View Full Version : Alcohol Stove adise
Bruce Hudson
06-03-2008, 18:57
Short background-- first time backpacking, last summer and spring-break (I'm a 65 year old teacher). Now have hiked between Hot Springs and Adkins. Inspired by the through hikers I met on a 60 mile section outside of hot springs the first of April, this summer's intention is to hike from Springer to Hot Springs without coming off the trail. Out buying new equipment with an attempt to keep it fairly failsafe I've used a Jetboil so far. There will be no urgency this summer and I'm just not happy with the dependence on pressurized cans and the Jetboil-- the simplicity of alcohol stove has great appeal.
Now I've sprung for a Trangia burner and a clikkstand mounting. In the backyard it works great. Any general observations will be appreciated. The biggest question would seem to me to involve how much fuel to carry and how to store it. I tried a Gateraid bottle, but it pours poorly and I'm concerned about the seal rolling around in my backpack.
Thanks in advance.
Bruce
The nice thing about the Trangia is that you don’t have to burn all the fuel in it up to put it away. You can just put the lid on it to put out the flame and travel with the stove while it’s got fuel in it. I always take the rubber O-ring out of the cap when I put out the flame, I don’t want to melt or burn it. I put it back in when the burner cools off.
Not knowing your food likes and how many meals you need to cook each day (some people have a cold breakfast & lunch, and only use a stove for dinner) and how much time you will run the stove, it’s hard to say how much fuel to have with you.
I find for me that 3-oz of alcohol works most times.
As far as what to carry it in, I use a Listerine bottle (the small one) it’s very tough and the cap can be used to measure fuel if you need to. I just make a label for it with my label maker.
Hey Bruce,
One thing for sure, you will need a wind screen in the great outdoors.
I just did a week section hike using a Trangia burner and a home made pot holder. The wind was problematic half the time because I didn't have a wind screen with me.
I use a shampoo bottle that I painted red for the alcohol. I store it upright in an outside pocket of my pack. In six days I used a bit more than half of a bottle of fuel. I cooked dinner every night and ramen for lunch half the time.
HTH
Tom
Footslogger
06-03-2008, 20:37
Short background-- first time backpacking, last summer and spring-break (I'm a 65 year old teacher). Now have hiked between Hot Springs and Adkins. Inspired by the through hikers I met on a 60 mile section outside of hot springs the first of April, this summer's intention is to hike from Springer to Hot Springs without coming off the trail. Out buying new equipment with an attempt to keep it fairly failsafe I've used a Jetboil so far. There will be no urgency this summer and I'm just not happy with the dependence on pressurized cans and the Jetboil-- the simplicity of alcohol stove has great appeal.
Now I've sprung for a Trangia burner and a clikkstand mounting. In the backyard it works great. Any general observations will be appreciated. The biggest question would seem to me to involve how much fuel to carry and how to store it. I tried a Gateraid bottle, but it pours poorly and I'm concerned about the seal rolling around in my backpack.
Thanks in advance.
Bruce
============================
I carry the Trangia and I own the Clickstand. After using the Clickstand for quite a while I found that the original Trangia Westwind stand (modified) with a homemade windscreen was more efficient. The Clickstand is sturdy but in some ways it is overkill.
As far as fuel goes, I generally carry either 10oz or 16oz depending on the type of hike I am doing. Main reason for those 2 amounts is that I have 10 and 16 oz booze flasks.
On my thru in 2003 I carried my 16oz flask and kept it topped off whenever I got the chance. I never had a fuel issue.
If you have any specific questions feel free to PM me. I have been using the Trangia since the mid 90's and have learned to trust their simplicity and durability.
'Slogger
Appalachian Tater
06-03-2008, 20:39
Here's a suggestion I picked up here but haven't yet used: color your alcohol with a couple of drops of food coloring to make it easier to see. I think you could also use a smidge of powdered drink mix if you are resupplying on a long-distance hike. Just make extra-sure nobody's going to drink it. Also, the alcohol can be absorbed through your skin and can be harmful so don't use it for hygiene.
Here's a suggestion I picked up here but haven't yet used: color your alcohol with a couple of drops of food coloring to make it easier to see. I think you could also use a smidge of powdered drink mix if you are resupplying on a long-distance hike. Just make extra-sure nobody's going to drink it. Also, the alcohol can be absorbed through your skin and can be harmful so don't use it for hygiene.
