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Treefingers
02-26-2010, 18:27
i just received the BM Gear Guide for spring, and upon flipping through the pages i saw no articles about some of these cottage companies such as tarptent, SMD, Gossamer Gear, ULA packs etc. that are redefining the way most of us backpack. Im not suggesting that BM should only be reviewing these companies great cutting edge products, im suggesting that they shouldnt be putting out these issues that are completely sold out to the multi million dollar companies that are essentially paying the writers of BM to glorify their products that they plan on making the most money off of. I have been a subscriber for a long time and the publication is consitently going down hill in terms of there informative articles and product reviews. i am not planning on renewing my subscription again and i am highly dissapointed that this rag is full of Eddie bauer advertisements and other products that have been trumped long ago but some of these great cottage companies that are fueling the advancement of our sport.

10-K
02-26-2010, 18:53
Hasn't it always been like that?

Egads
02-26-2010, 19:47
They know butters their bread...the advertisers:-?

Toolshed
02-26-2010, 19:52
i just received the BM Gear Guide for spring, and upon flipping through the pages i saw no articles about some of these cottage companies such as tarptent, SMD, Gossamer Gear, ULA packs etc. that are redefining the way most of us backpack. Im not suggesting that BM should only be reviewing these companies great cutting edge products, im suggesting that they shouldn't be putting out these issues that are completely sold out to the multi million dollar companies that are essentially paying the writers of BM to glorify their products that they plan on making the most money off of. I have been a subscriber for a long time and the publication is consitently going down hill in terms of there informative articles and product reviews. i am not planning on renewing my subscription again and i am highly dissapointed that this rag is full of Eddie bauer advertisements and other products that have been trumped long ago but some of these great cottage companies that are fueling the advancement of our sport.
here's my take - You and your cottage industry supporting buddies probably make up less than 1/2 of 1% of the backpack buying public and your spends probably total much less than that. Most Cottage industries don't set out to become market leaders but to experiment with their ideas & designs and eke out a living doing something they love, giving back to the community and getting by via word of mouth. Granted Tarptent designs are now starting to appear more like regular tents as more and more folks try them and make mention of the additional bells and whistle they would desire.
However, there is no need for a cottage industry mfr to advertise in a rag that doesn't focus on long distance hiking, but rather weekender hiking for the masses with disposable income to buy lots of gadgets and such.

I, too, am again disappointed by the magazine. I noticed all the ads in the back this year and thought what a total waste of time to read this. Fortunately it is relegated to the bathroom there to enchant all who enter, or provide additional wiping material when we run short on TP.

It seems the new owner is more intent on increasing ad revenue even more-so than Rodale was, although I think Rodale also increased ad space when they took over from some other company and then before that a large publishing company like Time Warner or NBC had it for a few years.
As for editors, I like Jonathan Dorn and I think he is a local guy, but I liked when John Viehman was the editor. I liked the older editions from the 80's - I couldn't wait back then to get each issue. I bought out the first 10 years of magazines when they came up at a local sale to supplement my collection, however, as of the mid 2000's, I have stopped collecting them and now just recycle them. The older issues had great articles. The newer editions seem to be fluff pieces.

trailangelbronco
02-26-2010, 19:59
Magazines always feature companies who spend tons of advertising dollars with them. They pretty much have to in order to keep them as customers and stay in business.

Fortunately, I take my gear advice from Thru Hikers, not magazine writers.

John B
02-26-2010, 20:24
I enjoy the magazine in the same way that I like to thumb through "Sky" magazine when I fly Delta -- they show lots of stuff that I could never afford and really don't want. Still, I like looking at it.

But what really struck me about the "editor's choice" products are:
(1) how heavy most things were in comparison to the stuff I typically see when hiking. One example is the Arc'teryx packs at close to 5 lbs. Another example is 3 lbs. boots (I don't believe they gave any awards to trail running shoes).
(2) how expensive their 'choice' award products are. Arc'teryx takes the cake again, with packs nearly $400. Most of the packs I see when hiking are REI, Osprey, Gregory, and Kelty, all of which are about half the price.
(3) how rarely I see their 'editor choice' picks on the trail. Maybe Arc'teryx is popular out west, but I only recall a handful of people carrying them down south.

Also, their "essentials" list seems odd. 1 lbs 4 oz "camp booties"; a 15 ounce first-aid kit; and a 3 ounce, $160 titanium flask, to name but a few that caught my attention.

Even the food they recommend is expensive and heavy. All that said, I'll still subscribe.

Note: I thought the ad they had on p. 141 wasn't exactly suitable for a mag that little kids probably look through.

Praha4
02-26-2010, 20:29
ditto, I've tried a lot of 2009's "Editor's Choice Award" items, and I would say only a few of those items were worth buying, I had to return most of them that I tried. They did at least pick the Tarptent Contrail as a top ultralight solo shelter in 2009.

