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RITBlake
01-03-2009, 21:17
I know all about Yogi's guide, but it seems like it would be impractical to carry it for the entirety of a PCT thru hike. Is there a smaller, bound book similar to the wingfoot book?

note:

I am ordering Yogi's book for planning purposes but want to know if its what I should be using for a day to day PCT guide.

Mags
01-03-2009, 21:54
Yogi's guide splits into two parts -

The first part is the pre-trail stuff and is in a larger page format.

The second part is like Wingfoot's book. Smaller format and easily broken into different chunks for sections of trail and mailing out as needed.

Along with Yogi's book (which is basically a town guide), you may want:

The guidebooks needed to hike the PCT are all available from the Pacific Crest Trail Association. The guide books to get are:

The Pacific Crest Trail: Southern California
The Pacific Crest Trail: Northern California
The Pacific Crest Trail: Oregon and Washington

These three books have the trail maps and descriptions needed for each state. Strongly suggest buying these books!

Pacific Crest Trail Data Book
Very similar to the AT Data Book. Has mileage guide, water info, elevations, etc. Another useful book.

Additionally, these maps are available that have been used and enjoyed by other PCTers:
US Forest Service Maps for the PCT
A series of nine color maps of the PCT that has all the topographic information for the PCT. Some people prefer these maps to the ones in the guidebook. These maps can be ordered from the PCTA.

Tom Harrison Maps for the JMT
A very detailed set of maps for the JMT portion of the PCT. In a heavy snow year, some people have found these maps more useful than the the PCT maps in the guidebook. These maps can also be ordered from the PCTA.

PCTATLAS.COM
The full set of maps will becoming out by Spring 2009. Put out by "Eric the Black", these maps are essentially full color topos with very streamlined info of the above resources. Initial reports are that some hikers very much like the streamlined info; others like more verbose info and want more details. As always, YMMV. They can be ordered from http://www.pctatlas.com/



Here's a Q&D guide I wrote that may be helpful:
http://www.pmags.com/joomla/index.php/Backpacking-and-Hiking-documents/PCT-Info.html

Sly
01-03-2009, 21:56
I'm the PCT guru. Have any questions?

In the meantime, check out all of Mags' links.

PS I just got Eric the Black's sample chapter in an email, it looks great.

PSS Halfmile has printable maps for all of CA, and lots of GPS and other info (for free)

http://www.pctmap.net/map/

Ron Haven
01-03-2009, 22:23
I'm the PCT guru. Have any questions?

In the meantime, check out all of Mags' links.

PS I just got Eric the Black's sample chapter in an email, it looks great.

PSS Halfmile has printable maps for all of CA, and lots of GPS and other info (for free)

http://www.pctmap.net/map/ Ok here goes,when you are on the PCT.How far is it from here to yonder???

Sly
01-03-2009, 22:26
Ok here goes,when you are on the PCT.How far is it from here to yonder???

That's an easy one, within walking distance. ;)

Bulldawg
01-03-2009, 22:30
Ok here goes,when you are on the PCT.How far is it from here to yonder???

I bet it is from that big ole tall tree shaped like an H over to that lil short tree that looks like a human, past uncle Jim's place and around Aunt Clara's barn.

Ron Haven
01-03-2009, 23:52
I bet it is from that big ole tall tree shaped like an H over to that lil short tree that looks like a human, past uncle Jim's place and around Aunt Clara's barn.I have learned how to follow some of those directions:D


That's an easy one, within walking distance. ;)Good Answer!!!!:)

Jim Adams
01-04-2009, 00:02
That's an easy one, within walking distance. ;)
So true but you can SEE the next 4 days of trail!!!!!!:eek:

geek

RITBlake
01-04-2009, 00:38
Yogi's guide splits into two parts -


Mags....as always.....thanks!

Worldwide
01-04-2009, 08:21
Yogi's book was a joke. The big one with all the hiker interviews with no useful info to an experienced hiker. Her small town guide is ok I guess. The Data Book is a must I feel.

Sly
01-04-2009, 11:55
Yogi's book was a joke. The big one with all the hiker interviews with no useful info to an experienced hiker. Her small town guide is ok I guess. The Data Book is a must I feel.

A joke?

It's a good book if don't know much about the PCT. It has tons of advice by experienced hikers and data you'd have to spend days, and weeks, trying to find and is updated annually where as the Databook every few years.

yappy
01-04-2009, 12:05
The data book used to me very good. I know Gentle Ben is very thorough.

Frosty
01-04-2009, 12:09
I bet it is from that big ole tall tree shaped like an H over to that lil short tree that looks like a human, past uncle Jim's place and around Aunt Clara's barn.Too definitive. More like, "past where Uncle Jim used to live and around the spot where Aunt Clara broke her leg that big winter, just before you get to the place where Cousin Ron used to camp a lot."

A-Train
01-04-2009, 12:11
Blake:
Get the Yogi, data book and the state guidebooks. They are all good in different ways. The Yogi is excellent whether you are an experienced hiker or not. The AT or other trails have little in common with the PCT so being an "experienced hiker" means little unless you've hiked the PCT recently. Her guide is very informative for planning maildrops. Her on trail guide, IMO, is less helpful, but has some good tips/helpful advice.

