View Full Version : Gulf Hagas, Maine
Johnny Appleseed
01-09-2010, 23:01
Take the 5 mile loop trail of Gulf Hagas in Maine. The grand canyon of the east. It was the most beautiful area for my entire thru hike in 2006. Lots of waterfalls and cliffs, also Grotto Rock water pool is great to swim in.
It is not part of the AT, and it is towards the end, but you must take this detour.
wcgornto
01-09-2010, 23:26
Take the 5 mile loop trail of Gulf Hagas in Maine. The grand canyon of the east. It was the most beautiful area for my entire thru hike in 2006. Lots of waterfalls and cliffs, also Grotto Rock water pool is great to swim in.
It is not part of the AT, and it is towards the end, but you must take this detour.
No. It's toward the beginning.
No. It's toward the beginning.
If you're SOBO, yes, otherwise it's toward the end (the first third of the Hundred Mile Wilderness in Maine).
I hiked part of it and took some pictures. The trails in the wilderness are pretty flat, but they're sort of boring. The Gulf itself is quite impressive.
wcgornto
01-10-2010, 01:08
If you're SOBO, yes, otherwise it's toward the end (the first third of the Hundred Mile Wilderness in Maine).
I hiked part of it and took some pictures. The trails in the wilderness are pretty flat, but they're sort of boring. The Gulf itself is quite impressive.
Yes I know. I was just being cute because I hiked SOBO.
Ok, I kinda figured that but wanted to keep things straight for folks not familiar with the AT.
Shutterbug
01-10-2010, 01:13
Take the 5 mile loop trail of Gulf Hagas in Maine. The grand canyon of the east. It was the most beautiful area for my entire thru hike in 2006. Lots of waterfalls and cliffs, also Grotto Rock water pool is great to swim in.
It is not part of the AT, and it is towards the end, but you must take this detour.
I have done the loop several times. There is nothing interesting to see on the north side of the loop. Now, when I visit Gulf Hagas, I take the loop counterclockwise half way, then return by the same way I came.
Yes, indeed, it's a beautifully scenic alternate Johnny Appleseed, but it's not the main trail because the nature of the hike/tread of this alternate would not handle the amount of hiking traffic if it was the main path of the AT without negatively impacting the experience of this alternate. The experience of the alternate would be very different if every hiker chose this route!
I have done the loop several times. There is nothing interesting to see on the north side of the loop. Now, when I visit Gulf Hagas, I take the loop counterclockwise half way, then return by the same way I came.
That's what I did. I guess I got lucky and went the best way the first time out. Unfortunately, my images of the Gulf are in movie form and, as far as I know, can't be fiewed as such here.
warraghiyagey
01-10-2010, 02:48
Yes I know. I was just being cute because I hiked SOBO.
All SOBOs are cute. . . :):):)
I've been reading about it in the guide books. Since I'll be hiking home, and still fairly fresh, I may do it. However, I'm wondering how that affects my food supply going through the 100 mile wilderness.
Johnny Appleseed
01-20-2010, 02:35
easy hike, food will be fine. Only problem is staying there for 3+ hours like I did. It might take some distance off your plan, but not much, and definatly not enough to skip it for this issue alone. Next time I'm staying longer.
easy hike, food will be fine. Only problem is staying there for 3+ hours like I did. It might take some distance off your plan, but not much, and definatly not enough to skip it for this issue alone. Next time I'm staying longer.
So you're saying "If the weather is good, It might be worth an extra day just to enjoy Gulf Hagas?".
Johnny Appleseed
01-21-2010, 01:02
yes I am saying that in the biggest way possible, Tuney. But I would also go if the weather were bad/horrible.
The Presidential range is the best thing I saw on the AT, while Gulf Hagas was better to me, it is just slightly off the trail, so it is the best thing on my journey. I saw a pic of a secluded swim pool in penn., and that would have been nice, I often wonder what did I pass that I did not know was there. That is why I am asking this for future trails and also why I inform other so they are at least informed.
I'm planning to keep journaling the highlights and the lowlights of this adventure in my trail journal. You can bet that there will be notes about the pleasant surprises along the way.
Yes, indeed, it's a beautifully scenic alternate Johnny Appleseed, but it's not the main trail because the nature of the hike/tread of this alternate would not handle the amount of hiking traffic if it was the main path of the AT without negatively impacting the experience of this alternate. The experience of the alternate would be very different if every hiker chose this route!
