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glacier48
05-16-2008, 10:17
Being new to this web site and the life of a thru hiker-tell me what exactly is Trail Days?
:sun
Glacier

Freeleo
05-16-2008, 10:26
http://www.traildays.us/

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-16-2008, 10:30
It is a festival held every year on the weekend after mother's day in Damascus, VA (http://www.traildays.us/). It was started by the town to honor the hikers, but is now more of a drunken / drugged-out party in the tent city and a craft festive for the town.

There are some noteworthy things available at Trail Days: Gear vendors showing off equipment, people with their homemade gear, some nice presentations (most repeat year after year so if you've already seen them....), and the hiker parade (a combo of a parade and a huge water fight between the on-lookers and those in the parade). The hiker talent show and the homemade gear contest are also interesting.

Freeleo
05-16-2008, 10:36
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k165/jeffhartman1019/IMGP0450.jpg

Red Hat
05-16-2008, 12:54
The best part is that it is a hiker reunion. Every year I get to see my long lost hiking buddies. Sure I love the vendors, the talent show, and the parade, but my favorite part is getting together with old friends. Sorry to miss it this year, but I'm saving for my hike in July!

Lilred
05-16-2008, 22:24
I'm sorry to miss it too, but I'm with Red Hat, since I'm leaving for my section in ONE WEEK!! Don't let Dino's description fool you. Tent city was not a drunken drug fest. At least not until after dark..... ;) I stayed in Tent city, and most everyone was very nice. I had a great time in Tent city, and would stay there again. The drum circle is something to behold, most definately a master's thesis waiting to happen.

Tennessee Viking
05-17-2008, 01:57
Being new to this web site and the life of a thru hiker-tell me what exactly is Trail Days?
:sun
Glacier
AT-stock
Hiker-polooza
Crowds of invading hikers coming together in one small mountain town

You got your hiking vendors displaying new gear and books. Games. Food (check out the free meals). First Aid. Showers. Alumni meeting the current class. Socializing with friends and old classmates. Town traditions. Water balloons. Parades. Taking a break from the trail and relax.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-17-2008, 07:02
From what I'm hearing from people who are at this year's trail day, many of the gear vendors aren't coming this year. The town is charging the gear vendors a lot more than the craft vendors for space this year - guess the gear vendors don't like being milked and opted out. There has been talk in the past few years about doing a mini-Ruck in one of the small towns within a reasonable drive of Damascus and leaving the tent city to the non-hiking party animals that now show up every year and Billville. Maybe it is time we got serious about putting this together and gave the vendors another venue to display their wares.

I prefer to go to the Gathering and Rucks to socialize with other hikers... nicer environment and more about hiking knowledge than about partying. I don't mind a good party, but there is nothing good about the level of partying in the tent city - it isn't all that uncommon to see people get so wasted they are barfing, peeing on themselves, etc.... and a local teen ended up in the hospital with alcohol poisoning a couple of years ago after being given moonshine.

Lone Wolf
05-17-2008, 07:06
From what I'm hearing from people who are at this year's trail day, many of the gear vendors aren't coming this year. The town is changing the gear vendors a lot more than the craft vendors for space this year - guess the gear vendors don't like being milked and opted out. There has been talk in the past few years about doing a mini-Ruck in one of the small towns within a reasonable drive of Damascus and leaving the tent city to the non-hiking party animals that now show up every year and Billville. Maybe it is time we got serious about putting this together and gave the vendors another venue to display their wares.

I prefer to go to the Gathering and Rucks to socialize with other hikers... nicer environment and more about hiking knowledge than about partying. I don't mind a good party, but there is nothing good about the level of partying in the tent city - it isn't all that uncommon to see people get so wasted they are barfing, peeing on themselves, etc.... and a local teen ended up in the hospital with alcohol poisoning a couple of years ago after being given moonshine.
all the gear vendors are here and accounted for. they're at the campground.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-17-2008, 07:23
all the gear vendors are here and accounted for. they're at the campground.Are they being charged out the wazoo to set up? And are visitors being charged $5 to enter the campground?

Lone Wolf
05-17-2008, 07:34
Are they being charged out the wazoo to set up? And are visitors being charged $5 to enter the campground?

yes.yes

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-17-2008, 08:03
That being the case maybe another venue is needed.

There are few areas that look promising for camping off highway 91 between Damascus and Glade Springs. Glade Spring has more eateries and food stores for resupply than Damascus and Abingdon is a short drive for those needing more services. Glade Spring also has a sizable city park - Leo "Muscle" Sholes Memorial Park - that could likely host vendors and a nearby middle school that could provide indoor venues for classes, presentations, etc.

Lone Wolf
05-17-2008, 08:59
That being the case maybe another venue is needed.

nah. fine where it is

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-17-2008, 09:10
Sorry, LW, but not everyone thinks so. Trail Days has moved away from being a hiker event to being a craft fair with hikers as a sideline and a huge regional party. A Trail Days Ruck could be about hikers and hiking and Damascus could still have their craft fair and huge party.

Lilred
05-17-2008, 09:44
Trail days is fine where it is. There is no need to start yet another hiker gathering. What year did you go to trail days dino? And so what if they charge a minimal fee to people, the town could use the money and it wouldn't stop me from going, even at $10 bucks a head. Anyways Dino, trail days is not just for hikers, it is also for bikers. Trail days is for those 'non-hikers' you refer to just as much as it is for hikers. Hikers have just taken over.

Jester2000
05-17-2008, 11:15
Party animals AND Billville?!?

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-17-2008, 12:04
Party animals AND Billville?!?Good point - non-Billville and Billville party animals

Red Hat
05-17-2008, 13:59
Last year I camped at the campground in the "quiet area" down by the stream. It was beautiful! I slept very well, not bothered at all by any noise from the campfire group. I love it and wish I were there again this year.... Y'all have fun...

Mother's Finest
05-17-2008, 15:34
I heard there was some trouble with consumption of

"untaxed liquor"

peace
mf

Bare Bear
05-17-2008, 16:31
What is it like at the Iron Horse Campground? I've been to three TD and l won't be there this year but I had considered the Iron Horse.

Local
05-17-2008, 16:32
That being the case maybe another venue is needed.

There are few areas that look promising for camping off highway 91 between Damascus and Glade Springs. .........

Dino, your intentions are good, and I agree we have some major problems with the conduct of Trail Days. Most of the problems originate in the lack of hiker participation with the group that puts Trail Days together. We hope this will change, and that a greater emphasis on the hiker community will evolve.

As far as moving the event to Glade or some other nearby community, I've grown up here and know the culture of these towns. It will be a cold day in hell before a hiker parade such as took place in Damascus a few hours ago (see photos) could comfortably happen in any other nearby town.

Cedar Tree
05-17-2008, 19:23
From what I'm hearing from people who are at this year's trail day, many of the gear vendors aren't coming this year. The town is charging the gear vendors a lot more than the craft vendors for space this year - guess the gear vendors don't like being milked and opted out. There has been talk in the past few years about doing a mini-Ruck in one of the small towns within a reasonable drive of Damascus and leaving the tent city to the non-hiking party animals that now show up every year and Billville. Maybe it is time we got serious about putting this together and gave the vendors another venue to display their wares.


all the gear vendors are here and accounted for. they're at the campground.

I just returned from Trail Days, and I must say it was a very good one for me. I sold 13 packas, and my previous high for TD was 6. However, with respect to FD's post about the vendors being dissatisfied, she is absolutely correct. As a vendor for 6 straight years, I feel I can comment on this with some authority. My first vendor fee in 02 was $80. In 6 years it has more than tripled to $250 this year. Some long time Trails Days cottage industry vendors (I won't name names) and I discussed this Thursday night after we had all set up. Most of us don't make money at TD. But, we get exposure for our products, and we are hikers, so we enjoy seeing all our friends again too.

I don't know what the answer is really, other than reducing the vendor fees for us small time cottage industry folks, especially long term people. I don't think FD's idea about a separate vendor area is the answer.

As for Lone Wolf's observation, I didn't go to the campground so maybe these vendors were there. But with regards to the main vendor area, where was Mast Outfitters? They took up several slots every year I've been there. How about Equinox? I know Equinox changed hands, but still a regular not there. Moonbow, Brasslite, Warbonnet, .... lots of cottage folk have bowed out over recent years. I must be bad luck because it seems every year a new vendor is next to me who does not come back. Remember the quickflip? or that guy with the big pickup truck rack thing? I guess that curse is over though, since I was between Vargo and 6Moons this year.

Great Trail Days for me, I really enjoyed selling Packas and seeing friends.
Cedar Tree

Roland
05-17-2008, 19:57
~ As a vendor for 6 straight years, I feel I can comment on this with some authority. My first vendor fee in 02 was $80. In 6 years it has more than tripled to $250 this year. ~

In May 2002, unleaded gasoline sold for 68 cents/gal. Today, I paid 5-1/2 times as much.

I wish it had only tripled in price, like the Trail Days vendor fee.

Different perspective....

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 20:39
In May 2002, unleaded gasoline sold for 68 cents/gal. Today, I paid 5-1/2 times as much.

I wish it had only tripled in price, like the Trail Days vendor fee.

Different perspective....

Sure, but did the cost of sidewalk space triple? :-?

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-17-2008, 20:44
Cedar Tree, thanks for saying what I have also been hearing.

Local, what is the reasoning for charging gear vendors more than craft vendors? Is the town trying convert Trail Days to a craft fair or is it simply a case of the committee thinking that the vendors will continue to attend and pay whatever is asked? What Cedar Tree is saying is exactly what I have heard from vendors that have decided not to come back.

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 20:54
Cedar Tree, thanks for saying what I have also been hearing.

Local, what is the reasoning for charging gear vendors more than craft vendors? Is the town trying convert Trail Days to a craft fair or is it simply a case of the committee thinking that the vendors will continue to attend and pay whatever is asked? What Cedar Tree is saying is exactly what I have heard from vendors that have decided not to come back.

I think you answered your own question. The cottage industry folks are not vendors, they are crafts people.

River Runner
05-17-2008, 21:20
In May 2002, unleaded gasoline sold for 68 cents/gal. Today, I paid 5-1/2 times as much.

I wish it had only tripled in price, like the Trail Days vendor fee.

Different perspective....

