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Alaskanhkr23
05-01-2009, 11:40
what is the best and lightest way to carry a couple days or even a weeks worth of food ?:sun im tired of carry such a heavy pack like i surgicly altered my tent so im looking for the food part

Foyt20
05-02-2009, 13:40
Take a gander at the cooking and food section of the board.Cooking and Food (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=32)

warraghiyagey
05-02-2009, 13:48
Sherpa. . . . or suck it up and carry what you need. . . .

SlowLightTrek
05-02-2009, 16:15
A giant helium balloon tied to the food sack and your backpack.

Engine
05-02-2009, 16:29
For trips of 1-4 days I can get by with 1 pound of food per day (I weigh 180), but for trips longer than that I really need 1 1/2 pounds of food per day to have any energy and also be able to smile. I still get hungry on that amount, but on long trips I "camel up" on food while in town or at any other chance I get. The weight of food is a requirement and it is the one area you shouldn't try too hard to cut back on if you are going to be out for very long.

wrongway_08
05-02-2009, 16:33
What Engine said.

I usually do subs if its only a few days and some power gels at night.

JAK
05-02-2009, 16:47
If you go light on food it should be high in carbs, and you need to have some flesh to spare.

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 16:58
Well i mean for the hundred mile wilderness 10 days of food righ? ive been asking question about maine for two day now and some people help ,some people just make stupid comments

JAK
05-02-2009, 17:01
Well your first post wasn't all that helpful. What do you really want to know?
How heavy are you? How many miles per day do you hike? How much do you know about nutrition?

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 17:04
What post? the post people went off about smoking? Wasn't my fault? i wanted tips pn better management of smokeing on the trail. But whats the best advice on how much and the lightest way to carry it on the 100 MILe wilderness

Engine
05-02-2009, 17:07
Well i mean for the hundred mile wilderness 10 days of food righ? ive been asking question about maine for two day now and some people help ,some people just make stupid comments

Your original post said a week and mentioned nothing about location. We aren't mind readers so we comment based on the info you give us to work with. For the 100 mile wilderness I would bring 8 days worth of meals and maybe 4 or 5 extra energy bars as a reserve in case you take an extra day. Based on my body weight it would be around 13 pounds of food. You have to figure out what you can get by on and it also depends on the time of year. If it's really cold your gonna need more food.

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 17:09
oh i thought someone else was bringing up the smoking thread that went to hell -SORRY EVERYONE

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 17:11
engine ,whats the best types of food like those freeze dried packs or like dried out meat?

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 17:16
I like usually bring two Large bottles of water,Then i bring a small bottle of water and some energy mix for it,And then i bring those Backpackers pantry things but i have found that there horrible to pack out and they begin to weigh alot-is there away to better pack them ? or is there better foods to bring?plus they don't last very long energy wise

Engine
05-02-2009, 17:17
engine ,whats the best types of food like those freeze dried packs or like dried out meat?

Honestly, I don't use freeze dried due to high cost and small portion sizes. I get by just fine with Knorr (used to be Lipton I think) noodle or rice based meals which come in a packet that has the right amount of food for a HUNGRY hiker. For protein I add tuna, summer sausage or stuff like that. At breakfast I pre mix cereal with powdered milk in a small ziplock for each meal. I add 6 ounces of water, shake it for a second, and eat it out of the pouch. Bingo, fast easy instant breakfast that doesn't use stove fuel. I will sometimes eat a hot lunch of soup, but usually eat peanut butter and crackers with some beef jerkey and stuff like that. Between meals I will eat a cliff bar or some other energy bar and some GORP twice a day. And after dinner I have the ever famous Snickers bar. When I get to a town I force myself to eat some fresh fruit and veggies since it's hard to get on the trail.

Engine
05-02-2009, 17:17
I do mix a couple bottle of Gatorade every day for electrolytes as well.

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 17:28
yeah,my cousin was like we wont need those packets of gatoraide-yeah i mixed one on a rest and he almost drank the whole thing they are great,are those noodle meals the ones that are small clear packets of dried noodles and some sauce,i think ive seen them.I like the little packets of peanut butter that u can invidualy open.

