View Full Version : resupply in the whites
phillycheze
05-20-2009, 01:44
is it easy enough to just to hit towns, etc. for goods. or are mail drops or a combination of the two the way to go?
peakbagger
05-20-2009, 07:34
Once you leave Glenciff, your options for maildrops all require long hitches and the hitches usually bring you to a town with a store where you can resupply. The exceptions are at Crawfords Notch (Rt 302 crossing) (where you may be able to send a package to AMC's Highland center (I am not sure of this so verify, before you do) and at Pinkham's notch (Rt 16 crossing)(where AMC does accept mail drops).
Crawfords Notch is roughly halfway through the whites, if you cant do a mail drop at the Highland Center (which is still a hitch), then you need to hitch down to the grocery store in Glen on Rt 302 (near the intersection of RT 16)or take your chances at a campground store several miles south of the trail crossing. Rt 302 is main tourist road with a a lot of hiker traffic so hitching shouldnt be a major hassle.
At Pinkham's, its usually an easy hitch to Gorham and many hikers elect to come off the trail, hitch to Gorham and take a break, then arrange a slackpack of the Wildcat Range. Unfortunately the Walmart which is the only grocery store in Gorham is a couple of miles out of town towards Berlin. There is a local shuttle to save the walking
One thing to keep in mind is that a lot of folks overestimate their daily mileage after leaving Glencliff, and sometimes get behind a day. If they planned their food tight, they end up having to hitch to Woodstock/Lincoln for a unplanned resupply. The flipside to this is that there is a string of three AMC huts in this section that usually sell some sort of lunch item (usually AYCE soup and occasionally baked goods) so you may be able to stretch your supplies if you arent trying to to a work for stay at the huts where you get breakfast and dinner (but if you have searched the threads on AMC huts, you will know there are pros and cons to this).
The Old Fhart
05-20-2009, 08:07
Peakbagger- "Once you leave Glenciff,...."Note the OP is going SOBO, not NOBO.
Just a Hiker
05-20-2009, 08:52
Hey there! You'll be surprised on how little food you'll need to carry in the White Mountains. Not sure when you're leaving, but as a SOBO, work for stay in the Huts is usually pretty easy; therefore, you'll have all the leftovers you can eat. Also, you can stop at the Huts for a break during the day, and they usually have great homemade soup and bread products for a very good price. When going SOBO through the Whites, I usually only go into town once (North Woodstock) at Franconia Notch to get anything that I might need to get me to Glencliff, and I usually don't have to get that much. Take care,
Just Jim
Just a Hiker is right about the benefits of the Huts. BUT... Be prepared for a cool reception (or even downright hostility) towards thru-hikers, depending on the culture of the Hut crew.
The AMC, or "Appalachian Money Club" as it's known, exists for the purpose of maintaining its Huts and associated trails that guests use to reach the huts; paying about $90 a day for dinner, breakfast, and a bunk. The AT and its thru-hikers are like the black flies, an annoyance that comes with the territory and must be tolerated.
The Huts are not set-up for thru-hikers who want to spend the night. If you get there too early, you'll be told to move-on. Otherwise you'll sit off to the side somewhere, out of the way, until its time to do your work-for-stay. The leftovers may be cold and served as late as 8:00. At 10:00 you can sleep on the floor or on one of the tables, unless the guests want to stay-up late and play games and talk. In the morning you'll be expected to get-up early and move out, unless you are doing work for breakfast. Having said all that, the Huts are a great place to get in out of the weather when it's cold and rainy outside (and when isn't it in the Whites).
--Jack Frost
The Old Fhart
05-20-2009, 11:01
jafrost-"The AMC, or "Appalachian Money Club" as it's known, exists for the purpose of maintaining its Huts and associated trails that guests use to reach the huts; paying about $90 a day for dinner, breakfast, and a bunk. The AT and its thru-hikers are like the black flies, an annoyance that comes with the territory and must be tolerated."
Very distorted and uninformed view of the AMC although a lot of thru-hikers that believe they are 'entitled' are definitely an annoyance, not just to the AMC, but to all service providers. If you took the minimal amount of time and effort to check you'd find the huts are a small part of the entire AMC. The uninformed generally complain about the condition of the trails thru the Presidential without taking the time to notice that the AMC doesn't maintain most of those trails but the USFS does. Unsupported rumors sound good and may fit into your view of the Whites but it has little to do with reality or facts. The following excerpts are from the AMC site and are much closer to the truth.
