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THEmapMAKER
12-19-2008, 00:30
Whats the major differences? Do most people who hike the AT stop in Maine and not continue on? Which is more popular?

double d
12-19-2008, 01:07
Do you mean the IAT as in the Ice Age Trail in Wisconsin?

Lone Wolf
12-19-2008, 06:25
Whats the major differences? Do most people who hike the AT stop in Maine and not continue on? Which is more popular?

correct. most stop at katahdin then go home after picture taking of the sign

Gnarly
03-31-2009, 18:09
Most people only hike to Katahdin also because of the time frame allotted by Mother Nature to do a through hike. To have time to make it to Katahdin from Springer and then do the entire IAT you would have to start very early and hike at quite a pace to make it up there (to Newfoundland or however far you decide to go) before it got too cold and the weather too extreme to safely hike. There is also an extension into Alabama somewhere that I read about that some people want to get included in the official National Scenic Trail portion of the AT. It could extend another few hundred miles to the Trail, and apparently already exists to a great extent if you keep traveling south from Springer and past the approach trail. It lends more weight to the phrase "hike your own hike" when you could nearly double the length of an Appalachian hike if you traversed the whole geologic extent of the range instead of the legally sanctioned "Scenic Trail" portion.

Slo-go'en
03-31-2009, 18:20
Also, the AT "extention" to Canada is really remote and mostly follows logging roads. The logistics of resupply is a big problem.

Pedaling Fool
03-31-2009, 18:43
Do you mean the IAT as in the Ice Age Trail in Wisconsin?
That's a good point, maybe the International Appalachian Trail should stop using the acronym IAT. World Wildlife Fund got the World Wrestling Federation to drop the WWF acronym, now theyíre WWE (I think).

Why do they call it International AT any way? Iíve been to Canada, thatís not another country, theyíre just like us.

Lemni Skate
05-26-2009, 17:54
There will be one long trail starting at Key West Florida, winding through Florida and then Alabama and Georgia and then follows the current AT from Springer to Katahdin. Then continues on through New Brunswick, Ontario, PEI, Nova Scotia, Newfoundland, Greenland and then to, I kid you not, Scotland. I think they left out Iceland, but I think the rational is that parts of Greenland and Scotland were part of the Appalachian Mountains before the continents drifted apart and Iceland is a volcanic island that appeared later and was therefore never part of the Appalachian Mountain Range.

I think this would be fun, but who's going to paddle me from Newfoundland to Greenland in their canoe?

Mags
05-26-2009, 18:13
More French is spoken. ;)

LockJaww
05-26-2009, 18:29
Or if ya just really got a case of happy feet, and a couple of years .....You could walk the ADT.

weary
05-27-2009, 15:01
[SIZE=2]Why do they call it International AT any way? Iíve been to Canada, thatís not another country, theyíre just like us.
Well it is another country. There are similarities. But they are not exactly like us. Luckily, for them..

Weary

boarstone
05-27-2009, 20:02
I wish New Brunswick would adopt us....

Old Hillwalker
05-28-2009, 06:34
Cape Wrath in North Western Scotland is the easternmost end of the Appalachain Monutain Range. I just completed a 215 mile backpack of the "North to the Cape" route that runs from Fort William near the big geological split that holds Loch Ness to the Northernmost tip of Scotland, Cape Wrath. Many miles of this route that really cannot be called a trail runs through remote mountain passes and across moorland that is essentially trackless. We used 9 1:50000 maps for covering the route. Lots and lots of snow still remaining over here even at the end of May. The snow levels are at about 3000 feet and above at present. Hopefully I will be making a presentation at an ALDHA Gathering pretty soon. This little jaunt takes about 18 to 20 days since hiking through moorland and across trackless passes takes a bit of time. A 10 mile day is considered pretty good mileage under those conditions.