Tripling in 6 years seem rather excessive.

So the vendors now have to pay 5 1/2 times as much for the gas to get there, and 3 times as much for the space. How would we hikers feel if they were charging us 3 times as much for a pack or tent than they did in 2002?

sofaking
05-17-2008, 21:21
where was gas $0.68 ?

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 21:22
Tripling in 6 years seem rather excessive.

So the vendors now have to pay 5 1/2 times as much for the gas to get there, and 3 times as much for the space. How would we hikers feel if they were charging us 3 times as much for a pack or tent than they did in 2002?

I think we will be paying triple the shipping soon enough.

River Runner
05-17-2008, 21:22
hiker parade such as took place in Damascus a few hours ago (see photos)

Looks like a fun parade.

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 21:24
Who's the poster boy standing next to Jester? ;)

River Runner
05-17-2008, 21:24
I think we will be paying triple the shipping soon enough.

Good point Tin Man. And the cottage manufacturers will be paying triple the shipping to get their materials. :(

Looks like there are going to have to be some increases in gear prices. :(

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 21:31
Good point Tin Man. And the cottage manufacturers will be paying triple the shipping to get their materials. :(

Looks like there are going to have to be some increases in gear prices. :(

What really drives me nuts: In the good old days, the mail truck drove down the street delivering mail and packages. Now there are many different services following each other down the same streets. Many days, my neighbor has UPS delivery, Fedex delivery, then there comes the mail man. What a frigging waste.

Roland
05-17-2008, 21:40
Sure, but did the cost of sidewalk space triple? :-?

There are many costs associated with Trail Days. If the players don't help defray the costs, how long would the tax payers of this tiny community continue to support this event?

Roland
05-17-2008, 21:49
where was gas $0.68 ?

Sounds awful low, doesn't it? I found the information, here. (http://spectrumcommodities.com/education/commodity/hu.html)

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 21:53
There are many costs associated with Trail Days. If the players don't help defray the costs, how long would the tax payers of this tiny community continue to support this event?

By "sidewalk space", I did mean the ALL the costs of supporting Trail Days. It doesn't sound reasonable that all the costs have tripled, but maybe they have. Reminds me of the whining about the route and maintenance of the trail. If you don't know, shut yer yap. I don't know, so I will shut mine.

TIDE-HSV
05-17-2008, 22:39
Gas prices at this time in 2002 were roughly twice the $.68 you claim. Is your memory really that bad? When were you born, anyway?

Tin Man
05-17-2008, 22:44
Gas prices at this time in 2002 were roughly twice the $.68 you claim. Is your memory really that bad? When were you born, anyway?

Easy there fella. Don't think he meant no harm.

Today, I spent enough on gas to fill my lawnmower that I it used to cost me to fill my car when it was bone dry. $4.05 at the pump today. What's the price in your area?

TIDE-HSV
05-18-2008, 00:06
Not that high. It's around $3.60-3.80, depending on where you buy. Gas has always been higher where you are. I've lived in NYC and I have a degree from NYU, so I know the price differential in that area. I've just been trying to remember when Gas was actually $.68. Probably early '70s...

Tin Man
05-18-2008, 00:15
Not that high. It's around $3.60-3.80, depending on where you buy. Gas has always been higher where you are. I've lived in NYC and I have a degree from NYU, so I know the price differential in that area. I've just been trying to remember when Gas was actually $.68. Probably early '70s...

I distinctly recall paying .29 cents a gallon in Delaware in '73.

TIDE-HSV
05-18-2008, 00:16
Well, 1978 was the last time gas prices were $.68. However, that's in raw numbers, not adjusted for inflation. Adjusted for inflation to today's dollar, the last time gas was $.68 would be the 1930s, or earlier...

Jimmers
05-18-2008, 00:17
Gas prices at this time in 2002 were roughly twice the $.68 you claim. Is your memory really that bad? When were you born, anyway?

I think he's confused by the commodities website. That 68 cents doesn't include federal and state taxes, which would push it up to about $1.50 a gallon. Ah, the good old days.:D

Anyway, it does seem kind of odd for the vendor costs to go up so quickly. Has the cost of Traildays gone up that much for the town?

Tin Man
05-18-2008, 00:26
Has the cost of Traildays gone up that much for the town?


That's the question. I am guessing the Police Officers' salaries haven't, so unless they need a lot more police, porta john's, etc., they either were losing money in the past or are milking it now.

TIDE-HSV
05-18-2008, 00:48
The last time gas was $.29 was 1950, which would be around $2.20, adjusted for today's dollar. By 1975, it had edged up only to $.53 or so, but that was still $1.92 in present dollars. By 1980, it had jumped to $1.13, or $2.68 today. The raw numbers are inaccurate, if inflation is not adjusted for. There are many web pages with average prices and COL adjustments...

TIDE-HSV
05-18-2008, 00:53
they either were losing money in the past or are milking it now

Given the multiple, I'd think the answer was obvious...

Tin Man
05-18-2008, 01:03
Given the multiple, I'd think the answer was obvious...

You're assuming too much there IMO. Many towns and venues take a loss initially to attract a crowd, then they either get overwhelmed with expenses or greed. To be fair, we really don't have enough information either way.

River Runner
05-18-2008, 01:04
Come to think of it my daughter recalls gas being around $1.29 a gallon when she started driving, which would have been late 2001.

It's been my experience that most towns actually lose money on fairs and festivals. I'm not sure exactly why they sponsor them, but I guess it's sort of a community service? Give the local population something to look forward to doing and a boost to local business?

River Runner
05-18-2008, 01:05
Many towns and venues take a loss initially to attract a crowd,

Looks like we were thinking about the same thing at the same time.

TIDE-HSV
05-18-2008, 01:15
To be fair, we really don't have enough information either way.

True, and it'll all come out in the wash. If they've jacked it up too high too quickly, the market will right itself. If the FD's anecdotes are representative, that process has already begun...

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-18-2008, 08:03
If this were a case of the town taking a loss to attract a crowd, then why were the prices only raised for the gear vendors? And why isn't a fee being charged to enter the main vendor area? This just reeks of milking the hikers and their gear companies - and as TIDE-HSV says, the market will right itself.

MOWGLI
05-18-2008, 08:15
Sounds awful low, doesn't it? I found the information, here. (http://spectrumcommodities.com/education/commodity/hu.html)

No way. No how.

mudhead
05-18-2008, 08:45
Gas was @.80/gal in Maine about six(maybe nine) months before the "dot-com bubble" burst. Whenever that was...

It is all about the price of gas.

Egads
05-18-2008, 09:30
Gas was @.80/gal in Maine about six(maybe nine) months before the "dot-com bubble" burst. Whenever that was...

It is all about the price of gas.

I believe your memory is faulty. I recall gas running up from $1.29 per gallon to around $1.89 per gallon in 2000 and thinking that was high.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-18-2008, 09:49
This source (http://www.randomuseless.info/gasprice/gasprice.html) seems to say the last time gas sold for $.70 to .80 was about 1986.

Lilred
05-18-2008, 09:51
I believe your memory is faulty. I recall gas running up from $1.29 per gallon to around $1.89 per gallon in 2000 and thinking that was high.

I started driving in 1976 and gas was around 90 cents a gallon. No way No how was it 80 cents anywhere in 2000. The dot com bubble hit around the late 1990's

Lilred
05-18-2008, 09:53
This source (http://www.randomuseless.info/gasprice/gasprice.html) seems to say the last time gas sold for $.70 to .80 was about 1986.

and that was in Texas, according to the graph, which I would assume would have lower gas prices anyhow, considering the source.

mudhead
05-18-2008, 10:01
Gas was @.80/gal in Maine about six(maybe nine) months before the "dot-com bubble" burst. Whenever that was...

It is all about the price of gas.

This was also during the start of the Explorer/Firestone fiasco. It was a comfortable ride at $0.79.

Lone Wolf
05-18-2008, 10:58
Good point Tin Man. And the cottage manufacturers will be paying triple the shipping to get their materials. :(

Looks like there are going to have to be some increases in gear prices. :(

how much for a cottage?

Lone Wolf
05-18-2008, 11:00
That's the question. I am guessing the Police Officers' salaries haven't, so unless they need a lot more police, porta john's, etc., they either were losing money in the past or are milking it now.

breakin' even now

Skyline
05-18-2008, 11:10
breakin' even now


I'm glad they're breaking even now, and a shame they were losing $$$ before.

What I don't understand is why the different level of fees for vendors. About the only differentiation that would make sense to me would be to give non-profits a break, and if your only purpose in operating a booth is to help out hikers by repairing gear but not exchanging $$$ (like Leki at the Tent City). Anyone else seeking to sell something should be charged the same fee.

Do you happen to know why gear vendors are in a higher fee class by themselves?

sofaking
05-18-2008, 11:23
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oil_gas/petroleum/info_glance/petroleum.html

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-18-2008, 12:57
breakin' even nowWas this last year's amount? This year's totals can't possibly be in yet.

I'm also interested in knowing why gear vendors are being charged more than others and why the campground is a fee area while the city park is not. Any answers for those questions, LW or Local?

Tin Man
05-18-2008, 13:14
breakin' even now

I suppose that could be considered both good and bad. Good that the town, meaning taxpayers, don't have to shell out. Bad that it means the vendors have to pay so much. Do you have an idea of what percentage of trail days support is volunteer service vs. paid for service?

10-K
05-18-2008, 13:34
I distinctly recall paying .29 cents a gallon in Delaware in '73.

In 1971 I was 10 years old and had a weekend job pumping gas at an American (now BP) gas station. I remember regular leaded being .39 and regular hi-test was .42 per gallon.

ki0eh
05-18-2008, 14:54
Around 1997 I remember paying $.699 at a gas station on I-24 in Georgia (which should narrow down the locale a bit...)

Also having been in many small towns but rarely Damascus and never Trail Days, I'll still hazard a guess on the motivation on gear vs. craft vendor fees: gear = out of town, craft = mostly local :)

wrightsphoto
05-18-2008, 16:52
Had an awesome weekend at Trail Days 08!
Hope to get a few photos uploaded soon.

Peace out!
wrightsphoto

Local
05-18-2008, 17:19
I...... Do you have an idea of what percentage of trail days support is volunteer service vs. paid for service?

