View Full Version : Does the SPOT Work?
Shutterbug
05-03-2009, 11:51
In another thread, I suggested that Ken Knight would have been rescued earlier if he had carried a SPOT. That post led to some questions. Because I didn't want to hijack the thread about Ken Knight, I am moving the conversation here.
Cool. I've heard mixed reviews about the SPOT.
Have you used it in thick forest settings yet? That is the complaint I have heard- it does not work in thick canopy.
I have used the SPOT for over a year. I used it this week when I climbed Mt. Wrightson in Arizona. One can see the results here:
http://share.findmespot.com/shared/faces/viewspots.jsp?&glId=0tLlE23uHHrLnyvAqgXHzKtqhP5XpPu7f
The record will disappear tomorrow, because it remains on the site for one week.
For background purposes, I should say that I am a 65 year old service disabled veteran with a history of heart problems. My disability is prostate cancer, so it does not impact my ability to hike, but it still makes my family nervous when I hike alone.
After having used the SPOT for a year, these are my observations:
1) The "Track" feature is very dependent on having access to an open sky. When I hike in heavily wooded areas, the signals don't get through.
2) The "I'm" OK feature seems to be much more reliable. I have come to the assumption that the SPOT continues to send it out until the message is received. To the best of my knowledge, no "I'm OK" message has ever not been received.
3) I have not used the "Help" or the "911" features, but becasue the "I'm OK" feature works all of the time, I assume those features will work when I need them.
I usually hike alone, so I use the SPOT primarily for the benefit of my wife. The "track" feature allows her to follow the progress of my hike. Even if a track signal gets out only now and then, she can see that I am moving. I use the "I'm OK" signal to mark the location where I camp. When I make camp, I find a location where I can see open sky, press the "I'm OK" button and place the SPOT on the ground. I leave it there until the SPOT shows that the signal has been sent. In the morning, I use the "I'm OK" button to let her know that I am breaking camp and on the trail again.
When I hiked the Wonderland Trail, the "track" messages were scarce. Approximately one an hour got out.
When I hiked the PCT in the Goat Rocks Wilderness, every track message got out.
When I hiked the Grand Canyon, rim to rim, the track messages generally didn't get out when I was close to the rim, but did get out after I got out of the shadow of the rim.
Week before last, I hiked in the Chiricahua Wilderness. About half of the track messages got out. All of the "I'm OK" messages got out.
My conclusion is that the SPOT is certainly worth the extra weight. I take it on every hike I do.
Plenty to read about the SPOT here: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=44399&highlight=spot&page=2
I too have been using the SPOT for over one year, no problems so far. I primarly hike solo, if I get injured to the point I'm unable to get to the next road crossing/town or lost to the point I'm unable to find my way for whatever reason(s) I believe the SPOT signal will enable local volunteers or SAR to find and help me sooner. Some may say sit tight and another hiker will soon be along, well maybe and maybe not, it depends on your location and time of year.
I know of one person that used their SPOT last year, with a broken ankle and unable to walk out on their own the 911 button was used and help was to the person in a few hours
warraghiyagey
05-03-2009, 13:48
No. . . he hides under the Munsters stairs. . .
http://www.the-reelgillman.com/munsters/images/spot2.jpg
No. . . he hides under the Munsters stairs. . .
http://www.the-reelgillman.com/munsters/images/spot2.jpg
LOL!
do you take him hiking or just the penguin and beaver? ;)
warraghiyagey
05-04-2009, 08:17
LOL!
do you take him hiking or just the penguin and beaver? ;)
Spot pretty much does what he wants. . . . :p
tlbj6142
05-04-2009, 10:43
My biggest compliant about SPOT (once you come to terms with the spotty coverage...:D) is the pricing. Having to pay $99/year is just crazy for someone that doesn't hike all that often. If they offered a pre-paid plan of say $40 for 20 messages ($2/message), I'd probably get one. With their pricing you can buy a PLB (better coverage though they don't offer the "I'm OK" feature) for the cost of a SPOT and 2 years of service.
JaxHiker
05-04-2009, 13:26
I agree completely with the pre-pay idea. You can do service plans for 3, 6, or 12 months with PocketMail. I suppose in the grand scheme of things if you need it once then $99 isn't much at all. But to those of us that don't get out as often as we'd like it's hard to justify.
Wrangler88
05-04-2009, 14:03
My parents bought me a spot a month or so ago to take with me on the AT. Havn't activated it yet.
My question is: Is it weatherproof enough that I can leave it on the outside of my pack for my entire trip? To get rained on, etc?
Shutterbug
05-04-2009, 21:29
My parents bought me a spot a month or so ago to take with me on the AT. Havn't activated it yet.