Scotland and England is chock full of National trails such as the West Highland Way, Hadrian's Wall, and others. This Cape Wrath route is not an official trail, neither is it on the maps, or waymarked in any manner. We used a GPS with a Scottish Memory chip on quite a few occasions to locate ourselves on our maps. It is referred to as the most extreme and remote route in the British Isles. Awesomely beautiful and wild. The final campsite before reaching the lighthouse on Cape Wrath was at Sandwood Bay (Google it) an old Viking landing site with a mile of sandy beach and sea stacks.

I recommend this route to the adventurous before it becomes more popular in a few years.

Jeff
05-28-2009, 07:18
For sure, north of Katahdin you will not have a town or hostel to visit every other day.:)

DavidNH
05-28-2009, 09:31
That's a good point, maybe the International Appalachian Trail should stop using the acronym IAT. World Wildlife Fund got the World Wrestling Federation to drop the WWF acronym, now theyíre WWE (I think).

Why do they call it International AT any way? Iíve been to Canada, thatís not another country, theyíre just like us.

You really should get out more. Canada is actually very different from America. They have the metric system. In New Brunswick, everything is bilingual and in the Quebec portion of the IAT, it is unilingual French. They have a different political system, and different accents. They have a different educational system, etc. etc. etc.

As for the IAT acronym, perhaps it should be changed to CAT or Canadian Appalachian Trail From what I have read, its best portion is in Canada anyway.

DavidNH

Pedaling Fool
05-28-2009, 12:50
You really should get out more. Canada is actually very different from America. They have the metric system. In New Brunswick, everything is bilingual and in the Quebec portion of the IAT, it is unilingual French. They have a different political system, and different accents. They have a different educational system, etc. etc. etc.

As for the IAT acronym, perhaps it should be changed to CAT or Canadian Appalachian Trail From what I have read, its best portion is in Canada anyway.

DavidNH

First off, that was a tongue-in-cheek response. Iíve never counted, but Iíve been to at least 30 countries, so who needs to "get out more". Yet, there is a glimmer of truth in my statement concerning Canada: "theyíre just like us", in comparison to any other country Iíve visited. However, I would say the country that comes in second, being "just like us" would be Australia, still much different in many respects.

As for multi-lingual nation, you really need to get out more and see the U.S. You know we are the melting pot of the world, you ever been to New Orleans? Also, just look at our Olympic teams, we have all peoples represented, this is starting to change because other countries are now starting to show a little diversity, but weíre still far in the lead.

Note: When it comes to multi-lingual cultures the U.S. or Canada doesn't really stick out as unique, many other coutries that are multi-lingual. Also many other multi-ethnic cultures, but I've never seen a country that is as intergrated as us (yes we have our racial problems, but look around the world...)

DAJA
05-28-2009, 13:25
First off, that was a tongue-in-cheek response. Iíve never counted, but Iíve been to at least 30 countries, so who needs to "get out more". Yet, there is a glimmer of truth in my statement concerning Canada: "theyíre just like us", in comparison to any other country Iíve visited. However, I would say the country that comes in second, being "just like us" would be Australia, still much different in many respects.

As for multi-lingual nation, you really need to get out more and see the U.S. You know we are the melting pot of the world, you ever been to New Orleans? Also, just look at our Olympic teams, we have all peoples represented, this is starting to change because other countries are now starting to show a little diversity, but weíre still far in the lead.

Note: When it comes to multi-lingual cultures the U.S. or Canada doesn't really stick out as unique, many other coutries that are multi-lingual. Also many other multi-ethnic cultures, but I've never seen a country that is as intergrated as us (yes we have our racial problems, but look around the world...)

The difference being that in Canada we recognize two "official" language's, French and English. We don't expect others to integrate, but rather offer them the freedom to practice there language, culture, religion and traditions openly. Canada is not considered a melting pot but rather a salad bowl, each ethnicity is recognized as unique and not expected to meld into the whole of Canadian Culture. We encourage diversity of all sorts.

Does it work in practice is debatable and depends on what side of the issue you find yourself... While I apprechiate the rights of the French to be able to recieve all services and programs in their mother tonque, the cost to the tax payer to provide services in both languages is enormous..

