View Full Version : foot problems - gross picture
karoberts
12-04-2008, 01:42
In July 2008, I kicked so many rocks through PA that I started bleeding under my toenail. It got infected, formed an abscess, filled with copious amounts of puss, formed a granuloma, and was all together nasty. I had to have surgery in August. They cut the granuloma off and took the nail off too. It was a very painful recovery. I couldn't walk for over a week.
Warning! Gross Picture: http://www.keith-roberts.com/carrie/P8150470.JPG
Fast forward to last week. It got infected again! I didn't even do anything to it this time. Now I have to have surgery again to take off my newly regrown nail. They are going to kill the nailbed so it can't grow back. Then I will be a 9-toenail-only freak for the rest of my life (thanks a lot Rocksylvania!).
I am feeling blue about this. Please share your AT foot problems with me and commiserate.
River Runner
12-04-2008, 02:22
Ouch that looks painful.
My son-in-law has had a lot of problems with ingrown toenails & they killed the nailbed, but they still grow back. Maybe you will be lucky & yours will grow back, only healthy this time. If not, look on the bright side - you will have one less toenail to trim, saving wear & tear on your nail clippers. :^)
Best of luck with your upcoming surgery.
fishinfred
12-04-2008, 02:29
Sorry to hear about this .What a bummer and hope it heals good this time .
When I was a kid (about 10) my dad had some major toenail problems and had to have ALL OF THEM REMOVED and they did it 1 foot at a time I think a couple months apart.I remember how bad he was hurtin especially after I accidentally stepped on his foot
I'll never forget that scream OUCH :eek:! True story
His toenails never did grow back so they must have removed the nailbed like you mention
Once he healed up he never had foot problems again though :)
Hope that will be the same for you !
Bummer. That does suck. Healthy looking feet otherwise though. I'm starting to get ganglion cysts on my feet, though not on my hands yet. Big one on my left big toe, and on the tendons under my arches. Doctor says not to worry. I'm going to try and get my weight way down now that I'm approaching 50. Anyhow your 28. You'll probably learn alot about toes and feet from the experience, and that might pay off for you in the long run. Keep on trucking, and take care of those ugly puppies.
I am feeling blue about this. Please share your AT foot problems with me and commiserate.
I haven't had any problems like that but I do suffer from foot in the mouth syndrome from time to time...........
NICKTHEGREEK
12-04-2008, 06:33
In July 2008, I kicked so many rocks through PA that I started bleeding under my toenail. It got infected, formed an abscess, filled with copious amounts of puss, formed a granuloma, and was all together nasty. I had to have surgery in August. They cut the granuloma off and took the nail off too. It was a very painful recovery. I couldn't walk for over a week.
Warning! Gross Picture: http://www.keith-roberts.com/carrie/P8150470.JPG
Fast forward to last week. It got infected again! I didn't even do anything to it this time. Now I have to have surgery again to take off my newly regrown nail. They are going to kill the nailbed so it can't grow back. Then I will be a 9-toenail-only freak for the rest of my life (thanks a lot Rocksylvania!).
I am feeling blue about this. Please share your AT foot problems with me and commiserate.
Call up a few pictures of real men who gave limbs, eyes, and lives in the service and quit your stupid whining. Hope it's not too hash for you
Call up a few pictures of real men who gave limbs, eyes, and lives in the service and quit your stupid whining. Hope it's not too hash for you
As a veteran myself, I have this to say- shut up.
Plenty of good men and women died so the rest of us can relax and talk about things trivial and not so trivial. This is a hiking website, not a forum for you to use vets as a tool to make yourself feel righteous over something that's obviously bothering this hiker.
Hope that wasn't too harsh for you.
mtnkngxt
12-04-2008, 07:40
Hope your toe gets better mate. By the way what kind of shoe were you wearing through Rocksylvania?
aaroniguana
12-04-2008, 08:06
As a veteran myself, I have this to say- shut up.
Plenty of good men and women died so the rest of us can relax and talk about things trivial and not so trivial. This is a hiking website, not a forum for you to use vets as a tool to make yourself feel righteous over something that's obviously bothering this hiker.
Hope that wasn't too harsh for you.
Awww darn it. I was going to use this as an excuse to brag about MY military service for the second time this week.
I have obscenely healthy feet due to excessive care. Past wives and GFs have told me I have the prettiest manfeet they've ever seen and wonder why I haven't ruined them hiking. I think it's genetic. :)
Omg.. that sucks !
