View Full Version : Tarptent Contrail
austinlowes17
02-18-2009, 15:05
I just ordered a tarptent contrail. Has anyone ever regretted buying this tent?
SouthMark
02-18-2009, 15:55
No.
I bought on on sale last fall. I haven't had time to regret the purchase. But I did see a used Squall for fifty bucks less somewhere recently...
Yes.
How about elaborating...
slowandlow
02-18-2009, 16:04
My only regret concerning a Shires TarpTent is that I didn't buy one sooner than I did.
Powder River
02-18-2009, 16:37
Yes.
I carried one until New Hampshire. The material is not waterproof, so water will come straight through it. The foot of the tent will collect water, up to maybe 2 liters before collapsing. The two back struts will twist to one side or the other, or worse both will twist inwards, negating any tension the tent may have had. The material stretches when wet, so you have to retension everything AFTER it starts raining. Finally, the tent needs at least 10 feet to pitch, which is longer than any tent platform, and generally causes headaches when looking for a site.
What I DID like about it was the weight and room inside. It's a great summer tent with lots of air flow. While it has its problems, those problems are worth the trade-off to me over a 3lb tent. However, I think there are other tarp tents that do the job much better. If buying today, I would get a design that is more of a pyramid and doesn't have that flat area in the back for collecting water.
Montana AT05
02-18-2009, 16:43
If i ever bought another tarptent, it would be the rainbow version.
SouthMark
02-18-2009, 17:07
Yes.
The material is not waterproof, so water will come straight through it. The foot of the tent will collect water, up to maybe 2 liters before collapsing. The two back struts will twist to one side or the other, or worse both will twist inwards, negating any tension the tent may have had. The material stretches when wet, so you have to retension everything AFTER it starts raining.
Mine has NEVER leaked. Back struts have never twisted. See Franco's simple solution for water collecting on foot:
http://www.practicalbackpacking.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1188&page=2&highlight=contrail
I've never had a problem... love it to death.
Have a Cloudburst, no regrets, no leaks.
garlic08
02-18-2009, 20:25
No. I've used it for two thru hikes so far, never had a problem and it still looks new.
I have posted this before, but since some prefer to blame the tools rather than lack of skill or willingness to learn...
Here is the same Contrail pitched in the same strong sideways wind , the top has only the four standard guyout points in use the other has the added rear strut and front and side guyout attached. If putting the shelter in tension when it srart to rain is a problem, use rubber snubbers (I made my own from 4mm shock cord from a hadwerar store) but just lifting the pole accomplishes most of this anyway.
BTW I came up with the center rear support after a heavy storm, never had a problem after that and I have had it in torrential all night rain several times.
Note that even "5th season" freestanding/bomproof tents need special attention , and fail, at times, IE lots of long guylines ....
"The material is not waterproof, so water will come straight through it"
The 1.3oz silnylon used by TT is the same type used by several other manufacturers, somewhat less waterproof than other materials but more than Epic. Water does not come straight through it, you can very occasionally get some misting from penetration, most of the reported misting is condensation knocked down from the inside. Wipe the top or coat the inside with a 1 to 5 silicone to mineral spirit solution if it really bothers you that much.
Note that condensation can and does happen inside all tents, the less ventilation you have the more condensation will form.
Franco
In case it isn't clear , just imagine reading a report from a guy that spent the night in set-up one and another in set-up two, you would think that they were describing two different shelters. And yes my Contrail still looks as it does in the bottom picture after a night of heavy rain.
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e389/Francophoto/Contrail/Contrail-not.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e389/Francophoto/Contrail/Contrail-full-help.jpg
vtdrifter
02-18-2009, 23:37
i carried the contrail on my thru last year.
main pros:
huge amount of space for the weight - i can sleep another person + both our gear inside so long as i like them
easy, quick set up
really light
cons:
requires a lot of space to set up like powderriver said - regularly extended to edge of tent platforms and beyond packed down tentsite areas, although i could generally work around those problems
requires some retensioning and ingenuity in the rain - extra tie out points help a lot
i'm not sure that i personally would carry it again on a long distance hike, but that's due to the evolution of my hiking preferences. i'd definitely recommend it as an excellent lightweight tent.
