View Full Version : Sleep apnea???
Does anyone have sleep apnea. I use a CPAP at home and can really tell the differrence when I don't use it. I notice while backpacking that I wake up several time a night gasping for breath. It is very disturbing but I will not let it keep me off the trail. I have tried using the breath right strips but they seem to have no effect. Just wondering if anyone has any experience that may help.
Desert Reprobate
01-12-2009, 22:58
You can have a dentist make you a device that resembles a football mouthguard. For a lot less money search ebay for cpap. There is a seller that sells a diy unit for around $20. I'll be using that at least for the start next year. A lot depends on how long you have been using the machine. I stopped hiking for a long time because of that. Now due to a large weight loss, I can sleep without it but it takes my mind a while to figure out what I am doing. Good Luck on the Trail.
MDhiker1967
01-13-2009, 00:15
I have used a CPAP since 2003 and when we camp I toss and turn quite a bit.. we are staying at a cabin in SNP in a few weeks so I will let you know how that goes...
I agree.. breath rite strips seem to have no effect..
I have apnea pretty bad myself. I got a CPAP machine a few months ago. When I use it, I seem to sleep better. Sometimes I wake myself up gasping (choking?). Sleeping on my side helps. Breathe-Rite only helps if you breathe through your nose. I breathe through my mouth while asleep mostly, though the chinstrap on my CPAP keeps my mouth closed pretty well, making full use of the "nasal pillows" :D.
I need one of the devices. I snore like a train in need a grease.
I don't sleep good either. The more tired I am the worse it is.
I have sleep anea, been on the cpap for about four years, tried different sleeping positions on the road as a truck driver,.... I lay my head back a little to one side, to open up my throat a little more and it seems to help some.... I have the abnormally severe sleep apnea and hypersomnia, wake up or stop breathing average of 61 times an hour! Will proabaly bounce box my machine to each hostel I plan to stay at, for one or two really great nights of rest.... need a battery operated one really....
WILLIAM HAYES
01-13-2009, 01:34
try pure sleep which is plasctic mouthpiece that you mould to the shape of your mouth it works for me and is fairy inexpensive about 60 bucks I don't snore when I use it and don't wake up a gozilion times -Puresleep.com
Tennessee Viking
01-13-2009, 01:36
Does anyone have sleep apnea. I use a CPAP at home and can really tell the differrence when I don't use it. I notice while backpacking that I wake up several time a night gasping for breath. It is very disturbing but I will not let it keep me off the trail. I have tried using the breath right strips but they seem to have no effect. Just wondering if anyone has any experience that may help.My was to the point where I was getting constant sinus infections and starting to sleep walk.
I would highly recommend you get tested and see if you are a candidate for the sleep apnea surgery. Realign your septum, remove your adnoids, tonsils, uvela, and some other things. My ENT said it is not a total cure, but it can help. But it helped me from being put on the CPAP.
But tricks I have learned is to sleep sitting up or on your side. The worst position is to be on your back. Also, keep some water by your side. A lot of cases of apnea are caused by a dry throat.
There is supposed to be a new sleeping aid mouth piece on the market now that helps you keep your mouth and throat relax while you sleep.
Jim Adams
01-13-2009, 07:10
I have it also. I have found that on my thrus, I lose weight and increase aerobic conditioning which ends the problem. 6 months later as I get back into normal "real world" life style and begin to gain weight...it comes back!
geek
MDhiker1967
01-13-2009, 07:19
try pure sleep which is plasctic mouthpiece that you mould to the shape of your mouth it works for me and is fairy inexpensive about 60 bucks I don't snore when I use it and don't wake up a gozilion times -Puresleep.com
This is from Pure Sleep website:
You have been diagnosed with central sleep apnea. PureSleep is not a
treatment for sleep apnea or any other medical condition.
• You have chronic asthma, emphysema, or any other severe
respiratory disorder. If you have a history of any of these diseases,
consult a physician prior to use.
The best thing to do is go to DOC and get the blood tests and sleep test and go from there....Insurance should pay for test once other tests are complete and things ruled out...
I had extremely severe sleep apnea. I checked into getting some help for it because I snored like a train and usually slept in the guest room because my wife would elbow me when I was sleeping, keeping us both up all night. In my sleep study I had more than 300 apnea events during 7 hours. I got the UP3 (http://www.sleepdisorderchannel.com/osa/treatment-surgical.shtml#uvp) surgery done, and now sleep much more soundly. I kinda thought it would change my life, that I would have tons more energy, but I'm still the same person, I just sleep better.
I think the surgery was worth it, though it has not been without side effects. Post surgery was two weeks of the worst sore throat in my life, liquid diet and lots of ice chips. The hydrocodone they gave me for pain turned me into an irritable monster, so I switched to advil after a couple of days. It took a while to relearn to swallow, many things would go up my nose.