Sly
01-04-2009, 12:16
The data book used to me very good. I know Gentle Ben is very thorough.

No doubt about it. All the data is painstakingly taken from the guidebooks and written into a very handy format. The water alerts are great. However, if the guidebooks don't get updated, neither does the databook. Currently, there's a new(er) set of guidebooks but the databook hasn't been updated.

Also, the guides don't have as much town info as Yogi, nor cache info.

yappy
01-04-2009, 12:30
We hiked with gentle ben in 96. he was a pretty interesting person. he really embraced all the challenges. he never complained and he seemed to revel in what might have scared him. he was also quiet and humble. I had to lean in to hear him. I had some great late night conversations with that guy.

Ron Haven
01-04-2009, 12:37
Too definitive. More like, "past where Uncle Jim used to live and around the spot where Aunt Clara broke her leg that big winter, just before you get to the place where Cousin Ron used to camp a lot."That's a real good one.Frosty how have you been?

RITBlake
01-04-2009, 14:01
Blake:
Get the Yogi, data book and the state guidebooks. They are all good in different ways. The Yogi is excellent whether you are an experienced hiker or not. The AT or other trails have little in common with the PCT so being an "experienced hiker" means little unless you've hiked the PCT recently. Her guide is very informative for planning maildrops. Her on trail guide, IMO, is less helpful, but has some good tips/helpful advice.

Cool, I may need to pick your brain in the near future. I just got the green light to get the PCT wheels in motion and I'm toying w/ the idea of leaving this spring.

clured
01-04-2009, 21:38
On the same topic - I ordered the three (huge, heavy) state-by-state books with the maps and the data book with the AT-style mileage index, but I really don't want to carry BOTH books at the same time, especially considering that the big guidebooks weigh like a pound and a half a piece. If at all possible I want to avoid any mail drops, so cutting the book up is not on the table.

Would it be possible to just hike with the data book and maps, or is there info in the guidebooks that is essential? Assuming you can competently read a map..? I would much rather just print out maps and stuff them into the data book

Thanks,
David

A-Train
01-04-2009, 21:41
On the same topic - I ordered the three (huge, heavy) state-by-state books with the maps and the data book with the AT-style mileage index, but I really don't want to carry BOTH books at the same time, especially considering that the big guidebooks weigh like a pound and a half a piece. If at all possible I want to avoid any mail drops, so cutting the book up is not on the table.

Would it be possible to just hike with the data book and maps, or is there info in the guidebooks that is essential? Assuming you can competently read a map..? I would much rather just print out maps and stuff them into the data book

Thanks,
David

That'd be challenging because the text in the guidebook is printed all around the maps and on the other sides. The text isn't all that helpful, all you really need is the maps and the data book info. The Yogi on trail notes are helpful but not neccessary.

Most everyone does a least a couple drops in Oregon and Wash so you could cut up the book (what I did). For Cali my partner carried our maps and I never really used them amazingly enough.

Johnny Swank
01-04-2009, 22:06
I've got Eric the Black's sample chapter as well. If the rest of the package is as slick as this, I'm definitely buying his guide as they becomes available.

Yogi's guide looks to be great as far as the prep work goes.

neighbor dave
01-05-2009, 08:59
Blake:
Get the Yogi, data book and the state guidebooks. They are all good in different ways. The Yogi is excellent whether you are an experienced hiker or not. The AT or other trails have little in common with the PCT so being an "experienced hiker" means little unless you've hiked the PCT recently. Her guide is very informative for planning maildrops. Her on trail guide, IMO, is less helpful, but has some good tips/helpful advice.

:-? i agree with A-Train:D
plus i found halfmiles maps to be great, actually i hiked with the data book, yogi pages and halfmiles maps until his maps ran out, then hiked with the state guidebooks.:welcome

Sly
01-05-2009, 10:46
On the same topic - I ordered the three (huge, heavy) state-by-state books with the maps and the data book with the AT-style mileage index, but I really don't want to carry BOTH books at the same time, especially considering that the big guidebooks weigh like a pound and a half a piece. If at all possible I want to avoid any mail drops, so cutting the book up is not on the table.

Would it be possible to just hike with the data book and maps, or is there info in the guidebooks that is essential? Assuming you can competently read a map..? I would much rather just print out maps and stuff them into the data book

Thanks,
David

Th guide books have a lots of info and lots of fluff. If you're good with maps you good probably get by with Halfmile's maps through CA and Eric's PCT Atlas's through OR and WA. Problem is, it' nearly impossible to get through the PCT without doing some mail drops. CA is 1700 miles with maybe 5 definite mail drops and both OR and WA you'll need them through the entire states, sending from Ashland and Cascade Locks

Sly
01-05-2009, 10:58
For Cali my partner carried our maps and I never really used them amazingly enough.

You must not have had much snow or followed someone. ;)

yappy
01-05-2009, 11:02
We bought in Ashland for Or and we bought in Cascade locks for Wa. it saved some bucks in shipping for AK. Hi Neighbor....:) heading east on Wed. Maybe I can get my Dad to take a road trip to NH.

Screech
01-05-2009, 11:04
all of my books and reading material are in the mail to me and I am trying to get on the ball filling out my permits.