For some the Rainbow , with the shorter footprint but similar usable space inside, would be better, particularly on platforms and busy spots where flat space is at a premium.
I still prefer sleeping inside the Rainbow but usually carry the Contrail because I use trekking poles (hence lighter for me) and to me is more fun to set up.
You will find that shelters of this type have most users liking them but a few very dissatisfied owners. This applies to the GG The One, the SMD Lunar Solo and the AGG Tarp Tents. But again I don't know of a single shelter that has universal approval.
BTW provably the most "polarising" shelters are the Stephensons Warmlite. Hard to believe sometimes that folk are describing the same tent.
Franco
Powder River
02-19-2009, 05:18
I have posted this before, but since some prefer to blame the tools rather than lack of skill or willingness to learn...
There is no need for personal attacks on this forum, Franco. As I mentioned above, I thru hiked with the Contrail, and spent over 120 nights in it. I am not just someone who spent one night in "tent A."
The second setup you picture is the extreme battened-down mode for the contrail, with the back end lowered to the ground and all vents sealed off. This increases the condensation inside, and is hardly a solution for the rather basic matter of the tent keeping its integrity during a rainstorm. If it were well designed it should be able to stand a rain storm either raised or lowered. When raised, the struts are unstable and tend to tilt one direction or the other. The bottom of the struts are not anchored to the ground, meaning they are free to slide in any direction. I usually find that one or both struts have slide to one side, tilting inwards. Making matters worse is unless you have some extremely solid soil to put your stakes in, a good storm will soften the ground and the stakes will give a little. I carried six inch stakes, and even if they had moved an inch towards the tent it was enough to give slack to the tent, and turn it into a rain collector.
I have the third strut on mine, and while it helps, it basically ends up dividing the rear of the tent into two tension areas, and I found that one side would hold while the other side would slack and start collecting water. Because I keep my pack at the foot of the tent, I would usually put the rain cover on it because I knew the roof of the tent would be resting on it after it filled with water, drawing water through the fabric. The other thing I would learn is to sleep very lightly so I could use my foot to kick the water off at about half hour intervals. This was one really disapointing thing about the situation because normally I would sleep really well in a rain storm.
As for the fabric, Shire's web site says it will "mist" through when it rains. It also hints that this might just be the condensation getting knocked off the underside of the fabric. If it really was condensation, wouldn't this be happening with every fabric out there? I certainly don't experience this in any other tent I've ever owned. While not a deal killer for me, it is enough to feel on my face while trying to sleep, and leaves my sleeping bag damp in the morning.
Say what you will about the tent, but don't assume that because someone doesn't like it they have "lack of skill or willingness to learn." The tent has legitimate problems, and there is no need to insult people to try to refute that.
Poweder River
For a start my comment was not meant to be a personal attack and directed at anyone in particular, just an observation.
"The second setup you picture is the extreme battened-down mode for the contrail, with the back end lowered to the ground and all vents sealed off. This increases the condensation inside, and is hardly a solution for the rather basic matter of the tent keeping its integrity during a rainstorm"
Depends on your point of view, to me extreme problems require extreme solutions. Most tents can do with extra help from properly set up guylines, that does not indicate "bad design". Note how when the weather turns nasty, climbers pop out from their "bombproof" shelters and start setting up guylines everywhere. Does that indicate bad design ?
Note how many ex-shelters litter popular high camping areas, IE Everest Base Camp. ( at some point every shelter has failed)
Recently I came across comments about a Hilleberg Nallo failing in heavy rain. Well I can safely state that if correctly set up, it doesn't. Funnily enough when someone else pointed out how to use the extra guylines the OP wasn't that interested in the solution.
As you highlighted the Contrail isn't for everyone and in some conditions , there are many other shelters that will perform better.
"If it really was condensation, wouldn't this be happening with every fabric out there?"
Yes it would and it does. Usually ends up on the inner but if you spent as much time as I do on the forums (not recommended) you would come across comments about "raining inside the tent" (misting) from owners of several shelters including the very popular Hubba and Akto.
