View Full Version : Bill Ballowe - White Box Stove
Bill Ballowe has his WBS stove listed on eBay and makes claims about the "Cobalt" stove that are not true. (I have a vested interest in the “Cobalt” stove)
He states that his data was taken from:
backpackinglight.com, whiteblaze.com, bplite.com, backpacker.com and a couple other web sites.
Can anyone here point me to the forum that will show proof of these following claims made by him?
The following are quotes from his listing on eBay:
The maker of the cobalt brags that he tests his stoves under optimal conditions but confesses he has not tested his copycat stove in the wind
I will admit one thing about the cobalt stove.. it only took the maker 2 years of experimenting with the
White Box Stove to come close to making a stove that is almost comparable to the White Box Stove. To bad his videos don't tell the whole truth.
Here are some unsolicited test results done by independent stove owners that compares the White Box Stove to the copycat cobalt stove. This data was taken from backpackinglight.com, whiteblaze.com, bplite.com, backpacker.com and a couple other web sites. Remember this data was unsolicited and freely published by people doing their own independent testing.
White Box Stove to be up to 25% more efficient than the cobalt copycat stove.
White Box Stove VS cobalt stove
Bloom Time Bloom Time
10 to 30 seconds with primer plate Advertised at 10 sec but their online video shows 90 secs
When properly using a primer plate the White Box Stove will bloom faster than the cobalt stove.Don't be fooled by videos that have been "fixed" to show that one stove works better than another.
These two tests are the true test of how efficient a stove really is. The following data was non-solicited and taken from the same web sites listed above and was published online by independent stove users.
White Box Stovecobalt stove
*1/2 oz of fuel Avg burn time... 7 minutes *1/2 oz of fuel avg burn time...5 min 45 seconds
*1 ounce of fuel Avg burn time 12 min. *1 ounce of fuel Avg burn time 9min 45 sec
*Avg time to boil 2 cups of water is 5 min 45 secs. *Avg to boil 2 cups of water is 7 min 30 secs
*Maximum amount of fuel 3 Oz. *Maximum amount of fuel 2.5 Oz.
*Maximum burn time 27min. *Maximum burn time 20min15 sec.
*Remember these are unsolicited results obtained from online posts by independent owners
who tested both of these stoves.
My "wicketized" cobalt stove wouldn't light in cold weather, d*** just another piece of junk to hide from my wife... the White Box always performs the best.
.
Red Beard
11-25-2009, 10:48
I can boil (yes rolling boil) 2 cups of ICE WATER (water temp in the low 40's on Fahrenheit scale) in 10 minutes on my cobalt stove. I can do this with about 3/4 oz of fuel.
During the summer I have to add LESS fuel than recommended, because my water boils well before all the fuel is used (usually around the 6 minute mark). I made a snuffer for my stove, and it's kind of a pain to get unused fuel out of the cobalt, but that's my only gripe.
I don't know Zelph, but I have used a lot of stoves. Frankly, I love my Cobalt stove! I really don't care what Mr. Ballowe says, the Cobalt is a quality product.
take-a-knee
11-25-2009, 11:13
I like my white box.
Thank you for your informative comments.
I'm hoping to find the thread/threads that contain the information.
He states that his data was taken from:
backpackinglight.com, whiteblaze.com, bplite.com, backpacker.com and a couple other web sites. Remember this data was unsolicited and freely published by people doing their own independent testing.
When properly using a primer plate the White Box Stove will bloom faster than the cobalt stove.Don't be fooled by videos that have been "fixed" to show that one stove works better than another.
.
My Whitebox Stove instructions did not indicate that it had to be primed in cold weather, something he added afterwards. The Cobalt does not need to be primed. I made a comparison of the two stoves today in 40 degree temperatures. I just wanted to see how they both responded to a primer plate. Maybe Sarbar can give us some instructions on the proper way to prime the WBS according to the instructions that she furnishes with the stoves she sells.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/sub%20two/th_2009-11-30175050.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/sub%20two/?action=view¤t=2009-11-30175050.flv)
i know that where he says "to bad his videos..." he should use "TOO". i don't really take a business serious when people can even use decent grammar
Tuckahoe
12-01-2009, 01:17
Am I the only one that doesn't understand this? And the video sure didn't clear anything up.
