View Full Version : help me with this standing indian loop...
kilarney1902
10-18-2008, 23:45
i am trying to do the standing indian loop, but through some googling i have found there are different possibilities. some folk and i are doing a three day hike, looking for 20-30 miles. is there a possibility here?
papa john
10-19-2008, 00:04
Definitely! Park your car in the backcountry parking lot (stay left as you come into the campground) and then follow the Kimsey Creek Trail through the park and up the mountain to Deep Gap. Once at the AT, turn left and ascend to Standing Indian Shelter (about .9 miles) and then ascend Standing Indian Mountain. Follow the trail all the way around and back to the road and then walk back to your car. Piece of cake and a great area to hike. You can stretch this out to 3 easy days. For an added bonus continue to hike on to Winding Stair Gap and then retrace your steps back to your car.
sbennett
10-19-2008, 00:26
The trail that takes you back to the parking lot (and finishes this loop that starts with the Kimsey Creek Trail and the AT) is the Long Branch trail. The total length is somewhat more than 20 miles and can be done as an overnight or 3 day. You go by 3 shelters (at least) during the hike and there are plenty of other places to camp.
I found the Kimsey Creek trail confusing. I hiked the bottom part of it until I reached a grassy bush hogged forest service road. This is a couple of tenths after the big clearing. I went right along this road and found more blazes, but they were for the wrong trail. Whoever is doing the blazing should use different colors for different trails here
Anyone have the scoop?
And yes, no problems with water on the loop. IIRC, there are at least 8-10 sources.
papa john
10-19-2008, 07:35
When you get to that grassy area, turn right and follow the creek up the hill. It is a bit confusing there, I agree.
When you get to that grassy area, turn right and follow the creek up the hill. It is a bit confusing there, I agree.
I made it past this point. What is next?
papa john
10-19-2008, 08:07
If you went past the clearing, then you went too far. When you come out of the woods and reach the clearing, turn right and hike up the hill. You will see the correct blazes for the KCT. The trail follows the creek for quite some time, you will cross over a few times and then it will eventually stay on the right side.
sherrill
10-19-2008, 11:24
Send a pm to Marta. She was extremely helpful to me with directions at the bottom of Kimsey Creek, which is confusing. She's done this area numerous times.
It is because getting started on the Kimsey Creek trail can be confusing that I would recommend doing the loop the other direction. Park at the Backcountry parking. Forget walking the road up to Rock Gap. Cross the USFS road and head up Long Branch trail (beautiful 2 mile trail up to the AT). There is a great field to camp in with creek right next to the field about 1 3/4 miles up the trail (great if you drive/arrive late). Then you climb steeply up to Glassmine Gap, turn right (south) on AT and hike over Albert Mt, Standing Indian Mt, down to Deep Gap, and then take the blue blaze Kimsey Creek trail back down to the campground. About a mile down the Kimsey Creek trail, you go thru a gate and cross a gravel parking lot by the USFS road that goes to Deep Gap. It's a little hard to find where the trail continues but if you walk to the other end of the parking area and then look for an overgrown faint looking trail leading down into the woods. You should see a blue blaze again 20 yds or so down it. When you get to the campground bridge, turn left and cross it, and in about 30 yds you'll see the sign on the right and trail up to the backcountry parking area. Did this hike a few weeks ago.
This hike can be done in two days (strenuous) or three (recommended).
Great campsites:
Long Branch Trail - field
Big Spring Shelter - Great camping spots across the other side of the trail from the shelter
Carter Gap shelter area
Standing Indian Peak - great place (there is water down obscure trail 20 yds south of where the Lower Ridge Trail and side trail to the summit converge with the AT).
Old Standing Indian shelter site (200 yds south of the new shelter) - right on a nice creek.
papa john
10-19-2008, 13:47
Send a pm to Marta. She was extremely helpful to me with directions at the bottom of Kimsey Creek, which is confusing. She's done this area numerous times.
This was my confusion. He was talking about where the trail crossed the USFS closer to the top. Where you have to walk over to the gate and then take off up to the right and back into the woods.
kilarney1902
10-19-2008, 13:54
thank you guys. you are awesome.
daddytwosticks
10-19-2008, 15:37
The beginning mile or so of the Kimsey Creek Trail is very confusing. But this loop is fantastic! Creeks, views, comfortable trails, no need for a shuttle, plenty of water, opportunities to bail out if needed, etc. One of my favorites. Planning on doing it again late May/early June next year.