Some double wall tents promote air flow so condensation inside is minimised, however there is a weight/volume penalty that many are not willing to pay for.
A final point. Going back to the well known and loved Akto. A 4 season tent around 3 pounds, with a rather large vestibule to boot.
What's not to like ? Condensation. Several owners have commented on the excessive amount of condensation created by the down to the ground design. Many have sold the tent because of that, however it remains (if you can afford it) an all season favourite, particularly in Europe.
OK, condensation is the problem.
So Tarptent comes up with the Scarp 1, similar in design but having two doors and two apex vents as well as a gap at the bottom of the fly, it allows for a better air flow.
Guess what people are commenting on ?
Too much "possible" wind inside the tent....................
Franco
wrongway_08
02-19-2009, 19:38
Never had a problem, bought 2 so far.
Never leaked water.
Thru-hiked with mine.
once you learn to properly set them up, you wont have any side dipping problems.
Water in the tub was never a problem, after learning how to properly set it up.
Water proof all seams and enjoy!!!
Forgot about this bit :
"I have the third strut on mine, and while it helps, it basically ends up dividing the rear of the tent into two tension areas, and I found that one side would hold while the other side would slack and start collecting water. Because I keep my pack at the foot of the tent, I would usually put the rain cover on it because I knew the roof of the tent would be resting on it after it filled with water, drawing water through the fabric. The other thing I would learn is to sleep very lightly so I could use my foot to kick the water off at about half hour intervals. This was one really disapointing thing about the situation because normally I would sleep really well in a rain storm."
I don't really get this. If the corner guyouts are set evenly at 45 degree angle and the center rear strut is correctly tensioned you will have three points of tension. If one of the side pegs come lose it means that it is not properly set or the ground is really soggy , in that case sticks and stones will help. However pegs that pop out /give have nothing to do with a specific shelter, to avoid that you need a freestanding tent.
Have a look at threads about the Stephenson tents. Some absolutely love them and have used the same shelter for decades, others hate them, passionately.
Strangely the trick with them is proper use and tension of the guylines.
IE the ones that want to make them work do..., and do so in all sorts of weather
( I don't like the lack of a proper vestibule with them but at well under 3 pounds what do you want ? )
Franco
Here is a comment that I just found reading reviews on a Lightwave tent ( on the clearance sale list direct from them right now)
lightwave ZRO Cylq
This tent was discontinued some time ago, but it is a 4 season 3 lbs 1+ tent (double wall)
"I found that due to thely flat roof and meshed pannel in roof of the inner that in heavy rain any condensation on teh outer was bashed off by the heavy rain drops drumming on teh outside...right on to my (down) sleeping bag. Hmmmm. Not too much fun, though OK if you have a dry waterproof you can put over your bag, underneath the mesh window"
http://www.outdoorsmagic.com/review/reviewProductReviews/mps/rpn/5319/prod/lightwave-ZRO-Cylq/rcn/12/rgn/11/v/3/sp/#2818 (http://www.outdoorsmagic.com/review/reviewProductReviews/mps/rpn/5319/prod/lightwave-ZRO-Cylq/rcn/12/rgn/11/v/3/sp/#2818)
Franco
Powder River
02-20-2009, 21:28
I will admit the Contrail is an incredibly useful and versatile tent, but you can't just excuse all of its weaknesses by saying that someone doesn't know how to set up a tent. There are simply too many factors that can go wrong with the pitch of a contrail during the course of a storm, assuming you are starting with a "perfect" pitch. The stretch of the material combined with soft or wetted out soil (stake movement) can happen to many tents, but the weakness of the Contrail is that its design gives these events the more drastic consequence of water collecting at the foot. Compare this to a pyramid shaped tent such as the lunar solo, where either of those events would only cause slackness in the walls of the tent. Its weakness is its shape. You can pitch the contrail on a soccer field all you want, and it will look great in the photograph. But the design is just too unforgiving to either mistakes made in pitching it (as you are quick to suggest) or to factors beyond one's control, such as rain.