Hiking in Georgia this past April I didn't realize I'd stubbed my toe heading north from Tray Mtn shelter. It was so cold out my toes were numb for the first 30 minutes of hiking that morning. needless to say, I ended up losing the toenail and now, December, it's only just become "normal" again in the last month.
your situation, however , looks horrid. How will not having a toenail affect your hiking ??
ps...
I once had a TI (that's an Air Force version of a DI) put his foot up my ass to get me moving. <<<there, I mentioned feet and military service in one statement.
I am somewhat curious myself about what toes and toenails are for. Probably one of those things you don't realize how important they are until they are gone. The big toe in particular I would guess is pretty important for balance, getting the feel of the ground, even walking and running speed and efficiency. I would guess the big toenail helps the big toe do all those things better. Not sure. Anyhow, if you gotta lose the nail to keep the toe or even the toe to keep the foot, I guess its worth it. Let us know how it works out.
Plodderman
12-04-2008, 09:51
Infectins are becoming more difficult to treat for some reason. Staph infection and other types of infections that get into the blood seem to be resistant to anti-biotic.
karoberts
12-04-2008, 10:31
I wore crappy running shoes in PA (and paid the price). They got holes in the toes and the soles fell off. I replaced them in DWG.
buckwheat
12-04-2008, 12:25
I am somewhat curious myself about what toes and toenails are for.
I am not a doctor, but I play one on the internet.
The toes are there to provide you with 5 independent balancers per foot. They make feet really dexterious and aid significantly in balance. Give me a large enough toe, and I could move the world. (The toe is a lever - a simple tool with which you could, theoretically, reposition planet Earth.)
The toenails are there to, in a sense, protect the toe from (relatively smaller) falling objects. Toenails are hardened proteins.
buckwheat
12-04-2008, 12:27
I wore crappy running shoes in PA (and paid the price). They got holes in the toes and the soles fell off. I replaced them in DWG.
Wow. That's hard to believe.
Your body is the most expensive piece of hiking gear you possess. I'm surprised to see any hiker not take extremely good care of that gear.
mtnkngxt
12-04-2008, 14:38
Hence the reason I wear my boots and not running shoes, they may weigh a ton, but i can kick all the rocks i want.
Blissful
12-04-2008, 15:02
Really sorry to hear this. I have a toenail on my left smallest toe that falls off every time I hike. Doesn't matter what I do or wear. Likely the shape of the toe, etc. But for sure, good shoes will alleviate problems.
Recommend also you soak your toe in Betadine solution. It can be found at drug stores.
Plodderman
12-04-2008, 16:11
I have problems with both little toes, with blisters and the nails falling off. I have tried different types of hiking shoes from boots to trail runners, moleskin, duct tape with no avail. But I keep hiking eventually I will get it right.
My big toe nails, were always too wide, and would ingrow into the side. Back when I life-guarded, they would be fine as long as I was in chlorine water. But in shoes, infected and inflamed. Back in about 1977, I had half of one nail removed and killed. It was a painful recovery!
About 10 years back, the other toe had been bad for a long time. My podiatrist did it in his office, in 30 minutes and NO pain on recovery! They now deaden the toe. pinch it to reduce blood blow. Scaple off the nail. Inject into the nail bed, some mixture that kills it AND is a pain killer / numbing agent. I didn't feel that toe for the entire week it was in bandages. Then went back and they removed the bandages and I had something like 2 weeks of home bandaging and nightly soaks.
No more pain, no infections, no problems, less nail to trim....
Maybe I should have them ALL done!
buff_jeff
12-04-2008, 16:43
As a veteran myself, I have this to say- shut up.
Plenty of good men and women died so the rest of us can relax and talk about things trivial and not so trivial. This is a hiking website, not a forum for you to use vets as a tool to make yourself feel righteous over something that's obviously bothering this hiker.
Hope that wasn't too harsh for you.
Good call. I'd expect that from a Middletown resident. :D
Most wilderness medicine books recommend draining hematomas/abscesses (pockets of blood/pus respectively) under toenails as this will relieve the majority of the pain and make a bad infection less likely as the blood and pus can drain out, hopefully taking any bacteria/fungus with it. The procedure is actually pretty easy: the wilderness medicine books I've looked at recommend taking the tip of a knife and simply spin it with light pressure in one spot on the nail, essentially using it as a drill bit. My dad once got a hematoma under his toenail skiing and he simply heated up the tip of a safety pin with a lighter and carefully pierced his toenail...no pain for the rest of the week skiing. This looked easier and it could be argued is more sterile. Either way, be careful not to go too deep.
