View Full Version : New A.T. Guidebook
Awol2003
10-20-2009, 16:06
In 2010 I will publish a new full-trail guidebook called The A.T. Guide. The A.T. Guide will have trail data, profile maps and town maps presented in a handy new format. Details to come at www.theATguide.com (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/www.theATguide.com) . Appalachian Pages will no longer be published; website sales of the 2009 book will cease at the end of October.
AWOL, i'm looking forward to it. you should know that your Appalachian Pages has been on my bedside table for several months now and i pick it up almost nightly either loosely planning, or more often daydreaming of my thru-hike next year. i really like the incorporation of profile maps into the mileage listing and how thorough the details and maps are of trail towns. i'm looking forward to the new version, and what i expect will be the book i choose to take along on my thru-hike.
when in 2010 will the new edition be available?
trippclark
10-20-2009, 16:52
In 2010 I will publish a new full-trail guidebook called The A.T. Guide. The A.T. Guide will have trail data, profile maps and town maps presented in a handy new format. Details to come at www.theATguide.com (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/www.theATguide.com) . Appalachian Pages will no longer be published; website sales of the 2009 book will cease at the end of October.
I could not get the link above to work, but it does work when I type http://www.theatguide.com/ in my browser. Hmmm . . . maybe this link (http://www.theatguide.com/)will work.
NICE! I think I'll really like the changes. Been using Appalachian Pages since they came out, this looks like it will be even better. Placed my order already.
You're right, the perforations, while a great idea, didn't work too well. I ended up using a razor blade to score the pages I wanted to tear out, should work just as well without the perforations.
Congratulations and best of luck with what looks to be a giant step forward.
Awol2003
10-20-2009, 18:49
AWOL, i'm looking forward to it. you should know that your Appalachian Pages has been on my bedside table for several months now and i pick it up almost nightly either loosely planning, or more often daydreaming of my thru-hike next year. i really like the incorporation of profile maps into the mileage listing and how thorough the details and maps are of trail towns. i'm looking forward to the new version, and what i expect will be the book i choose to take along on my thru-hike.
when in 2010 will the new edition be available?
Thanks. The book should ship mid-January.
kayak karl
10-20-2009, 19:10
In 2010 I will publish a new full-trail guidebook called The A.T. Guide. The A.T. Guide will have trail data, profile maps and town maps presented in a handy new format. Details to come at www.theATguide.com (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/www.theATguide.com) . Appalachian Pages will no longer be published; website sales of the 2009 book will cease at the end of October.
why the change? makes me question why i should back a book:-?. good luck with it. you've been good to me (snickers and sardines, i didn't forget:D). i think ill just use my old book to finish though.
Take Care
KK
Awol2003
10-20-2009, 20:42
why the change? makes me question why i should back a book:-?. good luck with it. you've been good to me (snickers and sardines, i didn't forget:D). i think ill just use my old book to finish though.
Take Care
KK
Good question, Karl.
There's two changes, really. For one, there's the end of one book and the start of another. That is simply a personal decision, similar to the change-of-job decisions that we all struggle with.
Secondly, there's a change of format and content. Those who have both 2008 and 2009 App Pages know that there was a substantial change between the two. The upgrade from App Pages 2009 to the The A.T. Guide 2010 is no less substantial. That's also the best answer I can give to the "why back it" question; you can be assured that I'm going to work diligently on it.
Will the elevation profiles and distances be set to the same scale throughout the book? It seemed as though in the AP guide the scale would change from one page to the next often leading me to over/under-estimate certain climbs and descents. Maybe I am incorrect in this reading but it sure seemed that way.
Also, about when will the southbouth pre-order be available (if at all)?
-Donnie
Awol2003
10-21-2009, 07:03
The scale was consistent in App Pages and will be in The AT Guide. The new book will cover fewer miles per day, so that the profile will show even greater detail, and there will be horizontal gridlines to give a better read on elev changes. The SOBO book pre-oreders will start in a couple of weeks, and that book will ship in Feb.
kayak karl
10-21-2009, 08:36
Good question, Karl.
There's two changes, really. For one, there's the end of one book and the start of another. That is simply a personal decision, similar to the change-of-job decisions that we all struggle with.
Secondly, there's a change of format and content. Those who have both 2008 and 2009 App Pages know that there was a substantial change between the two. The upgrade from App Pages 2009 to the The A.T. Guide 2010 is no less substantial. That's also the best answer I can give to the "why back it" question; you can be assured that I'm going to work diligently on it.
TY for your answer. send me a copy. ill tell you what i think:). good luck on your new book.
KK
Best of luck with the new, revised adventure. It's got to be a labor of love, that you can hopefully at least break even on.
ShelterLeopard
10-21-2009, 10:38
I have to say, I'm sad you won't be publishing Appalachian Pages anymore- I love it. I had the 2007 edition (which is so marked up and dogeared...), and I bought the 2009 a month ago, and just like PJbarr said, it's always next to my bed (I also carry it in my purse), and I totally rely on it. But I'm glad to hear you're coming out with something new! Good luck.
ShelterLeopard
10-21-2009, 10:45
Though I don't know if I'll get the new guide- will it be really big with all the extra data? (And I'm too attached and used to Appalachian Pages)
RichardD
10-21-2009, 11:03
Will the guidebook be available in electronic form for those of us who carry bookreaders?
trippclark
10-21-2009, 11:25
Though I don't know if I'll get the new guide- will it be really big with all the extra data? (And I'm too attached and used to Appalachian Pages)
Just judging from the info on the new website, it looks like the size is about the same, just oriented in a landscape fashion rather than portrait. The site says 5.25" x 8" and 212 pages. My 2009 Appalachian Pages book is 8" x 5" and 181 pages. I guess the extra 31 pages (16 sheets) would make it marginally heavier, if the paper weight (thickness) is constant.