Engine
05-02-2009, 17:53
yeah,my cousin was like we wont need those packets of gatoraide-yeah i mixed one on a rest and he almost drank the whole thing they are great,are those noodle meals the ones that are small clear packets of dried noodles and some sauce,i think ive seen them.I like the little packets of peanut butter that u can invidualy open.

I try to keep packaging to a minimum to help reduce weight, so I carry a 1 pound plastic jar of peanut butter and just use from that. It goes pretty fast when your hungry and it's calorie dense. The meals I was talking about are usually around the Rice a Roni type stuff in the grocery store and they are packaged with a photo of the rice or noodles over the front of the package and the name Knorr in bold lettering across the top, but there are other manufacturers as well. Typically they weigh 4-5 ounces and use 2 cups of water when cooking so they make around 3 cups of food and that quite a bit when you add meat or a bagel or something. I usually split one with my wife and have a bagel on the side to make up the difference.

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 18:06
yeah well from living in ak ,ivee learned to bring more food than u think,just on the basis on temp drop,or ttakes longer than u think,i would like to go light this summer.I know if u use water to make noodles u can recycle the noodle water and mix in hot chocklat mix and u get good drink with some carbs or starches

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 18:09
Whats better stove cooking or Fire pit? i plan on having a fire but if i can save gas for more appropriate situation i will

Engine
05-02-2009, 20:39
Whats better stove cooking or Fire pit? i plan on having a fire but if i can save gas for more appropriate situation i will

I'm too tired after a 12-15 hour day to mess with building a fire. I love hanging out by a fire and contemplating the meaning of life and all that, but for cooking nothing beats a stove. Unless it's a BBQ grill with a cold beer in hand. :D

OutdoorsMan
05-02-2009, 20:45
The solution is to drink light beer. If it says "light" that means is weighs less, right?

Engine
05-02-2009, 20:47
Did you see the other thread regarding the concentrated beer that is under development? I almost hollered out loud! I've been thinking about that for a long time and even tried to dehydrate one once just to see what would happen...didn't work but I'm waiting with wings on for this new product. :banana

Alaskanhkr23
05-02-2009, 21:42
I dont drink so i wouldnt know,im more of a Herbal remedies type

Engine
05-03-2009, 07:15
Too bad, a cold one with dinner is just the thing. It doesn't leave me coughing with a sore throat and then all hungry again...:)

Alaskanhkr23
05-03-2009, 11:04
LOL engine,thats funny ,nah i used to drink beer just didnt settle with me righ

jrnj5k
05-05-2009, 09:47
better is a matter of opinion. i prefer stove cooking via an alcohol stove. fire pits aren't always available.

LaurieAnn
05-05-2009, 09:51
I too prefer using a stove either white gas or alcohol (depends on the trip). One, for the reason mentioned above concerning firepit availability and two, sometimes there are firebans where we hike and paddle due to dry conditions.

JAK
05-05-2009, 11:25
My preference is really small and simple wood fires and wood stoves, but sometimes even they can't be used, and sometimes they don't work so well so you have to either go a little bigger or switch. I'm working on a small simple hobbo stove and when that doesn't work then use it with a simple alcohol or vegetable oil burner. So the plan is to always carry some alcohol and some vegetable oil, and use them as fuel when needed. Primarily the few ounces of ethanol will be for first aid / hygene, and the few ounces of vegetable oil will be for food, but both available as food when neccessary. The alcohol will be better for fast boiling. The vegetable oil will really only be good for slow heating, to save the ethanol fuel, but good enough for a cup of hot tea. I can go with cold food and a hot drink when conserving fuel also. I think this is a fun way to go when you like to mess around with all three. The alcohol and vegetable oil will use the same burner, perhaps my ION stove, but with the vegetable oil I will use a wick of jute twine or moss or grass or something from the woods. A piece of charcoal can make a nice wick also. Haven't made a hobbo stove I'm really happy with yet, but it will be simple and light. Perhaps more of a windscreen/pot holder than anything else. Maybe a cone collapsable into something flat or rollable. Still need something to keep the sticks off the ground though, especially on snow or wet or frozen ground, but I still have the burner option when conditions are nasty. My pots will likely remain dirty, but I'm ok with that.