I do this, but don’t post that you do it here. It will start a big debate and people (several of them) will tell you that you are wrong to do this. At least that’s how it went in my post.
Not worth the argument over something so meaningless. Just do it and don’t post about it.
twentybelow
06-03-2008, 22:08
i use a regular old bottled water container for my alcohol. 8 oz. size for short trips, two of em if i'm gonna be out for awhile. they are super light, durable, and easy to replace if ever one was to get damaged, although i've never had one fail. the cap makes a perfect seal and i stow them in my pack any which way without worry. to avoid spilling even one precious drop while filling the stove, i carry an extra bottle cap which has a pinhole in it. this makes it easy to precisely meter the quantity and minimizes the risk of disaster if you need to refill your stove for a second burn. the pinhole trick should work just as well on the gatorade bottle if spillage was your only complaint with that container.
Appalachian Tater
06-03-2008, 22:11
I do this, but don’t post that you do it here. It will start a big debate and people (several of them) will tell you that you are wrong to do this. At least that’s how it went in my post.
Not worth the argument over something so meaningless. Just do it and don’t post about it.
I wouldn't argue about it but I wouldn't not post about it just because some people think it's a bad idea.
I use a Sprite bottle for alcohol because it's green and a different shape from other soda bottles. I only use clear bottles for water. I mark the outside of the Sprite bottle with XXXs, too.
i use a homemade stove, either the Ion or the SuperCat, not a trangia. i usually 'cook' 2x a day, about 1/2 to 3/4 oz each time, so say 1.5oz per day... depending on trip length, i use 2 different sized bottles, 8 or 12oz...
both are old water bottles marked with a poison sticker and an off-colored cap. you can get the stickers free with a SASE to the Childrens Hospital of Pittsburgh... search here somewhere for the exact address. i've also sprayed the bottle with white paint, again to make it look 'different'. i just use 3 caps full to measure. rough, but works.
Rickosovitch
06-04-2008, 17:02
I bought a 16 oz. bottle of denatured alcohol. I figure the makers put it in a bottle they know won't react with the product and won't leak. I refill this from a gallon can before each trip. But when I need to take more than 16 oz. of fuel I take a second bottle which was a soda pop bottle. I like keeping fuel in more than one container on longer trips. More options for distributing weight in my pack and a failsafe: I can't lose all my fuel with one mishap.
hopefulhiker
06-04-2008, 19:58
I used a 10 oz shampoo bottle with a flip top.. got it from Tin Man at Trail Days. The flip top helps eliminat spills. I used Sgt Rocks ion stove.. Because of the weight Alcohol stoves are great! Definetey make your self a wind screen or look at gettiing a CALDERA CONE
Bruce Hudson
06-04-2008, 22:17
This site is unbelievable-- what great instant info. Schools out next week and within 10 days I'll be heading out for Springer.
Thanks for all the info.
Bruce
One thing interesting to note about alcohol stoves is that, the more alcohol you put in them, the longer it takes for them to get really hot. This is because the alcohol burns best when it's boiling in the stove, and it takes more time to boil more fuel. Don't overfill your stove and then have to blow it out or snuff it. It's more efficient to add a little more fuel if you need it - just make sure that the fire is OUT first. If you snuff a stove, the hot alcohol left behind evaporates very quickly - a waste of fuel.
Hope this helps a bit.
Nearly Normal
06-05-2008, 01:21
With the Trangia, don't put the lid on it to put it out. Use the simmer ring fully closed or you will ruin the O-ring in the lid.
For fuel go to your drug store and ask for a cough syrup bottle.
Red, different sizes to choose from, and already marked for measure. They will probably give you one.
They are heavy duty. Mine has served for 10 years.
Downunda
06-05-2008, 02:53
Don't forget to make up a windshield out of a piece of aluminium flashing or heavy duty foil. Your stove won't be very effective without one.
About 8oz as other have said is enough fuel. After using other heavier stoves I was sold on the Trangia after using it on my hike from Damascus to Katahdin.
============================
I carry the Trangia and I own the Clickstand. After using the Clickstand for quite a while I found that the original Trangia Westwind stand (modified) with a homemade windscreen was more efficient. The Clickstand is sturdy but in some ways it is overkill.
