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John B
12-03-2009, 14:21
Because of the stress runners place on their legs, it is common for foot injuries to crop up. And if you continue to try to run through the injury, the change in gait can often lead to additional injuries to the knees, hips, and lower back. Conventional treatment and/or solutions to the problem typically start and the foot and work upward, so to speak, but there is new evidence that calls for a top-down rather than foot-up approach to running injuries.

Put simply, research published in Sports Health looked at 283 studies that examined running injuries and concluded that the connections between weak hip stabilization muscles and running injuries were more conclusive than those caused by atypical foot pronation. What they're getting at is that while the foot automatically collapses inward (pronating) because of the downward force created by body weight transferred through the foot to the ground, and since the lower leg must follow through, it's like a wrench and bolt effect. Given that, the upper leg must move too in conjunction with the torque, and therein is when weak hip stabilization comes into play. If too weak, the femur isn't 'controlled,' and that's the primary cause of patellofemoral pain. Research at U. Wisconsin prescribed hip strengthening exercises to test group of runners, and the end result is that they exhibited significantly less pronation and attendant ankle and knee problems. I heard about the summary overview first through a pal who is an orthopaedic doc at UK, but much of the research was recently summarized in Running Times, which is why I"m bringing it up here.

If you have ITB, achilles tendonitis, patellar pain, etc., it might be worth your while to engage in a sustained exercise regime that targets hip adductors, abductors, flexors, etc. The research indicates that you do a series of these exercises every day until you're out of the woods, and 3-4X/wk thereafter.

If you're unfamiliar with such exercises, a Google, YouTube, or RunnersWorld search will quickly get you started. They're anything but complicated -- we're talking leg raises, side leg raises, lunges, etc. I know you'll look like an idiot doing them, but they're certainly worth a try -- avoiding achilles tendonitis, ITB, etc is definitely the way to go.

take-a-knee
12-03-2009, 15:05
Because of the stress runners place on their legs, it is common for foot injuries to crop up. And if you continue to try to run through the injury, the change in gait can often lead to additional injuries to the knees, hips, and lower back. Conventional treatment and/or solutions to the problem typically start and the foot and work upward, so to speak, but there is new evidence that calls for a top-down rather than foot-up approach to running injuries.

Put simply, research published in Sports Health looked at 283 studies that examined running injuries and concluded that the connections between weak hip stabilization muscles and running injuries were more conclusive than those caused by atypical foot pronation. What they're getting at is that while the foot automatically collapses inward (pronating) because of the downward force created by body weight transferred through the foot to the ground, and since the lower leg must follow through, it's like a wrench and bolt effect. Given that, the upper leg must move too in conjunction with the torque, and therein is when weak hip stabilization comes into play. If too weak, the femur isn't 'controlled,' and that's the primary cause of patellofemoral pain. Research at U. Wisconsin prescribed hip strengthening exercises to test group of runners, and the end result is that they exhibited significantly less pronation and attendant ankle and knee problems. I heard about the summary overview first through a pal who is an orthopaedic doc at UK, but much of the research was recently summarized in Running Times, which is why I"m bringing it up here.

If you have ITB, achilles tendonitis, patellar pain, etc., it might be worth your while to engage in a sustained exercise regime that targets hip adductors, abductors, flexors, etc. The research indicates that you do a series of these exercises every day until you're out of the woods, and 3-4X/wk thereafter.

If you're unfamiliar with such exercises, a Google, YouTube, or RunnersWorld search will quickly get you started. They're anything but complicated -- we're talking leg raises, side leg raises, lunges, etc. I know you'll look like an idiot doing them, but they're certainly worth a try -- avoiding achilles tendonitis, ITB, etc is definitely the way to go.

Much ado about nothing. Smart people don't run everyday anyway, especially long distance. Middle-distance runs (400 & 800m), mixed with kettlebell swings, pullups, pushups, barbell exercises like squats, deadlifts and power cleans produce a markedly more fit individual. No one ever got placed in a nursing home because their 5K time was too slow. If you do run a few or several miles each week (I do) then this is how to do it:

http://www.posetech.com/

Kerosene
12-03-2009, 15:12
Uh, the OP wasn't talking about fitness levels but how to avoid common injuries that can prove debilitating. I'm a great example where you don't have to be a long-distance runner to experience various problems associated with weak or mis-aligned hips & muscles.

