Great Smokey Mountains [Archive]

Swofford11

03-11-2010, 11:46

I am plaining my first big hike in the smokies.

However, as I was looking over the backcountry rules and regulations one of them says the following.

"7. The use of tents at shelters is prohibited."

I thought you could tent near shelters. Am I wrong in this thought. Are you required to sleep in the shelters a long the trail?

Lone Wolf

03-11-2010, 11:48

I thought you could tent near shelters. Am I wrong in this thought. Are you required to sleep in the shelters a long the trail?

only if you're a "thru-hiker" :rolleyes: i would seriously pickanother section to walk for your first journey

sbennett

03-11-2010, 11:52

only if you're a "thru-hiker" :rolleyes: i would seriously pickanother section to walk for your first journey

And I think that's still only if the shelter is full. The Smokies have some Draconian rules for sure.

Lone Wolf

03-11-2010, 11:53

And I think that's still only if the shelter is full. The Smokies have some Draconian rules for sure.

thu-hikers should have to get reservations too

d.o.c

03-11-2010, 12:06

they get rather upset if u forget to fill out the registration im glad he didnt fine me i hear they can

sidebackside

03-11-2010, 12:18

There are plenty of trails where you can tent camp if that's what your interested in doing.

HikerRanky

03-11-2010, 12:18

Per http://www.nps.gov/grsm/parkmgmt/upload/09-Compendium.pdf:

Reservations are required because of the high demand
for the limited space available.

The use of tents at shelters is prohibited except by persons
qualifying as thru-hikers on the Appalachian Trail (by
definition an Appalachian thru-hiker is a backpacker who is
using the Appalachian Trail exclusively while in the park
and whose trip begins and ends a minimum of fifty miles
outside the park). Thru-hikers may pitch tents outside
shelters only when all bunks are otherwise occupied.

It is unrealistic to expect thru-hikers to obtain advance
reservations when they do not know when they will be
entering the park.

There are other trails ( the BMT comes to mind ) that (a) don't require reservations and (b) are simple campsites. Unless you are certain that you want to hike the AT, might I recommend the Benton MacKaye trail instead...

Swofford11

03-11-2010, 12:20

Does anyone else suggest not staying at the Shelters for the first time in the Smokies? I've never actually stayed at a shelter before. All the trails I hike don't have them.

My trip had me staying at Shelters at Russell Field and Silers Bald then I was going to get off the App trail and head down the Forney Creek Trail to the Benton Mackay where I wouldn't have to worry about Shelters.

Can anyone tell me how well marked are the intersections in the park. I've hiked other National parks and they have had signs with mileage at almost all the intersections. Is it like this in the Smokies?

Blissful

03-11-2010, 12:28

AT I know is well marked with signs at trail junctions. Not sure about the other trails in the park.

sidebackside

03-11-2010, 12:29

Can anyone tell me how well marked are the intersections in the park. I've hiked other National parks and they have had signs with mileage at almost all the intersections. Is it like this in the Smokies?

Almost every junction is well marked in the Smokies. That shouldn't be a problem. You may wanna call the backcountry office about staying at Russell Field shelter. It was closed for a while because of bear activity. I know that's probably not a big issue right now, you still may wanna call though.

Backcountry Office
865-436-1231

HikerRanky

03-11-2010, 12:35

Does anyone else suggest not staying at the Shelters for the first time in the Smokies? I've never actually stayed at a shelter before. All the trails I hike don't have them.

I personally don't like shelters, but I have stayed at them before. It's something that should be experienced at least once...

My trip had me staying at Shelters at Russell Field and Silers Bald then I was going to get off the App trail and head down the Forney Creek Trail to the Benton Mackay where I wouldn't have to worry about Shelters.

Can anyone tell me how well marked are the intersections in the park. I've hiked other National parks and they have had signs with mileage at almost all the intersections. Is it like this in the Smokies?

