View Full Version : maine much harder?
chrishowe11
04-15-2009, 08:47
I was just wondering what the differnces in the trail are down south... i have only been exposed to the AT in Maine and the Presidentials in NH. Ive heard Maine is the most burley hiking on the trail and even has "the hardest mile" in Grafton Notch I think. The biggest day I have done in Maine was around 12 miles and i was beat. i hear people talking 20+ miles and I think that would almost be suicide on the trail up here. more possible in south? any comments are appreciated.
Lone Wolf
04-15-2009, 09:00
walking the trail in the south is easy. it's switchbacked and the treadway is soft. not much steep stuff at all
It depends alot on total weight on feet when you get into steep hills.
When I do the Fundy Footpath there are some pretty extreme ups and downs.
The Fundy Trail Parkway is like an easy approach trail. It is 10km, or 6 miles, and is easily done in 1-2 hours and you don't get slowed much by a heavy pack or excess body weight. Same on the other end, the Goose River Trail in Fundy National Park. It is considered moderate, and has some good hills, but is still only 2 hours for the 8km or 5 miles even if heavily burdened, like 260 pounds total on my 6 foot frame.
The Fundy Footpath is a different story. When heavily burdened you are likely to average only 1 mile per hour. 24 hours over 3 days is very typical for most backpackers who want to make good time. 4 days is typical for people that wish to go slow. If you want to do much better than 10 miles per day you have go light, and be either very lean, or very mean. People have trail ran it in a day, so >20 miles/day can be done, but that is light and lean and mean.
So I would say miles/day in Maine depends alot on total weight on feet, all relative to your capacity to sustain work. Judging by my experience on moderate trails vs rugged trails I would suggest you could divide by 2 what you might normally do. As far as easy trails vs moderate trails, I didn't do the trail in PEI any faster than normal and it was totally flat. Sometimes easy trails are actually tougher if they are a hard surface, like a packed railway bed, or pavement, but that depends alot on footwear and total weight on feet. If you are capable of some trail running then easy trails can be very fast.
How much switchbacks and ladders are on the trail in Maine? The steep inclines really do slow you down, especially if you are burdened, even if you don't have to stop and rest part way. The switchbacks and ladders are there primarily to protect the trail of course, not the hiker, so it is important not to take shortcuts even if you are so inclined. I haven't counted them all but there are alot of switchbacks and ladders on the Fundy Footpath, and I would expect trails in Maine and the Whites to be very similar. The Eastern Section of the Fundy Footpath is all switchbacks. The Western Section from Little Salmon to Big Salmon is done with ladders. They were developed and funded a little differently, but the Eastern Section with the switchbacks is the tougher of the two, but both are pretty rugged.
So if you are used to the hiking of Maine mountains and the Presidentials of New Hampshire, you will have NO trouble on the rest of the AT. I think that Maine is the hardest (but also the loveliest) of all the states the AT traverses. NH is a close second.
The south will present you with plenty of climbing but you won't have the rocks and boulders and you won't have the mud. Furthermore, no stream crossings!
20 mile + days are common in the southern Appalachians, where as in Maine and in New Hampshire's White Mountains, 10 miles may already be a tough day. In the mid Atlantic states, many do 20 miles plus with no trouble at all! However, even if you COULD do 25-30 miles in a day, I would not recommend it. Most who try that (in PA for example) end up doing less the next day and our thus no better off than if they had done two 15 miles days!
DavidNH
rainmakerat92
04-15-2009, 09:52
Ive heard Maine is the most burley hiking on the trail and even has "the hardest mile" in Grafton Notch I think.
You are probably thinking of Mahoosuc Notch.
CrumbSnatcher
04-15-2009, 14:20
Pinkham Notch NH. to Stratton ME.
Almost There
04-15-2009, 14:51
Agree with Wolf. Hiking in the south is easy for the most part, although I did do a 23 mile day in the Wilderness in just under 10 hours(heading SB). You will find things easier down our way.