I see on the PCTA thru hiker permit page found here http://www.pcta.org//planning/before_trip/permits/thru_permit_form.html that I need an approximate climbing date for Mt. Whitney. I also see that if you get a membership to the PCTA then it says you don't need to reserve a date for Mount Whitney.

Im a little confused on exactly what they mean. From the looks of the permit I am still supposed to pay 15 bucks and put down an approximate date. Since I don;t have my books yet what is a good amount of time to presume it will take to get to the Mt. Whitney portal if I am starting the trail mid April.

Thanks.

Screech
01-05-2009, 11:11
Also I was on a prettly low budget on the AT and avoided staying in hostels like the plague. As far as food and critical supplies such as fuel can I expect to pay a bit more or a bit less for food than on the AT. I am expecting to have to pay a tad more. Is it difficult to hitch to wal mart type resupplys or can you expect to be shopping at smaller grocery establishments. How often can I expect to pay large sums extra because the only resupply is at mom and pop stores in the middle of nowhere. I do know there are the 5 mail drop points you pretty much have to use, but other than that what is getting food like?

Sly
01-05-2009, 11:16
all of my books and reading material are in the mail to me and I am trying to get on the ball filling out my permits.

I see on the PCTA thru hiker permit page found here http://www.pcta.org//planning/before_trip/permits/thru_permit_form.html that I need an approximate climbing date for Mt. Whitney. I also see that if you get a membership to the PCTA then it says you don't need to reserve a date for Mount Whitney.

Im a little confused on exactly what they mean. From the looks of the permit I am still supposed to pay 15 bucks and put down an approximate date. Since I don;t have my books yet what is a good amount of time to presume it will take to get to the Mt. Whitney portal if I am starting the trail mid April.

Thanks.

PCT hikers generally don't go to the portal. That's on the eastern side and a long way down. 99 switchbacks. PCT hikers approach Whitney from the west, tag Whitney, reverse their steps and hike on. Everyone, that climbs, is suppose to have a Whitney stamp ($15). If you've never been, it's worth the trip, and usually quite easy after hiking from Campo.

If you have a approximate date to reach Kennedy Meadows, add 4 or 5 days and you should be on Whitney.

I would say most people bag Whitney mid June. Starting mid April you'll have lots of time to get there.

Screech
01-05-2009, 11:25
The only approximate date I have is that I have the pipe dream of reaching Seattle by August 22.

Screech
01-05-2009, 11:29
At the point I got off the AT SOBO this year i was on target for finishing the trail in just under 5 months, and that was at a relaxed pace. So barring unfortuante circumstances I think I can make it to Seattle in time.

I just don't know any of the mileages yet since I don't have all my books so I am unsure when to approximate my arrival at Whitney.

Why don't these forums allow you to edit your text after you post it?

MOWGLI
01-05-2009, 11:31
Why don't these forums allow you to edit your text after you post it?

You can if you are a donating member.

Sly
01-05-2009, 11:32
Also I was on a prettly low budget on the AT and avoided staying in hostels like the plague. As far as food and critical supplies such as fuel can I expect to pay a bit more or a bit less for food than on the AT. I am expecting to have to pay a tad more. Is it difficult to hitch to wal mart type resupplys or can you expect to be shopping at smaller grocery establishments. How often can I expect to pay large sums extra because the only resupply is at mom and pop stores in the middle of nowhere. I do know there are the 5 mail drop points you pretty much have to use, but other than that what is getting food like?

Food is more on the PCT but most of the hostels are free or donation only. You should try to save some money to donate something. These people go out of their way to help PCT hikers. Not all towns have hostels in which case you'll need a motel room. Since hitching is generally harder, and towns further away, it's not always easy to get in and out of town the same day.

Overall, it cost more to hike the PCT. Seriously, I wouldn't leave home with less than $4K and expect to complete the trail.

Sly
01-05-2009, 11:36
The only approximate date I have is that I have the pipe dream of reaching Seattle by August 22.


At the point I got off the AT SOBO this year i was on target for finishing the trail in just under 5 months, and that was at a relaxed pace. So barring unfortuante circumstances I think I can make it to Seattle in time.


Rule of thumb is add a third to your AT miles to get PCT miles. For example, if you hike 15 a day on the AT, you can expect to hike 20 on the PCT. That said, 30 mile days are not uncommon once you have your trail legs, if you don't mind pounding feet.

yappy
01-05-2009, 11:37
in 96 we did alot of mail drops but ending up buying in town as well.. the stores are pretty fair for the most part but the little ouposts in Or and Wa can be sparce. We were out again in 02 and it had'nt changed much... but we only did Wa and Or that year. The $ were spendy . I paid 2 bucks for a freaking luna bar at White pass.

Screech
01-05-2009, 11:37
I hiked ME-VA on like 500 bucks. I fail to believe it will take anywhere near 4 grand for the PCT.

yappy
01-05-2009, 11:38
and yeah... you can cook on the Pct. There are plently of fast miles on it.

Sly
01-05-2009, 11:41
I hiked ME-VA on like 500 bucks. I fail to believe it will take anywhere near 4 grand for the PCT.

Really, how many hiker boxes were your main food supply? They're few and far between on the PCT and shouldn't be relied upon. And how bad did you stink?