Other tips I've read about but have not tried or seen: for ingrown toenails you can try 1: use a small piece of duct tape or bandaid and pull the little flap of skin next to the nail away from the nail (i.e. stick the bandaid onto the skin and not the nail, wrap the band aid around the toe with tension and anchor it to the nail on the same toe, thus pulling both the skin and nail away from each other and offering some temporary relief. Or, 2: using a knife or other fine, sharp instrument, slowly shave down a thin vertical (i.e. in the same axis as the long axis of your finger) portion of the nail near the ingrown side. Once it's thin enough, the nail can "buckle" taking pressure of the side of the nail and, theoretically supplying relief.
I didn't make these up...they're from a book called Wilderness Medicine.
Legal: I'm not a doctor (yet), don't sue me, YMMV, etc.
If it's one thing I hate, it's nasty foot photos!
That was a beautifully grotesque picture!
This summer while hiking the Sauratown Trail (25 miles) in one day, I bruised my little toe badly due to too tight-fitting trail runners. I lost my toenail.
BTW, in a wilderness first responder course I took 20 years ago the doctor recommended soaking wounds in as-hot-as-you-can-stand-it soapy water for 2X/day. (after piercing to remove pus). The heat improves circulation, the soapy water floats away yucky stuff, and the would heals much faster.
Otherwise keep the wound as clean as possible, and dry.
I have since used this method many times for many bad wounds for myself and others with great results.
If you have ingrown toenails.
They told me to let it grow beyond the flesh, and trim straight across. yuck
I soak my feet for an hour, grind on them with a pumice, and trim nails. The "spike" gets flexible enough you can trim or scrape it away with the toe jam removal tool.
I have done the knife tip trick and it works, nasty when you beak thru, but blessed relief. Knife tip works better than an actual drill bit. (done that too.)
I have been pretty uptight about foot hygiene since having part of a nail removed in the '70s. The local was the worst part, down in the big toe knuckle.
By the way, excellent shot of foot pox. Reminds me of FL. Old men who insist on wearing leather shoes. One old guy would spray Raid on his feet if a sugar ant walked on them. But your pox is nastier. 5 spacebucks awarded.
sasquatch2014
12-04-2008, 21:24
Hence the reason I wear my boots and not running shoes, they may weigh a ton, but i can kick all the rocks i want.
Yeah I thought that too until at the end of a 20 miler coming into HF I kicked a rock. My gate was off due to some big blisters that I was also sporting they being in fashion this past year and so my stride was different and I found myself stubbing my toes a few times. I did this in April. In july at the each after a few boogie board rides it was just about all the way off so I took it the rest of the way off. It is now almost 3/4 re-grown although it looks a bit funky. Doesn't matter it has been a bit of a tradition for my daughter to paint my toe nails when I leave for a trip. She does nail art on them as well. For my spring trip I had flowers and blue sky with white clouds. If any of you want give me a shout when you get to Pawing and she"ll hook you up. Wrongway sported some great toe art for the hike north from my house. He was a good sport about it. Either that or he was just so full of food he couldn't move fast enough to get away.
If it's one thing I hate, it's nasty foot photos!
It looked pretty nasty, but I just gotta say...
I've seen feet alot uglier that were in perfectly good health.
The posters with the little toe nail issues and in grown big toe nails should consider wider shoes (4E). My feet seem to expand as much in width when hiking as length but larger shoes mainly adjust the length.
Caveman of Ohio
12-30-2008, 12:17
I am going through the same toenail issues. Just had a ingrown toenail removed this morning. It actually was a really cool procedure. Probably one of mybetter doctor visits to date.
I fully never intend to repeat my experience. That was like '75.