It's all marketing.....the advertisers that buy the most space in the magazine that get the top picks, again this year, and we all know those names. I glanced thru the 2010 Editors choice awards and again they go with those same names.

To try to be fair, I think BM seems to be ranking gear, clothing, boots and equipment that is more appealing to the alpine sports and winter skiiing crowds, than gear that suits hikers on the wet, muddy AT in the eastern mountains.

BM's editors are trying to appeal to the latte' drinking yuppie skiiers who drive BMWs and spend their days on the slopes and nites sitting in front of the fireplace at the lodge ....BM has made a marketing decision that the crowd has more $$$ to spend on gear than bums like us who cook with homemade alchohol stoves and hike the AT.

now I know there's some AT hikers out there with BMWs who will take offense, no offense intended! :)

Seeker
02-26-2010, 20:59
Hasn't it always been like that?

every year, like groundhog day... same thread, same discussion... i quit my subscription over it the first time i realized what they were doing... Western Mountaineering bags weren't featured at all (since they didn't advertise) in that issue. that sorta clinched it for me.

Not Sunshine
02-26-2010, 21:24
isn't this exactly the reason we have WB???

i've learned about 95% of what i know about gear from asking WB'ers. not from anything written in Backpacker. I did, however, get a great recipe for wasabi salmon taters from a BP mag though:

mix in some wasabi powder with the instant spuds, then mix in 1 package salmon and sprinkle on Parmesan cheese. really is simple, but i wouldn't have come up with it on my own. delish.

JustaTouron
02-26-2010, 21:29
I challenge you to find one item in that entire magazine made by a company that doesn't advertise with the magazine.

In the three years I subscribed to it (many moons ago) there was not one.

Roche
02-26-2010, 21:39
Shhhhhhh. When more folks realize they can hike faster, further and have fun the AT could look like the NJ Turnpike.

white_russian
02-26-2010, 22:05
I challenge you to find one item in that entire magazine made by a company that doesn't advertise with the magazine.

In the three years I subscribed to it (many moons ago) there was not one.
That is why the Backpacker subscription is only $12.

Consumer reports is $29 and that is for mainstream products.

Even backpackinglight isn't exactly impartial since they sell products themselves and that is $25 (not to mention that they cater to the OCD and occasionally have off topic whims like packrafting).

WILLIAM HAYES
02-26-2010, 22:19
somebody gave me a subscription as a gift this is the only way I would read it--I seldom see any of the Editor Choice gear on the trail most of the gear advertised requires a mule to carry it

Lyle
02-26-2010, 22:36
Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. Bill Kemsley was the founder and publisher of Backpacker for many years starting in 1973. In 1980 I had the honor and pleasure of meeting and hiking with Bill for a couple of days in the Weminuche Wilderness in Colorado. Fantastic guy who put out a superb magazine. Alas, now it is just another mass-produced advertising medium. Here's a very brief history of the beginnings:

http://www.outdoors.org/publications/appalachia/2007/1970s-backpacking-boom.cfm

Anyone else remember "Wilderness Camping" another good outdoor magazine of the 70's and 80's?

http://cgi.ebay.com/WILDERNESS-CAMPING-Magazine-September-1979-Nice_W0QQitemZ390134621380QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_De faultDomain_0?hash=item5ad5d5e4c4


There was one more, was it called "Backpacking Journal", or something like that? It was good, but Backpacker was by far the best - Fantastic photographs, they kept the cover free of all printing other than the name, so as not to hide the cover photo.

1970's were the heyday of backpacking.

Dogwood
02-26-2010, 22:59
There exists much negative sentiment towards BP for their annual Gear Review Guide and the mag in general here on WB.

The mag is trying to appeal to wide spectrum of readers. Not all readers who might peruse the mag or articles are ULers or long distance hikers. Perhaps, more of this segment of the outdoors and hiking market would read the mag more if more focus was put on articles and gear relating to this segment of the outdoor community. BUT, per say the mag is not aimed at one smallish segment of hiking readership. However, I have noticed Henry Shires Tarptents, ULA gear, and Gossamer Gear named in articles in BP, and most certainly at the BP Gear Forum disscussions. I have also noticed GoLite and Western Mountaineering gear mentioned in articles.

And, let us not forget not all people use the same gear or agree on the same hiking philosophies or do the same type of hikes. Still, most hikers are incorporating at least some conventional wt gear in their hiking and outdoor adventures.

Since I'm an ULer who purchases much gear from UL cottage industry gear manufacturers, yes, I would also like to see more UL and long distance hiking related articles, gear reviews aimed at ULers and long distance hikers, and advertising(this takes money though, and some cottage gear manufacturers don't feel the desire to get too big and don't have big advertising budgets). BUT again, I also realize this is a very small, but perhaps growing, segment of the hiking and outdoor community. In some regards it's still fringe.