Going down steep grades is the most challenging for me. Going up steep grades is no problem.
bullseye
04-15-2009, 16:44
How much switchbacks and ladders are on the trail in Maine?
Switchbacks? I aways assumed that the folks laying out the trail in Maine (and NH) would look at a peak and say lets go there- as directly as possible:D. When the guidebook Maine or New Hampshire guidebook says there are switchbacks I never seem to find them:-?. I will say the rock work is pretty amazing in some sections though!
I started on the AT in PA and in the New England area and just thought the whole trail was rocks, until I went to Tennesee and discovered there is some darn nice trail down there. Did 20 mile days with no trouble. 12-15 in Maine were more tiresome by far.
chrishowe11
04-15-2009, 18:00
yah the "hardest mile" is the mahoosic range not Grafton its just a mile of crawling in and around boulders... of the mountains ive done in maine (old speck, Haul, Baldpates, saddleback, biggelows, sunday river whitecap) ive encountered very little switch backs mostly just strait up.
Old Hillwalker
04-15-2009, 18:51
Last summer I met two SOBO ladies in the hundred mile who had done the southern half of the AT the year before. They quit at Antlers Tent site saying that the bottom half of the AT was a "walk in the park" compared to Maine. And they never really got to the hard stuff like the Mahoosucs and Whites. They were going to try and catch a ride out to civilization. Lots of us got off the trail in Maine last summer.
walkin' wally
04-15-2009, 19:37
yah the "hardest mile" is the mahoosic range not Grafton its just a mile of crawling in and around boulders... of the mountains ive done in maine (old speck, Haul, Baldpates, saddleback, biggelows, sunday river whitecap) ive encountered very little switch backs mostly just strait up.
I agree. I've done all of Maine and there are very few switchbacks. There are some ladders and some very steep sections like the Mahoosuc Arm, Fulling Mill Mtn, White Cap (SOBO), the Hunt Trail etc
MileMonster
04-15-2009, 21:42
I grew up in the south and now I live in NH. When i did my thru hike in 2004 once I got past WV it was my first time hiking in all the states north of there. I'd agree that NH and Maine are the hardest sections of the Trail. Steep, rocky trails that go straight up the ridge. Granted, there are some tough grunts in the south, but overall NH and Maine are more consistently difficult, IMHO. If you're NoBo, the south can be tough 'cause you're just starting out, not in trail shape yet and shaking off the civilized world. But NH and Maine are jsut tough trail miles. I've heard it said that when a NoBo gets to the Whites he (she) has done 75% of the hike but only 25% of the work. Before my thru I thought that was BS talk. After my thru I think it is probably about right. It is so beautiful up here, though, all the effort is worth it.
- MM.
bullseye
04-15-2009, 22:20
It is so beautiful up here, though, all the effort is worth it.
- MM.
I agree 1,000,000 %:D!
modiyooch
04-15-2009, 22:48
Everyone says that Maine is harder. I do agree, but I have 100 miles left in Maine. I have done from Kennebec to Katahdin, and Gorham thru Baldpate to Andover. Please tell me that the section I have left, Andover to the Kennebec, is not as difficult. I'm hoping to make better time on the trail than what I have been doing.
TrippinBTM
04-16-2009, 08:03
When the guidebook Maine or New Hampshire guidebook says there are switchbacks I never seem to find them:-?. I will say the rock work is pretty amazing in some sections though!
Yeah, it was fun and interesting. Remember that jumble of giant boulders just coming off of Avery Peak (NOBO)? I remember walking through it and thinking how freaking awesome it would be to be there to see one of those chunks detatch from the mountain and crash down (awesome in the original sense of fear and wonder). Some of those were bigger than houses!
By the way, I just can't understand getting to Maine and saying, well, this is too hard, I quit. I mean, after 1800 miles, haven't you proven to yourself yet that you can handle it? Sure it's hard, but it's so beautiful, it's worth it. And you've some so far...