What Is the Appalachian Mountain Club?
Since 1876, the Appalachian Mountain Club has been promoting the protection, enjoyment, and wise use of the mountains, rivers, and trails of the Northeast outdoors.
People
We are nearly 90,000 members in 12 chapters, 20,000 volunteers, and over 450 full time and seasonal staff. Our chapters reach from Maine to Washington D.C.
Outdoor Fun
We offer over 8,000 trips each year, from local chapter activities to major excursions worldwide, for every ability level and outdoor interest – from hiking and climbing to paddling to snowshoeing and skiing.
Great Places to Stay
We serve over 140,000 guests each year at our AMC Lodges, Huts, Full-Service Camps, Cabins, Shelters and Campgrounds – each AMC Destination is a model for environmental education and stewardship.
Opportunities for Learning
We teach people the skills to be safe outdoors and care for the natural world around us, through programs for children, teens and adults, as well as outdoor leadership training.
Caring for Trails
We maintain over 1,700 miles of trails throughout the Northeast, including nearly 350 miles of the Appalachian Trail in five states.
Protecting Wild Places
We advocate for land and riverway conservation, monitor air quality, and work to protect alpine and forest ecosystems through the Northern Forest and Highlands regions.
Engaging the Public
We seek to educate and inform our own members and an additional 1.5 million people annually through AMC Books, our website, our White Mountain visitor centers, and AMC Destinations.
Blissful
05-20-2009, 18:08
We got a box at Glencliff PO, got a shuttle at Pinkham Notch to Lincoln and stayed at Chets, got a mail drop at Crawford Notch Campground, got a mail drop at Pinkham Notch AMC, then north and out to Gorham. You can also get lunch cheap at the huts.
Blissful
05-20-2009, 18:16
Just a Hiker is right about the benefits of the Huts. BUT... Be prepared for a cool reception (or even downright hostility) towards thru-hikers, depending on the culture of the Hut crew.
The AMC, or "Appalachian Money Club" as it's known, exists for the purpose of maintaining its Huts and associated trails that guests use to reach the huts; paying about $90 a day for dinner, breakfast, and a bunk. The AT and its thru-hikers are like the black flies, an annoyance that comes with the territory and must be tolerated.
The Huts are not set-up for thru-hikers who want to spend the night. If you get there too early, you'll be told to move-on. Otherwise you'll sit off to the side somewhere, out of the way, until its time to do your work-for-stay. The leftovers may be cold and served as late as 8:00. At 10:00 you can sleep on the floor or on one of the tables, unless the guests want to stay-up late and play games and talk. In the morning you'll be expected to get-up early and move out, unless you are doing work for breakfast. Having said all that, the Huts are a great place to get in out of the weather when it's cold and rainy outside (and when isn't it in the Whites).
--Jack Frost
As for the huts, we had a great time at them. Several hut croos even cooked us extra food. Only one hut treated us rather raw, but that was the hutmaster only. Some went out of their way to accommodate hikers coming in late too. One hut said they take three hikers, that one night they took eight of us and found jobs for all. And cooked mac and cheese to feed us when there wasn't enough food.
Anyway, what does one expect for free? This just goes to show how thru hikers think they deserve special treatment b/c they are doing the trail. We need to be thankful that AMC and the croos allow us to do work for stay and there are safe places to stay in the Whites which can be deadly. They don't have to at all, you know.
When you get to Glen Cliff, plan to have a resupply box waiting for you at the Post office. Supply for 4-5 days. That should get you out to Route 302. Here you could hitch towards North Conway (lodging and food a plenty) or walk up to the Highland Center and stay at the Shapleigh Bunk House. I think you could send a resupply here but I am not sure.
As for the huts, they are actually a great experience. However, don' think you can show up at a hut at noon or earlier and expect a work for stay or anything free. You can refill on water to your hearts content at any hut. There are usually treats out, but they expect 1 to 2 bucks donation.
Now Lakes and Madison will not turn you away. Just arrive in afternoon. You will be almost guarenteed a work for stay. that means you do a few light chores, you can lay your bag out at night on a table for free and you get to eat hut food with the croo (the hut food is awesome)!. You might be delayed till near 9 the next day if your chores involve clean up after guests have left.