Tin Man, Trail Days is mostly a volunteer effort. The town clerk does a huge amount of the work, on her regular salary. Volunteers operate the vendor area, the campground, and the presentations. The primary cost has been law enforcement, which is seldom needed but when it is needed you want it available. Maintenance people from the town work on their regular salaries and also donate a lot of volunteer time. Port-a-Johns are a costly item, as well as the various musical groups.

Over the past two years I've tried to get a Trail Days budget that I could post on the town website I do, www.damascus.org (http://www.damascus.org). So far I haven't been able to get this budget, but I'm going to make another effort the next few weeks to obtain this, and will post it on whiteblaze, or post a link to it here.

TIDE-HSV
05-18-2008, 17:57
That's a noble effort, but it'll just get nitpicked... :D

Local
05-18-2008, 20:25
That's a noble effort, but it'll just get nitpicked... :D


All nitpickers will be asked to volunteer and do something productive. It's always interesting to see what kind of response this request has.

Tin Man
05-18-2008, 21:32
Tin Man, Trail Days is mostly a volunteer effort. The town clerk does a huge amount of the work, on her regular salary. Volunteers operate the vendor area, the campground, and the presentations. The primary cost has been law enforcement, which is seldom needed but when it is needed you want it available. Maintenance people from the town work on their regular salaries and also donate a lot of volunteer time. Port-a-Johns are a costly item, as well as the various musical groups.

Over the past two years I've tried to get a Trail Days budget that I could post on the town website I do, www.damascus.org (http://www.damascus.org). So far I haven't been able to get this budget, but I'm going to make another effort the next few weeks to obtain this, and will post it on whiteblaze, or post a link to it here.

:cool:

But do people really need to know? There just seems a lot of second guessing about the vendor fees from people who don't know what it takes to run Trail Days. I was asking merely to help educate people that it isn't as simple as some may think. Although, there were some good points raised about differentiating major vendors from a lone crafts vendor and the charges for each type.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-18-2008, 21:34
Tin Man, Trail Days is mostly a volunteer effort. The town clerk does a huge amount of the work, on her regular salary. Volunteers operate the vendor area, the campground, and the presentations. The primary cost has been law enforcement, which is seldom needed but when it is needed you want it available. Maintenance people from the town work on their regular salaries and also donate a lot of volunteer time. Port-a-Johns are a costly item, as well as the various musical groups.

Over the past two years I've tried to get a Trail Days budget that I could post on the town website I do, www.damascus.org (http://www.damascus.org). So far I haven't been able to get this budget, but I'm going to make another effort the next few weeks to obtain this, and will post it on whiteblaze, or post a link to it here.Thank you for your efforts, Local.

Crazy Larry #1
05-18-2008, 21:38
In May 2002, unleaded gasoline sold for 68 cents/gal. Today, I paid 5-1/2 times as much.

I wish it had only tripled in price, like the Trail Days vendor fee.

Different perspective....
I don't know where you were buying gas, but I do recall it has been over the dollar mark since the early nineties or earlier.....

sofaking
05-18-2008, 21:41
break down of gasoline prices by year http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/merquery/mer_data.asp?table=T09.04

Crazy Larry #1
05-18-2008, 21:46
I'm glad they're breaking even now, and a shame they were losing $$$ before.

What I don't understand is why the different level of fees for vendors. About the only differentiation that would make sense to me would be to give non-profits a break, and if your only purpose in operating a booth is to help out hikers by repairing gear but not exchanging $$$ (like Leki at the Tent City). Anyone else seeking to sell something should be charged the same fee.

Do you happen to know why gear vendors are in a higher fee class by themselves?
and why didn't you come to see me like you promised......?

Bulldawg
05-18-2008, 21:55
This source (http://www.randomuseless.info/gasprice/gasprice.html) seems to say the last time gas sold for $.70 to .80 was about 1986.

I can remember buying gas here when I was 16 or 17 that ran between .85 to .90 per gallon, that was 1991-1992.

My wife and I were just talking this weekend how much it must suck to be a teenager now. It would take almost what used to be my whole pay check to fill up my Tahoe.

Crazy Larry #1
05-18-2008, 21:58
Well I think the gear reps should never be charged a dime, I'm talking about Allyn Morton and his crew. And I am thinking about writing a letter and presenting it to the committee that oversees TD's outlining why I don't think that they ought to be charged.

Sure they benefit from doing all this free work, why should they not?

And TD's was not all that big this year.

doodah man
05-18-2008, 22:04
I distinctly recall paying .29 cents a gallon in Delaware in '73.

Hey Tin Man,
I was working in an independent (Shamrock) gas station in Denver Colorado in 1971 -> 1974. When I started, I remember our self service regular was 24.9 cents per gallon... I remember because you got pretty much exactly 4 gallons for a buck. (Also, for a point of reference, my 1971 pay started at $1.65/hr) doodah-man

Jim Adams
05-18-2008, 22:06
I can remember buying gas here when I was 16 or 17 that ran between .85 to .90 per gallon, that was 1991-1992.

My wife and I were just talking this weekend how much it must suck to be a teenager now. It would take almost what used to be my whole pay check to fill up my Tahoe.

1970, I was 17 years old working at a Sunoco gas station for $1 / hr.
I was very into drag racing and had a 600 hp car that only got 2 1/2 miles per gallon and I was totally pissed that Sunoco 260 (high test) was 24.9 per gallon!:eek:

geek

Tin Man
05-18-2008, 22:14
Hey Tin Man,
I was working in an independent (Shamrock) gas station in Denver Colorado in 1971 -> 1974. When I started, I remember our self service regular was 24.9 cents per gallon... I remember because you got pretty much exactly 4 gallons for a buck. (Also, for a point of reference, my 1971 pay started at $1.65/hr) doodah-man

I had a summer job at $1.65/hr in '73, when I was paying 29.9 cents a gallon.

http://www.dol.gov/ESA/minwage/chart.htm

hopefulhiker
05-18-2008, 22:23
Gas was $.99/gallon in 2000. I really missed going to Trail Days this year..had some family stuff. But next time I go I think I am going to avoid tent city.. It is too much a party for my old self. Not that I have anything against it.. It sounds like it was a success despite the high prices..

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-18-2008, 22:26
I remember gas being .15/gallon in the early 1960's

Ron Haven
05-18-2008, 22:46
I had a super weekend there with my family.Got to see many hikers who passed thru earlier this year that patronised Franklin and got to see many of my trail friends and nice business owners in Damascus again.Also thanks for all the happy birthday wishes.I celebrated it in Damascus this weekend but it is actually Tuesday May 20th,The big 50 :)

Panzer1
05-18-2008, 22:47
I remember talking to a friend in 2000 who knew everything. He said that if gas ever went up to $3 a gallon that the American people would riot in the streets. People would be glad to get gas for $3 a gallon these days. I guess he was wrong.

Panzer

Jim Adams
05-18-2008, 22:48
From what I'm hearing from people who are at this year's trail day, many of the gear vendors aren't coming this year. The town is charging the gear vendors a lot more than the craft vendors for space this year - guess the gear vendors don't like being milked and opted out. There has been talk in the past few years about doing a mini-Ruck in one of the small towns within a reasonable drive of Damascus and leaving the tent city to the non-hiking party animals that now show up every year and Billville. Maybe it is time we got serious about putting this together and gave the vendors another venue to display their wares.

I prefer to go to the Gathering and Rucks to socialize with other hikers... nicer environment and more about hiking knowledge than about partying. I don't mind a good party, but there is nothing good about the level of partying in the tent city - it isn't all that uncommon to see people get so wasted they are barfing, peeing on themselves, etc.... and a local teen ended up in the hospital with alcohol poisoning a couple of years ago after being given moonshine.

Just got home from TD's and it was GREAT! I've only missed 2 of them since 1990 and this was the best one yet. I got to see more old friends than I ever have. It was peaceful, fun, nonviolent and relaxing. I was camped 50' behind Billville and it was quiet. The loudest place in tent city was actually in the area marked "quiet area" at the end of the camping area.
I have attended a few rucks but they can't replace TD's...to me the knowledge and social environment IS at TD's. I find the rucks to be too "stuffy" most of the time.

Being in EMS, I usually talk to the police every year and they have always acknowledged that the hikers are not the problem but the locals attempting to party in tent city are,ie: see above...LOCAL TEEN, LOCAL MOONSHINE. I have ABSOLUTELY nothing against moonshine,in fact I have quite a fondness for it but the hikers are not out on the trail distilling it.

ALL of the vendors should be charged equally whether they are local or not. The local vendors are already getting a break by not spending tons of money to get there.

Just my opinions.

geek

ki0eh
05-18-2008, 23:37
All nitpickers will be asked to volunteer and do something productive. It's always interesting to see what kind of response this request has.

That's true Trail-wide (and beyond...). The difference is YOUR efforts on TD are widely appreciated Trail-wide (and beyond!) Hope I can get there someday.

wrightsphoto
05-18-2008, 23:48
The loudest place in tent city was actually in the area marked "quiet area" at the end of the camping area.

geek

Sorry we will try to camp in the non quite area next time... :D
The police only came out once.

OregonHiker
05-19-2008, 00:01
I remember gas being .15/gallon in the early 1960's

And what was the minimum wage and average annual income?

River Runner
05-19-2008, 00:13
how much for a cottage?

Depends where you want the cottage LW. :D

River Runner
05-19-2008, 00:25
And what was the minimum wage and average annual income?

Minimum wage - $1 hr/1960; $1.15 hr/Sept 1961; $1.25 hr/Sept 1963; $1.40 hr/Feb 1967; $1.60 hr/Feb 1968.

I didn't readily find information on average annual income.

Jim Adams
05-19-2008, 01:22
Sorry we will try to camp in the non quite area next time... :D
The police only came out once.

The loudness didn't bother me or anyone around me, I just thought that it was funny because there were so many people that began to set up camp near Billville and were warned about how "loud" Billville would get and then moved their camp to the "quiet area". Billville was very laid back for the most part. Tent City was a wonderful place to be for so many reunions.:cool:

geek

camojack
05-19-2008, 01:31
The loudness didn't bother me or anyone around me, I just thought that it was funny because there were so many people that began to set up camp near Billville and were warned about how "loud" Billville would get and then moved their camp to the "quiet area". Billville was very laid back for the most part. Tent City was a wonderful place to be for so many reunions.:cool:
I've noticed that there are always louder places than Billville... :-?