ShelterLeopard
10-21-2009, 11:28
Somehow I didn't think to look on the site for size- thanks tripp. (ShelterLeopard is moving very slowly today and is not thinking very clearly. Leopards get very tired if they don't get enough sleep.)
trippclark
10-21-2009, 11:48
Just judging from the info on the new website, it looks like the size is about the same, just oriented in a landscape fashion rather than portrait. The site says 5.25" x 8" and 212 pages. My 2009 Appalachian Pages book is 8" x 5" and 181 pages. I guess the extra 31 pages (16 sheets) would make it marginally heavier, if the paper weight (thickness) is constant.
Oops - need to correct myself. 2009 AP book is 192 pages, not 181, so it looks like the new guide will be 20 pages (10 sheets) larger.
I have seen somewhere -- either on this site or on the Appalachian Pages site -- a chart comparing the three guides. This would indicate how the size of this new guide compares to the other two as well, as far as dimensions and number of pages. Anybody know where that chart is?
Rain Man
10-21-2009, 14:13
Best of luck with the change-over, Awol. I'll be looking forward to getting a copy of the new-and-improved version. I use my current one constantly, both for planning and for hiking.
Rain:sunMan
.
Trail Bug
10-21-2009, 14:27
Great book with plenty of information. I carry it on all my hikes. I gave my 2008 copy to a friend and he is now marking off the pages as he completes a section. Keep up the good work. Looking forward to getting the new book.
SOBO 2011
10-21-2009, 16:08
So is this to be used as a "better" version to the Thru-hiker handbook? I am looking to take a thru-hike starting mid-april and looking for the best possible guide... is this is? And only planning on taking one such guide... or should I take several.....
Thanks for the info~
Jack Tarlin
10-21-2009, 16:19
There will be three Trail guidebooks for the 2010 hikers: There is the Thru-Hiker's Handbook; The Thru-Hiker's Companion; and now, this new one by AWOL. It's actually good that there is competition amongst the various guides; it encourages the authors and publishers of these books to stay sharp, to add things, and to always look for ways to improve their books.
I look forward to seeing AWOL's new book, but to answer your question, the three principal trail guides are very similar in terms of their format and content and what they provide for hikers, and at the end of the day, it probably doesn't matter too much which one you decide to use.
(For those not wanting to wait until January to check out the new guides, you can look at the present Thru-Hikers Companion for free, on-line, at www.aldha.org).
trippclark
11-16-2009, 17:55
I could not get the link above to work, but it does work when I type http://********************/ in my browser. Hmmm . . . maybe this link (http://********************/)will work.
Anyone know what is going on with the URL links? I tried adding a link in a new post, and it would not work, so I came back to this older post in which I posted the exact same link, to see if it was working. At the time, it worked, but now it is replaced by all asterisks. What's going on!? Is it a software glitch?
http://www.awolonthetrail.com/
trippclark
11-16-2009, 18:05
http://www.awolonthetrail.com/
Yep, that one works. The one that I cannot get to work is:
www dot theatguide dot com
when I type it as http://******************** it comes as all asterisks
wierd!?
http://tinyurl.com/atguide
neener!
trippclark
11-16-2009, 18:17
http://tinyurl.com/atguide
neener!
That works! THANKS!
It still does not explain the "glitch" that is causing it. Oh well. I'll use the tinyurl.
TJ aka Teej
11-16-2009, 19:36
I saw the ad for the new one in the AT magazine - So the Whitepages guide is kaput?
max patch
11-16-2009, 19:51
That works! THANKS!
It still does not explain the "glitch" that is causing it. Oh well. I'll use the tinyurl.
If you think about it you will understand the "reason for the "glitch".
Jack Tarlin
11-16-2009, 19:57
"Appalachian Pages", yeah, is kaput.
The new book, called the A.T. Guide, is by one of App. Pages' former authors
I think it's going to be great and I look forward to seeing the first edition.
So is this to be used as a "better" version to the Thru-hiker handbook? I am looking to take a thru-hike starting mid-april and looking for the best possible guide... is this is? And only planning on taking one such guide... or should I take several.....
Thanks for the info~
In a word, NO!
Any of the three will work. The trail environment has become pretty stable over the decades. Town businesses will always be changing. But the trail register books will let you know what is open, what is closed, what is worth investigating, what is worthwhile if anything......
Weary
I saw the ad for the new one in the AT magazine - So the Whitepages guide is kaput?
I kind of thought it was born Kaput, since it wasn't really an innovative guide. Just a couple of guys who thought Wingfoot's guide was kaput and saw a chance for quick profit.
Having been in related such businesses for decades I should have warned them of their folly. But I have enough trouble keeping people interested in supporting ATC, local maintaining clubs, and AT protection groups.
Weary
Jack Tarlin
11-16-2009, 20:52
Actually, in all fairness, there were some very innovative things and some fresh ideas in the first edition of "Appalachian Pages" and there were some very singificant improvements made in the second edition the following year, so to dismiss this venture as some kind of vulgar "quick profit" money-making scheme is not exactly fair.
I've seen some of the draft pages for the new A.T. Guide (the 2010 book), and I think there's some great stuff here. The trail town maps, in particular, are head and shoulders above the other ones presently available.
In short, I think it's great that the three main "guides" are competitive and stay that way.....it keeps them fresh, and it encourages the folks who write, edit, and publish these books to stay on top of things.
Competition is healthy, and in the end, it makes for better books.
The more information, and the better the information, then the better for the hikers.
trippclark
11-16-2009, 21:08
Actually, in all fairness, there were some very innovative things and some fresh ideas in the first edition of "Appalachian Pages" and there were some very singificant improvements made in the second edition the following year, so to dismiss this venture as some kind of vulgar "quick profit" money-making scheme is not exactly fair.
I've seen some of the draft pages for the new A.T. Guide (the 2010 book), and I think there's some great stuff here. The trail town maps, in particular, are head and shoulders above the other ones presently available.
In short, I think it's great that the three main "guides" are competitive and stay that way.....it keeps them fresh, and it encourages the folks who write, edit, and publish these books to stay on top of things.
Competition is healthy, and in the end, it makes for better books.
