View Full Version : Are the too many "tourists" on the trail?
I've been wanting to hike the AT for years and it looks as though I can make it happen this summer. I have done many trips in Alaska, Utah and Colorado. I've had many encounters with bear and moose some too close. One including a bear charge two days into a solo backcountry trip in AK. but thats another story. I more or less live out of my backpack.I recently came across a video that makes me question my whole hike.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBnGe9HDGBI
Are these the kind of people you frequently encounter? I enjoy a great deal of time alone in the wilderness and was hoping this would be a nice escape from modern society. Is it or should I consider another option for summer?
Tourists, be it Denali NP or Shenandoah NP, are going to stick to places near the road. Go a mile or so past the TH, and there are significantly less people.
The AT is a wonderful trail full of beauty, many wonderful memories and full of wildness (as opposed to wilderness).
If you want a remote, wilderness experience, you may want to consider living out of your backpack in Alaska again. ;)
If you want something in the lower 48 with more solitude, consider the CDT, the Hayduke "Trail", the Idaho Centennial Trail and others. Or just grab some maps and make up your own route.
I never had a bear charge me..but I have charged beers on my debit card....
modiyooch
02-12-2010, 14:58
I've been wanting to hike the AT for years and it looks as though I can make it happen this summer. I have done many trips in Alaska, Utah and Colorado. I've had many encounters with bear and moose some too close. One including a bear charge two days into a solo backcountry trip in AK. but thats another story. I more or less live out of my backpack.I recently came across a video that makes me question my whole hike.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBnGe9HDGBI
Are these the kind of people you frequently encounter? I enjoy a great deal of time alone in the wilderness and was hoping this would be a nice escape from modern society. Is it or should I consider another option for summer?I would be ticked if I was the owner of this car. Did you hear the one lady ask "why doesn't someone honk their horn?"
"I never had a bear charge me..but I have charged beers on my debit card....":)
I've considered going back to AK. but to be honest the conditions can be a bit much at times. There are rarely ever trails and unless your above treeline your bushwacking through very dense brush walkng in soaking wet mosquito infested tundra. The choose your own adventure style traveling is nice but I've found I spend too much time planning trip logistics along the way.The appeal of the AT is really the relative ease of trail life it offers. Trails, freqent resupply points and not much planning after the start.There is a price for everything though. Glad I still have time to decide.
Mags,thanks for the tip on the ICT trail. I had not heard of it before. I traveled threw on my way to AK. and have wanted to return. I will certainly look into it.
SGT Rock
02-12-2010, 15:35
I've been wanting to hike the AT for years and it looks as though I can make it happen this summer. I have done many trips in Alaska, Utah and Colorado. I've had many encounters with bear and moose some too close. One including a bear charge two days into a solo backcountry trip in AK. but thats another story. I more or less live out of my backpack.I recently came across a video that makes me question my whole hike.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBnGe9HDGBI
Are these the kind of people you frequently encounter? I enjoy a great deal of time alone in the wilderness and was hoping this would be a nice escape from modern society. Is it or should I consider another option for summer?
Seriously, if you want to hike in the East, you might consider the BMT.
bigcranky
02-12-2010, 15:48
Frequently? No, only at major tourist centers like Newfound Gap in the Smokies. Once you get 500 yards down the trail, the tourists are gone.
Oh, and tourists are a good source of protein. No, you don't eat them, silly, you Yogi their food. Or a ride to town, whatever.
Funny but it got to the point on last years thru-hike that I could "smell" tourists way before I could see them. Shampoo and cologne scents are a dead give-away.
Don't ever let anyone tell you the olfactory acuity of AT thru's isn't greatly enhanced after being on the trail for a while.
........ and yes some will say it goes both ways.
DrRichardCranium
02-12-2010, 15:59
The last time I drove down to SNP for a few days backpacking, I stopped for lunch at a Subway. I made sure to eat in the Subway rather than in my car, to reduce food odors in the car. That video illustrates why.
A friend of mine was a backcountry ranger at Yosemite and on her way to work pick up breakfast for a friend. She left no food in the car but the bears must have still smelled the food that was once there. When she got back the soft top on her jeep was shred to pieces. It's hard to imagine their power of smell.