Ron Haven
10-19-2008, 15:58
if you park in the back country lot and proceed 300ft or so turn left and cross the river.You will see a sign on the right where you turn into Kimsey Creek Trail.Hike oppx 1/10 of a mile and Park Creek Trail goes to the right and Kimsey to the left up the hill.It is marked well right there.Hike oppx 1/2 mile and you come into the first grassy field where you bear right in an old logging bed rd. oppx 300ft there is an unmarked blue blaze to the right which is Park Ridge Trail but Kimsey bears left across the creek on the wood bridge.
Go straight ahead on the left side of the creek in this same old forest service road bed oppx 3/4 mile and you will turn to the right into another grassy field by crossing the bridge and you will be back on the right side of Kimsey Creek.Cross the field and the trail leaves out of the field in the left corner.
Hike oppx 1 mile and you come out in a small gravel parking lot.To the right 25ft is forest service rd 71.If you turn left Deep Gap is oppx 1/3 mile,to the right 8 miles is US64.At this point Kimsey Creek Trail crosses that little parking lot to the left and as you are exiting the parking lot to the left is a little old forest service road bed with a steel gate.
After you pass the gate Kimsey Creek Trail turns right up the hill and is well marked with blue blazes.It is oppx 1/3 mile to Deep Gap.Total is 3.7 miles from Standing Indian to Deep Gap
Here is another option for Kimsey Creek & it is a short cut.
As you enter Standing Indian Camp Ground.Go to the second bridge but don't croos it.Instead turn right on the paved rd and go oppx 300ft.You will see a sign saying Kimsey Creek area.Go straight up by the picnic tables and that little trail crosses Kimsey Creek.Walk straight ahead oppx 400 ft and you come into the grassy field.Blue to the right is the loop around the campground I first gave instructions for.walk straight ahead and you will see the unmarksed blue blaze to the right which is Park Ridge Trail but you bear left across Kimsey Creek on the bridge.
Go straight ahead on the left side of the creek in this same old forest service road bed oppx 3/4 mile and you will turn to the right into another grassy field by crossing the bridge and you will be back on the right side of Kimsey Creek.Cross the field and the trail leaves out of the field in the left corner.
Hike oppx 1 mile and you come out in a small gravel parking lot.To the right 25ft is forest service rd 71.If you turn left Deep Gap is oppx 1/3 mile,to the right 8 miles is US64.At this point Kimsey Creek Trail crosses that little parking lot to the left and as you are exiting the parking lot to the left is a little old forest service road bed with a steel gate.
After you pass the gate Kimsey Creek Trail turns right up the hill and is well marked with blue blazes.It is oppx 1/3 mile to Deep Gap. Total is about 2.9 miles from Standing Indian Camp Ground to Deep Gap.
From Deep Gap look to the left of the parking lot and you will see the Kimsey Creek Trail sighn and blue blazes.Go oppx to you see a steel gate on your left and walk past it into a small gravel parking lot.As you are walking straight you are aproaching forest service rd 71.Oppx 25 ft before the rd you will see an old grown up trail turning right down by some plum trees.After you walk 50ft you will start seeing blue blazes again.
Hike oppx 1 mile and you will go to the left into a grassy field.Across the field you will cross a bridge and turn left down an old forest service rd bed.You will see a sign saying campground 2 miles but it isn't but one unless you bear left on the campground loop.Follow that old forest service rd bed all the way into the campground. To get out or the campground bear left back to Forest service service 67.
I hope this helps any of you in every way.Don't let this trail scare you because it isn't marked as well as I think it should be but it is the most beautiful trail in the Standing Indian Loop and was once upon a time a part of the A T and connected to the Water Oak Gap Trail which makes it only oppx 6 miles from Muscrat Creek Shelter to Standing Indian Campground.If anyone else needs info on this trail you can e mail me
[email protected] enjoy.
kilarney1902
10-19-2008, 19:48
i guess now my question is, how do i get to standing indian campground/ backcountry parking lot? I will be heading there from N. GA, i assume that i will go through clayton (heading north on 441) what is the best way from there? google directions seem a tad flaky, so help me out. also what are any issues with parking fees permits etc.
papa john
10-19-2008, 20:00
I usually go up through Hiawassee and then east on Hwy 64. Travel for a number of miles and look for Old US 64 heading to Wallace Gap. At the Gap turn right and towards the campground, go straight to the b/c parking area. Last time I was there it was free to park and secure.
You can also get there from Franklin, just go west on Hwy 64.
Go to Franklin, take hwy 64 west, after the turnoff for Wayah Bald on the right start looking for Old Murphy Rd on the left, go down the road and you will see the big sign for the campground.
Check out post # 20 here:
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?p=646467&highlight=standing+indian#post646467
Search "Standing Indian" as there are lots of threads with more detail on this area.