The local thru the knuckle caught my attention.
adventurousmtnlvr
12-30-2008, 13:31
I'm currently recovering from foot surgery. Had half of the ball of my foot removed as it was broken for 4 years (a long time to walk on a broken one) but then that break split again and affected me to the point I finally gave in to surgery. It's difficult trying to balance as they did NOT replace it with anything. You just learn to "compensate" that's all. But as far as staph ... I get that all the time in various places ... last time under my finger nail which I was sure I'd lose but didn't. Once you get staph it goes to various places it seems and will most likely show up again some year. I think as well all have these anti-germ products (soap etc) we are causing our own problems with anti-bodies that we eventually need. Too many anti-bacterial products so our bodies can handle every day life any more ... or so it seems its heading that direction. Best wishes in your recovery ... I know first hand how painful staph in under a nail is ... I just hit my hand/nail on the stove ... days later BAM! there is was and I've been hurt much worse in my life, lol so that was just weird.
Bucky Katt
12-30-2008, 14:26
I was born with bunions. Certain family memebers of mine have nasty feet--unfortunately, I inherited them. My feet are starting to hurt like ALLLLL the time. (backpacking exacerbates the pain in a big way). On occassion it hurts too much to walk on them. At the ripe old age of 25, I'm looking at having to have my big toe joints broken and sanded down and then re-set....
How is that for commiserating? lol.
I was born with bunions. Certain family memebers of mine have nasty feet--unfortunately, I inherited them. My feet are starting to hurt like ALLLLL the time. (backpacking exacerbates the pain in a big way). On occassion it hurts too much to walk on them. At the ripe old age of 25, I'm looking at having to have my big toe joints broken and sanded down and then re-set....
How is that for commiserating? lol.
Get it done, both my mother and mother in law had it done, it changed their lives. Hurt like a beotch for a couple weeks is better than hurt some every day.
Call up a few pictures of real men who gave limbs, eyes, and lives in the service and quit your stupid whining. Hope it's not too hash for you
seriously? it's hiking forum. get a clue.
In July 2008, I kicked so many rocks through PA that I started bleeding under my toenail. It got infected, formed an abscess, filled with copious amounts of puss, formed a granuloma, and was all together nasty. I had to have surgery in August. They cut the granuloma off and took the nail off too. It was a very painful recovery. I couldn't walk for over a week.
Warning! Gross Picture: http://www.keith-roberts.com/carrie/P8150470.JPG
Fast forward to last week. It got infected again! I didn't even do anything to it this time. Now I have to have surgery again to take off my newly regrown nail. They are going to kill the nailbed so it can't grow back. Then I will be a 9-toenail-only freak for the rest of my life (thanks a lot Rocksylvania!).
I am feeling blue about this. Please share your AT foot problems with me and commiserate.
hey, there was a link not too long ago for a long distance runner that had so many problems with her big toenails, that the docs recommended that they just surgically remove the nails just like you're talking about. apparently some people are just prone to that type of foot problem. she raved about the surgery results tho so i'll go try to find that link for you.
here it is, mags posted it:
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showpost.php?p=744968&postcount=22
I quit having nail problems when I started wearing trail shoes rather than boots. Of course, I rarely stub
I quit having nail problems when I started wearing trail shoes rather than boots. Of course, I rarely stub
same thing with me. well, i didn't really get nail problems like the above, but downhills sometimes left me with black big nails and sore toes no matter how short i cut my toenails and what kind of boots i wore. and now with my merrells, no problems at all.
After getting a few sores and blisters under the toenails, it felt so goooood when they finally fell off :) IMHO,toenails are highly over-rated and quite the nuisance.
Jan LiteShoe
12-30-2008, 17:54
Didn't Nimblewill Nomad have his doctor remove his toenails (all of them) on purpose? In advance of further trauma?
Lots of interesting advice...
May I suggest that you see your local podiatrist if you are experiencing any foot related problems. Board certification is always better. You can go on apma.org to look for one near you.
Treatment appropriate for one person is sometimes contraindicated for another. Be careful, friends.
by the way...I am a doctor and did not stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
superman
12-30-2008, 21:17
Call up a few pictures of real men who gave limbs, eyes, and lives in the service and quit your stupid whining. Hope it's not too hash for you
Here's my whine.
June 1967... I also tried to think of how long it had been since I’d taken off my boots. I couldn’t remember that either but as I took off my socks there was a tug when I got to my toes. The socks came off but so did my toenails. They’d turned to puss and stuck to my socks as I took them off. They didn’t hurt. I put my feet in the nice cool water and cleaned the toenail sockets out with my fingers. I turned my socks inside out so the puss wouldn’t be against my skin.
My toenails grew back crooked but cutting V’s in them straightened the problem out in about five years.