It's not a magic bullet, but it has helped me considerably, and I get to sleep in my own bed now.
If you don't choose surgery, at least lose weight and stop drinking if you do. Both of these things aggravate sleep apnea and are very effective at lessening the symptoms if you can address them.
Desert Reprobate
01-13-2009, 14:55
I was up 3 times one night on the PCT to chase off the bear that seemed to be prowling around my tent. It turned out I was waking myself up with my snoring.
that's why hikers should have ear plugs........
Does anyone have sleep apnea. I use a CPAP at home and can really tell the differrence when I don't use it. I notice while backpacking that I wake up several time a night gasping for breath. It is very disturbing but I will not let it keep me off the trail. I have tried using the breath right strips but they seem to have no effect. Just wondering if anyone has any experience that may help.
The poor guy is having trouble sleeping and it is interfering with his hiking.
Rockhound, you were the first one to mention shelters. Sam4msu is looking for support, and new ideas of how to alleviate the symptoms of sleep apnea while on the trail. You are looking to stir up trouble by trying to turn it into a debate on whether snorers are being incosiderate by using shelters.
Please start a new thread if you want to discuss something different.
Sam4msu, I am sorry that this is taking place on your thread. I wish I had some good suggestions for you... I think it's pretty awesome that you are going to hike the trail anyway.
Maybe you could try a hammock! It might help you sleep better, and if you hang a hammock with a good deal of sag, you might be able to sleep in a more upright position.
HikerRanky
01-14-2009, 11:05
Please start a new thread if you want to discuss something different.
Wish granted..... If you wish to discuss Snoring, Sleep Apnea, & Shelters as a subject, here is the thread (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=45240).
Let's keep this one on the subject of how to deal with sleep apnea while backpacking....
Thanks all!
Randy
Here's a couple of tricks to help with apnea on the trail.
The tennis ball trick, put a tennis ball in a sock and pin it to the back of your sleeping shirt. This will keep you from sleeping on your back, the worst position for breathing.
Use a small stuff sack as a "neck roll" without a regular pillow. This will straighten your windpipe as opposed to a regular pillow which puts your head at an angle.
Bring some afrin or other nasal spray to open up your nasal passages before you go to bed. Even if you're a mouth breather like most people with apnea, every little bit of airway clearing helps. Don't make afrin a many times a day habit as eventually it will have the opposite effect and irritate your sinuses.
Cookerhiker
01-14-2009, 13:14
First of all, my sympathies to you Sam4msu - it's not a fun condition.
I have a problem with snoring but from what I've read, it's not necessarily sleep apnea. But I guess I can't be sure. What are the differences between sleep apnea vs. just being a loud snorer?
Per the American Sleep Apnea Association website (http://www.sleepapnea.org/info/index.html), those with sleep apnea also have high blood pressure and headaches which I don't have and I usually sleep very soundly through the night.
Gray Blazer
01-14-2009, 13:19
Seriously, PGeyer thru-hiked the FL Trail with a portable CPAP machine. He would have to get a shuttle back to his car every coupla days so he could recharge the thing. Then he would drive to where he stopped walking and start the process all over again. That's one solution.
I only had headaches when I took naps, not in the morning. I also have normal blood pressure.
The only way to know is to have someone awake in the room when you're sleeping to see if you stop breathing. Usually it will be a pause in snoring, where you're actually not breathing at all, followed by a deep breath or gasp. Sleep breathing should be regular, as in following a regular pattern of in and out without pauses.
Blissful
01-14-2009, 14:27
My hubby snores very badly (we cannot be in the same room anymore or I get no sleep even with earplugs). I think he is having a sleep apnea problem, but has not yet be evaluated. He hammocks on a far off tree which he likes very much. But I know he needs to lose quite a bit of weight.
This is probably going to make someone mad but if it does I am sorry.
I have sympathy for anyone who has sleep Apnea or simply snores loudly. One of my sons does this. He had his tonsils removed which helped some but he still snores very loudly. Thank goodness he's married and moved out. I do not intend to be critical, but it would be considerate if anyone who has this condition use their tent in lieu of staying in the shelters. Your fellow hikers would be very grateful. And we could all get some sleep.
Thanks and happy hiking. :sun
Kanati, you will be glad to know that I have never and plan to never in the future slept in a shelter!!! This is certainly not out of consideration for you but because I am smart enough to sleep in a hammock!!! Thanks to everyone else for your suggestions and sympathies.
orangebug
01-14-2009, 23:14
Sleep apnea is more than a nuisance for the noise of snoring. Those with it have increased risks of hypertension, arrhythmias and sudden death. It is a real problem with no absolute perfect treatment. Often, victims do not get evaluated prior to complications, and treatment does not appear to improve complications once they have started. It was initially felt to be solely due to obesity (Pickwickian's Syndrome) but availability of testing and treatment has shown even 17 year old skinny girls with the disorder.