Do the math... if it takes you 150 days to do the trail x $10 per day in food that's $1500. Not counting any mailing, any hostels or motel, any beer, any restaurants, any gear replacement, etc. You'll likely go through 3-5 pair of shoes.

Maybe you can do it, like I said, I wouldn't try without $4K in the bank.

yappy
01-05-2009, 11:49
I guess if you did huge miles most of your trip and did'nt go to town much you could get away with 2800 or so but Sly is correct... it can be a spendy hike. Oh yeah, and eat ramen ALOT.

Sly
01-05-2009, 12:00
I guess if you did huge miles most of your trip and did'nt go to town much you could get away with 2800 or so but Sly is correct... it can be a spendy hike. Oh yeah, and eat ramen ALOT.

I don't know why any one would go hike on the west coast to live like a bum. For many it's their one and only trip.

Screech
01-05-2009, 12:01
Nope I wasnt really living out of hiker boxes, I just knew I couldnt afford to splurge on pointless things. I usually bought extra when it was cheap and carried longer.

Like how much more expensive is food at the stores. I already know this will be a more expensive hike but how often am I going to be facing things like 3 dollar Lipton Sides, overpriced peanut butter, ridiculous raisins, and all the low budget things hikers get down on? The AT gave me ample opportunity to do things like buy Wal Mart generic lipton sides for like 80 cents a piece. I doubt Ill get that lucky that often.

I was expecting to spend about 1500 this time so from what you guys are saying(since you specifically stated 1500) that seems realistic.

yappy
01-05-2009, 12:13
I agree Sly, why anyone would want to rip thru and not spend time in some of the VERY cool towns along the way is beyond me. But, alot of folks do. We met a guy who barely went into town ... all he ate was cheap granola bars and ramen.. even cold with ketchup. Ugh. I ended up sharing food with him cuz I felt bad. But, that was all the $ he had and he really wanted to hike. I think he had a great time too... I guess he felt that this was his chance so he took it.

MOWGLI
01-05-2009, 12:18
Hikes can be done on the cheap. It all depends on what you're looking for. I admire folks who stay out longer and don't go into every little town. Most young folks get with a posse, and want to stay with them, partying in every little town & hostel. Others don't want to walk in the rain, and won't leave town if it's raining. That chews up the $$$.

I'd be interested to see a thread on creative ways for hikers to save money on a long distance hike. Unfortunately, these threads usually devolve into an argument, when some folks insist it simply can't be done.

Jim Adams
01-05-2009, 12:23
I hiked ME-VA on like 500 bucks. I fail to believe it will take anywhere near 4 grand for the PCT.
2007 I paid $6 for a foil pouch of tuna.:eek:
You can't find a cheeseburger and fries for less than $10. With a soft drink or a beer, tax and a tip you are spending $20 for lunch just about everywhere.
I did 1,000 miles from Campo to Yosemite and it cost me the same or more than either of my AT thrus. Almost all town resupplies are an overnight ordeal and motels aren't as cheap as the AT hostels.

geek

yappy
01-05-2009, 12:27
Very true Mowgli... you can do these hikes on the cheap...and some would say not miss out on anything. I know plenty of hikers that go in get there food and head back out on the trail... saving that 100.00 for another town. I guess what really matters is doing your hike and enjoying it. I feel for the folks that don't go in cuz they are broke. I see on thier faces that they would like to go in and enjoy all the amenities but they can't. That would suck. I think alot of folks think they won't want to " get out of the wilderness " when they are planning things in the living room.... then they get out.. and things change.

You can do it fairly cheap and still have a great hike as long as you understand that you won't be in town that much. I am old.. I like town :) but it sure ain't they only way to hike.

The groceries on the Pct can be $ in thier own right. There is'nt much in the way of hiker boxes or hostels. I think it is still more $ then the AT even if ya don't go in much.

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 12:39
Th guide books have a lots of info and lots of fluff. If you're good with maps you good probably get by with Halfmile's maps through CA and Eric's PCT Atlas's through OR and WA. Problem is, it' nearly impossible to get through the PCT without doing some mail drops. CA is 1700 miles with maybe 5 definite mail drops and both OR and WA you'll need them through the entire states, sending from Ashland and Cascade Locks

Can someone please tell me where I can get Halfmile's maps??

Sly
01-05-2009, 12:42
Hikes can be done on the cheap. It all depends on what you're looking for. I admire folks who stay out longer and don't go into every little town. Most young folks get with a posse, and want to stay with them, partying in every little town & hostel. Others don't want to walk in the rain, and won't leave town if it's raining. That chews up the $$$.

I'd be interested to see a thread on creative ways for hikers to save money on a long distance hike. Unfortunately, these threads usually devolve into an argument, when some folks insist it simply can't be done.

I don't think a creative ways to save money on a thru-hike thread would be very long.

#1 Eat **** and stay out of town. :D Otherwise, you're inviting irresponsibility, like depending on others.

Weathercarrot is one of the frugalist hikers I know and did the trail for about $1500. He also knows lots of people on the west coast.

Sly
01-05-2009, 12:43
Can someone please tell me where I can get Halfmile's maps??