I doubt if adding Gulf Hagas to the AT would make a significant extra impact on the Gulf Hagas Trail. Most of the "crowds" that AT hikers complain about are folks who visit the area specifically to see the gulf.
The Gulf Hagas loop attracts several thousand walkers a year, far more than the AT by itself in that section.
Weary
Besides, at the time I'll be there around Mid June, what's left of the NOBO mob will still be down in Virginia somewhere.
So you're saying "If the weather is good, It might be worth an extra day just to enjoy Gulf Hagas?".
Some of my favorite visits to Gulf Hagas have been in cloudy, or light rainy days. In sunny conditions the patterns, colors, and textures on the canyon walls are obscured by deep shadows. I've found the best photos are taken on somewhat overcast days. This is probably even more true in the digital age. At least, the range of recordable light I get with my six megapixel digital camera is considerably less than that recorded by the color film I once used.
Actually, black and white film produced some of my best Gulf photos.
Weary
Actually, black and white film produced some of my best Gulf photos.
Weary
I'm carrying a 10MP Fuji point and shoot mounted to the top of one of my trekking poles. It does a good job, and it's about 1.5 LBS lighter than my good Canon 10MP SLR. It does a good job for a point and shoot. It gets close enough on the exposures that I can usually fix them with Photoshop Elements. I always shoot at maximum resolution so I can edit the images down to a usable size and still maintain image quality. Using the Walking stick as a mono pod helps with slow exposures in difficult lighting.
There has to be some valid reason(s) why IT IS NOT the official tread of the AT. It's a Blue Blaze instead. I'm not really sure of all that's going on, in terms of hikers, in the Gulf Hagas area, but it is my assumption that someone or some group wanted to preserve the experience of the waterfalls, rim, Gulf Hagas itself, and the sometimes narrow somehwhat fragile trail that often runs right along the rim, FOR EVERYONE, by NOT making it the official route of the AT and thereby having this area and trail less subjected to the added impact from thru-hikers, who might seek to camp overnight right on or near the rim or the narrow trail. And, that doesn't take into account the added foot traffic that would impact this trail and certainly the experience for all, both dayhikers and thru-hikers. It is my thought that the "crowds" you speak about are day hikers who do specifically come to experience the Gulf, but who also leave at the end of the day!
Pedaling Fool
01-22-2010, 09:33
It would be interesting to hear from the ATC and/or MATC why the AT bypasses the Gulf. If the reasoning is "crowd impact", I'd say that's a non-issue now.
Also, do they see an impact issue with the crowds that visit each year now?
Pedaling Fool
01-22-2010, 10:15
There has to be some valid reason(s) why IT IS NOT the official tread of the AT. It's a Blue Blaze instead. I'm not really sure of all that's going on, in terms of hikers, in the Gulf Hagas area, but it is my assumption that someone or some group wanted to preserve the experience of the waterfalls, rim, Gulf Hagas itself, and the sometimes narrow somehwhat fragile trail that often runs right along the rim, FOR EVERYONE, by NOT making it the official route of the AT and thereby having this area and trail less subjected to the added impact from thru-hikers, who might seek to camp overnight right on or near the rim or the narrow trail. And, that doesn't take into account the added foot traffic that would impact this trail and certainly the experience for all, both dayhikers and thru-hikers. It is my thought that the "crowds" you speak about are day hikers who do specifically come to experience the Gulf, but who also leave at the end of the day!
It would be interesting to hear from the ATC and/or MATC why the AT bypasses the Gulf. If the reasoning is "crowd impact", I'd say that's a non-issue now.
Also, do they see an impact issue with the crowds that visit each year now?
How many day-hikers does it take to cause an equal impact as one camper?
I know the question is a little crazy with a lot of varibles, but I don't see an occasional hiker that sets up camp having more impact than the crowds of day-hikers seen there now.
I say "occasional", because of the "No camping" permitted rule that's in effect and would remain in effect if the trail passed by. I know some will camp; I wonder how many stealth there already?
BTW, I'm not advocating a reroute of the AT, just curious. However, this bypass supports the claims of many that the AT is far less scenic than it could otherwise be.
And don't forget if you do this loop you're not eligible for a 2,000 miler certificate, unless you backtrack
:D
.
How many day-hikers does it take to cause an equal impact as one camper?
I know the question is a little crazy with a lot of varibles, but I don't see an occasional hiker that sets up camp having more impact than the crowds of day-hikers seen there now.