Even if the huts where cheep (which they aren't) it wouldn't matter because they are full months in advance and you won't know when you get there till a few days prior.
You can also send a re-supply at Pinkham Notch Camp. I'd also recommend staying here and partaking in the all you can eat meals (and I do mean all you can eat).
Then you will pig out and resupply in Gorham where there are hostels. Expect to leave Gorham with a weeks worth of food to get you through the Mahoosics (well 5 days worth anyway).
Hope that helps,
David
PS I wouldn't be so down on the huts folks. The shock that thru hikers experience here is probably that they are now just one more hiker rather than the almighty thru hiker they have been previously. Heck, you might even score some trail magic from the day or weekender hikers!
Very distorted and uninformed view of the AMC although a lot of thru-hikers that believe they are 'entitled' are definitely an annoyance, not just to the AMC, but to all service providers. If you took the minimal amount of time and effort to check you'd find the huts are a small part of the entire AMC. The uninformed generally complain about the condition of the trails thru the Presidential without taking the time to notice that the AMC doesn't maintain most of those trails but the USFS does. Unsupported rumors sound good and may fit into your view of the Whites but it has little to do with reality or facts. The following excerpts are from the AMC site and are much closer to the truth.
Oh, I forgot to mention: The membership of the AMC will staunchly defend their club and are intolerant to any criticism, no matter how benign or well-intended.
I'll admit that by the time I reached the Whites, my tolerance to B.S. was pretty low, and that Old Fart makes some good points. But that doesn't excuse the outright hostility and mocking behavior that I witnessed directed at thru-hikers by some, repeat some of the crew at Lake of the Clouds Hut. And when I and another more "mature" thru-hiker reported this to the crew leader in the hopes that we might improve relations, our efforts were turned-back on us and it became all the thru-hiker's fault. Kind of like the quote above.
--Jack Frost
HikerRanky
05-20-2009, 21:49
Oh, I forgot to mention: The membership of the AMC will staunchly defend their club and are intolerant to any criticism, no matter how benign or well-intended.
I'll admit that by the time I reached the Whites, my tolerance to B.S. was pretty low, and that Old Fart makes some good points. But that doesn't excuse the outright hostility and mocking behavior that I witnessed directed at thru-hikers by some, repeat some of the crew at Lake of the Clouds Hut. And when I and another more "mature" thru-hiker reported this to the crew leader in the hopes that we might improve relations, our efforts were turned-back on us and it became all the thru-hiker's fault. Kind of like the quote above.
--Jack Frost
Several years ago, I had the opportunity to hike in the Whites. I stayed at a couple of the huts operated by the AMC and I must say that I was treated very well by the crews.
Had I not been treated well, I wouldn't have lodged a complaint with the crew leader, but rather with the AMC club management themselves.
And like Blissful said, we all need to be thankful of ANYONE that volunteers their time in support of the Trail. Without people like that, it wouldn't exist.
Randy
Oh, I forgot to mention: The membership of the AMC will staunchly defend their club and are intolerant to any criticism, no matter how benign or well-intended.
I'll admit that by the time I reached the Whites, my tolerance to B.S. was pretty low, and that Old Fart makes some good points. But that doesn't excuse the outright hostility and mocking behavior that I witnessed directed at thru-hikers by some, repeat some of the crew at Lake of the Clouds Hut. And when I and another more "mature" thru-hiker reported this to the crew leader in the hopes that we might improve relations, our efforts were turned-back on us and it became all the thru-hiker's fault. Kind of like the quote above.
--Jack Frost
I'm gonna chime in for a minute (and will probably regret it) about this. I've been out on the trail a few times, doing thru's, and last year was out on a big section; I've also grown up in NH and did alot of hiking among the Whites. I will say that last year a few of the hut crews seemed to have a different behavior and attitude towards thru's than i've experienced in previous years. It wasn't only my own experience of it last year, it was hearing numerous accounts of others too. With that said, I also agree that many many thru-hikers seem to carry around an 'entitled' or 'elitist' attitude since they are hiking the whole trail at once; that attitude is totally not needed nor called for in my opinion.
The Old Fhart
05-20-2009, 22:24
jafrost-"Oh, I forgot to mention: The membership of the AMC will staunchly defend their club and are intolerant to any criticism, no matter how benign or well-intended."Once again, that is far from the truth. Several years ago when the AMC out of Joy Street wanted, and expected, a quick renewal on the hut system which is mostly on WMNF land, I was one of the people that spoke against the long-term lease at the public meetings the USFS held. The local chapters are often at odds with the 'upper management'.
