Gortex or no gortex?!??

[stinkytoe]

Getting ready to leave in april, and one of my last purchases is the boots. I have been trying ones on and bought a pair and took them back over the last few weeks. My major concern is the gortex lining offered in the boots, I cannot come to the decision on whether I want the waterproof layer at the expensive of potentially longer drying heavier gortex.

The pair of asolo's I bought had gortex but I just took them back, for possibly buying the others that fit better and have no gortex and are simply "water resistant".

Any thoughts would help.




Saw Lion King this past weekend at H. Ferry. Great help, completetly stoked our fires for the upcoming hike. Great to meet, cool trail hiker.

[SGT Rock]

No Goretex.

Imagine hiking in hot weather. Now imagine hiking in hot weather with a goretex jacket on.

Same thing for your feet.

[Pedaling Fool]

I've worn gortex boots only once (during my 2008 trip) and I can't tell the difference between those boots and my leather boots (as far as sweat goes). And when it rains you may be able to step in a puddle and keep your feet dry, but what's the point when the rain runs down your leg.

[Just a Hiker]

I got a wicked case of Jungle Rot with Gortex boots.....I would vote no, but everyone is different I suppose.

[Jack Tarlin]

Skip it.

If you go for it, you'll STILL have wet feet, but it'll be from sweat.

And don't worry about keeping the rain out. There's no such thing as a waterproof shoe on the Appalachian Trail. If it rains hard enough or often enough, or long enough, your feet are gonna get wet, period.

[theinfamousj]

That's easy: no goretex.

Unless, of course, you don't like the skin on your feet. Then, goretex all the way.

(Says the girl who soaked her goretex boots on the first day of a three day backpacking trip, could never get them dry, and lost a significant portion of foot skin as a result.)

[SGT Rock]

There is a equasion that shows the longer it takes boots to get wet on the inside, the longer it takes to dry them out. So Goretex takes about 3 days to get soaked on the inside and 9 to dry.

[take-a-knee]

Non Goretex Asolo FSN 85's work for me.

[stranger]

Gore Tex definitely has limited uses, and there has been a shift over the years to get away from it, especially with cheaper, more breathable fabrics that have been developed with slightly less waterproof levels, yet still good enough to repel the hardest rain.

Gore Tex in footwear is something I never really understood. It's kinda like having a Gore Tex jacked with no hood, because you can't stop the water from running down your legs and into your boots/shoes.

I've found lighter, more breathable footwear is much better for me atleast, cause it can dry out in a matter of hours with a good breeze and decent sun. A water logged Gore Tex boot will take days to dry out, and considering you lift you foot over 1000 times per mile, that's a clear weight issue, and cost.

[SmokyMtn Hiker]

My Rocky boots are lined with Gortex and found out first hand that after hiking 8 miles in the pouring rain in the Smokies my feet still got soaked. It was on day 3 of 6 and by day 6 when I arrived at Fontana they were still wet inside somewhat. I have since waterproofed them with Nikwax, the salesman at REI reminded me that Gortex is on the inside of the boot and you need to protect the outside to prevent water getting inside to where the Gortex is. I don't think there any hotter on my feet in the summer, but I assume everyones feet reacts differently when it comes to sweating and foot odor.

[Wise Old Owl]

Gortex is somewhat heavy, overrated, and uneeded on the AT.

[bulldog49]

This discussion about footware should always be predicated on the time of year you are talking about hiking.

I agree Gortex is not advisable for warm weather hiking. But I would never hike without waterproof breathable boots in cold weather. I do most of my hiking late fall to early spring and except for rare, extremely prolonged periods of rain, my feet stay dry. On those very rare occassions when my boots do get wet inside, they always dry out after a few hours walking in them in dry weather.

Just last week I did a 6 day section hike. Several of those days I was walking in wet, slushy snow with temps in the low to mid 30s. I was wearing a pair of Keen waterproof boots and not once did my socks get wet. I did not even have to change socks when I arrived in camp. I would have been extremely uncomfortable in non-waterproof boot.