I recently did notice a multiple page spread describing thru-hiking the three N-S long distance trails - AT, PCT, and CDT. It included fold out maps of each trail. I thought that was nicely done!

In most for profit publications, especially daily, weekly, and as in the case of BP, monthly, it would be naive to assume avertising does not play a role in the financial solvency of the mag, sometimes so signicantly that some publications survive off advertising. Sometimes, advertising makes the difference between a profitable venture and one that wouldn't exist. I would also think accounting, public relations, marketing, and publisher politics play a role too.

In the end, I think it accurate to state, BP is not exactly a trail blazer when advertising or submitting articles for long distance or UL hiking. So what? It's not just solely aimed at that readership. From a readership perspective take it for what it is - a general magazine on backpacking!

Personally, even though I'm an ULer, purchaser of UL gear, and long distance hiker I'm still going to read BP and take from it what I can, which IMO is still more significant than having NO BP!

bigcranky
02-26-2010, 23:03
Didn't Backpacker pick a ULA P-2 pack as one of their editor's choices a few years ago? And the Contrail last year?

FamilyGuy
02-27-2010, 00:12
Yes and actually, they also had the top ultralight a couple of years ago as the Six Moon Designs Wild Oasis. Previous years have seen the Squall, Double Rainbow, Lunar Solo, Lunar Duo....

The fact is - these tried and true designs are developed with a lot of input from you, the user and when they hit the market, they change very little over the years. They are that good. But new products from other mainstream manufacturers come out every year. The Gear Guide is not an annual comparison of what is available but instead a compilation of what is new to the market or alternatively, new to the magazine.

Dogwood
02-27-2010, 00:27
Yes, Family Guy and Big Cranky you are right. I forgot about the SMD rec as Top Ul too. Some good pts to consider when reading the annual gear reviews made by FamilyGuy.

The top Ul gear categories are not solely based on what is the lightest wt either! BP may have different considerations or rated priorities when they make their gear picks than you or myself in different gear categories.

jesse
02-27-2010, 00:36
Eddie Bauer doesn't make outdoor gear. They're more into fashion.

Wags
02-27-2010, 01:24
i'm glad the cottage manufacturers aren't in it. otherwise it'd take 3x as long to get my gear and it'd likely be done by someone other than the owner of the company. :D

Fiddleback
02-27-2010, 12:32
Eddie Bauer doesn't make outdoor gear. They're more into fashion.

Supposedly, EB is changing...we shall see.

As for BP, they publish to make a profit. Profit or not, I'm sure most revenue comes from their advertisers so it's no surprise that BP; 1) has lots of advertisements and, 2) BP's content comments on the gear advertised. We are all capable of understanding, or should be, that that content will be at best even handed and likely favorable towards those that advertise. Whether it should be that way or not, that is the way it is with all periodicals that accept advertisements. IMO.

I view BP as an entry-level magazine that has a pretty low subscription rate. I think it's fair value, especially compared to their competitors (can you name three?). I don't get much out of it but I do get some. One of my favorite pieces of gear I learned about from their mini-column reviewing their writers' favorite pieces of gear.:)

Cottage industry? I wish. A few years ago I signed up to respond to online surveys about the magazine's content and plans. It's not been much of a 'panel' but it did have one good feature...it always provided space for additional comments. And I always asked for more coverage of the backpacking cottage industry. As we all know, not much has been seen on the subject. Not surprisingly, those in the cottage industry don't seem to do much advertising either.

Funny...I don't get those survey requests very often anymore.:-?

FB

Feral Bill
02-27-2010, 13:25
Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. Bill Kemsley was the founder and publisher of Backpacker for many years starting in 1973. In 1980 I had the honor and pleasure of meeting and hiking with Bill for a couple of days in the Weminuche Wilderness in Colorado. Fantastic guy who put out a superb magazine. Alas, now it is just another mass-produced advertising medium. Here's a very brief history of the beginnings:

1970's were the heyday of backpacking.


Just for the record, Backpacker went through several owners before landing at Rodale Press. Also, Bill Kemsly has a new backpacking book with some rather different ideas that is definintly worth a read.

FB

Lyle
02-27-2010, 13:31
Just for the record, Backpacker went through several owners before landing at Rodale Press. Also, Bill Kemsly has a new backpacking book with some rather different ideas that is definintly worth a read.

FB

You probably are correct in this. I stand corrected. I do remember now that Backpacker did a major slide for several years, and did improve somewhat after Rodale bought them. Bill was also one of the founders of AHS.

skinewmexico
02-27-2010, 13:50
i'm glad the cottage manufacturers aren't in it. otherwise it'd take 3x as long to get my gear and it'd likely be done by someone other than the owner of the company. :D

Amen brother

Tipi Walter
02-27-2010, 13:56
The BP Magazine Gear Guide issue is fun to take out on a backpacking trip and read thru and burn page by page. In addition, tent catalogs are very excellent things to take out on a backpacking trip and burn page by page. Why tent catalogs? Cuz we all live in our tents, or at least we should(if you're a tarpist or a hammocker:rolleyes:)

There's nothing quite like sitting in a tent during a snowstorm and reading thru a tent catalog. It must just be me.