Roots
05-19-2008, 09:27
I've noticed that there are always louder places than Billville... :-?

This was our first TD and we stayed at Billville. We knew what we were getting in to, but didn't care. Honestly, it was not bad at all. You are very right about louder places. The groups behind us and beside us(back in the woods) were much louder and rowdier. We slept just fine. The only time I ever got woken up was Thursday morning, about 5 am, by the group behind us. No biggie...it was all a good.

Wonder
05-19-2008, 09:36
ALL of the vendors should be charged equally whether they are local or not. The local vendors are already getting a break by not spending tons of money to get there.

As far as I could tell....we all did. The other people in the Arts and Crafts area were not all locals, but we all paid the same amount. The price scale was Arts and Crafts, Resale vendor, and food vendor.
With my very, very very small business, I never could have afforded the re-sale vendor spot....so I'm glad that they do this.

Bare Bear
05-19-2008, 09:42
I have been to Trail Days just three times. Once tenting (naive as I was) then once at The Place, then renting a house about four miles from downtown (always up for a short hike right). There are a few things I like, a few I don't like. I still wish I could go every year and help out.
If we the hikers do not donate, maintain, support ATC, support Trail Days; etc then it will all be lost or changed into a unrecognizable mess (like Walt Disney's dream of an Experimental Protype City of Tomorrow that became the Shopping Mall known as EPCOT).
What do you want the future of hiking to be and what are you willing to do about it?

Alligator
05-19-2008, 09:51
...The price scale was Arts and Crafts, Resale vendor, and food vendor.
....What were the rates on these? (Anyone)

Wonder
05-19-2008, 10:06
$75, $250...and then I"m not sure on food
From the research I'm doing.....$75 is not uncommon for Artists.

Alligator
05-19-2008, 10:18
Where was your stand at Wonder? I ended up wandering through several of the jewelery stands shopping for a gift for my wife but I know I didn't see you.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-19-2008, 10:44
The loudness didn't bother me or anyone around me, I just thought that it was funny because there were so many people that began to set up camp near Billville and were warned about how "loud" Billville would get and then moved their camp to the "quiet area". Billville was very laid back for the most part. Tent City was a wonderful place to be for so many reunions.:cool:Billville was not itself this year - I heard they were in mourning because Jester wasn't there.

Gray Blazer
05-19-2008, 10:47
$75, $250...and then I"m not sure on food
From the research I'm doing.....$75 is not uncommon for Artists.

Come do the Archer,FL Yulee Days on June 7th. All booths are free. I'll have a booth selling my AT photos and frames.

Skyline
05-19-2008, 11:03
and why didn't you come to see me like you promised......?


TOW,

Life got in the way. About 1-1/2 weeks ago, I found out I couldn't get the # of days I needed to hike and attend TD, so I cancelled. Only the second time since '94 I've missed it. And I did miss it.

Maybe next time.

doodah man
05-19-2008, 11:15
I remember gas being .15/gallon in the early 1960's

Here is a handy little chart on historical gasoline prices thru 2007.

MudDuck
05-19-2008, 11:37
Well, 1978 was the last time gas prices were $.68. However, that's in raw numbers, not adjusted for inflation. Adjusted for inflation to today's dollar, the last time gas was $.68 would be the 1930s, or earlier...
Gas at Murphy's in Spartanburg SC on I85 was .68 at one point during the summer of 1998. It cost me 13.00 to fill my truck which now cost 75.00. Gas was cheap most of that year. No more than .80 as I recall.

MudDuck
05-19-2008, 11:38
I got gas there at least twice a week there that year.

MudDuck
05-19-2008, 13:20
breakin' even now
Sorry I don't buy it,,I bet the town made 20 if not up wards to 30% of it's annual economical income last week, maybe more. The economical benefit for the town far exceeded by 10's of what the town spent. Not even close. TD has never been nor ever will be nothing but a major economic BOOM for the town. It's the biggest thing they have. Police salaries are there whether TD is in town or not, yes they may have some overtime issues but for what 4 or 5 days? They know it's comming, it's not an extra cost it's anticipated in the budget. Not to mention the tax revenue gained last week alone is probably more than the total Police and fire annual budget. If TD was even close to a "breakin even" venue it would be history. Damascus would be far less than it is without TD and the powers that be know it. Just go into next months city council meeting and suggest TD be done away with. The numbers (people, tax revenues, cost) are there if someone would get them and post them. I for one would be very interested to see them.

The vendor cost is probably on line with other festivals this size ( Tin Man what would you say? And how did you do this year? I know your tent was busy when I was there and everytime I passed it)
I for one am not going to have a "pity party" for gear vendors who's profit margins are in the hundreds of percent per item. And made their entire vendor fee back on the first pack or tent they sold. As far as the "vendors" spending a fortune to get there,,We paid the same gas prices to get there too. I didn't see a single vendor offering me a discount because I bothered to show up even though gas prices were so high. The local, independent artist / yard sale vendor should be given a "local section" of their own for little or free and not be put into the same class. Without them there would be no TD and we would be following the Rainbow clan around.
But the town only breaking even is ludicrous.

Jason of the Woods
05-19-2008, 13:32
I had a great time at Trail Days. We are actually just leaving now. We did name it the "Year of The Cop". It was ridiculous the way that the under-covers and cops hounded or camp like it habored an Escobar. Surely the Feds have much better things to do than harass hikers that are taking a break after hundreds of miles of hiking. I'm soooooo glad that I pay taxes for that SH@T! Last but not least the next time a FED follows my girlfriend to our tent at midnight he or she will get tackled and beat like a dog.;) The local cops and people are awesome just to clarify. I'm gonna go hike now. There are many miles to go!

Tin Man
05-19-2008, 14:42
<snip>

The vendor cost is probably on line with other festivals this size ( Tin Man what would you say? And how did you do this year? I know your tent was busy when I was there and everytime I passed it)
<snip>

I ain't THAT Tin Man, Anti-Gravity Gear George is tinman here and doesn't post much. Good point about the tax revenues, except that sales tax goes to the state, unless Damascus has their own sales tax.

Mother's Finest
05-19-2008, 16:58
I had a great time at Trail Days. We are actually just leaving now. We did name it the "Year of The Cop". It was ridiculous the way that the under-covers and cops hounded or camp like it habored an Escobar. Surely the Feds have much better things to do than harass hikers that are taking a break after hundreds of miles of hiking. I'm soooooo glad that I pay taxes for that SH@T! Last but not least the next time a FED follows my girlfriend to our tent at midnight he or she will get tackled and beat like a dog.;) The local cops and people are awesome just to clarify. I'm gonna go hike now. There are many miles to go!

I would tend to imagine that additional law enforcement was requested by the locals to keep property crimes down.
But law enforcement can be a pursuit of opportunity. LEO, like other groups, talk to each other. "Hey, while you are watching for stealing, keep an eye out on the long hair types....."
Maybe there was not much else to do.

I would be interested in the opinion and experience of real police officers.

peace
mf

Rockhound
05-19-2008, 19:13
From what I'm hearing from people who are at this year's trail day, many of the gear vendors aren't coming this year. The town is charging the gear vendors a lot more than the craft vendors for space this year - guess the gear vendors don't like being milked and opted out. There has been talk in the past few years about doing a mini-Ruck in one of the small towns within a reasonable drive of Damascus and leaving the tent city to the non-hiking party animals that now show up every year and Billville. Maybe it is time we got serious about putting this together and gave the vendors another venue to display their wares.

I prefer to go to the Gathering and Rucks to socialize with other hikers... nicer environment and more about hiking knowledge than about partying. I don't mind a good party, but there is nothing good about the level of partying in the tent city - it isn't all that uncommon to see people get so wasted they are barfing, peeing on themselves, etc.... and a local teen ended up in the hospital with alcohol poisoning a couple of years ago after being given moonshine.
non hiking party animals? what about the hiking party animals? If one doesn't like the party atmosphere in tent city, there are plenty of hostels/bed&breakfasts in town or they could just set up in tent city far enough from the party so they won't be disturbed. Trail Days offers a great deal. gear repair, gear vendors, great speakers, lots of food, showers, entertainment, and a great party if you so choose. yes when you get that many people together in that kind of atmosphere there will be a % that over do it and make asses out of themselves. If you let that ruin your time thats your own fault not theirs. with that said, i don't mind the drunken idiots (I've been one on occassion) what concerns me are the thieves that show up. anyone caught in the act should be subject to a little vigilante justice.

Wonder
05-19-2008, 22:26
here we go....the annual after trail days thread

max patch
05-19-2008, 22:34
what concerns me are the thieves that show up. anyone caught in the act should be subject to a little vigilante justice.

No, they shouldn't, this is America.

Gaiter
05-20-2008, 03:19
I would tend to imagine that additional law enforcement was requested by the locals to keep property crimes down.

Not so much, the problem is the locals more than anything else, after one person had already unsuccessfully complained to the cops about three locals circling around tent city on their bikes, me and that person went up again, after seeing them ride by 3 times, only one cop walked after them, unlike the bunch that were sneaking up on hikers. I don't think a single local I saw down there was of age to drink.

Crazy Larry #1
05-20-2008, 03:37
I know one thing, I am glad it is over............

The Scribe
05-20-2008, 06:59
here we go....the annual after trail days thread

For sure Wonder.
My thanks to the locals who organize it, plan it, then execute it. Then put up with the grief for doing so. I had a GREAT time. Thanks to those who presented. Thanks to the bands. Thanks to the vendors of all types.

It's easy to armchair quarterback. Especially if one wasn't involved in the planning or execution, or even there at all.

Peace.

Was nice to meet you Wonder.

kathmandu
05-20-2008, 07:49
Hi All,

Here is link to a web gallery with some pics of Trail Days 2008 and a link to 4 of the performances from the Talent Show.

http://toddbushphotography.com/traildays/TrailDays2008Web/

Hope all who went had a great time. The energy seemed kind of spread out this year. Intentional by design or happenstance? Either way - what a fantastic place & way to get together with lovers of the trail.

