Crampons vs. Slipons

[bigcat2]

I want the opinions of people who have used crampons and those who use slip-on devices, such as yacktrax. I recently had to abort a trip in the Smokies because of the amount of ice on the trail and mainly because I didn't have the proper footwear. I was wondering if one was better than the other. Thanks for your input.

[Skyline]

For most winter conditions on the southern A.T. in winter, the slip-ons work fine for me. Anything more would be overkill. But to go without these would be foolish in icy conditions.

I have a friend who lives in Gorham, NH and hikes in the Whites and Mahoosucs 12 months of the year. His standard winter gear includes heavy-duty crampons and/or snowshoes. Every time I think of him dealing with the northern winter I say a thank-you for whatever good graces convinced me to remain a Southerner (he's originally from Georgia).

[jlb2012]

Personally I like instep crampons - four points under the arch of your foot. They are not as heavy or as expensive as a full crampon but work well for trail walking over ice. The ones I have are from CMI - two straps are used on each crampon - one pair of ends fastens over the toe and one pair wraps around leg/ankle - straps attach to two "tabs" that serve to keep the crampon centered under your foot.

Another alternative that I have heard of is to use short sheet metal screws driven into the soles of trail runners - I think Never-B/Flying Brian used this approach on his triple crown hike. This approach has the great advantage of being lighter than other approaches. One needs to carry a small nut driver and a supply of replacement screws but that is rather light weight.

[Bankrobber]

Unless you are hiking in heavy duty snow and ice, go with the slip ons. I picked a pair up for a day hike in Shenandoah National Park yesterday. They worked well maintaining traction on icey patches. My only convern was that they moved towards slipping off my feet They only weigh eight ounces.

[steve hiker]

My only convern was that they moved towards slipping off my feet.
I have Icewalkers and noticed they moved to the side of my shoe, as though they were thinking of slipping off. But I'd smack them back into place and never let 'em get that far.

[gravityman]

Check this out http://www.kahtoola.com/

Great for hiking in snow/ice that isn't really steep, although we have used them to go up Mt Washington twice up the winter lionshead route, and they worked fine. However, we should have brought an ice axe...

Work great on trail runners...

Gravity Man

[MedicineMan]

http://www.whiteblaze.net/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=2479&password=&sort=1&cat=500&page=2

[gravityman]

Kahtoolas are generally a lot more comfortable and give you much more secure footing than instep crampons.

Gravity Man

[hungryhowie]

For most any conditions that you'll find in (or on the edges of) thru-hiking season on the AT, slipons like Yaktrax work fine. I've used my Yaktrax several times in conditions with mixed snow & ice and have found them to be very helpful in an AT-like setting (not to mention that they are soft, flexible, and weigh only ~2oz).

For more serious conditions, however, like the high-passes in the Sierra on the PCT or NH/ME in winter, you'll want some real crampons. The Kahtoolas (already mentioned several times in this post) are probably the best thing going right now for hikers who need crampons (rather than mountaineers who hike). They are lightweight (for crampons), offer substantial traction, and work well with running shoes (a big bonus for lightweight hikers). A good investment if you'll be doing a lot of winter hiking/climbing in harsh conditions. Don't forget a good ice axe as well, if this is what you need it for.

But for on-trail stuff in the Smokies? While one of my friends always used to carry and use crampons in the winter there, I find Yaktrax to be more than adquate the vast majority of the time.

Hike safely,

-Howie

[Two Speed]

I hiked the section from Newfound Gap to Pigeon River at the end of January of this year. Snow, packed snow and ice covered about 60% - 70% of that section. For the parts where Vibram soled boots weren't doing the job, I used a pair of Yak Trax. I might have been able to make the trip without a traction device, but the Yak Trax sure did make it a whole heck of a lot easier, faster and definitely safer. I have seen complaints that Yak Trax are not very durable. Examining the construction, I get the feeling that if used for very long on dry trail, they'd break up pretty quick, but I'm pretty sure dry trail won't do a set of crampons any good, either. The weight of the 'Trax is pretty good; less than 4 oz for the set I had.

Long story short: for moderate snow and icing, as I found in the Smokies, Yak Trax were the ticket for me. For tougher conditions, I'd get a set of crampons.

