View Full Version : primaloft bag loft for 0 degrees?
jacknoir
03-07-2009, 19:44
Hey gang,
I just bought an Alps Mountaineering Slick Rock primaloft bag rated at 0 degrees from Steep and Cheap. The quality of construction seems good, but the bag seems to be too "flat" to me, as if it won't decompress to it's full height. I emailed Alps, the makers of primaloft, and Backcountry Outlet and nobody would directly answer my question of how much loft should this bag have when new.
Can anybody with a 0 degree rated primaloft or similar bag tell me how thick your bag is when it lays flat?
take-a-knee
03-07-2009, 20:01
Hey gang,
I just bought an Alps Mountaineering Slick Rock primaloft bag rated at 0 degrees from Steep and Cheap. The quality of construction seems good, but the bag seems to be too "flat" to me, as if it won't decompress to it's full height. I emailed Alps, the makers of primaloft, and Backcountry Outlet and nobody would directly answer my question of how much loft should this bag have when new.
Can anybody with a 0 degree rated primaloft or similar bag tell me how thick your bag is when it lays flat?
A 0 degree down bag should be 7in thick, a synthetic at least 6in.
6 inches regardless of fill. at least i think :o
Tipi Walter
03-07-2009, 20:51
Everyone knows the shelf life of a synthetic bag is shorter than a down bag(loft-wise), I just wonder if Primaloft is the same as Polarguard in this regard?? As in long term lifespan of the loft?
jacknoir
03-09-2009, 11:26
Thanks everybody so far. I wonder if having been in the compression sack until I bought it, probably a year anyway, has mashed the fiber irreparably. Anyone else have experience with Primaloft?
Tipi Walter
03-09-2009, 11:40
A year in a compression sack? It's probably ruined.
warraghiyagey
03-09-2009, 11:44
Disagree. . . strongly. . . the rating might be slightly affected, but it's not 'ruined'.
Gray Blazer
03-09-2009, 11:51
Disagree. . . strongly. . . the rating might be slightly affected, but it's not 'ruined'.
What do you know? You've only got one pic in your gallery. Tipi has way more.
skinewmexico
03-09-2009, 11:57
Everyone knows the shelf life of a synthetic bag is shorter than a down bag(loft-wise), I just wonder if Primaloft is the same as Polarguard in this regard?? As in long term lifespan of the loft?
Only slightly better.
Tipi Walter
03-09-2009, 12:06
Disagree. . . strongly. . . the rating might be slightly affected, but it's not 'ruined'.
Slightly? I used to own a nice polarguard North Face Bigfoot bag with 5F rating with between 8-10 inches of loft. Got it new in 1977 for $65. After 5 years of near constant use the loft was down to between 2-3 inches and useless for winter camping. Ruined? Naw, not for summer, but ruined for what it was intended for, winter backpacking. And this loss came not from a year stuffed in a compression sack, but just from normal long term backpacking and camping. I ended up giving it to Big Don who needed it to augment his two-bag winter system.
What do you know? You've only got one pic in your gallery. Tipi has way more.
And I'm sure to load in yet more. Who can keep up?
I have a marmot primaloft bag and got a year out of it at 0*(6.5loft new). lost 1-2 (4inches now) inch of loft during that time and its only comfortable down to 15-20* now wearing thermal pants and shirt with head covered
jacknoir
03-09-2009, 17:14
I say a year in the compression sack because, the box it came in obviously came from the manufacturer (Alps Mountaineering), and I emailed them to ask about the loft issue, and they would only say that they sent the bags to Backcountry.com in 2008 - so it wasn't like it had been hanging until I ordered it. I don't know what to think at this point. I'll have to head way north and go for some altitude to get anywhere near a zero degree night now. In fact, that doesn't sound so bad!
skinewmexico
03-09-2009, 18:00
Tumble it in a dryer and see if that helps it.