Further, recently there have been a lot of situations were in an effort to be PC, we have gone to far. For instance, Government offices and schools can no longer openly celebrate or decorate for holidays such as Christmas due to its Christian (more acurately Pegan) background, as it may offend employee's of other faiths... All very reasonable, and understandable, but at times seems to be missing the origional intent of the salad bowl theory...

There was a principle in a local elementary school here in NB who recently halted the daily morning singing of the national anthem due to references to God in the anthem. He did this out of respect of a minority of kids who where from different faiths. He said he would continue to play the anthem for special assembly's as a comprimise. This single incident created a huge national debate that ended in the principle quietly resigning. The poor guy recieved death threats... I cannot imagine being that blindly patriotic that I would threaten a man's life because he was attempting to be respectful and tolerent... It's not like we choose where we are born... I could just as easily be Afgan or German... People are strange indeed..

Pedaling Fool
05-28-2009, 13:38
Just for claification, there is NO offical language of the United States. There is a movement to establish English as the official language, which I disagree with, and I don't think it will happen.

We also have two primary languages here in the states, English and Spanish. You can not anything without there being instructions in at least one other language, and if only one other language it will be Spanish. It's almost required for a business to interpret certain things in Spanish.

DAJA
05-28-2009, 13:42
Back to the IAT... If you where to hike it today, you would find a great deal of road walking and what was not road walking would be walking long stretches of old rail bed. However, just recently the Canadian Government has announced $30 million in new funding for trail development and maintance. So hopefully in the next five years you will see the road sections replaced by wilderness trail sections... The Quebec and Newfoundland sections would be stunning!

DAJA
05-28-2009, 13:51
Just for claification, there is NO offical language of the United States. There is a movement to establish English as the official language, which I disagree with, and I don't think it will happen.

We also have two primary languages here in the states, English and Spanish. You can not anything without there being instructions in at least one other language, and if only one other language it will be Spanish. It's almost required for a business to interpret certain things in Spanish.

Funny story, in my teenage years I got pulled over by the RCMP for speeding and requested the officer speak to me in French (I don't speak French) and requested my ticket be written in French. Because he only spoke english he clearly couldn't respond to my request and continued to deal with me in english. I showed up to court on the date stated on the ticket and explained to the Judge that I requested to be dealt with in French and the officer could not and did not comply. The Judge scolded the officer and tore up my ticket...

:banana

Mags
05-28-2009, 14:01
I imagine hiking the Chic Chocs to Gaspe' would be the highlight of the IAT. What a way to end the trail!

http://www.summitpost.org/mountain/rock/152381/mont-richardson.html
http://www.summitpost.org/mountain/rock/150774/jacques-cartier.html

(links above for Chic Chocs..more for photos..sweet looking!

http://members.virtualtourist.com/m/34414/dde4c/
(Nice photo of the cape itself)


As a piece of trivia, the original ending of IAT at Gaspe' has a 1990s version of the famous Springer Mtn plaque. Notice which way the hiker is facing! :)


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/78/Forillontrail.JPG/450px-Forillontrail.JPG

IIRC, the IAT folks received the blessing of GATC to do a sister plaque (if you will)

..just for reference:
http://emapstore.com/sc_blue_ridge_mountains/Hike/springer_mtn_ga_at.jpg

bulldog49
05-28-2009, 14:06
The difference being that in Canada we recognize two "official" language's, French and English. We don't expect others to integrate, but rather offer them the freedom to practice there language, culture, religion and traditions openly. Canada is not considered a melting pot but rather a salad bowl, each ethnicity is recognized as unique and not expected to meld into the whole of Canadian Culture. We encourage diversity of all sorts.

Does it work in practice is debatable and depends on what side of the issue you find yourself... While I apprechiate the rights of the French to be able to recieve all services and programs in their mother tonque, the cost to the tax payer to provide services in both languages is enormous..