The more information, and the better the information, then the better for the hikers.
Well said Jack. Having THREE options available makes ALL of the options better.
Skidsteer
11-16-2009, 21:14
I kind of thought it was born Kaput, since it wasn't really an innovative guide.
Really.
Is there another guide with vertical elevation profiles paired with horizontal waypoints? Did I miss something?
I suppose you could argue content and accuracy but innovation? Please. :rolleyes:
Just a couple of guys who thought Wingfoot's guide was kaput and saw a chance for quick profit.
Weary
Good for them. Wish I'd thought of it first.
I used App Pages NOBO Loose pages this summer. It was very compact and easy to use.
Sad story though: I had the entire App Pages and the corresponding map for North Adams to Wallingford in a freezer bag and in my pocket when starting my section hike this past summer at North Adams. I was somewhere around Sherman Brook Campsite when the bag fell out of my pocket. I didn't notice till I got to the Pine Cobble Trail. I backtracked for 2 miles searching for the guide/maps with no luck. I had to hike "blind" between North Adams and Wallingford, where the next map set and an old copy of the data book/Companion was awaiting me.
It was rough. I had memorized most of the maps/guidebooks as I had been studying them the previous winter. I had to rely on other hiker's maps/guide books at the shelters as well as asking everyone I passed how far to the next... . I was so upset I contemplated just going back to North Adams. But I stuck with it, rain and all, and, 58 miles later, when I got to Manchester Center, I bought a one year old Companion and used it until I got to Wallingford.
Having three guides for the AT is no different than multiple gear manufacturers, lodging options in a trail town, or even different online hiking resources.
The tent is large and different services and products meet different needs.
As others said, friendly competition can help only make all services and products better. It certainly works with the small cottage gear manufacturers. (And their competition is friendly. The people who own the companies even go on hiking trips together! (http://community.sixmoondesigns.com/blogs/ronmoak/archive/2007/10/23/ultralight-brain-trust-hike.aspx))
Actually, in all fairness, there were some very innovative things and some fresh ideas in the first edition of "Appalachian Pages" and there were some very singificant improvements made in the second edition the following year, so to dismiss this venture as some kind of vulgar "quick profit" money-making scheme is not exactly fair.
I've seen some of the draft pages for the new A.T. Guide (the 2010 book), and I think there's some great stuff here. The trail town maps, in particular, are head and shoulders above the other ones presently available.
In short, I think it's great that the three main "guides" are competitive and stay that way.....it keeps them fresh, and it encourages the folks who write, edit, and publish these books to stay on top of things.
Competition is healthy, and in the end, it makes for better books.
The more information, and the better the information, then the better for the hikers.
But first Jack wrote:
I look forward to seeing AWOL's new book, but to answer your question, the three principal trail guides are very similar in terms of their format and content and what they provide for hikers, and at the end of the day, it probably doesn't matter too much which one you decide to use.
Whatever. But really, Is there money to be made. Let's face it. There are a thousand or so thruhikers every year, Maybe double that number of wanna bes. And multiple thousands of almost identical past editions, I own 5 or 6 myself.
I walked north in 1993 with a two-year-old edition of Wingfoot's Guide. I had called ATC a few days before I left to ask if this would surfice. No problem, I was told. The trail doesn't change much, year to year. The current dataguide and an old Wingfoot Guide got me to Katahdin without any problem.
When I got home, I bought a 93 edition to see what I might have missed. It turned out to be nothing. I suspect I could use that 16 year old verion on a thru hike today and find equally few problems if I also checked the trail registers for new recommendations.
Weary
TJ aka Teej
11-16-2009, 22:05
...to dismiss this venture as some kind of vulgar "quick profit" money-making scheme is not exactly fair.
Agreed! Anyone thinking 'hiking guidebook' = 'quick profit' hasn't been paying attention over the years.
Agreed! Anyone thinking 'hiking guidebook' = 'quick profit' hasn't been paying attention over the years.
TJ. That's my point exactly. But folks dream on.
Wrangler88
11-16-2009, 22:24
Actually, in all fairness, there were some very innovative things and some fresh ideas in the first edition of "Appalachian Pages" and there were some very singificant improvements made in the second edition the following year, so to dismiss this venture as some kind of vulgar "quick profit" money-making scheme is not exactly fair.
I've seen some of the draft pages for the new A.T. Guide (the 2010 book), and I think there's some great stuff here. The trail town maps, in particular, are head and shoulders above the other ones presently available.
In short, I think it's great that the three main "guides" are competitive and stay that way.....it keeps them fresh, and it encourages the folks who write, edit, and publish these books to stay on top of things.
Competition is healthy, and in the end, it makes for better books.
The more information, and the better the information, then the better for the hikers.
I agree. I used Appalachian Pages last year and it was very easy to use. I loved the format. It was very easy to pull a couple pages out of my pocket and check mileages. I also loved the elevation profiles on each page as well as the town maps. Its very useful for those of us that are very visual.
I also really like the new layout of the AT Guide. I'm excited to actually get a copy of it to actually look through. And plus AWOL is an great person and puts a ton of work into his guidebooks.
Agreed! Anyone thinking 'hiking guidebook' = 'quick profit' hasn't been paying attention over the years.
i'm glad to see someone finally suggest this. i don't think most people realize the amount of work that goes into producing a book. too often it seems that people see writing a book as a method of quick, take-advantage-of-you financial gain. there's a stigma associated with it, and even on here the promotion of books is sometimes met with distaste or skepticism. or a sense of shame for capitalizing on the should-be-free outdoors. gear makers do not receive the negativity that authors do, yet both parties are focused on helping you enjoy the outdoors more and both put their heart and sole into their work.
outdoor guidebooks don't make the New York Times bestseller lists. (bill bryson's book wasn't a guidebook). if you add up the hours that an author puts into a book with the little return they actually see, it would be a gain of only pennies per hour. you could cut grass, rake leaves, or recycle cans and be more profitable for your time investment.
