View Full Version : Yet another sleeping pad thread... (WINTER pads this time)
Powder River
02-21-2009, 06:20
I just thought you can't have enough threads on these things...but why are the ones I would like to try not out yet?
I had already ruled out the Exped Downmat after watching this painful video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-AN0Pd221c), not wanting to go through such torture each night. But with all the buzz over the neoair I had overlooked the second half of this article (http://www.feedthehabit.com/outdoors/new-air-core-sleeping-pads-from-therm-a-rest-and-exped/), showing that the downmat now has an integrated pump. :eek: I can't find any press on it anywhere, and it seems OR has quietly updated their webpage, but nothing to indicate it's a new or even exciting feature. Interesting. The old version seems to be either out of stock or on sale at a lot of places, and the new one is on sale at Cabella's already (the 9 version). I don't even see anybody blogging about it, like they are for all the other fancy new gear. It still looks like a painfully slow process, but that whole thing about using the stuff sack to inflate the old version had me scared away. Looks like I won't be buying a women's sleeping pad after all!
Powder River
02-21-2009, 06:40
http://www.odoo.tv/Exped-Downmat-Pump.407.0.html
This video is painful too, but mostly because it's not in english. Clever design!
The built in pump version has been for sale in England and New Zealand since early Jan. One English user reported (from memory) an under 2 minute inflation.
I use the Exped 7 when is cold enough, not as hard to inflate as some would like you to believe. A few years ago, just for fun I practiced a bit and did it several times under 2 minutes with the provided storage sack/bellow pump/pillow. Now I use the accessory pillow pump (old version)., easier to use inside the Contrail.
Franco
Buy a Big Agnes Air Core Mummy pad, buy some 1/2" (better for winter than 3/8") blue foam, lay the foam on top for insulation. The air underneath provides the padding. If you get a flat, you'll still have some cushioning. Leave the blue foam home in the warmer months.
The extra volume of the two mat approach can be a problem for some, the provided repair kit is only about 1/2 oz.
The only negative comments I have seen about the Exped have been about inflation, it can take a long time if, like me, you leave the other valve open (done that a few times ....) but again if you are willing to practice a bit and learn how to do it correctly, it's not a bother at all.
But the inflatable plus thick blue mat solution is a lot cheaper and maybe more versatile to some.
Franco
Ramble~On
02-21-2009, 20:40
In winter I've been using a Thermarest and a Ridgerest - For Christmas Santa ( :D thanks buddy) hooked me up with a BA Insulated Air Core which I continue to use with a Ridgerest. I carry a Thermarest chair kit and use the Ridgerest in it - Air Core takes a bit to inflate but is magic to sleep on.
- Seems the Air Core is a flat waiting to happen and I don't trust it enough to use in the chair kit.
Blissful
02-21-2009, 23:40
For cold I have used my BA insulated air core paired with a ridgerest.
Feral Bill
02-22-2009, 02:29
I once spent a couple of nights with a slow leaking air mattress in the snow. Not at all fun!. For winter I use a closed cell foam mat, though I may add a Thermarest as a topper next time.
Add me to the ridge rest on top of BA crowd. For true luxury and the princess in the pea thing, for scouting cold camping ,which usually doesnt involve backpacking, i will use my BA, and LE model thermarest in tandem.
garlic08
02-23-2009, 10:08
This stuff is great as a second pad in winter:
http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100012574&N=1643+90401&marketID=401&locStoreNum=8125
If you're lucky you can scrounge some from a building site, along with some Tyvek.
FamilyGuy
02-23-2009, 12:01
I have a two year old Exped 7 downmat. It isn't a pain to pump, it just takes time - but it is NOT rocket science. And the result is really, really worth it. Like sleeping on a cloud and I continue to swear I can actually feel the radiant heat through the pad (no heat loss through conduction here!).
...or you can use TipiWalters multi-pad winter setup that weighs 6.5 pounds.....
unclemjm
02-23-2009, 12:54
I agree with FamilyGuy my most comfortable night ever on the ground is on my Exped 9 DAM.
