PDA

View Full Version : Front Pack



johnny quest
07-26-2004, 19:22
has anyone ever experimented with a small pack attached to your rig on the front of your body? kind of balancing the back pack?

Fiddleback
07-26-2004, 19:39
I think LuxeryLite is doing that...

FB

food
07-26-2004, 20:13
I used a small pack across my chest attached to my shoulder straps with carabiners for a couple of years. Eventually I found a fanny pack that was comfortable under the waist belt of the backpack and wear it in front.

The pack clipped in front added an extra step in taking off and putting on the backpack. I do not take off the front fanny pack when taking breaks because it has my water bottle.

I think Luxury Lite has made the putting on taking off a lot easier, but it is still nice to have a pack to wear around camp and for day hikes.

It was a comfortable system.

The Solemates
07-26-2004, 20:54
there is an 81 year old named EZ1 on the trail this year who carries a "front and back" pack that he has made. The back is the normal deal; in the front he carries two water bottles and some other stuff, totaling probably 10 pounds. seems to work, although i wouldnt want to do it that way.

johnny quest
07-27-2004, 10:01
that is the basic idea im thinking. in military survival they teach us a three layer system of carrying our gear...i will try to put it in hiking terms.
1. carry basic survival gear in pockets so that your never without it.
2. on webgear carry the stuff you need through out the day
3. in your pack carry the rest of your gear.

i dont like stuff in my pockets. hell, i dont like pockets. so im trying to hit on a fanny pack that i carry the bare essentials in up front. also i would keep the stuff i am always having to get to.

icemanat95
07-27-2004, 10:22
The one potential problem is the loss of cooling surface. You won't be able to shed waste heat as efficiently if more of your body surface is covered with additional pack bags.

johnny quest
07-27-2004, 10:42
more coverage of the body definitely will effect the cooling system. granted. i wonder if one of those mesh vests could be used to attach gear?

orangebug
07-27-2004, 11:12
I have a little pack that attaches to the front of me, via the lower shoulder straps. It clips into place, but will not work alone as a fanny pack. It has a round pouch for a water bottle, and a zippered pouch for gear, snacks and map.

And I can't recall the manufacturer or name for it at all. I think whoever makes the "Bomb Pack" made it. "Side Kick?"

It sucks. It barely holds enough to make it worthwhile. It is not waterproof at all. Sweat from my chest seaps inside. Maps and pags from guidebooks become mush by noon.

I find it better to use hiking pants with extra pockets down the front of the thighs.

Bill...

johnny quest
07-27-2004, 11:22
yucky. thanks for the visual. i would definitely want this front pack tohold enough and i like the idea of it being detachable and usable as a fanny pack. i didnt find anything on luxurylites site except that george jetson external pakc

Alligator
07-27-2004, 11:30
I used to carry a SLR 35 mm camera in a molded camera bag on my chest strap. It was more accessible this way and it helped to balance the pack. The down side was that it was attached to the chest strap and made taking off/putting on the pack more burdensome. I also managed to drop it frequently because it was awkward.

I currently use a small belt pouch which holds snacks, sun hat, digital camera, and sometimes gloves and warm hat. This let's me grab a quick snack w/o taking off the pack and to adjust my warmth level. Other frequently accessed stuff goes in the top lid: map, polar pure, tp, talc, headlamp, etc.

I'd be careful adopting military packing style to backpacking. What you are expected to carry differs greatly, and military packs are designed to accomodate heavier loads and more items.

HikeLite
07-27-2004, 11:47
I use a small pack that fits over my hip belt in front. In it I carry my poncho and food for the day so I never have to go searching in my pack for my snacks and lunch. The same for when it starts raining. I just whip out the poncho and never hardly miss a step. No stopping like some of my hiking friends.

johnny quest
07-27-2004, 12:24
you misunderstand me. i am talking about a philosophy the military teaches about packing your gear in relation to its importance to your existance. it has nothing to do with using military gear. obviously military gear is built for extreme use, not light weight.
the philosophy i speak of has you putting your survival gear ON YOUR BODY. whether its in pockets on on some fanny pack that never comes off. the idea is that illustrated this way: if you go down the trail from the shelter/basecamp position at dusk to get water and your pack/webgear is up at the campsite/pos...and something happens....what gear do you have on your body ALL THE TIME?