Anybody get any pics of the campfire Jam at Riff-Raff? I was drummin & strummin but not clickin. What a blast. We went from Gilligans Island raps to Queen tunes. Crooning, dancing & mucho laughter!

Next section - north of Roanoke.

Hike On!

Local
05-20-2008, 08:03
Great photos! I'm going to contact Possum Bill, who now does the Trail Days website, and see what his plans are for collecting links to the different 2008 galleries and putting them online. He may be too busy running golf tournaments, however, in which case I'll add as many links as I can find to the town of Damascus website.

Local
05-20-2008, 08:16
Sorry I don't buy it,,I bet the town made 20 if not up wards to 30% of it's annual economical income last week, maybe more. The economical benefit for the town far exceeded by 10's of what the town spent. Not even close. TD has never been nor ever will be nothing but a major economic BOOM for the town. It's the biggest thing they have. .....

Well, not quite. For the first 17 or 18 years of Trail Days the town lost money (speaking of the political entity of the town, not the entire array of merchants). Last year the town made a bit but then some of it disappeared, and later the police chief disappeared, but that's another story. This may be the first year an actual profit is made.

As to the "biggest thing they have," don't forget that Trail Days is great, but the main tourism comes from the seven-month biking season. Our Virginia Creeper Trail (http://www.vacreepertrail.us/) brings in people from all over the country. A bike shop, for example, makes more on Memorial Day than it does the entire week of Trail Days. Our lodging books a year in advance for October. During Trail Days several individual merchants may approach the 30 percent of annual income you suggest, but I haven't heard this. I'll do a scientific survey of Dot's and Food City and Mojoe's and MRO.

But you are correct in that Trail Days is the biggest single event, and we want to make it better. We're encouraging several resident hikers to run for town council or mayor next time around.

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-20-2008, 08:28
If the town made money last year, why couldn't they roll back to the price structure from last year and then raise prices as needed to compensate for inflation and increasing fuel prices / salaries?

Getting several people from the resident hikers on the town council and making LW mayor :D would help considerably with TD, but it also needs to be in the best interest of Damascus. TD is one week a year and the townspeople deserve elected officials that will be sure the other 51 weeks include their best interests as well.

Dances with Mice
05-20-2008, 09:00
Here is link to a web gallery with some pics of Trail Days 2008 and a link to 4 of the performances from the Talent Show.Oh No!! Not the old "Animal Balloon of Death" trick! It's hard to find entertainment like that outside of a frat house.

D'Artagnan
05-20-2008, 09:01
Probably the best thing we could all realize is that we are guests in their town. I'm sure they appreciate our suggestions, but ultimately, they are the ones who have to live there 365 days a year and they probably know what's best for them. Just saying. ;)

Lone Wolf
05-20-2008, 09:15
http://www.tricities.com/tri/news/local/article/council_residents_spar_over_trail_days_police_pres ence/9712/

Grampie
05-20-2008, 09:27
here we go....the annual after trail days thread

This year was the 6 time I have been to TD. I keep comming back because I enjoy being there. Especialy seeing old friends and spending time with hikers.
I think the town does a good job of doing what they do. That's the positive part.
Now the negitive: Through the past, I have seen Trail Days turn from a event participated in by folks who were hiking, had hiked, were maintainers or had other ties to the AT or other simmilar trails. Now a lot of the folks at the campground are just there to drink, party and raise hell in general. I think this is driving a lot of folks away because they see the event changing from what it was to what it is becoming.
The farce of charging everyone $5 for a wrist band didn't fly with a lot of folks. Honest people were entering through the controled gate and paying the fee. Many, many were entering through holes in the fence or just going around the control point, without paying. I guess the original thought was that by selling the wrist bands they would be able to control who entered the camping area, but it didn't work. It was the same deal with paying $15 to park your car. A lot of people were just parking outside the tenting area and walking in, not paying to park.
My next big gripe in that too many people are bringing dogs into the tenting area and letting them run loose. Why do people who come to TD feel that they have to bring a dog? The dogs crap everywhere and it's not being cleaned up.
I think that the folks who run TD have to take a hard look at what is happening and make an effort to stem the downward spirial of the event. If not, the dedicated hikers will stop comming and it will turn into something that it was not attended to be.

Grampie
05-20-2008, 09:37
here we go....the annual after trail days thread

This year was the 6 time I have been to TD. I keep comming back because I enjoy being there. Especialy seeing old friends and spending time with hikers.
I think the town does a good job of doing what they do. That's the positive part.
Now the negitive: Through the past, I have seen Trail Days turn from a event participated in by folks who were hiking, had hiked, were maintainers or had other ties to the AT or other simmilar trails. Now a lot of the folks at the campground are just there to drink, party and raise hell in general. I think this is driving a lot of folks away because they see the event changing from what it was to what it is becoming.
The farce of charging everyone $5 for a wrist band didn't fly with a lot of folks. Honest people were entering through the controled gate and paying the fee. Many, many were entering through holes in the fence or just going around the control point, without paying. I guess the original thought was that by selling the wrist bands they would be able to control who entered the camping area, but it didn't work. It was the same deal with paying $15 to park your car. A lot of people were just parking outside the tenting area and walking in, not paying to park.
My next big gripe in that too many people are bringing dogs into the tenting area and letting them run loose. Why do people who come to TD feel that they have to bring a dog? The dogs crap everywhere and it's not being cleaned up.
I think that the folks who run TD have to take a hard look at what is happening and make an effort to stem the downward spirial of the event. If not, the dedicated hikers will stop comming and it will turn into something that it was not attended to be.

Lone Wolf
05-20-2008, 09:42
The farce of charging everyone $5 for a wrist band didn't fly with a lot of folks. Honest people were entering through the controled gate and paying the fee. Many, many were entering through holes in the fence or just going around the control point, without paying. I guess the original thought was that by selling the wrist bands they would be able to control who entered the camping area, but it didn't work. It was the same deal with paying $15 to park your car. A lot of people were just parking outside the tenting area and walking in, not paying to park.
My next big gripe in that too many people are bringing dogs into the tenting area and letting them run loose. Why do people who come to TD feel that they have to bring a dog? The dogs crap everywhere and it's not being cleaned up.
I think that the folks who run TD have to take a hard look at what is happening and make an effort to stem the downward spirial of the event. If not, the dedicated hikers will stop comming and it will turn into something that it was not attended to be.

i saw lots of people in the campground with no armbands. i suggested years ago to enforce a leash law inside the campground. people camped at other places couldn't get gear repaired by the reps without paying $5. reps should not be in the campground

The Old Fhart
05-20-2008, 09:58
I visited the campground several times to see reps or visit, each time stopping to tell the police what I was doing, and each time they told me to just go in. I never had to buy an armband and I did not sneak in.

Lone Wolf
05-20-2008, 10:55
I visited the campground several times to see reps or visit, each time stopping to tell the police what I was doing, and each time they told me to just go in. I never had to buy an armband and I did not sneak in.

pretty well unorganized

Skyline
05-20-2008, 12:30
http://www.tricities.com/tri/news/local/article/council_residents_spar_over_trail_days_police_pres ence/9712/



Wow, some of Damascus' politicians could teach us on WB a thing or two about fussin' and fightin'. Especially in the Political forum.

Good post.

JDCool1
05-20-2008, 13:05
As an old geezer, I found TD a lot of fun and well worth the expense. More to follow

JDCool1
05-20-2008, 13:22
Dino, I am surprised by what you are saying. I had come to think of you as one of the level heads on this site. What happened? I attended my first Trail Days and found it a fun and interessting event. Sure, there was some of what you mentioned but far from what you describe. Whenever you get a group of hikers together or a group of young and older people on break, you will find drinking and the party atmosphere does encourage some to over do it on a nightly basis. Most of what I witnessed I have seen every weekend on upscale college campuses. In my area of Tent City, I was one of the last to turn in and I was sober. The Bon fires and drum circles were energetic and respectful for the most part.

At the opposite end of the camp from the bon fire a group of highly talented blue grass musicians held an impromptu concert that out lasted the drummers. This only proved that TRail Days in 2008 had something for everyone.

I am concerned that you believe fees for such activities are unfair and uncalled for. The $5 camp fee for the week helped to cover expenses and I am sure it did not cover all of them. The city had brought in many porta-poddies, garbage bins and overtime for city employees and police. who do you believe should pay for all of this. I find it appalling that you believe that hikers should not pay for thier own entertainment. The fees charged to vendors help underwrite these same expenses and can be charged off as advertising and let me assure you they did well and will write thier expenses off. As a tax payer and hiker it is as it should be. I get the idea that some hikers prefer to be "welfare" cases, expecting handouts and discounts all along the trail. I did not have the imprression that you were among them.

I would endorse Trail Days as an event that should be on the agenda of every hiker at least once.

I found it to be a "trail reunion and homecoming", an event that included something for everyone and an introduction to a bunch of fun seeking, life affiming people. The more the merrier.
:sun

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-20-2008, 13:33
JDCool, I'm not opposed to hikers paying fees as long as the fees are in line with the non-hikers are paying. By making the area where the gear vendors set up a fee area while making the area where the craft vendors set up a free area, the town tipped the balance. I absolutely believe in hikers paying their own way, but this seems to be a case of hikers paying their own and non-hikers' way -- and lining the city coffers.

As for the vendors - the big guys no doubt made back the fee, but I dare say a small vendor - especially one introducing a new product to the market like Warbonnet did last year and Cedar Tree (Packa) did some years back and Ron Moak (Six Moon) did before that - not only will not make the costs back, but may choose to introduce their product at the gathering rather than at the event that has come to be known as the place to intro new gear. I know two new designers who did not take their product to TD this year solely because of the exorbitant fee for gear vendors.

StarLyte
05-20-2008, 14:20
Hey y'all,

Had a real good time at Trail Days 08. Typical weather eh?

I'll post pictures later on this evening. We got some real good shots of the Hardcore group at the departure area Sunday morning. These people were ready and adrenaline pumping !!!

I love the new playground at the fairgrounds and watching the children. You could hear the river rushing over the rocks, it was pleasant and I could hear it as I slept in my camper behind the ALDHA booth.

The music and performances at the grandstand were outstanding and the Bluegrass band on Saturday late afternoon was fantastic--I can't seem to find them in the Trail Days program though.