As for the theory that the mist coming down is simply condensation, what if I made you a tent out of 320D nylon with no coating? I could point out to you that rather than the fabric leaking, it's only condensation. After all, there are other tents out there that suffer condensation problems as well, right? I have spent many nights in a Hubba and there is no misting effect. Condensation, yes. Misting, no. It is further obvious by looking at the fabric in the morning; the Hubba material shakes out pretty good, and drops are beaded. The Shires is always wetted through.
While I'm sure you have more lectures about tensioning guylines, etc., I for one will be on the lookout for a tent that will keep me dry, and not collect water.
Powder River
As I stated before you need to choose your poison. With tents it's a balance between size,weight,strength and cost as well as colour,shapes and other factors.
I have had the Contrail, both the original and the 08 version, under very heavy rain, both here in Australia and in Nepal. And I don't mean just two or three hours of showers.In Nepal in particular,several of the heavy Nepalese A frame tents next to me were dripping inside both from condensation ad just water coming in , not dangerously so but just annoying, particularly since I was sound asleep next to them ( I am a heavy snorer, hence I usually pitch as far as I can from others) ) So I do have some real life experience with it, but provably having set it up dozens of times in my backyard as well, to fiddle with it and test various ideas, it helps me to figure out a better way of using it.
Several times walking around camps I have heard people commenting about soggy sleeping begs and drips and usually I am the only one with anything like a Tarptent here.
However I use down bags and never had a problem with either the Rainbow or the Contrails.
Again , if you use a freestanding shelter, you can have fewer problems with soggy grounds, however the Contrail is certainly not the only shelter on the market that uses single or multiple struts for corner/end support. Obviously this does not work for you, but it does for others.
There are two possible types of misting inside a 1.3 oz silnylon fly , as well as Epic and some versions of Spinnaker . And of course you can get drips from several PU coated ripstop nylon versions.
1) condensation knocked from the inside of the fly. This is also common to double wall tents, some appear to be more prone than others but in the end most of it has to do with time and location. Many Tarptent and other silnylon tent owners have claimed to have never had this problem.
2) penetration. There is no fully waterproof fabric. However for practical purposes you will not experience "penetration" with 3000mm plus rated types. The 1.3oz silnylon is rated somewhat around 1000-1500mm. That will keep rain out in most situations but if the drops are big enough they will penetrate via the misting effect.
I have had both types. The second has been pretty rear and nothing like the dripping from a wetted out Epic shelter. ( I have used many shelters, at the moment I still have 9)
So it is entirely possible for TT and the like users to spend hundreds of nights out without ever experiencing the second type.
Obviously the Contrail is not for you, however there is not one single "faultless" shelter out there.
Franco
You may find this comment amusing, or not
From Kathleen :
A friend of mine bought the Hubba a few years ago and hates it. She says it's only wide enough for her sleeping bag and doesn't have any arm-flopping room. She then bought a Contrail Tarptent.
BPL 4/14/2008
Name a shelter, ask for a positive or negative comment on it , and I will find it for you.
Franco
austinlowes17
02-21-2009, 00:26
Would spraying the fabric with a waterproof chemical (silicon maybe) help solve the "misting effect"? It may be a dumb question but i'm no expert.
Final comment
It provably would be fair for all if certain points were called weaknesses (post 21) rather than faults. And there is where opinions differ. As much as I was happy with the 06 version of the Contrail, the 08 is nicer and I would suspect easier to set up . Sometimes it is like reading an instruction manual, easy if you already know what they are talking about.
Not to overlook the Lunar Solo , some have switched from that to the Contrail because of the headroom and or excessive condensation, no doubt some have gone the other way.
For a 24 oz shelter, it is still a pretty good choice but of course it can be improved. Right now for me it is the best compromise.
BTW I reminded someone else just a few days ago that his shelter (not a Contrail) wasn't at fault when a stake popped out and the tent collapsed. But that is the way I am.
( The Rainbow collapsed on me one night because the stupid wind suddenly gusted from the wrong direction. Because I knew the area I only guyed out carefully the "weather" side... No damage and my pride was intact because I was by myself and I had been to the toilet an hour or so before)
Franco