Kerosene
07-27-2004, 13:00
The question starting this thread was asking about a counterbalancing front-pack, but the responses have shifted to making items readily available. I have used the Dana Designs Wet Rib, attached to my non-Dana pack, to hold a small camera, snacks, map, condensed trail guide, and a 20-oz. squeeze top water bottle for my last several hikes. While I liked the convenience of this arrangement, I ended up augmenting one of my flexible Nalgene Canteens with a hydration tube, putting a few snacks in a thigh pocket, and reaching back into my open side pocket when I wanted the camera. Not quite as convenient, but I save about 6 ounces of pack weight and it's one less strap the buckle and arrange.

orangebug
07-27-2004, 13:07
...I have used the Dana Designs Wet Rib, attached to my non-Dana pack, to hold a small camera, snacks, map, condensed trail guide, and a 20-oz. squeeze top water bottle for my last several hikes. While I liked the convenience of this arrangement, I ended up augmenting one of my flexible Nalgene Canteens with a hydration tube, putting a few snacks in a thigh pocket, and reaching back into my open side pocket when I wanted the camera...

Yeh, the Dana Wet Rib. That's what I used. Very well named as ribs and all contents tend to be wet. I have made the same adjustments to it.

Bill...

Pencil Pusher
07-27-2004, 13:07
If one could somehow attach their gut to the pack, this may be a good counterbalance;) What survival gear would you keep with you at all times, Johnny?

Alligator
07-27-2004, 13:30
Maybe my gut is why I don't miss my camera case. I have heard mention of a rule of three. Three hours to die from cold, 3 days from water, 3 weeks from lack of food. (Rough guide). I carry at all times a whistle with crappy compass and mirror inside, waterproof matches, striker, 2 iodine tabs, dry condom, and an LED on the whistle string.

Sorry confused your "webgear" with "mesh vest". Sounded like a military item.

johnny quest
07-27-2004, 15:21
this is great. it gets me thinking. what im wanting now is some type of carrying case that will add no more steps than unhooking a sternum strap to get off my entire pack, that stays attached to my pack if i want it to, that doesnt scrape or wear on my body, and that can convert easily into a standalone fanny pack.

as to what i would carry in it. i am working on having nothing in my pockets, if i have pockets. (im an anti clothing guy if its hot) but some things i think we should all have always.
firemaker
whistle
pocket knife
bandanna

grrickar
07-27-2004, 16:58
Get a cell phone pouch that fits on the sternum strap. My Columbia daypack has one. You could easily put matches, whistle, Leatherman Micra, and a firestarter in that, and wrap it in the bandanna. You'd need a ziploc to make it waterproof though.

johnny quest
07-29-2004, 11:39
i got sidetracked with the whole "what should you carry on your body" thing. i think that is a great topic worthy of its own thread. but back to the idea of a front loading pack...ive been looking at some fanny packs that i can tear up and rebuild. im looking at making something that would end up looking somewhat like the golite team pouch

http://www.golitestore.com/store/NS_proddetail.asp?number=PA5113

it would attach by sliding over both the existing sternum strap and the waistbelt. that way it would be easily removable, yet wouldnt cause any extra time taking on or off the pack itself. ideally it would also be usable as its own fanny pack for quick multi hour adventures or trips to the water hole.
i think it needs to be able to hold a water bottle and a bit of gear. NOT just the basic survival stuff. am i making this more cloudy or what?

Alligator
07-29-2004, 12:12
Having a water bottle in that area may be a bit unwieldy. It would drag. A hydration system is much easier. I almost like the golite design, but have reservations. If the sternum strap is run through as in the golite design, you will have difficulty in where the strap buckle ends up, based on your chest size and pack design. What would happen to me with my camera bag is the buckle would be right near the middle. As soon as I opened it, the weight of the camera would drag down the bag and it would fall. If you could make sure that the release buckle was at the side, this would be prevented. My suggestion would be to make sure that you do not have to thread either the sternum strap or the waist belt back through the pouch every time the pack is removed. For instance, for the golite design, having two release buckles on the top and bottom horizontal attaching webs, both on the same side.

johnny quest
07-29-2004, 12:20
i gues this front pack would need to be connected to one or the other backpack strap by a hinge method. it would be more permanently attached to one side.

food
07-29-2004, 12:57
I think what you carry in the pack will determine your decision.