Please tell me that the section I have left, Andover to the Kennebec, is not as difficult.
Sorry, can't do it.
That section after RT 4 going north up to and including the Bigelows has some serious elev. gain and loss, but both ends won't be too bad.
Its worth it though .
walkin' wally
04-16-2009, 08:31
Everyone says that Maine is harder. I do agree, but I have 100 miles left in Maine. I have done from Kennebec to Katahdin, and Gorham thru Baldpate to Andover. Please tell me that the section I have left, Andover to the Kennebec, is not as difficult. I'm hoping to make better time on the trail than what I have been doing.
I would try to make enough time for this last section so you can enjoy it. There are great views. In my opinion there are tough stretches such as the ups and downs through the Saddleback area and the downhill into the South Branch of the Carrabassett River before the Crockers. ( if you don't like downhills )
There is the rugged Bigelow section with 360 degree views and the steep descent into Safford Notch. After Little Bigelow it's a cruise to the Kennebec River. If it is warm have a swim in Pierce Pond.
If you went to Andover by way of the East B Hill road then you have that little snot Moody Mtn with it's recent landslide and then up Old Blue and the long downhill from Bemis Mtn. This is a beautiful stretch though.
Do you have the maps for this section from the Maine AT Club or the ATC at Harpers Ferry?
Just my opinion but again I would try to make enough time to enjoy your hike without having to work against any deadline. I envy you. I wish I was doing this section again. Have fun :sun
Switchbacks don't make it any easier. You still have to go up and up and up and back down the other side and then back up and up and up again and they are still steep especially where they switch back. Easier on the trail though. I can see how they might not be so neccessary where there is rock. The switchbacks leaving Little Salmon River heading East still gives me nightmares from my first time with an insane pack stopping at every tree and going through 2 litres of water every hill but its not quite so bad with a light pack when my weight is down where it should be. I'm not sure but the Fundy Footpath never gets above 300m, and most of the climbs are only 500 feet at a time, but there are alot of them, and they are all pretty much straight up if not for the switchbacks. I think the total elevation gain over the 26 miles is gotta be something insane, like 3 or 4 miles maybe.
modiyooch
04-17-2009, 10:00
Do you have the maps for this section from the Maine AT Club or the ATC at Harpers Ferry?
I haven't carried maps, yet. I carry the summary data book, printouts of the road atlas of the area, and follow the white blazes. (I do own maps for the Whites, but forgot to pack them)
walkin' wally
04-20-2009, 10:19
I haven't carried maps, yet. I carry the summary data book, printouts of the road atlas of the area, and follow the white blazes. (I do own maps for the Whites, but forgot to pack them)
Having a look at the maps may give you an idea of the terrain. If you do, keep in mind the vertical exageration that is on the maps. You may not want to bring them and that's okay. I guess you have done well without them. Have fun.
modiyooch
04-20-2009, 22:12
maybe it's the vertical exageratin that you are talking about, but I have been misled by profiles before. Now I just tend to job plod on and take it as it comes. But, I am getting older and shouldn't have left the NE for last.
Chaco Taco
04-20-2009, 22:41
South is fun. I think that by the time you get North in New England you are so strong and in such good shape that the climbs are easier for you. Plus you are carrying as much because you have narrowed your gear down to what you need. I remember being surprised at how much better I was hiking when I knew it was more difficult in New England
Mahoosuc Notch is actually flat. However, boulders many the size of a VW, fell into the notch from the steep cliffs that make up the notch walls. You have to go up, over, under and around. Not hard, just time consuming, but fun, because it is unique. It is only a mile, but it might take two hours to hike through.
http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1087743537045831896WAIwjh
The trail builders of Maine do not like switchbacks, but they do like building stone steps!
