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Sharkey
09-09-2008, 02:26
I'm preparing to do some winter hiking in February/March of 2009 and I am trying to make some final preparations. In consideration of weight, and costs, I am trying to use as much of my present gear as possible. (most of it is 3 season gear). I have a 30 degree sleeping bag (S.D. Lazer) and a liner. The liner manufacturer states it adds 15 degrees to the sleeping bag. It works well but 10 degrees sounds more realistic. So, I'm good to about 20 degrees. I have considered getting the MontBell Thermawrap jacket and pants. 1)Are these items effective? 2)Would it work using the present sleeping bag, liner and these items on cold nights or would I be better off just getting a sleeping bag with a lower temperature rating? I am trying to keep the weight and costs down but don't want to sacrifice safety. Thanks ahead of time for your input.

Baby Blue
09-09-2008, 02:43
Alot has to do with where you will be hiking in Feb. and how long you will be out for.

Jim Adams
09-09-2008, 02:44
Probably work but then more to carry. Try looking on ebay for a lower temp, low cost bag. there are some outragous deals to be had at times and you have till feb. to get one.
If I was hiking in Georgia in Feb., I would carry a 0* bag but thats just me.

geek

Chatter
09-09-2008, 06:29
Baby Blue's question is right on the mark - i.e. where you will be hiking.

Hiking in February near where you live in the South is much different than Winter hiking here in the Northeast in range of New Hampshire's White Mountains. For example, your bag and liner may keep you warm at 20F, but February conditions in the Whites demand something more in the order of a minus 20F bag.

Lots of other differences too, depending on the "where" part of your hiking.

Egads
09-09-2008, 06:43
There is not a liner made that adds 10*. A heavy fleece summer bag used as a liner will add 10-15*, but will also add 2# to your load. You would be better off with a 3.5# 0* bag.

You definitely need to consider some insulation to wear in camp. The MB Thermawrap will help you keep from freezing your tail while in camp and will definitely help inside the bag.

Consider a car camping trip when the temps hit the teens to test your system. No need to endanger yourself w/o a tested system. You should always prepare for 10-15* colder than the forecast. It's a lesson you only need to experience once to learn.

Jim Adams
09-09-2008, 08:27
There is not a liner made that adds 10*. A heavy fleece summer bag used as a liner will add 10-15*, but will also add 2# to your load. You would be better off with a 3.5# 0* bag.

You definitely need to consider some insulation to wear in camp. The MB Thermawrap will help you keep from freezing your tail while in camp and will definitely help inside the bag.

Consider a car camping trip when the temps hit the teens to test your system. No need to endanger yourself w/o a tested system. You should always prepare for 10-15* colder than the forecast. It's a lesson you only need to experience once to learn.

Definetly good advice. I learned to winter camp at 32* to -10*trying different gear by camping in the mountains at state park campgrounds. The park rangers thought that I was crazy back then but their advice was " well, if you think you're going to freeze to death, sleep in the bathrooms...they're heated.":)

geek

bigcranky
09-09-2008, 08:28
Part of it depends on your current 30-F bag. (I'm not familiar with the Lazer.) I have used my WM Megalite in March when it was my only bag, and I had to make do. I used my down jacket over my torso, Powertec fleece tights on my legs, a balaclava, warm socks, and my sit pad inside my bag under my feet. I was reasonably warm with the temps just under 20-F, but then I sleep pretty warm to begin with. My poor wife would have been a popsicle under the same conditions.

The Megalite is very wide, so all that clothing lofts up inside and doesn't compress the bag's loft. If your bag is a slim-cut mummy, it might not work so well.

I strongly second the suggestion that you try this out closer to home this winter. An overnight at a state park up in the mountains in December or January will tell you everything you need to know, and you can hit the car if it gets too cold.

Lawn Sale
09-09-2008, 08:53
I also recommend this and have done it often myself.

I can't imagine needing a lot lower rating than 20° down south, I bring a down 15° bag and a GTX bivy with me when winter hiking in the White's, which would keep me alive should something happen. To be comfortable I may go to a lower rating depending on the weather, but the weight adds up fast. A good base pad will do wonders for sleeping, there is nothing worse than the warmth getting sucked out of the bag.

I tried some of the liners out there and they're mostly gimmicks, there is no way they add that much warmth. I have found a good sleeping bag will weigh less than a sleeping bag and liner 'system' and be more comfortable.

Sharkey
09-09-2008, 12:38
Thanks for your input. I will be hiking in North Carolina in February/March. I also plan on doing some hiking in late October in the GSMNP. (If I can get time off from work.). I'm considering taking my sleeping bag and MontBell ULAP thermal sheet and see how that does for the late fall. For winter hiking I have been leaning towards a 0*bag but wanted some input on the other items. Thanks again.