My question is: Is it weatherproof enough that I can leave it on the outside of my pack for my entire trip? To get rained on, etc?
The battery compartment is water proof. I am not sure that the LEDs are weatherproof, but they appear to be.
Personally, I just stick my SPOT in the top pocket of my pack. The silnylon material does not have any impact on the signal.
My primary concern has been about accidentally pressing the 911 button. Once I attempted to send the "I'm OK" message after dark. After I pressed the button, I had this sinking feeling that I might have accidentally pressed the wrong button. All I could see in the dark was a red LED blinking. I pulled out a flash light and was very pleased to confirm tha I had pressed the right button. After that incident, I went back and read the instructions. I was pleased to learn that one can cancel the 911 signal by holding the 911 button for 4 seconds.
Shutterbug
05-04-2009, 21:31
My biggest compliant about SPOT (once you come to terms with the spotty coverage...:D) is the pricing. Having to pay $99/year is just crazy for someone that doesn't hike all that often. If they offered a pre-paid plan of say $40 for 20 messages ($2/message), I'd probably get one. With their pricing you can buy a PLB (better coverage though they don't offer the "I'm OK" feature) for the cost of a SPOT and 2 years of service.
Before SPOT came out, I used to carry a satellite phone. Compared to a satellite phone, the SPOT is economical.
modiyooch
05-04-2009, 22:10
I didn't think that SPOT worked too well for the Karl Meltzer run. Actually, I didn't see it work at all.
tlbj6142
05-05-2009, 09:01
Before SPOT came out, I used to carry a satellite phone. Compared to a satellite phone, the SPOT is economical.For the price of SPOT's annual usage fee you can rent a sat phone for 3 weeks. Txt messages are only $0.60/each.
I'm coming up on my first year too. My sig line has my usage info and thoughts, so I won't repeat it here. Here's my biggest pro and con.
Pro - The hands-free nature of the unit in TRACK mode. Turn it on, put it in TRACK mode and forget about it.
Con - Globalstar financials. The company is burning through it's cash and then? It is not profitable. Credit is tight. They are creatively marketing their satellite service, but I don't know if they can pull it off. Will Obama buy them too?
The SPOT is soooo much more convenient than a sat phone rental. Spot goes with me on the dash of my truck as well as on my pack. I think the service is priced just right.
My parents bought me a spot a month or so ago to take with me on the AT. Havn't activated it yet.
My question is: Is it weatherproof enough that I can leave it on the outside of my pack for my entire trip? To get rained on, etc?
Yes, it is weather proof. Mount it on top of your pack facing the sky. Leave it on until you camp for the evening. Enjoy it.
tlbj6142
05-05-2009, 11:16
Pro - The hands-free nature of the unit in TRACK mode. Turn it on, put it in TRACK mode and forget about it.Doesn't the track mode cost an additional $45/year? I guess I don't see the need for track mode (as I would become far to paranoid about battery life to ever use it). It is the "I'm OK", "Need Help" and "911" features that are interesting to me. It would also be nice if the device had a simple display (UTM coords, status, etc.).
Hasn't one of the GPS manufactures starting doing something similar to SOPT? Maybe I'm thinking of a car based GPS not handheld???
It is priced correctly if you use often. If you only want to use it 2-3 weekends a year, or less, it is too expensive. And 90+% of backpackers (and back country users) fall into that category. Which is why I don't understand why they don't have a pre-paid option. They are alienating a huge market and/or price gouging them.
I guess I don't see the need for track mode (as I would become far to paranoid about battery life to ever use it). .
Read the info provided in my sig line link.
Hey, if you find something equivalent, please post a link for the rest of us.
tlbj6142
05-05-2009, 12:53
Read the info provided in my sig line link.I have; however, I'm not sure what information it adds to the discussion (except for the anecdotal comment about battery life). If anything, it makes it seem like the extra $50/year tracking is all but required. Making the device even more expensive to own in order to make it "usable".
tlbj6142
05-05-2009, 13:05
Hey, if you find something equivalent, please post a link for the rest of us.My concern isn't about the device's functionality (though it is a concern from what I've read in several reviews), but the pricing scheme. For many potential users, I see the SPOT plan ($170 for the device, $150 for a year of service [assuming I purchase the tracking feature]) as the equivalent of buying grandma a $99/month all you can eat cell phone plan when you know she's gonna let the battery go dead and it will sit in the glove box. Whereas a pre-paid phone that runs on AA would do just as well.
If they offered a pre-paid, weekly, or monthly option, etc. I could see their sales improving dramatically. And if they added a simple UTM coord LCD window you could even use the device as an on-trail navigational aid (GPS replacement).