Chaco Taco
11-16-2009, 22:33
I used App Pages 08 and was frustrated with it. The 09 guide was much improved. Still disappointed with the elevations> AWOL Im really pumped about this new addition because its the one thing i was looking for from this book. I like having less mile marking and more profile. Good luck on the book and I look forward to receiving my copy
white_russian
11-16-2009, 23:13
Several folks have mentioned innovation probably referring to format, but I would take more accurate trail data any day. Here is a innovative idea: go out with a surveyors wheel and fix the errors.
Awol2003
11-17-2009, 00:31
All of the errors reported for the 2009 App Pages are on the update page available from the book's website. There's a couple of incorrect zip codes and phone numbers, and a couple of places where places of business were in the wrong direction relative to the trail.
There are over 2000 on-trail landmarks in the book, of the type that could be verified by walking the trail with a measuring wheel. Of those landmarks, none were reported to be in error.
In 2010 I will publish a new full-trail guidebook called The A.T. Guide. The A.T. Guide will have trail data, profile maps and town maps presented in a handy new format. Details to come at ******************** (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/********************) . Appalachian Pages will no longer be published; website sales of the 2009 book will cease at the end of October.
why the change? makes me question why i should back a book:-?. good luck with it. you've been good to me (snickers and sardines, i didn't forget:D). i think ill just use my old book to finish though.
Take Care
KK
Good question, Karl.
There's two changes, really. For one, there's the end of one book and the start of another. That is simply a personal decision, similar to the change-of-job decisions that we all struggle with.
Secondly, there's a change of format and content. Those who have both 2008 and 2009 App Pages know that there was a substantial change between the two. The upgrade from App Pages 2009 to the The A.T. Guide 2010 is no less substantial. That's also the best answer I can give to the "why back it" question; you can be assured that I'm going to work diligently on it.
TY for your answer. send me a copy. ill tell you what i think:). good luck on your new book.
KK
I have to say, I'm sad you won't be publishing Appalachian Pages anymore- I love it. I had the 2007 edition (which is so marked up and dogeared...), and I bought the 2009 a month ago, and just like PJbarr said, it's always next to my bed (I also carry it in my purse), and I totally rely on it. But I'm glad to hear you're coming out with something new! Good luck.
So is this to be used as a "better" version to the Thru-hiker handbook? I am looking to take a thru-hike starting mid-april and looking for the best possible guide... is this is? And only planning on taking one such guide... or should I take several.....
Thanks for the info~Rumor in my neck of the woods is that Appalachian Pages will be published on schedule.......
Rumor in my neck of the woods is that Appalachian Pages will be published on schedule.......I don't think this rumor is true, I'm sure Awol can confirm or dispell it as necessary. I don't see how the Pages can be published if one author (Awol) is writing a different guide and the other author (ATTroll) is going to be on the trail.
I don't think this rumor is true, I'm sure Awol can confirm or dispell it as necessary. I don't see how the Pages can be published if one author (Awol) is writing a different guide and the other author (ATTroll) is going to be on the trail.Guess we'll see, perhaps Attroll has help?
max patch
11-28-2009, 19:35
Rumor in my neck of the woods is that Appalachian Pages will be published on schedule.......
Like I said a couple weeks ago, there is a reason that the website links to the new book don't work.
Based on all the complaints about the guidebooks (all of them) having inaccurate information, I really don't think that a quarter of the people who thru-hike today would have made it into NC back in the 70's. Good God, it's a guide!! Sounds like a fair number of people want someone to go with them and point out every turn or dip.
I think most of the information in the guides are fantastically accurate given the scope of what they cover. If you find an error, let the appropriate folks know, and I'm quite certain it will be corrected in the next edition.
This is one reason AT hikers should be encouraged to try other trails. They don't realize how good they have it.
TJ aka Teej
11-28-2009, 20:21
Like I said a couple weeks ago, there is a reason that the website links to the new book don't work.
This has always worked for me:
www dot atguide dot com
GeneralLee10
11-28-2009, 20:49
If you want to know about errors in the book. Go hike the first few miles of the AT and you will see what mean. More than one BMT crossing and creek crossings before Stover Creek Shelter. I have to say this is only the first few pages. I had to back track more than 3 miles due to this error. So I put the pages where the belong in my pack. I will give you props for your hard work but mite want to walk a little more of the trail and take alot more notes for your new book just my thoughts. I found the maps Elev. profile to be much more accurate and easy to read. I came across 4 SOBO's on my last hike and all 4 said do not carry the guide books that they were more incorrect than the maps. Plus a book is not going to get you off the trail in the correct dirrection like a map will. Keep up the hard work it may pay off.
If you want to know about errors in the book. Go hike the first few miles of the AT and you will see what mean. More than one BMT crossing and creek crossings before Stover Creek Shelter. I have to say this is only the first few pages. I had to back track more than 3 miles due to this error. So I put the pages where the belong in my pack. I will give you props for your hard work but mite want to walk a little more of the trail and take alot more notes for your new book just my thoughts. I found the maps Elev. profile to be much more accurate and easy to read. I came across 4 SOBO's on my last hike and all 4 said do not carry the guide books that they were more incorrect than the maps. Plus a book is not going to get you off the trail in the correct dirrection like a map will. Keep up the hard work it may pay off.
That's what a map is for. Guidebooks were never intended to replace a current map.
GeneralLee10
11-28-2009, 21:38
That's what a map is for. Guidebooks were never intended to replace a current map.
Sorry, But my point was that they are more of a waste to carry for mileage, water sources, and elevations. This last time I was out I found that most all the info for mileages were different from signs to the paper info, I had both pages and map. While the others had a download sheet from the net they were all different. If we wanted it to be exact then someone would pay a surveyor the money to map the whole trail. Which I would be willing to help with as I have the experience to do so. This is not in no way intended to trash his book but to make note of the errors.
This is one reason AT hikers should be encouraged to try other trails. They don't realize how good they have it.
