tent and bag

[squeezebox]

I'm been looking at the catalogs,
Thinking of the REI quarter dome T2 at about 4 lbs
Kelty light year +20 bag just under3 lbs
REI lite core pad 1.5 " 27 oz.
Since I'm a newbie it's nice being able to go to the local REI store and actually see what I'm buying.
Thanks!!
Planning a mid April NOBO

[Appalachian Tater]

Nothing wrong with any of that stuff except honestly, they all seem pretty heavy. For instance, you could even go with the same brand and type pad but in a short length and save 9 oz.

Look at some of the gear lists and threads in the gear forums. If your pack is lighter you'll be much happier every step. Your knees will thank you. Start off with a heavy pack, shelter, sleeping bag, and sleeping pad and you've already lost the battle. You want to carry as little as possible and what you do carry you want to be as light as possible.

Only a very few people who start out with heavy stuff finish with it and often they replace a lot of it at Neels Gap. You'll be carrying your gear several thousand miles over a period of several months. Spend the time now to research and be willing to pay a few extra bucks for lighter stuff and in the long run it will be cheaper and better.

[tammons]

Yep,

Too heavy IMO.

Look at a Tarptent Moment at 28oz, or a sublite at 18.5 oz + hiking poles or if you need a 2 person tent a double rainbow at 2.5#. Contrail too for one.
All are less expensive and lighter. Used even less.

Get a Neoair short or a prolite 4 short lightweight pad and put it on top of a $7 walmart blue pad. More comfortable and more expensive but worth it IMO. This combo weighs roughly 14 oz. If you get a neoair regular, 19 oz with the blue pad.

I have a neoair regular and use it on top of a 3/8" blue pad from bass pro shops and its the most comfotable I have ever slept on the ground.

Climasheild is some good stuff, but for $130 for a main bag I would get a campmor 20dF down bag that is lighter at 36oz and more compressible. that is unless you expect to get soaking wet, but synthetic insul loses its loft over time.

Either that or an REI sub-kilo down bag. They have them on sale in the REI outlet for $160-29 oz. $170 for long. Thats a really good deal.

Or if you want to venture into quilts, $200 for a golite ultra 20 at 19.5 oz, but its probably only good to 25-30dF, so you might have to wear some cloths inside to take one down to 20dF unless you are a hot sleeper.

[tammons]

8.7# on your list vs 3.85# on the list above with the sublite, short pad on a blue CCF pad, and sub kilo reg. Around 5# total for a normal tarptent.

Believe me it adds up fast and these are 3 items along with your pack you want as light as possible. For a pack look at a Gossimer gear mariposa at 24 oz.

Considering all this stuff will cost roughly the same amount of $ as on your list its a no brainer.

I will add I really prefer freestanding dome tents, but they are just heavy.

[Tipi Walter]

I went backpacking last summer with an old geezor into the Upper Bald River wilderness and he was carrying a quarter dome TI, check out the fotog below. He had some trouble with the weird pole configuration but it all worked out. I think your kit is okay, though you should take out your bag and pad tonight and sleep out on the front porch or deck and see if you can stand the pad and stay warm in the bag.

The weights are insignificant, and I wouldn't be too concerned with them. Four lbs for a tent is okay but you might want to check the Rvalue on the pad just to make sure you don't sleep cold. For comfort's sake I'd look for something in the 3.5 Rvalue range, whether inflatable or not.

[squeezebox]

okay on the bag change to REI sub kilo and pad to neo air thinking the 6' vs, 4' length yes 14 oz vs 9 oz saves 1 lb. each
How about the MSR twin sisters shelter REI $149 2lb 3oz 114x72 floor saves2lbs. big enough when my son joins for the summer.
do I use anything for a floor and what.

[tammons]

That would be fine for winter, but I would want a bivy to go with it and a bug tent for summer, so more $ and more weight.

It ends up less expensive and lighter just to get a tarptent double rainbow for the both of you at $220. YOu could always send it back if you dont like it.

Any normal 2 person double wall tent with crossing poles and a heavier floor is going to be in the 4-5# range so if you are going to buy it at REI thats probably where you will be.