FamilyGuy
02-27-2010, 16:18
There's nothing quite like sitting in a tent during a snowstorm and reading thru a tent catalog. It must just be me.

There's nothing quite like sitting in a warm house by a roaring fire during a snowstorm and watching Olympic Hockey. It must just be me.
:D

Kerosene
02-27-2010, 19:12
There's nothing quite like sitting in a tent during a snowstorm and reading thru a tent catalog. It must just be me.Or perhaps you've been sitting in tents during extended snowstorms for too long? Just sayin'. ;)

winger
02-27-2010, 19:51
BP magazine is like the MAD magazine of comedy, entertaining but little else. I enjoy hanging in my hammock and well, not reading those rags, maybe Tolkien or Kurzweil instead....

Tipi Walter
02-27-2010, 22:04
BP magazine is like the MAD magazine of comedy, entertaining but little else. I enjoy hanging in my hammock and well, not reading those rags, maybe Tolkien or Kurzweil instead....

But do you burn your Tolkien and thus lighten your load?

skinewmexico
02-28-2010, 00:32
There's nothing quite like sitting in a warm house by a roaring fire during a snowstorm and watching Olympic Hockey. It must just be me.:D

Unless Canada wins.

FamilyGuy
02-28-2010, 00:38
Unless Canada wins.

Grrrrrrr.....

Toolshed
02-28-2010, 09:29
Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. ....

Kelmsley sold to Ziff Davis
Ziff Davis sold to CBS
CBS sold to Rodale
Rodale sold it to Actives Interest Media

Franco
03-03-2010, 18:11
This comment from Tin Man (AntiGravityGear) made me think of this thread :
"About that time, there was an article about alcohol stoves in Backpacker Magazine and I decided to send one in to the gear editor because I thought mine was superior to the ones I read about. There was extra room in the shipping box so in went a pot cozy. They were not at all interested in the alcohol stove but really loved the pot cozy. Next thing I knew they had awarded the Editors’ Choice Award of 2003 to AGG for the pot cozy and that was when the company really took off"

from
http://www.hikinginfinland.com/2010/03/interview-george-andrews-of.html (http://www.hikinginfinland.com/2010/03/interview-george-andrews-of.html)
Franco

the goat
03-03-2010, 18:42
backpacker is mostly worthless.

i say "mostly" because they quoted me in an article a couple of years ago, that little snippet was priceless, invaluable insight.

mykl
03-03-2010, 20:26
I just picked up the new 2010 BP Guide....I wasted $5.99. Its very limited on what they review, especially tents, stoves and sleeping pads. I found the advertisements got my interest better than the actual reviews.
I haven't seen one of these in years, I use to enjoy them, and still have the old ones (2005 was the last I got). The new one won't make it into the bathroom, where it belongs, not on the trail. For that I prefer Heavy Metal Magazine (the graphic, adult fantasy one), and good old Mad for a larf for in the tent/by the fire.

Toolshed
03-03-2010, 20:32
This comment from Tin Man (AntiGravityGear) made me think of this thread :
"About that time, there was an article about alcohol stoves in Backpacker Magazine and I decided to send one in to the gear editor because I thought mine was superior to the ones I read about. There was extra room in the shipping box so in went a pot cozy. They were not at all interested in the alcohol stove but really loved the pot cozy. Next thing I knew they had awarded the Editors’ Choice Award of 2003 to AGG for the pot cozy and that was when the company really took off"

from
http://www.hikinginfinland.com/2010/03/interview-george-andrews-of.html (http://www.hikinginfinland.com/2010/03/interview-george-andrews-of.html)
Franco
...and that cracks me up, considering pot cozies were around for at least 18 years (and probably more.) Back then others were making them out of blue foam and I was making them outta duct tape and reflectix. and the idea was passed down to me from another old-timer winter climber....

Red River Falls
03-03-2010, 20:42
It looks like Eddie Bauer's First Ascent gear is a legitimate attempt to bring some quality gear to the market. I'm no expert but I think they needed to do something, and some of the stuff looks good with a bit of innovation here or there.

As for Backpacker, obviously it is a business, but I do enjoy much of what is in there. I like seeing the gear issue just to see more of what is out there. There is enough in the magazine that interests me to subscribe for now. Of course, I am, comparatively, a novice hiker.

sbennett
03-03-2010, 21:04
It looks like Eddie Bauer's First Ascent gear is a legitimate attempt to bring some quality gear to the market. I'm no expert but I think they needed to do something, and some of the stuff looks good with a bit of innovation here or there.