Looking at my map, the Welch Ridge Trail comes off of the AT right by Silers Bald. Take that trail for about 2.4 miles and it intersects with Jonas Creek Trail. Stay on that trail for about 4.1 miles and you will reach Campsite 70 which is a non-reservation campsite. From there it is about 3.6 miles to the BMT. Where the trails intersect , Campsite 74 is not far ( about a mile ) away...

Hope this helps.

Randy

garlic08

03-11-2010, 12:37

Does anyone else suggest not staying at the Shelters for the first time in the Smokies? I've never actually stayed at a shelter before. All the trails I hike don't have them.

If you have any way of avoiding shelters in the Smokies in thru hiking season, do it! I purposely hiked until dark in the Smokies to be sure I arrived at a shelter after it was full, so I could legally tent instead of trying to sleep in the mass of mice and men.

Mags

03-11-2010, 12:40

If you are not set to hike strictly the AT, most of the trails in the park have campsites WITHOUT shelters.

The AT gets all the press, but from what little..(AT and BMT only) I've seen, there are plenty of options that are outside the AT corridor for hikes in the Smokies.

I'd incorporate a bit of the AT for sure, but you may want to camp at places that do not have shelters. :)

The trails are well marked. The TI map for the Smokies (http://www.amazon.com/Great-Smoky-Mountains-National-Park/dp/1566953014)is pretty good and should help as well. This map also shows which sites must be RSVP'd ahead of time rather than using the self-serve kiosk found at some ranger stations. (May or may not be an issue for your hike).

Have fun!

Swofford11

03-11-2010, 13:09

Ramble~On

03-11-2010, 13:11

http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/2/7/8/5/gsmnp_at_044.jpg (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showimage.php?i=33132&original=1&c=member&imageuser=2785)
Shelters in the Smokies fill up fast and it's not uncommon to see people sleeping on the dirt floor. I have often tented outside the shelters and have never had a problem from ranger or ridge runner for doing so.

Mags

03-11-2010, 13:32

Am I correct if I am only camping at non reservation sites I do not have to call my itinerary in early. I can just show up and register the day I am leaving.

Correct. (AKAIK..remember, I am not a local! :) ). It is what I did on the BMT. Filled out the permit at the self-serve kiosk for non-RSVP sites. Pretty easy. I checked out the one shelter on the BMT in the Smokies..what a pit! :eek:

Swofford11

03-11-2010, 13:33

Thanks for the picture Ramble on....

But man that does not look like fun to me, way to crowded.

sbennett

03-11-2010, 13:36

I could avoid all Shelters. I would just have to get off the App trail at one point for a couple miles and then get back on.

My trip starts at Fontana Dam
I'll head up the Eagle Creek Trail camp at site 97
Then hit the App trail to the Greenbrier Ridge trail camp at site 28
Get back on the App trail Head to the Hazel Creek Trail Camp at site 82
Follow this trail to the Benton Mackaye Trail camp at site 91
Finish hike

All these camp sites are non reservation sites.

Am I correct if I am only camping at non reservation sites I do not have to call my itinerary in early. I can just show up and register the day I am leaving.

If anyone has a better idea please share with me.

You're right about not having to call about nonreservation sites. You'll still need the backcountry permit though. I've stayed at Silers Bald, Mt. Collins, Icewater Spring, and Tricorner Knob shelters at various times and I never really enjoyed them. Icewater and Tricorner were fine because they had been rebuilt (I actually don't remember mice problems at all) but the older shelters were just overrun. It would probably be just as fun staying on other trails in the Smokies.

bigcranky

03-11-2010, 13:42

Swofford11

03-11-2010, 13:44

Thanks everyone for the help. That picture scared me away from the shelters :-)

I'll stick to the non reservation sites.

I'm assuming I can leave my car at the Fontana Dam visitor center during my hike.

Swofford11

03-11-2010, 13:55

Are you trying to hike in the Smokies? Or are you trying to get a good A.T. hike in the South? If it's the latter, then one can make the argument that the 60 AT miles South of the Smokies, and the 90 AT miles North of the Smokies are better for that. Easier logistics, no reservations, and great sections of trail.

