View Full Version : Are tent footprint worth it?
Brian321
02-07-2010, 03:10
I just bought my first tent and dont really know if i want the extra wieght or if i should spend the extra money on a footprint, What do you guys think?
Wrangler88
02-07-2010, 03:44
Don't get it.
My suggestion is to go to your local hardware store and look for the stuff that some people use to make sort of temporary storm windows at this time of year with plastic that is attached to the window and a hair dryer used to shrink tight. My understanding is that this is basically the same as polycro that Gossamer Gear sells (http://www.gossamergear.com/cgi-bin/gossamergear/polycryo_ground_cloth.html). Buying from GG is a fine option too (!), but buying at your local hardware store eliminates the shipping charge, and you might find yourself able to find something that's better sized to your tent.
Polycro is tough stuff, yet very lightweight. The benefits vary, depending on what you want a ground cloth for, and there are --- of course --- differing schools of thought on this. Some folks feel that a ground cloth is likely to catch and hold water above the waterproof ground cloth and this increase the chance of water infiltration. For this reason, I do recommend that you size your ground cloth such that it doesn't stick out beyond the rain-sheltered area of the tent (or tarp or whatever). Some feel, for this reason, that a non-waterproof groundcloth is best, such as tyvek.
For me personally, a light groundcloth keeps the tent floor itself clean; I find it easier to deal with a wet/dirty/muddy groundcloth.
There are also different schools of thought on whether the ground cloth really protects a tent floor. Some feel that tent floors are tough enough on their own, and site their personal examples of not having problems. These folks also tend to believe that anything that can punch through their tent floor will likely also punch through the ground cloth. The (or "an")other school of thought here is that the ground cloth reduces abrasion and extends the life of the tent floor, something perhaps of more value in a lightweight tent with relatively thin flooring.
I'm not particularly religious about this, but given how light and tough polycro is, I tend to use it. I wouldn't use anything much heavier.
I just bought my first tent and dont really know if i want the extra wieght or if i should spend the extra money on a footprint, What do you guys think?
i would't get the footprint, but i sleep in a hammock!:cool:
The tents I've had have always started to leak from the top first. Use common sense and don't set up your tent on top of sharp objects and you should be fine.
Toolshed
02-07-2010, 07:06
Brian,
Protect your new investment.. You can pick up a 25'x10' roll of 4mil plastic at Wal-Mart for about $6. Cut a piece off and save the roll for anything else you need (future tents, painting, etc...). You'll have enough groundcloth for the rest of your life....
trim it to a size about an inch or two less then your tent floor.
Take a sharpie and mark "Top" or "Door" on it to quickly note where it sets up (If you are setting up in a rainstorm, this helps)
Put this on the ground under your tent. It will protect against general abrasion. It will increase the life of your tent, reduce stains attributable to mud, dirt, squished slugs, etc....
It will also increase resale value of your tent, if you decide to sell it later.
I spent a rainstorm soaked night in the tent of a friend who doesn't believe in using a groundcloths. The floor of his tent (Sierra Designs) was worn somewhat, but the fly was fine.
We were careful to choose out site, but the ground was soaked everywhere. Anyways, over night, the tent didn't leak from the roof, but from the bottom. Capillary action from moving around on your sleeping pad sucked the water in under our pads. This made for a very uncomfortable night.
Its a personal preference insofar as whether or not you want the extra weight. One more thing to carry, one more thing to dry out if it gets wet.
We've never carried one backpacking, ever. We are just careful to survey where we place out tents.
bigcranky
02-07-2010, 09:34
Having a piece of lightweight plastic to use as a groundsheet is a good idea. You can use it inside shelters, when you stop for breaks, etc.
Buying the "footprint" that the tent manufacturer makes for your tent is not such a good idea. They are usually very expensive and heavy.
Big Dawg
02-07-2010, 09:56
I just bought my first tent and dont really know if i want the extra wieght or if i should spend the extra money on a footprint, What do you guys think?
What kind of tent did you buy? Is the floor made of silnylon? If so, consider this treatment for silnylon floors (http://jwbasecamp.com/Articles/Silnylon1/index.html). Only adds 1 to 2 ozs depending on floor size, and you don't have to keep up w/ an extra piece of gear (footprint).
We've never carried one backpacking, ever.
I haven't either and have never regretted it.
Here is my reasoning:
I have done a whole lot of miles with neither tent floor NOR groundcloth (relying on my sleeping pad to keep me off any damp ground,) so why would I ever need both?
I NEVER rely on my shelter floor, if any, to keep pooled/running water out of my tent. That is asking for trouble. I set up in areas of good drainage.
If I do have a shelter with a floor, it is mainly for insects, with the added advantages of keeping debris out and as a moisture (not liquid water) barrier. IF I get pinholes from tiny stone/stick punctures, my floor will still work fine because I'm not sleeping in pooled/running water. Therefore I've saved 100% of the weight of a tent footprint/ground cloth.
Pedaling Fool
02-07-2010, 10:18
I ditched mine after the first few hundred miles because it just wasn't worth the hassel of packing up, especially when it got muddy. In heavy enough rains moisture and mud always gets between the tent floor and footprint.