As far as fuel goes, I generally carry either 10oz or 16oz depending on the type of hike I am doing. Main reason for those 2 amounts is that I have 10 and 16 oz booze flasks.
On my thru in 2003 I carried my 16oz flask and kept it topped off whenever I got the chance. I never had a fuel issue.
If you have any specific questions feel free to PM me. I have been using the Trangia since the mid 90's and have learned to trust their simplicity and durability.
'Slogger
Can you provide some more info on your windscreen? I'm looking at changing to a Trangia/Westwind set up soon and would like some pointers from someone who has cooked a meal or fifty on one.
Thanks.
Alligator
06-06-2008, 13:38
With the Trangia, don't put the lid on it to put it out. Use the simmer ring fully closed or you will ruin the O-ring in the lid...I always used the simmer ring except when I used the lid by accident, so buy an extra O-ring when you get a chance.
Footslogger
06-06-2008, 13:47
Can you provide some more info on your windscreen? I'm looking at changing to a Trangia/Westwind set up soon and would like some pointers from someone who has cooked a meal or fifty on one.
Thanks.
================================
Here is my set up. Carried it all the way to Katahdin in 2003 and it's still going strong. Everything you see here fits inside my cookpot (Evernew Ti 0.9Liter)
'Slogger
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/1/5/0/Trangia1.JPG
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/1/5/0/Trangia2.JPG
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/1/5/0/Trangia3.JPG
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/1/5/0/Trangia4.JPG
No one would agree with me, but I carry/use Golden Grain alcohol rather than Heet and, jokes aside about drinking up the fuel and thus not caring about whether you have hot food, I do so because I'm paranoid about the carcinogenic potential of Heet/ et al if it gets on your skin or the residue in your food.
In regard to what to use for carrying, the best thing I've found it from Brasslite.com Aaron sells plastic fuel bottles that dispense exactly 1/4, 1/2, or 1 ounce increments. I believe that he has fuel bottles in 4, 6, and 8 oz. sizes.
For a windscreen, I cut the top 4" from a coffee can, then use a church key to punch triangular holes around the bottom and top. It's light and, if I'm using a Pepsi stove instead of my Brasslite, it doubles as a pot stand.
================================
Here is my set up. Carried it all the way to Katahdin in 2003 and it's still going strong. Everything you see here fits inside my cookpot (Evernew Ti 0.9Liter)
'Slogger
That looks perfect. I use an REI .9 liter pot that looks to be the exact same size as that one.
I also have some of that aluminum material around from making screens for other stoves.
I think I'm going to pick up a Westwind set. Thanks for the info!
oldfivetango
06-06-2008, 15:49
My personal favorite is the plastic pocket flask intended
for alcoholic beverages.It even has a measuring cap.You
can get obsessed with alcohol requirements if you want to
but about 20 ml in my Brassilte turbo 2 D will boil a couple
cups in short order.If cooking I will use 30 ml and plan to
simmer asap.Also,Aaron makes a little primer bottle that
holds a couple ounces and it is quite handy to use for
priming.And I always use a priming pan to get things going
without wasting fuel.Better to carry a little bit too much than
not enough.
OFT
Pedaling Fool
06-06-2008, 15:51
...Not knowing your food likes and how many meals you need to cook each day (some people have a cold breakfast & lunch, and only use a stove for dinner) and how much time you will run the stove, it’s hard to say how much fuel to have with you.
...
I also would like to know the foods you eat/cook. I have a jetboil and cook 20-30 minute rice for dinner (with dehydrated foods added), which requires good simmering capability and Jetboil is great at doing that. I don't bother boiling water because I've found that it's just a waste of fuel. Don't have a problem getting canisters, although alcohol is more abundant, need an outfitter for canisters. If all you cook is foods that require hot water, w/o simmering, than alcohol is probably the way to go.
P.S. With respect to weight, there is no arguing that alcohol stoves are the lightest, however, I often wonder how much weight the fuel adds, I've seen many alcohol users carry a lot of fuel, greatly adding to the real stove weight.