I am trying to hike in the Smokies. I just wanted to hike some of the AT while I was there. I haven't been on the AT in years and just wanted to get back on it.

I don't care if I stay the night on the AT or anything like that. I did want to hit up the area around Fontana while I was there to.

Chaco Taco

03-11-2010, 14:32

I am trying to hike in the Smokies. I just wanted to hike some of the AT while I was there. I haven't been on the AT in years and just wanted to get back on it.

I don't care if I stay the night on the AT or anything like that. I did want to hit up the area around Fontana while I was there to.

Yea the BMT runs parallel to the AT and has the non reserve sites. Will be much quieter

bulldog49

03-11-2010, 16:25

I could avoid all Shelters. I would just have to get off the App trail at one point for a couple miles and then get back on.

My trip starts at Fontana Dam
I'll head up the Eagle Creek Trail camp at site 97
Then hit the App trail to the Greenbrier Ridge trail camp at site 28
Get back on the App trail Head to the Hazel Creek Trail Camp at site 82
Follow this trail to the Benton Mackaye Trail camp at site 91
Finish hike

All these camp sites are non reservation sites.

Am I correct if I am only camping at non reservation sites I do not have to call my itinerary in early. I can just show up and register the day I am leaving.

If anyone has a better idea please share with me.

Eagle Creek Trail has numerous creek crossings. With the snow melt that could be dicey, plan to get your feet very wet.

As others suggested, you may want to consider taking the BMT through the park at this time of year. You can begin and end your hike as you are planning.

bulldog49

03-11-2010, 16:34

Chaco Taco

03-11-2010, 16:52

Oops, misread your post, thought you were planning to end at Davenport Gap. Hazel Creek, like Eagle Creek, has a bunch of stream crossings, over 20. Personally, I would not hike either trail with the streams at current high level.

If I were to do that loop, I would go up the AT on the Shukstack and come down Jenkins or Welch Ridge.

I agree with this. Some of the crossings can be avoided by hiking downstream but there are so many and the levels are high right now with the current precip trend.

Aly

03-11-2010, 16:52

Does anyone know if I-40 is open??

Chaco Taco

03-11-2010, 16:53

Oops, misread your post, thought you were planning to end at Davenport Gap. Hazel Creek, like Eagle Creek, has a bunch of stream crossings, over 20. Personally, I would not hike either trail with the streams at current high level.

If I were to do that loop, I would go up the AT on the Shukstack and come down Jenkins or Welch Ridge.

There is a really cool loop you can do outta Fontana that will take you up and over Rockytop

sbennett

03-11-2010, 17:00

Does anyone know if I-40 is open??

Not for a couple months I think.

Chaco Taco

03-11-2010, 17:07

Not for a couple months I think.

Pushed to mid April. Was supposed to be done but taking longer because of the weather. There is a detour

Chaco Taco

03-11-2010, 17:08

Pushed to mid April. Was supposed to be done but taking longer because of the weather. There is a detour

And its only about a 30 minute round about

Swofford11

03-25-2010, 12:14

Where should I park my car (four nights) if I am leaving from the Fontana dam area

I did get reservations for Spence Field and Double Spring Gap shelters then I am heading back via that Benton Mackaye trail staying in campsites. Some one advised me that i should stay in the Shelters once in my life so I thought I'd get it out of the way. :)

Going by what I have read on whiteblaze. I do have reservations but what if I do show up to a shelter and it is full to the top. I'm not the type of person who is going to force people to move. Would a ranger have to much of a problem if i just set my tent up near by. If it is not full I will of course sleep in the shelter.

I've just never had to deal with a shelter system before when backpacking. I'm hiking the CT this summer and there is only 1 shelter on the whole 500 mile trail.

bigcranky

03-25-2010, 13:18

You can park at Fontana Dam.