Gray Blazer
12-03-2009, 15:33
I'm a great example where you don't have to be a long-distance runner to experience various problems associated with weak or mis-aligned hips & muscles.

Everybody should be good at something.

Mags
12-03-2009, 16:27
Very timely. I plan on doing a dirt road half-marathon in March.

I'll let people tell me if I really ran it or not at the end. :D

Pedaling Fool
12-03-2009, 18:52
What I do when the pain of a certain activity wonít go away I stop and work that area with another exercise, and weights are a big part of that.

However, Iíve been crazy in my running in the past month and working through the pain, but todayís run was too much so Iím stopping for a while. I got all the typical pains in the hip, lower back, knees and feet Ė especially the right foot.

But I got a pain somewhere Iíve never had pain before; it feels like a simple muscle strain, but a muscle Iíve never strained.

Anyone ever experience pain between your private area and bellybutton?

Itís been hurting for a few days and really hurt bad during todayís run. I have strong core muscles, so thatís not the issue; Iíll give it a couple days off and see how it heals, canít even cycle without feeling discomfort.




.

mudhead
12-03-2009, 19:27
I feel better about flopping around on my blue pad.

Those freakin' "draw little circles with your big toe" about make me nuts. Clockwise is the harder.:)
"Now keep the hip stable."

Donnie
12-03-2009, 21:01
Anyone ever experience pain between your private area and bellybutton?




Google "Sports Hernia" and look through the results. It is one of those injuries that, to my understanding, can't be fixed short of tolerating the pain and waiting for a surgery. However, with that said, I never studied the option too thoroughly so take the aforementioned advice with a grain of salt.

-Donnie

Pedaling Fool
01-23-2010, 11:38
This study suggests that our body can take more abuse http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/01/22/humans-run-mph-theory/

Humans could perhaps run as fast 40 mph, a new study suggests. Such a feat would leave in the dust the world's fastest runner, Usain Bolt, who has clocked nearly 28 mph in the 100-meter sprint.


"If one considers that elite sprinters can apply peak forces of 800 to 1,000 pounds with a single limb during each sprinting step, it's easy to believe that runners are probably operating at or near the force limits of their muscles and limbs," said Peter Weyand of Southern Methodist University, one of the study's authors.

But Weyand and colleagues found in treadmill tests that our limbs can handle a lot more force than what is applied during top-speed running.

More in the above link



.

GeneralLee10
01-23-2010, 11:52
I would not listen to anything that came from Fox News.

Pedaling Fool
01-23-2010, 17:15
I would not listen to anything that came from Fox News.
Fox News has the best Science and Tech. website of all the cable news stations, by far.

Since you're handicapped by your prejudice and closed mind I'll post this for you
http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2010-01/scientists-investigate-how-break-biological-speed-limits-humans

Lone Wolf
01-23-2010, 18:00
I would not listen to anything that came from Fox News.

oh brother :rolleyes:

Lone Wolf
01-23-2010, 18:01
I would not listen to anything that came from Fox News.

Fox News reported a horrific quake in Haiti. don't believe it

Mags
01-23-2010, 19:46
This is a thread about sports injuries..not about the validity of a news org.

Thanks.

(Almost had my own sports injury today. A dozen snowshoers taking a break at the bottom of a steep, narrow, icy and wooded trail! Not the smartest thing in mixed environments in winter...)

Egads
01-23-2010, 20:08
I started a running program 4-1/2 months ago. Started Yoga classes this month with my wife. My entire body has less tension, my muscles & joints have loosened up. Let's hope this prevents any new running injuries.

Mags
01-23-2010, 21:14
I've been doing about 1 hr of yoga per week since May.

Certainly helps with my flexibility, core and balance. Hopefully it will help prevent injury as well. Has not helped my hiking per se (other than, again, helping to prevent injury), but my backcountry skiing has improved quite a bit. Helps dodge clueless snowshoers. ;)

JAK
01-23-2010, 23:13
Fox News is a brilliant parody of Daily Show and Colbert Report.

Running injuries are tough to figure out, knowing when and how much to back off.
Also how light of a shoe you can run in. It is a trial and error thing unfortunately.
An experiment of one.