JAK
05-05-2009, 11:47
As food goes, I think its best to first work out how much protien, fat, carbs you need. If running or doing alot of tough hills you need more carbs. If going more steady all day at a nice slow pace you burn more fat. Transition in theory is what they call the Aerobic Threshold, where you burn 50% of each, which for me is about 120bpm. Not to be confused with Anaerobic Threshold. As I am somewhat heavy, my Aerobic Threshold is lower than my slowest running pace, especially with a pack. Some runners can run below their Aerobic Threshold but not me. For everyone it is probably what you can maintain 12 hours, running or hiking, but with hills there will always be periods where you burn more carbs. I think for most hikers, hiking 6-12 hours a day, heavy or lean, 10% protien, 40% fats, and 50% carbs is a pretty good mix for total calories burned. If you are lean, that would need to be your diet mix. If you are overweight, and willing to burn some flesh, then you are basically replacing fat from your diet with fat from your body, and the other to go up proportionally, but you are carrying less food for the same calories burned, and more food for the same calories carried. So for the overweight hiker the mix of calories in food carried becomes more like 15% protien, 10% fats, and 75% carbs, though you are still burning it up at 10/40/50, roughly. Your not really burning the protien so much as using it up to replace worn out muscle tissue, but you can think of it the same way.

So I say first decide how many grams of protiens, fats, and carbs you will burn.
Then decide how much fat can come from your flesh, and not have to be in your food.
Then perhaps break the carbs in half between slow carbs and fast carbs.
Then choose foods that fit the bill, and make sure it includes some fibre.
With a good balanced mix it should contain all the vitamins and minerals you need.
Make sure anyway, and then make some changes. Make sure there isn't too much sodium.

I've started making my own jerky, which is fun and easy, and allows alot less salt. You really don't need any salt in dried meat, but its a good place to add the small ammount of salt you do need if you don't add it anywhere else, and then eat more jerky on those days you sweat more and drink more, and less jerky and perhaps more milk on days you don't.

JAK
05-05-2009, 12:01
Ryan Jordan wrote a nice article which got into the fact that your body also stores protien, so your protien reserves can also be a resource to fall back on during your hike. Rather than a specialized storage tissue like adipose tissue for fat, the body stores its protien reserves as extra muscle, muscle you don't actually need. That is why beef cattle develop huge muscles without working out. Men and women both do the same, some more than others, and usually not without alot of fat issue as well. As Ryan explains is lean people probably lose a pound of muscle for every 2 pounds of fat, and moderately overweight people might lose a pound of muscle for every 4 or 5 pounds of fat. In my simplified thinking you don't want to lose muscle, but in reality, especially for lean hikers doing high miles, your body can't help but fall back on muscle and fat reserves even if you bring more than you can eat. The super lean high mileage hiker really only needs to bring all he can eat. The moderately overweight hiker, doing long days, and willing or eager to lose weight, only needs to bring enough to be comfortable, without bonking. A lean hiker might need 2 or 3 pounds a day, 40-50% fat, as much as he can eat, and he might still lose some flesh. The moderatelty overweight hiker, hiking the same hours but perhaps less miles, might only need 1 to 1.5 pounds a day, 5-10% fat, with another 1.0 pounds per day coming from his body, and still feel he is eating well enough. For losing weight hiking only 0.5 pounds of food per day might be done in theory, but not without discomfort and risk, and probably more muscle loss than desirable.

sarbar
05-05-2009, 12:30
Jak...one who is overweight can and will lose weight on 1 to 1 1/2 lbs of food a day - if hiking hard enough. I often lose 10 lbs in 4 to 5 days when hiking. And I eat pretty decently. Thing is....doing 15+ mile days and gaining 3-6K a day of elevation burns them calories ;-) Great weight loss (well till one gets back to town and chows down!)

My friend T. is one of those ladies who is in super shape (she is a trail runner, loves doing 50 milers). She can never get enough to eat. But has no reserves on her body. So she eats from waking up to sleeping. If she doesn't she has nothing but lean muscle to eat up and she can't risk that. It is going to be interesting to see how her thru hike plays out this year.