[Big Dawg]

I just got back 4 days ago from hiking the AT in the smokies (awesome trip) & used the Yak Trak. 2/3 of the trail had some amount of ice/snow, so some sort of crampon, etc. is needed. The Yak Traks gave me traction-----when they were on,, the problem is that b/c of the way they are made, they tend to slip to the side/front/back based on whether your hiking up/down, on snow/ice, or regular trail w/ rock/roots. (There were plenty of areas where one side of the ridge was 6-12 in. of packed snow/ice, then cross over the ridge, & there was clear trail-----so these Yaks need to stand up to snow/ice & rock/roots,,,too much of a hassle to take off Yaks each time you come back to clear trail). During the trip, they broke 2 places on mine, & 3 places on my friends pair. We repaired w/ rope, which broke again. These seem to be great for low impact, flat surfaces w/ snow/ice, like driveways, but definately not for the trail, in my humble opinion. I researched this b-4 I bought, & it seems yak trak works for some. I would only use these again if they were the only traction device available. Better options in above posts.

[snowshoe]

Crampons are the way to go either 6 or 10 point work best. Yak trax are ok but they have a better chance of slipping off as well not getting a good bit on ice when doing steeper climbs.

[Jaybird]

I want the opinions of people who have used crampons and those who use slip-on devices, such as yacktrax. I recently had to abort a trip in the Smokies because of the amount of ice on the trail and mainly because I didn't have the proper footwear. I was wondering if one was better than the other. Thanks for your input.



Mt.Rainier =crampons


A.T. = ..."i dont need NO stinkin' crampons!" :D

[The Old Fhart]

I've done winter hiking for many years and what I've found is that if its steep and icy, you will need full crampons. Kahtoolas are a version of lightweight full crampon and look like they would work just fine. Insteps only work if you keep your foot flat. If you are going up a slope you have a tendency to rock foreward onto your toes and you will lose traction. Traction devices using screws aren't going to do any good if there is more than a dusting of snow over the icy surface. Anything that is advertised as "slip on" I'd view as "slip off", and at the most inconvenient time. The crampons I use are 12 point and have 1.5 inch long teeth or points and they have got me up all the high peaks in New England in winter, including Katahdin. Walking with crampons takes a little practice and after you've shreaded the legs on an expensive pair of Goretex pants with the crampon points, you learn to pick your feet up and keep them further apart. Crampons and iceaxe use go hand-in-hand (no, wait, crampons go on feet!) and for winter climbing I wouldn't be caught dead without them (or is it the opposite?). Although you can't see them well, in this photo I am wearing full crampons. http://www.whiteblaze.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/2185/size/big/password/0/sort/1/cat/500

I didn't use crampons on the John Muir Trail in summer but there were a couple of short stretches where I wish I'd had them. If there is just a late spring snow in Georgia or the smokies, and I always seem to hit them, I've never had to use any traction device there at all.

[Pencil Pusher]

I love those insteps. They're great to pack when you're unsure of needing crampons or not, or when it's a moderate slope. Though a gondola would be better.

[hikerdude]

I must have everyone confused. But I'm carrying Yactrax pro's with the velco strap, hooked to my dasy chain on my backpack, crossing the whites now. There's snow on the north face of Lafayette this week.
I can see YakTrax won't last long. They have a weak link [ thin rubberband strap, edging shoe sole, cutting on a sharp rock]. Crampon's are least a pound. But I seen these rugged 8 point crampons that really fit the bill. For years most use just Sherpa Claw snowshoes.4#, But MSR has a better smaller snowshoe that I haven't tried that really look good. If you are on a Ego, get FootFangs.
:clap hikerdude.

[hikerdude]

"Wasting my time", on the computer they say. Anyway My crampons have the Chouinard brand on them and alot of neoprene straps that weigh 2lb 8oz. And those Footfangs are Parsay. How you say in french? Lowe Footfangs. Now I see they have some BOB DOLE terminators, or rambos names of today. Yea no crap and I don't even get the big orange antiball plates, if you got the balls to call em that cause they will cost about $400 today with everything:eek: . Sides MSR did everyone in for fall of 05. So its not the Lowe Footfangs of yesterday anymore. Those TERMINATOR and RAMBO crampons are the macho crampons today.But really Jeff Lowe made them. I think he fell off a cliff anyway so he won't care.
So for me those Kahtoola's are the best thing for you guys that don't like Yaktrax Pro . Like I said I was either going to have to carry my duel boots or get new crampons. Well no backpackereviews or help here. Just hard to find and everyones best seller and I really wanted a pair of old 8 point .So I updated to STUBIA's 10 p 590 gram on my own. Such a better strap system, and a pound ligher than my old timer Chouinard's. I should have them in about 4 weeks.
Also wasting my time on the internet, I found a 60mm CAMP XLA 210 ICE AXE a pound ligher than my Chounard to. Sunshine Village is calling Jac? this winter. But for you winter A.T.er's the new CAMP 6 punte light crampons are worth looking at to.That's what I said looking at. I spent enough.