There was not a good showing for the Whiteblaze.net group photo, but we did take a group shot of the folks that did show. I just hope I can post it here without being booted off this site :D

A great job by the city of Damascus, even though I did complain about the tent city fee :rolleyes: Honestly, I never had time to go down there, I was quite busy. Time flew, as always.

It was nice spending time with D'Artagnan, and thanks to CamoJack for volunteering at the ALDHA booth.

Thank you Kevin for helping me and photographing :sun

Jason of the Woods
05-20-2008, 15:51
I figured that would happen. The locals are unbelievably nice. If it weren't for them I would never come back to be quite frank. I spent time getting to know the local cops and they were awesome guys. Hell, they even delivered wood to us and my buddy bought a puppy from one of them. Kermit had the attitude that every cop should have. What ever happened to "protect and serve"? We hiked into Damascus on Wednesday and were there for a week. The first and last night there were the best because the idiot cops hadn't arrived yet. I suggest that they get the other town cops to come back and help next year. Send the Rambos to do something constructive like bust jay-walkers.:D

http://www.tricities.com/tri/news/local/article/council_residents_spar_over_trail_days_police_pres ence/9712/

Jason of the Woods
05-20-2008, 16:44
P.S. It was nice to meet you, Wolf and Wonder! You guys really are lucky to live in such a great town. Keep doing the awesome magic that you do!

camojack
05-20-2008, 18:31
Hey y'all,
Had a real good time at Trail Days 08. Typical weather eh?
I'll post pictures later on this evening. We got some real good shots of the Hardcore group at the departure area Sunday morning. These people were ready and adrenaline pumping !!!
I love the new playground at the fairgrounds and watching the children. You could hear the river rushing over the rocks, it was pleasant and I could hear it as I slept in my camper behind the ALDHA booth.
The music and performances at the grandstand were outstanding and the Bluegrass band on Saturday late afternoon was fantastic--I can't seem to find them in the Trail Days program though.
There was not a good showing for the Whiteblaze.net group photo, but we did take a group shot of the folks that did show. I just hope I can post it here without being booted off this site :D
A great job by the city of Damascus, even though I did complain about the tent city fee :rolleyes: Honestly, I never had time to go down there, I was quite busy. Time flew, as always.
It was nice spending time with D'Artagnan, and thanks to CamoJack for volunteering at the ALDHA booth.
Thank you Kevin for helping me and photographing :sun
It wasn't the first (or second, or third) time I've volunteered to help at the ALDHA booth, but you're quite welcome. :)

gungho
05-20-2008, 20:08
Trail days was unorganized,but really what events aren't really? Their will always be a complaint or someone will always have an opinion of how things could have been better. This was my 1st trail days and will not be my last. I met a lot of great people and developed a lot of great friendships. I did wonder why the vendors were not all in the same location?? I did not mind paying the fees and hopefully the money they did collect will help make next year even better.

warren doyle
05-20-2008, 20:22
From my perspective, Trail Days was very organized. Eleanor did her usual great job organizing the educational programs (with help from JD Cool) and Bunny organized what many considered to be the best Trail Days contra dance yet.

There is a Trail Days beyond the campground, vendors, Dot's, talent show and parade.

musicwoman
05-20-2008, 21:21
I have to admit, I am a non-partying individual who hikes because I seek solace and the trail fulfiils that need. As a consultant for the Dept. of Defense's radar programs, hiking provides a much needed break from the reality of my job. I know what I do protects our servicemen and servicewomen from harm, and the last thing I want is to take my time off to spend it with people whose primary goal is to drink or do drugs until they're oblivious, especially since I usually hike with my sons (17 yrs old and 10 yrs old). So my question is: Is Trail Days for me?

I don't want to come off as some uppity individual, just that partying and so on is not my thing. So, do I go next year or not? It's a question I've asked myself for many months now. I don't have the answer.

warren doyle
05-20-2008, 21:43
I suggest you attend the ALDHA Gathering in Pipestem, WV and Concord University. www.aldha.org (http://www.aldha.org)

sloopjonboswell
05-20-2008, 22:26
i was glad the cops didnt put any drugs in my pockets. and getting deputized made for a good story the next day. thanks damascus. thanks everybody. next year i just know i'll end up leaving tent city for a few hours.
-pike county

hnryclay
05-20-2008, 23:21
I have to admit, I am a non-partying individual who hikes because I seek solace and the trail fulfiils that need. As a consultant for the Dept. of Defense's radar programs, hiking provides a much needed break from the reality of my job. I know what I do protects our servicemen and servicewomen from harm, and the last thing I want is to take my time off to spend it with people whose primary goal is to drink or do drugs until they're oblivious, especially since I usually hike with my sons (17 yrs old and 10 yrs old). So my question is: Is Trail Days for me?

I don't want to come off as some uppity individual, just that partying and so on is not my thing. So, do I go next year or not? It's a question I've asked myself for many months now. I don't have the answer.

I backpack for the same reasons, but without kids. Damascus is a great place, most backpackers are great people, but I don't like trail days.

There are cool gear vendors, you meet some really nice people, hear some good music, I just never have been one for crowds.

The whole counter culture thing is a bit off for me as well, I am just not a hippie. Nothing against hippies but I don't really fit in with them.

All in all there is good and bad at Trail days, like any other large gathering. I have been in Damascus before when it was going on, did not have a bad time, just did not enjoy it.

Frosty
05-21-2008, 01:16
As far as I could tell....we all did. The other people in the Arts and Crafts area were not all locals, but we all paid the same amount. The price scale was Arts and Crafts, Resale vendor, and food vendor.
With my very, very very small business, I never could have afforded the re-sale vendor spot....so I'm glad that they do this.Just want to say that my wife absolutely loved your jewelry. And Gypsy did a fantastic job of making up the gift bag. Thanks to you both!

Wonder
05-21-2008, 08:43
That's sweet.....thank you!

Frolicking Dinosaurs
05-21-2008, 09:06
Wonder, would you post some pics of your jewelry creations in the non-AT forum? I'd love to see them.

Crazy Larry #1
05-21-2008, 09:17
unorganized events make for the best of times........

Creek Dancer
05-21-2008, 09:22
The Kindred Spirit of the Campfire called us together Saturday night. Like a mother gathering up her children, her warmth pulled together friends and strangers alike around her gentle glowing embers and roaring flames.

“You do not all know each other”, she said, “but you will gather around me and be together tonight. My energy will flow through you and bind you to one another. You are, after all, brothers and sisters who share the seed of love for the trail. You will hear string instruments and harmonicas played by brotherly musicians who are strangers to you. The musicians will play and you will sing out “Rockytop” to one another. Their music will make you sway in your camp chairs and you will dance around my sparks. My love will help heal your broken heart over your recent loss. You will not dwell on the things in your life that you do not like; you will take joy in the here and now of me. My smoke will get into your lungs and permeate your clothing so that long after you leave me, you can smell me and remember this time. So gather around me and make this memory together.”

And so we did…and so we did.

Hikerhead
05-21-2008, 20:37
Hey, what about that Moonshadow emceeing the talent show. I thought she did a fantastic job. She deserved a prize herself.

sofaking
05-21-2008, 22:19
The Kindred Spirit of the Campfire called us together Saturday night. Like a mother gathering up her children, her warmth pulled together friends and strangers alike around her gentle glowing embers and roaring flames.

“You do not all know each other”, she said, “but you will gather around me and be together tonight. My energy will flow through you and bind you to one another. You are, after all, brothers and sisters who share the seed of love for the trail. You will hear string instruments and harmonicas played by brotherly musicians who are strangers to you. The musicians will play and you will sing out “Rockytop” to one another. Their music will make you sway in your camp chairs and you will dance around my sparks. My love will help heal your broken heart over your recent loss. You will not dwell on the things in your life that you do not like; you will take joy in the here and now of me. My smoke will get into your lungs and permeate your clothing so that long after you leave me, you can smell me and remember this time. So gather around me and make this memory together.”

And so we did…and so we did.
ha ha ha, that is so gay.

Jim Adams
05-22-2008, 22:17
I have to admit, I am a non-partying individual who hikes because I seek solace and the trail fulfiils that need. As a consultant for the Dept. of Defense's radar programs, hiking provides a much needed break from the reality of my job. I know what I do protects our servicemen and servicewomen from harm, and the last thing I want is to take my time off to spend it with people whose primary goal is to drink or do drugs until they're oblivious, especially since I usually hike with my sons (17 yrs old and 10 yrs old). So my question is: Is Trail Days for me?

I don't want to come off as some uppity individual, just that partying and so on is not my thing. So, do I go next year or not? It's a question I've asked myself for many months now. I don't have the answer.

Musicwoman,

YES, go to Trail Days.
It is a large gathering of a very diverse group of people who all have the common enjoyment of hiking.
I love to sit and drink whiskey with my friends that I haven't seen for years.
There is partying. There are local crafts. There are gear vendors. There are lectures. There are shows. There is a parade. There is a talent show. There is a great outfitters. There is good food. There are great local people who treat you as family.
YES, go to Trail Days.
Take a look for yourself and see if you like it. It's only 2 days of your life but it may change you forever...be it good or bad...but you are the only one that can answer your question.:-?

geek

wrightsphoto
05-23-2008, 09:44
Musicwoman,

YES, go to Trail Days.
It is a large gathering of a very diverse group of people who all have the common enjoyment of hiking.
I love to sit and drink whiskey with my friends that I haven't seen for years.
There is partying. There are local crafts. There are gear vendors. There are lectures. There are shows. There is a parade. There is a talent show. There is a great outfitters. There is good food. There are great local people who treat you as family.
YES, go to Trail Days.
Take a look for yourself and see if you like it. It's only 2 days of your life but it may change you forever...be it good or bad...but you are the only one that can answer your question.:-?

geek

Ditto what geek said...
But yes you should go! There's plenty of room there away from the party's to get some piece and quite. And there's so much more to do!
This year was my first and I hope I can make it every year!

peace out!
wrightsphoto

Creek Dancer
05-23-2008, 09:53
Bite me.



ha ha ha, that is so gay.