My previous post is correct. When you said: ""The AMC, or "Appalachian Money Club" as it's known, exists for the purpose of maintaining its Huts and associated trails that guests use to reach the huts", that was totally false and the quoted material I posted from the web site clearly shows that. I've stayed at all of the huts, including work for stay; worked for the USFS in the WMNF; worked and basically 'lived' on the summit of Mount Washington; and hiked in the region for over 45 years so I have a good knowledge of the region. Most thru hikers go through the area in a few days and think they know the area, but they don't.
If you want to complain about the AMC, there are things you could legitimately complain about, just get it right and use facts.
Pokey2006
05-21-2009, 00:18
And like Blissful said, we all need to be thankful of ANYONE that volunteers their time in support of the Trail. Without people like that, it wouldn't exist.
Randy
I don't think they are volunteers. It's my understanding that croo positions are PAID jobs. Someone correct me if I'm wrong...
Oh, and I also understand that these positions are quite competitive and hard to come by. So, not like it's a mundane job that no one wants. Not like being a trail maintainer.
HikerRanky
05-21-2009, 00:36
I don't think they are volunteers. It's my understanding that croo positions are PAID jobs. Someone correct me if I'm wrong...
Oh, and I also understand that these positions are quite competitive and hard to come by. So, not like it's a mundane job that no one wants. Not like being a trail maintainer.
I don't know whether they are or not..... If they are, then so be it,
If they aren't then so be it.
I was just, and still am, thankful that they are out there... They are still providing a valuable service to the people that hike in the Whites.
No back to the regularly scheduled thread topic of resupplying in the Whites....
Randy
While I enjoyed staying in the huts (as a paying guest) a number of times, the hut system can be a PITA to thru-hikers. It's a mixed bag: On the one hand you've got comfy places to stay when the weather turns foul (which happens a lot), and great food, and some companionship. On the other hand, they're expensive and often crowded and hard to get spaces in.
Getting a place on the Croo is about like getting into an Ivy-League school, and there's a lot of overlap between the two groups--the Croo introduce themselves every evening, and they are pretty much a silver-spoon group. That said, like any other group, the individuals range from caring and compassionate to jaded and arrogant. Like thru-hikers, they have their own little Croo community, which they care way more about than they do about outsiders. My experience was that they were much friendlier and easier to deal with in the early season (June) than they were later on (August)--by the end of the season they're pretty burned out on dealing with their customers, Boy Scouts, families, and thru-hikers alike.
The Old Fhart
05-21-2009, 07:44
On resupply heading SOBO, if you are thru hiking from Maine, Gorham, NH (about 3.5 from the trail) is a must stop. From Gorham south to the next convenient supply almost on the trail in Glencliff is about 100 miles and that could take 5-7 days depending on weather, etc.. If you plan carefully, plus are lucky, and hit the huts between breakfast and noon, you can generally buy some leftovers. In 1998 when I got to Lonesome Lake they had sausages, pancakes (no syrup), some homemade bread, and a ton of brownies for $1, all you could eat. YMMV.
You can also get a meal at the restaurant on the summit of Mount Washington (not real cheap but convenient) and the same at the Flume Visitor Center in Franconia Notch (0.7mi off trail). If you can do a work for stay at a hut that would help food wise but doing the work required for the stay could cost you a few hours time in the morning so that may be a consideration if you're in a hurry.
Doing the 100 mile stretch of trail this way you could possibly avoid having to go any great distant off the trail to towns between Gorham and Glencliff. It would require carrying about 5-7 pounds of food out of Gorham and some planning.
Oh, and as an aside, the hut croo are paid employees of the AMC and as near as I can tell get about $8 per hour for a 45 hour week. I believe they have some taken out of that for their food as well. Almost all of the food for the huts is carried in by the croo on packboards so this isn't an easy job. Although I think the limit they are allowed to carry is 75 pounds, in the past some would carry far heavier loads.
At Pinkham's, its usually an easy hitch to Gorham and many hikers elect to come off the trail, hitch to Gorham and take a break, then arrange a slackpack of the Wildcat Range.