I have; however, I'm not sure what information it adds to the discussion (except for the anecdotal comment about battery life). If anything, it makes it seem like the extra $50/year tracking is all but required. Making the device even more expensive to own in order to make it "usable".
It's not for you. I can tell. Next in line please.
Shutterbug
05-05-2009, 14:43
..I guess I don't see the need for track mode (as I would become far to paranoid about battery life to ever use it). .
First, let me address the battery life issue. I have been amazed. The batteries last for months. I carry extra batteries, but have needed them only once, even on week long hikes. The batteries that are now in my SPOT have been there since January and are still working fine.
For me the track feature is the best feature. If you carry a traditional ELP, you have to be conscious and able to activate the unit for it to do any good. If you have a heart attack or fall off a ledge and hit your head, you may not be able to press the button. With the track feature, you just turn it on at the start of your hike. Even if you can't press the button, when you don't show up were you are supposed to, SAR will know within 1/4 mile or so where to look for you. It will narrow the search area dramatically.
Another feature that no one has mentioned is the SAR insurance. If one travels outside the U.S., like I do, the SAR optional rescue insurance that can be purchased with the SPOT is worth the price of the unit.
First, let me address the battery life issue. I have been amazed. The batteries last for months. I carry extra batteries, but have needed them only once, even on week long hikes. The batteries that are now in my SPOT have been there since January and are still working fine.
For me the track feature is the best feature. If you carry a traditional ELP, you have to be conscious and able to activate the unit for it to do any good. If you have a heart attack or fall off a ledge and hit your head, you may not be able to press the button. With the track feature, you just turn it on at the start of your hike. Even if you can't press the button, when you don't show up were you are supposed to, SAR will know within 1/4 mile or so where to look for you. It will narrow the search area dramatically.
Another feature that no one has mentioned is the SAR insurance. If one travels outside the U.S., like I do, the SAR optional rescue insurance that can be purchased with the SPOT is worth the price of the unit.
Did the unit indicate low batteries? I've been thinking of changing the batteries "just because" - mainly because it is spooky how long they last. I keep expecting the unit to signal low battery - but it just keeps on working.
Regarding TRACK, OK and electronic breadcrumbs - I'm amazed at how many people can't get their head around the concept. Over time I've come to believe that there are people just too "slow" to own SPOT. Harsh, but true.
Regarding SAR: The following is a sober reminder that my primary safety and wellbeing is up to me - carrying SPOT or a PLB won't change the fact that SAR isn't perfect. This fellow was carrying SPOT and died even though SAR knew where he was
http://www.news10.net/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=48747&provider=top
Shutterbug
05-08-2009, 11:15
Did the unit indicate low batteries?
Yes. When the batteries finally ran down, the led started blinking red. It has happened to me only once in a year of frequent use.
mister krabs
05-08-2009, 12:02
Does anyone use This? (http://www.google.com/latitude/intro.html) It's cell based rather than sat based, but seems to have some of the same utility for the best price out there.
Sure, coverage would be *more* spotty than sat, or even non-existent in some places, but in others could be very good. Free is pretty powerful.
I have seen about 6 SPOT equipped hikers in the last year. In each case, the purpose was to calm and reassure friends and family.
Each person was well pleased with the results.
Most didn't "track". They found a clearing at day's end and sent a single post. (and I suppose an "I'm okay" signal)
They all said their families were easier to get along with because of the device.
Kerosene
05-08-2009, 14:16
Does anyone use This? (http://www.google.com/latitude/intro.html) It's cell based rather than sat based, but seems to have some of the same utility for the best price out there.I saw this also. Given that many people insist on bringing a cell phone, combined with SPOT's difficulty of finding a satellite while walking the AT's green tunnel, this might be a very workable compromise.
I saw this also. Given that many people insist on bringing a cell phone, combined with SPOT's difficulty of finding a satellite while walking the AT's green tunnel, this might be a very workable compromise.
Try it, compare it with SPOT and post your results.
Manufacturer's recall http://www.trailspace.com/articles/2009/12/15/spot-voluntary-return.html
mweinstone
12-17-2009, 09:29
fear. selling fear is wrong. spots suck, dont work and are allways unessisary. fear is not to be taken lightly. selling it makes us all loosers.the spirit of human adventure and of our trail is lessoned by it, and the bearspray it rode in on.
the spot 2 is on recall....alot of stores still sell them.....I know people that have them and don't know....pass the word:confused:
So they release a new version to correct the issues with old version..and now they are recalling the "new and improved version".... :confused:
Interesting take on the economic issues of SPOT vs a PLB (people in the thread have different takes..so it could be a useful thread)
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=25569
the old spot is good.....they work really well ......