I carry my TP and hand sanitizer in the front pack. When I drop the back pack the front pack is still on and I just walk into the woods.

There is a bottle holster on the front pack. I carry my hot beverages around camp in the pack. Most mornings I leave camp while still drinking my cocoa. I use a hydration system, but you need one hard container to dip water if you treat rather than filter.

The hygiene stuff is in the front pack so when it come time to clean up I already have the stuff and can pick up the clothes bag and find some privacy.

My toothbrush is in the front pack so I can brush after meals.

Travelling the backpack stays in the car and the fanny back goes inside with me.

Just like the size of your pack is determined by what you are going to carry; whether a detachable top lid, a GoLite Team style pouch or a front fanny pack is best determined by what you put in it.

Footslogger
07-29-2004, 13:53
Experimented with one before my thru last year. Ended up being more trouble than it was worth, at least for me. Had to take it off separately each time I wanted to drop my pack. I found that a medium sized fanny pack worked better and that's what I carried on my thru. It had a front padded pocket that held my digital camera, which made it easy to get at in a hurry. The main compartment held my ID, money, snacks and a few items I wanted to keep handy.

Of course now I own the Fusion pack from ULA and it has zippered pouches on each side of the hip belt so my need for any additional front storage is history.

'Slogger
AT 2003

frankcornbread
07-29-2004, 14:15
I recently purcased a ULA P-2. Got the water bottle hosters as an option. Was somewhat skeptical but thought they were inexpensive enough I could ditch them if I didn't like their function. They hold typical bike bottles but would work w/ any large mouth bottle like gatorade, etc. Just a pair of bungees, 1 top and 1 bottom, with a spring clip to snug them. In practice they are really quite nice. With a full load and two 16oz bottles attached, the water weight disappears. I think there may be a counterbalancing effect as well. Great idea and easy enough to duplicate on any pack. The P-2 has the hip belt pockets too which are another very useful feature. All in all the distribution of some weight forward and off the pack itself is, IMO, a great idea.

Footslogger
07-29-2004, 16:19
[QUOTE=frankcornbread]I recently purcased a ULA P-2. Got the water bottle hosters as an option.

Saw someone with a home made bottle holster on his shoulder strap last year and rigged my own with lightweight bungee cord. Not sure if that front weight helps balance out the load but I sure like the convenience of having a 20 oz bottle right there where I can grab it.

'Slogger
AT 2003

Tim Rich
07-29-2004, 16:42
i gues this front pack would need to be connected to one or the other backpack strap by a hinge method. it would be more permanently attached to one side.


I've used a Dana Designs Web Rib Pack for the past ten years or so, and it works that way. A three point hitch setup, two permanent on the left and one quick release buckle on the right. I put snacks, map and camera in it usually, plus a 20 ounce nalgene in the bottle holder (the original squeeze bottle died several years ago).

For those of you with hydration systems, Dana makes the Rib Pack (no "wet") that comes without the bottle and holder.

Tim

johnny quest
07-29-2004, 17:59
pictures people, i need pictures!! i went to dana designs webpage and what a terrible site!!! after searching to find the wet rib i have no better idea what it does or looks like than i did. terrible! to make matters worse, the awful font they chose makes it look like it weights 8 lbs and 7 oz.

and what is a ula p-2? didnt the nazis almost defeat great britain with one of those?

Footslogger
07-29-2004, 18:28
and what is a ula p-2? didnt the nazis almost defeat great britain with one of those?[/QUOTE]
What a HOOT ...a P2 is a backpack made by a company called ULA

www.ula-equipment.com (http://www.ula-equipment.com/)

They offer as standard equipment, a set of zippered pouches on the hip belt just to each side of the buckle. A really nice system in my opinion.

As far as the wet-rib is concerned ...I own one but I'm not going to try and describe it to you.

'Slogger
AT 2003

johnny quest
07-29-2004, 18:37
so you have this cool thing with this cool name but your not going to tell me how it works? im serious, the pic on the dana website looks like a sonogram of my dads colon

Footslogger
07-29-2004, 18:53
so you have this cool thing with this cool name but your not going to tell me how it works? im serious, the pic on the dana website looks like a sonogram of my dads colon
You asked for it ...