Just think of a certain hiker whose initials are M S when he tried the Pinhoti trail. :O
As for maps, books, signs etc all having different mileages.. Fact of life. Sorry. I did a trip prior to this past Thanksgiving. The websites, maps, trailguides and signs ALL HAD DIFFERENT MILEAGE.
I didn't kvetch about it though. I was too busy enjoying myself. ;)
As Lyle said, go hike a Western trail if you think it is bad back East. Hell, no one even knows what the official length of the CDT is as all the sources disagree...
Just think of a certain hiker whose initials are M S when he tried the Pinhoti trail. :O
As for maps, books, signs etc all having different mileages.. Fact of life. Sorry. I did a trip prior to this past Thanksgiving. The websites, maps, trailguides and signs ALL HAD DIFFERENT MILEAGE.
I didn't kvetch about it though. I was too busy enjoying myself. ;)
As Lyle said, go hike a Western trail if you think it is bad back East. Hell, no one even knows what the official length of the CDT is as all the sources disagree...
Confession time (again, no less): I made most of the maps and wrote the guide document that describes our small town's 31 miles of hiking trails. I even scouted and helped build some of those trail miles, but from time to time I wake up at night in a cold sweat, wondering if I've calculated the mileages correctly.
Weary
Now my info is telling that it may not be published on time but I am going to pitch in to see where I can help because really I would like to see Appalachian Pages keep going.
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 10:17
Now my info is telling that it may not be published on time but I am going to pitch in to see where I can help because really I would like to see Appalachian Pages keep going.
You are just trying to stir something up.:rolleyes: as usual
As far as I know, Troll is preparing for his thruhike in 2010. Why would any of them hide the fact that Pages is still going and advertise here that a new book with one of the same organizers is coming out. Doesnt make sense!
Furlough
11-29-2009, 10:26
Not sure I understand why the under currents of angst exists over this new guidebook. I look at this as an opportunity to get another piece of gear. I buy all the guide books. That goes along with the 4 packs, 3 tents, 5 sleeping bags, 3 or 4 cook set set ups and the many stoves I own (afraid to actually inventory those). If the links continue to have "glitches" just google AWOL on the trail and you will get to his site. If as TOW suggests AP Pages does get published again, I'll be buying a 4th new piece of gear, err book. :)
Furlough
kayak karl
11-29-2009, 10:33
You are just trying to stir something up.:rolleyes: as usual
he's not stirring the pot!! rick is trying to publish 2010 book. TOW just wants to help.
KK
Jack Tarlin
11-29-2009, 10:43
TOW:
If you actually know more details on this, it'd be nice of you to be more forthcoming instead of being so cryptic.
I'm sure we'll hear one way on another from the various authors before too long, which is probably the best thing, rather than geting vague and incomplete rumors that serve no purpose at all.
I was under the impression that AT Pages would not be published this year, but that AWOL was coming out with his own book, probably sometime in January. But I may have been misinformed. So I'll wait a few weeks and see what happens, which is probably what other people may want to do as well.
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 11:22
he's not stirring the pot!! rick is trying to publish 2010 book. TOW just wants to help.
KK
I had heard last year that Rick was looking to focus more on his planning.
Now if TOW has info that the rest of us dont, why doesnt he come out with it instead of just going on heresay? Relax Karl, its just a book
kayak karl
11-29-2009, 11:36
Relax Karl, its just a book
and this is just a forum. even my opion doesn't count:). this is what he is referring to...
http://www.appalachianpages.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1519&postcount=2
KK
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 12:56
and this is just a forum. even my opion doesn't count:). this is what he is referring to...
http://www.appalachianpages.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1519&postcount=2
KK
Well then I stand corrected. Just emailed Troll to see if I can help.
I was referring to TOW's vagueness he tends to do before getting allllllll of teh facts!
Jack Tarlin
11-29-2009, 15:37
Chaco:
When you hear back from Troll about this (i.e. whether not this is definite), please feel free to let us know. Thanks!
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 15:46
Chaco:
When you hear back from Troll about this (i.e. whether not this is definite), please feel free to let us know. Thanks!
He is trying to put out the book this year but is having some copyright issues. Spoke to him by phone this afternoon. Basically, he is puting something together and some of us are going to lend a hand to help him make it happen.
AWOL has nothing to do with Pages anymore.
TOW:
If you actually know more details on this, it'd be nice of you to be more forthcoming instead of being so cryptic.
I'm sure we'll hear one way on another from the various authors before too long, which is probably the best thing, rather than geting vague and incomplete rumors that serve no purpose at all.
I was under the impression that AT Pages would not be published this year, but that AWOL was coming out with his own book, probably sometime in January. But I may have been misinformed. So I'll wait a few weeks and see what happens, which is probably what other people may want to do as well.All I will say about this is that I am in Ricks corner.....
It is best that any of you who know Rick to contact him as Chaco did.
Jack Tarlin
11-29-2009, 20:27
Actually, TOW, it'd probably be for the best if we heard from both Rick and Troll here, so we'd be accurately and correctly informed about what's going on, rather than get vague remarks or insinuations from folks who may or may not be truly well informed on this matter.
Also, while it seems that there's an ongoing disagreement between the two gentlemen (and this happens more frequently than you might think in the publishing world), it's unfortunate that people are speaking of being in someone's "corner".
I wasn't aware that this was a prizefight.
In any case, I have no doubt that we'll know more about this situation before too long when we hear from the two authors.
Authors, TOW. Not boxers.
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 20:28
All I will say about this is that I am in Ricks corner.....
There you go stirring again!:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Jack Tarlin
11-29-2009, 20:28
Correction: I obviously meant to say "AWOL and Troll".
And I'm sure we'll hear something from them before too long, which would be best for everyone.
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 20:29
It is best that any of you who know Rick to contact him as Chaco did.
You should have as well instead of going on speculation. Just drop it!
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 20:31
It is best that any of you who know Rick to contact him as Chaco did.