Unless you're heading out right away, give it a few days to loft back up. All synthetics compress, some pop back up faster, but most all will recover some, given some time.
Was it really in a compression bag? Like stuffed in, and then cinched down further? That would definitely not be a good sign for long term useful lifespan.
I read on Ray Jardine's website that all the syn fibers made in the USA are vacuum packed, shipped overseas where the products are assembled, packed back into vacuum bags for the boat ride back to the US, and only then put into their stuff sacks. The better stores will hang them to re-loft. I can neither confirm nor deny the statement, just repeating it (on the Internet).
If you can't give it a few days to rest, try the dryer set to no heat.
Ranc0r
.
Tipi Walter
03-09-2009, 18:39
I say a year in the compression sack because, the box it came in obviously came from the manufacturer (Alps Mountaineering), and I emailed them to ask about the loft issue, and they would only say that they sent the bags to Backcountry.com in 2008 - so it wasn't like it had been hanging until I ordered it. I don't know what to think at this point. I'll have to head way north and go for some altitude to get anywhere near a zero degree night now. In fact, that doesn't sound so bad!
If you could just find a nearby meat locker to stay in for the night . . . or a walk in freezor. I wonder if there's a Backpacking Institute that has walk in freezors for testing purposes?
I used to own a nice polarguard North Face Bigfoot bag with 5F rating with between 8-10 inches of loft.
this guy's bag is primaloft. they're different
I have a Kelty Bristlecone down bag - circa 1970's still plenty of loft.
Tipi Walter
03-09-2009, 19:09
this guy's bag is primaloft. they're different
Did you not read my previous post(below):
Everyone knows the shelf life of a synthetic bag is shorter than a down bag(loft-wise), I just wonder if Primaloft is the same as Polarguard in this regard?? As in long term lifespan of the loft?
yes i read it. but your other post, the one i quoted, you were inferring that your polarguard filling was the same. i'm not gonna argue w/ you. i see it happen in a lot of threads
Tipi Walter
03-09-2009, 19:35
yes i read it. but your other post, the one i quoted, you were inferring that your polarguard filling was the same. i'm not gonna argue w/ you. i see it happen in a lot of threads
So, what's the lifespan differences between Polarguard and Primaloft?
i'm not gonna argue w/ you. i see it happen in a lot of threads
^^^
jacknoir
03-09-2009, 21:41
yeah, in fairness to alps mountaineering, the bag's construction seems pretty good otherwise, and they finally responded to my question about how much loft it should have new: "3.75 inches across the chest." (I too have a circa 1975 down bag "Down Fill Country USA, Denver, CO" -how's that for obscure?, it still lofts pretty well but was only 20 degree rated). But my problem is this bag, new, out of that cranked down compression sack for a week now, lofts only 2.75" - 3" max. I had read about that vacuum packed business too. I wonder if that is true. I'll try the tumble dryer routine.
I bought a synthetic bag from NF. Used it a few years; broke the zipper, sent it back to NF to get zipper fixed - N sent me a new bag - said the loft didn't meet their standards.
Pretty darn nice of them, no?
it is. i've always gotten nothing but excellent CS from them
Take ALL temperature ratings with a healthy grain of salt, particularly from manufacturers like Alps Mountaineering who make a lot of extremely inexpensive gear.
If I had to guess, I'd wager that it has the amount of loft that it should, but it's still nowhere near lofty enough to sleep in comfortably at 0 degrees, assuming all your other gear is appropriate for that temp.
Tumble it in a dryer and see if that helps it.
Not a hot dryer. Extreme heat relaxes the fibers, straightening the kinks that give them loft.
One trip to a hot dryer ruined a Hollofil bag I had years ago. I decided to go with down in 1986 and haven't looked back.
jonathanb23
03-11-2009, 23:37
Tumble your Down on low - but keep your syn out of the dryer. For syn lightly shake and hang, but syn WILL lose loft with time and use.