View Full Version : Wool Pants
JumpInTheLake
09-22-2009, 19:56
Last year I did a hike in the Smoky Mountains while the high temps were in the teens. I wore my North Face convertible pants and I was very cold. I am thinking about some wool pants for hiking.
Any advice on yes or no, brands etc. The Filsons look great.
mister krabs
09-22-2009, 20:17
yes, filson anything is top of the line, but that might be a good thrift store item too.
a base layer pant may be a more flexible option
njordan2
09-22-2009, 21:29
Google the phrase "Swedish wool pants" and you find the wool pants I wear deer hunting and hiking in the cold. I have had my pair for about 10 years and they are fantastic. They cost about $10 then, although now I see them going for upwards of $30 or $40. The pants are military surplus and generally have never been worn. The pair I have has the date on the inside of the waist band as 1939. Yes, 70 years old!
They have 4 pockets: two slash pockets in the front and two cargo pockets on the side. In standard European fashion there are no back pockets. The ankles have leather straps to sinch them down and clips to hold gators or something. I removed the clips. They have suspendor buttons on the waist and I recommend suspenders with them. That is my only complaint; the crotch of the pants is very long, like the waist is supposed to be on your belly, like the way old people wear pants. Other than that they are great, are very sturdy, warm and cheap. Also, I wear thin polypro or silk long johns with them, as I do any wool pants.
more important than the high temp, is the day time low (at night you are in the sleeping bag) so if you say 0 for a morning start, I would use heavy base layer, nylon shorts, insulated pants and rain pants/wind shell. For a cold morning start I would have all of it on, if it was 20F sunny, calm and hiking hard, I would be down to the base layer + shorts. For the weight the wool pants are easy to beat with other layers.
Blissful
09-22-2009, 22:38
I'd try silk underwear or the like underneath the convertible pants. Wool is too heavy and cumbersome, IMO, and if it gets wet - HEAVY
dreamsoftrails
09-22-2009, 23:52
i would wear a light wool baselayer or maybe a a mid or heavier if it were even colder, along with some shell pants, like sierra designs microlight or something.
I use wool pants (military surplus) when I ski tour. Wind resistant, very breathable and repels the mainly fluffy snow I see in Colorado. Love 'em.
Wool is terrific stuff, especially in below-freezing temps. I haven't gone for actual wool pants, but in winter I wear a wool base layer, with fleece pants over that. If that leaves me cold (below 15 degrees, with wind), then add rain pants.
In the pre-synthetic era, wool was the gold standard for hiking clothing. (How's that for a mixed metaphor?) Colin Fletcher, for example, was a devotee of wool clothing, though in the arid western US, he wore cotton courderoy shorts.
bigcranky
09-23-2009, 07:17
Basic nylon hiking pants are pretty cold when the temps drop below 20-F. I find I do better with various layers than with a heavier pair of pants. I have a pair of Powerstretch tights that I carry in winter, mostly as a camp/sleeping layer, but they are great for hiking in very cold temps. When the wind picks up, I can layer wind pants or even rain pants over them.
For high-teens hiking, though, I would be wearing my wool long johns and shorts (I'm always amazed at how versatile that combo is), then put on the wind pants or rain pants if the wind picks up.
Google the phrase "Swedish wool pants" and you find the wool pants I wear deer hunting a...The pair I have has the date on the inside of the waist band as 1939. Yes, 70 years old!
.
I have a Swedish wool surplus overcoat from 1939. It's just heavy, thick wool with pockets everywhere. Looks like a Wermacht coat of the same era, but with Swedish crowns instead of german markings.
Anyways, it's really really warm, and is great in snow/wet conditions. It's very bulky, though.
brooklynkayak
09-23-2009, 10:15
Yes, a couple of light layers will be more useful than a thick heavy pair of wool pants. I find light merino wool underwear under hiking pants to be comfortable well below freezing, especially on the move. If I stop for lunch in sub freezing weather, I throw on my rain pants as well or tuck part way into my sleeping bag.
Basic nylon hiking pants are pretty cold when the temps drop below 20-F. I find I do better with various layers than with a heavier pair of pants. I have a pair of Powerstretch tights that I carry in winter, mostly as a camp/sleeping layer, but they are great for hiking in very cold temps. When the wind picks up, I can layer wind pants or even rain pants over them.
For high-teens hiking, though, I would be wearing my wool long johns and shorts (I'm always amazed at how versatile that combo is), then put on the wind pants or rain pants if the wind picks up.
