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Wags
05-16-2008, 00:04
ok i've already pulled 4 ticks off me this season (not to mention the 100's of 'ghost ticks' i feel on me from teh time i pull 1 off until the next shower i take) so i'm gonna get some of this stuff but have a few questions...

#1 do you buy the spray on stuff or concentrate? is there a more effective approach one way or another?

#2 i've read that while it kills bugs, it is also very toxic to fish and frogs. i'd rather not kill those guys, especially when landscaping and working in ponds around expensive fish and good for teh ecology frogs. once dried into the fabric, will it have to come in contact w/ the fish/frogs to kill them or will my clothes/shoes in the water trigger some badness?

#3 do you guys bother coating your tent/fly/footprint/pack with it? is it worth it and do i need to worry about damaging my gear?

thanks

Bob S
05-16-2008, 00:24
I use the spray, I’ve been using it for several years with great results. I can’t remember a single bug bite through my clothes since I started using it.

I’ve never used the kind you mix up and dip your clothes in so I can’t say how it works.


I do spray my tent with it and it has never caused a problem. I always seem to get spiders in between the tent and the rain fly on the top of the tent. And a few always seemed to find a way into the tent. I started spraying it around the base of the tent and around the door. Since doing this no spiders have made it into the tent and no spiders in the area between the tent and rain fly. I have a small tarp I put on the ground right outside the tent door, I notice dead spiders on it in the morning (that were not there before I sprayed the tent) since spraying the tent with Permethrin.

Can’t say how it works in relation to fish, don’t really care as I’m not going to go swimming with my clothes on.



I’m sold on the stuff.

Bear Cables
05-16-2008, 00:26
I use the spray, Iíve been using it for several years with great results. I canít remember a single bug bite through my clothes since I started using it.

Iíve never used the kind you mix up and dip your clothes in so I canít say how it works.


I do spray my tent with it and it has never caused a problem. I always seem to get spiders in between the tent and the rain fly on the top of the tent. And a few always seemed to find a way into the tent. I started spraying it around the base of the tent and around the door. Since doing this no spiders have made it into the tent and no spiders in the area between the tent and rain fly. I have a small tarp I put on the ground right outside the tent door, I notice dead spiders on it in the morning (that were not there before I sprayed the tent) since spraying the tent with Permethrin.

Canít say how it works in relation to fish, donít really care as Iím not going to go swimming with my clothes on.



Iím sold on the stuff.

where do you purchase it?

Bob S
05-16-2008, 00:30
where do you purchase it?


Wal-Mart $3.00 a can, in the camping section. But most stores that sell outdoor stuff have it.


I also use it at home, I have a window in the kitchen that spiders always build a web on and when looking out I would see debris and dead bugs in the window that was caught in the web. I use to knock it down all the time to only have it reappear the next night. I now spray the window frame on the outside and the spiders donít seem to have any interest in the window any more. It last for over a month on the window frame.

Bare Bear
05-16-2008, 00:32
You could just try living with the spiders as they are eating a lot of bugs for you.

Bob S
05-16-2008, 00:35
You could just try living with the spiders as they are eating a lot of bugs for you.
I donít want to live with them in my tent, I donít want to look at the web full of junk every day as I look out the window. So I use it to convince the spiders to go someplace else.


If you donít want to use it, donít.

SweetAss03
05-16-2008, 00:42
Bob S. Sitting here laughing my A@@ off. Right to the point, my kind of guy.

SweetAss

LIhikers
05-16-2008, 07:58
My wife and I have used both the spray on and concentrate type permethrin. The spray is defenitley more convenient to use but it seems to me that it works better when our clothes are dippped in a solution of the stuff and then let to dry before use. I've never tried it on any part of the tent so I can't speak to what it might or might not do in that situation. Also, I have no idea what it might do to fish or frogs.

orangebug
05-16-2008, 08:09
It is toxic to waterlife. It makes sense to spray the stuff on the exterior of clothing, at least to be economical in use. Our skin/sweat/enzymes degrade permethrin, hence it is useless applied to skin.

follow the instructions and it will be safe and effective without creating an environmental hazard.

chili36
05-19-2008, 22:23
It relative hazard to fish is minimal unless you overspray a holding area (koi pond, etc).