Further, recently there have been a lot of situations were in an effort to be PC, we have gone to far. For instance, Government offices and schools can no longer openly celebrate or decorate for holidays such as Christmas due to its Christian (more acurately Pegan) background, as it may offend employee's of other faiths... All very reasonable, and understandable, but at times seems to be missing the origional intent of the salad bowl theory...

There was a principle in a local elementary school here in NB who recently halted the daily morning singing of the national anthem due to references to God in the anthem. He did this out of respect of a minority of kids who where from different faiths. He said he would continue to play the anthem for special assembly's as a comprimise. This single incident created a huge national debate that ended in the principle quietly resigning. The poor guy recieved death threats... I cannot imagine being that blindly patriotic that I would threaten a man's life because he was attempting to be respectful and tolerent... It's not like we choose where we are born... I could just as easily be Afgan or German... People are strange indeed..



So exactly why is it that the "minority religion" kids can't be tolerant of the majority when the anthem is sung? :confused:

zoidfu
05-28-2009, 14:44
..............................

DAJA
05-28-2009, 14:46
So exactly why is it that the "minority religion" kids can't be tolerant of the majority when the anthem is sung? :confused:

Excellent question, and one I don't have an answer too.. That's why I say it is debatable how well it works in practice. I suppose you could argue that because we vow not to discriminate against any belief, culture, language or religion that if we don't have time to properly recognize all religions both majority and minority than we shouldn't recognize any. It goes back to being a salad bowl as opposed to a melting pot. In a melting pot the wishes of the majority are recognized. In Canada, supposedly, the interests of all are recognized, and if you can't recognize them all, you recognize none.

You have to remember the singing of the anthem is a age old tradition, stemming back to the days when everyone for the most part would be of christian background. So I guess this principle was trying to update an old tradition by limiting the singing of the anthem everyday out of respect for the minority of different faiths..

Who's right, I have no idea, but it sure stirs some strong debates nationally..

Frosty
05-28-2009, 15:50
First off, that was a tongue-in-cheek response. Second off, you must realize that on the internet no one can see your cheek. You made a statement and lacking any clue that you were kidding, people took you literally. Granted it was a very funny thing to say once we realize it was a joke, but how was anyone to know that you were joking?

Third off, beyond that, what you are doing here is a classic internet troll trap, where you say something, and when someone responds to your literal statement, you go beserk on them and bring out the machine guns and flame-throwers:



Iíve never counted, but Iíve been to at least 30 countries, so who needs to "get out more". Yet, there is a glimmer of truth in my statement concerning Canada: "theyíre just like us", in comparison to any other country Iíve visited. However, I would say the country that comes in second, being "just like us" would be Australia, still much different in many respects.

As for multi-lingual nation, you really need to get out more and see the U.S. You know we are the melting pot of the world, you ever been to New Orleans? Also, just look at our Olympic teams, we have all peoples represented, this is starting to change because other countries are now starting to show a little diversity, but weíre still far in the lead.

Note: When it comes to multi-lingual cultures the U.S. or Canada doesn't really stick out as unique, many other coutries that are multi-lingual. Also many other multi-ethnic cultures, but I've never seen a country that is as intergrated as us (yes we have our racial problems, but look around the world...)

Pedaling Fool
05-28-2009, 16:40
Second off, you must realize that on the internet no one can see your cheek. You made a statement and lacking any clue that you were kidding, people took you literally. Granted it was a very funny thing to say once we realize it was a joke, but how was anyone to know that you were joking?
It was an obvious tounge-in-cheek remark to anyone that has been overseas. I can't speak to everyone and I sometimes forget to add:D

Third off, beyond that, what you are doing here is a classic internet troll trap, where you say something, and when someone responds to your literal statement, you go beserk on them and bring out the machine guns and flame-throwers:
However, that statement was by no means trolling, you obviously don't know what you're talking about...yes I'm trolling now, but only for frostys:D

CowHead
05-28-2009, 18:06
what about that little part of maine pass Katahdin it just seems strange not to complete the state

weary
05-29-2009, 16:51
Just for claification, there is NO offical language of the United States. There is a movement to establish English as the official language, which I disagree with, and I don't think it will happen.