Surgery is often touted as the definitive cure. Thirty years ago, this was a tracheotomy. There are several less invasive procedures, all very painful with associated risks of morbity and mortality.
CPAP and related treatments can be effective, but often fail due to claustrophobic symptoms from the mask or nose plugs. Some studies suggest that 50% fail within 2-3 months of initiation.
Dental appliances have been touted for at least 20 years. None of these have been graced with FDA approval, and all honest vendors will note that. The concept is that pulling the jaw foreward may open up the upper larynx/airway. A concern may be interference with swallowing and choking on sputum/saliva.
Weight loss and avoidance of tobacco and alcohol are the best initial treatments. Nasal strips have absolutely no effect, as the airway obstruction is not nasal.
Consultation with a real world doctor, ENT specialist and sleep study center are wise, although insurance companies often balk. Position of sleeping may help, particularly avoiding lying directly on the back or keeping the head propped up on a pillow. Recliners are often cited as a better sleep area than beds. The tennis ball pocket t-shirt is often cited, although never tested clinically. Alcohol and other sleep inducing agents are to be avoided, as these relax musculature around airways and make collapse worse.
I have slept in shelters with sleep apnea victims. It can be very frightening to hear the prolonged silence before breathing initiates.
Wise Old Owl
01-14-2009, 23:43
I had extremely severe sleep apnea. I checked into getting some help for it because I snored like a train and usually slept in the guest room because my wife would elbow me when I was sleeping, keeping us both up all night. I got the UP3 (http://www.sleepdisorderchannel.com/osa/treatment-surgical.shtml#uvp) surgery done, and now sleep much more soundly. I kinda thought it would change my life, that I would have tons more energy, but I'm still the same person, I just sleep better.
I think the surgery was worth it, though it has not been without side effects. Post surgery was two weeks of the worst sore throat in my life, liquid diet and lots of ice chips. The hydrocodone they gave me for pain turned me into an irritable monster, so I switched to advil after a couple of days. It took a while to relearn to swallow, many things would go up my nose.
It's not a magic bullet, but it has helped me considerably, and I get to sleep in my own bed now.
If you don't choose surgery, at least lose weight and stop drinking if you do. Both of these things aggravate sleep apnea and are very effective at lessening the symptoms if you can address them.
Wow I could not have written that better myself - DITTO!
ChinMusic
01-15-2009, 00:18
I cannot Dx Sleep Apnea. Let me start with that. I CAN treat snoring.
I have had great success in treating snoring (and by default improving sleep apnea) by using a TAP device. http://www.amisleep.com/tapproducts.html
For the life of me I cannot figure out why insurance does not demand a cheaper alternative to CPAP. I cannot figure out why patients do not demand a less obtrusive/cheaper/less invasive (surgery) angle of treatment. I have wondered this for 15+ years.
I guess I will retire wondering.
For snoring ask your dentist if s/he makes TAP appliances. These devices position the lower jaw forward (if you have a standard bite, it places your lower front teeth, typically, just in front of your upper teeth). From that position it is MUCH more difficult to snore. From that position the airway more open. Try it on yourself.
For backpackers who cannot bring their CPAP machine with them this could be your answer.
I assume that you are a dentist that fits for these devices? If so, what is generally the initial out of pocket for such a device? Also, if my insurance balks totally what is the cost outright?
Thanks, I am very interested in a device such as this.
ChinMusic
01-15-2009, 13:17
The fees that I have heard about for the TAP3 is quite a wide range. $500 to $1500.
The lab fee is quite high but IMO $1500 is ridiculous.
Another option to ask about is the Silent Night from Glidewell Labs. That fee is in the $250-500 range. I find these devices somewhat fragile but many folks do fine with them.
I like the TAP3 (my own wife wears one) as they are dang near bullet proof.
FYI...there are a hundred different varieties of sleep apnea, that's why sensores are placed everywhere on you body during the sleep study. The bad thing about doing this hike is that you can have a stroke, heart attack, or just die if you have sleep apnea and don't stay on the treatment or get treatment. Reggie White, the pro football player had it and passed away because he didn't use his machine, it can be serious. I have tried different postions to sleep without the cpap and I am willing to "RISK IT" to try and do the trail. There is a risk! If anyone finds a mobile cpap,i.e. ... batteries, PM me because I will buy it, for sure. If you snore,thrash about, stop breahing, sleep walk, have AM headaches, wake and fill as tired as when you went to sleep, or have several close relatives with sleep apnea, get to the DR and get a study done, if not for you, then for your family for sleep apnea runs in the family!