Slackpacking the Wildcat Range (from Pinkham to Rt 2) is a very tough day even for thru hikers. Had several friends who tried this and ended up needing a zero in Gorham the day after!!!
peakbagger
05-21-2009, 08:05
I agree its a long day, and is probably not something a typical hiker would or should do, but over the years I have given several thru hikers rides at the begining or the end of the day who did the trip. One time, I gave a thruhiker out for the slackpack a ride out to rattle river around 7 in the morning and totally by chance picked him up as he walked out of the woods around 7 PM at Pinkham. When he got in the car, he thought I was stalking him!
Talking about a long day, the hut croos speak of hiking to all seven huts in a single 24 hour period. I believe the route from Lonesome Lake to Carter is not entirely on the same path as the AT, but still a monster hike...quite impressive.
The Old Fhart
05-21-2009, 08:58
Jeff-"Talking about a long day, the hut croos speak of hiking to all seven huts in a single 24 hour period...."That is a well established tradition. Here is a little history from the RMC (Randolph Mountain Club) site:
"By the 1930s, when the AMC hut system was well established, a contest for speed was added to the challenge -- traversing all eight AMC huts in under 24 hours. The first record, 23 1/4 hours for 52 miles, was set in August 1932 by Ralph Batchelder and Ev Loomis; an average of 2.24 miles per hour total elapsed time, with actual walking time 18 hours."
I believe the current record for the approximate 52 mile trek is under 13 hours! :eek:
garlic08
05-21-2009, 10:02
Almost all of the food for the huts is carried in by the croo on packboards so this isn't an easy job. Although I think the limit they are allowed to carry is 75 pounds, in the past some would carry far heavier loads.
A croo member told me that "most" of the food is flown in by chopper before the huts open--all the non-perishables, at least. The croo will pack in the fresh stuff--eggs, meat, dairy, etc.
This discussion is a good one. I'm glad I'd heard about the varying attitudes of both croo and hikers before I hiked the Whites. I think the lesson is you never know what kind of reception you'll get at a hut. It's best to not expect anything good, and be pleased if you have a good experience. My experiences were all good. I loved the $1 bottomless soup bowls and $1 baked goods, and made great use of them when they were available.
The Old Fhart
05-21-2009, 11:28
garlic08 -“A croo member told me that "most" of the food is flown in by chopper before the huts open--all the non-perishables, at least. The croo will pack in the fresh stuff--eggs, meat, dairy, etc.”
A lot of what is flown in before the start of the season (about late May/early June) are non-food items like the propane tanks for the stove or lighting. If you remember eating at the huts, most of the food is fresh. I would say “some” rather than “most” of the food is flown in. During the season the croo typically makes 2 trips per week to take out the garbage and bring in fresh food supplies. Lakes Of The Clouds hut, for instance, is generally booked the entire summer and it can accommodate about 96 people. Although that is only 1.5 miles from the summit of Mount Washington, the heavy food supplies have to be packed from the summit down about 1200 feet elevation which is pretty hard on the packer’s knees. Selling the leftover food to thru hikers saves the croo the trouble of packing it out as garbage. :D
Attached is a photo I took about 5 years ago when I had hiked to Lakes and happened to catch the helicopter bringing in some supplies plus the work croo who were opening the hut up for the summer season. That's the summit of Washington that you see in the background but they fly in from the base station for the Cog Railroad on the west side of the mountain. They generally fly pretty high to avoid the unpredictable downdrafts around the ravines. The chopper may not actually land in the area around the hut so it doesn't destroy any of the plant life.
6318(click for full size)
garlic08
05-21-2009, 11:46
I would say “some” rather than “most” of the food is flown in.
Yeah, that makes more sense considering what I ate at the huts. Lots of fresh food, with comparatively few non-perishables. Thanks for clarifying what I thought I'd heard.
At Carter Notch, I was invited to join in a gouda cheese feeding frenzy. They'd packed in a 10# hunk and the paying guests couldn't possibly eat it before it spoiled. Wonderful! I offered to pay, and the croo said they'd just have to pack it out as garbage so they appreciated the help. Likewise, at Lake of the Crowds, I hiked in right after breakfast and the scrambled eggs were the victim of a croo prank--dyed green. The pampered guests left huge bowls untouched. Hot, buttery, salty--a thru hiker's dream. I felt like Cool Hand Luke walking out of there.