As for Backpacker, obviously it is a business, but I do enjoy much of what is in there. I like seeing the gear issue just to see more of what is out there. There is enough in the magazine that interests me to subscribe for now. Of course, I am, comparatively, a novice hiker.

The First Ascent stuff is actually pretty nice. They had the whole line at the RMI shop outside of Rainier when I was there last summer. Seemed pretty comparable to everything else on the market. I think a bunch of big time climbers wore it to the top of Everest last year and all the guides at RMI use it (probably forced to but still).

skinewmexico
03-03-2010, 21:52
Good review on the EB down jacket on BPL today.

Franco
03-03-2010, 21:58
Apparently tea cozies have been around since 1867...

To me the peculiar point was that in spite of the fact that Backpackers is very much "mainstream" and not that useful for the people here, it was responsible for the big launch of an otherwise very niche cottage manufacturer brand,
possibly one that did not buy full page ads in that or any other edition.
Franco

Jonnycat
03-04-2010, 17:59
Welcome to magazine publishing in the 21st century - of, by, and for advertising.

Cookerhiker
03-04-2010, 18:12
Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. Bill Kemsley was the founder and publisher of Backpacker for many years starting in 1973. In 1980 I had the honor and pleasure of meeting and hiking with Bill for a couple of days in the Weminuche Wilderness in Colorado. Fantastic guy who put out a superb magazine. Alas, now it is just another mass-produced advertising medium. Here's a very brief history of the beginnings:

http://www.outdoors.org/publications/appalachia/2007/1970s-backpacking-boom.cfm

Anyone else remember "Wilderness Camping" another good outdoor magazine of the 70's and 80's?

http://cgi.ebay.com/WILDERNESS-CAMPING-Magazine-September-1979-Nice_W0QQitemZ390134621380QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_De faultDomain_0?hash=item5ad5d5e4c4


There was one more, was it called "Backpacking Journal", or something like that? It was good, but Backpacker was by far the best - Fantastic photographs, they kept the cover free of all printing other than the name, so as not to hide the cover photo.

1970's were the heyday of backpacking.


Just for the record, Backpacker went through several owners before landing at Rodale Press. Also, Bill Kemsly has a new backpacking book with some rather different ideas that is definintly worth a read.

FB


You probably are correct in this. I stand corrected. I do remember now that Backpacker did a major slide for several years, and did improve somewhat after Rodale bought them. Bill was also one of the founders of AHS.


Kelmsley sold to Ziff Davis
Ziff Davis sold to CBS
CBS sold to Rodale
Rodale sold it to Actives Interest Media

In the 70s and early 80s, I subscribed to both Backpacker and Wilderness Camping. I remember when they were both sold at the same time to Ziff-Davis and Bill Kelmsley's final column explaining how he and Fitz???, the WC owner, couldn't make it by themselves anymore. I cancelled right away knowing that a generalist, non-outdoorsy owner could never produce as good a magazine. Supposedly Kelmsley was staying on in some capacity but not sure that happened.

John Viehman
03-06-2010, 11:46
Actually, you missed an owner in this sequence. CBS sold Backpacker to Diamandis Communications Inc. (DCI), which then sold it to Rodale in 1988. The first issue published by Rodale was March of that year. It improved dramatically from that point forward, of course, and has numerous National Magazine Awards to its credit.... ;-)
John


Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. ....

Kelmsley sold to Ziff Davis
Ziff Davis sold to CBS
CBS sold to Rodale
Rodale sold it to Actives Interest Media

Wise Old Owl
03-07-2010, 12:28
I challenge you to find one item in that entire magazine made by a company that doesn't advertise with the magazine.

In the three years I subscribed to it (many moons ago) there was not one.

no sense in looking, they are running a big business. Love the website, its a weath of trail information.

Furlough
03-07-2010, 13:31
Note: I thought the ad they had on p. 141 wasn't exactly suitable for a mag that little kids probably look through.
Funny, I thought it was the best part of the magazine. :)

WalkSoftly33
03-07-2010, 19:04
While they are not in featured articles in the most recent Backpacker Magazine Editors Choice Awards, a good number of cottage manufactures were included in the spreadsheets at the end of the sections for Tents, Bags etc.

There Top prducts with weights and comments on a few were in there. MLD, GG, ULA, TT, the only one that I noticed missing was SMD. (I know there are others but im talk about the "main stream cottage guys" Haha)

While they werent fetured they are in the magazine you just have to look real close at the fine print in the spreadsheets.

WalkSoftly33
03-07-2010, 19:04
While they are not in featured articles in the most recent Backpacker Magazine Editors Choice Awards, a good number of cottage manufactures were included in the spreadsheets at the end of the sections for Tents, Bags etc.