"I used to jog but the ice cubes kept falling out of my glass."
-- David Lee Roth
that's funny... i knew i liked him for a reason! :D
I should note the wool pants I use for ski touring are NOT the heavy Swiss army mountaineering pants. They are surplus wool uniform pants. Pretty light compared to the Swiss ones mentioned.
Why do I like them for ski touring? They breathe well, very wind resistant, repel the snow quite well and are warm when damp. I picked up on this idea from local mountaineering legend Gary Neptune. (http://www.neptunemountaineering.com/neptune/default.asp?s_id=0) This guy has the pick of some of the best gear in the country and he skis in wool pants and sweaters.
For hiking? Dorky shorts and long underwear combo rules. :D
http://www.pmags.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=19695&g2_serialNumber=2&g2_GALLERYSID=119b28e3dc3f09387b46a5aa240c9c76
On the BMT in the Smokeys. Perhaps mid 20sF ?
Snowleopard
09-24-2009, 10:14
The best pants for cross country skiing I've had were military surplus wool pants that were medium weight, smooth surface, fairly windproof and breathable. Snow didn't stick to them. I can't find them anymore. It's easy now to find thick green fuzzy wool pants that are very warm (often too warm); snow sticks to them more.
I should note the wool pants I use for ski touring are NOT the heavy Swiss army mountaineering pants. They are surplus wool uniform pants. Pretty light compared to the Swiss ones mentioned.
Why do I like them for ski touring? They breathe well, very wind resistant, repel the snow quite well and are warm when damp. I picked up on this idea from local mountaineering legend Gary Neptune. (http://www.neptunemountaineering.com/neptune/default.asp?s_id=0) This guy has the pick of some of the best gear in the country and he skis in wool pants and sweaters.
For hiking? Dorky shorts and long underwear combo rules. :D
http://www.pmags.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=19695&g2_serialNumber=2&g2_GALLERYSID=119b28e3dc3f09387b46a5aa240c9c76
On the BMT in the Smokeys. Perhaps mid 20sF ?
I'm not sure I would be smilin' if I looked like the Green Knight.
I'm not sure I would be smilin' if I looked like the Green Knight.
Hey..I was hiking. What's not to like.
i also say 'NI'! :D
The best pants for cross country skiing I've had were military surplus wool pants that were medium weight, smooth surface, fairly windproof and breathable. Snow didn't stick to them. I can't find them anymore. It's easy now to find thick green fuzzy wool pants that are very warm (often too warm); snow sticks to them more.
I use these pants. (http://www.rddusa.com/French-G-I-Military-Wool-Pants-Military-Pants-Trousers-Army-Pants-Combat-Pants-Bdu-Military-Clothing-Military-Shorts-Goretex-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-G-I-Military-Clothing.html) Sounds like the pants you described.
Those are especially useful in reverse.
Sometimes I amuse myself. I swear Fluff is the stuff.
garlic08
09-24-2009, 14:52
I stopped using wool when I skied for a few years in the Cascades. They do eventually wet out in the Cascade concrete snow and when they do, they're miserable. My apologies to all the wool devotees, but that's my experience.
I had similar conditions in the Smokies last year (add blowing snow), and I did fine with light nylon hiking trousers under a cheap breathable rain pant. It would have been better with a polypro layer, but I started hiking in April and didn't think I'd need that.
Google the phrase "Swedish wool pants" and you find the wool pants I wear deer hunting and hiking in the cold. I have had my pair for about 10 years and they are fantastic. They cost about $10 then, although now I see them going for upwards of $30 or $40. The pants are military surplus and generally have never been worn. The pair I have has the date on the inside of the waist band as 1939. Yes, 70 years old!
They have 4 pockets: two slash pockets in the front and two cargo pockets on the side. In standard European fashion there are no back pockets. The ankles have leather straps to sinch them down and clips to hold gators or something. I removed the clips. They have suspendor buttons on the waist and I recommend suspenders with them. That is my only complaint; the crotch of the pants is very long, like the waist is supposed to be on your belly, like the way old people wear pants. Other than that they are great, are very sturdy, warm and cheap. Also, I wear thin polypro or silk long johns with them, as I do any wool pants.
I had a pair of those that lasted me through a lot of years camping as a Boy Scout. Of course their weren't any pairs that fit me though until I was older, so just a lot of folding and trimming :D
Snowleopard
09-24-2009, 15:10
I use these pants. (http://www.rddusa.com/French-G-I-Military-Wool-Pants-Military-Pants-Trousers-Army-Pants-Combat-Pants-Bdu-Military-Clothing-Military-Shorts-Goretex-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-G-I-Military-Clothing.html) Sounds like the pants you described.