For me there is nothing worse than walking all day with wet cold feet. :eek:

[bigcranky]

Totally agree with Bulldog. Goretex trail runners are awesome in winter hiking and in prolonged cold rain (when worn properly with gaiters and w/b pants). Mesh trail runners are awesome the rest of the year.

The tricky part is deciding when to make the switch. March and April can throw some serious snow, deep muddy trails, and cold rain at hikers in the South.

If you are going to use leather boots for a thru-hike, I would strongly vote in favor of non-Goretex.

[SGT Rock]

But you don't ned goretex to be built into the shoe to get the benifit of Goretex. Get socks made out of goretex and you can wear it when you need it and take it off when you don't. Sort of like a rain jacket for your toes.

[bulldog49]

Every review I've read about Gore-Tex socks has been negative. The Gore-Tex boots work just fine in cooler weather, wet or dry conditions.

[shelterbuilder]

Sgt. Rock's idea is probably the best by far. One of the problems with Gore-tex boots is that, the more the Gore-tex is flexed, the sooner it develops leaks - then it's useless.

I hiked through Vermont one year (many years ago) during one of the wettest summers on record. My boots were Gore-tex. They got wet around day 2 from water running down my legs, and stayed wet for the rest of the trip (9 days total). IMPOSSIBLE to dry out on the trail (although, if I had been home, I could have dried them out in 24 hours by stuffing them with dry newspaper, and changing the newspaper when it got soaked).

I vote for non-Gore-tex.

[SGT Rock]

Every review I've read about Gore-Tex socks has been negative. The Gore-Tex boots work just fine in cooler weather, wet or dry conditions.

I haven't read any reviews of goretex socks. But I have used them. I ain't going off reviews but first hand knowledge.

Rocky Goretex - just a Goretex shell. If it gets wet, then it dries out quick. Won't keep your feet waterproof like a vault when walking in creeks - water can still get in over the top. But when hiking in snow with shoes they keep the snow and slush out. Wear socks under them and they do find - in fact if you can wear socks that extend over the top of them they breath better (more like boots). Don't wear them when you don't need them. They do what they are supposed to do. If you hike in them all the time you will regret it because they are likely to keep in more sweat than a boot.

Seal Skinz - Feel much more lilke a sock.They have wool or something inside them. You don't need a sock with them when you wear them. But they also are not waterproof when crossing streams -water can also still go in over the top just like with Goretex boots. Since they have wool (or something) in them, they get heavy as heck when they do get wet - sort of like walking in sponges. They also will never dry in camp (just like goretex boots) and take forever to dry in town even using a dryer (I don't use hot when drying hiking gear for obvious reasons) so in that regard they are VERY like Goretex boots. You should also not wear these unless you need them.

I had Rockys for years. I decided to try Sealskinz during my thru-hike. I encountered the issues with them getting wet and staying wet finding out the hard way deep water ain't a good thing for 'em. But they did EXACTLY what I wanted them to do when hiking in snow or heavy rain with trail runners. Since I got off, I have switched back to my Rocky socks.

And for the record I own about 3 or 4 pair of Goretex boots. One hiking - the rest work. I prefer the socks.

[warraghiyagey]

Goretex is great for a one or two day hike but for distance I wouldn't ever use it. . . simply takes to long for them to dry out. . .

[Blue Jay]

I'm in an extreme minority on this one. Unless it is very hot my feet don't sweat much. Most of the time Goretex works well for me. I hate to tippy toe around puddles. With Goretex, as long as it's not over the top, I can walk right thru. I've also never had a problem once they get wet with drying them out while walking. Again my feet must be warm enough to push the moisture out, but not too warm to sweat. I'm so glad they designed a product just for me.