Ron Haven
10-19-2008, 23:32
i guess now my question is, how do i get to standing indian campground/ backcountry parking lot? I will be heading there from N. GA, i assume that i will go through clayton (heading north on 441) what is the best way from there? google directions seem a tad flaky, so help me out. also what are any issues with parking fees permits etc.No it is free to park in the back country info center or at Rock Gap parking lot.If you turn into the campground and stop at the checkin there is a parking lot on the left but there is a fee.
Here is something for you folks coming thru Clayton,Ga to check out sometime.On 441 four miles north of the Ga/NC state line turn left onto Coweeta Lab Road.Go 3 miles and the pavement will end becoming FS83.
Keep on this rd 7 miles as you will pass Pickins Nose Notch Trail and cross the A T at Mooney Gap.When the road ends it will be FS67,If you turn right it will be 2 miles to Mt Albert and Bear Pen Gap.At the end of FS83 you turn left it is 6 miles to Standing Indian Campground.All this is marked very good.
On FS67 you can access Betty Creek Trail,Mooney Falls Trail,Timber Ridge Trail,Laural Falls Trail,Beech Gap Trail,Lower side of Bear Pen Trail,Blackwell Gap Trail,Hurricane Creek Trail,Long Branch Trail and as the road turns back to pavement again the back country parking is on your left where you can access Standing Indian Campground and get to the Low Ridge Trail and the trails on Kimsey Creek.Straight ahead is Rock Gap and the roads end into old 64 at Wallace Gap.
I hope I didn't go over board putting this much info but if anyone is wondering about any of these trails here is how to get to them.
kilarney1902
10-19-2008, 23:54
Ron, that is some awesome info. i never knew there were so many trails in that area. i like knowing areas really well, and i know just about all of the side trails and access possibilities for the GA AT. this really helps with the bottom half of NC.
I hope I didn't go over board putting this much info but if anyone is wondering about any of these trails here is how to get to them.Nobody knows that area better than you do Ron, and thanks for the shuttle to Dick's Creek a year ago this month. ;)
Saturday morning Ron mentioned making a map of how to get through the campground on the Kimsey Creek Trail. That is a superb idea. Just about everyone I know has gotten mixed up in there, sometimes going several hours out of their way.
I second the idea that it is easier to hike the loop clockwise. For one thing, you are going down the only slightly challenging part of the hike--the Albert Mtn. rock hop.
The other reason is that once you are in the vicinity of the campground, you can simply head for the entrance, cutting through the campground.
The signs you want to follow are the ones that say "Backcountry Information Booth." That's where you car should be parked.
Two Speed
10-20-2008, 08:38
I dunno about all that. Getting lost around Standing Indian is part of the fun. It's all great hiking and camping terrain.
Ron Haven
10-20-2008, 09:44
Ron, that is some awesome info. i never knew there were so many trails in that area. i like knowing areas really well, and i know just about all of the side trails and access possibilities for the GA AT. this really helps with the bottom half of NC.Yes they are many.I have hiked most of them at some time or another and a couple that I haven't I know where the beginning and the end of the trail heads are.If I can ever help any of you in this area I will.I don't want to sound like a know it all though.
Saturday I shuttled Marta & Hubbie,Skidsteer,Gungho,kanga,Roots and Hooch to the beginning of the Chunky Gal Trail on the west side and I learned 2 things new.Where the Bob Allison Camp is where the trail head is and a thru rd to Andrews & Junaluska Rd in Nantahala by the lake.
[quote=Marta;712576]Saturday morning Ron mentioned making a map of how to get through the campground on the Kimsey Creek Trail. That is a superb idea. Just about everyone I know has gotten mixed up in there, sometimes going several hours out of their way.
quote]Marta do you think the directions I gave were good enough to keep people from getting lost?Also I will try to get started on drawing that map soon.
Definitely! Park your car in the backcountry parking lot (stay left as you come into the campground) and then follow the Kimsey Creek Trail through the park and up the mountain to Deep Gap. Once at the AT, turn left and ascend to Standing Indian Shelter (about .9 miles) and then ascend Standing Indian Mountain. Follow the trail all the way around and back to the road and then walk back to your car. Piece of cake and a great area to hike. You can stretch this out to 3 easy days. For an added bonus continue to hike on to Winding Stair Gap and then retrace your steps back to your car.
I'm thinking about doing this loop. Is Winding Stair Gap north on the AT, past the trail that takes you back to the parking lot? I'd be looking for a way to extend the 25 miles or so of the loop, to add maybe another 15 miles to the whole trip, for a total of 40 miles.
I understand there is parking at the Backcountry Office. Is it open late at night in winter? Would I be able to park there and then hike in a bit on the Kimsey Creek Trail to camp if it's late?