Annnnd, the only people that really know what the deal is, is AWOL and Troll so lets just leave it between them. It really isnt our business! I just called to extend an offer of assistance since we have done so much hiking down here this year.
oh the drama, don't know how i make do with just the ATC maps. :rolleyes:
Jack Tarlin
11-29-2009, 20:37
Gotta disagree with you there, Chaco.
In the next few weeks, hundreds if not thousands of hikers will be deciding which book they'll use before and during their hikes.
If there's going to be a brand new book, or perhaps more than one new book, then I'm sure people will want to hear about it. If an established, trusted book is NOT going to be appearing for whatever reason, people will want to know about that, too.
The more people know about the various guideboks and their features (especially new ones), the more informed they'll be as to which one they'll want to purchase and use, so therefore, I think this subject is indeed the "business" of the hikers, as well as the authors.
In any case, I hope this matter gets resolved soon, for everyone's benefit.
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 20:41
Gotta disagree with you there, Chaco.
In the next few weeks, hundreds if not thousands of hikers will be deciding which book they'll use before and during their hikes.
If there's going to be a brand new book, or perhaps more than one new book, then I'm sure people will want to hear about it. If an established, trusted book is NOT going to be appearing for whatever reason, people will want to know about that, too.
The more people know about the various guideboks and their features (especially new ones), the more informed they'll be as to which one they'll want to purchase and use, so therefore, I think this subject is indeed the "business" of the hikers, as well as the authors.
In any case, I hope this matter gets resolved soon, for everyone's benefit.
I guess what I meant to say was that the issue between the two of them, is between the two of them. A book is coming out regardless of the drama between them. I just dont think its any of our business.
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 20:44
This could have all been avoided but we do have drama queens here....... Good luck to both of you AWOL and Troll. If you guys want any help with some of the southern sections you guys have my email and can call me anytime. I am looking forward to both books and the 501 book. I love Guidebooks! Good luck ya'll
Actually, TOW, it'd probably be for the best if we heard from both Rick and Troll here, so we'd be accurately and correctly informed about what's going on, rather than get vague remarks or insinuations from folks who may or may not be truly well informed on this matter.
Also, while it seems that there's an ongoing disagreement between the two gentlemen (and this happens more frequently than you might think in the publishing world), it's unfortunate that people are speaking of being in someone's "corner".
I wasn't aware that this was a prizefight.
In any case, I have no doubt that we'll know more about this situation before too long when we hear from the two authors.
Authors, TOW. Not boxers.You are right, I'll stay out of it.....
Awol2003
11-29-2009, 21:57
Judge the books on content. When you hike that is what you will have with you. Hopefully no one will be going on the trail preoccupied with speculations upon the motivations of persons they have never met. An enormous amount of work went into "The A.T. Guide," which will be readily apparent when the book is released. It will publish on-schedule, probably early, and samples can be seen on the book's website....theatguide dot com.
Jack Tarlin
11-29-2009, 21:58
Actually, I mis-spoke when I said that we needed to hear from both of these guys.
We have actually heard from AWOL several times already in regards to his intentions next year.
In fact, it was AWOL that started this thread. :rolleyes:
Judge the books on content. When you hike that is what you will have with you. Hopefully no one will be going on the trail preoccupied with speculations upon the motivations of persons they have never met. An enormous amount of work went into "The A.T. Guide," which will be readily apparent when the book is released. It will publish on-schedule, probably early, and samples can be seen on the book's website....theatguide dot com.
I was out of line here.......
Chaco Taco
11-29-2009, 22:15
Judge the books on content. When you hike that is what you will have with you. Hopefully no one will be going on the trail preoccupied with speculations upon the motivations of persons they have never met. An enormous amount of work went into "The A.T. Guide," which will be readily apparent when the book is released. It will publish on-schedule, probably early, and samples can be seen on the book's website....theatguide dot com.
The layout is really cool AWOL. The grids with the profile is really cool. Is it the same size as Pages??
I thought I would put any rumors to rest. I am not going to have Appalachian Pages out in time for the 2010 season. I tried to get it done but just did not have enough time and help. I am hoping to gather information on my thru hike this year and publish again in 2011.
Despite any rumors that are circulating, Awol and myself are still on talking terms and I still consider him a good friend. I was not going to be around to help with the 2011 edition due to my thru hiking this year (2010) and it was decided upon that it would be best to for Awol to move out on his own.
If I do finish the 2010 edition of Appalachian Pages, I will put it up for downloading on WhiteBlaze.
ATTroll,
Thanks for the clarification. You are a true professional !!!
ATTroll,
Thanks for the clarification. You are a true professional !!!
WOW. What a wonderful example of the spirit of the Appalachian Trail. Who says White Blazers can't get along? The rest of us just have to try harder.
SGT Rock
01-04-2010, 21:23
Exactly.:sun
downes911
01-04-2010, 21:45
The only thing I don't like about the 2010 AT guide opposed to the 2009 Appalachian pages, is it does not with symbols/letter show quickly where the Roads are. Which is a nice that to know at a glance when trying to decide on a camping spot. Otherwise I love it.
Chaco Taco
01-04-2010, 22:42
I thought I would put any rumors to rest. I am not going to have Appalachian Pages out in time for the 2010 season. I tried to get it done but just did not have enough time and help. I am hoping to gather information on my thru hike this year and publish again in 2011.
Despite any rumors that are circulating, Awol and myself are still on talking terms and I still consider him a good friend. I was not going to be around to help with the 2011 edition due to my thru hiking this year (2010) and it was decided upon that it would be best to for Awol to move out on his own.
If I do finish the 2010 edition of Appalachian Pages, I will put it up for downloading on WhiteBlaze.
Like i said to you earlier, if you need any help with the southern sections, Im here to help. Good lcuk on your thruhike
Johnny Thunder
01-04-2010, 23:07
Like i said to you earlier, if you need any help with the southern sections, Im here to help. Good lcuk on your thruhike
He'll even walk it for you if the deal's right.