Shutterbug
12-17-2009, 17:13
fear. selling fear is wrong. spots suck, dont work and are allways unessisary. fear is not to be taken lightly. selling it makes us all loosers.the spirit of human adventure and of our trail is lessoned by it, and the bearspray it rode in on.
The three climbers on Mt. Hood would probably still be alive if they had carried a SPOT.
they were my friends .....I know they had it....:mad:
they were my friends .....I know they had it....:mad:
? Please explain..
The three climbers on Mt. Hood would probably still be alive if they had carried a SPOT.
Mt Hood is a very nasty place when the weather turns. Often SAR can't get to you. The 304 Air Guard helicopters can't fly. You're stuck until the weather breaks. SPOT or a PLB will give your exact location so that SAR can focus on getting you out, instead of searching the mountain. Unfortunately, I don't think the bodies will ever be found - not uncommon.
Shutterbug
12-18-2009, 13:07
they were my friends .....I know they had it....:mad:
Taking your post at face value, if they had a Spot or PLB, they didn't activate it. That points out one of the key differences between a Spot and a PLB.
For the PLB to be of value, the user has to be able to activate it in an emergency. If a climber falls and is injured, he or she may not be able to activate the PLB.
If one has a Spot and has the "track" feature activated. Their location can still be determined based on the tracks, even if they are unable to activate the 911 button.
The ony time I have ever come close to needing rescue was on the Wonderland Trail on Mt. Rainier. I was in a remote area on the west side and came across a large tree that had fallen across the trail. As I attempted to climb over the tree, I slipped and went over the edge. Limbs of the tree broke my fall. If they hadn't I would have fallen head first on the rocks below. If that had happened, I would have been unconscious, out of sight from the trail. Frankly, my body would probably still be there.
In that kind of situation, if one is using a Spot with the track feature activated searchers will know where to look based on the tracks even if the 911 featue isn't activated.
SAR did get a hit......but not long enough...maybe that's why the spot2 is recall.............................
SAR did get a hit......but not long enough...maybe that's why the spot2 is recall.............................
I know that SAR reported a cell phone ping. A "ping" is when the phone tries to connect to a cell tower.
SAR doesn't get a "hit" from SPOT. The SPOT ERC calls SAR (in this case SPOT ERC would've called the Clackamas Sherrif's office).
Shutterbug
12-18-2009, 15:06
SAR did get a hit......but not long enough...maybe that's why the spot2 is recall.............................
All of the news reports say they didn't carry a PLB or a SPOT. In fact, I saw one of their friends on Seattle TV discussing why they didn't carry one. The arugment was that people who carry PLBs are tempted to take more risk than those who don't. The argument seemed weak considering the circumstances.
It does what it says.
I use one for motorcycle travel. Family and friends could track my progess across Canada. So there are other uses than just backcountry.
You can use the 'Help' button as a poor mans tracker. It may say 'Help' but its for your use. You use it to notify your personal contacts should you need help. Once pressed it sends out a 'Help' message every 5 minutes for one hour. So if your moving it will show your track. But you need to repress it every hour.
I ride to work at 2am, when the deer, drunks, and cops are the most active. Its always in tracking mode at that time. When I reach work, I turn the tracking off , press the OK button to let everybody know I made it.
You can set it up to send OK messages to your own cell phone. This lets you know your messages are going out. Most of the time its fast....press the OK button and the cell goes off maybe 20-30 seconds later.
I'd buy one again....if fact I did as the first one was stolen with my tankbag. Had it been in tracking mode. I'll still have it.
daryl
I taked to some of my friends and you are right it was a cell phone ping ......let's just let them rest...I could'nt think of a better place......
My dad recently bought me a Spot II, which really surprised me since he's not very tech-savvy. I have no idea where he heard about the device.
Anyway, I haven't turned mine on yet either due to the expense. All the local hiking I do around here is in areas where cell signal is easily acquired (Sam Houston Natl Forest 60 miles north of Houston). If it were a bit cheaper, I'd probably go for it. Otherwise, I'm waiting until next year to turn it on just prior to my thruhike.
According to the owners manual it is waterproof, so I used the included 4mm carabiner clip to attach it to a daisy chain running across the top of my pack and intend to leave it there rain or shine.
SunnyWalker
12-18-2009, 22:23
I like the tracking feature. Like SBug says, if one fell and was unconscious you'd be found eventually.
Regarding motorcycle use. I picked up a 2 1/2" deck screw in the rear tire just south of Hannibal MO. Pulled over to have a look-see. It took me 90 minutes to change out the tube. During the whole time the SPOT was in my jacket pocket draped over the handle bars. When I checked my SPOT track there where 9 flags in one location along the road where I stopped. Won't ride without it.
daryl