I included a link in an earlier post. #3

MOWGLI
01-05-2009, 12:45
I don't think a creative ways to save money on a thru-hike thread would be very long.

#1 Eat **** and stay out of town. :D Otherwise, you're inviting irresponsibility, like depending on others.

Weathercarrot is one of the frugalist hikers I know and did the trail for about $1500. He also knows lots of people on the west coast.

I suppose you're right. You can always do what WD does and eat nothing but Little Debbies brownies for weeks on end. :eek:

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 12:52
I included a link in an earlier post. #3

:datz Thanks Sly!

Sly
01-05-2009, 12:57
:datz Thanks Sly!

No problem. There's a ton of them (approximately 285 maps, or 1MB per map) .5 mile to the inch. I have them all downloaded! ;)

If they print anything like the Ley CDT maps you'll need to spend about $15 in cheap ink and $20 on good paper (double sided). I recommended HP Premium paper.

yappy
01-05-2009, 12:59
ramens and little d... ahh, the life. Screech, you are young unlike the rest of us old farts on this thing.. hike hard, fast and free... have a blast.

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 13:04
Wow..... Great link, these maps are the business. Washington maps missing though, eh? Ok but this is a solid start.

Also ordering Yogi's book over lunch.

MOWGLI
01-05-2009, 13:05
Wow..... Great link, these maps are the business. Washington maps missing though, eh? Ok but this is a solid start.

Also ordering Yogi's book over lunch.

Good luck on your hike Blake. Are you planning on going to ADZPCTKO?

yappy
01-05-2009, 13:06
are you going Mowgli ?

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 13:12
Good luck on your hike Blake. Are you planning on going to ADZPCTKO?

It's tentative now, if I can get the $ together, I'll be on the thru hiking in 2009. If not, I'll go spring of 2010. If I do go in 2010, I will fly out to California for the 2009 ADZPCTKO, even if just to learn and check things out. I don't want to rush my planning, and I definitely want to make sure I have enough $ to cover the entire trip.

The links and info you guys have provided have been incredible.

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 13:13
Also, I just downloaded Eric the Black's guide, and I agree w/ the person who posted before, if the entire book is like this, it looks terrific. Very sharp and clear maps, well packaged.

MOWGLI
01-05-2009, 13:16
are you going Mowgli ?

Unfortunately not. I hope to in a few more years. Prolly not before 2011.

Sly
01-05-2009, 13:18
Wow..... Great link, these maps are the business. Washington maps missing though, eh? Ok but this is a solid start.


Only California right now. You'll still need OR and WA. If you decide to use Halfmile's maps for CA, you could probably use Eric's PCT Atlas for those two states, skipping the official guides altogether, using Yogi's for resupply. I'd still get the databook, it's the one you'll use most often.

yappy
01-05-2009, 13:19
ahhh... 2011 will be here before you know it... which is sorta scary.. haha

Screech
01-05-2009, 13:20
ramens and little d... ahh, the life. Screech, you are young unlike the rest of us old farts on this thing.. hike hard, fast and free... have a blast.

Im 25, but I have the same responsobilities as a fresh high school graduate. That is, none.

On the AT my budget was forced to be small. The next few years need to be attempted low budget, but if need be I do have the cash behind me.

yappy
01-05-2009, 13:23
25 is still young... good grief !..:) Mowgli, sly and I double you dude... I would'nt be suprised if you were flying....that trail is special, enjoy.

Sly
01-05-2009, 13:27
The Kick Off is a great time, especially if the weather is nice which it usually is in southern California. I suggest starting a week before, hiking to Warner Springs and getting a ride back, which is no problem. That way you'll avoid "the herd". At the KO, you'll get the latest water report and meet all sorts of cool folks. Thru-hikers pay nothing.


You'll also have plenty of time to get to Kennedy Meadows and in good time to start the Sierra. Depending on snowpack, you may even be able to take plenty of zeroes as to not get there too early, if you're not familar with hiking over snow. It's a lot of work.

Screech
01-05-2009, 13:27
Im so glad this forum exists BTW. This trip would be near impossible to plan on a budget without it.

Wolf - 23000
01-05-2009, 13:38
I know all about Yogi's guide, but it seems like it would be impractical to carry it for the entirety of a PCT thru hike. Is there a smaller, bound book similar to the wingfoot book?

note:

I am ordering Yogi's book for planning purposes but want to know if its what I should be using for a day to day PCT guide.


A while back, I created my own PCT Handbook and used it on all 3 of my thru-hikes. As I went up the trail I made corrections as needed. I included forks in the trail, town information, water sources and tips. I used it still from time to time and except for some of the prices in towns it is still very actuate.

My copy is back in the states but I gave it out to several people. I just don't remember to whom.

Wolf

Sly
01-05-2009, 13:41
Hey Wolf you in Iraq yet? Be safe.

A-Train
01-05-2009, 17:49
You must not have had much snow or followed someone. ;)

Basically no snow in 07' with the exception of a couple snowfields. We made up for it with the hot temps and extra dry sources.

Nafta had our maps and we hiked apart probably 70% of the time. Seemed there was either a sign or obvious footprints at the junctions.

Mags
01-05-2009, 20:14
Yogi's book was a joke. The big one with all the hiker interviews with no useful info to an experienced hiker. Her small town guide is ok I guess. The Data Book is a must I feel.