Jim Adams
09-09-2008, 13:09
Thanks for your input. I will be hiking in North Carolina in February/March. I also plan on doing some hiking in late October in the GSMNP. (If I can get time off from work.). I'm considering taking my sleeping bag and MontBell ULAP thermal sheet and see how that does for the late fall. For winter hiking I have been leaning towards a 0*bag but wanted some input on the other items. Thanks again.

Used a 20* on my first thru. Was cold a few nights in march / april but got thru. Used a 0* on my second thru. There were a couple of nights that I would have been cold in the 20* but was fine in the 0*

geek

jaywalke
09-09-2008, 13:35
I use a Western Mountaineering Antelope SMF (conservative 5 degree rating) in southern Virginia on the coldest January-February trips. It's probably overkill, but I've given away so much winter gear since moving here and I can't stand to let this bag go.

I have a SD 20-degree synthetic bag, and I've been cold in it right at 20 degrees, although that may be a factor of age and southern living making me a wimp about cold. Liners, IMO, cannot add more than a few degrees to a bag's rating.

There are so many factors to sleeping warm that no one can give you assurances. It depends on your shelter, your pad, your metabolism, humidity, food, wind, rain/snow, elevation, location (i.e. meadow versus valley), etc. As others here have said, try it close to home with a bail-out plan before you try it deep in the woods.

The Solemates
09-09-2008, 14:36
typically if the forecast is for 30 or below i just go ahead and take my winter bag (5 degree bag). i dont mind not being prepared for many things (like I've forgetten my tent poles on several trips and just slept under the stars), but having a warm place to lay me down is something i do not compromise on.

ASUGrad
09-19-2008, 13:58
I carry a fleece insert and use it as a blanket. It's a little heavier but more functional

OldStormcrow
09-19-2008, 16:39
Thanks for your input. I will be hiking in North Carolina in February/March. I also plan on doing some hiking in late October in the GSMNP. (If I can get time off from work.). I'm considering taking my sleeping bag and MontBell ULAP thermal sheet and see how that does for the late fall. For winter hiking I have been leaning towards a 0*bag but wanted some input on the other items. Thanks again. Late October in the Smokies, eh? The first time I went to Leconte for a nice fall trip on November 1st it got down to 4 degrees that night. Be sure and test out your liner theory before you go out "for real". Most of today's bags don't have a lot of room for anything else but you in them. Just an extra polar fleece hoodie on you and the loft is all stretched out. If you are going for fairly short periods of time (like section hiking) you might consider renting a nice 0 dgree bag from your local outfitter. The one where I work part time rents them for a fairly low price and it could save you some expense.

WILLIAM HAYES
09-20-2008, 16:37
don't underestimate the ga/NC/Tenn section during this time it can get just as cold as the northern section of the trail I would think about a 15 degree bag like one of the marmot ultra light bags

Two Speed
09-20-2008, 19:59
A 20 degree bag has worked for me in the Smoky's in January. Of course I seem to sleep warmer than a lot of folks, and on that trip I went to bed with my thermals, arcrylic gloves, fleece jacket, fleece hat and wool socks on.

I have to get up once or twice a night to "drain the dragon," so staying in my base layer and fleece jacket made complete sense to me; no point in getting dressed to go take a leak, then get undressed just to repeat the process a few hours later.

Doctari
09-20-2008, 21:41
It also depends on YOUR temp rating: I regularly use a quilt rated at 30, easily down to temps in the teens. My (Florida native) hiking partner starts shivering at 50, even in a 30 bag.

Winter hiking ROCKS!!!! My favorite time to hike, and, I hope you get snow!

ASUGrad
09-23-2008, 14:29
Forget getting out. Just use a marked Gatorade bottle. Didn't you guys ever road trip with Mickey's?

Reid
09-23-2008, 22:39
When I winter hike I will throw some of the super large hand warmers in my bag, say 5 of them, and believe it or not when I jump in the bag its quite toasty and I don't have to fight to warm up the bag. Just a thought

Tinker
09-23-2008, 23:36
If you wear clothing in your bag, make sure you have enough room for it. Compressed insulation is weight not worth carrying. Wearing clothing inside a bag is a great way to extend its comfort range, and you won't freeze your backside off if you have to go visit the bushes in the middle of the night. Using a vapor barrier is out of the question when wearing clothing in the bag, however, as it will ensure that your clothes get soaked in your perspiration. You can use vapor barrier clothing under your regular clothes inside your bag if you wish, and it will keep everything drier. I found that I feel less damp in the VB clothing than I do in a VB bag liner. Vapor barriers are usually only useful well below freezing (usually below zero F.), and take some getting used to, but they are the lightest way to increase the warmth of your bag.

Panzer1
09-24-2008, 00:24
The 30* bag you have is a nice bag for the warmer months. But if you are serious about winter hiking you should have a proper winter bag, not just a hopped up summer bag.

Panzer

Wags
09-24-2008, 23:31
personally i think you should check this bag out

http://www.rei.com/outlet/product/750068

and let me know how it is and whether i should pick it up. hard to believe at that price