StarLyte
05-23-2008, 10:01
Just updated the photo gallery with the last of the Trail Days photos.

click here (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/browseimages.php?do=member&imageuser=271)

camojack
05-23-2008, 13:53
Just updated the photo gallery with the last of the Trail Days photos.

click here (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/browseimages.php?do=member&imageuser=271)
Lucky the camera didn't break on a few o' those... ;)

Dances with Mice
05-23-2008, 14:00
Just updated the photo gallery with the last of the Trail Days photos. Great photo of Gene Espy.

SawnieRobertson
05-24-2008, 12:07
Have y'all heard grumbling about the way vendors (and campers) have been treated at Trail Days? I was wondering, if they have had enough of us, if Tah Dah! should be moved up to Pearisburg, which obviously needs us. Dairy Queen, anyone?--Kinnickinic

Jack Tarlin
05-24-2008, 13:33
I heard no grumbling at all, except maybe from the folks who were arrested.

If you know of anyone who was "mistreated" at Trail Days, you might wanna provide details.

Or retract your last comment.

Everyone I dealt with in Damascus, either from the town, or working with law enforcement, was friendly, capable, helpful, and professional.

So what exactly are you talking about?

Jason of the Woods
05-24-2008, 14:03
Dude, they totally followed my girlfriend to the tent at like midnight and did not announce themselves as the police even when asked. Even worse they had to walk through a grouping of 40 or so tents that belonged to us so we knew they didn't belong. Where I come from that is crossing the line. I guess that I'm lucky that we just spotlighted them and I didn't tackle his ass for looking as if he was about to attack my girl. If that's not going too far then I guess it's different there. I would like to say that the Damascus PD was awesome. I would say that I made a couple of new friends there.
I heard no grumbling at all, except maybe from the folks who were arrested.

If you know of anyone who was "mistreated" at Trail Days, you might wanna provide details.

Or retract your last comment.

Everyone I dealt with in Damascus, either from the town, or working with law enforcement, was friendly, capable, helpful, and professional.

So what exactly are you talking about?

Jack Tarlin
05-24-2008, 14:16
Um, with no disrespect whatsoever, WHY were they following her?

Was she doing anything wrong or questionably legal?

And good thing you elected not to tackle these folks, or you'd probably still be in a box somewhere.

Oh, and by the way, plainsclothes police officers are NOT required to identify themselves as law enforcement people. This is a frequently heard Trail myth that I've encountered myself, i.e. someone will light up in front of me, ask me if I'm a cop (I get this a lot as I always turn down offered drugs), whereupon the young Perry Mason willsmugly say something to the effect of "Well, you can't touch me now since I asked you if you were a cop and you didn't identify yourself!!"

This is a frequent myth. Plains-clothes undercover officers are just that.....plainly clad and undercover. They are under no obligation whatsoever to advertise or tell other people what they do for a living.

And to be perfectly honest, this practice doesn't bother anyone......except people who are breaking the law. :rolleyes:

rafe
05-24-2008, 14:28
And to be perfectly honest, this practice doesn't bother anyone......except people who are breaking the law. :rolleyes:

So decent, law-abiding citizens ought not be concerned with invasions of privacy? Or with public resources wasted on enforcement of dumb laws against victimless crimes?

You got your clear cutting, your acid rain, your mountain-top removal, decaying dams, despoiled rivers, oil spills... but g*d forbid some smelly long haired hikers share a doob in the woods.

I wonder how many narcs I've met on the AT? :confused:

Tin Man
05-24-2008, 14:43
So decent, law-abiding citizens ought not be concerned with invasions of privacy? Or with public resources wasted on enforcement of dumb laws against victimless crimes?

You got your clear cutting, your acid rain, your mountain-top removal, decaying dams, despoiled rivers, oil spills... but g*d forbid some smelly long haired hikers share a doob in the woods.

I wonder how many narcs I've met on the AT? :confused:

If you have an issue with the law, talk to the lawmakers. LEOs are just doing their job as outlined by the law, leave 'em be.

Regarding "victimless crimes", I assume you are referring to home grown doobs or whatever as opposed to those that go through the notorious drug cartels and importing gangs. :rolleyes:

Jason of the Woods
05-24-2008, 15:15
Thank you! She was doing nothing out of the ordinary unless putting on a jacket because it was cold. And I have a prescription for what I smoke due to back pain so if they had a problem with me I would have been more than happy to provide that to them. It just felt a lot more like Germay in the 30s than Trail Days in 2008. I and a lot of my friends are seriously considering not going back and that's just sad. I had no issues in Hot Springs. They would love to have the money that TDs brings in I'm sure. We were much more welcomed there.....

My theory about Narc is simple. F*^&k them. If they want to bust a hiker with a little weed then so be it. In my opinion that is about the biggest waste of time and money there is. It's ok for folks to be drunken idiots because the government makes money from that......BS! It is unbelievable that they wasted my tax money to send FEDS into TD in the first place. They didn't bust 1 person with anything more than a jar. Not to mention they are really idiots if they think that hikers narc each other out.

So decent, law-abiding citizens ought not be concerned with invasions of privacy? Or with public resources wasted on enforcement of dumb laws against victimless crimes?

You got your clear cutting, your acid rain, your mountain-top removal, decaying dams, despoiled rivers, oil spills... but g*d forbid some smelly long haired hikers share a doob in the woods.

I wonder how many narcs I've met on the AT? :confused:

Jason of the Woods
05-24-2008, 15:17
Dude, Government propaganda BS. Maybe you meant to say the CIA??
If you have an issue with the law, talk to the lawmakers. LEOs are just doing their job as outlined by the law, leave 'em be.

Regarding "victimless crimes", I assume you are referring to home grown doobs or whatever as opposed to those that go through the notorious drug cartels and importing gangs. :rolleyes:

saimyoji
05-24-2008, 16:56
It just felt a lot more like Germay in the 30s than Trail Days in 2008.

And by invoking goodwin's law, you lose. congrats. :cool:

Jack Tarlin
05-24-2008, 18:12
Um, note to Jason:

Do you really know anything about Germany in the thirties or what took place then?

Invoking Nazi Germany because you seem to think that people somehow have an inherent right to break laws (especially those relating to illegal narcotics) is really one of the dumber things that's been said here in awhile.

Your comparison was vulgar and ignorant.

If you wanna cry about your God-given right to get stoned wherever you want, well, that's your right, but please don't invoke Nazi Germany when you do so. It doesn't help your argument.

Tin Man
05-24-2008, 21:40
And by invoking goodwin's law, you lose. congrats. :cool:



If you wanna cry about your God-given right to get stoned wherever you want, well, that's your right, but please don't invoke Nazi Germany when you do so. It doesn't help your argument.

He's got nothing and he lost long ago. Time to move on.

winger
05-24-2008, 21:46
"And I have a prescription for what I smoke due to back pain so if they had a problem with me I would have been more than happy to provide that to them. "


OH REALLY??? I would be very interested in knowing what state allows for you medicinal marijuana to be smoked in Virginia!

Gray Blazer
05-24-2008, 22:15
Um, note to Jason:

Do you really know anything about Germany in the thirties or what took place then?



A lot of hippys believe in reincarnation. Maybe he was there.

Flush2wice
05-24-2008, 22:45
Jason- first of all there were no "feds" at trail days. The plainclothes guys were VA ABC officers. Secondly- you and your friends set up your tents on public property, so anyone, including LEO's had a right to walk through the park. In fact that was their job.
You continue to make these outlandish claims of abuse and harrassment (undercover cop barged into my tent and refused to identify himself) but you've conveniently avoided saying if you or any of your friends were actually arrested. All of this even though you openly admit to smoking pot in the middle of a crowded festival on public property. Sounds to me like you should be thankful that they were so lenient.
And if you and your friends decide to skip it next year I'm sure the good folks of Damascus won't fret too much.

Jason of the Woods
05-25-2008, 10:56
It's the same as any other prescription. I have cronic pain due to a failed back surgery so it is the same as if I chose to take pain killers and went to a different state. I just choose not to torture my body with the 5 different pills that my previous doctor had me on. Thank you for your concern. That was so sweet.

Also whatever they were it was ridiculous. yes, you're right. If a bunch of hikers didn't come to DAmascus for TDs they wouldn't miss us a bit. What a ignorant thing to say. Think for a minute why they have TDs in the first place. Is this really what I'm dealing with? Surely there are smart people out there.??:confused:
"And I have a prescription for what I smoke due to back pain so if they had a problem with me I would have been more than happy to provide that to them. "


OH REALLY??? I would be very interested in knowing what state allows for you medicinal marijuana to be smoked in Virginia!

A-Train
05-25-2008, 11:01
It's the same as any other prescription. I have cronic pain due to a failed back surgery so it is the same as if I chose to take pain killers and went to a different state. I just choose not to torture my body with the 5 different pills that my previous doctor had me on. Thank you for your concern. That was so sweet.

Also whatever they were it was ridiculous. yes, you're right. If a bunch of hikers didn't come to DAmascus for TDs they wouldn't miss us a bit. What a ignorant thing to say. Think for a minute why they have TDs in the first place. Is this really what I'm dealing with? Surely there are smart people out there.??:confused:

So, let me get this straight....

You smoke medical marijuana for your chronic back pain, but you can thru-hike??

Jason of the Woods
05-25-2008, 11:02
Yes, bad comparison. I just wanted to prove a point that this is not so much of a free country that it used to be. Where I come from if someone is following your girlfriend into a dark alley (or such) you would defend her. That's scary as hell to me that the police would do that. It may be their right but at the same time in that environment you would think out of respect for another human they would try to not create such a hostile environment. That's exactly what it felt like after Wednesday night. Why didn't they just follow the local cops lead? I had a local cop tell me on Sunday that they never have any problems with hikers. The only two arrests that the locals made were that of locals. I just wish that more people would see that and maybe talk about it instead of being sheep and believing everything that is programmed into our brains.;)
Um, note to Jason:

Do you really know anything about Germany in the thirties or what took place then?

Invoking Nazi Germany because you seem to think that people somehow have an inherent right to break laws (especially those relating to illegal narcotics) is really one of the dumber things that's been said here in awhile.

Your comparison was vulgar and ignorant.

If you wanna cry about your God-given right to get stoned wherever you want, well, that's your right, but please don't invoke Nazi Germany when you do so. It doesn't help your argument.