Sure it takes a little while to inflate, but what is a few minutes in the woods? I hike to slow down my lifestyle, not to worry about a few extra minutes of inflating. It's not like I have a date or something.
skinewmexico
02-23-2009, 13:06
I have POE Max Thermo (now the Ether Thermo 6). It takes 10 big breaths to inflate, and kept me warm and super comfortable down to 22 degrees Saturday night. In fact, 3 of us were using them, and we were all comfortable. If I was going lower, I'd throw a GG Thinlight on top of it. I've used it without a leak, in mostly rocky terrain, for almost 4 years now. I guess you can pay twice as much for the Thermarest, but that's a lot to pay for the name.
Mighty Mouse
02-23-2009, 18:13
I would go with the OR since they now have the built in pumps. For truly cold weather, I think they're the best. The new models are supposed to cut down on leaky valve issues and also improve the ease of inflation. They did all of this without increasing the weight:banana. I will receive mine within the next week and give a review at that time.
One thing that has helped me a lot (presumes sleeping in a tent) is a super tick layer of leaves under the tent, have never been cold and have been out in some nasty-cold weather.
Powder River
02-23-2009, 21:24
I would go with the OR since they now have the built in pumps. For truly cold weather, I think they're the best. The new models are supposed to cut down on leaky valve issues and also improve the ease of inflation. They did all of this without increasing the weight:banana. I will receive mine within the next week and give a review at that time.
Waiting on mine now too! Found a 15% off code for REI. Can't wait.
I have POE Max Thermo (now the Ether Thermo 6). It takes 10 big breaths to inflate, and kept me warm and super comfortable down to 22 degrees Saturday night. In fact, 3 of us were using them, and we were all comfortable. If I was going lower, I'd throw a GG Thinlight on top of it. I've used it without a leak, in mostly rocky terrain, for almost 4 years now. I guess you can pay twice as much for the Thermarest, but that's a lot to pay for the name.
My wifes favorite pad.
http://www.pacoutdoor.com/2008/index.cfm?action=product&productID=133&groupID=23&familyID=1
I use the POE Hyper High Mountain Aerogel Pad for winter
http://www.pacoutdoor.com/2008/index.cfm?action=product&productID=139&groupID=25&familyID=1
Mighty Mouse
03-02-2009, 00:50
My Exped Downmat 9 arrived this week. I bought the model that has the built-in pump. I finally had enough time off work to inflate it.
I didn't look at the directions, and inflated in about 2 minutes. The ease of inflation is unbelievable! This is a HUGE improvement over the stuff sack inflation model. There are two hand prints that you simply place your hands over and press down on the mat. Lift your one hand over the valve for half a second and press again. It's that simple:banana!
I'm going backpacking March 12-14. When I return, I'll let you know if there's any leaky valve issues.
Tipi Walter
03-02-2009, 13:04
The extra volume of the two mat approach can be a problem for some, the provided repair kit is only about 1/2 oz.
The only negative comments I have seen about the Exped have been about inflation, it can take a long time if, like me, you leave the other valve open (done that a few times ....) but again if you are willing to practice a bit and learn how to do it correctly, it's not a bother at all.
But the inflatable plus thick blue mat solution is a lot cheaper and maybe more versatile to some.
Franco
Another big problem with the Exped Downmats is cushioning, I know, hard to believe, but when I sit up on my Downmat 9, my butt always touched the cold ground. It's a pet peeve and I don't want a pad that I can feel the ground when I'm sitting up, especially in the winter. The Prolite 4s were bad about this, too. Since alot of time in the winter is spent sitting up on a pad half wrapped in goose down, you don't want to feel the cold ground on your tailbone. Deep sixed the Downmat.
I have a two year old Exped 7 downmat. It isn't a pain to pump, it just takes time - but it is NOT rocket science. And the result is really, really worth it. Like sleeping on a cloud and I continue to swear I can actually feel the radiant heat through the pad (no heat loss through conduction here!).
...or you can use TipiWalters multi-pad winter setup that weighs 6.5 pounds.....
Uh, I have never used a multi-pad system and never will. One pad, one bag, one tent, one butt cold winter trip. Some winter backpackers swear on the multi pad system, blue foam under a thermarest, etc, but to me it's too much bulk and sliding when a good 1.75 to 2 inch thermarest will work. Sleeping on snow and in the winter with a down bag is comfy with a thermarest and these are the ones I've used:
Standard long: the old standby, now discontinued, 1.75 thick and good Rvalue.
Expedition large: I only use large pads nowadays: 25x77x1.75 or 2. This was like the standard but larger and with die cut foam. A great pad and of course discontinued. Rvalue at 4.4.
