View Full Version : Wolves in Virginia?
As I was hiking last month north of Reed's Gap (just south of SNP) I saw what I thought at first was a coyote. It was about 30 feet away and just stood and stared at me. I then noticed it didn't have coyote ears but more like wolf ears. It had pale eyes and a reddish gray coat. It didn't seem to be afraid of me till I yelled at it and it loped away. Have there been any reports of wolves around there?
Nope, not that i know of......?
vamelungeon
07-05-2009, 18:29
If there's a wolf here, someone set it loose. There were wolves here at one time but not in 150 years or so, maybe longer. Could it have been feral Husky?
As I was hiking last month north of Reed's Gap (just south of SNP) I saw what I thought at first was a coyote. It was about 30 feet away and just stood and stared at me. I then noticed it didn't have coyote ears but more like wolf ears. It had pale eyes and a reddish gray coat. It didn't seem to be afraid of me till I yelled at it and it loped away. Have there been any reports of wolves around there?
My wife and I saw a wolf matching your description last year in the same area. We were a bit south of Reed's Gap on the Parkway and were stopped beside the road. We watched him cross in front of us, view time was about 30 seconds.
The campground host at Rocky Know has also seen a wolf south of Roanoke. Their policy is to say that they do not exist.
Blissful
07-05-2009, 18:48
I've seen a sighting in Shenandoah - many, many years ago. But a few months ago I did see a coyote by the Skyline Drive.
http://www.brunswick.k12.me.us/jas/wolfproject/images/pdf/wolfprint2.pdf
Grain of salt. One site I saw said coyote tracks were only 2 1/2" long. So I want to know where the track pics are.:sun
Another site I saw had a good profile. I have seen big, chunky coyotes, but not like that, and the muzzle shape! Having never seen one in the woods, I'd like to!
I assure you that you saw either a coyote or a hybrid wolf, the latter of which that has escaped its owner. I have a pack of coyotes living in a field and woods behind my residence and they are very large compared to a western coyote, which by the way I have been fooled into thinking was a wolf when first spotted in Yellowstone. I have seen the Yellowstone wolf pack also. The coyotes here are red to gray in colo, with a full coat and I would estimate weighing around 80 lbs. I also own a German shepherd that was a stray that is part wolf. Also we have a wolf habitat nearby and I am often there on weekends photographing them as a hobby. They can be mistaken for each other, even by one familar with both species.
We have a lot of coyotes around here and this didn't look like one of those. Could have been a cross, or feral husky I suppose. But considering there have been other reports it could have really been a wolf! :banana
Wise Old Owl
07-05-2009, 22:05
We discussed the Eastern Coyote, March of last year on WB, I generally when hiking make very little noise and travel alone. I walk right into them on the trail. My experience was on Hawk Mountain Northern lookout near Dan's Pulpit two years ago.
Further reading.
http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/view.asp?a=458&q=164013&pp=12&n=1
I first became aware by articles in the 1990's when Cape May NJ started loosing pets to the Eastern Coyotes.
Pretty close to what I saw except the ears were shorter and the head was wider between the eyes and base of the ears.
Nicksaari
07-06-2009, 00:14
in june, i packed out of rockfish gap SOBO up out of mill creek and paul wolf shelter to a nice overlook called glass hollow. right as the sun was going down and i was settling into camp & getting my fire going, what sounded like fifteen coyotes about two hundred yards down the ridge started their evening howls. it scared the bejesus out of my, as i had never heard them before, though i had read they're in the area. at that moment, instictivley, a few seconds into their concert, i growled and barked and used my stovepot top against a rock to startle them. they shut up as fast as they started, and i did not hear a peep the rest of the night.
def coyote you saw, keep close eye on ground in area for their scat. its hairy- the telltail sign.
World-Wide
07-06-2009, 00:33
As I was hiking last month north of Reed's Gap (just south of SNP) I saw what I thought at first was a coyote. It was about 30 feet away and just stood and stared at me. I then noticed it didn't have coyote ears but more like wolf ears. It had pale eyes and a reddish gray coat. It didn't seem to be afraid of me till I yelled at it and it loped away. Have there been any reports of wolves around there?
Could have been a Red Malamute that got away from its owner?? W-W
http://www.dotphoto.com/SAN1/0C/8C/88/i0C8C889E-69C5-4E6F-936B-4EB75710165E.jpg
A Red Wolf, perhaps? They have been reintroduced in North Carolina. It's possible they have migrated north.