Spirit Walker
02-12-2010, 16:31
The term is 'touron' - combination of tourist and moron. Trouble is, people are used to animals in zoos or on television - safe and cute. They don't realize the danger. I've seen bear jams in Yellowstone and Glacier where people stopped their cars in the middle of the road, got out and took pictures, or chased a herd of buffalo to get a good photo. Then there's the guy who tried to put his toddler atop a buffalo to get a photo.
Tourists are a small part of a thruhike, which can be minimized by spending very little time where they congregate. OTOH, they can sometimes be a good food source for hikers as well as bears. The only time I got tired of hordes of tourists was in the Whites, where the same questions were asked over and over and over.
To repeat what Mags said, there are other trails that are more wild than the AT. The PCT is very easy to do without a lot of pre-planning. The CDT requires a bit more. The Hayduke and ICT require water and possibly food caches. You would probably like the Great Divide Trail in the Canadian Rockies.
JustaTouron
02-12-2010, 17:09
Funny but it got to the point on last years thru-hike that I could "smell" tourists way before I could see them. Shampoo and cologne scents are a dead give-away.
Don't ever let anyone tell you the olfactory acuity of AT thru's isn't greatly enhanced after being on the trail for a while.
Tourist could probably smell you before they could see you too. The lack of shampoo and soap was a dead give-away
Tourist could probably smell you before they could see you too. The lack of shampoo and soap was a dead give-away
hehehehehe
Toolshed
02-12-2010, 19:41
we're all tourists at some level. Where does the definition start and stop? I think the term you maybe need is "Tethered tourists".
aBRG2far
02-12-2010, 19:56
Why would one video of one of the busiest sites in the most visited National Park in the country put you off the entire trail? I certainly have no love for car tourist here but once you leave the road you leave them behind as well.
The important thing when you encounter a tourist, is not to turn your back.
Just back away slowly. Do not turn your back and run. This brings only out their competive consumer instincts. They will think there is a sale on and run right over you.
Rockhound
02-12-2010, 20:37
Of course there are hiker tourons as well. Last year there was a hiker purposefully leaving food out at night right outside shelters to bait bears so he could get a photo op. This guy also had a blowgun with a bayonet attached to it. Not what I would call essential gear.
fiddlehead
02-12-2010, 20:43
Are these the kind of people you frequently encounter? I enjoy a great deal of time alone in the wilderness and was hoping this would be a nice escape from modern society. Is it or should I consider another option for summer?
I think you should definitely consider some other hikes.
Or try just Maine or the northern portion of the long trail.
But western trails are much more what it sounds like you are looking for.
The AT is too close to hordes of people and who can blame them for wanting to be out in nature?
But, that video is a parking lot in a Nat. Park. I'm would guess you have similar things happening in Alaskan parking lots.
we're all tourists at some level. Where does the definition start and stop? I think the term you maybe need is "Tethered tourists".
I kind of like tourists when I meet them on the trail. A woman I met on Clingsmans Dome asked what I was doing while sitting on the abutment of the observation ramp.
I was tempted to tell her I was sitting on the abutment of the observation ramp. But I weakened. I told her I was walking home to Maine, she exclaimed. "Let me bow to you." and she did. Three times.
I was impresed. No one had ever bowed to me before. And to think three times in as many seconds. Not only that, she gave me a big box of cookies and a batch of candy bars. And guess what? Six months later a photo showed up at my house, showing me and a figure bowing to me. What an experience. What a memory. Even my wife was impressed. What's not to like about tourists?
Weary
I've been wanting to hike the AT for years and it looks as though I can make it happen this summer. I have done many trips in Alaska, Utah and Colorado. I've had many encounters with bear and moose some too close. One including a bear charge two days into a solo backcountry trip in AK. but thats another story. I more or less live out of my backpack.I recently came across a video that makes me question my whole hike.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBnGe9HDGBI
Are these the kind of people you frequently encounter? I enjoy a great deal of time alone in the wilderness and was hoping this would be a nice escape from modern society. Is it or should I consider another option for summer?