We have used it to fog restaurants (suffering from a small fly problem) that had multiple fish tanks. You just need to make sure it doesn't settle on the water. IMHO, it will not leach off your clothes in sufficient quantities to harm fish in the great outdoors unless, of course, you saturate your clothes with it then soak them in a slow moving or small still body of water.

Get the brand Permanone. Spray your boots and gaiters. Use it on you tent. I haven't had to apply it any more than once per year and I have been extremely happy witht he results.

sofaking
05-19-2008, 22:26
My wife and I have used both the spray on and concentrate type permethrin. Also, I have no idea what it might do to fish or frogs.
i've never been bothered by fish or frog bites...but i'll definitely be on the look out for 'em now. do they itch, or are they just slimy?

earlylight
05-19-2008, 22:30
I just sprayed Sawyer permethrin on a lot of my clothes to keep the black flies off in Vermont. I've had good luck with Buzz off pants in Africa which are permethrin dipped. The sawyer DIY spray is supposed to last 6 washings.

valleyfire
05-19-2008, 22:43
What are Buzz off pants?

4eyedbuzzard
05-19-2008, 22:49
I use the spray on Permanone on boots, socks, and all clothing except rain gear. They say 3 oz (half a can) will do an entire "outfit". I'm not sure how they measure. I get an entire set of clothes - shoe uppers, 2 pair socks, boxers, tee shirt, long sleeve shirt, pants, base layer, and hat out of a full can(6 - 7 oz?). Some people do their sleeping bags and tent perimenter walls, I don't bother as we aren't as tick infested here in northern NH as other places. Then I use Sawyer's Broad Spectrum(formerly Sawyers Gold) on exposed skin and skin above socks, inside shirt cuffs, collar etc. It's DEET + R-326 fly repellent + MGK264 synergist(helps the DEET and R-326 work better). Seems to keep the black flys and bigger deer flys and the like from biting both in the woods and on the golf course better than just DEET. They still buzz around you, but they don't light on you and bite.

4eyedbuzzard
05-19-2008, 22:55
What are Buzz off pants?

http://www.buzzoff.com/CMSContent/WhereToBuy-WhereToBuy.aspx

A trade name of clothing treatment sold with permetrin already applied in the fabric. Offered in clothing by Exofficio(usually associated with the Buzz off pants), LLBean, REI, and others. The factory treatment is deep/bonded in the fibers supposedly and lasts though lots of washings (70) compared to the DIY spray on which only lasts a few washings. You can get pants, shirts, socks, pretty much anything with the factory permethrin bonded in. I got some LL Bean merino socks with it in. Same price as without. The girl at the store tried to talk me out of them because they "had poison" in them that would be in contact with my skin and that it kills bees. I told her my socks would probably wind up toxic anyway, that I wouldn't put them near a beehive, and I'd take my chances with a permetrin reaction vs lyme disease.

Montego
05-19-2008, 23:04
Bought the Sawyer's Permethrin spray from BassPro and sprayed not only my clothes (socks, wind pants, shorts, short and long sleeve shirt, hat, head net, and shoes) but also the netting on my SD Clip Flashlight tent and the entrance part of the rain fly. Though I was only on the AT for about a week, no ticks/fly/skeeter bites. Also didn't seem to harm any of the fabrics.

While out there, I did help a couple of other hikers, that did not use Pemethrin, to pull ticks off them, so the ticks were definately out and feeding. I'm sold.

take-a-knee
05-19-2008, 23:12
Bought the Sawyer's Permethrin spray from BassPro and sprayed not only my clothes (socks, wind pants, shorts, short and long sleeve shirt, hat, head net, and shoes) but also the netting on my SD Clip Flashlight tent and the entrance part of the rain fly. Though I was only on the AT for about a week, no ticks/fly/skeeter bites. Also didn't seem to harm any of the fabrics.

While out there, I did help a couple of other hikers, that did not use Pemethrin, to pull ticks off them, so the ticks were definately out and feeding. I'm sold.

That stuff works.

Tinker
05-19-2008, 23:21
That stuff works.
Yup! Like a charm!

Wags
05-19-2008, 23:23
thanks guys. exactly the info i wanted to hear

4eyedbuzzard
05-19-2008, 23:32
That stuff works.

Usually I'm not real "brand name" oriented, but Sawyer stuff seems to be the real deal. A lot of good science that actually works - the time/protein release DEET, fly repellent, etc.

Bob S
05-19-2008, 23:51
I've been really happy with Sawyer stuff also, I've been using it for 4-years.