Big Dawg
07-06-2009, 10:14
I saw a Wolf in Damascus one time,,,, lonely scruffy lookin fella. :D
World-Wide
07-06-2009, 10:18
I saw a Wolf in Damascus one time,,,, lonely scruffy lookin fella. :D
LMAO....new to the site, but starting to catch on to the humor amongst the veterans' on WB!! :D Not talking about LW are you?? :-? W-W
A Red Wolf, perhaps? They have been reintroduced in North Carolina. It's possible they have migrated north.
Nope. The only Red Wolves in the wild in NC are on an island off the coast. They are most certainly no wild Grey Wolves in VA. Unless they escaped captivity, that is.
leeki pole
07-06-2009, 12:18
Nope. The only Red Wolves in the wild in NC are on an island off the coast. They are most certainly no wild Grey Wolves in VA. Unless they escaped captivity, that is.
Mowgli, we've got them both in MS. I've seen them. Why are you so sure they could have not migrated to NC? Just curious.:-?
Why are you so sure they could have not migrated to NC? Just curious.:-?
Roads (habitat fragmentation), hybridization with coyotes, parvo virus, to name three reasons.
Both what? Both species of wolves? In MS? I'd love to see some documentation of that.
Furlough
07-06-2009, 12:35
Yes, we have them. However, they are more commonly known as and referred to as Real Estate Developers.
freefall
07-06-2009, 12:39
Per US Fish and Wildlife:
Gray Wolf: http://ecos.fws.gov/speciesProfile/profile/speciesProfile.action?spcode=A00D
And per NPCA:
Red Wolf: http://www.npca.org/wildlife_protection/wildlife_facts/redwolf.html
I couldn't find anything about gray wolves being in the southeast. Red wolves are on islands in MS and NC.
Yes, we have them. However, they are more commonly known as and referred to as Real Estate Developers.
Very good! :jump
Big Dawg
07-06-2009, 16:37
LMAO....new to the site, but starting to catch on to the humor amongst the veterans' on WB!! :D Not talking about LW are you?? :-? W-W
You catch on quick! ;)
It would not be unusual to see a hybrid wolf. That would be part dog and part wolf. There are folks in the hollows who indeed breed them this way. Could one have escaped capitivity?
Pedaling Fool
07-06-2009, 16:58
I assure you that you saw either a coyote or a hybrid wolf, the latter of which that has escaped its owner. I have a pack of coyotes living in a field and woods behind my residence and they are very large compared to a western coyote, which by the way I have been fooled into thinking was a wolf when first spotted in Yellowstone. I have seen the Yellowstone wolf pack also. The coyotes here are red to gray in colo, with a full coat and I would estimate weighing around 80 lbs. I also own a German shepherd that was a stray that is part wolf. Also we have a wolf habitat nearby and I am often there on weekends photographing them as a hobby. They can be mistaken for each other, even by one familar with both species.
I agree.
I know I could tell the difference between a bobcat and a mountain lion -- regardless of size. However, I'm not so confident I could tell the difference between a wolf and a coyote; some coyotes are easy to ID, but others do look very much like a wolf.
I agree.
I know I could tell the difference between a bobcat and a mountain lion -- regardless of size. However, I'm not so confident I could tell the difference between a wolf and a coyote; some coyotes are easy to ID, but others do look very much like a wolf.
Coyotes are 1/3 to 1/2 the size of Grey Wolves. There are essentially no Red Wolves in the wild in the Appalachian Range. Red Wolves are smaller than their Grey cousins. Some scientists believe the Red Wolf is a Grey Wolf - Coyote hybrid.
johnnybgood
07-06-2009, 17:15
Quite possible . This same scenario of a personal pet escaping into the wild has also been therorized concerning the eastern cougar. Why not also the wolf ?
Pedaling Fool
07-06-2009, 17:27
Coyotes are 1/3 to 1/2 the size of Grey Wolves. There are essentially no Red Wolves in the wild in the Appalachian Range. Red Wolves are smaller than their Grey cousins. Some scientists believe the Red Wolf is a Grey Wolf - Coyote hybrid.
Yes I know a Grey wolf is typically larger, but there are some pretty good size coyotes, the largest that I know of is near 80lbs, which is about average for the GW -- also the colorization can vary in both species, so that's not necessarily at tell-tale sign.