In theory you could probably prevent this with optimum site selection and perfect placement of footprint, but that ain't going to happen everytime on the AT. -- Some one will dispute this, I guess they're just a better camper than me:)
lucky luke
02-07-2010, 10:29
hi,
i never use one. the tent is heavy enough, whichever i carry.
my ahwahnee has 9 holes in the floor (its been bought in 1985, got the holes on denali in 1986), i would not want to miss them. they donīt matter at all, and the big one that my partner burned into the floor with the stove is used to get rid of the dirt while i am inside. the 8 small ones were punched with crampons by the very same person.
i never got a hole in the floor from the surface i was camping on.
happy trails
lucky luke
Some tent makers offer a lightweight fly/groundcloth pitch option making the tent more versatile. You can leave the tent body at home and simply pitch the fly and ground cloth for a single wall shelter. If your tent offers this option, you may want to consider this.
Pedaling Fool
02-07-2010, 10:40
I ditched mine after the first few hundred miles because it just wasn't worth the hassel of packing up, especially when it got muddy. In heavy enough rains moisture and mud always gets between the tent floor and footprint.
In theory you could probably prevent this with optimum site selection and perfect placement of footprint, but that ain't going to happen everytime on the AT. -- Some one will dispute this, I guess they're just a better camper than me:)
BTW, I have yet to puncture my floor, tent is 5 years old and I've used it all along the AT and on a few cycling trips. However, I do carry a tent repair kit. I punctured my platypus hydration sys. and used the tent tape and it's still holding (2 years later). On-trail repairs only add character to your equipment, imo.
Polycro.
DO a search ont he internet for frostking and get one of their window insulation kits.
Just the clear plastic one. Tough stuff and tent size it typically weighs about 1.5 oz.
Wise Old Owl
02-07-2010, 11:09
I read the above posts and its all very good advice, in PA the mud comes right up though the debris. Condensation forms on the bottom,and makes breakdown of a tent twice as long because It needs to be packed dry, to avoid molding. A lightweight sheet of plastic makes a huge difference in making your investment last longer...
In back of car camping they now require the tent to be on the "pad" in state/nat. parks. The pad is made of stone micro chip and it tears up the "bathtub" flooring. We use a heavy Polycro tarp for additional protection that has been sized to the tent.
Some tent makers offer a lightweight fly/groundcloth pitch option making the tent more versatile. You can leave the tent body at home and simply pitch the fly and ground cloth for a single wall shelter. If your tent offers this option, you may want to consider this.
Especially if this setup allows you to put up the fly first (in the rain) where you can then setup the tent body and keep it dry in the rain (relatively speaking) under the fly.
garlic08
02-07-2010, 11:35
I don't use a ground cloth either with my silnylon tent floor. It has over 5,000 trail miles on it, including a couple thousand desert miles, and not a sign of inordinate wear, no more than the canopy. I spoke with the tent manufacturer (Henry Shires) about once it in amazement, and he verified that he practically never repairs a floor. I say save the weight and money.
brooklynkayak
02-07-2010, 11:38
I only use a groundcloth in my floorless shelters. I have small holes from pine needles and lava rock in my tent floors. Since I always pitch on high ground, I don't worry about water coming in.
I'm a fan of ground cloths, for two reasons. The first is it keeps the tent a little cleaner, though that's certainly not a necessity. The second is that if I feel like sleeping out under the stars I can use it alone to keep my sleeping bag and whatnot better protected from the ground. Really though, like others said, it's all a matter of personal preference.
But I wouldn't go out and buy a footprint, just buy some tyvek and cut it to size.
gravy4601
02-07-2010, 13:05
I bought the ground cloth cause it's a freestading tent so i can bring the footprint and the fly and leave the rest at home
Two issues, weight and real functionality, cancelled mine off the list after 1st section hike primarily due to excess weight and then limited functionality. Have been in some killer storms with and without, no difference, less weight ruled!
Appalachian Tater
02-07-2010, 13:37
Well, what kind of tent is it and where will you be using it? That information is necessary to answer the question.
I have never needed a ground cloth on the AT for my Tarptent. It's just unneeded excess weight and if I had taken one on my thru-hike, I would have sent it home, without a doubt. I actually used my Tarptent as a ground cloth in a couple of shelters with dirty floors to protect my sleeping bag so I don't know why you would need to carry one for that. If your tent can't function without a groundcloth under normal circumstances take it back and get one that can.
I don't look at a silnylon tent as a permanent piece of equipment like a cooking pot but something that will get used up and worn out with normal use like a pair of shoes and certainly it is not an investment because even if it never wore out, it wouldn't earn me a single nickel of profit unless I rented it out.
If you do need a groundcloth because you will be hiking in stony, cactus-covered desert and you need to protect the floor of your tent from punctures, then consider a Tyvek sheet. If you will be hiking in areas where the ground is saturated and you are afraid it will seep through, then go with a lightweight sheet of impermeable plastic. Either way learn to size it properly in relation to the floor of your tent.