I say "occasional", because of the "No camping" permitted rule that's in effect and would remain in effect if the trail passed by. I know some will camp; I wonder how many stealth there already?
BTW, I'm not advocating a reroute of the AT, just curious. However, this bypass supports the claims of many that the AT is far less scenic than it could otherwise be.
And don't forget if you do this loop you're not eligible for a 2,000 miler certificate, unless you backtrack
:D
.
I've argued from time to time that the trail should be the most scenic route, and used Gulf Hagas as an example.
The answers I've gotten have never struck me as very sensible, but then they were given by people, so what can you expect.
Anyway, the gist of the argument seems to be that the trail builders didn't want long distance hikers to have to cope with a lot of sightseers and day hikers.
Weary
Some good questions John Gault. I would like to hear from the ATC and MATC. I have not been to Gulf Hagas since 2006 so it may currently be different than I remember. Though, I STRONGLY suspect someone or some group still does not want the additional impact from thru-hikers! Despite the no camping rule that I believe was in effect for Gulf Hagas in 2006 I witnessed obvious places where this rule was disregarded and it resulted in impacting this trail and the experience for all negatively. If this was the official AT that thru-hikers followed there would most likely be MORE hikers camping illegally overnight on this trail and further negative impact. In discussing this we should take into account the sensitive somewhat fragile nature of this trail that sometimes follows along directly on the rim and how added foot traffic from thru-hikers might adversely effect the experience for all.
Reroutes, Blue Blaze, unofficial alternates are done on the AT, and other trails, for many reasons. I would guess that one of those reasons include someone not deeming the alternate appropriate for the added impact of all thru-hikers. I certainly don't pretend to understand all those reasons nor trail politics, but I see thru-hikers, of which I am one, disregarding and disrespecting the rights of land owners and rules along the AT. I witnessed several thru-hikers, despite warnings from rangers, law enforcement, and private land owners NOT to camp illegally on private land between Boiling Springs and Duncannon PA, doing so. I found hikers, many AT thru-hikers, camping illegally in the Whites. Their illegal camping negatively impacted the environment and thus the experience for everyone, not to mention adding to a bad rep for all thru-hikers. All hikers, and that includes sometimes lofty minded I'm special I'll do as I please thru-hikers, should understand that as they embark on thru-hikes this yr that what they do impacts those who come after them. FORTUNATELY, the vast majority of thru-hikers do seem to care for the trail by realizing it's there for all.
max patch
01-22-2010, 11:20
Weary, a few years ago someone said that Gulf Hagas was actually outside of the legally defined corridor and thus the trail could not be located there. Was that you?
I think the trail should be the most scenic option when there are alternatives, and I agree that the reason the trail does not go thru Gulf Hagas is to minimize impact to this area.
Weary, a few years ago someone said that Gulf Hagas was actually outside of the legally defined corridor and thus the trail could not be located there. Was that you?
I think the trail should be the most scenic option when there are alternatives, and I agree that the reason the trail does not go thru Gulf Hagas is to minimize impact to this area.
I don't remember saying that. I've always assumed the corridor includes the Gulf. I know the land around Gulf Hagas is now owned by the National Park Service.
I doubt if impact has anything realistically to do with where the official AT footpath goes. There are only a few hundred thru hikers left by the time most reach Maine. A drop in the bucket compared with the thousands that visit Gulf Hagas each year.
Most Appalachian Trail hikers are out for a day or two respite from civilization. They are not out to complete the trail, or even any special part of the trail. They just want a day or two or a long weekend in the woods and wilds. I doubt if many of these bypass the Gulf Hagas side trail, just so they can say they hiked only on the "official" trail.
Weary
TJ aka Teej
01-22-2010, 12:00
Gulf Hagas, on the right day, is a wonder. In the pouring rain, it's a pain.
Gulf Hagas is outside the narrow corridor, and has always been owned/managed by concerns other than the ATC.
Make it part of the AT? If we could add every beauty spot and 'worthy' blue blaze, the AT'd be three miles wide.
--
edit: I know the Hermitage is inside the corridor, but isn't Gulf Hagas to the west a bit, Weary?
(I'm looking for my maps...)
Gulf Hagas, on the right day, is a wonder. In the pouring rain, it's a pain.
Gulf Hagas is outside the narrow corridor, and has always been owned/managed by concerns other than the ATC.
Make it part of the AT? If we could add every beauty spot and 'worthy' blue blaze, the AT'd be three miles wide.