As I said in my original post, some coyotes are easy to ID, but I've seen pics of some that look damn near wolf like, but I'm no where near an expert.
As for Red wolves, I agree.
I'm no expert as I know many of you are, but they look pretty similar to me. IMO in the woods with nothing to reference size it's hard to tell height or the weight of animal.
I can except a wolf escaped from captivity or migrated from some other state.
Red Wolf
http://www.scienceclarified.com/images/uesc_02_img0107.jpg
Grey Wolf
http://www.warbirdphotographs.com/WSC/GreyWolf-1.jpg
Coyote
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n210/gwldn/Nature_2/PGC_017_1000x800.jpg
After doing a quick search I found this article on releasing wolves in VA and WV by U. S. Fish and Wildlife Service and the U. S. Forest Service. I haven't found a follow up article, but if the release happened it's entirely possible some of the wolves survived and are reproducing.
http://www.vlrc.org/articles/42.html
Quite a large range of sizes with coyotes. The last really big one I saw, I thought it was a German Shepherd. Seen some runty ones that were healthy.
Thanks for those photos. Enjoyed comparing the eye/muzzle differences.
After doing a quick search I found this article on releasing wolves in VA and WV by U. S. Fish and Wildlife Service and the U. S. Forest Service. I haven't found a follow up article, but if the release happened it's entirely possible some of the wolves survived and are reproducing.
http://www.vlrc.org/articles/42.html
Did you read the whole thing? This is not a USF&WS release. It's not an article either. It's a fiction piece put together by a land rights group to create a boogeyman.
Yes I know a Grey wolf is typically larger, but there are some pretty good size coyotes, the largest that I know of is near 80lbs, which is about average for the GW -- also the colorization can vary in both species, so that's not necessarily at tell-tale sign.
As I said in my original post, some coyotes are easy to ID, but I've seen pics of some that look damn near wolf like, but I'm no where near an expert.
As for Red wolves, I agree.
80 pound coyote? I'm from Missouri on that one. Show me.
Most coyotes I have seen in the east are around 40-50 pounds. Grey Wolves will run 120. Red Wolves aren't found in the wild except for a few places where they have been introduced by the USF&WS. I have a Red Wolf recovery site about 250 yards from where I am sitting as I type this. They live in an enclosure. I hear them howling most nights.
Pedaling Fool
07-07-2009, 09:29
80 pound coyote? I'm from Missouri on that one. Show me.
Most coyotes I have seen in the east are around 40-50 pounds. Grey Wolves will run 120. Red Wolves aren't found in the wild except for a few places where they have been introduced by the USF&WS. I have a Red Wolf recovery site about 250 yards from where I am sitting as I type this. They live in an enclosure. I hear them howling most nights.
I'm not talking to you about this anymore MOWGLI, you obviously know a lot more about this subject than me. Maybe there's not coyote out there that can fool you, but I know they can fool me and many others.
My memory was a little off on the record size coyote, but here's the link
http://home.sou.edu/~rible/wildlife/coyote.html (http://home.sou.edu/~rible/wildlife/coyote.html)
From the link:
"Northern coyote subspecies are larger than southern subspecies (Beckoff 1977). One of the largestcoyotes on record weighed 74¾ pounds and measured over five feet in total length (Young 1951). Coyotes can run up to 40 miles per hour, but normally only run between 25 and 30 miles per hour. They may also jump as high as 14 feet (Whitaker 1980). Coyotes generally don't live in close-knit packs, as do wolves, and are much more solitary. The coyote packs that have been observed usually consist of family members. (Beckoff 1977)."
I'm not talking to you about this anymore MOWGLI, you obviously know a lot more about this subject than me. Maybe there's not coyote out there that can fool you, but I know they can fool me and many others.
My memory was a little off on the record size coyote, but here's the link
http://home.sou.edu/~rible/wildlife/coyote.html (http://home.sou.edu/~rible/wildlife/coyote.html)
From the link:
"Northern coyote subspecies are larger than southern subspecies (Beckoff 1977). One of the largestcoyotes on record weighed 74¾ pounds and measured over five feet in total length (Young 1951). Coyotes can run up to 40 miles per hour, but normally only run between 25 and 30 miles per hour. They may also jump as high as 14 feet (Whitaker 1980). Coyotes generally don't live in close-knit packs, as do wolves, and are much more solitary. The coyote packs that have been observed usually consist of family members. (Beckoff 1977)."