ChinMusic
02-07-2010, 13:59
I read about a footprint keeping the bottom of your tent clean..........so what? You now have a dirty footprint to pack up. Something is gonna get dirty.
The reality is you really don't NEED a perfect tent floor unless you have a habit if setting up in a depression......don't do that.
For me a tent floor keeps the crawlies out and allows me to spread my things about without fear of losing stuff. If I didn't care about crawlies or losing stuff I would go without a floor all together.
most tent manufacturers sell expensive "footprints", customized to fit the tent floor. Save your money, and save some ounces.... use a scrap piece of tyvek or 2-mil plastic sheeting if you absolutely want/need a groundcloth. The lightest groundcloth I've found is sold by Equinox, it's a 4'x9' ultralite silnylon cloth.. with tiedowns sewn into the 4 corners... only weighs about 4 oz
Brian321
02-07-2010, 16:04
Thanks for to tips everyone. I really didnt want to buy a footprint but wanted some suggestions. I think i will just go with some plastic.
That's all you need. No need for TWO FLOORS (unless your tent has a balcony and staircase :p).
Basically, though, you'll need floor protection if your tent has a silnylon floor, not so much with a polyurethane coated floor - the poly floors tend to be more waterproof (on good tents, not on cheapo junk), and the nylon is usually thicker and tougher.
Some people use tyvek, which is heavier than 4mm plastic, tends to pill, and picks up debris after that (on the plus side, it can be washed and used again).
Another tip:
GET BLACK PLASTIC - no, it won't necessarily dry faster, but it will be much easier to spot holes in when you hold it up to the light. Patch holes with duct tape until it gets too ridiculous then throw it out.
white_russian
02-07-2010, 16:46
If you are worried about holes in the floor just buy your tent from REI.
frisbeefreek
02-08-2010, 19:46
I have a Tarptent Rainbow, which has a pretty thin floor. I really liked having Tyvek in the desert to protect from rocks and sharpies. I use Polycro in the East. It keeps the tent dryer and cleaner (not having to clean mud off the floor when packing up after a wet night is a nice benefit for 1.5oz penalty).
On the AT, a you can use a ground cloth to sleep on in the shelters.
I read about a footprint keeping the bottom of your tent clean..........so what? You now have a dirty footprint to pack up. Something is gonna get dirty.
Packing away a dirty, and especially wet, shelter is a bad idea. There's no harm to packing away a wet and dirty groundcloth so long as you fold it up to contain the crud. Now if you take the time to dry and clean out your gear in the middle of the day, it probably doesn't matter how you pack shelter.
ChinMusic
02-08-2010, 21:18
Packing away a dirty, and especially wet, shelter is a bad idea. There's no harm to packing away a wet and dirty groundcloth so long as you fold it up to contain the crud. Now if you take the time to dry and clean out your gear in the middle of the day, it probably doesn't matter how you pack shelter.
A wet tent goes into a mesh bag or in the mesh pocket of the pack. If the weather cooperates it comes out for some drying time at lunch.
Pretty standard stuff there.....
I've never bought a "footprint" but always have used some type of groundcloth underneath the tent floor. I think it is common sense that if you can reduce the abrasion of you inside the tent - rolling around at night, with the tent directly on rocks, roots, woody stems, sand, clay, whatever - you will extend the life of you tent floor.
In the past I used 3 mil plastic sheeting cut to size, now I use the GG Polycryo. Amazingly tuff. Makes a great sit pad for breaks or lunch too when the ground is wet if you keep it accessible in an outside pocket.
I usually buy a shower curtain at the local dollar store. Works great.
DirtySouth
02-15-2010, 21:59
I usually buy a shower curtain at the local dollar store. Works great.
That's actually not a bad idea. Sure they may weigh more than the manufacturers foot print, but at less than 10% the cost, I'll carry a few more ounces.
Username75
02-16-2010, 05:05
If you buy some Tyvex House type Vapor Barier, You'll be convinced
to Use a footprint.
Cut it to size then wash it in a washing machine with a mild detergent
a couple of times and let AIR DRY,
I cut 1 for the Tent and 1 for sleeping bags, in the cold
or damp weather you will thank Me for this advice.
boarstone
02-16-2010, 07:50
I just use one of those mylar emergency blakets...duel duty, footprint, sleep under the stars w/it under my sleeping bag, folded--use for seat,pillow... wrapped around sleeping bag--extra warmth, wind buffer, laid between fly and tent screen--extra warmth,.....etc, etc,..:)
Spot In The Sky
02-16-2010, 08:36
If you are worried about holes in the floor just buy your tent from REI.
I dont get it...does REI make awesome tents?
Big Dawg
02-16-2010, 10:41
I dont get it...does REI make awesome tents?
no, they have an unparalleled return policy for members.
cowboy nichols
02-16-2010, 11:01
I just use one of those mylar emergency blakets...duel duty, footprint, sleep under the stars w/it under my sleeping bag, folded--use for seat,pillow... wrapped around sleeping bag--extra warmth, wind buffer, laid between fly and tent screen--extra warmth,.....etc, etc,..:)
I've used one of these for years good for all of the above cheap & lite.