View Full Version : Ground cloth ideas
If you are a confirmed hammock user or tenter, you probably have little interest in groundcloths. However, if you spend time in shelters or are a tarp person, a good groundcloth can be very helpful. The basic idea is to keep a waterproof (or mostly waterproof) barrier between yourself and the ground. When it rains (and it is known to rain a wee bit on the AT), the utility is obvious. Even when it is dry out, the groundcloth protects you and your bag from dirt, punctures, and overnight condensation from the ground itself. There are several options for groundcloths, but I'll only mention a few. In terms of size, you'll want something which is three or four feet wide and your height plus, say 30 inches long. Individual preferences here dictate how much space you need, but I would tend to cut things on the large side to start.
1) Walmart tarp. Go to Walmart and buy a $10 camping tarp. Made of very durable, entirely waterproof plastic, you'll want to cut this thing down to eliminate the metal eyelets. Cutting the tarp will NOT increase the danger of tearing. My groundcloth of this material is rather large and roomy and weighs (a portly) 10 oz. Unless you set this on fire, you won't have to buy another one in your life time: A friend of mine has used the same groundcloth, of this material, on her Triple Crown hikes, the LT, Superior Trail, Colorado Trail, and Ice Age Trail. You can add up the miles for yourself.
2) Tyvek. Tyvek is a funny looking, paper like material that they wrap houses in. It it NOT completely waterproof, but usually good enough for the job at hand. Before using, you'll want to either run it through washing machine (no soap), or crush it up alot in a sink full of water. This "softens" the Tyvek. If you skip this step, it will crinkle loudly whenever you roll over or break wind on it. The worst thing about Tyvek is getting it. You can either steal some from a construction site (you might want to ask if you can have some first) or buy it online. DancingLight (trailquest.net) and LW Gear both sell groundcloths made of Tyvek. Expect to pay around $15 or $20. Tyvek is not completely durable. I got good use out of mine for about 120 nights before it was really letting condensation through. This should be enough for a single thru hike, however. The lack of waterproofness will be felt only in the groundcloth's old age, or if you are trying to camp on standing water, or if it rains hard and you have pitched in a bad place. My Tyvek weighed 6 oz. for a basic sized one.
3) Painter's drop cloth. Go to a hardware store and buy some 2 mil. painters drop cloth. A big roll, enough for 3 huge groundcloths, will set you back about $3. Made of clear plastic, the stuff is very light, completely waterproof, but some care must be taken as it isn't very durable. This is my current favorite groundcloth, as the durability isn't a big deal: Just put a spare one in a bounce bucket. In 30 nights in the Canadian Rockies, I managed to punch a few holes in mine by camping on rather sharp rocks. My jumbo sized version weighs 5.8 oz. A true ultralighter could shave this down to probably 4 oz. with a properly shaped groundcloth. I suppose that 1 mil. drop cloths might cut the weight of the jumbo version, while decreasing durability, and that a 3 mil. drop cloth would increase the weight of the small version, while also increasing durability. The cost is so minimal that you can afford to experiment.
Other examles of groundcloths that I have seen in use include Mylar space blankets (usually used in conjunction with a bivy) and silnylon (good reviews from PCT hikers).
Gossamer Gear has an product that is very promising. I only have one night on it so I can't make a lot of comments. I am switching from TYVEK because it becomes fuzzy and starts to pick up a lot of duff. It will take some time to evaluate this spinn sheet.
http://www.gossamergear.com/cgi-bin/gossamergear/spinn_sheet_ground_cloth.html
Gossamer Gear has an product that is very promising. I only have one night on it so I can't make a lot of comments. I am switching from TYVEK because it becomes fuzzy and starts to pick up a lot of duff. It will take some time to evaluate this spinn sheet.
http://www.gossamergear.com/cgi-bin/gossamergear/spinn_sheet_ground_cloth.html
I'm also giving the spinnsheet a try. I will let you know...
Singletrack
09-09-2004, 22:05
Chris, informative post. I use a 36X85 silnylon ground cloth. I have sewn loops in each corner, to stake out. Silnylon is slippery, and hard to stay still when I move around. Thats the reason for the stakes. Mine weighs 3.4 oz., but that does not include the stakes.
orangebug
09-09-2004, 22:22
One way to deal with slippery silnylon is to use silicon sealant/glue and draw beads across the surface, perhaps writing you name, drawing your favorite college mascot or Martha Stewart's cell number.
On a section hike this summer I used a large industrial strength garbage bag (42 gal Husky Contractor Clean-Up Bags.) Cut it down each side to double the length. 3 mil thickness. Home Depot sells a 32-bag box for $13 so they are really cheap and you can include one in mail drops so you have an easy back-up if something happens.
tarbubble
09-10-2004, 02:51
http://www.theneatsheet.com/
i use it out here in the West and i love it. it's not waterproof, but it's water-repellant enough for my needs. if you are planning on bedding down in a puddle you may want to keep looking.
Texas Dreamer
09-10-2004, 16:10
I, too have been using the neatsheet, after cutting out the little weights in the corners of course. I was wondering, though--would these be hard to find in the winter months? I have been seeing them in the seasonal aisles with the kids smim toys and sunscreen and such, and worry that I might need a replacement in the winter and the stores won't be carrying them.
