because to him you are. Biggest danger from a bear IMO is someone trying to chase a bear away from food it has already pilfered.

SGT Rock makes excellent points. Many hikers bearbag in established camping spots, usually don't bother when away from them.

sofaking
05-07-2008, 11:45
'food not near anyone' is probably theirs too...

SGT Rock
05-07-2008, 11:49
Sleep with your food.

sofaking
05-07-2008, 11:55
an unopened package of hot dogs for a pillow?...hmm, mebbe a nice summer sausage or block of cheese to prop the feets up...

SGT Rock
05-07-2008, 11:58
I just keep it all in the same bag for a foot rest. Maybe foot funk covers the odor.

sofaking
05-07-2008, 12:06
i have used my 'wine in the bag out of the box' as a pillow...then again, i've also woken up on the cold, hard ground next to said 'pillow'...

SunnyWalker
05-16-2008, 23:03
Uh. . . . whats the topic of this threaed? :-)

River Runner
05-17-2008, 02:15
Here are some thoughts I have had on food odors lingering on tents and clothing - totally unproven, but they make sense to me at least.

Humans can generally tell the difference between the smell of food that is there (i.e. cooking, or freshly cooked) and food that is no longer there (i.e. vague lingering odors). If a bears nose is more sensitive than ours, I think they can proably tell the difference too. I am quite sure that some food odor lingers on everything we are packing, simply from food being packed all day next to all of the rest of our gear, inside our pack. I think it probably takes a pretty fresh odor of food to attract a bear. Not to say we should not be careful, just that a slight odor is probably minimal risk.

And as to cooking under a tarp, or even in a tent vestibule in the rain, I would try to make it a low smell meal (i.e. rehydrating freeze-dried meals as opposed to cooking a Lipton's mix with a pouch of chicken thrown in for a long time in the pot, so less smell lingers. Or as others have said, eat something cold and have the hot meal the next day for lunch.

Another thing I think about is that most animals do not wander very far in the rain - they generally hunker down in a sheltered area. So if it is a lengthy, heavy rain, there is probably less chance of a bear out roaming around. Maybe.

Squeamish
05-18-2008, 09:26
Why don't you use the groundcloth for your tent as a tarp and the tent poles as a support? it will be just big enough to cook with and sit. If you don't use a groundcloth, unzip the door of your tent and cook in the vestibule. I haven't tried these out yet, but that's what I would do.