We are all tourists, so to speak, on the AT or any other trail. It's unnatural for civilized :rolleyes: folks to be out in the woods.
If you enjoy time alone, do a sobo, flip flop, inside out, HYOH sort of trip.
Oh, and bring your own SHELTER fer cryin' out loud!
You don't have much choice on who you meet while hiking, but you sure don't have to camp with them (except in the Smokies, I guess).
JustaTouron
02-12-2010, 22:24
The important thing when you encounter a tourist, is not to turn your back.
Just back away slowly. Do not turn your back and run. This brings only out their competive consumer instincts. They will think there is a sale on and run right over you.
More advice on what to do can be found in the "how to yogi" thread. It is easier to yogi tourists than other thru hikers.
I got to Clingman's dome before the road was open so there was no crowd there.
But it was definitely a shock to my system when after 3 weeks on the trail I came out of the woods at newfound gap to a parking lot crowded with people and literally a solid line of people heading up to the first shelter and another solid line coming back down. I couldn't wait to get past all those people, and I was very glad I didn't need to resupply and could just keep walking.
I also didn't like the portions of the trail near the Blue Ridge parkway where the trail was literally just a few feet off the road itself, with observation points and parking lots at frequent intervals...I felt sort of out of place there, though there weren't nearly as many people as there were at newfound gap.
But for the most part, get a mile in from the road and anybody you might encounter doesn't fall into the idiot tourist category...they are mostly idiots for other reasons.
I kind of like tourists when I meet them on the trail. A woman I met on Clingsmans Dome asked what I was doing while sitting on the abutment of the observation ramp.
I was tempted to tell her I was sitting on the abutment of the observation ramp. But I weakened. I told her I was walking home to Maine, she exclaimed. "Let me bow to you." and she did. Three times.
I was impresed. No one had ever bowed to me before. And to think three times in as many seconds. Not only that, she gave me a big box of cookies and a batch of candy bars. And guess what? Six months later a photo showed up at my house, showing me and a figure bowing to me. What an experience. What a memory. Even my wife was impressed. What's not to like about tourists?
Weary
i think its one of those situations where human nature kicks in and theres several bad apples that ruin the image of the bunch regardless of the group....politicians...actors...catholic priests...tourists......thru hikers...
what i find is it always comes down to that indivual person who chooses what side of that fence to sit on... the idiots who just sat there and had their children around.... or the people who was trying to get people to scare the bear away... an idiot is an idiot...no matter what group they are a part of
More advice on what to do can be found in the "how to yogi" thread. It is easier to yogi tourists than other thru hikers.If they leave food in their cars is it ok to break in their driver window and crawl in to get it? What if it turns out to be just food crumbs and wrappers and spilled milk on the seat cushions? Can we rip into those? :banana
garlic08
02-13-2010, 09:52
There is a huge difference between a tourist and a traveler. The mode of transportation, clothing, or amount of money in the pocket doesn't matter much.
Generally, at least in the eyes of the subject, a camera demotes you from a traveler into a tourist. The traveler wants to understand what he's seeing, the tourist just wants a photo.
I hiked from Phoenix to the Grand Canyon last spring, 300 miles along the Arizona Trail. When I got there, I saw a new phenomenon. I was sitting at a roadside overlook, and twice in succession saw a car pull up, a cell phone reached out the window, a photo snapped, and the car pulled away, in search of the next restroom or soda, leaving me shaking my head in uncomprehension. Now those were tourists.
I agree with most of what Garlic wrote...
However, I'd say that for some people, having a camera really let's them get into the landscape, the subject and the culture. I find when I frame a photo, I capture an aspect that appeals to me and try to show other people how I felt when that photo was taken.
Of course, that is just my half-ass excuse of why I take so many photos. ;)
(Beautiful sunny day...and I am off to an animal sanctuary. What you do for love on V-day weekend. :o)
RE: BMT
Concerning what Rock said about the BMT... Yeah, if you want to see the beauty of the East, that's a great trail to do. The southern Apps are wonderdful. Seeing it on the BMT? Even better. No markings in wilderness areas. Only to shelters on the trail itself and no people compared to the busier AT. Hook on to the Pinhoti Trail, and you have a 600+ mile jaunt on the East Coast. (Pinhoti Trail, the Cohos and the IAT are on my EAST COAST to-do list. Of course, I still want to do the Great Divide Trail. Sigh...)