There Top prducts with weights and comments on a few were in there. MLD, GG, ULA, TT, the only one that I noticed missing was SMD. (I know there are others but im talk about the "main stream cottage guys" Haha)

While they werent fetured they are in the magazine you just have to look real close at the fine print in the spreadsheets.

dont know if that was all ready said in this post I didnt read all the way through, sry if it is a repeat of info.

Tin Man
03-07-2010, 19:20
backpacker is mostly worthless.

i say "mostly" because they quoted me in an article a couple of years ago, that little snippet was priceless, invaluable insight.

ok, we'll go with 100% worthless. jk :D

a scout dad told me today his son got backpacker for christmas and now NEEDS a $240 pack... i just smiled

Jester2000
03-07-2010, 20:05
Nice to see the annual Backpacker Magazine bitchfest off to a fine start.

Here's a question:
In the tiny, tiny world of UL "I can make my own stove/tarp/backpack/hammock lighter/cheaper/better than the manufacturers," how come none of the people who annually complain about Backpacker have started their own magazine?

What's up with that? Or in this case is it more fun to complain?

Tuckahoe
03-07-2010, 21:16
Until this thread, I had not heard of Backpacker Magazine. Either that, or I had and just did not pay attention. Regardless, I went over to their website and signed up for a free issue... I'll get to see what all the angst is about.

One question though. How many of the small time manufacturers or cottage industry types could really survive and actually meet the demand if they were suddenly made well known in a national publication?

double d
03-08-2010, 02:14
Actually, you missed an owner in this sequence. CBS sold Backpacker to Diamandis Communications Inc. (DCI), which then sold it to Rodale in 1988. The first issue published by Rodale was March of that year. It improved dramatically from that point forward, of course, and has numerous National Magazine Awards to its credit.... ;-)
John


Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. ....

Kelmsley sold to Ziff Davis
Ziff Davis sold to CBS
CBS sold to Rodale
Rodale sold it to Actives Interest Media
John, loved your Trailsides TV show on PBS back in the 1990's. And I believe you were the editor of BP back during that time.

Toolshed
03-08-2010, 07:57
Actually, you missed an owner in this sequence. CBS sold Backpacker to Diamandis Communications Inc. (DCI), which then sold it to Rodale in 1988. The first issue published by Rodale was March of that year. It improved dramatically from that point forward, of course, and has numerous National Magazine Awards to its credit.... ;-)
John


Backpacker Magazine has gone downhill steadily since the 1980's when Bill Kemsley, Jr. sold out to Rodale. ....

Kelmsley sold to Ziff Davis
Ziff Davis sold to CBS
CBS sold to Rodale
Rodale sold it to Actives Interest Media
I hope this is the real John Viehman - The one of Trailside Series, and the previous EIC of Backpacker, and not a spoof, if it is, it is a pleasure to meet you online!!

mrc237
03-08-2010, 10:26
WB and BP have alot in common! SOS!!!

Two Speed
03-08-2010, 12:53
I view Backpacker the same way as tabloid newspapers.

I'll read the National Enquirer if a copy is laying around but ain't no way in hell I'm shelling out MY coin for it.

Disney
03-08-2010, 13:33
Nice to see the annual Backpacker Magazine bitchfest off to a fine start.

Here's a question:
In the tiny, tiny world of UL "I can make my own stove/tarp/backpack/hammock lighter/cheaper/better than the manufacturers," how come none of the people who annually complain about Backpacker have started their own magazine?

What's up with that? Or in this case is it more fun to complain?


Well of course it's more fun to complain, easier too.

I've notice that you are increasingly making these kind of observations, which, while technically correct, lack the irreverent humor that you have become known for. I don't know what is driving this shift towards seriousness, but I don't like it. You need to step it up, or return the name Jester so that it can be issued to someone else.

Jester2000
03-08-2010, 14:43
Well of course it's more fun to complain, easier too.

I've notice that you are increasingly making these kind of observations, which, while technically correct, lack the irreverent humor that you have become known for. I don't know what is driving this shift towards seriousness, but I don't like it. You need to step it up, or return the name Jester so that it can be issued to someone else.

It's my advertisers. They're steering me in a direction that runs counter to what everyone else is demanding.

Johnny Thunder
03-08-2010, 15:30
It's my advertisers. They're steering me in a direction that runs counter to what everyone else is demanding.

Your loyal advertisers at THE NEW BAR politely request that you recommence the dick and fart jokes.

John Viehman
03-09-2010, 07:44
I hope this is the real John Viehman - The one of Trailside Series, and the previous EIC of Backpacker, and not a spoof, if it is, it is a pleasure to meet you online!!

I would be the one. Pleasure to meet you as well, Toolshed.
John

John Viehman
03-09-2010, 07:50
John, loved your Trailsides TV show on PBS back in the 1990's. And I believe you were the editor of BP back during that time.