Lemni Skate
04-21-2009, 12:04
Hardest to easiest:
1. New Hampshire (Maine has harder sections but NH is more consistantly hard)
2. Maine
3. Georgia
4. North Carolina/Tennessee
5. Virginia
6. Vermont
7. Pennsylvania
8. Massachuttes
9. Conneticuit
10. New York
11. New Hampshire
12. Maryland
13. West Virginia
dzierzak
04-22-2009, 11:04
Should 11 be New Jersey?
TrippinBTM
04-22-2009, 20:34
Hardest to easiest:
1. New Hampshire (Maine has harder sections but NH is more consistantly hard)
2. Maine
3. Georgia
4. North Carolina/Tennessee
5. Virginia
6. Vermont
7. Pennsylvania
8. Massachuttes
9. Conneticuit
10. New York
11. New Hampshire (New Jersey?)
12. Maryland
13. West Virginia
List starts out well, until you get to 7. New York was definitely harder than PA, which was easy though annoying with the rocks. NY had all those little PUDs, not to mention its share of real climbs, plus a major lack of water. I'd switch their places in the list.
(and like dzierzak, I'll assume #11 is meant to be NJ.)
wcgornto
04-22-2009, 21:17
Hardest to easiest:
1. New Hampshire (Maine has harder sections but NH is more consistantly hard)
2. Maine
3. Georgia
4. North Carolina/Tennessee
5. Virginia
6. Vermont
7. Pennsylvania
8. Massachuttes
9. Conneticuit
10. New York
11. New Hampshire
12. Maryland
13. West Virginia
I´ve continually read that the ends (GA/TN/NC and NH/ME) are harder than the rest. Your list conforms with this stereotype.
I do have one question, however. Why is Georgia #3 on the list ahead of North Carolina / Tennessee? Is it because of absolute difficulty or simply the break-in time for Northbounders? In other words, would the list be ordered differently for a southbounder (like me as of June 15)?
TrippinBTM
04-23-2009, 10:32
You'll handle GA ok. It has more to do with the break-in period.
Even after having 1900 miles under my feet, Maine still kicked my butt. That's mainly because I had just marched through the whites and had to immediately contend with southern Maine. Once you enter the Whites, it's consistent hard from there until you finish the bigelows, and then it's pretty much cruise control until the big K. For some reason, a lot of hikers believe that once they are through the whites, they are golden, that it's all downhill after that
When you look at GA is the grand scheme of things, it's quite easy. A lot of NOBO thru's consider it hard(as I did) because we had just started out and we're still carrying 40 pounds on our backs and try to get used to things.
In terms of daily elevation change, GA-NC and Maine are similar. You often get 6000-10,000 ft/day, if you put in a long day (ie 15+ miles). Neither are "easy" in terms of elevation gain/loss.
But the trail in GA-NC is often packed dirt, swithbacked, and skirts many summits on sidehills. In Maine, the trail is rocks/roots, not switchbacked, and goes right over the top of everything (we called it "no nubbin left unclimbed"). And Lord help you if you need to do those nasty climbs out of anything called a "Notch" in Maine. There's nothing like that in the south, except perhaps the north flank of Blood Mtn, and the south approach to Mt Albert, which is very short and sweet.
Having said that, Maine is my favorite. Not easy, but very fine hiking.
Kerosene
04-27-2009, 17:33
Here's my list, assembled after years of 75-150 mile sections:
New Hampshire
Maine
North Carolina (south of Hot Springs)
Virginia
Tennessee (north of Hot Springs)
Vermont
Pennsylvania
Georgia
Massachusetts
New Jersey
New York
Connecticut
Maryland
West Virginia
Of course, I haven't yet hiked what Maine and North Carolina, so they're up there by reputation. As a mid-mileage section hiker, I'm never in real backpacking shape when I start out, which is why I rate Georgia much lower. Some of the easier sections I did back in the 70's, so perhaps I've just forgotten some of the pain.
Switchbacks, steep hills, whatever. If there is Beer and/or good food at the end I believe I can hike as far as it takes with proper motivation. A lighter pack and proper footwear helps a little too.