Full disclosure: I know Yogi pretty well and I am in both her books. I am also passionately loyal to my friends. :D

Glad you know everything there was about the PCT to start. But more and more people are doing the PCT as their first trail. Plus, not many ATers have desert or snow experience. The first part of the book was helpful in that regard.

You can certainly not like the book as an experienced hiker, but calling it a "joke" is not fair.

Her CDT book is much leaner and CDT specific. Hopefully only experienced hikers will do the CDT.

The only part that was a joke in both books was the very questionable advice from that Paul Magnanti fella...

Mags
01-05-2009, 20:15
Mags....as always.....thanks!

Glad I could help! As always, if you have questions..post away. I'll pretend to know the answer! :sun

handlebar
01-05-2009, 21:49
Here are some thoughts on many of the items in this thread coming from an "old" hiker who did the PCT in 08:

1. Guidebooks: Don't bother with the data book or the official guidebooks. The guidebooks are full of extraneous information you really don't need and the data book is misleading in that it only contains the points listed in the guidebooks. Often there are higher highs and lower lows between the listed points. Instead, I'd combine Yogi's guide with Erik the Blacks books. I had Yogi's book, pages torn from the guidebooks and data books, and, for SoCal and Washington, also Erik the Blacks 1st edition books. I found that a combo of Erik's and Yogi's was all I needed during the SoCal section and I wound up sending the pages from the guidebook and data book home and relying solely on Erik's book for WA. Erik's book for WA was a major improvement over the SoCal book (better elevation profiles and more landmarks) and the new 2nd edition with color is yet better. I know they are pricey, but I think they are worth the money. If you have these books you will not need any maps.

2. Cost. I spent a lot more than you are proposing, but I had the complications of having to come back east for two family weddings, I'm old and enjoy sleeping between sheets now and then, and my budget permitted it. Groceries aren't a lot more expensive in CA than anywhere else in the US. I ate mostly Lipton's or MacNCheese with foil packs of tuna or spam respectively and a dollop of olive oil for the extra calories. Lunch was scrunched down bagels (300 calories each) slathered with peanut butter and most of the time a big chunk of cheese. Breakfast was pop tarts and oatmeal to go bars and the like. Snacks were bars, Snickers, handfuls of Fritos or shoestring potatoes (great hiking foods--salty, high calorie, and still good if scrunched), raisins, gorp, etc. I ate very few PowerBars or ClifBars as I just didn't like them. The only Ramen I ate was two packs I yogied from a section hiker. Late in the hike a friend introduced me to ProBars which I do like---pricey at $3 but at least they taste good and have 350-400 calories each. Eating this kind of diet, I purchased food for all of WA at Cascade Locks for about $200 and sent 4 mail drops ahead in Priority Mail Flat Rate Boxes for about $13.50 each. So my food that I ate on the trail was costing about $10/day. That translates to about $1400 for the days I hiked. Where the $$$ added up was in towns on zero days. It's easy to spend $100/day even with a shared room between hotel and restaurants when zeroing in a town. If you remove the zeros I took that were associated with trips to the weddings, I had about 8 zeros--which translates to one every 3 weeks. Zeros usually involve two nights in a motel. I also took some neros in towns. For example, I hitched into S Lake Tahoe at 4pm just in time to get my bounce bucket from the post office, stayed at Motel 6 where I did laundry, resupplied for the next 5 days at a supermarket, found alcohol at a hardware store, and ate a good restaurant dinner and breakfast plus lots of extras from the supermarket in my room, sent my bounce bucket ahead to Pooh Corner, and was hitching back to the trail the following morning. One night in a hotel is a lot better than two and just about as refreshing. If you can avoid hotel nights in towns, you'll save a lot of $$$, but do plan for some town zeros and neros. Bottom line: you can probably get away with about $2000 for on trail expenses not counting equipment (especially shoes and socks) replacement. At $100 a pop, shoes alone could cost you $500. Five pair was not unusual. (I wore heavy hiking boots, the same as I did on the AT, and they made it the whole way. I got them used on Ebay for $75 and they might have had a total of 100 miles on them.)

For WA and OR and some remote locations in CA like the Sierra, it's far cheaper to shop in larger towns and send boxes ahead. I don't recall a lot of Walmarts, but there were large grocery stores within a reasonable hitch that had comparable prices to towns along the AT. I send boxes to myself from Ashland for all of OR and from Cascade Locks for all of WA. I also sent food ahead to Kennedy Meadows. Otherwise I resupplied by hiitching from the trail to nearby towns.

On top of this you have to add travel to and from the trail. By booking early, I flew from Pittsburgh to SanDiego for $120. I couldn't book the return early, but using one of the discounters, I got a flight back from Seattle for about $250. There are a number of trail angels who will help you get to the trail from SanDiego.

3. You might consider signing up for the PCT-L mail list for more info on the PCT. It's pretty active and has a lot of info.

4. PCT miles: For me, my PCT miles/hiking day were 1.4 x my AT miles/hiking day----and I'm 63 and not ultralight, though I did shave a few pounds off my AT pack weight.