I'm not trying to argue John. This is a subject that I am VERY interested in. That's all. I appreciate your input.
Pedaling Fool
07-07-2009, 10:04
I didn't mean to sound offended by your posts. Alls good.
A farmer shot a wild wolf in Mass last year. Only confirmed incident of a wild wolf on the east cost ive heard of.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2008/03/05/after_160_years_a_wild_gray_wolf_turns_up_in_mass/
A farmer shot a wild wolf in Mass last year. Only confirmed incident of a wild wolf on the east cost ive heard of.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2008/03/05/after_160_years_a_wild_gray_wolf_turns_up_in_mass/
That is cool as hell! Reminds me of the Coyote that walked across bridges to reach Central Park in NYC. Those were 2 determined animals!
Firechick907
04-05-2010, 15:07
I live in a very rural area of Central Virginia and I think I saw a gray wolf this morning going to work. It was solid gray and too big to be a fox and bigger than any coyote I have ever seen. It was graceful and majestic. I tried to grab my camera and spooked him. What a shame because I would've had proof!!!
The Bays Mt menagerie lost some wolves from their pen when a storm laid a tree across their double fencing late last year.
To my knowledge they've retreived all but one.
That's over 200 miles to SNP.
Not the same animal I guess, but there's one at large somewhere, feasibly along the AT corridor.
skinewmexico
04-05-2010, 20:56
I think I read the other day that something like 60% of the eastern coyotes tested were wolf-hybrids.
Graywolf
04-06-2010, 03:17
As I was hiking last month north of Reed's Gap (just south of SNP) I saw what I thought at first was a coyote. It was about 30 feet away and just stood and stared at me. I then noticed it didn't have coyote ears but more like wolf ears. It had pale eyes and a reddish gray coat. It didn't seem to be afraid of me till I yelled at it and it loped away. Have there been any reports of wolves around there?
There is a wolf sanctuary at the border of N.C. and Virginia, could be an escapee..But then, the Eastern Red Wolf is still know to be in existance even though it is very rare..Their range did at one time expand the entire east coast..Thanks to those silly guys that came over from England back in the 15th Century..
Graywolf
gunner76
04-07-2010, 20:26
Check this link http://www.fws.gov/nc-es/mammal/redwolf.html
The wolves are not confined
From the Alligator River National Wildlife Refuge web site
The red wolf was in trouble long before Alligator River National Wildlife Refuge existed. Native to the southeastern United States, the species had been eradicated from all but a small segment of its original range. By the early 1970's, the US Fish and Wildlife Service had captured the few remaining red wolves and declared the species extinct in the wild. Through captive breeding, red wolves were maintained while a suitable location was found to re-establish them back into the wild. For red wolves, Alligator River offered hope.
By 1986, a five-year experiment to rebuild a self-sustaining red wolf population in the wild began. During this experiment, red wolves proved that they could adapt to life in the wild ... that they could find food and avoid people ... the necesary combination for success. Today, red wolves roam free in eastern North Carolina.
rasudduth
04-07-2010, 20:33
There are foxes that run around the Charlottesville area, I see them occasionally when out for early morning runs, they could possibly wander up to the mountains. Just an idea.
Wasn't red and definitely not a fox.
Snowleopard
04-07-2010, 23:16
I think I read the other day that something like 60% of the eastern coyotes tested were wolf-hybrids.
I've read that coyotes in the northeast USA and southeast Canada are hybrids with wolves, by DNA testing. They're also larger than western coyotes.
Don't forget that there are wolves in Quebec. I'm not sure if any parts of the St. Lawrence River freezes over. I've read a trip report of someone crossing Lake Erie on the ice in winter, but that's a bit of a haul from where the wolves are common in Quebec. I've been at a park north of Lac St. Jean in Quebec where there are wolves, but they're rarely seen.
There's an interesting article about a possible pack of wolves south of the St. Lawrence near the Vermont border:
http://www.timberwolfinformation.org/info/archieve/newspapers/viewnews.cfm?ID=314
hacktorious
02-15-2016, 23:49
Per US Fish and Wildlife:
Gray Wolf: http://ecos.fws.gov/speciesProfile/profile/speciesProfile.action?spcode=A00D
And per NPCA:
Red Wolf: http://www.npca.org/wildlife_protection/wildlife_facts/redwolf.html
I couldn't find anything about gray wolves being in the southeast. Red wolves are on islands in MS and NC.