--
edit: I know the Hermitage is inside the corridor, but isn't Gulf Hagas to the west a bit, Weary?
(I'm looking for my maps...)
You are right about Gulf Hagas being to the west of the Hermitage. Sorry for confusing people. Anyway, it is now all owned by the National Park Service.
I also think Gulf Hagas is now part of the AT corridor, but I wouldn't bet any money on it. My belief stems from my memories of a casual conversation I participated in some time ago with people who should know.
Weary
Edit: Just an additional thought. The decision not to include Gulf Hagas as the official AT route occurred long before there was an AT corridor. The trail around the Gulf is an official side trail of the Appalachian Trail and is maintained by MATC. It was first rebuilt mostly by volunteers, as part of the effort that pushed the trail through Maine in the 1930s. I believe the rim trail was first rebuilt in 1934. It's been maintained by MATC as part of the Appalachian Trail system ever since.
Johnny Appleseed
01-22-2010, 21:28
All/nearly all the hostels are not on the AT, but yet thru hikers are there. All I want is for thru hikers to know gulf hagas is coming up, should we go? I did not hear it from any other hiker, I saw it on some tourist map that thru hikers do not get to see. As long as we talk about it in our circles then that is all that is needed. I know when I has w/ in xxx of some pizza joint I heard about it, for up to three days in some cases.
I am divided on it being the AT.
Well maybe we should make the AT corridor three miles wide. That's a good idea TJ.
All/nearly all the hostels are not on the AT, but yet thru hikers are there. All I want is for thru hikers to know gulf hagas is coming up, should we go? I did not hear it from any other hiker, I saw it on some tourist map that thru hikers do not get to see. As long as we talk about it in our circles then that is all that is needed. I know when I has w/ in xxx of some pizza joint I heard about it, for up to three days in some cases.
I am divided on it being the AT.
Well maybe we should make the AT corridor three miles wide. That's a good idea TJ.
Well, in a few places in Maine, the trail is three miles wide -- or close. But the leadership of the MATC during the relatively brief period that we had to make decisions, our leaders still dreamed of working out private arrangements with the paper industry and large industries. Maine was the last state that the National Park Service did any significant acquisitions.
Our leadership was wrong, as I suspected. No company seriously signed. All dreamed of getting some unexpected trail purchase dollars. and never seriously considered donating anything of value.
But then, I was a lonely maintainer. I had no real influence. Really a negative influence. I overheard a conversation once among folks who didn't know I was there.
One asked, "Who is that cummings who is writing all that stuff?
The reply: "I think some-know-it all from New York."
I was in fact born in Maine a couple of months before the 1929 Wall Street collapse, raised in Maine, and lived in Maine during the decade of the depression and the overlapping decade of World War Two. I left for a decade or so to explore a wider world. I returned in 1958, and became involved in some issues, important, but still marginal to the trail hierachy.
Regardless, MATC made a monumental mistake when it defined the "corridor" so narrowly in Maine. It should have insisted on a minimumm of a five mile wide corridor, Instead it settled mostly for a thousand foot corridor. Then, as now, Maine is the wildest section of the entire 2,000-mile plus trail system. A wider corridor was clearly justified. We just never asked.
Whatever.
Now, I'm working mostly as a volunteer (former president) for the Maine Appalachian Trail Land Trust.
And working to provide buffers, even for Gulf Hagas, would you believe.
Weary
WalkinHome
01-23-2010, 15:51
From everything I have ever seen and read the entire Gulf Hagas loop is inside the AT corridor. Weary is correct regarding the impact of a relatively few thru hikers hiking Gulf Hagas. Thousands (I think in the neighborhood of 5,000) per year visit this area. As to informing hikers about their possible encounter with Gulf Hagas, it is in the Maine Guidebook and featured on Map 2. You can lead a horse to water.........
max patch
01-23-2010, 16:00
Gulf Hagas was mentioned in the original Philosophers Guide. Every thru hiker knows about it.
Gulf Hagas was mentioned in the original Philosophers Guide. Every thru hiker knows about it.
Well at least all those that read this thread. And, of course, those that have read the Philosophers Guide, which died 20 years ago.
I have done the loop several times. There is nothing interesting to see on the north side of the loop. Now, when I visit Gulf Hagas, I take the loop counterclockwise half way, then return by the same way I came.