[SGT Rock]

There are those people. I'm on the other extreme - I don't want anything to block my feet breathing. I wear ankle running socks and trail runners all year long. I walk through creeks and keep going because I know I will walk my feet dry within 0.1 miles of the crossing with this sort of system. I hike in rain the same way - I only put on Goretex socks when it is a long cold rain, or when hiking in snow/slush. I didn't put my socks on once during my trip because I figured I could keep moving fast enough to keep my feet warm and dry - but I screwed up and ended up stopping early to let my feet warm up and dry out. The next day I hiked out in the same crap with my Goretex socks on and was a happy hiker again.

[JAK]

I have these light soft leather ankle boots that are uninsulated but have a gortex liner on the inside. They are great in winter, but not in summer. I'm wearing them now actually, with thin wool socks. They weigh 1 pound each. I am not sure the gortex liner really does that much. Leather itself is a pretty awesome material. For wet winter conditions I seal them pretty good with a beeswax sealer. By mid-winter it is mostly worn off but I don't reseal them again until we get back into wet winter conditions again, which can be anytime really, but I wait before a trip. I soak them in water to get the salt out, then heat them up in the oven to dry them out and then apply the sealer while the leather is hot and dry.

For summer I would like to try moccassins, but I think I would need to lose some weight for them to work. My choice Spring/Summer/Fall and even winter depending on conditions, is light trail runners that have a good tread, and good cushion, and absorb the least amount of water when wet. I'm not conserned about drying time, since when that really matters they never dry anyway. I just want the least amount of water when wet. Its hard to tell when you buy them.

[stinkytoe]

Thanks for all of the advice given here. Much apprieciated. I am leaning torwards the lighterweight non-gortex boot from asolo.

I looked at the seal skin socks this weekend. they now make fully submergable waterproof socks, there is a seal at the top of the sock that supposedly keeps water out. would this be a nice thing to carry with these boots in case i need to keep dry? anyone used these ones before?

[Tinker]

Thanks for all of the advice given here. Much apprieciated. I am leaning torwards the lighterweight non-gortex boot from asolo.

I looked at the seal skin socks this weekend. they now make fully submergable waterproof socks, there is a seal at the top of the sock that supposedly keeps water out. would this be a nice thing to carry with these boots in case i need to keep dry? anyone used these ones before?

A seal at the top of the socks (much like diving dry suit gaskets) will give the socks better protection when submerged and prevent some water (less if you have hairy legs as the hair will act as a spacer between the skin and the gasket) from running down your leg and into the sock, but they would likely be much hotter due to the fact that the gasket would trap heat inside, too.
In wet weather that's not too cold, you're probably better off letting your feet get wet from rain. At least it's not sweat, which provides the best climate for bacterial growth on your skin.
Sgt. Rock almost has me convinced to try the Gore-Tex socks in cold, wet weather. For now, I have my choice of Sealskinz or neoprene.

[stinkytoe]

tinker,

do you think you would carry these fully submergable socks with the extra seal if you were to carry sealskinz?

[McKeever]

Your feet are waterproof, so don't worry about your boots, it's wool socks and liners that count!

Light weight fabric boots are better because they dry faster and are much lighter. If your pack is really light, you can go even lighter and use shoes. It's hard to beat a good pair of New Balance shoes and a light pack. For your feet, try the cheap thin nylon white socks from Wallyworld for wick liners and hot days and buy yourself a variety of wool rag socks and marino wool socks. The different sock weights are what is going to save your feet and keep them warm when slogging though the creeks.

[SGT Rock]

Go with what works for you. Unfortunatly you haven't figured that out yet.

In hindsite I would probably not go with one that I can submerge and here is my logic (it might be flawed).

1. Crossings in high water that happen when it is not raining, but the creek is high - if you put on your Goretex socks in order to keep your socks dry - your boots or shoes will still be wet. You have to keep the Goretex socks on while hiking after you cross in order to keep the socks dry which is why you put the Goretex on in the first place. If your Goretex seals that well you socks are going to still get wet from the sweat you trap in.