But all in all winter is coming and your going to get fat and lazy and scared of the cold. So buy some snowshoes and do some winter dayhiking. They are cheap as hiking poles today, so take the whole family. And they got claws on em and you won't wreck or get you sneakers wet with frostbite, ouch. And they really make everything in the northeast here into a white sidewalk in 15 minutes, even Mahoosuc, so why would you leave them or yourself at home?
Unless you want to snowshoe race.:-? Then we have traps set and all the fun that goes with the race. I tried that walking up the snow sidewalk too, without snowshoes to save my 4 pounds to you think, sink to a place that looks like a good soundproof snowcave many times in a very short day. I insist everyone carry snowshoes, so we all float on. To some decent miles considering. check around and get a good pair with good bindings. I got the old Sherpa Claw ADK rental style with the Claw replacement at 4 pounds a pair, if I care. Oh I would say from Mass Pike to Katahdin anyway. I know you don't listen anyway. But that's why everyone has Sherpa claws on in case you wanted to know.
Everything is Xmas, right?

[Skyline]

I switched to Yak-Trax this year and am mostly happy with them. They make two versions--one is called Yak-Trax, the other is Yak-Trax Pro. I looked at both and I think the Pro version has a better chance of success on the AT. The cheaper version might be better suited for someone walking down a driveway to a mailbox.

I'll admit that they tend to slip around and could even slip off but if you pay attention while you're hiking you can easily knock them back in place while hardly missing a step. For places I hike in the South and Mid-Atlantic states full crampons would be serious overkill.

[fiddlehead]

Since i don't like to carry more than i have to, i've found (in my 2001 southbound winter AT hike) that sheet metal (pan head) screws work fine. Just screw them into your running shoes and you'll be amazed at how good they work, you'll need about 7 per foot. You may want to drill small holes in your shoe back home but can, (with patience) do it on the trail with an awl and small screwdiver, use phillips heads if you can as they are easier to take back out once they wear down a bit. we started in Oct at Katahdin and finished on Feb 14 and only needed to use the screws in Maine and the whites. The Smokies happened to be 60 degrees and we saw NO overnight hikers the whole park! A truly wonderful time to hike! Enjoy fh

[Lumberjack]

Stubia makes a decent set of AL cramps that are a little less money then the katoolas but a few grams more in weight.

southern you can get away with insteps and so on but up north get real cramps and stay out of trouble.....

[Moxie00]

I hike in Maine winter and summer and have not needed crampons. For years I used Walmart purchased ice cleats, I even used them in the Grand Canyon when the first mile down the trail was glare ice. Three years ago I decided to take a short cut up an ice face on a winter hike. About half way up the ice face I heard a clang, clang clang and looked down to see one of my ice cleats tunble to the bottom. I hike solo so with no way to go but down I made it to the bottom with one cleat but it was no fun. It wasn't ice climbing but it was a very steep frozen snow face. Now I use Yaktrax and for eastern winter trail hiking them and a pair of snowshoes are all that is needed, crampons woul be overkill in the Applachians most of the time. Ice climbing is a different ball game than hiking and crampons are a must there.

[TOW]

I want the opinions of people who have used crampons and those who use slip-on devices, such as yacktrax. I recently had to abort a trip in the Smokies because of the amount of ice on the trail and mainly because I didn't have the proper footwear. I was wondering if one was better than the other. Thanks for your input.i don't know about crampons, but having used yaktraks i can say they were efficient enough, although on ice-sheer ice you still had to watch your step....

[LIhikers]

The past couple of winters I've used Stabilicers when not on my snowshoes. They have pins under your toes and heels as well as the middle of the foot. At first I tried their Sport version and they were terrible as they kept coming off. The regular version with the velcro adjustable straps work like a champ!

www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplaymemberId=12500226&productId=39161984 (http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplaymemberId=12500226&productId=39161984)

[betic4lyf]

do i need crampons for winter hiking in the whites? specifically i want to know if what i need if i want to ski on washington a bit, specifically sherourne ski trail.