Linesman
04-30-2009, 17:42
Glad to hear everyone thinks Maine and New Hampshire are the hardest, because that's what I'm used to. Good thing the AT isn't all like Mount Washington or Old Speck. I guess no one would finish it if it were:eek:
Chaco Taco
05-01-2009, 22:58
Glad to hear everyone thinks Maine and New Hampshire are the hardest, because that's what I'm used to. Good thing the AT isn't all like Mount Washington or Old Speck. I guess no one would finish it if it were:eek:
I think it really depends. By the time you reach NH and ME you are diesel and hike like a machine! Dont underestimate NC/TN. Also it aint just physical, the mental game in VA aint all peaches!
Maine has a special place in my heart. I would have to say that Maine was probably my favorite!
Lemni Skate
05-02-2009, 17:14
They've all got parts that get you. Virginia has some long, tough climbs, and the Roller Coaster sucks because everyone tells you that you'll be on cruise control once you get to SNP. Personally, I feel every 50 foot climb.
superman
05-02-2009, 17:40
Maine doesn't have much going on so they start these rumors that it's difficult. All such claims are exaggerations...don't worry about Maine...just go for it.:welcome
The Whites and southern Maine destroyed my knees.
Still feel the pain to this day.
max patch
05-04-2009, 12:30
7. Pennsylvania
Ignoring MD and WVA because they are so short (and honestly I don't even remember WVA without pulling out my journal) I'd have to rate PA as the easiest hiking. I budgeted 23 mpd in terms of resupply and always did that much or more. The rocks were more than an acceptable trade-off for the easy hiking.
TrippinBTM
05-05-2009, 09:15
I think it really depends. By the time you reach NH and ME you are diesel and hike like a machine!
I dunno. I was getting pretty tired by New Hampshire. The Whites kicked my butt, which made Maine harder. I still loved it though, being above tree-line with pretty much just wild forest all around.
gonewalkabout
05-05-2009, 10:44
I have not done Mahoosuc Notch which I know is very slow but I have done about 160 miles of ME including the 100 mile wilderness and did not find it to be dificuilt trail miles. NH is harder.
I have not done Mahoosuc Notch which I know is very slow but I have done about 160 miles of ME including the 100 mile wilderness and did not find it to be dificuilt trail miles. NH is harder.
You did the easiest part of Maine.
The trail in ME becomes rather easy once you march through the Bigelows.
However, the trail in ME up until the Bigelows is certifiably difficult, even for a hardened thru hiker mountain warrior.
bluffhead
05-31-2009, 15:13
i grew up hiking in the north , depends what ur used to i think. when i got down south i thought the trails were alot easyer to move long distance faster.
knicksin2010
06-05-2009, 17:38
A lot of the perceived difficulty of a section depends on the conditions that individual hikers face including weather, pack weight, re-supply strategy etc. It rained every day I was in Maine so I rank that state as the most difficult with NH a close second. The other states really don’t compare difficulty wise.
Maine
New Hampshire
North Carolina/Tennessee
Virginia
Vermont
Georgia
Massachusetts
Connecticut
New York
Pennsylvania
New Jersey
Maryland
West Virginia
South has more of the rolling hills type terrain with fewer steep climps.
Grafton Notch is not hiking! It's a dangerous, particularly when wet or icy, obstacle course.
Switchbacks don't make it any easier.
YES they do. They make it easier to maintain the trail and climb to the summit when compared to the older way of routing a trail by taking a steeper shorter route perpendicular or at a sharp angle to the contour lines that have a tendency toward greater erosion. I've noticed that where a trail crew or trail designers have a choice of rerouting or building trails, and not just on the AT, they are installing more switchbacks. Of course the switchbacks result in longer mileage, can take additional labor, and one still has to get to the top.
modiyooch
06-06-2009, 08:28
which stretch is the absolute hardest? I'm up to south arm road. The next 13 miles looks very tough.