5. Weather: I had fantastic weather: only 5 days of rain. (I did miss a 3 day storm in May on one of those trips to a wedding.) Much of the time I slept under the stars and used my tent mostly as a refuge from mosquitoes. A tarp should be fine, though for those 5 days, I was glad I had a tent.

You will love the PCT!

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 21:56
I spoke via email w/ Erik the Black today. Seems like a good dude, and he's passionate about the books, plus they look great. I think they'll do the trick.

What I like about his book especially is that he doesn't lay out the entire hike for you. He gives you 'just enough' info to get down the trail. I want my walk to be spontaneous as possible w/ help on water and trail junctions. Seems like Eriks book does just that.

Anyway, look forward to getting Yogi's book, and reading through some PCT journals tonight on TJ.

Spirit Walker
01-05-2009, 22:39
Re: Eric the Black's info - do the maps include alternate routes? Quite often the official trail is not the best route on the PCT. Every time we took it in lieu of alternatives, we were sorry.

Does he include enough town information to make Yogi's book unnecessary? i.e. which towns are usable for resupply and which need maildrops?

The online resources that I used in 2000 haven't been updated in a long while. Craig's PCT planner predates my hike and Weathercarrot's planning information dates from about 2003. The buy as you go list that was on the PCTA website was written about 1998. It's probable that some of the towns where I was able to buy groceries no longer have stores and I don't know any current town lists with services information that are freely available. I have an old version of Yogi's book, but it's also outdated and I'd rather not spend the money twice for the same thing, especially since I may not hike the PCT again in the near future.

A-Train
01-05-2009, 23:17
Re: Eric the Black's info - do the maps include alternate routes? Quite often the official trail is not the best route on the PCT. Every time we took it in lieu of alternatives, we were sorry.

Does he include enough town information to make Yogi's book unnecessary? i.e. which towns are usable for resupply and which need maildrops?

The online resources that I used in 2000 haven't been updated in a long while. Craig's PCT planner predates my hike and Weathercarrot's planning information dates from about 2003. The buy as you go list that was on the PCTA website was written about 1998. It's probable that some of the towns where I was able to buy groceries no longer have stores and I don't know any current town lists with services information that are freely available. I have an old version of Yogi's book, but it's also outdated and I'd rather not spend the money twice for the same thing, especially since I may not hike the PCT again in the near future.

Good point. Almost everytime I took an alternate on the PCT I was happier than sticking to the original. I got my own set of maps in Oregon and was really pleased with the prettier alternates that often had a lot more water than the viewless PCT.

ARambler
01-05-2009, 23:25
Here are some thoughts on many of the items in this thread coming from an "old" hiker who did the PCT in 08:

1. ...

4. PCT miles: For me, my PCT miles/hiking day were 1.4 x my AT miles/hiking day----and I'm 63 and not ultralight, though I did shave a few pounds off my AT pack weight.
...
You will love the PCT!

1.4 x because you were not an ultralight fast packer.

I think the pct is only about 15% faster per day than the AT. Al was 13% faster at ages 66 and 70.

That said, most AT hikers can do what it takes to the pct done. Some of us just take more than 30 years.
Rambler

RITBlake
01-05-2009, 23:32
Re: Eric the Black's info - do the maps include alternate routes? Quite often the official trail is not the best route on the PCT. Every time we took it in lieu of alternatives, we were sorry.


I would suggest signing up on Erik's website and getting the demonstration chapter. It only takes a few minutes. He uses full maps, just does a nice job of trimming the fat and condensing them for book size. Like I said, I'm still picking up Yogi's guide and will supplement Erik's book w/ info found in Yogis.

sarbar
01-05-2009, 23:56
Erik's books are sweet indeed.

My copy of this past summers edition of Washington was well used. For me it is all about finding water sources, road crossings and good spots for sleeping.

Desert Reprobate
01-06-2009, 00:09
I did parts of the SoCal PCT in 84. Came across a guy packing with two packs. All his food was in cans. He'd carry one pack up the trail and then come back and get the other. I thought I was packing heavy but he sure had me beat. There are a lot of great fishing spots along the trail.

RITBlake
01-06-2009, 01:39
I did parts of the SoCal PCT in 84. Came across a guy packing with two packs. All his food was in cans. He'd carry one pack up the trail and then come back and get the other. I thought I was packing heavy but he sure had me beat. There are a lot of great fishing spots along the trail.

I didn't realize Lonewolf was on the PCT in 84?

neighbor dave
01-06-2009, 07:42
I did parts of the SoCal PCT in 84. Came across a guy packing with two packs. All his food was in cans. He'd carry one pack up the trail and then come back and get the other. I thought I was packing heavy but he sure had me beat. There are a lot of great fishing spots along the trail.

mmmmm.... i wonder if it was billygoat, he's been know to do the 2 pack hike as recently as this year?

speaking of carying alot of stuff, we ran into a guy just out of cascade locks this year carrying 6 pieces of lugguge, yes luggage. here's a photo of him from years past doing the same thing, since this photo, he's updated his gear a bit, but it's still all luggage. had i known he was a trail legend i'd have grabbed a photo of him myself.
http://www.nwhikers.net/forums/download.php?id=217850657_696d80da54&p=406109

Mags
01-06-2009, 15:26
Like I said, I'm still picking up Yogi's guide and will supplement Erik's book w/ info found in Yogis.