Yep... I was the Editor of BP then, shifted my role somewhat and became Editorial Director while I developed Trailside and then a second series, "Anyplace Wild," eventually slid into the Publisher slot for a spell. It was a nice ride...

Symbol
03-09-2010, 09:30
This 2 person Big Agnes tent got a Editor's Choice award this year...

http://www.bigagnes.com/Products/Detail/Tent/FlyCreekUL2

Not for the solo hiker but at 2 lbs 2 oz (trail weight) or 2 lbs 10 ozs (packed wieght) it is a pretty freaking light 2 person tent.

At $350 you may need a mortgage though....

DAJA
03-09-2010, 09:42
This 2 person Big Agnes tent got a Editor's Choice award this year...

http://www.bigagnes.com/Products/Detail/Tent/FlyCreekUL2

Not for the solo hiker but at 2 lbs 2 oz (trail weight) or 2 lbs 10 ozs (packed wieght) it is a pretty freaking light 2 person tent.

At $350 you may need a mortgage though....

It's comparable to other options of similar weight. Especially considering it is a double wall free standing tent including poles.. Look at Big Sky, SMD Lunar Duo, or various Tarp Tents which are all single wall or hybrids, leading to condensation and stability issues, so comparitively, it is in the range of reason... Problem is the limited interior space due to being a modified A frame, and single door make it somewhat less appealing than double door/vestibules tents like the Evolution 2p or Double Rainbow..

I'd still take a double wall anyday over a single wall for a North East climate... But I'd want double doors and more interior space... Still it's a good contender...

Lyle
03-09-2010, 10:11
John,

Met you and ate a meal with you at one of AHS's meetings at the Hilltop House and KOA in HF. I am a very good friend of Butch's, so was there for her retirement.

No offense meant personally about Backpacker, but it wasn't the same magazine once it joined the corporate magazine owners. I did enjoy your Trailside and Anyplace Wild series. In fact, I have some of them on DVD. Good to see you here on WB.

double d
03-09-2010, 10:32
Yep... I was the Editor of BP then, shifted my role somewhat and became Editorial Director while I developed Trailside and then a second series, "Anyplace Wild," eventually slid into the Publisher slot for a spell. It was a nice ride...
Trailside and Anyplace Wild were great shows, I remember the AT thru-hikers Trailside allowed to film themselves on their hike, very interesting to follow their journay from Ga. to Maine. And one of my favorites was when you were hiking the White Mts., just a great show, too bad Trailside is not produced anymore. I also own numereous Trailsides that I bought on Ebay over the years. Thanks John for making such great outdoor shows.

dmax
03-09-2010, 10:56
It was the Trailside show that introduced me to the AT. And a couple of years later I headed down to Ga to try a thru hike. Thanks John!

Jester2000
03-09-2010, 11:05
It's comparable to other options of similar weight. Especially considering it is a double wall free standing tent including poles.. Look at Big Sky, SMD Lunar Duo, or various Tarp Tents which are all single wall or hybrids, leading to condensation and stability issues, so comparitively, it is in the range of reason... Problem is the limited interior space due to being a modified A frame, and single door make it somewhat less appealing than double door/vestibules tents like the Evolution 2p or Double Rainbow..

I'd still take a double wall any day over a single wall for a North East climate... But I'd want double doors and more interior space... Still it's a good contender...

Considering this is a free standing, 3 season, double wall tent, I don't know that there's anything comparable for the weight. Especially since its nearest competitor in my mind is from the same company -- the Seedhouse SL 2 -- and the Fly Creek 2 is lighter and the same size (vestibule is smaller, though).

Add to the fact that while it is a new product, the Fly Creek 1 -- made with the same materials and same basic design -- was released last year and seems to have held up well for people.

If you've got the money, I think this is the tent to buy.

DAJA
03-09-2010, 11:29
Considering this is a free standing, 3 season, double wall tent, I don't know that there's anything comparable for the weight. Especially since its nearest competitor in my mind is from the same company -- the Seedhouse SL 2 -- and the Fly Creek 2 is lighter and the same size (vestibule is smaller, though).

Add to the fact that while it is a new product, the Fly Creek 1 -- made with the same materials and same basic design -- was released last year and seems to have held up well for people.

If you've got the money, I think this is the tent to buy.

Have you seen one of these in person? I'm curious if two people could sit up comfortably inside without touching walls... I've never been inside a seedhouse and they appear to be close in dimension.. Anyone have feedback?

Jaybird
03-09-2010, 11:36
when you see these smaller companies ADVERTIZE...
then you'll see more articles abt them...
its the way of the BIG BIDNESS!

Jester2000
03-09-2010, 11:38
Have you seen one of these in person? I'm curious if two people could sit up comfortably inside without touching walls... I've never been inside a seedhouse and they appear to be close in dimension.. Anyone have feedback?

I've been inside a Fly Creek 2, and could sit up in one without my head hitting the top (I'm about 5'11").