I was planning to spend a night at Carl Newhall, Hike Gulf Hagas the next day, and spend the next night at The Hermitage. From your comment, It sounds like it might be better to go on down to the Hermitage then weather permitting hike the southern half of Gulf Hagas the following day, and then depending on the status quo, spend another night at the Hermitage, or possibly go on down to Chair Back Gap.
WalkinHome
02-20-2010, 12:25
You should know that the Hermitage and Gulf Hagas are designated as a No Camping No Fires zone from the Gulf Hagas Cut-Off Trail south to the southern banks of the West Branch of the Pleasant River. Enjoy the Gulf (as TJ said if it's not raining LOL)!!
You should know that the Hermitage and Gulf Hagas are designated as a No Camping No Fires zone from the Gulf Hagas Cut-Off Trail south to the southern banks of the West Branch of the Pleasant River. Enjoy the Gulf (as TJ said if it's not raining LOL)!!
Funny you should mention that. I'm just now reading about North Maine Woods Reservations. In the 2009 Companion. Seems there's a lot more to this exercise than just loading up the pack and hitting the trail.:D
Shutterbug
02-20-2010, 13:29
You should know that the Hermitage and Gulf Hagas are designated as a No Camping No Fires zone from the Gulf Hagas Cut-Off Trail south to the southern banks of the West Branch of the Pleasant River. Enjoy the Gulf (as TJ said if it's not raining LOL)!!
All of the travel literature seems to make a big deal of the Hermitage. The tress in the Hermitage are large by east coast standards, but don't compare to the tress we have in the Northwest. I walked right through the Hermitage without recognizing it.
You should know that the Hermitage and Gulf Hagas are designated as a No Camping No Fires zone from the Gulf Hagas Cut-Off Trail south to the southern banks of the West Branch of the Pleasant River. Enjoy the Gulf (as TJ said if it's not raining LOL)!!
There are some North Maine Woods campsites just south of the canyon on the east side. You can arrange for camping when you drive through the Katahdin Iron Works gate. Just follow the sign from Route 11, a few miles north of Brownville. The camping fee is around $10 -- or was the last time I checked.
Weary
All of the travel literature seems to make a big deal of the Hermitage. The tress in the Hermitage are large by east coast standards, but don't compare to the tress we have in the Northwest. I walked right through the Hermitage without recognizing it.
Agree. Runts compared to cedar or fir in your area.
They are fine examples of their species, however. Hard to find stands of tall, straight white pine here. Between the leader eating "weevil" and chainsaws.
I have some here that are close to or larger, but were damaged by the fire of '47. Sad.
All of the travel literature seems to make a big deal of the Hermitage. The tress in the Hermitage are large by east coast standards, but don't compare to the tress we have in the Northwest. I walked right through the Hermitage without recognizing it.
Granted Shutterbug, but let's appreciate what was saved. You're talking about the east coast where VERY VERY VERY few virgin or old growth exists, even when hiking a protected corridor near the Appalacian ridge. Even still, those are impressive old stands of Eastern White Pines in the Hermitage no matter where you go. And, lets not forget, that is an eastern species, not exactly what's found in the Northwest. Something akin to comparing the large impressive, but yet still smaller, tree species found in WA state with the larger and even more impressive species the Giant Redwood and taller Coastal Redwood found in northern and central California.
LOTS of logging going on in the Northwest right now. If humankind doesn't change their consumptive ways its only a matter of time before the human locusts change the face of the northwestern forests to resemble the majority of the eastcoast forests or lack of them. Can't really replace a 1000 yr old Redwood unless we allow for 1000 more yrs, now can we?
I've been reading about it in the guide books. Since I'll be hiking home, and still fairly fresh, I may do it. However, I'm wondering how that affects my food supply going through the 100 mile wilderness.
Tuney,
You don't have to carry all your food thru the 100 mw. White House Landing can provide two great meals and some basic resupply items - not a lot of variety but enough to help you get to Monson w/o lugging too much food.
And in mid-June, the nobos will be in PA, NY, NJ.
JustaTouron
02-20-2010, 17:31
After reading this thread it sounds like Gulf Hagas is an area worth blue blazing and saying to heck with any purest. Because some clown decided to have the AT skip a really nice section, I am gonna blue blaze AND say I hiked the entire trail trail and get a the rocker. If any purist doesn't like it thats their problem.
Good swimming spot. Several actually. The highlight of those white pines, to me, are how far up the first branches are. Again, not a western tree, but slick for here.