When I finished my AT thru hike I had foot pain that didn’t go away. I started to see a VA doctor about it and that went on until last fall. I was whining that the pain had gone on long enough and the VA doctor told me that the problem is that I have PTSD in my heels. I looked at his face real close to see if he was kidding as I asked him to repeat it. The damn fool was serious so I went out and got a real doctor (non VA). It took the new doctor between 6 to 8 weeks to get me pain free. I’d gotten some good advice from some folks on Whiteblaze about where to go and what to do with my feet. I thank them for that.
karoberts
12-30-2008, 23:48
This is a fun thread. Somehow hearing about how other people lose toenails makes me feel better.
Update: I haven't had my surgery yet because my doc wanted to clear the infection before cutting into me. He gave me some antibiotics to take and we scheduled the surgery for a couple weeks from now. Here is what it looks like now. Note the half-regrown nail and the disgusting pus.
***WARNING - NASTY PIC ALERT***
http://www.keith-roberts.com/carrie/toe3.jpg
Alligator
12-30-2008, 23:58
I held off looking at the first pick because I figured it was nasty, but I couldn't resist the "recuperating" pic because I thought, "It'll only be half nasty." Well, the second pic was really nasty so I had to go and look at the first one.
That one was putrid. Hope your toe heals up soon!
Many Walks
12-31-2008, 01:09
I feel for you and can relate. I had good socks, Asolo boots a size larger than normal, broke in, and laced with heel lock. We started with too much weight and the Georgia ups and downs just beat up my feet so bad by the time we hit Damascus I had lost 4 nails. I kept them as clean as possible and was lucky to avoid infection. In Vermont we tried switching to low trail runners, but the outfitter had a limited selection and I couldn't find a size big enough. Foolishly, I opted for a size that was too snug and off went another 3. My big toe looked just like yours with the nail off and every step was a new adventure in pain. It's been over a year since we finished and my nails are just now starting to get back to normal....well, sort of. Most of the other aches and pains have finally subsided as well. I remember, when they hurt that bad it's a relief when they actually fall off. Yours will get better in time too.
mkmangold
12-31-2008, 02:48
In July 2008, I kicked so many rocks through PA that I started bleeding under my toenail. It got infected, formed an abscess, filled with copious amounts of puss, formed a granuloma, and was all together nasty. I had to have surgery in August. They cut the granuloma off and took the nail off too. It was a very painful recovery. I couldn't walk for over a week.
Warning! Gross Picture: http://www.keith-roberts.com/carrie/P8150470.JPG
Fast forward to last week. It got infected again! I didn't even do anything to it this time. Now I have to have surgery again to take off my newly regrown nail. They are going to kill the nailbed so it can't grow back. Then I will be a 9-toenail-only freak for the rest of my life (thanks a lot Rocksylvania!).
I am feeling blue about this. Please share your AT foot problems with me and commiserate.
Cool: battle scars!
Uncle Tom
12-31-2008, 07:52
My feet are still screwed up, and it has now been 15 months since I completed my thru-hike. I sustained nerve damage to both forefeet. The net effect is forefoot discomfort, present 24/7. Not bad pain , but on a scale of 1-10 about a constant 4. Consulting a podiatrist, he indicated the problem was due to a genetic abnormality involving unusually long metatarsal bones which contributed to a gait problem. I have been on a search for remedy since then. Custom orthodics have helped the right foot but not the left. I have since learned that what I am experiencing is not that uncommon. I have consulted with a good physical therapist as well. I will keep hiking in the hopes that it will not get worse. I can live with it. I am experimenting with altering my gait, which is not as wierds as it sounds.
Great picture, boy am I grossed out.
Sincerely hope you feel better soon.
karoberts
12-31-2008, 21:26
My dad got me this and put it in my stocking. Love it!
http://www.onemoremilerunning.com/stickers-etc-/car-magnets/toenails-are-for-sissies-magnet/prod_545.html
boarstone
12-31-2008, 22:00
This is a fun thread. Somehow hearing about how other people lose toenails makes me feel better.
Update: I haven't had my surgery yet because my doc wanted to clear the infection before cutting into me. He gave me some antibiotics to take and we scheduled the surgery for a couple weeks from now. Here is what it looks like now. Note the half-regrown nail and the disgusting pus.
***WARNING - NASTY PIC ALERT***
http://www.keith-roberts.com/carrie/toe3.jpg
HEY! Not bad! At least it's a healthy nail coming back....trust me, I've seen worse....