Now if you were going with a Cuben tarp that weighed 6-8oz or so and a UL 6 oz bivy and or an UL bug tent it would make more sense.

Once you get into the specialty tent and unltrlight companies like tarptent and six moons etc. then you can drop a 2-3 pound, but those are normally single wall tents.

Six moon designs sells a cuben fiber 2 man tent that weighs 16 oz. $400

[squeezebox]

well i looked at six moon and tarp tent
tarp tent double rainbow is 6 0z heavier than the squall 2
free standing is a big plus though
is interior condensation an issue in colder weather thus the 4 oz liner totals 10 oz heavier than the squall
Is the blue pad under the Neoair more for insulation or durability
again thanks for your patience with a newbie

[tammons]

Ventilation is the key to controling condensation and the tarptents have good ventilation. You can get condensation even with a double wall tent.

If you completely close up most any tent they will condense depending on the environment, cold, humidity size etc.

The squall is held up by hiking poles, the rainbow with a tent pole.

The squall 2 is an end entry while the double rainbow has dual side entry which is perfect for 2 people.

The scarp 2 with the crossing poles is freestanding I think, but heavier.
I think it has a seperate bug tent and fly, but I have never tried one.

I think the double rainbow, moment, contrail and subsil are the most popular models.

Blue pad for both reasons above.

Not required unless its cold like below 35dF or so, but helps protect the bottom of the neoair, adds warmth, and I use it for extra cushion since I am a side sleeper.

Some people use the gossemer gear 1/8" pad that weighs 2oz. I use a blue pad from Bass pro shops, mostly because I have 2 of them already. They weigh about 5 oz ea.

[skinewmexico]

Only time I ever set up my Double Rainbow freestanding was to seam seal it. I saw a poll once, and the overwhelming majority were the same. It's a bit of trouble to rig up your trekking poles for freestanding, and a freestanding tent is way overblown in the need department anyway.

[Lyle]

a freestanding tent is way overblown in the need department anyway.

I agree. I've been backpacking for 30+ years, and I just thought about it, I don't think I've ever owned a free standing tent. I've used a few, and there is a bit of a convenience factor, but not worth the extra weight. Not even close in most cases.

I would go with a ULA pack if you don't already have one. I agree with the others, get the lightest you can afford for the big three.

You can definitely save some weight on the tent. 4 lbs USED to be a good weight for one person, about 10 or 15 years ago. There are much lighter options now. Personally, I use The One from Gossamer Gear, or a Wild Oasis from Six Moon Designs. Love them both. 17 oz and 14 oz respectively. Full protection with The One, close to full protection with the Wild Oasis.

I'll agree with tammons about the pads. At our age you'll appreciate the comfort, but you can go lighter than your stated pad. When the weather warms up, you can ditch the closed cell pad, and still sleep comfortably with even less weight and bulk. With your choice, you'll be stuck with it the entire trip.

Good Luck and HAVE FUN!!!!

[mark schofield]

I have the Gossamer Gear 1/8 pad to go with a POE inflatable. I should have gotten the 1/4 or 3/8 because the 1/8 wrinkles up allot and is hard to keep straight. I use shelters most of the time so my Shires Contrail tent is fine, especially for the weight. If I tented every night, I might think about something different. I switched from the ProLite to the inflatable last year. For a few extra ounces, the comfort is well worth it to me. I have the REI sub kilo 20. The only problem for me is the frustating zipper. But it's light and warm.

[TimeSnake]

six moon designs for a lightweight spacious tent, and western mountaineering for a grand down bag.

[squeezebox]

So if free standing is a non issue. Please tell me about the tarptent Squall 2 vs. the Double Rainbow. sounds like there is a preference for the double rainbow.
6 0z wt. difference would call for the squall 2 unless there are other reasons. better setup? better interior room?
I will plan on getting the ground cloth with it.
Thanks

[The Solemates]

So if free standing is a non issue. Please tell me about the tarptent Squall 2 vs. the Double Rainbow. sounds like there is a preference for the double rainbow.
6 0z wt. difference would call for the squall 2 unless there are other reasons. better setup? better interior room?
I will plan on getting the ground cloth with it.
Thanks

dude, you are gonna get a million different opinions. what's important is that your set up works for you. don't do something stupid and order gear before trying it out or viewing it. go to the store and get hands on before making a decision. if you plan on ordering from internet cottage industries, well that is one thing. BUT, going to the store and crawling at least similar tents would help, especially if you are such a newbie. i cant stress enough: get what you are comfortable with, and you are not going to know this by discussing it on an internet forum.