FiremanFrank50
12-01-2009, 02:00
Hey Zelph.... I am wondering why you won't tell the people that a lot of the statements made by Bill actually were from you, posted by you, on your web site. That would make more sense than another video that doesn't mean anything to anyone.
For Mr Wags...If you want to articulate someones grammar... try reading Zelph's ebay ad. I see lots of misspelled words and poor grammar...but more importantly what about telling the truth. The ad states his stove blooms in 15 seconds but his video shows that it can take as long as 90 seconds. Come on now, you don't really take him serious do you? Zelph knows those quotes came from his own hand and he knows his blooms times aren't gospel.....shhhhh....he just has a hard time telling the whole truth.
Tuckahoe64... I don't believe anyone but those with bad intentions understand this thread but if you find out different I'd like to know too.
FiremanFrank50
4Whatitis
12-01-2009, 05:58
I like my solo white box just fine. it cooks quickly enough for me and by holding the pan over it while it warms up it is even faster.
Two each there own.
Hey Zelph.... I am wondering why you won't tell the people that a lot of the statements made by Bill actually were from you, posted by you, on your web site. That would make more sense than another video that doesn't mean anything to anyone.
FiremanFrank50
Hey FiremanFrank50, let's start with the above video and what Bill said.
When properly using a primer plate the White Box Stove will bloom faster than the cobalt stove.Don't be fooled by videos that have been "fixed" to show that one stove works better than another.
I used a primer plate like Bill suggested. The video shows the Cobalt blooming faster. Bill says the WBS blooms faster. The video is not fixed. The video tells the truth.
Let's look at another one:
The maker of the cobalt brags that he tests his stoves under optimal conditions but confesses he has not tested his copycat stove in the wind
When I post statistics about a stove I state the conditions that the stove was tested under. I don't brag about it. I just state the facts. You want to see what my stove looks like with wind blowing across it, I'll do a video to show how wind tolerant it is.
My stove is not a "copycat" of his stove. His is a two piece and mine is a one piece. My hole size and placement are different. The only thing these two stoves have in common is the aluminum bottle that they are made of.
White Box Stove VS cobalt stove
Bloom Time Bloom Time
10 to 30 seconds with primer plate Advertised at 10 sec but their online video shows 90 secs
Point me to the online video that shows the Cobalt bloom time to be 90 seconds. I think he was a little confused when he said that. I recall a video that shows the WBS blooming at 90 seconds without primer plate.
Keep in mind that the "Instruction Sheet" given by Bill on bplite.com did not contain information about having to use a primer plate in cold temperatures. I tested his stove according to the information available at that time.
If you want, I can give links to what I said on bplite.com that will shed more light on stove comparisons and things that were said.
My video up there shows a comparison of the 2 stoves using a primer plate. It's clear which stove primes faster.
FiremanFrank50
12-01-2009, 12:38
Point me to the online video that shows the Cobalt bloom time to be 90 seconds.
Try this link Mr Zelph. Or did you forget you posted this video. It clearly shows your Cobalt stove blooming at 90 seconds. Why don't you tell the whole truth instead of advertising 15 seconds!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdHTowe93QQ
By the way you are the only one interested in how fast a stove primes. Makes no difference to me or most other people.
Fireman Frank
ShelterLeopard
12-01-2009, 13:51
I use a pocketrocket, could never quite bring myself to bother with alcohol stoves.
I'm with tuckahoe on this, kinda don't get what is going on, or who you are fireman (no offense meant, truly, just wondered if you joined WB to talk only about this stove- which is totally fine, just wondered why.)
Only other thing I had to say, is even if alcohol stove number one and alcohol stove number two look similar, it doesn't mean it is a copy. It's a pretty basic alc. stove design, and no reason to deviate from it. (I suppose the minor adjustments are what make the real difference)
I've only even used my own homeade alc. stove and a thru hiker's swedish alc. stove (my old whisperlite broke), and they were okay. Never used either of these.