2. If you wear them on a rainy or snowy day - chances are you will still trap sweat in there and make your feet wet. In that case, as soon as you stop the first time you feet are going to be cold and wet even in Goretex.

My reccomendation would be to cross streams in some other manner and save a pair of Goretex socks for hiking in snow or long cold rains. That is one reason I like light trail runners and minimal socks - they hike dry. If you are going to use leather boots and thick socks - then you may want to have some sort of Crocks for camp shoes anyway - and switch over to those for water crossings.

[vonfrick]

That's easy: no goretex.

Unless, of course, you don't like the skin on your feet. Then, goretex all the way.

(Says the girl who soaked her goretex boots on the first day of a three day backpacking trip, could never get them dry, and lost a significant portion of foot skin as a result.)

same thing happened to me 'cept it rained for 3 days at the start of a 5 week trip. after losing the skin and 3 toenails the boots went in the trash and i did the rest of my hike in tevas and socks. i bought neoprene kayaking booties (~$20) and wore them when it rained over the socks. now that's all i hike in unless it's winter when i can stand a day or two in boots.

[shelterbuilder]

Now I'm going to muddy the waters a bit with a question that's (only) slightly off-topic. When I hike in my Gore-tex rainsuit, I've noticed that, when I stop at a shelter, I'm quite damp inside the suit. If I take the Gore-tex off immediately, I stay damp for quite a while, but if I leave the suit on for, say, half an hour, the excess water vapor seems to pass through the Gore-tex and I'm relatively dry.

Anybody notice the same effect with Gore-tex footwear (boots or socks)?

[Kerosene]

Now I'm going to muddy the waters a bit with a question that's (only) slightly off-topic. When I hike in my Gore-tex rainsuit, I've noticed that, when I stop at a shelter, I'm quite damp inside the suit. If I take the Gore-tex off immediately, I stay damp for quite a while, but if I leave the suit on for, say, half an hour, the excess water vapor seems to pass through the Gore-tex and I'm relatively dry.

Anybody notice the same effect with Gore-tex footwear (boots or socks)?Nope, my feet stay soaked.

I'd go with non-GT boots, but I'd seriously consider waterproofing the boots. The problem I have is that, once GT boots get wet, they stay wet.

[sticks&stones]

gor-tex is good up to 80lbs per square inch. depending on terrain, and weight, the limits on this fabric can be exceeded by 100's of lbs in a single step. seepage is immanent.

[bulldog49]

Now I'm going to muddy the waters a bit with a question that's (only) slightly off-topic. When I hike in my Gore-tex rainsuit, I've noticed that, when I stop at a shelter, I'm quite damp inside the suit. If I take the Gore-tex off immediately, I stay damp for quite a while, but if I leave the suit on for, say, half an hour, the excess water vapor seems to pass through the Gore-tex and I'm relatively dry.

Anybody notice the same effect with Gore-tex footwear (boots or socks)?


Never a problem drying out my Gore-Tex boots. I question what sort of conditions folks who claim otherwise were wearing them. If you're wearing them in summer in 90/90 conditions (90% humidity, 90 degrees) then, sure, they probably won't dry out very well. But Gore-Tex is not designed for those conditions. In cooler temps, lower humidity they are fine.

[lingo]

I do quite a bit of cross country type running. It is often that the trail we are running goes through creeks, rivers, swamps, etc. I wear a pair of Salomon Fury's. They are actually a softshell material. It will keep water out to a point. Once water does make it into the shoes though, they drain very well. I have had them dry out after running through a creek by the end of a 5 mile run before.
And for those that complain about the rain running down your leg into your boots. How about a pair of Paclite Goretex pants. They usually have a full zipper down the side and velcro at the top. That way you don't have to pull them on. They cover the tops of the boots and are waterproof.