[Red Beard]

Not trying to steal the thread or anything, but how waterproof is a TT Rainbow?

[XCskiNYC]

Here are some ideas for a tent:

The Big Agnes Fly Creek UL1 ($300), "packed weight" (manufacturers as you've probably noticed give a number of weights depending on how much of the total set you bring on your hike; you have to just carefully read their sites to figure out exactly which weight they mean) 2#3.

The All-Time Double-Wall Lightweight Value Champ: Eureka Spitfire, $110, 3#4.

The Spitfire is a copy of the Sierra Designs Clip Flashlight, a staked, two-hoop tent (it's a very copied tent with about half the tent makers in the world now having a similar model).

Roomier, Freestanding, Inexpensive, a Bit Heavier: Alps Mountaineering Zephyr 1, $100, 3#11 (you can bring the weight down a quarter pound or more by leaving home some of the optional stakes and guy lines).

And then the Tarptents, Gossamer Gear, Six Moons and others. These are products sold directly by the makers. They are designed and made in the U.S. There's no retailer with a %100 percent (standard) markup so you're probably going to get more for your money buying from one of these manufacturers.

Plus, these tents look to be very well designed (I use a double-wall tent, the Alps Zephyr, so can't say from direct experience but as you can see many people here like the Tarptents and other similar designs).

Best of all, the manufacturers of the Tarptents and similar only give one weight, not three different weights. Many of these designs use a hiking pole or two for support so, if you're going to have hiking poles anyway, this saves weight. If you don't use a hiking pole most of these tents only need one fairly short pole that might add three ozs to the package weight.

Freestanding versus not: I'm going to describe my Alps Zephyr 1 here to give some detail on this question. The tent will stand up fine by itself with just the poles. It won't be as taut as possible, of course, because the four corners of the tent won't be pulled out to the max as will be the case if you use the stakes on the four corners. The front vestibule will just hang straight down; this really requires two stakes to pull its two forward points out to their max extension. The fly has two guy-out points midway along its sides. Attaching these will let more air get under the sides of the fly, allowing for better ventilation. Finally, in the case of high winds, you're gonna want stakes to keep your freestanding tent from blowing away.

[LIhikers]

Not trying to steal the thread or anything, but how waterproof is a TT Rainbow?

I have a Tarp Tent Rainbow and it does fine in the rain. I've also had it protect me from sleet and snow. Like any other tent, be mindful of how and where you set it up for best protection.

[Trooper]

I am in the process of finding lighter solutions to what I currently have. Here are the gear changes I will be making:

*REI T2 Tent (4 lbs.) ---> Tarptent Moment (1.78 lbs.)
*REI External Frame Backpack (5.75 lbs.) ---> ULA Circuit (2.25 lbs.)
*Therm-a-Rest Original (2.25 lbs.) ---> Therm-a-rest ProLite (1.0 lb.)
*Sierra Designs Synthetic Zero Degree Bag (4.0 lbs.) ---> Marmot Down Sleeping Bag (1.69 lbs.)

It might cost a little more for better, lighter gear up front, but you might save money from having to replace things later.

[rpenczek]

My Tarptent Double Rainbow is great for weather protection. Both of my AT sections (past two summers) had driving rain storms and this past summer we had one entire night of hard rain and I had no water issues, not even misting.

I use my double rainbow as a solo shelter (I like my space and I am big 6'3" and 300 lbs). I have never had my DR set up free standing, but have not needed to either. I do get a little condensation, but just use a small camp towel to wipe down the roof before I get moving around (this is NOT and issue). I need to learn to set it up with better vetilation.

Some one suggested you try out some styles before you buy, of course with tarptent and six moons you can't (unless you have friends with them), but you can check out how you like a double walled front loader vs a side loader and we which works better for you. Then you will know if a Rainbow (side loader) is better for you than a contrail (front loader).

Happy gear hunting