The wet-rib (or dry rib for that matter) is a triangular pouch that attaches to the bottom of the shoulder strap, where the padding stops and there's just a nylon strap. It's got a zipper that runs along 2 sides so it can be just about totally opened for access. Mine attached on the left side and had a strap that crossed over and attached to the other shoulder strap. The "wet-rib" has a bottle holder and the "dry-rib" (for lack of a better name) is just the pouch without the bottle holder.

Make sense ??

If not unfortunately you're gonna have to deal with that colonic sonogram on the Dana website.

'Slogger
AT 2003

johnny quest
07-29-2004, 18:59
so it hangs sort of like a shoulder holster does for a pistol? it doesnt attach to the belt at all??? odd. and its comfortable i assume. gee, it would be great if SOMEONE who had one of these marvelous items would PHOTOGRAPH it and post it on here so that we could better understand. WHO COULD POSSIBLE DO SUCH A THING????

frankcornbread
07-29-2004, 21:51
JQ.
Go to :
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5108818503&ssPageName=STRK:MESO:IT
This a Dana pack I just sold w/ a Wet-Rib attached. Must admit it's not the most descriptive picture but there it is.
Imagine a pouch attached permanently on one shoulder strap bottom, the "strap" part with a connecting strap that has a quick release buckle over to the other strap bottom. It spans across your stomach w/ the water bottle in the middle and the pouch to the side. I never used it in warm weather so don't know if it would get hot. Don't know if it leaks. It might because the zip has no cover and isn't a waterproof type. I didn't mind it's being there, though. But I sure like the P-2 setup better.
P-2 is a pack. Doesn't fly but I wish it could.
FC

orangebug
07-29-2004, 21:52
so it hangs sort of like a shoulder holster does for a pistol? it doesnt attach to the belt at all??? odd. and its comfortable i assume. gee, it would be great if SOMEONE who had one of these marvelous items would PHOTOGRAPH it and post it on here so that we could better understand. WHO COULD POSSIBLE DO SUCH A THING????
I don't think I've got a photo of it. It have the wet rib. It attaches to the web shoulder strap, most comfortably with the lower half of it on my Dana Bombpack or Flight60.

The shortcoming of it, in my opinion, is that it is not waterproof, at all. Sweat will seep through where it touches you. Rain goes straight thru the zipper. It is almost big enough for a few candy bars, GORP, a few pages of Guidebook and a map. I use the bottle holder for a Ziplocked Camera, Cell Phone, or a folded up Marmot Precip jacket. I have found it useful only on the straps of a Platypus bladder carrier for day hikes.

YMMV :(

Bill...

johnny quest
07-29-2004, 22:19
im still lost on how this thing works but that isnt your faults. i need to see one myself in real life i guess. ive been looking into it some more and i dug out my ak-47 ammo pouch that i picked up in the gulf war. im liking its basic design, a chest pouch that hangs over the head and ties around the back like an apron. worn under the pack and totally autonimous

smokymtnsteve
07-29-2004, 23:34
I use a dana wet rib...they come left handed and right handed (also come indifferent size pouchs.. small ,medium, and large depending on how much storage you want up front) ...I have one of each ..I prefer the left handed one ...as far as your map/guide book and such getting wet...have it inside a ziplock bag...you'll want to have your map and other gear waterproof for when I rains (or snows) anyway. Also in wamer weather when you put cool spring water in your drinking bottle you can get some condensation...stuff a banadana into the water bottle pouch and you soak up most of the condensation wetness...also the bandana keeps you water bottle from "eating through" and wearing out the mesh bottom of the pouch.

Tim Rich
07-30-2004, 08:48
pictures people, i need pictures!! i went to dana designs webpage and what a terrible site!!! after searching to find the wet rib i have no better idea what it does or looks like than i did. terrible! to make matters worse, the awful font they chose makes it look like it weights 8 lbs and 7 oz.

and what is a ula p-2? didnt the nazis almost defeat great britain with one of those?

attroll took a picture of me with my pack on (and Dana wet rib) when I started my section hike this month. Maybe he can add it to the gallery here.