Prolite 4 large: To thin for winter camping by itself.
Basecamp: I took this behemoth out on my last 10 day trip and LOVE IT but at 3 pounds 10 ozs the ULers send me hate mail. It's 2 inches thick with an Rvalue of 6.2! It's all a person needs for the winter. I ordered a few extra cuz probably in a couple of months Thermarest will discontinue it like they did the Ultralites, Trail Lites, Trail Comforts, Standards, Camp Rests, and all the rest. Peculiar company.
My Exped Downmat 9 arrived this week. I bought the model that has the built-in pump. I finally had enough time off work to inflate it.
I didn't look at the directions, and inflated in about 2 minutes. The ease of inflation is unbelievable! This is a HUGE improvement over the stuff sack inflation model. There are two hand prints that you simply place your hands over and press down on the mat. Lift your one hand over the valve for half a second and press again. It's that simple:banana!
I'm going backpacking March 12-14. When I return, I'll let you know if there's any leaky valve issues.
Here's what I want you to do: After inflating, sit up on it and see if you can feel the ground. Yes or No. I wait for your report.
I like blue foam pads. Sometimes 2 in winter. In theory one should be enough on snow, but if its going to be really cold an extra blue foam pad is a cheap upgrade to you sleeping system if you can manage the extra volume. Hauling a tobogan I would bring something extra thick. You can buy black closed cell foam 1/2" amd 1" thick. I've used it paddling. I agree with Tipi that its better to keep it simple than to have too many. I don't like inflatables though. With snow its a bit easier to shape a pretty decent bed, but not as much as you would think, and there's not always snow, so someday I might get something more comfortable but for now just blue foam.
Tipi Walter
Sorry for your butt but mine doesn't, helps to be only 150 pounds at times
Franco
Must be one of them new fangled Aussie butts. I've heard of them.
Apparently 150 lbs is about the right weight for my height, 67". Regardless I am happy with it...
You may be surprised to know that on average Aussies are just as big as Americans, in fact last year we became the fattest nation on earth in spite of my efforts and the other two or three that manage not to eat full time.
http://www.abc.net.au/rural/nsw/content/2006/s2281046.htm (http://www.abc.net.au/rural/nsw/content/2006/s2281046.htm)
Franco
Your lucky. My butts spends way too much time just sitting around. It has stuck with me though.
My weight was the same between 18 and about 40. Then I moved from the shop floor to the office and in spite of going up and down 3 floors several times a day my bones grew larger , so from about 150lbs I settled at around 165 lbs. Since I left work I got "luckier" by moving around a lot more.
But the thread is about mats, specifically the Expeds. From all preliminary reports I have seen, the built-in pump version can be inflated in around 2 minutes. But of course... they don't work for everybody.
Franco
Yes, I am at one with my butt too, it completes me.
Mighty Mouse
03-02-2009, 20:03
Tested the butt on the floor issue. No, my *ss does not hit the floor. However, I'm 5'5'' and 125lbs. So, I don't know if it would be different for a larger person.
As with any inflated pad, they aren't truly comfortable to sleep on FULLY inflated. Depending on how much you under-inflate, more of the butt may reach the ground.
bulldog49
03-03-2009, 15:55
I bought a Thermarest Prolite4 and used it for the first time 2 weeks ago on a weeklong Va section hike between the Tye River and Daleville.
Night time temps were in low 20s to mid teens. Slept 2 nights in a shelter, rest in my Lunar Solo, several of those nights on a layer of snow. I never experienced feeling cold through the pad, slept warm every night. No need whatsoever for a bulky closed cell enzolite or Ridgerest pad to provide additional warmth.
I use a short pad that weighs about a pound and fold it into the hydration pocket in my frameless SMD Comet pack. It folds up very compact and works great as a frame and pad for my pack.
FamilyGuy
03-03-2009, 18:05
[/quote]Here's what I want you to do: After inflating, sit up on it and see if you can feel the ground. Yes or No. I wait for your report.[/quote]
I cannot feel the ground and I am 210 pounds with a moderately sized ass.
I actually been using Wiggy's sleeping pad with one of his winter bags with several nights out that were below zero i seemed to stay comfortable and warm. I know Wiggy's doesnt get much press but find the guy to be pretty insightful and makes good stuff.