Chaco Taco
01-04-2010, 23:35
He'll even walk it for you if the deal's right.
and you can be my sherpa;)
Red Beard
01-04-2010, 23:49
How long did it take ya'll to get your guides? I ordered mine a few days before Christmas, and don't have it yet. At any rate I'm really looking forward to getting my hands on one of these guides.
Edit: I see the ship date on the site now.
Johnny Thunder
01-04-2010, 23:50
and you can be my sherpa;)
bull ****. You can be my sherpa.
http://www.webstar.co.uk/~afzal/images/topgun.jpg
Chaco Taco
01-05-2010, 10:25
bull ****. You can be my sherpa.
http://www.webstar.co.uk/~afzal/images/topgun.jpg
Oh you are good my friend, damn good!!!!
I just checked out AWOL's book, "The A.T. Guide" and it is very well published, excellent work AWOL!
takethisbread
01-07-2010, 19:05
For those of us that ordered the guide, but also are leaving in Feb what's the ETA of my looseleaf Nobo?
Chaco Taco
01-07-2010, 19:11
For those of us that ordered the guide, but also are leaving in Feb what's the ETA of my looseleaf Nobo?
maybe email AWOL about this
"For those of us that ordered the guide, but also are leaving in Feb what's the ETA of my looseleaf Nobo?"
Just got mine in today's mail (and I live on the West Coast).
FWIW, without the book cover pages the looseleaf NOBO pages in total weigh 205 grams, 7.2 oz. Not trying to start any discussion about that, just data ...
After just very hasty review I have a couple questions/comments (I certainly I agree with others that overall it looks fantastic, at least from a cursory thumb through).
On page 3, right side, second paragraph it says about town maps: "the width of the mapped area is at the bottom of the map" and then "horizontal and vertical gridlines cross the map every one-half mile."
For the most part that's true, but I did find a couple of exceptions. The map for Franklin on page 16 gives no width on the bottom of the map, though presumeably I can figure that out easily from the gridlines. But look at the one for Roan Mountain, TN on page 38 ... on the bottom of the map it says 3.7 mi, but there are only three intervening vertical gridlines. The latter would suggest that the map width is something just under 2 miles.
I don't mean this as criticism, I'm just trying to understand --- which is the correct map scale? Perhpas every other gridline is missing? A similar situation exists with the map of Fort Montgomery on page 128.
No big deal, just curious, I didn't do an exhaustive review, but I think these are exceptions.
I'll post my other question/issue as a separate entry.
After just very hasty review I have a couple questions/comments (I certainly I agree with others that overall it looks fantastic, at least from a cursory thumb through).
On page 3, right side, second paragraph it says about town maps: "the width of the mapped area is at the bottom of the map" and then "horizontal and vertical gridlines cross the map every one-half mile."
For the most part that's true, but I did find a couple of exceptions. The map for Franklin on page 16 gives no width on the bottom of the map, though presumeably I can figure that out easily from the gridlines. But look at the one for Roan Mountain, TN on page 38 ... on the bottom of the map it says 3.7 mi, but there are only three intervening vertical gridlines. The latter would suggest that the map width is something just under 2 miles.
I don't mean this as criticism, I'm just trying to understand --- which is the correct map scale? Perhpas every other gridline is missing? A similar situation exists with the map of Fort Montgomery on page 128.
No big deal, just curious, I didn't do an exhaustive review, but I think these are exceptions.
I'll post my other question/issue as a separate entry.
Right after shelter names it seems that generally there's a distance and a direction to where the shelter is off of the AT proper, i.e., (0.1W). Not always, though; for example, Blood Mountain Shelter (page 7) has (1934) after it. Is that the year it was built, or .... ? Lower on the same page, Low Gap Shelter doesn't have anything in parens after it ... perhaps it's dead on the trail, or so close that it rounds down to zero? I guess that will be pretty obvious once I'm on trail, but what would be really nice would be to know for sure that if no distance is given, then it's basically on trail.
Having the distances to the next 3 shelters in either direction is nice. The question that immediately came to mind for me was whether I could know anything about how far off the AT proper a shelter is if it's listed that way, i.e., whether or not that was a true distance to the next shelter, or to the turn-off only. I think it's to the turn-off only.
An example is the Whitley Gap Shelter at NOBO 36.9 (page 7). From looking at the previous shelter, I believe that the distance listed is not to the shelter itself; in this particular (admittedly egregious) case, the shelter is 1.2 miles off trail. I'm assuming that the elevation given is also for the turn-off point, and it's just not knowable whether a given shelter is significantly uphill or downhill from the turn-off.
To be clear, I'm not trying to make a big deal out of any of this, just trying to understand what the pages are (and are not) telling me.
If any of the above represents misunderstanding on my part, I'd be grateful for feedback/correction.
Looking forward to starting to actually *use* this information next month ... !
Okay, maybe I should push to get my donation connected to this user name so I can edit ... apologies for the first half of the last entry being a duplicate ...
trippclark
01-07-2010, 20:17
Right after shelter names it seems that generally there's a distance and a direction to where the shelter is off of the AT proper, i.e., (0.1W). Not always, though; for example, Blood Mountain Shelter (page 7) has (1934) after it. Is that the year it was built, or .... ? Lower on the same page, Low Gap Shelter doesn't have anything in parens after it ... perhaps it's dead on the trail, or so close that it rounds down to zero? I guess that will be pretty obvious once I'm on trail, but what would be really nice would be to know for sure that if no distance is given, then it's basically on trail.
Your assumptions here are correct. Blood Mountain shelter is an old stone shelter and 1934 sounds right for the year of construction and it is right on the trail, or so close as to be practically so. My understanding is that when shelters are removed from the trail there is a designation of approximately how far from the trail they are located and when they are on the trail or very close to it, then no designation is given. This same methodology was utilized in "Appalachian Pages" last year.
trippclark
01-07-2010, 20:23
For the most part that's true, but I did find a couple of exceptions. The map for Franklin on page 16 gives no width on the bottom of the map, though presumeably I can figure that out easily from the gridlines. But look at the one for Roan Mountain, TN on page 38 ... on the bottom of the map it says 3.7 mi, but there are only three intervening vertical gridlines. The latter would suggest that the map width is something just under 2 miles.