I think if there were two of you in there, your head might brush against the mesh a bit.

Mags
03-09-2010, 11:51
Ah..as Jester said, the annual "BPer Mag" sucks thread. :)

As I've said before, it is not that backacker mag sucks..is it that their focus is different now. Done in a day activities are more popular than before; camping/backpacking less so. Financial survival dictates it.

More articles on peak bagging, local day hikes, the odd article about MTB or even rafting, and outdoors-as-lifestyle articles. Reflects the overall trend of the industry.

Former writer for BPer mag wrote about it far better than I (http://web.archive.org/web/20051102092910/www.mountaingazette.com/art.php?uid=190&date=2004-10-01&title=The+deceased:+Backpacker+magazine)

The article was written almost six years ago and his predictions have held up.

(Let's here it for the Wayback machine!)

Having said that, I thumb through the magazine at the local library or grocery store. :)

ASUGrad
03-11-2010, 11:59
The really nice thing about Backpacker is that my university has every copy since 1984 online so I can read it whenever I want.

chris948
03-11-2010, 12:50
As I've said before, it is not that backacker mag sucks..is it that their focus is different now. Done in a day activities are more popular than before; camping/backpacking less so. Financial survival dictates it.


It seems like there are two issues being mentioned though. I don't think many are complaining that the issue includes information on rafting/hiking or climbing but that they're advertising what you find at REI/Sportsmans warehouse and not the stuff that the people here rave about.

I suppose to each the answer is the same, they're playing to their biggest demographics. I think a lot of people complaining are understimating the amount of discomfort some people endure to save a few lbs and go a few miles farther. I myself sleep in a waterproof-ish coffin and many times have been miserable but consoled myself that it's still not to a level of dangerous. However I wouldn't recommend that to the average person and think new people should start with something double walled and make sure they're comfortable and happy to a reasonable extent. With that in mind most of the gear they recommend really is good stuff, and as was mentioned they really do recommend some kick ass albeit expensive stuff.

i like the magazine, but fair warning I do have a m-f job and can't really take much time off to go trek in the woods so my trips are small.

Tin Man
03-11-2010, 18:11
BP'er is like any other mag - pretty pictures, little substance, lots of ads. Good for noobs to get started, not so much for experienced hikers who know less is more.

Mags
03-11-2010, 18:32
but that they're advertising what you find at REI/Sportsmans warehouse and not the stuff that the people here rave about.

.

It goes with the shifting demographics. If I hike, mtn bike, car camp, trail run, ski, climbing, etc. I am going to have lots of gear..few of it (if any) from specialty cottage industries. You tend to go the one-stop shopping store. REI is basically a department store for the outdoors.

Every outdoor pursuit has its equivalent of ULA/Gossamer/SMD/ etc gear. But only the people extremely into the recreation activity know about these little cottage gear manufacturers.

If you are the typical outdoors person, you tend to have a casual interest in many different activities. Easier to go to the REI and pick up the generalist gear. Backpacker Mag (and others) show this outdoor reality.

I think the two themes (showing only advertised gear..and the advertised gear is generalist at that) are related personally.

As TinMan said, outdoor magazines in general tend to skim the surface.

The local (very avid) trail runners grouse about trail running mags, the (very avid) climbers grouse about the many climber magazines, etc. etc.

Doesn't really matter in the end. I read the various outdoor mags for free at the library. ;)

chris948
03-12-2010, 08:41
Every outdoor pursuit has its equivalent of ULA/Gossamer/SMD/ etc gear. But only the people extremely into the recreation activity know about these little cottage gear manufacturers.

How many times would you recommend a cottage gear manufacturer to someone who isn't extremely into the activity though?

Maybe I'm just a wimp and project it onto other people but I don't think I'd recommend a tarp-tent to a new person even on the AT (in the wrong conditions) that could be borderline dangerous or at least miserable. I mean you had better be pretty good with your stuff before an adjustable floor is a good idea.:D

Mags
03-12-2010, 12:55
How many times would you recommend a cottage gear manufacturer to someone who isn't extremely into the activity though?




All the time. ULA makes some awesome packs, for example. The cottage gear manufacturers also make tents with floors (not that a floor is 'safer'!)


The "dangerous gear" caveat about cottage gear is a bunch of horse feathers.

Jester2000
03-12-2010, 13:07
The "dangerous gear" caveat about cottage gear is a bunch of horse feathers.

Billville Safety Research is developing a sleeping bag made with horse feathers.

Tin Man
03-12-2010, 13:14
Billville Safety Research is developing a sleeping bag made with horse feathers.

... from a horse that et a goose, no doubt :)

ki0eh
03-12-2010, 18:44
I wouldn't pay for a subscription to Backpacker but it comes with my membership in AHS (http://www.americanhiking.org/) (which may be cheaper than a sub!)