Thanks for the link, Mags. I just ordered a pair; we'll see how they are.
They also have white Swedish cotton wind parkas, a classic for cold winter weather http://www.rddusa.com/Swedish-Wind-Parka-Off-White-Military-Parka-S-Military-Clothing-Military-Gear-Warm-Winter-Wear-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-Army-Parka-G-I-Military-Clothing.html
Their shipping is kind of expensive ($17 for a $22 order).
Thanks for the link, Mags. I just ordered a pair; we'll see how they are.
They also have white Swedish cotton wind parkas, a classic for cold winter weather http://www.rddusa.com/Swedish-Wind-Parka-Off-White-Military-Parka-S-Military-Clothing-Military-Gear-Warm-Winter-Wear-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-Army-Parka-G-I-Military-Clothing.html
Their shipping is kind of expensive ($17 for a $22 order).
That's a problem with many surplus dealers I find. I also noticed that surplus dealers tend to swap in something similar than what is on their website.
e.g. A thin pair of pants may come back with a similar, but, thicker pair of pants. They probably buy in bulk and sell from one batch.
Good luck. I hope they work for you. I've been pleased with mine (for cold, dry conditions usually found in CO winters. PNW? Smokies? I wouldn't use 'em) and they sound identical to what you described.
ps. seems the parka is Ventile cotton? Still popular in Europe. Some swear by it for winter use. Never used it myself.
JumpInTheLake
09-24-2009, 16:09
After processing everyone's comments I think I will purchase a pair of Smart Wool medium weight base layer (top and bottom) to wear under my convertible North Face Paramount Pants. Any experience with these?
I would not want to sleep out overnight in my current base layer in under 20 degrees. It's a thin nylon that was supposed to be miracle wear, but I have not been impressed. I look great in it though!
Also I looked at some heavy wool pants today in an outdoor store. No way would I hike in those. They weighed a ton, and they were very bulky. I can't imagine them wet.
I'm preparing for monthly hikes that we have planned for the winter. Each trip will be for one or two nights, so we can optimize our gear for the weather.
When it gets REALLY cold: below say 20 degrees, you'll wish like heck you had wool pants. I wear them from November on into the Spring months, and was very glad I had them when stuck in a snow storm on Mt rogers with 15 degree temp and wind blowing 25-30 mph.
I'm preparing for monthly hikes that we have planned for the winter. Each trip will be for one or two nights, so we can optimize our gear for the weather.
Different tools for different jobs. And sometimes what works for another person does not work for another.
Good luck..and have fun!
JumpInTheLake
09-24-2009, 20:49
I use wool pants (military surplus) when I ski tour. Wind resistant, very breathable and repels the mainly fluffy snow I see in Colorado. Love 'em.
Would you classify those as medium or heavy weight. What I looked at today was made by Columbia Sportswear. They were incredibly heavy and bulky. I will keep my eyes open for a pair of wool pants with a reasonable weight. I like to be comfortable, especially in camp.
Would you classify those as medium or heavy weight. What I looked at today was made by Columbia Sportswear. They were incredibly heavy and bulky. I will keep my eyes open for a pair of wool pants with a reasonable weight. I like to be comfortable, especially in camp.
If you are looking for CAMP clothes (as opposed to active wear) you can't go wrong with army liner pants.
They are borderline "fugly", but are very warm and functional. Essentially light quilted pants (nylon shell/ with a synthetic fill) for your legs. They come up to your shin or so (meant to be worn with combat boots) and get on and off VERY easily. Many pairs of these have buttons on the sides for even easier on/off functionality. They do run large, so order a size smaller than what you normally wear. You can sometimes luck out and find a "long" pair that comes down to a normal person's ankle.
http://snipurl.com/s2oqg [www_rddusa_com]
If you have some sewing skills, you can really customize them (e.g. sew elastic bands on the bottom for a tighter seal). I wear these pants on many camping trips and sometimes on social backpacks. Warm, light, cheap, functional. (I tend to hike all day rather than hang out in camp when solo. On social trips? Not so much)
http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs029.snc1/4291_112268580020_563440020_3144088_5452045_n.jpg
As for wool pants....