Jason of the Woods
05-25-2008, 11:06
The action of hiking is the first thing that makes my back feel better since I hurt it. I still have the pain when I stop at the end of the day and on days off. The way that I look at it is the pain is not going anywhere. I could sit at home in pain, take pills, and get stomach cancer in a few years or I could enjoy ncture and maybe do some good for my body through strengthening. Hiking is the one thing that the doctors have said that I can do. I only do about 7 miles a day on average with two days a week off. Yes it will take me two years to finish. So call it what you want. You all should try compasion for someone other than Karl.;) Where's my sponsor for accomplishing my challenge?:(
So, let me get this straight....

You smoke medical marijuana for your chronic back pain, but you can thru-hike??

Jack Tarlin
05-25-2008, 11:22
Actually, Jason, when it comes to investigating criminal activity and citing or arresting law-breakers, this is not the "right" of law-enforcement personnel.

It is, instead, their job.

You've already essentially admitted that you and your girlfriend are habitual drug-users and were presumably doing drugs over Trail Days weekend.

But you seem to think that any police officers that objected to this activity were guilty of creating a "hostile environment."

Um, no. Once again, they were merely doing their job, which is to investigate criminal activity, and to then take appropriate action when they witness it.

Lastly, there's a direct connection between the use of illegal narcotics and having interactions with cops. And there's also a pretty easy way to avoid these interactions.

Wanna guess what this is, Jason?

Jason of the Woods
05-25-2008, 11:28
Come on man. You're not that prudish. I've met you. I use medicine. My girlfriend has never used any drug. I have a prescription just like the millions of other people who take prescription drugs. It works better than any pill they have given me and is much less harmful.
Actually, Jason, when it comes to investigating criminal activity and citing or arresting law-breakers, this is not the "right" of law-enforcement personnel.

It is, instead, their job.

You've already essentially admitted that you and your girlfriend are habitual drug-users and were presumably doing drugs over Trail Days weekend.

But you seem to think that any police officers that objected to this activity were guilty of creating a "hostile environment."

Um, no. Once again, they were merely doing their job, which is to investigate criminal activity, and to then take appropriate action when they witness it.

Lastly, there's a direct connection between the use of illegal narcotics and having interactions with cops. And there's also a pretty easy way to avoid these interactions.

Wanna guess what this is, Jason?

Jack Tarlin
05-25-2008, 11:34
I apologise for the presumption about your girlfriend.

But your medicine of choice happens to be illegal, so therefore, you use it at your own risk.

Jason of the Woods
05-25-2008, 11:41
Actually it's not illegal for me. I have a prescription, just like the pain killers that I used to take. There are 12 states now that it is legal in for medicinal purposes. I am lucky enough to live in one of these progressively thinking states. This also entitles me to take it with me anywhere that we travel both domestically and internationally. I just took it to Amsterdam with me a few months ago. I know that seems a bit ironic.;)
I apologise for the presumption about your girlfriend.

But your medicine of choice happens to be illegal, so therefore, you use it at your own risk.

Frosty
05-25-2008, 13:04
Bite me.Don't mind sofaking. He has about 1000 posts, not one of which was anything but a wiseass comment. I think he is a Webelo.

Pirate
05-25-2008, 13:27
Um, note to Jason:

Do you really know anything about Germany in the thirties or what took place then?

Invoking Nazi Germany because you seem to think that people somehow have an inherent right to break laws (especially those relating to illegal narcotics) is really one of the dumber things that's been said here in awhile.

Your comparison was vulgar and ignorant.

If you wanna cry about your God-given right to get stoned wherever you want, well, that's your right, but please don't invoke Nazi Germany when you do so. It doesn't help your argument.

Don't forget Nazi Damascus.

Creek Dancer
05-25-2008, 13:32
Thanks Frosty. I am here to learn and contribute whenever I can. Not sure why sofaking is here, other than to troll. I will try not to feed him. LOL:)

Tin Man
05-25-2008, 17:07
And I'm sure medice man, Jason, doesn't share his prescription. :rolleyes:

winger
05-25-2008, 20:01
Do wish to expound on the legality of your RX for marijuana, and in which state? It will be very easy for me to confirm or deny your statement. And are you aware of the plethora of medical literature that states that there is NO MEDICAL BASIS FOR THE USE OF MARIJUANA FOR PAIN.
In other words, you're just blowing smoke.

JDCool1
05-25-2008, 22:40
Jason, I cannot believe you used the idea of any kind of lack of respect for you and your privacy when you intentionally violated the respect of those around you by fouling the air with toxic smoke. Sorry but you are losing your argument. The campground and park are public property therefore any of us can walk through at our leisure and since I and others paid the fee to camp there, we recognize your privacy only in your tent. Your review of the week surely only works to give the event a rather negative view. It isn't the cops who turn others away it is those to violate the law.

Enjoy your hike.

Wonder
05-26-2008, 17:22
The cops were doing what they are paid for.....plain and simple. Shoot, the Cheif told me that he put in a 21 hour day on sat.!
And I'm not going to look back and see who made a dig towards the residents not liking trail days......but it's not true...... Yes, there are some who are bothered by it, but most locals actually look forward to it......we may be happy that's it's over (myself included)...but it is still enjoyed! Do you think that with our residents that the funding would still be allowed to come out of our town taxes if they didn't?? This is a town where I heard a man at a counsil meeting gripe about how much time the cops may spend on their cell phone!!! ("I saw him on that there phone all the way across town!!!!") Trust me.,.....if they didn't want it.....it wouldn't be here.
Remember.....there are people on this forum who call Damascus home by choice. You don't like it......don't show up.
Thank you
PS...JOTW....ok, you have a script.... you're lucky to live somewhere where that is allowed to you, BUT the cop wouldn't know that until he was speaking with you.....don't blame him for coming over if he smelled something.

It's just common sense people. The cops aren't "out to get you" I know some of them....as long as you're not hurting anyone, for the most part...they'll leave you alone. Rule number one of trail days.......DON"T BE STUPID!!!!!!

(jeez, I go away for a few days and this is the crap I come ack to.....oy.......lol)

TailGunner
06-07-2008, 14:55
Damascus PD aggressively targeted hikers in searches after nightfall friday night in Tent City. VA ABC officials were on the scene as well as police bussed in from nearby counties. The level of contempt for hikers was tangible (hey, where's your wristband) and at times dangerous...TASERS were used in apprehending hikers smoking pot and drinking moonshine.
It was suggested that the raids were a response to the former police chief's arrest for selling METH out of squad cars, which is a shameless and dishonorable excuse for involving visitors in a local problem.
STAY AWAY from Damascus, the local law enforcement will arrest you. They have lost all respect for the hikers that bring business to this small town...next year, let's do Trail Fest in Hot Springs.

Lone Wolf
06-07-2008, 14:57
Damascus PD aggressively targeted hikers in searches after nightfall friday night in Tent City. VA ABC officials were on the scene as well as police bussed in from nearby counties. The level of contempt for hikers was tangible (hey, where's your wristband) and at times dangerous...TASERS were used in apprehending hikers smoking pot and drinking moonshine.
It was suggested that the raids were a response to the former police chief's arrest for selling METH out of squad cars, which is a shameless and dishonorable excuse for involving visitors in a local problem.
STAY AWAY from Damascus, the local law enforcement will arrest you. They have lost all respect for the hikers that bring business to this small town...next year, let's do Trail Fest in Hot Springs.

you're FOS. nobody was tazed, bro :D don't do anything illegal and nobody will bother you

The Old Fhart
06-07-2008, 15:25
TailGunner-"The level of contempt for hikers was tangible (hey, where's your wristband) and at times dangerous....."I never got a wristband because I was staying elsewhere and always asked permission when I entered the campground. The police always let me walk in without any problem. I've been coming to Damascus for over a decade and never had any problems-of course I probably don't hang with the same people you do. :rolleyes:

Are you sure you're not getting this mixed up with what happened to you in NYC?:D

saimyoji
06-07-2008, 16:08
Are you sure you're not getting this mixed up with what happened to you in NYC?:D

details?

Gaiter
06-07-2008, 16:42
damn, still discussing trail days? i've been hiding away from wb for a while kinda surprised to see this still being discussed... has it not been beaten to death yet?

Grampie
06-08-2008, 10:09
Damascus PD aggressively targeted hikers in searches after nightfall friday night in Tent City. VA ABC officials were on the scene as well as police bussed in from nearby counties. The level of contempt for hikers was tangible (hey, where's your wristband) and at times dangerous...TASERS were used in apprehending hikers smoking pot and drinking moonshine.
It was suggested that the raids were a response to the former police chief's arrest for selling METH out of squad cars, which is a shameless and dishonorable excuse for involving visitors in a local problem.
STAY AWAY from Damascus, the local law enforcement will arrest you. They have lost all respect for the hikers that bring business to this small town...next year, let's do Trail Fest in Hot Springs.

TailGunner, Your opinion sounds like a bunch of sour grapes to me. Damascus is a small town. They require additional law inforcement for the large number attending Trail Days. My feeling is; If you are doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to fear.
The town does a great job of putting on TD. My suggestion to you would be; If you dont like what's going on, stay away.

Pedaling Fool
06-08-2008, 10:37
...They have lost all respect for the hikers....
Me too!

Roots
06-08-2008, 10:46
damn, still discussing trail days? i've been hiding away from wb for a while kinda surprised to see this still being discussed... has it not been beaten to death yet?

I am with Gaiter on this one. We stayed at tent city, around Billville, from Thurs. to Sunday and only saw 1 incident with the police. They patroled around, which was their job. They were very nice to us everytime we crossed paths with them. They were even hauling loads of wood around to people. I saw NO police harrassment anywhere we were at tent city.

gungho
06-08-2008, 11:05
http://www.appalachiantrailservices.com/pics/smilies/beatdeadhorse5.gifEnough said

Pedaling Fool
06-08-2008, 11:59
http://www.appalachiantrailservices.com/pics/smilies/beatdeadhorse5.gifEnough said
If you look close enough there's something moving by the horse's hind hooves area. I think he's flinching; he's not dead yet. Beat it, Beat it...

max patch
06-08-2008, 13:08
STAY AWAY from Damascus, the local law enforcement will arrest you.
I somehow managed to avoid getting arrested when I was there for 4 days in April. Guess I was lucky. Obeying the law may have helped a bit, also.