ShelterLeopard
12-01-2009, 13:52
I meant "ever" not "even" in the last sentence.
Red Beard
12-01-2009, 14:01
I use a pocketrocket, could never quite bring myself to bother with alcohol stoves.
If you ever do start messing with them, you'll get infected. Being a stovie is a hard sickness to break. ;)
ShelterLeopard
12-01-2009, 14:04
NOOOO!!!! The hiking and hiker food infection is bad enough!!! (And gear)
FiremanFrank50
12-01-2009, 14:07
"I'm with tuckahoe on this, kinda don't get what is going on, or who you are fireman (no offense meant, truly, just wondered if you joined WB to talk only about this stove- which is totally fine, just wondered why.)"
I am fairly new here... joined in August but not much time for post. I am going into retirement mode soon and thought I would explore cyberspace a little. Am finding lots of good information. Been a backpacker for years but am Old School so am trying to get up to snuff on new gear and techniques.
Howdy to all.
Fireman Frank
Point me to the online video that shows the Cobalt bloom time to be 90 seconds.
Try this link Mr Zelph. Or did you forget you posted this video. It clearly shows your Cobalt stove blooming at 90 seconds. Why don't you tell the whole truth instead of advertising 15 seconds!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdHTowe93QQ
By the way you are the only one interested in how fast a stove primes. Makes no difference to me or most other people.
Fireman Frank
Thanks FiremanFrank. That video was produced in 8 degree temperatures but bill doesn't tell you that. I wonder why.
The 10 second time probably came from the video shown here on Whiteblaze (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showpost.php?p=746209&postcount=1)
Here is a statement made by Bill here on Whiteblaze:
FOR THE RECORD: Your kit is a one piece kit and the WBS is a two piece stove. You are misinforming the people and that is why I don't want to be associated with you or your products. Liar Liar pants on fire. You can say what you want about similarity of the stoves but the only similarity is the bottle we both use.
I wonder why he associates the word "copycat" to his stove on his eBay listing. I think he's trying to blow smoke up your so you have hard time seeing the truth.
guys,
I think you should take this little tiff off of this forum. It smells of commercial undertones.
There is no best stove, best tent or best shoe. Just Your favorite or the best you've found for a specific purpose.
Red Beard
12-01-2009, 14:57
guys,
There is no best stove, best tent or best shoe. Just Your favorite or the best you've found for a specific purpose.
I heartily agree.
FiremanFrank50
12-01-2009, 16:44
I agree too.....
ShelterLeopard
12-01-2009, 16:54
guys,
I think you should take this little tiff off of this forum. It smells of commercial undertones.
There is no best stove, best tent or best shoe. Just Your favorite or the best you've found for a specific purpose.
Agreed. I think this thread has pretty much run its course.
i didn't look at zelph's listing. i'm just saying that at a place of business, if someone uses poor grammar, odds are i will not take them seriously. is that always the right thing to do? nope, but it's how i roll
guys,
I think you should take this little tiff off of this forum. It smells of commercial undertones.
There is no best stove, best tent or best shoe. Just Your favorite or the best you've found for a specific purpose.
I love a good stove fight!
ShelterLeopard
12-01-2009, 21:39
I love a good stove fight!
I can see the crowds gathering now... women screaming, children running rampant, the battle of the stoves HAS BEGUN.
And wags, I agree- bad grammar puts me off (especially if something is supposed to be an advertisement) as well.
MDhiker1967
12-01-2009, 23:01
guys,
I Think You Should Take This Little Tiff Off Of This Forum. It Smells Of Commercial Undertones.
There Is No Best Stove, Best Tent Or Best Shoe. Just Your Favorite Or The Best You've Found For A Specific Purpose.
Agreed 100%
MDhiker1967
12-01-2009, 23:03
It seems like this "topic" came up this same time last year...
come on... all we need to do is boil water...
I think the cave man should get all the credit for inventing fire LOL