I also would like to know the foods you eat/cook. I have a jetboil and cook 20-30 minute rice for dinner (with dehydrated foods added), which requires good simmering capability and Jetboil is great at doing that. I don't bother boiling water because I've found that it's just a waste of fuel. Don't have a problem getting canisters, although alcohol is more abundant, need an outfitter for canisters. If all you cook is foods that require hot water, w/o simmering, than alcohol is probably the way to go.
P.S. With respect to weight, there is no arguing that alcohol stoves are the lightest, however, I often wonder how much weight the fuel adds, I've seen many alcohol users carry a lot of fuel, greatly adding to the real stove weight.
For the meals I make, I save weight in Alcohol vs. Canister for about a 5 day trip. After that, it makes more sense for me to carry my MSR Pocket Rocket and a canister.
Most of my hiking is day hikes and a few overnighters thrown in, alcohol stoves work great. There are quite few good alcohol stoves that can simmer too.
This, of course, will vary depending on the hiker.
Downunda
06-06-2008, 21:11
A tip for storing the windshield... wrap it around your fuel bottle when not in use. Also to avoid loss of your lighter (I lost mine once and had to go without a cooked dinner because of it) attach your lighter to your stove stand with a piece of cord and attach the cord to the lighter with a piece of duck tape.
John Galt,
SGT ROCK has done a study of weight over time for various stove systems.
You can see the study at Hiking headquarters. He assumes efficiencies few of us attain (ounces per burn/meal) You may want to adjust a bit for the real world
Grinder
honkydory
06-23-2008, 11:24
No problem using the lid to snuff out the flame on the Trangia. Just learn to remove the rubber gasket FIRST and install it AFTER! First thing you learn in the Swedish army "cooking-cours"(and do learn this!).
If you leave the lid on until the burner has cooled less alcohol will evaporate. Bring a extra gasket anyway as they age and will finaly break after many years of use.
Fit a thin steel wire to the simmering ring. Then it's easy to lift it of the burner and regulate the flame without burning your fingertips.
Think you meen it's Methanol (wood spirit) that is highly poisonus and can be absorbed through the skin:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methanol_fuel#Toxicity
Otherwise many ol' Scotsmen will be out of work.
Buy no more than a 1 L bottle of 99% ethanol if in Italy. Or the kemist might mistake you for a addict and chase you down the street trowing insults at you! Don't ask...;)
budforester
06-23-2008, 11:52
I bought a 16 oz. bottle of denatured alcohol. I figure the makers put it in a bottle they know won't react with the product and won't leak. I refill this from a gallon can before each trip.
Rick, I''d be grateful to know where you find the alcohol in gallons; I only find small cans and it's probably twice as expensive.
Skidsteer
06-23-2008, 20:00
Rick, I''d be grateful to know where you find the alcohol in gallons; I only find small cans and it's probably twice as expensive.
Lowe's, Home Depot, just about any hardware store with paint for sale.
whitefoot_hp
06-23-2008, 20:39
Rick, I''d be grateful to know where you find the alcohol in gallons; I only find small cans and it's probably twice as expensive.
wally world.
Don't use the lid to snuff with - always use the simmer-ring. The more you mess with the rubber ring, the greater the chance of dirt/damage/melting - which will cause a leak.
A good windscreen is nice to have, the following is my Trangia setup.
http://mysite.verizon.net/restoq6v/
honkydory
06-24-2008, 04:24
You are a very lucky man if you manage to do so on first try everytime! ;)
hopefulhiker
06-24-2008, 07:34
I used a shampoo bottle I got from Anti Gravity gear with a flip top.. Never had problems with the alcohol stove. I carried about two oz of alcohol a day...Eight oz container was plenty.
jimtanker
07-07-2008, 00:45
I use a kids drink bottle "Bug Juice". Can be found at most convenience stores. Has a spout top on it and holds 8-10 Oz(?).
sliderule
07-10-2008, 00:45
I find for me that 3-oz of alcohol works most times.
3 oz. per ???
Per meal, per day, per month?
vamelungeon
03-26-2009, 19:24
I like my Swedish Army mess kit made by Trangia. It comes with an alcohol bottle that stores inside, burner, windscreen and two pots and it all fits together into a compact size. I light it with a Light My Fire army model fire steel.
You can make a wind screen out of tooling foil found at craft shops. Thicker than tin foil, thinner than flashing.