The somewhat followable portion of Great Eastern Trail (http://www.greateasterntrail.net/) from I-64 in VA up to Addison NY would be over 600 miles. And even if you encounter hikers, they probably don't know they're on the GET. ;) Very unlikely to encounter "tourists" except maybe in a couple of the state parks you go through. Bad yogiing.
aBRG2far
02-13-2010, 21:25
By the way Clingmans Dome Rd won't open til May 28th this year because of repaving. So no tourist just hungry bears!
JustaTouron
02-13-2010, 21:57
There is a huge difference between a tourist and a traveler. The mode of transportation, clothing, or amount of money in the pocket doesn't matter much.
Generally, at least in the eyes of the subject, a camera demotes you from a traveler into a tourist. .
Wow! That might just be the most narrow minded definition ever.
You do realize the the majority of thru-hikers bring cameras with them.
By your definition Sir. Edmund Hillary was a tourist. (He brought a camera with him to the top of Mt. Everest.) But the last time I took my kids to an amusement park we were travelers (we had forgotten it at home.)
fiddlehead
02-13-2010, 22:33
“The traveler sees what he sees, the tourist sees what he has come to see" G.K. Chesterton
fiddlehead
02-13-2010, 22:34
“Tourists don't know where they've been, travelers don't know where they're going.” Paul Theroux
fiddlehead
02-13-2010, 22:36
“A good traveler has no fixed plans, and is not intent on arriving.” Lao Tzu
Thanks for all the good suggestions! There where a number of trails I've never heard of or considered. Everyone's response was helpful and did help alleviate some doubt. I know how crowded parks can be and yet their back country still offers solitude. As of now the AT is very,very high on my list of summer probabilties.
Gator 65
02-14-2010, 13:12
Believe me, you will have plenty of isolation and wilderness on the AT. GA,NC, TENN. and VA will be mostly wild. By the time you hit Pa., NJ., NY who will welcome the chance to drop your pack and walk 1/4 mile down the road to a covenience store for a "ready made" dinner and a cold beer.
NH and Maine are also wild and in my humble opinion, the most beutiful part of the trail as well as the most challenging, but it makes for a great ending to scale Mt. Katahdin after 6 months of seeing a part our great country that 98% of oor population will never see. When you do come across tourists, they will stare at you and ask you why you are doing the hike. It is obvious to us why we hike and sad that others do not appreciate the joy of hiking. My experience at Clingsman Dome was getting off the trail just prior to a 10 " snow fall that shut down Newfound gap and stuck us all in Gatlinburg for 3 days. I asked a tourist to take my picture in front of the Clingsman dome sign. He thought I was a homeless person because of my appearanceafter 7 days on the trail getting through the Smokies.
Jester2000
02-14-2010, 14:28
There is a huge difference between a tourist and a traveler. The mode of transportation, clothing, or amount of money in the pocket doesn't matter much.
Generally, at least in the eyes of the subject, a camera demotes you from a traveler into a tourist. The traveler wants to understand what he's seeing, the tourist just wants a photo.
That's incredibly silly.
Sometimes I'm a tourist; sometimes a travelor; sometimes a hybrid. Being a bit of a fraud, sometimes when I'm in tourist mode, I pretend to be a travelor.
Weary
.....NH and Maine are also wild and in my humble opinion, the most beutiful part of the trail as well as the most challenging, but it makes for a great ending to scale Mt. Katahdin after 6 months of seeing a part our great country that 98% of oor population will never see.
....
Maine is far wilder than many folks give us credit. The last count I saw showed that only about 12,000 people lived in the half of Maine (10 million acres) with no muninicpal governments.
Even if you add in the populations of border communities -- all tiny towns --- Rangeley, Stratton, Monson, Brownville, Allagash, Greenville and such, the total probably comes to less than 25,000.