I realize this post is old, but I just had to say I know for a fact there are grey wolves in VA. I've seen and heard them myself while out backpacking. I was so shocked when I did that I did some research online and found this article:
http://www.vlrc.org/articles/42.html
TexasBob
02-16-2016, 10:07
I realize this post is old, but I just had to say I know for a fact there are grey wolves in VA. I've seen and heard them myself while out backpacking. I was so shocked when I did that I did some research online and found this article:
http://www.vlrc.org/articles/42.html
Go to the bottom and read the "Note":
[NOTE: Some of this “article” is fiction, but most of it is taken from real news sources, research and articles. Wolf reintroduction to the Allegheny Highlands is not as far-fetched as it might appear. The Wildlands Project is being implemented by stealth. The Nature Conservancy and other radical environmental organizations are fully committed to the subversive plan to destabilize rural America, transfer control of private property to state and federal government, and ultimately, to a tyrannical New World Order government under the United Nations. Don’t take our word for it. Research the facts.
I realize this post is old, but I just had to say I know for a fact there are grey wolves in VA. I've seen and heard them myself while out backpacking. I was so shocked when I did that I did some research online and found this article:
http://www.vlrc.org/articles/42.html
Among the rmany gems in the BS article... "The Nature Conservancy and other radical environmental organizations are fully committed to the subversive plan to destabilize rural America"
cneill13
02-16-2016, 13:36
You could have seen a Coywolf, a hybrid of a coyote and a wolf. There is a documentary on Netflix about it.
With dwindling wolf populations in Canada, they are breeding with coyotes. Not typical.
Coywolves have the brain of a coyote with the strength and body size of a wolf and not nearly as timid around humans as a coyotes are.
Carl
4eyedbuzzard
02-16-2016, 13:45
Go to the bottom and read the "Note":
[NOTE: Some of this “article” is fiction, but most of it is taken from real news sources, research and articles. Wolf reintroduction to the Allegheny Highlands is not as far-fetched as it might appear. The Wildlands Project is being implemented by stealth. The Nature Conservancy and other radical environmental organizations are fully committed to the subversive plan to destabilize rural America, transfer control of private property to state and federal government, and ultimately, to a tyrannical New World Order government under the United Nations. Don’t take our word for it. Research the facts.I knew those wolves were up to something. I never figured them joining up with the Illuminati though. I'll bet the Pandas are in on it too. They're on the WWF logo. Sneaky devils.
Zebras are reactionaries,
Antelopes are missionaries,
Pigeons plot in secrecy,
And hamsters turn on frequently.
What a gas! You gotta come and see
At the zoo.
(Paul Simon)
TexasBob
02-16-2016, 15:47
I knew those wolves were up to something. I never figured them joining up with the Illuminati though. I'll bet the Pandas are in on it too. They're on the WWF logo. Sneaky devils.
They are being released into the wild by black helicopters that are putting out chemtrails too.
Sarcasm the elf
02-16-2016, 16:10
Zebras are reactionaries,
Antelopes are missionaries,
Pigeons plot in secrecy,
And hamsters turn on frequently.
What a gas! You gotta come and see
At the zoo.
(Paul Simon)
But is the A.T. really a light and tumble journey?
rocketsocks
02-16-2016, 18:12
Zebras are reactionaries,
Antelopes are missionaries,
Pigeons plot in secrecy,
And hamsters turn on frequently.
What a gas! You gotta come and see
At the zoo.
(Paul Simon)
But is the A.T. really a light and tumble journey?
Its all happenin' at the fair!
Traveler
02-16-2016, 18:22
I wonder if this is related to the reintroduction of seals in Fontana Lake...
swatsullivan
07-20-2018, 15:23
Just read a great article about coywolves. I think that likely the OP saw a coywolf:
http://www.c-ville.com/coywolves-albemarle-county-new-species-calls-area-home/#.W1I2Q8InaHs
I think I read the other day that something like 60% of the eastern coyotes tested were wolf-hybrids.
Possibly a Coywolf, as discussed about 3 years ago on PBS. Very interesting development.