If the shelters were full, I would just set up my tent nearby. I'm not the ranger and I'm not going to throw anybody out of the shelter for my reservation.

Gray Blazer

03-25-2010, 14:16

I was staying at Tri-corner one time. When I announced I was going to set up my tent, I got the iciest glares from the other shelter dwellers.

SGT Rock

03-25-2010, 14:18

Yep, park at the dam or up near the shelter. TVA police regularly check the area so your car should be safe.

How are you hooking into the BMT?

Swofford11

03-26-2010, 09:22

Yep, park at the dam or up near the shelter. TVA police regularly check the area so your car should be safe.

How are you hooking into the BMT?

From Double Spring Gap I'll head up to Clingman's Dome and then go down the Forney Ridge Trail to the BMT. I'll take the BMT all the way back to Fontana Dam. From what I can tell that's about 13-15 miles.

I'm hopeing to average about 15 miles a day during my trip.

Ox97GaMe

03-28-2010, 12:54

A couple of updates...

Talked to men from the I-40 repair crew. They are getting VERY close to finishing up the work related to the rock slide. The issue now is that TDOT decided to also replace guardrails and pushed up bridge inspection and repair while the interstate was planned to be closed. So.... even though the slide area will be finished ahead of schedule, the road may not be open until mid April. The delay now will be bridge repairs. They may open the road and have it single lane while they finish those repairs, but I cant say for sure that will be the case.

Swofford, The BMT will cut back uphill near campsite #90 (Lost Cove Trail), you will want to continue along the Lakeshore Trail back to the Fontana parking area for 5 miles rather than the 7.5 miles up hill to Shuckstack and back down the AT to Fontana. Also, there are a lot of blow downs on the trails between 2000 and 3500 ft elevation. Be careful when hiking through this zone. The AT is clear, but I dont now about side trails like Forney Ridge, Welch Ridge, Jenkins Ridge, Forney Creek, or Hazel Creek.

Swofford11

03-28-2010, 12:59

Thanks for the up date Ox97GaMe

I was planning on hiking around 15 miles a day. Do you think that is doable with the blow downs.

Ox97GaMe

03-28-2010, 13:10

The AT is open, and Ive heard that Lakeshore Trail isnt bad because it is below the 'disaster' zone. Cant say what you will encounter getting from the ridge down to Lakeshore. We are generally seeing about 100+ trees/large limbs per mile across the trail in that zone. This usually equates to about 1-2 miles of trail in that zone that are significantly impacted. Since you will be going downhill, you may make up the lost time and 12-15 would be managable distance. It is also possible that the trail you are going down is clear by the time you get there. The chainsaw window for volunteers opens April 1st, and there will be a lot of crews in the park Easter weekend to get started on the high volume problem areas.

Swofford11

03-28-2010, 23:15

awsome Ox97GaMe....thanks for the up-date

I'm going to go ahead with my hike...i'm ready for 12 hour days if that is what it takes..

I appriciate all your help.

thanks

SGT Rock

03-29-2010, 04:03

From Double Spring Gap I'll head up to Clingman's Dome and then go down the Forney Ridge Trail to the BMT. I'll take the BMT all the way back to Fontana Dam. From what I can tell that's about 13-15 miles.

I'm hopeing to average about 15 miles a day during my trip.

Good choice. I've done that Forney Ridge to Forney Creek trail and loved it. Sometime I'll go back and do the Forney Ridge Trail down to Springhouse Branch.

15 miles per day should be doable. After walking the BMT that last section of Lakeshore Trail from 90 to Fontana feels like a roller coaster. Lots of cool old cars though.

ccathcart72

04-06-2010, 16:50

Hey Everyone this is my first post here. I have been doing a lot of reading on here and want to say thanks for all the great information. I have learned a lot.
One question I have about the GSMNP, and it's probably is a dumb one, is they say not tent camping around the shelter unless you are a thru hiker. Would hammock camping be allowed or do they treat this the same as tents.

Thanks,
Chris