Praha4
01-24-2010, 01:00
I came down with a serious ITB problem in one leg this fall.... on a cold, rainy day on the downhill side of Blood Mtn. 6 weeks of physical therapy taught me the importance of proper stretching, and strengthening the adductor and abductors, and hamstrings. A lot of AT thru-hiker wannabes will get bumped off the trail this year, as every year, due to knee and ITB problems, a lot of which could be avoided if they were aware of what is causing their problem. If you think just hiking the trail will get you in shape, you could be throwing the dice and gambling these problems won't hit you. Read up and get smart on ITB and other knee/leg problems.

Pedaling Fool
01-24-2010, 09:27
Itís all too common to hear people say that they donít run because of the issue with impact. And I see many people in the gym stay away from the treadmill and opt for those "low-impact" machines, which move in an elliptical motion. I think those things are useless; we humans need impact to make our bodies strong, we obviously have evolved as runners not ellipticals. Just look at astronauts when they come back from a long space mission, which is the best proof that our bodies need weight bearing stress. So if you're avoiding impact then your body is (over a longer time) getting weaker. No matter how good your cardio conditioning is, if your frame is weak (or any part of it) you will suffer for that weakness.

Also, my worst knee pain was during a 300+ mile bike tour through the mountains (Skyland Drive & Blue Ridge Parkway), it eclipsed any pain I had during a hike or run. So I believe the pain people feel in the knees are probably something other than simple impact, in most cases.

I found that weightlifting worked for me in relieving pain. However, thatís just me, I do wonder if professional runners do much lifting?











:)

Sue_Bird
01-24-2010, 09:30
Man. The thing is, I WASN'T a long-distance runner before I started the trail. I was sedentary. And this exact thing happened to me, such that I had such debilitating knee pain I had to get off the Trail on Barren/Chairback so I'm missing 70 miles of the Wilderness. Cumulative injury from not stretching and taking care of your knees = a really frustrating, preventable reason to have to get off.

If I could go back with the knowledge I have, I would DEFINITELY have done knee stabilizing exercises before and during the Trail.

Pedaling Fool
01-24-2010, 09:45
Man. The thing is, I WASN'T a long-distance runner before I started the trail. I was sedentary. And this exact thing happened to me, such that I had such debilitating knee pain I had to get off the Trail on Barren/Chairback so I'm missing 70 miles of the Wilderness. Cumulative injury from not stretching and taking care of your knees = a really frustrating, preventable reason to have to get off.

If I could go back with the knowledge I have, I would DEFINITELY have done knee stabilizing exercises before and during the Trail.
Don't worry about it, you're young. Pain is weakness leaving the body, however, that doesn't mean you should plow through pain, it's good you got off the trail.

Don't just sit around do something that doesn't cause so much pain and slowly come back to what was painful. Building up the knees are easy, just doing squats/lunges (without weight in the beginning) is something you can do anywhere, even while watching tv.

John B
01-24-2010, 11:51
Well, I'm joining Mags and Egads and starting yoga. I'm training for an April 24 marathon with a large group of newbies and those who want to do long group runs. We're up to 32 miles a week total, our long runs are 12 miles and increasing 2 miles a week. And I'm having debilitating knee problems. This Saturday my knee felt like there was broken glass in it, so for the first time at mile 10, I stopped. Really depressing.

About 2 mths ago, I started doing hip abductor and flexor exercises with weights. I use a foam roller. I try to stretch but I'm lazy and don't do it enough. I take massive amounts of glucosamine/condroiton (sp?). I have shoe inserts because I have flat feet and pronate. In other words, I think that I'm doing all things reasonable. But one problem is that I'm a "Clydesdale runner" -- +200 lbs -- I'm right at 50 yrs old, and years in the weight room, etc have taken a huge toll on my knees. So on the advice of the running coach, I'm adding yoga to the routine -- twice a week in a class, an hour each time.

No way I can do trail running right now. The decents are too freaking painful. So on Sundays, I do a pseudo trail run in a city park -- dirt/grass path, no real ups/downs.

My schedule now is 5 days a week weight room; 4 days tempo or interval runs; 1 day long run; and now adding 2 days yoga.