I was at gathering last week where the speaker showed a nighttime satellite photo of continental United States. Not even the west had such a vast area with no lights as did northwestern Maine.
Some of us are in a continuing-- and often losing -- struggle to keep Maine wild. Groups like AMC, the Nature Conservancy, and our Maine Appalachian Trail Land Trust, help around the fringes. But now that the paper companies have sold almost all their lands to developers, I despair for the future.
The best hope for preserving Maine's wildness seems to me to be a big (3 million acres at least) Maine Woods National Park, with most of it managed as a designated federal wilderness.
Weary www.matlt.org
garlic08
02-14-2010, 19:08
Generally, at least in the eyes of the subject, a camera demotes you from a traveler into a tourist.
However, I'd say that for some people, having a camera really let's them get into the landscape, the subject and the culture. I find when I frame a photo, I capture an aspect that appeals to me and try to show other people how I felt when that photo was taken.
Wow! That might just be the most narrow minded definition ever.
That's incredibly silly.
You guys are right, it was a stupid thing to write, especially on a forum where nearly everyone uses a camera and sometimes very well. My judgement was clouded by a few experiences, mainly in developing countries, where I've seen the interpersonal dynamic change for the worse when the camera comes out. I know photography can be a very powerful tool, especially when the photographer respects and works with the subject. I enjoy National Geographic magazine, too. My apologies.
“The traveler sees what he sees, the tourist sees what he has come to see" G.K. Chesterton
I think this sums it up best, but usually I leave the camera behind to make sure. :D
My apologies.
Hey..it's all good. If I had to apologize for every bone-headed thing I wrote..well,I'd still be writing my apologies list! :D
Powder River
02-20-2010, 00:59
Yeah you'll meet the best of them at Clingman's Dome. I'll never forget the day I came out of the woods at the base of that god-awful tower, only to hear an overweight woman who had just hiked the .5 miles from the parking lot exclaim, "THIS THING COULD USE AN ESCALATOR!"
Jester2000
02-20-2010, 01:16
In all fairness, it really could use an escalator.
berkshirebirder
02-20-2010, 06:56
The AT is too close to hordes of people, and who can blame them for wanting to be out in nature?
The Trail was created for these people. Some of them, especially the children, may be inspired by the bit of Trail they see and eventually become hikers.
“Tourists don't know where they've been, travelers don't know where they're going.” Paul Theroux
Paul Theroux is a genius.
I would hate for him to write anything about me, though.
Hikers should count their blessings he has never written about them on the Trail. Readers should feel the loss.
The Trail was created for these people. Some of them, especially the children, may be inspired by the bit of Trail they see and eventually become hikers.
Maybe even trail maintainers and financial supporters. I suspect most of us began as tourists, and gradually progressed to being snobs.
rainmaker
02-20-2010, 22:47
Maine is far wilder than many folks give us credit. The last count I saw showed that only about 12,000 people lived in the half of Maine (10 million acres) with no muninicpal governments.
Even if you add in the populations of border communities -- all tiny towns --- Rangeley, Stratton, Monson, Brownville, Allagash, Greenville and such, the total probably comes to less than 25,000.
I was at gathering last week where the speaker showed a nighttime satellite photo of continental United States. Not even the west had such a vast area with no lights as did northwestern Maine.
Some of us are in a continuing-- and often losing -- struggle to keep Maine wild. Groups like AMC, the Nature Conservancy, and our Maine Appalachian Trail Land Trust, help around the fringes. But now that the paper companies have sold almost all their lands to developers, I despair for the future.
The best hope for preserving Maine's wildness seems to me to be a big (3 million acres at least) Maine Woods National Park, with most of it managed as a designated federal wilderness.
Weary www.matlt.org
I certainly agree. Because of an orthopedic procedure on Madame's right knee, we weren't able to get in our section hike of Mass. and Vermont last year so we decided to spend three weeks in Maine. It was truly stupendous and gave us profound respect for the hardy souls who live in the back country. Then there was that wonderful highway we took from just outside Baxter to Greenville. We'll never forget it.