View Full Version : Pack weight question
I am wondering if people include the clothes they will be wearing every day, pair of underwear, pants/shorts, socks ect. in the total pack weight? Becuase without including these items in my total weight I shave off almost 2 pounds.
The Weasel
03-03-2009, 12:01
Witch --
Many people use the concept of "FSO" for total weight. That stands for "From the skin out," referring to everything you're wearing. It's a bit more accurate, since it represents everything you are carrying, regardless of how. It can also remind you that you may well have as much as 5# or even more, depending on shoes/boots, belts, wallets, hat, and other stuff, and encourage you to rethink some of those things.
TW
I understand base weight to not include clothes normally worn.
I am not sure what is meant by clothes normally worn.
I hike with more clothing weight on than most people, because I keep my wool sweater on, always, even if I need to hike in shorts in winter, and my skin layers and wind shells and rain shells are normally packed. I only wear skin layers on coldest days. Others always wear skin layers, and call them base layers, which doesn't make sense to me in summer.
I think a better standard is skin out weight, less food and water.
For estimating food consumption per mile, I use total weight on feet.
Haven't worked out formula yet, but something like...
Food (kcal) = W (A + B*X + C*Y)
W = weight in pounds (total weight on feet)
X = total horizontal distance, in miles
Y = net elevation gain, in feet
A = kcal per pound (base metabolism)
B = kcal/mile per pound (flat terrain)
C = kcal/1000 feet per pound (for elevation gain)
Once you get the formula worked out for yourself, and you figure out how much energy you can burn in a day, you can use the formula in reverse to figure out how many miles you might cover in a day, or how many days to the next resupply point.
The other variable is how rough the trail itself is, like rocks and stuff.
Snow really slows you down, even a little snow alot more than you might think.
Why weigh anything other than everything you've got? It's all being carried!
SGT Rock
03-03-2009, 20:40
I am wondering if people include the clothes they will be wearing every day, pair of underwear, pants/shorts, socks ect. in the total pack weight? Becuase without including these items in my total weight I shave off almost 2 pounds.
Most people just go pack weight. They load up their pack and stick it on the scales.
Some people get a little more specific. They go by about 3 weights:
Base - this is the weight of all your gear IN YOUR PACK without consumables like food, water, fuel, etc.
Pack Weight - this is the weight of your pack with everything in it you plan to carry in it, including all consumables.
From Skin Out Weight (FSO) - this is the weight of everything you wear and carry.
You figure out what works for you. There are no pack weight police. I just reccomend you be honest with yourself. I've seen gear lists in the past where the hiker is happy to have a 35 pound pack weight, but has 12 more pounds of stuff he is carrying in his hands, pockets, worn, in fanny packs, etc.
You figure out what works for you. There are no pack weight police. I just reccomend you be honest with yourself. I've seen gear lists in the past where the hiker is happy to have a 35 pound pack weight, but has 12 more pounds of stuff he is carrying in his hands, pockets, worn, in fanny packs, etc.
Yeah, that is a good point. I always wonder which method someone is going by when they say there pack weighs 35 pounds.
SGT Rock
03-03-2009, 21:04
FWIW my FSO in winter with 4 days of food is about 37.5 pounds.
garlic08
03-04-2009, 00:48
Sgt Rock listed the most common definitions as I understand it. Most Western hikers use the "base weight" number. When I hit the AT, I found that many Eastern hikers used the "pack weight" number instead, which usually includes an ill-defined "full load of food and water". Many AT hikers don't know or care what their pack weighs, and that's OK too. I've never heard anyone talk about the "skin out" weight anywhere but here on WB.
Base - this is the weight of all your gear IN YOUR PACK without consumables like food, water, fuel, etc.
Does that include the pack itself, or just everything that goes in it excluding food, water, etc? Just wondering because I'm looking for a new pack and some of them have recommended base weights and I'm not sure whether or not to include the pack in that.
High Life
03-04-2009, 01:19
i always just include my pack full and then water ,food and fuel
I weigh myself on the scales, fully loaded, before I go. For myself, if it is over 240 pounds I know its going to be rough. If its under 220, I can include some trail running. If I ever get it under 200 I know it would feel really good. My FSOW for 5 days is also about 40 in winter, 30 in Spring/Fall, and can be as light as 20 in summer. My body weight has varied 185 to 230 over the past 6 or 7 years. My mileage has varied. ;)
SGT Rock
03-04-2009, 09:10
Does that include the pack itself, or just everything that goes in it excluding food, water, etc? Just wondering because I'm looking for a new pack and some of them have recommended base weights and I'm not sure whether or not to include the pack in that.
Yes it includes the pack itself.
SGT Rock
03-04-2009, 09:14
Sgt Rock listed the most common definitions as I understand it. Most Western hikers use the "base weight" number. When I hit the AT, I found that many Eastern hikers used the "pack weight" number instead, which usually includes an ill-defined "full load of food and water". Many AT hikers don't know or care what their pack weighs, and that's OK too. I've never heard anyone talk about the "skin out" weight anywhere but here on WB.
Hang around on some of the ultralight sites and they do talk about it. But some of these guys turn pack weight into a competition of who can get lighter. Base weight is how they keep each other honest in that competition. So a guy that claims to have gotten down to a sub5 pound base also has 12 pounds of other stuff is then considered a cheater. I did the sub 5 pound thing a while back - by FSO weight back then was about 15 pounds with all my stuff, food, water, fuel, and what I was wearing/carrying.
It's fun to try and go really light in summer. I like to go more primitive light than ultra light, just to mess around. I don't have a light sleeping bag, so I improvise. It ends up not much lighter than light, but not much heavier than ultralight either, just alot colder. It can still get rather cold at night though, so you have to be mindful of that. In Fall, Winter, Spring I don't mess around. March is probably the worst month here to mess around. I've never been deep in the woods in March. I've heard it can get rather ugly.