Honestly, I never wear wool pants except for ski touring for the reasons I listed in Colorado's dry, cold, winter climate. They are light ones (more like thin uniform pants than say, hunting pants).
Most of my hiking is in shorts with the long underwear combo. As others mentioned, if I get cold while moving, I throw on rain pants/long underwear.
Last year I did a hike in the Smoky Mountains while the high temps were in the teens. I wore my North Face convertible pants and I was very cold. I am thinking about some wool pants for hiking.
Any advice on yes or no, brands etc. The Filsons look great.
Wool pants are heavy - MUCH heavier when wet - AND they dry more slowly than their comparable weight in fleece. They are more durable than fleece, but less so than nylon. I used them back in the '70s and '80s. I've recently made the switch back (sometimes, at least) to wool - but only in underwear. It doesn't stink as much as poly and is more comfortable when things get warm.
Nylon is still my choice for an outer layer. As someone above mentioned, experiment with undergarments. The pants should be fine for anything short of a whiteout.
Last year I did a hike in the Smoky Mountains while the high temps were in the teens. I wore my North Face convertible pants and I was very cold. I am thinking about some wool pants for hiking.
Any advice on yes or no, brands etc. The Filsons look great.I am a huge wool underwear and sweater fan but haven't found wool pants that I am happy with yet. I find most hunting type wool pants too heavy. I keep looking in thrift stores though for wool pants that might work.
My current mode is light wool sweater and breathable nylon hiking shorts, which is what I wear every day now even when not hiking. Then for extra layers polyester fleece pants and top and wind/rain shells.
JumpInTheLake
09-25-2009, 21:29
If you are looking for CAMP clothes (as opposed to active wear) you can't go wrong with army liner pants.
I am definitely looking for hiking wear. And wool base layers with synthetic outerwear are making a lot more sense to me now than wool outerwear. I want to be able to hit the trail in the winter, stay light and not be cold and miserable. Last year all of my layers were synthetic, and I wasn't very comfortable below 20 degrees. I'm rarely cold walking, but I hate standing around camp/shelter freezing.
I have plenty of heavy, bulky cotton options for winter car camping, and I take the kids a lot in the winter. Plus we always take a trailer full of wood.
Thanks MAGS, you've been a lot of help. You put effort into responding. I appreciate that.
shelterbuilder
09-26-2009, 21:42
Another vote for surplus wool pants - this coming from southeast Pa. We used to have a whole BUNCH of "true" surplus stores within 50 miles of here, and it wasn't too hard to find good pants. I don't know if they still make it, but one pair that I loved was a very-tight weave "dress wool" that was almost shiny when new, and would stop the wind almost as well as some of today's modern synthetic cloth.
Yes, when it gets wet, it's heavy - so the trick is to NOT let it get wet!
Snowleopard
09-27-2009, 10:28
...
I don't know if they still make it, but one pair that I loved was a very-tight weave "dress wool" that was almost shiny when new, and would stop the wind almost as well as some of today's modern synthetic cloth.
...
Yes, that's the kind I used to use. They're great in snow. I'll see if the pants from Mags link are the same thing.
I use these pants. (http://www.rddusa.com/French-G-I-Military-Wool-Pants-Military-Pants-Trousers-Army-Pants-Combat-Pants-Bdu-Military-Clothing-Military-Shorts-Goretex-Camouflage-Clothing-Military-Surplus-Army-Navy-Surplus-G-I-Military-Clothing.html) Sounds like the pants you described.
If you upgraded to these, you might care how much greenhouse gas a Pocket Rocket gives off. I am shocked you are so uncaring.
http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/179,1663K_Musto-Technical-Wool-Tweed-Pants-Lightweight-Finished-Breeks-For-Men.html
You have to admit, the savings are substantial.:p
Snowleopard
09-28-2009, 10:02
If you upgraded to these, you might care how much greenhouse gas a Pocket Rocket gives off. I am shocked you are so uncaring.
http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/179,1663K_Musto-Technical-Wool-Tweed-Pants-Lightweight-Finished-Breeks-For-Men.html
You have to admit, the savings are substantial.:p
That's $199 (reduced from $495):
"Musto clothing began with sailing items..." I'll just sell my yacht and buy a pair.
If you upgraded to these, you might care how much greenhouse gas a Pocket Rocket gives off. I am shocked you are so uncaring.
Perhaps if I was more of a gear hobbyist. :)
(People who backpack to buy gear as opposed to buying gear so they can backpack).