I think that the page 16 Franklin map without the mileage is indeed an omission, but I disagree with you regarding page 38 Roan Mountain. I count roughly 3.7 using the gridlines. Start at the right edge of the map and move left . . . the first gridline would be one mile, the second gridline roughly in the middle would be two miles, the third gridline that intersects where Subway is located would be three miles, and the remaining distance between the Subway and the left edge of the map does appear to be a bit over half a mile.
trippclark
01-07-2010, 20:28
An example is the Whitley Gap Shelter at NOBO 36.9 (page 7). From looking at the previous shelter, I believe that the distance listed is not to the shelter itself; in this particular (admittedly egregious) case, the shelter is 1.2 miles off trail.
It has been 10 years since I hiked this section, and I do not remember a shelter that far off trail, but I think that 1.2 miles is accurate. This is the same figure given in the 2008 and 2009 "Appalachian Pages" books and the 2006 "Thru-Hikers Handbook."
I usually take a picture of every shelter, and I do remember skipping one in Georgia saying that it was too far off the trail. That was probably the one!
SGT Rock
01-07-2010, 20:46
It has been 10 years since I hiked this section, and I do not remember a shelter that far off trail, but I think that 1.2 miles is accurate. This is the same figure given in the 2008 and 2009 "Appalachian Pages" books and the 2006 "Thru-Hikers Handbook."
I usually take a picture of every shelter, and I do remember skipping one in Georgia saying that it was too far off the trail. That was probably the one!
Yep it is. :eek:
Thanks all, and particularly for taking my comments in the spirit intended.
At the risk of splitting hairs here (just exploring a difference), trippclark said:
"... but I disagree with you regarding page 38 Roan Mountain. I count roughly 3.7 using the gridlines. Start at the right edge of the map and move left . . . the first gridline would be one mile, the second gridline roughly in the middle would be two miles, the third gridline that intersects where Subway is located would be three miles, and the remaining distance between the Subway and the left edge of the map does appear to be a bit over half a mile."
The vertical gridlines are stated as crossing the page every half mile. I see only 3 gridlines on that page (p.38), at least in the looseleaf NOBO version that I have. 3 gridlines breaks out 4 spaces, each at max a half mile, and the one at the left is clearly a shorter space than the other three hence --- either the gridlines there aren't at halfmile intervals (I'm guessing only 1 mile intervals on that particular page) or the 3.7 mi figure is wrong.
Again, these are what I suspect are very limited exceptions to what I look forward to as a lightweight and efficient, highly useful set of paper to carry. Even with just 5 resupply drops I'm thinking I'll carry on average just over a half ounce of paper to have this densly packed information available in hard copy. Very nice.
trippclark
01-07-2010, 21:27
The vertical gridlines are stated as crossing the page every half mile. I see only 3 gridlines on that page (p.38), at least in the looseleaf NOBO version that I have. 3 gridlines breaks out 4 spaces, each at max a half mile, and the one at the left is clearly a shorter space than the other three hence --- either the gridlines there aren't at halfmile intervals (I'm guessing only 1 mile intervals on that particular page) or the 3.7 mi figure is wrong.
Brian, you have a good eye for detail and I am sure that AWOL will appreciate your comments. You will notice though, back on page 3, that the book says ". . . gridlines cross the map every one-half mile. There are a few exceptions where gridlines mark one mile intervals on larger maps." Perhaps that should be more clear, but I think that the map you identified on page 38 and the one on page 39 also, are examples of those exceptions where the gridline is at one mile intervals.
Red Beard
01-07-2010, 21:29
Got my guide today. Wow is all I can say. Thanks for all the hard work Awol.
Awol2003
01-07-2010, 21:29
Some maps that cover larger areas have gridlines every 1 mile. Elk Park / Roan Mtn is one of these. Under the town name (page 39) you'll see "Grid Dim 1.0 mi". The width of the map on the Roan Mtn side is 3.7 miles.
Yep, I forgot to put the width at the bottom of the Franklin Map. I've also been told that the Walmart plaza is a popular destination. It's just off the map to the right, opposite quadrant of the intersection where BiLo is located.
The shelter-shelter distances are to the shelter turn-off. If a distance off-trail is not specified, then the shelter is close to the trail (likely within sight). The elevation is intended to be the elevation at the turn-off, but admittedly this is a bit of information that I have not thoroughly verified.
"Brian, you have a good eye for detail and I am sure that AWOL will appreciate your comments. You will notice though, back on page 3, that the book says ". . . gridlines cross the map every one-half mile. There are a few exceptions where gridlines mark one mile intervals on larger maps." Perhaps that should be more clear, but I think that the map you identified on page 38 and the one on page 39 also, are examples of those exceptions where the gridline is at one mile intervals."
Good eye back atcha! Yup, obvious now, "my bad". And again, definitely no big deal; I'll just keep in mind the number at the bottom of the map is the ruling piece of data.
One suggestion for future versions: I personally wish that the page format was designed to fit inside a quart ziplock bag. I.e., about 1/2" to 3/4" shorter, but wider would be fine to compensate. Likely this isn't any sort of standard print size and might increase the cost?
Yes, I know that a sized-to-fit ziplock is provided, but I doubt that's going to hold up (and remain waterproof) for the whole trail, and a gallon ziplock is sort of overkill.
I guess another option would be for online purchasers to be able to buy N additional sized-to-fit ziplocks at time of book purchase?
I appreciate you monitoring this Awol, and providing definitive replies!
Got my Guide the other day and it is the unbound version. I relly like certain attributes like the scaled profile.
Because it is unbound and the book has two orientations(longways and sideways) the pages are very easy to place incorrectly in the stack.
Solution: Take a permanent marker when all the pages are correctly placed and draw a line on the edge of the pages(1/2 inch thick book =1/2 inch line). This way a backward pages would be odvious.