Cheers.
papa john
11-02-2008, 22:05
It is open 24/7, there is nothing to keep you from parking there. The campground is closed during the winter but you won't be going in there with your vehicle. Winding stair gap is north on the trail from where you park your car. You should be able to find some places to setup a tent or hammock along the KCT although much of the trail is alongside a steep hillside, so you may have to go off the trail a bit to find a flat spot.
I'm thinking about doing this loop. Is Winding Stair Gap north on the AT, past the trail that takes you back to the parking lot? I'd be looking for a way to extend the 25 miles or so of the loop, to add maybe another 15 miles to the whole trip, for a total of 40 miles.
I understand there is parking at the Backcountry Office. Is it open late at night in winter? Would I be able to park there and then hike in a bit on the Kimsey Creek Trail to camp if it's late?
Cheers.
The road is open year round, 24/7, as far as the Backcountry Information Station. (It's not exactly an office--it's just a signboard.)
If you did the loop counter-clockwise, from Glassmine Gap (instead of turning left onto Long Branch Trail) it's about 8 miles to Winding Stair Gap: 4 to Rock Gap Shelter, another mile from there to Wallace Gap, and then 3 - 3 1/2 miles from Wallace to Winding Stair. People park long term at Winding Stair all the time, but it is a little risky. If you do, leave nothing of value visible in your vehicle.
A better option to add more miles to this section would be to start at Dick's Creek in GA and finish at the Standing Indian Backcountry parking lot after taking a left down Long Branch Trail at Glassmine Gap. On this new piece, Plumorchard Gap shelter is one of the nicer shelters in the South. Bly Gap (GA/NC State line) is kinda cool with the 'knarly tree.' And you can take the side trail at Muskrat Shelter out to Raven Rocks view (spectacular).
The Standing Indian Backcountry parking lot is never closed. The campground closes this year on 11/22. There are several places to tent camp just outside the confines of the campground right on the river just a few hundred yards up the trail from the bridge in the campground (before you get to the signed trails intersection). There are places to camp along Kimsey Creek Trail, though not very many fire rings. There are several fields / old apple orchards with Kimsey Creek nearby.
daddytwosticks
11-03-2008, 08:36
Summit's dead on...several nice places to tent within the first 30 minutes walking of the Kimsey Creek Trail.
whatever you do, stay away from the chunky gal... she's not a nice girl at all.
troglobil
11-03-2008, 17:55
How is the water on this loop right now? I plan on hiking it later this week.
The side trails (blue blazes) will have plenty of water (Long Branch and Kimsey Creek), even if a little low. The stream by Standing Indian Shelter is actually Kimsey Creek and should have water but may be low that far up. There's a good stream that's always flowing north of Beech Gap about 2-3 miles before you reach Carter Gap Shelter. At Glassmine Gap, if you aren't taking the blue blaze Long Branch Trail to the Standing Indian Backcountry parking lot, you may want to drop down this trail a couple hundred yards to some nice water anyway (nice campsite as well). The other sources, Carter Gap, Big Spring Shelter, culvert (stream) just north of Mooney Gap, may be dry or a trickle.
troglobil
11-04-2008, 09:33
thanks,
Thanks, everyone, for all the great beta on Standing Indian.
My boyfriend and I got to the Backcountry Information "Center" on Wednesday evening and found a beautiful campsite just along the river, past the first bridge in the campground. Weather was a little chilly with ice forming on the tent, but the setting was fantastic.
We hiked up KCT and the AT over to Carter Gap on Thursday under pleasantly sunny skies. We found a very picturesque campsite just south (or west?) a few yards before the gap.
On Friday we hiked up Albert Mountain and enjoyed the scramble to the top. Views were outstanding from the fire tower. We camped that night along the Long Branch Trail, just past the junction with the AT. We managed to find enough dry wood for good camp fires both nights.
On Saturday we hiked up to Winding Stair Gap under fog, drizzle and a decent amount of rain at times. We then back tracked to Wallace Gap and walked the road back to our car.
We were surprised at how few backpackers were out there. We saw eight the first day near Standing Indian and that was it for the rest of the trip. We did see a few day hikers and one hunter (actually ON the trail with his rifle!).
No shortage of water along the trail.
All in all it was a great trip!
daddytwosticks
12-01-2008, 08:43
Lucinda...thanks for the trip report! Good info about the water situation. Glad you enjoyed the hike. :)
If it were me I'd start at Deep Gap, go south on the AT to Bly Gap make my way down to the Tallulah river. I'd return up by Big Scaly, maybe bushwhack up to the AT; though there is a trail up to AT between Beech Gap and Standing Indian and at Beech Gap. Take AT north and take side trails here and there. I like getting off the beaten path. OMO