I did have a little dampness come through this past weekend. I had run out in the rain to set up new (used) shelter to see how it went up in the rain (Hex 2--set up in less than two minutes!), so the ground was already damp. I will probably switch to something else for the wet AT. (My neighbors just assume it's the KIDS camping in the backyard!!)
Those of you using Sil tarps, are you having any trouble with punctures? They could still be used for kitchen tarps in the rain if they don't get punctures when in use on the ground.
Singletrack
09-11-2004, 23:52
No problem so far with my silnylon ground cloth. Been using for about a year. Most of the tarp tents made now days with floors, are using silnylon. I do not know if hikers use ground cloths under these. I did'nt when I had one.
I for one, like to keep something between my sleeping bag/ sleeping pad and the shelter floor or ground. So, when sleeping in a shelter or under the stars, I'll spread out a ground cloth of some sort. But I'm not a fan of the 2 mil plastic drop cloths. I want something more durable.
When using my tent, I'll also use a ground cloth. Tents are expensive enough without tearing up the floor on sharp sticks and stones on the ground. For me, a good ground cloth gives the tent floor a layer of protection. Better to replace the ground cloth than the whole tent.
eyahiker
09-12-2004, 19:13
Good point, Peaks. I learned this the hard way in Arizona a few years back.......rough ground, took two set ups to destroy my floor.
Sorry, I misposted the weight for the drop clothground sheet. I listed a weight of 8 oz for the 2 mil, jumbo sized painters drop cloth. It should have been 5.8 oz.
I'm also giving the spinnsheet a try. I will let you know...
Just got back from a thru-hike on the Colorado Trail where I used the spin sheet.
Worked pretty well. Water resistant but not water proof (which is fine for a ground cloth). Was concerned about the durability at first, but it appears to have held up fine. Curious how it would work on a 5 mo thru-hike.
Overall, I'd reccomend it.
I can vouch for the Gossamer gear Spinsheet. :clap It is cut generously by my standards, (27"x84") but it works, and only weighs 1.7 oz. Pretty crispy when new.
If you reall thrash around while you sleep, they make a double.
Ratfunk
I've used Typar house wrap for years and it has held up beautifully. It's cheap, and you can cut it to size with scissors. The problem is nobody wants to buy a whole roll, so where do you get a small piece? Answer: I recently bought a half roll to use on my house and have a lot left over. If you want a piece, go to eBay, type in Appalachian Trail, and there should be a 4.5 X 8 foot piece available.
I use a tube tent cut in half...that way I can buy a tube tent and I get 2 ground sheets! Each one weighs 7-8 oz and is big enuf for 3 people! Cut it down for 1 -2 people. Dee
tlbj6142
10-05-2004, 09:35
What exactly is a tube tent? Seems like it is one of those phrases that means something different to each person that uses it.
I think of it as a sheet of 2-4mil plastic setup in an a-frame (something Scouts do at winter campouts).
sierraDoug
10-05-2004, 14:37
Check this out for "what is a tube tent". It's a tube of plastic sheeting with open ends. There is no top or bottom. You can rotate it around the guy line.
http://www.beprepared.com/product.asp?pn=CT%202010
tlbj6142
10-05-2004, 15:14
THanks. I wouldn't have thought they had a bottom. But, I guess, they wouldn't be a "tube" then would they?
SalParadise
10-05-2004, 16:43
I hope I'm not throwing this thread off topic, but....If you had a bivvy sac that's more durable than syl-nylon or tyvek, would you even need a groundcloth at all?
tlbj6142
10-05-2004, 17:08
Plenty of folks use silnylon bivies (bottom only) as their "ground cloth". Maybe not on the AT, but they are quite common in the UL communitee.
SalParadise
10-05-2004, 17:21
What do you mean "bottom only", and why might that not work on the AT?
Singletrack
11-26-2004, 08:42
Check out the new polycryo ground cloths at Gossamer Gear. A 32X93 weighs 1.3 oz. It comes in a 2 pack for $3.95. Polycryo is supposedly water proof, and puncture proof. Lighter than Spinaker cloth. I ordered me a 2 pack, will let you know what it's like when I receve it.
Dances with Mice
11-26-2004, 12:39
I've used heat shrink film sold as window insulation. It's mylar, a touch heavier and more durable than a space blanket. I forget the weight, but the slightest breeze would blow it away when I spread it to dry. Found it at Wal-Mart, looks like this: http://doitbest.com/shop/product.asp?mscssid=5XAHV6BCKM2L8JJ5GBAGAES7B5PX7X NF&dept%5Fid=2240&sku=282960
Big enough to cut to size and get 2 or 3 groundsheets per package.