If I did the PCT again, that's what I'd do FWIW. When I did the PCT back in the dark ages of 2002, I found I used the data book and maps more for navigation than the guidebooks. Erik's basically sums up the databook and maps in one package. Throw in Yogi's guide for a little more in depth beta, and you are good to go. Again, some people prefer more verbose descriptions, so that is where the guidebooks are useful.

Like most things, there is no one-size-fits-all solution.

sarbar
01-07-2009, 14:59
Hopefully not treading on toes - I do have a couple copies left of the 2008 version of Erik's South Cal book. I have them priced to move at $15.00 (were 25.00). So....if you don't care about all the flashy extras and want a good deal come by:
http://www.freezerbagcooking.com/bargainbin.htm

Erik The Black
01-08-2009, 22:19
RE: Pacific Crest Trail Atlas Alternate Routes

Hey guys, the PCT Atlas DOES include alternate routes. But it doesn't show them up-close like the official route for the PCT. The reason for this is if I added detailed maps for all the alternate routes it would increase the number of pages by a lot, and before long the PCT Atlas wouldn't be so small and lightweight anymore.

You can find the alternate routes in the overview maps at the beginning of each section. I took a lot of alternate routes on my hike and I've found that as long as it's not in an area where water is scarce then just knowing which trails to piece together and where to leave and rejoin the PCT was enough to go by. You can find all this info in the overview maps.

Regarding town/resupply information. The PCT Atlas is not meant to be a replacement for Yogi's Book. Yogi and I have focused on two different things with our books. She provides a lot of advice, opinions and details about town amenities like which hotels and restaurants are "best", how much they cost, hours, etc.

The PCT Atlas is completely advice and opinion free. It's just packed full of facts and navigation data that will allow you to get from point A to point B with minimal headaches.

You will find these town/resupply related features in the PCT Atlas:



Town maps showing hiker friendly businesses (hotels, restaurants, grocery stores, etc.) + mini-maps showing how to get there from the trail, and how to get back
A list of common mail-drop locations and addresses
A list of amenities in each town
Post Office hours
A list of "hiker hotspots" which are popular hangout spots in each section (on trail and in town)


You will not find any of these things in the PCT Atlas:


Any recommendations or advice on which towns to visit or how to structure your resupply strategy
Prices or hours for any of the businesses (except PO hours)
Any value judgments whatsoever


The PCT Atlas is the ultimate "hike your own hike" guidebook. It doesn't tell you how to hike. Just gives the information you need to make your own decisions.

My Advice: I've used Yogi's Book as a planning guide for years and I wouldn't think of planning a long hike on the PCT without consulting it first. Now I don't carry Yogi's book with me on the trail, but before leaving I glance over it for any information that I think is important and then jot down a couple notes.

If I were planning a long hike I would buy Yogi's book and the PCT Atlas, carry the PCT Atlas on the trail and keep Yogi's book in your bounce box. The PCT Atlas has a blank page for "notes" at the beginning of each chapter so you can write down any information from other books or resources that you think is important without having to carry any more pages.

Many hikers from 2008 reported to me that the combination of Yogi's Book plus the PCT Atlas was the "magic bullet" for PCT navigation and completely eliminated the need for the Databook or WP Guidebooks.

If you would like to download a free chapter from the new 2nd Edition PCT Atlas you can go here: http://www.pctatlas.com/freechapter.htm

Halfmile
01-14-2009, 00:46
Hi Everyone,
I noticed a bunch of web traffic hitting my little web site at www.pctmap.net (http://www.pctmap.net)and just dropped in to see why.
If you have not already done so, you might what to check out my fee maps. I believe they are the most accurate PCT maps you will find (for the first 1,853 miles of the PCT, anyway). Everything is based on GPS tracks and waypoints from 2007 and 2008 hikes.
My maps take a different approach that might appeal to hikers who are really into maps or on a low budget or are using a mapping gps like a newer Garmin Vista or Oregon.
My maps use a larger 1:31,680 (1 = mile) map scale.
I try and make sure I have a bit of overlap between map pages. I find it annoying when books leave out a sliver of terrain between map pages, and using relatively large (compared to books) 8.5 x11 page means less jumping across pages.
I try to include many side trips (and am adding more as I revise the maps for 2009). My maps include side trails to places like Idyllwild, San Jacinto Peak (and tram), Mount Baldy, Mt Whitney (and Whitney Portal), Kearsarge Pass, Onion Valley, Bishop Pass, Southlake.
My maps assume a hiker will carry other guides, databooks, water reports, etc.
I have matching waypoints, tracks, etc. you can download from www.pctmap.net (http://www.pctmap.net) and load into your gps, if you use one.
My maps are free.
-Halfmile

Wolf - 23000
02-04-2009, 12:48
Hey Wolf you in Iraq yet? Be safe.

Thanks Sly, Yes I'm over here in Iraq. It's a BLAST if anyone like to join me.

Wolf

Sly
02-04-2009, 12:51
Thanks Sly, Yes I'm over here in Iraq. It's a BLAST if anyone like to join me.

Wolf

LOL... It's a blast? I can imagine. ;)