We also have two primary languages here in the states, English and Spanish. You can not anything without there being instructions in at least one other language, and if only one other language it will be Spanish. It's almost required for a business to interpret certain things in Spanish.
In Maine we have two primary languages: Various dialects of Maine (some are similar to English) and Quebec French (unlike anything spoken in France.)

Weary

Graywolf
09-06-2009, 21:03
In Maine we have two primary languages: Various dialects of Maine (some are similar to English) and Quebec French (unlike anything spoken in France.)

Weary

I speak 2 American languages and both ARE american. One never is spoken outside of America, So THERE.

Lets please get on with HIKING.

Mitakuye oyasin - We are ALL related!!

Snowleopard
09-06-2009, 21:38
Maybe we should call it the SIA, for Sentier International des Appalaches.
Alas, my French pronunciation is really bad.
The section through Gaspe is supposed to be fantastic. There are parts finished in Newfoundland and that should also be great. I like the idea of a trail that is remote.

Graywolf
09-07-2009, 01:25
I think Nimbellwill Nomad gives an excellent account in his book/journal "Ten Million Steps". He really describes the IAT with fever. You alt to check it out. If you can't find the book then you can find it on his web site, www.nimbelwillnomad.com (http://www.nimbelwillnomad.com) You can read it here along with his other hikes including his most current one. He also has some really good gear lists for those interested.

For one, I don't understand what is the bickering from some of the folks here on the IAT. I think it is a great addition to the AT, and hikers have a choice of doing just 2160 miles or go for broke. It's your choice.

WalkingStick75
09-07-2009, 17:14
I speak 2 American languages and both ARE american. One never is spoken outside of America, So THERE.

Lets please get on with HIKING.

Mitakuye oyasin - We are ALL related!!

Just finished hiking 240 km of the SIA and while in Quebec I found that those hiking spoke a common language - hiking.... with the help of sign language and a French dictionary we communicated very well :)

I will be writing a trip report shortly

Graywolf
09-08-2009, 01:02
Just finished hiking 240 km of the SIA and while in Quebec I found that those hiking spoke a common language - hiking.... with the help of sign language and a French dictionary we communicated very well :)

I will be writing a trip report shortly

Hey Walking Stick, That is a good language. Hiking is very diversified and easy to understand.

BTW, my post was in comment to the post putting down English. I love diversity. One day I am going to hike to the Gaspe too. I hear it is beautiful up there.

Hope your trip went well!!!

Different Socks
08-15-2010, 00:30
You really should get out more. Canada is actually very different from America. They have the metric system. In New Brunswick, everything is bilingual and in the Quebec portion of the IAT, it is unilingual French. They have a different political system, and different accents. They have a different educational system, etc. etc. etc.

As for the IAT acronym, perhaps it should be changed to CAT or Canadian Appalachian Trail From what I have read, its best portion is in Canada anyway.

DavidNH

Gotta agree with you on the CAT designation. Seems every time I mention IAT to people they think I mean the AT extension.

88BlueGT
04-29-2011, 11:02
what about that little part of maine pass Katahdin it just seems strange not to complete the state

You don't need to complete the state because you complete the trail. The Appalachian National Scenic Trail that is.

weary
04-29-2011, 11:33
You really should get out more. Canada is actually very different from America. They have the metric system. In New Brunswick, everything is bilingual and in the Quebec portion of the IAT, it is unilingual French. They have a different political system, and different accents. They have a different educational system, etc. etc. etc.

As for the IAT acronym, perhaps it should be changed to CAT or Canadian Appalachian Trail From what I have read, its best portion is in Canada anyway.

DavidNH
And real universal health insurance. The guy who first dreamed of the IAT has sort of gotten carried away with his extensions. He's probably got the trail running all the way to North Africa by now. That's where fossils can be found that otherwise are only found in northern Maine.

LDog
04-29-2011, 11:34
Second off, you must realize that on the internet no one can see your cheek. You made a statement and lacking any clue that you were kidding, people took you literally.