TakeABreak
11-26-2004, 21:33
As the first message suggested the Tyvek, I also use it, it works great. I also carry a small piece just large enough to sit on. I keep it so it is handy on rainy or wet days, that way I sit can down to eat a snack or relax without getting my butt wet.
hungryhowie
11-27-2004, 13:32
You don't have to go to great lengths or specialty ultralight manufacturers to get a great groundsheet for one person, you know. I bought a box of trash contractor bags from Wal*Mart several years ago (~$5? for 50). Making two slits, one down each side, yields a solid rectangle that is ~80" x ~30" and weighs in at 2oz. I know, I know, it's 0.7oz heavier than the newest thing from gossamer gear, but I've been using the same one for more than a year now and it only cost me a dime, and it still looks great. Oh, and they also work well as pack liners.
just thought I'd chime with my $0.10...
-howie
TakeABreak
11-27-2004, 17:28
H.H., I never thought of using one for a ground clothe, but I used a trash compactor bag as a pack liner also, I also did a food cache two weeks before the start of our thru hike for me and 3 others, near deep gap shelter in ga, I put the food in the trash compactor bags and then in the stuff sacks the others had sent me, and I hung them in an Ice storm, the end of january in 2000, we started our hike on 2/12 and got to deep gap about 3 weeks after I hung the food, there was water in the stuff sacks but none had gotten through the trash compactor bag.
Since I use a down bag to save weight, after I put my sleeping bag in it's stuff sack, I then insert the stuff sack in a trash compactor bag. I fell on my butt plenty of times in water, but the sleeping which in the bottom of pack never got wet.
Bill Strickland
11-27-2004, 19:22
Roy Robinson put me on a good source of silnylon if anyone is interested. It's www.owfinc.com Jakebrake
I use an Equinox bivy, modified slightly, at about 6oz. I could go much lighter using 1.1 silnylon from Walmart (nearly transparent white for, get this, $1 a yard), but I would still need a bivy under my poncho.
Eric
I use a "Neat sheet" It's made of paper, not sure of how durable it is, only used it once. Its light, & seems durable: a friend stood on one & 2 of us lifted him, he weighs about 200 Lbs.
I did spray it with a bit of water proofing (scotch guard) so I hope that helps.
Used to use a coated nylon tarp, 3' x 7'. Neet sheet is lighter, similar size.
Doctari.
Dances with Mice
11-28-2004, 20:03
I use a "Neat sheet" It's made of paper, not sure of how durable it is, only used it once. Its light, & seems durable: a friend stood on one & 2 of us lifted him, he weighs about 200 Lbs. Plastic. Not paper.
Two polypropylene materials are stitched together to form the product. Each material, dark blue and light blue, are thermally bonded laminates. To put it another way, each layer is constructed the same way as Frogg Toggs (www.froggtoggs.com) material, so you could say the 'Neat Sheet' is made by sewing two layers of Frogg Toggs material together. Different manufacturers but nearly the same manufacturing processes.
It's strong and very tear resistant. Abrasion resistance might be a concern, just like with Frogg Toggs. You can wash it but never put it in a dryer.
The materials of Neat Sheet are waterproof, but the needle holes from the stitching won't be. Scotch Guard won't hurt and will probably help.
tlbj6142
11-29-2004, 10:26
Neat Sheet's are not waterproof. From the neat sheet site "This large, cottony soft water-repellent sheet".
Water sort of beads off them, but it can easily be forced (place one on a puddle and sit down) through one. Espeically if you pull apart the layers.
Neat Sheet's are not waterproof. From the neat sheet site "This large, cottony soft water-repellent sheet".
Water sort of beads off them, but it can easily be forced (place one on a puddle and sit down) through one. Espeically if you pull apart the layers.
Yea, I figured. However, that ain't why I use a ground cover, my tent floor is sil nylon, so is water proof, I use the neet sheet to protect my tent, & to keep my sleeping bag mostly clean the rare times I use a shelter.
I actually use a Disposable sheet [a very similar product], & I get them free :D
Doctari.
I make my ground cloth from plastic. You can get whatever mill thickness you like. When tenting I cut it bigger than the floor, then fold the edges to make it a few inches smaller than the floor. I have found. this fold channels the rain runoff under the cloth.
I use a milar emergency blanket as my groundsheet, but I have not used it enough times to say whether or not it will last long enough. I will be doing a through hike on the Tahoe Rim Trail this summer, so I will have a better idea then.
The Hammocker
02-11-2005, 21:17
if you open up a trashbag it is slightly bigger than a sleeping pad and is very light. might be worth a shot as a ground cloth.
fantasmagris
02-11-2005, 21:32
First i used an old tent footprint from a SD Clip. And, it was nice, large, waterproof and easily stake-able (zat a wurd?). It weighed somewhere between 0.5 - 1.0 lb. Then i made a homemade combo groundcloth/bivy with a silnylon floor and a breathable top and some netting around the head. Ultralight - less than 7 oz with netting and all) but i wanted something bigger so i could sit up when the bugs are fierce and i like to read at night too (and the light brings bugs). So, now i primarily use a MSR trekker bug mesh insert. It weighs a whopping 1-11, but ... it doubles as a groundcloth and tent under my tarp. I opted for MSR over other lighter mesh inserts cause it's bigger, appeared to be the only one with a truly adequate bathtub style floor and it was less than $70. It works for me and is worth the extra weight (in gold). It also gives you the option of sleeping two, say if someone needs rescuing from the bugs...
:-?