Well. You are no fun to razz today. I kinda figure, for two bills, they should arrive on someone. And not a buffalo.
Well. You are no fun to razz today. I kinda figure, for two bills, they should arrive on someone. And not a buffalo.
.....if you send them on a petite blond who is ,oh, about in her early 30s, I'd be most happy.
Tipi Walter
09-28-2009, 17:53
For hiking? Dorky shorts and long underwear combo rules. :D
http://www.pmags.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=19695&g2_serialNumber=2&g2_GALLERYSID=119b28e3dc3f09387b46a5aa240c9c76
On the BMT in the Smokeys. Perhaps mid 20sF ?
I agree totally here. Most hiking in the winter can be in either shorts or the shorts/long johns combo. Most people forget how hot it can get around their legs when winter backpacking. The old bulky military surplus wool pants are great if you're dirt poor and there's nothing else, and I used to wear them religiously thru the homeless winters when I dumpster dived. They're unbearingly hot and restrictive when postholing up a mountain, even in 10F. The only drawback to Mag's "dorky shorts" are the eventual briar holes in your expensive merinos. Every pair I have gets eaten by brambles and dog hobble, so they shouldn't be worn as pants but I'll keep doing it forever.
After processing everyone's comments I think I will purchase a pair of Smart Wool medium weight base layer (top and bottom) to wear under my convertible North Face Paramount Pants. Any experience with these?
I would not want to sleep out overnight in my current base layer in under 20 degrees. It's a thin nylon that was supposed to be miracle wear, but I have not been impressed. I look great in it though!
Also I looked at some heavy wool pants today in an outdoor store. No way would I hike in those. They weighed a ton, and they were very bulky. I can't imagine them wet.
I'm preparing for monthly hikes that we have planned for the winter. Each trip will be for one or two nights, so we can optimize our gear for the weather.
As above, we agree. You can't go wrong with merino long johns, there's Smartwool which are very nice and soft and then there's Icebreaker midweights which aren't as soft but durable. I left the Patagonia capilene and the old polypro years ago. But longjohns are like boots, they have to be replaced every two years or so after extensive use. At $75 a pop it's always tempting to go the wool pants route or with the surplus GI polypro.
When it gets REALLY cold: below say 20 degrees, you'll wish like heck you had wool pants. I wear them from November on into the Spring months, and was very glad I had them when stuck in a snow storm on Mt rogers with 15 degree temp and wind blowing 25-30 mph.
When you say REALLY cold I think below zero, and even here a good set of merino long johns covered by a pair of lined rainpants works wonders, but of course, not everyone has warm legs like I do. And if you're serious about spending more than a few weekends backpacking in the winter, there's always the Volant etc style pants sold by Western Mountaineering. Not cheap, but cheap over the long run. Nylon goretex rainpants(lined with something thin) over midweight merino long johns is my deep freeze solution. And when it's really cold, like -10F or worse, you're either be pumping nylon up a mountain or sequestered on your pad partially covered by the sleeping bag. Tain't a whole lot of time standing around camp doing nothing.
Whatever you do, don't ever wear those insulated one piece suits with the zipper from the crotch to the neck. Sure, you'll be toasty and look officially serious, but Thor help me you'll be a hog-tied sweaty mess after 20 minutes of postholing and then you'll tie the arms off around your waist and curse the warmth. And then there's the fun of squatting over a cathole in the things. But they're cheap, alot cheaper than down gear, just don't ever realistically consider getting a pair.
SunnyWalker
10-28-2009, 19:22
The absolute best (wool) pants I ever used for hiking and climbing were "Whipcord" pants. I am out of town and so am not at home, can't tell you the website. But if you search for "Whipcord pants" you'' come across them. I took them as they were recommended by the Mtn Climbing school I attended for 6 weeks in the North Cascades.
I have had such wool whipcord trousers. If I am hiking, I get too warm in wool trousers, even if using suspenders to open them up for ventilation.
My better cold weather outfit for walking is hunter's silent fleece "rainwear" bibs and jacket over wool-silk longjohns.
My best cross-country ski or snowshoe cold weather outfit is Roffe skiwear wool tights over silk.
I understand Pacific Trail has purchased Roffe skiwear.
I think high quality wool skiwear pants with a smooth finish could be very trail-worthy. I think Roffe wool skiwear pants were water-resistant.
The close-fit at the ankles is also something important for pants, for hiking, etc. in my opinion.
SunnyWalker
10-29-2009, 12:45
the Whipcord pants were pretty durable also.