I didn't


Granted it was a very funny thing to say once we realize it was a joke, but how was anyone to know that you were joking?

Twas pretty obvious to me


Third off, beyond that, what you are doing here is a classic internet troll trap, where you say something, and when someone responds to your literal statement, you go beserk on them and bring out the machine guns and flame-throwers:

How ironic.:rolleyes:

JAK
04-29-2011, 11:38
I think the best way to continue on from Katahdin would be by some sort of canoe / portage route, like the Maliseet Trail, and then on up the St.John River and the Tobique. From there the IAT starts to get interesting again, i.e. ridgelines.

http://www.maliseettrail.com/

88BlueGT
04-29-2011, 11:47
And real universal health insurance. The guy who first dreamed of the IAT has sort of gotten carried away with his extensions. He's probably got the trail running all the way to North Africa by now. That's where fossils can be found that otherwise are only found in northern Maine.

They're working on it.

Spirit Walker
04-29-2011, 19:39
One of the biggest issues for hiking the IAT after hiking the AT is that in Canada you need permits and reservations for campsites in most of the National Parks. That requires a level of planning that most AT thruhikers aren't willing to do. It means staying on schedule. It also can get quite expensive.

Snowleopard
04-29-2011, 20:18
I haven't hiked it yet, so this is all from trailjournals and the websites. The Quebec and Newfoundland sections are supposed to be very pretty.

One of the biggest issues for hiking the IAT after hiking the AT is that in Canada you need permits and reservations for campsites in most of the National Parks. That requires a level of planning that most AT thruhikers aren't willing to do. It means staying on schedule. It also can get quite expensive.
There's been some changes in the rules and reservations for Quebec are no longer required for thru-hikers. The Maine and New Brunswick sections have always been looser, but apparently there's a fair amount of road walking.

The IAT-QC passport is a thru-hiker permssion to camp without reservation in the IAT-QC accommodation sites. Over permitting cheaper accommodation, the passport allows the hiker to be more flexible with their itinerary. Even though the rules state that a hiker with a passport should give their spot to a person with a Sepaq reservation, there has never been such a problem up to now and the thru-hikers have a camping platform especially for them along the IAT in the Gaspesie National Park.
http://www.sia-iat.com/en/longue_rando_passeport.html
The passport costs $355, but if you join the quebec chapter of sia I think you get a discount. It is more expensive than just the passport because you will need to sometimes stay at hotels or campgrounds that aren't covered. Food can be expensive also and resupply is not always easy.

The shelters/refuges are apparently very nice. Sometimes the trails are not. There is no stealth camping allowed in the Quebec section.http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?trailname=11117
PluggerJohn has lots of info in his trailjournal:

DavidNH
07-29-2011, 18:32
John Gault.. Canada is most definitely a different country and, no they are NOT just like us. For starters. in the Gaspe Peninsula area no one will speak English. they could but why should they? Beyond that their political system is different, their philosophies are different and their currency is different and worth lots more than ours. Man you gotta get out more!

They call it International AT because the trail runs through two countries (US and Canada). Personally, I'd prefer the IAT became the CAT or Canadian Appalachian Trail. But then the french translation would not fit in crossword like fashion as the IAT translation of SIA (Sentier International des Appalaches) does.

atraildreamer
07-30-2011, 13:03
Well it is another country. There are similarities. But they are not exactly like us. Luckily, for them..

Weary

Our beer is better than their beer. :)

First time I drove into Canada (early '70's), I stopped at the border crossing and a petite young lady in a blue customs officer uniform waved my car up to where she was standing. She asked where I was from (RI), where I was going (Expo in Montreal), and wished me a nice day and a good trip! :welcomeI said: "Is that it? No ID requested, no search of the vehicle, etc. She said:" NO...enjoy Expo!" :sun

Once into Canada, the town was indistinguishable from the states other than the funny looking money and the gas being sold in liters. :confused:

Today...thanks to 9-11, you need at least passport card, expect a search of your vehicle, and probably some form of profiling. How times have changed! :(